Welcome everyone. We are waiting for the guest to arrive. So just a bit of patience
I think that while everyone is on board that we can start with a little intro
about this new season of Autumn Zone. So welcome everyone to the second season of
Autumn Zone. The Cosmos sub community goal where you can speak out on finding
alpha and explore upcoming consumer chain. All said by me Rob Sac a cosmonaut who has
been around for a while and the man bringing Cosmos to the masses Kriptos Ito
who just joined. First of all congratulations everyone if you're still
here you have you've been around one of the most challenging year in Cosmos has
been quite difficult even for cosmonauts they've been for a while here like me and
Kriptos Ito and you held into your belief while the entire world tried to shake
them so congratulations because you are a true cosmonaut and it's very nice to see
you here. Also I see a lot of new faces so welcome to all the newcomers. Now the
year is 2024 and Adam is undergoing an unprecedented evolution. We are witnessing
the atom economics and expansion, the revamp of tokenomics improvement to
interchange security and even inscriptions on the Cosmos sub. 2024 is
already an epic journey and we are here for it. Today we have a special episode
featuring Informal System with Jian, Curious J with Atom Accelerator, Spade
the voice on Neutron, the first Cosmos sub consumer chat and John Galt from
Strive. With this short intro I will pass the mic to Kriptos Ito and let's
start the conversation. Yeah hello hello like I said I think you know 2023 has
definitely been a wild year with a lot a lot of ups and downs I think the end of
the year kind of turned a lot of things around and brought a lot of
excitement and positivity back into the entire market so yeah congratulations for
everybody that that stayed throughout the bear market yeah and I think you know
the Cosmos hub is is is still there a lot of new features coming up also red
spades post from yesterday maybe we can talk about this later as well with a lot
of cool and exciting ideas around navigating the future for for the
Cosmos hub and Atom. You mentioned the inscriptions as well it's also very
interesting and brought a lot of excitement specifically for for Atom so
yeah great to be here and crazy to also think this is already episode 15 so
we've been doing this throughout the bear market and here we are still
standing. Yeah and without counting also the side series like Atom's own Agora and
the Atom's own radioactive session. So I think that we are still waiting for
John so maybe we can start directly with Chris Jay from Atom Accelerator who
recently got approved by Cosmos sub governance and for everyone that is not
aware the Atom Accelerator is now a long-lasting organization focused on Atom
so we are definitely curious to know more about what's coming in 2024. Thank you
for having me. I'm really excited to be here and talk in front of all you guys
I feel like I'm in presence of legends here but yeah we're excited about 2024
because there's a lot of changes a lot of lessons we learned on our first pilot
year. First our grants will reopen on February 7th so once once that's open
everybody can can apply. We are migrating from a part-time model of many members
to a more full-time model. I think 75% of our members that are going to be
full-time and we realized that there's a lot of work needs to be done and you
know when you're working part-time it's kind of hard to collaborate and get
stuff done on time and a lot of applications get backed up so
additionally we're going to we announced some new positions we're in the process of
irony grant lead and a marketing lead and in the process of the marketing
right yes and a marketing lead yes we need a marketing lead especially for for
a DAO but also more importantly for the hub itself so for if you guys know
anybody with good recommendations feel free to shoot them our way and we'll
interview them and see if they're a good fit but yeah additionally we listen to
the community feedback and we're also in the process of structuring an election
for a third oversight number one that the community chooses themselves so we
want to you know be more aligned with the community while also trying to you
know lead lead a DAO in a way that is beneficial for the hub and another thing
is where we're transitioning to not just public grants but more RFPs and in
fact I think we might do half and half RFPs and have public grants and and
the reason is really because we want some some alignment and some like
leadership in terms of where we want the hub to to be positioned we see a lot of
things where you know IBC relays can be addressed now that we have inscriptions
development on that more on interchange security so these RFPs I urge everybody
whether it's in stride whether it's in neutron whether it's informal to just you
know be more collaborative and yeah just work together more to you know get
stuff going but yeah thank you for having me and I'm happy to answer any any
other questions but I just wanted to give a brief overview of what we're doing
at a DAO yeah thank you for the presentation and I think that it's very
nice to see this here having all this organization actually accountable to the
Cosmos sub community we've seen this with informal system and now with the
atom accelerator so we actually now I have more minds than ever working towards
improving the Cosmos sub so this is quite exciting unless krypto see to us any
question I will start to introduce you sure yeah I think you know DAO like when
you guys launched during during the bear market also I think there was a
