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Boyco with BurrBear, Goldilocks, Infrared, Jumper, Kodiak, Set & Forgetti (a THJ joint)
Recorded: Jan. 28, 2025 Duration: 1:08:12Space Recording
Short Summary
The discussion highlights several key developments in the crypto space, including the launch of new projects like Kodiak and Goldilocks, which are introducing innovative DeFi solutions. There is significant growth in liquidity, with Boyko securing substantial TVL for major assets. Strategic partnerships are forming between protocols, and technological innovations are being introduced, such as Infrared's liquidity infrastructure and Settin Fogetti's auto-compounder. The democratization of access to liquidity bootstrapping is also noted as a significant advancement.
Full Transcription
Hello, everybody.
We are going for some more speakers to join and then we'll kick off.
Can everybody hear me okay?
This morning's space was pretty funky with the sound.
Yep.
I can hear you, BM.
Next up, I've got to figure out how to add some music.
I'm going to need to talk too.
Maybe, Jani, you can hook me up with some how-tos.
Honestly, we keep it low-fi this side.
We just have a speaker or laptop and then play it.
So depending on the compression, it can sound bad, but sometimes it sounds good.
To be honest, the person, the pro here is Icy from Baritone.
So that would be who I'd go to for pro tips.
have not only had to put up with me trying to coordinate this for the last couple months,
but we're sat through multiple rounds of dry runs, multiple versions of CCDM based off
of different tech upgrades we made, coordinated feedback with me on market creation, worked
on short timeframes, just really all around has been a difficult but enjoyable process
because of the company.
And so excited to get to talk with them a little bit more in depth today, share more
about what they're building, share more about what their markets look like as part of Boyco,
talk to them about the kind of overlap of the Venn diagram between those two things.
And yeah, in case folks haven't noticed, the Baruchain Boyco front end is working again,
the Ryco front end is working, the Jumper front ends are working.
And so we are back online and going to be continuing to grind out nonstop UI, UX, quality of life
improvements over the next 24 hours to hopefully get it to where we have addressed, you know,
everyone's questions.
Building something like this is always tough.
I think we were extremely focused on, you know, the interop and the security of something like
this and may have had some incremental design space that we missed in terms of how to surface
a lot of new things that, you know, when you're sitting really, really close to them
make sense because you've been working on them for months and months and months.
And so intuitively, you're just like, yeah, of course that makes sense.
And then someone sees it for the first time and they go, what the hell are you talking about?
And so we're going to try and close that gap a little bit more over the next 24 hours.
But I think we're getting there really quickly.
And Royco team has been absolutely phenomenal in getting their back end updated and helping
us get all these pushes to the front end done.
And so I'll stop yapping on my side and turn it back over to Sugar so we can kick off with
the app teams.
Awesome.
Yeah.
And I just wanted to add that I think one of the motivations behind putting together these
spaces specifically with the app teams is there's so much excitement about the liquidity
and the markets.
But at the end of the day, all of this is about actually launching real products that
people will use in the not so distant future.
So I also want to give the teams an opportunity to explain even just like, you know, if you're
not exactly familiar with what the dApps do, like where your liquid, what your liquidity
is going towards and how it's going to really make a difference in the go to market that would
be different than what some of the other bootstrapping strategies would enable.
So I don't know if maybe Kodiak, do you want to kick us off and just sort of briefly introduce
what it is that Kodiak does and how Boyko is integrating with your launch strategy?
Yep.
So you have Baratik, one of the co-founders of Kodiak here.
So at Kodiak, we're Baratik's native liquidity platform.
So we kind of own the entire lifecycle of a token.
So we're the place to launch, trade, provide liquidity for any asset on Baratrain.
And for Boyko, it's been a, it's something pretty tremendous.
The amount of liquidity that's come in from just the pre-pre-vault and even day one, I
think just based off games theory, like a lot of people are just probably waiting until
the last 24 hours to deposit, but we already have a hundred mil, a closer hundred mil net
new liquidity into Boyko itself.
But for Kodiak, because we want to be the best place to trade and also even launch to launch
tokens and like have protocols host or liquidity on Baratrain.
Something like Boyko is like very important for us and what it allows us to achieve is nobody
wants to launch their token or host or liquidity on a DEX where there's no deep liquidity for
major assets or even blue chip assets.
But through Boyko, we're able to get kind of secure TVL for blue chip assets as well as
a major asset, such as Honey, USDC, USDT, Wrapped Bitcoin, and even Wrapped ETH before the chain
is even live.
So on day one, it kind of solves that like a cold start problem.
We'll have hopefully more than sufficient liquidity.
And what this allows is other projects that are launching like either Meme Coins or even
protocols that are launching tokens on us.
They know that their pairs will be able to route through liquidity from all the major
assets as well.
And then what this also allows us to do is we work with a lot of other protocols building
on top of us or leveraging our liquidity, such as lending markets, like auto compounders,
perp dexes, et cetera.
And these other DeFi platforms can't really, I guess, scale or kind of even launch without
sufficient liquidity for major assets on Kodiak itself.
So this kind of helps our partners as well.
And then lastly, with this liquidity, like we've kind of secured all the major assets.
And then once we go to launch, we can focus on helping our ecosystem partners kind of like
help grow their liquidity as well as liquidity denominated in Vera.
Awesome.
Janie, do you want to talk a bit about Set in for Jetty?
I think that a lot of the people listening are probably familiar with the honey jar, but
Set in for Jetty is probably a new name to a lot.
If you want to talk a little bit about what that project is going to be doing.
Sure.
First up, thank you, folks.
It's a Herculean effort on the foundation side.
And actually, from our perspective, if you consider the number of conversations, deal
making with LPs and other stuff that would have necessarily needed to happen off chain
behind closed doors.
And if you multiply that by the number of teams that get to benefit from Boico, that's
an immense effort that you folks have put in.
But I think in terms of net effort, it's way less effort than however many teams who are
waiting to launch on Boico each individually going out and trying to make those deals behind
the scenes.
So just from the bottom of our hearts, thank you.
Thank you for the effort because I'm not trying to diminish the amount of effort.
I'm sure you haven't slept in however long.
But in terms of the ecosystem, it's just an incredible zero to one.
So I'm Gianni from The Honey Jar.
You'll have seen us on the timeline, but a succinct way of describing us is that we're
a DeFi team that's disguised as a chaotic marketing organization.
And so you may be more familiar with kind of some of the art on the timeline or just a
constant stream of creative chaos, but really deep on the inside, we're DeFi nerds.