great experiment and I think a lot of good things came out of it so I'm very
excited to see you know the journey for this year and I think you guys you know
obviously we've been in touch with the whole time and I think there's a lot of
lessons learned as well both for you but also for the community so yeah and I
think you know the call to action really is you know the Cosmos have an
atom I suspect also wrote about this like governance is also like one of the
superpowers of atom right which basically means the community so the
community can really step up take the fate of the hub into their own hands
because it's leaderless it's like one of the few chains out there that's truly
leaderless where no one has any expectations to one team to do do
everything and run the show right so it's really cool to see how things are
coming together I know everyone and then the neutron team to strike team like a
lot of a lot of collaborations and synergies and I think you know moving
forwards and maybe we can also use the atom zone here this format to like refine
some of these ideas and like nail it down more and get also more feedback and
involvement from people that are listening to say okay I have an idea we
can improve XYZ and then you know turn it into something tangible turn it into a
proposal to improve the hub but yeah I think Rob you wanted to start I think
with with informal so yeah maybe we can introduce Jihan just so far anyone that
is not aware that don't think many people informal system is the team that is
working on Cosmos sub core development and today we have Jihan which is the
Cosmos sub product leader so Jihan feel free to share the priorities for 2024
yeah hello so yeah our priorities for 2024 I think I'll mostly look at Q1 right now
and then we can also talk about how that kind of you know relates what rest of
the year but uh we also did a as part of our grant we have this oversight
committee and we did a kickoff meeting with them last week we published a
report from that meeting so you can you can read that and it also questions
from the committee in it but I'll kind of go over the stuff we went over there
so sir if you want priorities so first of all and I was probably supposed to go
over R&D here because there's maintenance but that that's always you
know it's always the same and we talked about that but it's it's very important
it's a lot of our work but it's also you know not the new exciting stuff so
alright so the first priority is partial security and I've been I've been
posting about this on the forum and tweeting about this and this is this is
basically a new version of interchange security interchange security for the
past year has been a system where you where every validator needs to run
every consumer chain basically so when a consumer chain uses replicated security
they get the entire validator set and that's good because the security is the
security is very well defined very it's very simple it is the full security of
the Cosmos Hub but it's also it's a lot of work for validators to run that many
chains and it's it makes it you know it makes it kind of a high a high bar for
consumer chains so we wanted something where it's it's a little bit easier
for chains to come in and start with maybe a lower level of security and
scale it to what they need as they go and so what partial security does is
pretty simple it it just lets validators opt in to run a consumer chain and if
they're not opt in they don't have to run it so as a delegator if your
validator is running a consumer chain you're gonna get the rewards from that
chain and if they're not you're not so that kind of means that validators will
choose the consumer chains that they want to they want to support you know
probably largely depending on what the rewards are and so that the security can
scale with you know can scale with the rewards they have available so that is
I've currently been you know been putting some questions on how to design
it up to you know the community we talked about on Twitter on the form and
stuff that's we that's the discussion phase we have this thing called chips
we're going to right now but it's a process for bringing new features with
union input that's the discussion phase we're now about to move to the
specification phase so our team at informal has has written an ADR and
that's actually in a pull request right now on our repo so so comment coming on
it's being finished up but um basically when that's done we'll be posting on
the forum and I'll probably do a tweet thread about it too but yeah basically
what's gonna happen is that when a new consumer chain joins using opt-in there's
also another variation as well to cover but using opt-in new consumer chain
joins then every validator who votes yes on the prop will validate the
consumer chain and validators who vote who vote no or abstain don't have to
and so basically it's like you know it gives them the choice and then after it's
running validators can opt in and out as they want so I think that's pretty
much pretty much covers it you know relatively simple concept so I don't
know if there's any questions but I'll move on to the next thing yeah yeah one
question to that so so that's that's kind of like what you're describing this
this concept of like semi-permission less onboarding right can you maybe expand
on that because right now if a consumer chain wants to be onboarded to be atom
secured they have to like present a full-on plan and everything and in the
forum and then go on chain and entire community votes on it but what you're