And so Settin Fogetti is just a very simple product that came from the recognition that
when you need to claim your BGC and you need to come back every eight hours, many people,
roughly eight hours, many people would rather not have to do that.
So Settin Fogetti is a simple auto-conbounder that on the inside has some simple different
strategies that allow you to, depending on what you want to do, whether you want to increase
your LP position, whether you want to increase stacked BGT, or in one instance, in the case
of this Boyko Vault is converting some of the different incentives into Henlo points.
And Henlo we can get into, but it's a meme coin that THJ is launching.
Settin Fogetti is just a very simple widget.
It will be available throughout our ecosystem, but we've also made it a plug-and-play widget
that other teams who maybe don't run a validator be able to place the widget inside of their
app and to capture some of the user flow in terms of delegation.
And I think we share up to 25% of kind of fees relating to that.
So it comes from a philosophy of wanting to surface some of the innovation from within
the Veritain ecosystem, which we've all been very kind of eagerly anticipating.
And it kind of brings some of that power straight to the user in user apps.
And that's just from the observation that in a similar way that when you're in your own
city, you frequent your typical coffee shops, maybe your workplace, your home, maybe some
friends' houses.
Most of us are creatures of habit and routine.
And that translates across to the digital realm as well.
So one of the beautiful things about the Veritain testnet is that there's been so much
stuff to do that of the however many tens of thousands of people who've been trying out
the testnet, everyone will have been forming their habits that maybe mentally have their
home bases, whether that's Rayman, Yeet, Berra Borrow, or whatever your particular kind
of routines digitally are within the Berra Eco.
And what we'd really like to do is just make it easy for people to operate Pol from within
those apps by collaborating with different teams.
We obviously run one of the validators over at THJ.
So to summarize, it's an auto-compounder that we want to bring to your favorite hangout spots
that enables you to leverage the power of Pol.
And why sat in Fagetti?
Well, bears love pasta.
And so that's the deal.
Okay, and you just resolved a debate that Jack and I were having, which is, is the G hard
or soft?
Because I was doing a proper Italian pronunciation with the soft G, but it sounds like it's...
Full disclosure.
Janie's got no Italian relatives, so if Janie's butchering it, sorry for your loss.
Yeah, the problem is that Suga is a woman of culture and Janie and I are not, so we read
it like the uncultured bears that we are, yeah.
No, my Italian family or Italian-American family actually pronounces our name wrong.
So, also, so yeah, Set and Forget, I think it's right there in the name, kind of gives
you a good sense of the use case once at launch.
Rado, would you like to, could you kind of kick us off and tell us a little bit more about
Infrared?
For sure, yeah.
First of all, thanks for having me.
And also, huge shout out to Jack, rest of the team, Enzo, Enzo and Boyko team for putting
all of this together.
And then also, shout out to all the protocols and founders for grinding out over the past
weeks, and then also sprinting over the past couple of days to make sure everything is launched
properly and all end-to-end testing is secure, focusing on security and everything.
So, I'm Rado, one of the co-founders here at Infrared.
As I said, we're building liquidity infrastructure here.
What I mean by that is building a suite of tool products to complement interactions with
proof of liquidity with the goal of helping users optimize their yield when it comes into
interacting with PLO.
And then also, like, protocols be able to bootstrap liquidity at the cheapest cost of
capital.
So, we first start looking at, like, two major infrastructure stacks.
One is the liquid staking stack and then the validator stack shortly after that.
Specific to the liquid staking stack, I guess the most relevant, as of now, would be our
IBGT product, which is a novel LSD stack that is specific to BearChain and PLO.
It's designed in a way to complement PLO and be able to help users optimize their yield.
So, allowing users to be able to route their liquidity through us as a pass-through, have
it still go to whatever destination it is, and then be able to earn BGT in a new, like,
liquid and composable token in form of, like, an IBGT wrapper.
Creates several couple benefits, allows users to really just maximize their yield without having
to deal with some of, like, the novelties associated with, kind of, receiving novel BGT.
And then, at the same time, it also introduces composability.
So, you can expect, like, a full DeFi ecosystem to be formed around it, as we've seen happen.
So, promoting innovation and creating a hard asset within the ecosystem.
So, it can generate, like, new activity and then allow for, like, new use cases.
Then, of course, we also have the iBear product, which is going to be more of, like,
the traditional LSD stack.
And then, like any LSD project, we're building, we're accumulating powerful assets to be staked
and delegated to validators to optimize, kind of, like, the validator stack.
And that will allow us to, kind of, one, be able to look at some deeper infrastructure
product, like MEV, consensus block stuff.
And then, also, specific to BearChain, is be a major player in the incentive layer.
So, helping, creating, like, an incentive marketplace where protocols can come and bootstrap liquidity
directly with our validator sets.
And then, at the same time, optimize specific incentives that go back to the validators,
which will flow back to our LSD stack.
So, boosting rewards to curate, kind of, like, the highest reward profile for any yield-generating
tokens, specifically in the form of, like, IBGT and iBear.
So, with, in regards to Boyco, specifically, we, like, the tools and products that we build
are really non-competitive for TVL.
So, a lot of the TVL that comes to us really flows through us as a pass-through.
So, it puts us in a very unique position where we're able to support a lot of the core
permittives within the ecosystem, such as, like, Kodiak's, the Dolomites for the money
market side.
And then, even, like, asset issuers like EtherFi, Abracadabra, and many other partners
that can come in.
So, within Boyco, we're not launching our own native markets.
Rather, we're going to be supporting core partners and core kind of permittives throughout
the ecosystem, so, like, Kodiak, for example, Dolomite, and, like, the reason why we're
taking this approach is because once, like, the assets and liquidity are migrated over,
the LP tokens and assets will flow through its underlying position at whatever core
primitive, and then the LP tokens and receive tokens will then be staked at infrared into
our POL vaults, which opens up the opportunity for users and depositors to be able to participate
in POL rewards, assuming once it's, like, turned on and there would be, like, BGT emissions
pointed to it.
But, yeah, that's a little bit about infrared and then kind of a quick high level on our
Boyco side of things.
So, stop, take a stop there.
Awesome.
Yeah, I think that's one of the things that's, and we can, well, I want to get to Goldilocks
first, but we can talk about later just the way that this setup for liquidity bootstrapping
enabled more collaboration, which I think was really in line with just the Barrett ecosystem
because there are so many projects that collaborate on a daily basis.