presenting now is basically like a reduction of that right or how does
yeah yeah yeah yeah so it's semi right we're the first version we're gonna do
is gonna be semi-permission and we're gonna be moving to full permissionless
after that basically it's semi-permission because there's still a
governor's proposal but we're going to lower the quorum requirements on that so
that means that only you know maybe only five percent of people need to vote
so there's like a bar they have to get enough people to either vote yes or
abstain basically to launch but it's I'm like to lower bar so right now it's
like people you know if a consumer chain wants to join this heavy debate
about oh no this is not worth it it's not good enough you know but this is
gonna be a lot easier because it's gonna be more like you know do you have any
problems with joining no and the reason that we're having a semi-permission
format instead of going straight to fully permissionless is first of all for
development speed there's some challenges that we have to kind of
think through a system to to overcome for fully permissionless consumer chains
having to do with the chain ID and not wanting to have people kind of
claim those and squat on them and stuff that's not a huge not a huge deal but
it's just to make it faster it's gonna be the semi-permission thing at first and
that also sort of lets it lets people use the the interfaces that they're used
to with the Cosmos Hub you know it's um you know the governance interface to
sort of opt into and learn about consumer chains and when we're fully
permissionless then we're probably gonna want to have some kind of a
special interface just to learn about consumer chains that are running because
that's gonna be kind of outside of you know the existing governance system so
this is it's an intermediate phase as we as we get partial security going I had
a question on this actually so does this mean that the current consumer
chains of neutron and stride will they have to opt into partial security or
does it make economical sense for them to you know shift or remain as is well
so we've spoken with them obviously about this already I don't think we
have super firm plans yet but basically there's another thing that I
haven't mentioned which is top end so with partial security there's the opt-in
where it's totally open you could have you got one validator running consumer
chain and I can also talk more about why that's how that's secure but anyway
there's also top end which is basically where the consumer chain says I want to
have the top end percent of the hub running the consumer chain if they set a
top end of 100% then it's exactly the same as replicated security so that will
provide a they'll provide a transition path for existing replicated security
chains to they either have the option to to keep the exact same setup they
could also switch to something like you know if it was like a top 80% maybe that
really cuts down the size of the validators at maybe 60 validators then
and so it's a lighter lift but still much of the same security if you go to
66% it's actually only 24 validators so that's going to also give it's going
to give kind of consumer chains the the ability to have like pretty like a
majority of the hub security a large majority of the security but but make it a
lot lighter because you cut out like a long tail of very small validators yeah
that's pretty great and for a short summary of what we have been heard so
far I think it's relevant to remember that the atom accelerator grant program
will start in February and for regarding the inter-chain security
improvements we are pretty really closer right now we are in the discussion base
and actually you can participate by joining the Cosmos app forum there is
also a pinhead with up here that can drive you to that conversation and one
important things to understand is that everything is decentralized in the
Cosmos app so you can actually be aware of the upcoming feature before they
actually implemented which is pretty cool because usually you are just saying some
project flashing an announcement and then it's lively the day after while here
it's it's all up for the community participate and see the process going so
pretty interesting update so far we have also spade from neutron which has been
also involved with a lot in conversation regarding the Cosmos app so it's great
to see you here and you can start by introducing neutron priorities hey folks
thanks for having me sure so I'll run over a few of the things that we're
thinking please keep in mind that I'm speaking one as a contributor so you know
like I don't get to say what exactly happens to the network when governance
is involved but also as the CEO of like hidden labs so most of the when I say
like here's what we're focusing on it means like me and my team are working
on developing this but whether or not it becomes like a thing depends on whether
or not it's voted on by governance most often but basically you know we look at
where neutron is and where Cosmos is today and it's like it has this very
fundamental valuable feature of you know Cosmos is the only place where you can
actually develop like small contract based applications that have fairly low
amount like fairly low level control of the blockchain like they can
participate in a bunch of very advanced stuff and there's like natively
interoperable right and so what we're trying to do is we're trying to really
take this value and bring it to market in a way that's like as appealing as
possible that being said there's like still you know on neutron which is like