So, to be able to incorporate that into this process, I think, has really helped.
So, it's cool to hear that even in the structure of how you've thought through the markets
that went into action.
Because I think that was one of Jack and the team's goals in the design of Boyco was
to make it so people, you know, weren't just competing, but were actually encouraged to
work together.
Awesome.
Goldilocks.
Sorry, I'm not sure who we've got from the team, but if you could kick us off and tell
us a little bit more about your markets and what you guys are working on.
Hey, yeah.
Yeah, so it's Amp Noob here, one of the co-founders of Goldilocks.
So, like everyone else, I just want to echo the kind of extreme thanks for Jack and the
Barrett chain team and the Royco and Enzo guys and everybody that's been involved in making
it such a success.
Really been an incredible amount of work that's gone into it that I've seen.
And yeah, I really can't overstate that.
Yeah, so Goldilocks now, we are kind of a DeFi project that dedicates building various
kinds of DeFi infrastructure on Barrett chain.
There's two things which we're initially launching specifically.
The first one is a novel kind of AMM, which kind of integrates a notion of minimum backing
value for tokens whilst also allowing for kind of natural price discovery mechanisms in
the same way the normal AMM would, and that's where our native token will be trading.
And the second products that we're initially launching is what we call Goldilocks, which
is a yield tokenization platform, platform, which allows users to trade and speculate on
the yield of various kinds of assets on Barrett chain.
And just to kind of dive into the second one, because that's the most one that's most relevant
for Boico, you know, we expect with the kind of the very nature and design of the chain,
we think that a lot of the best yields in DeFi and crypto in the long term are going to
be Barrett native, they're going to be on Barrett chain.
And it's natural then to expect that there's a kind of a real important niche to be filled
for allowing users to trade and speculate on the value of that yield.
And that's really the kind of the function that we're trying to play at the chain.
And kind of so long term, we're really going to be focusing primarily on Barrett native
yields, the kinds of things which can only really happen with proof of liquidity.
And Boico is a kind of an, as we've used it as an opportunity to also bring across, you
know, sources of yield and sources of kind of DeFi opportunities, which kind of already
exist. So specifically, we've been focusing our markets on LRTs, so major Bitcoin and
Ether LRTs. And Boico has helped us to bootstrap liquidity for yield marketplaces for those
kinds of assets. And so from day one, we're going to have significant liquidity for those
assets on Barrett chain. And for anyone who's seen how things have gone in the LRT space over
the last year, kind of the yield trading is a really crucial part of the way that those
projects function. And so having that necessary liquidity to enable that to happen day one
on Barrett chain, I think is significant. And it really allows, really can allow for kind
of the LRTs to thrive on the chain.
I also just want to say kind of something else that maybe hasn't been focused on about Boico
yet so much, but I think is important and really cool is the kind of the way it democratizes
access to these kind of initial liquidity bootstrapping processes, which are usually a lot of them
happen behind closed doors, a lot of them aren't accessible to ordinary users. And it's really
cool, right? The Boico, all of these projects are launching these markets, which allow you
to get access to, you know, the initial distribution of the token, the initial distribution of the
project by negotiating for liquidity in a really clear and transparent way.
So I think that that's a really important innovation, that kind of can't be overstated.
Yeah, that's it for me.
Yeah, thank you for that call out. I feel like I'm much more normie leaning. And when I first
learned about Boico, that was one of the things that really jumped out to me was it almost felt
like when Kickstarter launched and gave access to all of these ideas and products that you might
not have gotten to see until they fully, fully went to market. It's really cool.
One question that I have that just anybody on the panel, if you want to take it, is the idea of
kind of how this might compare to I think we're all often saying like other liquidity bootstrapping,
other liquidity bootstrapping. I don't know if anyone on the panel has kind of done bootstrapping on,
you know, we don't have to name names, but like on other chains and past launches and how you see
this, like kind of go a little bit deeper into what makes this different and what this is enabling
at launch that maybe would have taken longer or wouldn't have been possible without Boico.
I can take a hot dog swing at it. So Jenny's not the detail artist on the team. There's a whole bunch
of people who mop up the kind of creative oversight. But what's I've heard it said, I can't track it
down. So definitely look into this for yourself. But one way of measuring how advanced a society is,
is the number of things that you can achieve and do without really thinking about how they work.
And I see Boico in that kind of arc of by, let's say, making the market more efficient,
you're reducing a vast amount of work that individually all of these different teams would
have had to do by going and meeting LPs or tapping into, let's say, existing social networks,
whether that's through VC funders, whether it's through prior relationships established in
previous protocols, et cetera. And so all of that time that you've saved is time that can be applied
elsewhere. Oftentimes within teams, you might have people who are really proficient at the kind of
institutional side relationships, deal making, et cetera. But not every team has that. And so
oftentimes you'll have, especially in startups, teams having to go outside of their, let's say,
strong wheelhouse or domain of expertise, which is energy that's drawing away from core competencies,
which ultimately are the things you really need the liquidity. It's important. I don't mean to
diminish it. But if your product is around delivering a different set of affordances and
capabilities to the market, it's dependent on and amplified by the liquidity, but it's not the
core aspect. That's the way in which I see kind of Boico. I used zero to one earlier on, and I really
think it is one of those just because it has made the market more efficient. Anytime you've got
a market that is more efficient, that effort, time, and skill can be applied elsewhere. So just at
that high level, that's kind of Jani's read on what's happening here. And I'll be really honest,
now that this is in the wild, I really don't see a future in which this isn't just going to propagate
through other ecosystems. It would be, yeah, I just can't see a reason why that wouldn't happen.
But yeah, that's Jani's hot dog take. I'm sure we'll get into the deep brain stuff now.
Happy to jump in a bit to follow up on Jani's point. Yeah. So I think it's amazing that Boico
provides the ability for liquidity bootstrapping across the ecosystem. It really sets up all the
major participants within the ecosystem and the core parameters for the best chance of success by
being able to push up liquidity ahead of launch. I think on the part of democratizing access across
the board for users, this is the part where I want to focus on a little bit more is I find it
very compelling. I think traditionally, a lot of liquidity deals have always been done behind the
scene. So not only being able to provide transparency and a very educated outlook into what type of
rewards people would receive, but it also allows anybody, whoever you are, regardless if you have
a very strong network or if you're a well or you're planning on depositing a smaller amount to have
access to this. By having the core ecosystem projects participate and just like major projects
that are going to be launching the ecosystem and providing rewards and incentives, it provides
the ability for like all these users and liquidity providers to get buy-in and align kind of their
interests. So not only are you solving for liquidity for like the ecosystem to just bootstrap like
protocols, but at the same time, you're also capturing users and getting buy-in to what hopefully
would be like loyal users for like the, for the long run. All this just generates tremendous value
back to the chain to like the projects and then also back to the users as well. So it's amazing
to see, um, everything being executed. Awesome. Thank you. Um, one thing that I see, uh, kind of on the
timeline or in chats is, is people kind of wondering, should I be locking up my liquidity? Should I not?