fairly young as a network there's still like a bunch of hurdles that needs to
be lifted and some of them are like fairly sexy right like building new
products that are crazy and stuff but there's also just like what I think is
you know a very important thing to happen but that isn't sexy to say
that much is just like you know really improving the onboarding and the
cohesive so like feel of the ecosystem right and so some of the stuff that
we're focusing on is you know like how do we make bridging from other
ecosystems and into the AZ like a whole lot faster cheaper easier to to the
user and there's a bunch of work that's being done here with skip with
leap with bridge providers to really streamline this process and also to
build the infrastructure that would allow us to basically compensate for the slow
finalization times of like blockchains like Ethereum so that when you're a user
and you're trying to get into the AZ to you it's kind of like instantaneous right
because there's an underwriter behind the scenes that's kind of like
underwriting the risk and providing that instant transfer but because the bridge
technologies that we've deployed are very very secure they can do so at a
very minimal so like risk and therefore cost to the user so one of you know one
of these segments is like onboarding and bridging and cohesive feel is like one
of these priorities of these topic we have kind of like this trust bridging
solution there's the idea that like today if you look at neutron there's
there's a UI for everything that you might want to be doing right there's a
governance UI there's a launch UI there's a few bridge UIs there's all of
the UIs of each of the protocols but there's really no cohesive one-stop shop
whereby you connect your wallet you're done you can do everything that you want
to do right and this is something that exists on other chain or that existed
very well on other chains and I think one of the most successful example of
this was like TerraStation right TerraStation allows allowed you back on
the days and in Terra to see your all of your assets including you know like
divide positions on the ecosystem itself which often lack from others
third-party wallets as well as like stake swap bridge voting governance all
of these things discover dApps on the ecosystem all of these things from like
one simple to use UI that feels familiar right and so this is something
that I think would bring is not sexy to talk about but that would actually make
the day-to-day experience of actually interacting with the network like a
whole lot better and fortunately through cooperation with like the NGP and
leap it's likely that this will actually happen like very quickly in the sense
that like a lot of this work has already been done by some of the teams out
there including leap which provides this kind of like you know SDK for like
connecting these things together and so we're likely going to collaborate with
them to sort of like bring all of these features together into one UI so
that at least when you're discovering the ecosystem you know it doesn't take
like three weeks of research for you to find all of the cool stuff that you
can do it takes like five seconds now the other so that's like one side of
things onboarding bridging all of these things the other side of the equation is
we're sort of like getting to a stage where neutron as a platform
technologically is actually fairly mature like of course there's always
going to be maintenance and there's going to be new feature that that crop
up but I think I think like in the first half or you know the first three
quarters of the year we're actually going to deliver the last few fundamental
bits that we think are required for the for the network to really be fully
featured like duality launched recently as a Cosmos SDK module you know like the
duality blockchain basically merged with the neutron blockchain so it's now
available to build on but you know that's not full-featured until we've
sort of like put out the UIs that people will use to interact with these things
and this is something that's going to happen soon we're working like our team
is developing some UIs for it that will be open-sourced and then it out to
ecosystem projects like Astroboard and Mars that want to leverage this module
to provide or to book functionality and such for the ecosystem so that's one
of the things that we're doing and we're working with skip on a number of
things including the return of the block SDK like previously neutron used
Mevtendiment which is a slightly modified version of comment comment BFT that
allows for a sidecar in the auction we're now moving to the block SDK which
allows the block production process and the immediate recapture process to happen
in a way that's that that the chain itself has power to enforce specific
parameters and rules which will help for example enable things like you know
proto rev on osmosis has been like a very very powerful mechanism for like
basically making the ecosystem better because it helps basically do all of the
arbitrage like this cyclical arbitrage but do do it in a way where the value
rather than go to third-party arbitrages is essentially redistributed
throughout the ecosystem and this is something that could happen you know on
neutron as well whereby like you know once duality is well adopted you have a
very efficient decks and that decks allows the entire ecosystem to benefit
from up specific use cases such as automated cyclical arbitrages that
generate value for for for being shared with you know some of it would go to
neutron and some of it would go to the Cosmos Hub and its stakers so that's
another thing that I'm fairly excited about so block SDK is one there's like
the Oracle module which will allow DeFi application builders to have access to
data to create like feeds and products around like assets that typically don't
get price feeds from like pith or others for example like you know perps is
going to be a great application of the of the Oracle module this is something
that a number of protocols including like Mars for example is very excited about
and this is you know great work that's being done in collaboration with skip
but then there's also like just ecosystem growth right like new Sean has
launched it's one of the you know most liquid ecosystems in Cosmos but
there's like a long way to go before it's you know like where it should be
which is you know like it like one of the tops industry DeFi hub at least
that's you know the the vision that we put out for it when we started working
on the project and I think you know as a community this is where we should be
aiming to be and so you know like neutron has done it has seen a whole
lot of progress so far but it hasn't even started like liquidity mining really
at any sort of scale PL is an interesting idea that has started to be
implemented but it's you know we haven't really standardized or
industrialized how we go about it it's not super standardized the infrastructure
is still being built and refined and so I think throughout the year all of
these things are going to come together so that you know what that means for
the hub and for neutron is that you know what one of the things that I
think should be our mutual objective is let's make sure that DAZ is the
trading center for the Cosmos ecosystem because really this is how
we're going to bring actual activity and value to the hub and to neutron so
this is something that you know we're doing a lot of groundwork today to be
able to scale in the upcoming quarters so that we can you know really hone in
and solidify DeFi in general but also DeFi based on liquid staking which I
think is particularly useful for the hub long term in terms of like stake
decentralization and ability to really wield its monetary policy we're doing a
lot of efforts around being more coherent and structured in the way that
we approach developer onboarding so that we can bring more teams faster better to
the ecosystem to build new applications around Adam and the ecosystems assets
and the products that are on neutron and we're doing a lot of work to with
Mars and astroboard and Apollo and other projects in the ecosystem to help
them refine their products take you to the next level so that you know like by
the end of the year my hope is that the applications on neutron are the best
applications you've ever used you can do perps like you can do anywhere else
and that kind of stuff right that's that's where we're trying to to aim and
finally there's like a last kind of like point that I think is like often
disregarded but like that is actually super important is the hub for example
is already extremely decentralized and in that sense it's like way ahead of
neutron but it's not super structured and so I think like there's a lot of
progress that can be done there but I apply the same sort of like mental
framework for neutron and the reality today is that neutron has some
infrastructure that's set up that has allowed it to be fairly efficient in some
ways but for example the liquidity mining program that it has is not
particularly decentralized or efficient and so it's being restructured but more
generally generally what I mean with this so like work stream is we want the
neutron down to become a lot more active a lot more participative we want to make
sure that like community members that are like getting engaged with the network
are getting more and more of a say and are getting more and more influence you
know like long term and this is something that I've said when we founded the when
we incorporated the foundation and it was then subsequently recognized by
neutron governance like you know the endgame is for the foundation to
disappear right there like it might be useful as a legal construct but
that should be based around a subset of like small contracts that actually
enforce the rules of governance right it should be kind of like an extension
into the legal realm rather than a separate independent entity and so
creating these structures and these contributor base that is diverse and
engaged enough that you know neutron as a DAO is actually what powers the
network and drives its growth is also something towards which we want to be
driving continuously throughout the year I guess that was a bit of a rant I'm
sorry if I went into too many directions at the time but those are the
things that we're working on yeah I think what you're describing is a very
like underrated feature of the cosmos hop right it's this decentralization
aspect but but a fair criticism for that is like you were saying also it's
it's unstructured sometimes right and I think it also feels chaotic for some
people especially if you're not in cosmos and you don't understand that
they're like who is actually running the hub they don't do proper BT proper
marketing proper this proper that but I think that's also kind of the beauty of
the hub in that sense right so I just have one kind because you wrote this
you dropped this post yesterday your long-term strategy for the cosmos hub
and you also defined three goals there for the hub the first goal being the
cosmos hub governance is effective decentralized and reliable the second
goal atom is the most money-like token in the customs ecosystem and the third