I know there's, there's different lockups depending on the market. Um, but does anyone want to try and
take a crack on like that, that question of, of, of, you know, locking up liquidity now versus waiting
for the chain to launch? Yeah, I'll hop in here too, um, just to share some high-level thoughts, but,
um, I think there's a couple of points to this. The first is, is like, um, pre-pre-vaults versus main
boyco. Um, those two things are functionally very, very similar, right? Just with different sets of
trade-offs for different types of users. Uh, a pre-pre-vault is a really good way to get involved
as, you know, you can basically say, look, here are the assets I want exposure to. Let me find the
vault that allows me to retain exposure to those assets. Don't want to think about anything else.
Um, I can do it all in one transaction and I don't have to digest this front end. It's super easy.
Uh, and then the vault managers will handle allocation on your behalf, right? Um, it's already
something that we've worked with them on. Um, and they're, they're quite familiar with the product at this
point. Um, the second thing is I've seen a lot of people asking, well, should I deposit now or should
I wait till the last day? Um, and that's, I think quite a reasonable question. Um, the, the answer
is there's no advantage one way or the other, right? Like if you want to just deposit and be done with
it, you can do it today. Um, what I suspect a lot of folks are doing is as the course of the week
goes on, right? As you deposit, you're, you're locked until the expiration of the market. Um, in case
anyone cares, the reason for that isn't solely to just lock people's funds. It's because, um, we tried to put
as much of this on chain. So it's trustless, uh, as trustless as possible. And the way that that
works is that anytime a user deposits, um, they're actually adding a leaf to a Merkle tree that is
bridged over to bear chain along with the funds, which allows us to handle withdrawals down the
line. Um, and so as a result of that, it's, it's, um, very, very difficult, let's just say to like
remove a line, go back and figure out like, Oh, this user wants to withdraw. Like, how do I go back
and, and remove that, that leaf of the tree? Um, and so, um, the, the reason for that is, is technical,
not, uh, economic, let's just say. Um, but as a result of that, right, like I expect a lot of folks
are waiting towards the end of the period to deposit so they can start to see which pools are filling up,
um, which pools remain kind of most enticing, uh, where yields end up, uh, where the deposits for the
pre-pre-vaults end up specifically in terms of allocation, right? You can kind of get a directional
sense of this in that, you know, the, the USDE vaults will only go into USDE markets, the, the LBTC
vaults will only go into LBTC markets. There's also a little bit of nuance there, right? In that
like concrete has an LBTC and a WBTC market. Um, it doesn't mean that the WBTC market is, is just
getting deployed generically. It's, it means that, um, those two assets will in practice get paired
against each other on mainnet. Um, and so to, to share this question of, um, should I wait or should
I deploy now? Uh, you know, I, I don't know that I have a perfect answer for that. The answer is
probably it depends, right? Um, if you have an opinionated view, uh, on bearer or on applications
on, in the bearer ecosystem and you want exposure to it, uh, now, right? Like this is effectively your
first opportunity to do so. Um, at the same time, one of the beauties of bearer chain and
a proof of liquidity specifically is this ability to like bifurcate different, um, different user
preferences into different tokens. Right. And so it's like, if I want, um, staking and validator
exposure, then I want to hold bearer and I want to stake it somewhere, whether that's iBearer or
somewhere else. Um, alternatively, if you want exposure to like the fees being generated from, um,
application incentives towards validators, then you probably want to get involved with
BGT. And I think the latter, if I had to guess is probably what's most interesting to folks
is it feels like that's where a lot of the novelty of bearer chain really lies is in that
interaction of BGT, um, with like standard proof of stake economics. And so if I had to
guess, right, like, I think folks are likely underestimating just how much, uh, demand there
will be on mainnet for, uh, getting early exposure to a lot of that BGT. And I think
that that really is, uh, exemplified even by the fact that folks like Origami and THJ made,
uh, BGT acquisition effectively a core part of their vault strategy is like, Hey, I want
to be the first seat at the table in size. Um, and so I think we'll see a lot of both.
Uh, and then that hasn't even mentioned the fact that, um, Boyco because of the tremendous
amount of operational and technical overhead, um, as well as the fact that I am simply, uh,
one man, um, and can only do so much, uh, ended up limited to kind of these, these 11 applications
and two vaults. And so, um, that doesn't even really scratch the surface, uh, of, uh, of what
we expect to see on mainnet, right? Like bear chain ecosystem is crazy. Um, there's, there's
probably 250 to 300 applications that'll be deployed on mainnet. Um, and so we're, I, I
know that there's going to be a lot of really cool stuff launching that either we didn't
have ability to fit into Boyco or wasn't a fit for Boyco. Um, and so, you know, I fully
expect to see a lot of folks utilizing either Boyco itself, right? Like there's an easy way
to turn it into, or a fairly easy way to turn it into something that can continue post
mainnet, right? Not just a pre-deposit program, but a post-deposit or a post-deposit program.
Um, there's other folks, uh, like jumper that have really cool variations of the product and
have built on top of it. I know the folks over at roots are building in Barrow, which
is kind of like a virtual liquidity commitment platform that I think has some really nice design
elements and they'll be releasing more info on that soon. Um, and so, yeah, like, look,
like, do I have a perfect answer for, for, for someone that's answering that? No, uh, I'm
always like a NFA, DYOR kind of guy, but I hope that at least gives people the information
that they need to, to make a little bit of a, uh, of a more educated decision on where
they want to do stuff.
Thank you. Yeah. I think that that's the thing I've, I've seen throughout this process
is there's a lot of different options for people depending on not just like, uh, I think
in this world, it's, it's almost less risk tolerance and more like how much research or
effort do you want to put in. Um, but I think that we're probably ready now to, to move to
questions if, uh, unless anybody else on the panel wants, uh, to chat about anything else.