goal customer sub security offering attracts the best blockchain
applications in the markets and I personally think like to achieve those
goals like it requires a lot of alignment amongst the core contributing
entities we have three or four of them actually today here with dried neutron
informal NDA del but also of the broader community like the core community to
really kind of rally really behind this and I think maybe I misunderstood but I
think that's also kind of the goal that you have with this post is to say okay
I don't want to like dictate a roadmap I just want to share how I view the space
and evolution of the hub Carter from shade actually also wrote a great piece
on that couple months ago so yeah maybe you can just comment on that on your post
and kind of your goals around why you share that and what you kind of wish
for the community to provide us feedback or get involved yeah absolutely I mean I
think you put it fairly well right the idea is like I don't want to and I'm
also in new position to dictate the hubs roadmap but I think you know as
you said like one of the greatest strengths of the hub is that it's you
know actually decentralized but that can result without the proper sort of like
structure to the madness then you just get madness right and so it kind of feels
like the hub has tremendous resources right it has extremely talented teams
working on it or around it like informal IFA like stride and other teams are like
you know their powerhouse in the in the industry this is a great strength
right Adam also has you know a very wide distribution and like people know
about it it has a lot of strength and it is worth a lot of money as well right all
of these things that are like the resources of the hub the risk for the
hub comes from the fact that the market the environment around the hub is not
static it's going to simply moving right you have other projects that are trying
to eat the hubs lunch because you know they're competing with the hub for like
being a security provider and such right it's only natural and so in this
context for the hub to really strive it needs to make sure that the resources
that it has are focused towards going in the same direction and the way that
traditionally this is set which I think applies to decentralized entities and
organizations is you first set the objectives right where do we want to go
once you have the objectives then the work becomes all right all these cool
ideas that we have how do we fit them into this so that they're we're actually
all independently pushing in the same direction rather than impeding each
others or like progress right because if we're working against each other then
there's nothing that we're going to do and we're just going to suffer inertia
and so I think you know like many many times in decentralized governance we
try and put the the card before the horses and so it feels to me like we
haven't really fundamentally defined and approve these things as a community so
that then we can all use the same lenses when you know deciding what should be our
priorities and what we should work on next and that kind of stuff and so the
hope is basically hey here's you know an example an idea of what based on my
experiences of the hub we should be focusing on let's you know all have a
look at it and then you know maybe break it down and then make a new one
that's better but let's just ratify these objectives together so that then
anything that we do next in the coming years we have a very clear idea of whether
or not they're bringing us closer to our goals and I think if we're able to do
this as a community then I'm actually fairly confident in the hubs ability to
like you know really further its position in the top like industry
projects because it has tremendous resources actually it just needs to use
them efficiently I think that the key messages here is having more focus like
finding a path that most of the teams are aligned and focus on that so that
all the teams does the reason to like a lot of energy to do stuff that no one
or not all the teams are aligned so this kind of energy that we can get
from focusing could actually be very powerful because we have a lot of strong
teams on the hub so it's a very interesting topic and I think we can
also do a dedicated episode on that because there is a lot to talk about so
maybe we can plan an episode of atoms on the fully dedicated to this with the
multiple multiple teams of the hub but I go now to John Galt the contributor of
Stride which will share up data on Stride which is the leading the liquid
second provider right now in Cosmos and also the second Cosmos sub consumer chain
please John hey everybody sorry it's been a while can you hear me well can
everybody hear me yeah okay great now I hate just just talking and then not
knowing whether or not and I'm not getting any response that's how it is
with the Twitter space you can't actually see your audience you just see
the avatars but anyway yeah otherwise you're talking for five minutes and then
nobody actually heard you yeah good morning I'm John Galt I'm the head of
strategy at stride and yeah strides had a very good year in 2023 as we've been
discussing in this space 2023 was a bear year but we used it to really set
down roots I feel like we put down a lot of roots we made a lot of connections a
lot of partnerships and we got st tokens a lot of places in the cosmos and now I
feel like to continue this metaphor with roots and everything I feel like 2024 is
gonna be the year we really grow you're gonna see like a big strong tree