All right. So, um, if you would like to ask a question, uh, can please, uh, apply to be
a speaker and I'll start approving, uh, people and please just, uh, try to keep your questions
kind of brief. We will try and get through, uh, as many as we can.
Okay. Let's see, unless we don't have any. There we go. Okay. Uh, the alpha degen, I'm proving you.
Okay. Um, you can also, if, uh, it might be a little bit faster than trying to approve speakers,
feel free to DM questions to the bear chain account and I'll just read them in the messages.
Um, and then I can read them so we don't have to kind of worry about, but I think the alpha degen,
you should be approved to speak. Thank you for having me up. Thank you for this space. It's
very informative. Um, and I love sitting around being the dumbest guy in the room. Sorry for my loss,
but, um, no, this is, this is what we, everybody's waiting for. It feels like Q5 is alive, regardless
if it's alive or dead, but it's definitely on the way. But my question, um, it surrounds sustainability
and have anyone done any sustainability models and modeled out like two, five and 10 years
or any type of throughput at all? If that makes sense.
Yeah, uh, I guess that one's for me. So, you know, I think the answer is yes,
but the answer is also, it kind of depends on exactly what you're talking about. Um,
and so the way I think about this and break this out is into kind of two categories, right? Um,
the first is, uh, I guess with, uh, Boico specifically, right? And so, yes, I did a
lot of economic modeling on Boico. That's how a lot of the, uh, the math and multipliers were decided.
That said, right, they weren't necessarily from a two, five and 10 year time present, right? That
isn't really the goal or the focus of this program specifically. Um, but that isn't to say that,
those things aren't important parts of what we were looking at, but with, with proof of liquidity,
right? What really matters is, uh, from a Boico perspective is solving the cold start problem.
Because if you achieve that, then you really kind of set this, the baseline for, um,
bear chain to do what bear chain was designed to do. I think the saddest outcome would be for us to
have gone into all this work for the last few years to, to really do something thoughtful and
novel in terms of the, um, the proof of liquidity side, uh, and then not have any liquidity to,
uh, to prove so to speak. And so, um, you can think of this as both like a cold start problem
for applications, but also for the chain as a whole. Uh, and the second part of that is,
I think more relevant to probably the underlying question, which is really like,
how does this thing work at scale? Um, and the answer is yes. Like we've done
a ton of quantitative work. We've done economic audits. We've done as much as we possibly can
on proof of liquidity to ensure that it's both stable, um, and has the ability to sustain itself.
But, you know, I think a lot of folks, um, over complicate proof of liquidity in some capacity,
because in some ways it's, it's complicated. Um, but in, in many ways, it's mostly just really,
really different than anything they've seen before. Um, but in practice, right? Like if you think about it,
um, what all that proof of liquidity really needs to be able to do is to be able to increase the
amount of, uh, value that it captures, which is measured in the form of application incentives
to validators. Um, and that needs to be greater than the inflation that the chain is producing.
Right. And then you effectively have like some form of, of unit economic positive value capture
that doesn't exist on any other POS chain because no other POS chain has those application incentives.
Um, and, and my perspective on that is like, if the chain can't grow those numbers at like,
you know, whatever inflation is, um, then that, that they've probably already failed. Um,
and so, you know, the focus is always on applications first.
Thanks. Um, great. Uh, Curry, I'm going to approve you.
And I got, uh, some messages of questions, but unfortunately I don't think we can help, uh,
answer how to explain this to your tax accountant. I wish we could,
because I would also like an answer to that.
They'll be saying ooga booga before long. They'll, they'll know.
They'll know.
While we're waiting for the, can I, um, um, we've been running a few, uh, June dashboards,
just some numbers whilst we're waiting for the questions to come up. Uh, we're at around two,
2.2 billion, uh, and, uh, give or take some change, um, in the pre-deposit vaults across 152
thousand or 152 and a half thousand users. Um, so that's in the pre-deposit vaults. And of
them about 4.5% hold ecosystem, um, NFTs. So the vast majority of that says about 139,000 people,
um, uh, uh, uh, don't have an indicator on, on their wallet that they've, uh, been, uh,
priorly engaged in the ecosystem. Um, and of those NFT holders that constitutes about, uh, 20% of people
who hold an NFT, a bear chain ecosystem, NFT in their wallet. So it's about 20%. And in terms of
the Boico markets that have just launched, we're up near 90 million TVL across about 1300 depositors.
So, um, in terms of, uh, I don't know what you guys over at the foundation thought whether that lines
up with what you thought, but we're definitely seeing like an influx of new eyes, new attention,
um, on the chain, which all kind of feeds into the attention economy flywheel. Um, and this type
of things, it's just, yeah, from our perspective, looking, looking at the on-chain data has just,
uh, been really solid so far.
Awesome. And I encourage everyone to favorite those Dune dashboards. They're fun to refresh.
Um, uh, Curry of, uh, uh, OX Tistic Angel, uh, you're approved to speak. Are you still there?
If not, I'm going to approve.
Yeah. Okay. Great.
I appreciate you letting me up. Um, super exciting stuff, guys. I am like,
I feel like I'm so behind the eight ball on this one. It's driving me nuts because like a lot of
others just been chasing waterfalls, you know, the past couple of weeks, bear chains definitely been
on the forefront. I would say just on my attention, just on the front burner. Um,
I've been doing the test net stuff and doing the swaths, trying the burps, all the good stuff,
you know, I guess what I'm, my question and my whole reasoning of coming up here was like,
how do I get more? And I guess you guys are kind of answering that with this boy co thing. And
I had found that chatted it up with one of my buddies, sent the link, like, Hey, is this the
thing that I need to be looking for? And I guess the question is more just like, is the next step
of getting involved with this thing? Is this pre pre vault through this pre vault, uh, thing and
just depositing, uh, wrapped Ethan there and just, and, and just waiting.
Um, yeah, I guess I'll try and take a stab at this as well. And then maybe I'll turn it over to,
uh, to the, sorry, that was such an open, such an open-ended question. I know I'm serving you a
grenade. It's okay. It's all right. Um, I, I think, uh, a lot of life is really learning how
to answer open-ended questions. Uh, um, but you know, I, I'll, I'll be brief here for once in my
life and then I'll kind of turn it over to Jannie and Kodiak and Goldilocks and right now, because,
um, you know, one of the things that's special about, um, our eco is that we don't have to do a lot of
kind of like onboarding and guidance because we have such a great network of folks that do it for
us. Like there's so much grassroots, organic love and demand for what's been built that I actually
don't think I'm the best person to answer how to get involved. Um, because all the folks that are
involved know better than I do. Um, in terms of, of how to get into Boyko, I think there's like
basically two broad questions to ask yourself, right? It's like, what assets do I have or what
assets do I want to allocate? And that might be weak. That might be Bitcoin. It might be an LST
or an LRT. It might be a stable. It might be something like even further down the risk curve
than that. Um, and then the second is how involved do I want to be, right? If the answer is, if I want
to be really hands-off, then find a pre-pre-deposit vault that lets you be hands-off that, um, services
the kind of asset that you want and you're done. Um, if you want to be more involved, right, then
basically just filter Boyko by the assets that are interesting to you and start searching through the
markets. There are descriptions on every market that help under, that help you understand exactly
what each Boyko deposit script does. Um, there are resources on the blog with, uh, more information
about all the applications and find something that sounds interesting, find something that you're
excited about, uh, jump into a, a, a discord or a Twitter or something from, from these apps and, uh,
and start to get a sense of the culture, man. I think that's what, what really drives a lot of what
we do is, is, you know, love for the game and, and, and passion. And so, um, find the group that,
that you identify with the most and, uh, start Ooga Booga.
Yeah. Thanks dude. I appreciate it. Uh, I've been welcomed a little bit by these,
these Henlo guys seem like to be some, uh, some legit people. So yeah, I appreciate it.
Thanks for answering. Yeah. Hello.
In terms of there's, there's a vast amount of, um, the ecosystem is big, um, and it's growing.
It can be intimidating. One of the, uh, uh, signatures that I've picked up from folks is
maybe it's almost overwhelming and that can trigger in folks a sense of, oh, I'm, I'm too late.
Um, Jani was around, uh, pre Ethereum ICO. And when I hear people say that, uh, in, in, inside my head,
I go like, imagine being pre Ethereum and, and on the eve of the launch and then saying, oh, I'm, I'm late.
I think it's, there's a comparable number of zero to ones here. Um, but in relation to, uh, just information,
um, I can give you, if you've got a pen and paper, this is being recorded, so you can roll it back.
Bearer searches, uh, threads, uh, bearer search from, uh, Raymond, fantastic information. Uh, Kevin from Ooga Booga
has been putting out kind of these really short, sharp 20 minute, um, interviews with ecosystem players, um,
that kind of really gets into the details. Uh, we've got wadge up. I can see him with a purple heart
from IVX does really kind of, um, good, uh, threads and YouTube videos. I'd be remiss not to
mention bearer land, uh, bearer land have a fantastic kind of ecosystem, um, uh, explorer.
And I have to show my own bags here. Um, uh, if you want a particular form of, uh, uh, bearer mental
illness, uh, follow, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, Twitter thread, but, um, in case you want it a bit more
kind of succinct going to the THJ, um, uh, site we've often every Wednesday or Thursday,
we've got education threads. So those are some starter points, but, um, really, um,
I agree with Jack, whatever your interest is, whether it's GameFi, GambleFi, NFTFi,
meme stuff, uh, the very eco really has a lot of different zones. And if you head to the different,
uh, dApps, most teams are really good at onboarding folks, but not just the teams,
it's the community of people who've made that their home. Um, and so far as Johnny's seen,
um, uh, that feeling of feeling late doesn't last long because you realize, oh, folks will,
folks will chat with me. Um, I've got questions and they get answered. Um, so that's kind of a high
level kind of community ecosystem end of the spectrum answer that there's, yeah,
there's a lot of folks putting effort into trying to aggregate the information, um, into more
digestible forms. But really once you've got that thread of curiosity, um, I don't know,
I don't think you can bottom out on this ecosystem just cause it's compounded over years now. There's
just so much, um, that really, uh, it's, you're not going to get rugged on your time in the sense that
you could really follow your thread of curiosity for weeks, months, and you're not going to bottom
out and find the bottom because it's, this generative culture that's just keeps adding
more and more and more. And I think culture compounds in that sense. And, um, from Johnny's
perspective, the BeraEco, um, has definitely, uh, reached escape velocity. And that's really
in a big way, why, why there's so many then, um, it's a flywheel. That's why there's so many teams
who've decided to make BeraChain their home because, um, yeah, that, that, uh, uh, uh,
raw, raw resource of just people here, um, adding their time, attention, skill, um, and effort, uh, uh,
towards this shared zone is, yeah, it's, I haven't, in the decade that I've been in, in this sector,
plus I've not seen an L1 launch into as mature a culture as this. So I hope that helps and welcome.
Good to see you here. And hello, and furthermore, ooga-booga.
Yo, that last line hit really hard right there. That's exactly how I felt just coming into this
is just like, yo, it's like walking in to a place. The chain hasn't even launched yet.
And it's already like rooms and rooms and rooms and rooms and rooms of people.
It's definitely overwhelming. Like you said, dude. And yeah, I, I appreciate that. It's definitely
just a little bit of a feel of overwhelming, but at the same time, that's probably a good thing
in this space, uh, where it's typically like vast emptiness and, uh, regenerative of like,
uh, down bad agains or whatever. I do have a final question, if you guys don't mind. Um,
this one's kind of silly. Does, uh, does testnet bara get translated to, uh, to mainnet?
Negatory big Ben. The fake money does not become real money directly.
Exactly. That's a big 10 for ghostwriter. Yes, sir. Signing off.
All right. Um, I'm going to do our last question. Uh, it came through DMs, um, from Waj.
Um, this boy co is a fantastic for the start cold start problem for BTC Ethan stables.
Were there any considerations for other asset types, uh, long tail assets, RWAs, et cetera. And if so,
which ones, um, and I would just, um, add to this for the DAPs. Um, I think it would also just be
interesting if, you know, they're not included in boycott, but if you have plans to include those
other types of assets, uh, you know, soon down the line. Yeah. I'll speed run the high level,
uh, on the strategy here, and then I'll turn it over to the DAPs to talk about how they're thinking
about using some of these. So the answer is yes. Um, there was a lot of interest in longer tail things.
The answer though, is that like, I didn't really see those as a core part of the cold start problem.