branches stretching out lots of leaves because something I'm really excited about
in 2024 is I don't know if everybody's fully aware but it seems to
me like there's just a Cambrian explosion of blockchains in the cosmos
taking place and it it's so exciting and refreshing after like the doldrums of
our recent bear market I mean it just really incredible you have so many
chains we had I mean it started with Tia there at Celestia dy dx but there's
dimension Anishia Babylon nemata zeta chain and these are all fairly large
chains and then there's you know medium sized chains smaller chains yeah but I
don't want to say like the amount of cosmos chains is going to double in 2024
but it kind of seems like it might or it might come close to doing that and so
this is really a fantastic time to be a liquid staking provider and of course
stride is the the premier liquid staking provider in the cosmos we have
very big market share and with all of these chains launching every chain is
going to want liquid staking for their tokens because every chain has to I mean
so long as it's a layer one proof-of-stake cosmos blockchain it's
going to be bootstrapping its security with inflationary rewards probably high
APRs and they're going to want liquid staking so this is a fantastic time like
I said now that stride has such a presence we're so solidified and
strong such strong roots in the cosmos now is a really good time to just reach
up and grow in the short term if anybody's curious you're going to be
seeing st dy dx launching very soon maybe in a week or so and then st tia
coming up st dy m and yeah liquid I mean this is just a fantastic time for liquid
staking and that's what it's all about with stride stride has always been and
probably always will be singularly focused on one thing just liquid staking
we have our own blockchain but the only thing on it is liquid staking we only
have one product which is liquid staking and some small features like
quality of life improvements like autopilot which makes it easier to liquid
stake but really it's just all about liquid staking I won't go on and on
because it's really very simple we offer a liquid staking and we want to
provide the most secure the most accessible liquid staking for all tokens
in the cosmos with integrations and deep liquidity on various taxes so pretty
simple yeah I think that actually stride does a lot of focus so like we were
saying it just before about the lack of focus but definitely stride doesn't
lack of it and also you share that there is a some
upcoming some upcoming news which is quite interesting like SCYDX
we are all looking forward for that also because the Cosmos sub
share the revenue of stride so actually when you see stride getting
adoption this adoption also translate for the Cosmos sub so there is this
strong relation between the two projects which is part of the
the old HZ concept I will go forward if
if a crypto seed was any question to add yeah I mean that's what I had in mind
kind of to also maybe talk a little bit about
the revenue and value accrual for for the AZ right
that has always been something that you know hasn't like fully taken off yet
and some people are also concerned like is that even the right pathway
so I have maybe a question to I guess either of you
but maybe for for spain and john specifically since you guys are
are like the the atom secure chains and you know generate and share revenue
back to to to to the validator and delegator community
like you know now being I don't know six seven eight nine months
atom secured what is kind of your your learnings
and are there any sort of ideas or thoughts around
moving forward any any changes required any adjustments or what are your thoughts on
um yeah I guess um I would say
one thing that's become very clear is that it's very difficult to
generate revenue um for interchange security
um like we've been saying a lot of really good things in this conversation but I
think we should really stay anchored to the
reality of the situation which is um I think
for cosmos hub to thrive it needs probably different revenue sources
to supplement revenue coming in from interchange security because
interchange security revenue is just not that very big
and um interchange security may or may not be
very scalable um so to put some numbers on it
what stride does um stride is an app chain
so we've got an application built into the chain we're not just
making revenue from transaction fees we've got the application which is
obviously liquid staking if you liquid stake was stride
you're earning staking rewards but stride will skim off 10 of those staking
rewards and we do that for the sake of sustainability I mean we don't just
want to be doing inflationary stuff forever
um so we are pretty sustainable we have real
revenue coming in so stride is earning like I said about 10
of um staking rewards that liquid stake token holders
get and then um 15 of that so 1.5 percentage points
goes to the cosmos hub um to pay for interchange security
and in addition the stride chain also sends
there's there's still some inflationary stride going to
strd stakers so 15 of that um goes to the cosmos hub as well
um but even so it's not terribly big it's um off the top of my head I think
it's something like 20 or 25 000 a month um
which sounds like a lot but relative to the value of atom maybe it's not that
much so I've been you know personally quite excited lately to see um
revenue from protocol owned liquidity actually starting to click
that that can be the second revenue source um we've had protocol owned
liquidity um from the cosmos hub on neutron for about