And I also don't see them as like a core part of the chain's mandate to solve in some capacity,
right? Like the honest answer is like, I think some of the RWA stuff is interesting,
but I haven't actually really seen a good use for it just in a vacuum. I was like,
I want to just supply this into a liquidity pool and like, there's magically going to be some utility
from it. I do, however, see a lot of value in it, um, to use for like a collateralization of
stable assets. Um, and that's exactly what folks like Reservoir are doing, right? Um,
which is in Boyko with RUSD. Um, some of the other longer tail stuff like meme coins,
like I know that stuff is absolutely going to cook on bear chain. Um, I don't see it as like
a mandate of solving a cold start problem. And even more than that, I think it's not my design space
to put, to push into it. It's almost like too paternalistic. Um, I want to make sure that
there's still design space for folks and applications to innovate on launch and to build
really cool shit. And I'm not just coming in here and saying like, all right, here are the
10 applications that are going to get to do everything end to end. And that's it. Right.
The goal is really to say, okay, like let's bootstrap the pools that will benefit all
applications across the entire ecosystem in aggregate. Right. It's like, if I have stable
liquidity paired against BTC and in WBTC, ETH liquidity, and like all of these majors and LST pools,
then, and then, uh, a new lending market that launches, like, let's say Euler comes over to
bear a chain. Um, guess what? Like day one, they can have high supply caps and their vault managers
can, uh, effectively allow people to put on LST loops. And so it becomes one of these things that
really propagates broadly. Whereas if I, if I started to just like, you know, take really opinionated,
uh, paternalistic bets on these things and say like, here users, this is what you have to do. Um,
you know, I don't think that's really what we're about at the end of the day. What we're about is
like creative freedom and agency. Um, and so I'll let the rest of the folks speak on, on what their
kind of plans are for some of these things. You know, I think Goldilocks probably has some
interesting things that we're, they're working on with, with yield splitting, um, and with the
baseline products. I think that Kodiak has a lot going on with Panda factory. Um, I know that
Jannie and team are, are always cooking on like 15 different things at once. And so, um, I'll,
I'll pass off to them to, to give a more thoughtful long tail answer.
Yep. So, um, so I'll speak on the Kodiak side, like with Boyko, um, I think it's good to
concentrate on the majors and also blue chip assets. Um, also like we would have loved to
do like stuff denominated in Bera, but Bera doesn't exist yet. And we don't like, nobody
wants to deposit X asset and just be filled at a certain price where they wish they could
have got filled at a different price. Um, so, but in terms of like Boyko, like we wanted
to secure the major assets. Cause that really does solve the cold start problem. Like we
don't want like Kodiak to launch with a bunch of meme coins, but, um, nobody can get into
WEF or, uh, or Bitcoin or even stables. Um, on the other hand, like I think what, after
Boyko launches, um, there's also the RFA portion, um, where majority of those, um, incentives
from the RFA program have to go towards main net incentives, uh, for that application,
as well as there's a proof of liquidity, like proof of liquidity is supposed to solve the
issue of, of like a lot of these cold start, like a lot of these solutions to cold starts,
like initial like liquidity mining campaign or like, um, like chain level incentive programs.
Um, they last in the big, uh, they last for a few months and then rewards run out and like
people migrate to another ecosystem, but proof of liquidity ensures that they're sustainable
and also perpetual rewards from the chain, uh, from the chain layer itself. Um, so I think
that will, um, like all of these other types of assets can kind of benefit from, benefit
liquidity once the chain launches. And from Kodiak side, like, well, um, now we can shift our
focus to, um, helping projects launch their tokens through Panda factory, um, like both
projects as well as meme coins. And then on the core decks itself, um, help project, help
protocols that raise funds, um, or, or do like a public sale or just like seeding liquidity.
Um, like let's say they, um, they're doing a lot, uh, a public sale through like ramen. Um,
once they complete their sale, then that liquidity is migrated over to Kodiak. Uh, we want to help
them, uh, grow their liquidity to the point where now they can get another, uh, they can
get their pools whitelisted for BGT emissions. Um, and then, um, and then even work with infrared
to kind of kickstart that POL flywheel. Um, but yeah, I'll hand it off to, um, I guess,
Jani or, um, or, uh, or Raito or even Ampnu.
Um, yeah, I'll go, I'll go quickly. I just wanted to, I mean, I get the feeling maybe folks are
looking for, um, kind of examples of some of the cool stuff, which will be available
kind of, uh, once we actually get into mainnet and they're able to, you know, all the tokens
are actually live and stuff. Um, I just wanted to give one example, which is like an illustration
of how many kind of synergies have been built between all the projects kind of, and how rich
the ecosystem is going to be. Right. So we've got like proof of liquidity on the chain, which
is this, um, kind of going to be this canonical core source of yield and source of incentives on
the chain. Then you've got infrared, right. Who've got LSTs, um, built on top of the proof of
liquidity stack. Um, and then you've got, uh, like projects like origami, right. Who are doing,
who are building also compounders, um, for those LSTs so that, you know, users who know that they
just want to maximize their, their kind of, uh, governance power or their stake in the chain.
Um, they know they can kind of set and forgetting it in a, in a IBGT also compounder, for example.
Um, and then like we are very much looking at, you know, building yields yield trading on top of
that. Right. So then you can take origami's, uh, also compounding wrapper for IBGT, uh, and you can
kind of, um, you know, uh, uh, try to price the yield on that, the expected future yield on that.
And then the liquidity for those is going to be housed on Kodiak. Right. And we'll be using their
concentrated liquidity, um, managers for those pools moving forward. Um, so you can just see that like,
you know, the opportunities and the, the stuff that we can talk about, it's kind of endless because
there's just so many, uh, kind of pieces would have been put together and the teams have been
working synergistically already for a couple of years. And, um, that's really pretty unique, I think.
Daniel, what's going on next? Can I take a super quick one? Um,
um, Johnny from THJ here, uh, in terms of information aggregation, how could I forget,
uh, the honey cast, but in, um, uh, Arnav at some point during the bear, uh, Arnav came up,
uh, from hash key capital came up with this, uh, really neat phrase, which has, has stuck with a lot
of us. And that is, um, uh, using the metaphor of, uh, bear chain as a canvas for infinite economic games.
Um, one of the things which I love because it, it's this open ended thing. You've got this, uh,
let's say a primitive set of building blocks that then you can kind of, uh, reconfigure up and build
out in different ways. One of the things in, in my travels, uh, through the ecosystem, a lot of new
folks entering into the eco kind of, uh, uh, we meet them along the way and, uh, it's this kind of
maybe, uh, uh, a hard, um, uh, uh, seeing bear chain as defy chain. And actually I think that's
missing quite, quite a, a, a big, um, trick because when you get down into the projects
building, you'll actually notice there's a, um, a bunch of game five builders such as
baritone, barimonium, there are horses. Um, there's, uh, stuff over on the social side,
NFT side. Um, and, uh, I think it would be a mistake just to pigeonhole the chain just into,
um, like thinking it's, um, uh, a lot of defy games, which of course, like a lot of us that are
here have come from defy. We love that stuff, but actually the pole mechanism can feed into,
um, all of these different sectors in interesting ways. And that kind of corresponds to how society
at large works, right? So you may be working one sector, but at somewhere on the backend,
it's tapped into markets and in some sense, whether you, um, directly touch that or not.
Um, I'll give one small example and then, uh, maybe pass on to writer or whoever. Um, so one of
the products that we built out, um, towards the beginning of the testnet was a product called
cub quests. Um, and that was cause we didn't, we didn't want to use, um, stuff from outside of
the eco because there was a lot of, let's say, uh, extra, uh, sinks and, uh, rooms that we didn't
necessarily need, but we, we did want something that could, uh, give people simple things to do,
um, that just essentially costs time. Now, in terms of, uh, incentive mechanisms, uh, but for them,
for the most part, um, uh, uh, uh, uh, other big providers, they need to pull in some type of
incentive exogenously. So from outside of their system. Uh, so maybe other people use it to,
I don't know, create some grind set as to, okay, if you do these grinds, then you're going to get a
reward from some external party. Um, Baruchain really allows you to flip that stuff on its head.
So one of the design spaces, once the chain launches is we can actually look at the cub quests,
product, commoditize it to have it essentially be as like a, um, uh, education and guide type of
experience. Because a lot of the time, what you're dealing with with people is kind of that
cold start problem, emotionally speaking, in terms of inertia, like that, that hesitation,
uh, this feels unfamiliar. I'm not sure if, if I'm going to give it a try. And one of the superpowers of
stuff like that is just to really guide you over that threshold so that when you are playing,
um, with, with real funds, you're kind of more informed, you have a bit more experience.
Now, finally, we have a chain where actually, uh, tools like cub quests, we can look at, um,
endogenous rewards. So we can look at, okay, what are ways that we can incentivize particular type of
actions, commoditize it. So different teams can kind of, um, uh, let's say reduce the cognitive
overload for trying stuff. Um, but then have some of the incentives draw from, um, emissions itself.
It's, it's kind of a completely new design space. And that's why I like, um, on apps, uh, uh, uh,
canvas for infinite, infinite economic games, but I would feel sad if folks just pigeonhole it into
just defy, because I think a lot of the time what we're dealing with is let's say liquidity of
attention, liquidity, and it's not constrained necessarily just to this one category. And so for that
reason, uh, at THJ, we, it's a compulsion by this point, we keep noticing things that can be built
and then building them out just because, uh, Verachain as a, as a building space, it just, um,
it kind of promotes that type of, um, innovation and, um, uh, capability for applying, uh, these, uh,
new baseline innovations in so many different directions. So if you're out there and you're on
the fence and you're a builder, uh, that's, I, I would guess why so many teams, why we're launching
with two to 300. Um, but it's, yeah, there's a lot, but the, the design space is wide open.
So if you've got some crazy, like I did, please come and spend some time and check it out.
Cause I think it will be, uh, even if you go a different direction, it will be an interesting
mind experiment, um, for you to kind of, uh, check out some of the new paradigms, mental models,
and this type of thing.
Yeah, really well said Johnny. And, um, just to touch on that too, like, uh, DeFi definitely
makes up a small portion, um, of like Verachain. Um, there's amazing applications that are launching
too, like shout out to, um, PuffPaw in more of like the depend side of things. And then also Eden,
which, uh, which is a really amazing project, um, bit on the play of like sex to earn. Um,
so really cool, innovative projects that are like being built on Verachain, um, in general.
Um, so again, really, really well said and glad you kind of like brought up that, um,
topic, Johnny. Um, I, I think the previous question too, was in regards to long-tail assets.
So just to touch on that a little bit, um, at infrared, we typically take an unimpinionated
position, um, very neutral, um, in a sense, um, where our goal is really just to build like the
tools and products to support. Um, so in regards to like Boyko, right. I do, I like,
I think one of the major benefits is being able to build the base layer of liquidity, um, through
all the majors, um, and then large cap assets. And that provides the foundation for, you know,
for the longer-tail assets to launch come mainnet. Um, so two parts, right. Building, uh, initially
building that like subset of liquidity and then second, um, for the tokens to actually go live.
And then wherever those token lives, um, whether it's being housed on Kodiak, BEX,
um, another DEX or liquidity venue, um, infrared, when we step in is, um, at least on like the
bootstrap liquidity side of things is to be able to help streamline access to PLL. So within PLL,
I like the unique part of the design and the thesis of bear chain to begin with is to help, um, make
things more capital efficient. So that means like, um, protocols are longer-tail assets, bootstrapping
liquidity, um, to build deeper pockets of liquidity, um, without giving like without wasting emissions.
Um, so that, that means like incentivizing validator sets to boost BGT emissions towards their pool,
um, to incentivize liquidity providers to, um, LP and deposit liquidity there. Um, so part of like our,
our, like stack of tools and products is going to be like the incentive markets where, you know,
protocols, um, and any stakeholders, um, that has an incentive to direct more emissions towards, um,
a certain kind of pool will be able to come to us and incentivize like the validators to
direct emissions that way, um, in a very simple and streamlined matter. And then we'll also have
like tools to optimize, um, for kind of like the, the best rate of exchange and, um, tools so that
people can like easier, easily understand kind of like what, like the exchange rate between like the bid
tasks of like what incentives go into per like BGT emitted, um, stuff like that.
Thank you. Um, and I think we're over time, so I think we're going to wrap up, but I just want to
thank everyone for joining today. Um, we are going to have deeper dives with that the individual depths
are hosting, um, starting tomorrow and later throughout the week. So keep an eye out. Um,
we will be posting a schedule from the bear chain Twitter so that, um, you can, if you want to go
like really deep with any of the individual projects and, and learn more about the markets or ask more
kind of market specific information, um, we'll have those opportunities. Uh, and then also just, uh,
tomorrow morning around, uh, at 10 AM Eastern, uh, we're going to have another space similar to this,
but with, um, another batch of the Boico dApps. Um, so mark your calendars if you have some time in
the morning, but, um, thank you so much everyone for joining, uh, and, and happy Boico.
Happy Boico everyone. Uh, and furthermore, Ooga Booga. See you later.
Bye.