nine months now um recently some more was deployed to neutron
and also to um persistence chain on their dexter decks
but just two weeks ago um a deployment was made to osmosis
and that is starting to make some significant revenue
um stride put out a tweet about it yesterday and so far
it's the amount of atom pol that's been deployed to osmosis is about
100 000 annually in terms of revenue so that's good to see
and then also um personally like this is kind of moving away from stride but
personally of john gault speaking I've been just blown away by the
success of asteroid protocol it the revenue being created for um
for cosmos hub is just insane I mean it's really good we're having this
conversation today because this is the one week
the one week mark since asteroid had their surprise stealth launch
and like asteroid obviously lets you mint inscriptions on cosmos hub tokens
but also nfts and um yeah transaction fees from asteroid
protocol have been roughly 40 000 in just a week which is absolutely blind
mind-blowing um so I feel like yeah and actually
yeah you can jump in I I don't want to ramble just jump in
because you mentioned asteroid actually stay tuned for next week because
we might have an episode related to that so
stay tuned for this one and uh also I think that
what I'm hearing from your speech now is uh
actually very very interesting because uh you basically explained
how many revenue sources right now as the cosmos hub
so you have ICS you have pol which uh is actually doing mini film revenue
right now on those moses as well so actually there is already a quite a big
variety of revenue sources for the cosmos hub and I think
I was written also on the spade on spade
last forum post this is also the meaning of that like
starting to focus on this pillar of the cosmos hub
and it could be a very interesting 2024 ahead of us
uh spade you want to add those as well on the topic
like uh before I interrupted uh jongat you were the
second to speak no I think that makes a lot of sense I
think you know um part part of this like work on on
objectives and priorities as well as like hey as the hub right
um let's have a strategic approach to bringing volumes where they're best
monetized right I think you know like the hub is two
things to balance in so like it's monetary policy
if it wants to take like an active step in furthering the role of
atom as like money in the in the ecosystem which is on the one hand
you want to be proactive in like plugging liquidity gaps
to ensure that atom is like the most functional token you can use to move
value across the ecosystem and a really good collateral asset
um and at the at the same time you also want to create an incentive
to over time create as much volume as possible
where you can monetize it best right where you get
portion of like transaction fees portion of like the mev that they generate and
that kind of stuff right and so I think you know
these early pol deployments are like very encouraging in the sense that like
they're a sign of atom becoming like more proactive
with its monetary policy I think if we are able to like
move towards standardizing automating and making these
more so like constructed I think like that is going to strengthen the hubs like
positions significantly yeah I can speak to that too
unless um you want to move on Rob but um
I think you can share you said oh it's just yeah yeah please go ahead
um yes so I want to just briefly uh one thing because I think
there's also a project in the works uh called time wave I think that's also
very interesting one by by sam harper yeah jian go on please sorry
yeah so um I think first of all I think the thing about
revenue is that um you know in the blockchain space as a whole
uh inflation is uh the vast majority of of income that people see
is from from inflation and um so I think when you compare that with
real revenue that's coming in um that's like you know cold hard cash
uh from you know from fees like asteroids has been pretty amazing but
also from interchange security revenue um it can it
can look underwhelming but that's like the it's kind of a long term
um that's what really matter in the long term so we got it we got to build it up
slowly um however what I will say with what
we're hoping with parts of security is that
having having to be a lot more open having more consumer chains
um there will be a lot more kind of competition
and the market will be able to price what you know what what the what the
revenue is supposed to be um and also probably a lot of consumer
chains will be um will be inflating their token um
to to generate revenue to to pay for their security
which um you know like I said that's that's kind of
uh you know that's that's prevalent in the blockchain space that that like you
know this inflation often outpaces um outpace transaction fees but that's
going to benefit the hub as well because that's going to
be partially going to pay for security um then also on the um
on the pol front uh we were working on a project called atom wars
um and uh cyborgs on our hub you know informal just be not on the hub team
but he's a media inform he he just tweeted about it um and
that's that's kind of going to be like a more structured
and competitive uh sort of um you know uh competition or or marketplace
for for pol deployments yeah this one was the big
alpha of the day because I think that many people have been seeing around this
atom wars circulating on twitter but actually no one
is fully aware of it or what it is yet so
cool to have the alpha now kibtase do you are saying something or
could you say yeah yeah I really just want to reiterate