Good morning gang. We're just gonna give it a few minutes here. Let the room fill up. Get the guests up here and then we're gonna kick it off.
What's up Jason good morning
Fantastic house everyone didn't wait
There's good Miami right on right on we're just gonna give it a few minutes to let the room fill up and we for alter to show up and then we'll get rocking and rolling Sounds good Where are you right now?
I'm based in Vancouver so I'm on the PST baby. Is there a lot of web 3 stuff in Vancouver? Yeah, surprisingly actually. I just went to the pizza dial thing last week and there was a really great turnout as well as like mana
Fold, Dapper Labs, Clone Network, it's all based out of Vancouver, so it's got a pretty good Web 3 pedigate. Gotta make a trip out there. Yeah, it's also it's near Westlark too. Oh absolutely. Yeah, it's definitely one of those places to check out if you haven't.
What's up? What's up? How's everybody doing?
I was doing great. I heard you guys talking about pieces. So I had this. What's up, med? How's your day going so far? Fantastic.
I've not seen such a packed Twitter space. It's 300 people here. Yeah, it's bumping. Well, you know, third web is a part of it. Yeah, we got truly low in there. Like now we're rocking.
Love to see it. Well, you know, everybody's here. So maybe this is a great, great time to kick it off. I want to welcome everybody here to our, you know, Power by Web 3, TELLOS panels that we've been having. Today, we're cutting into infrastructure. I know it doesn't seem
like the most sexy topic, but I promise you by the end of this conversation you're going to be a nerd for what infrastructure means, especially on telos. And I think we've got two really killer guests on deck here to talk about why it's important and what they're building and what it means for telos as well. So maybe just before we dig in
Let's do a quick round of introductions for anybody new in the room. I'll kick it off here. I'm the big gooey. I've been working for the foundation for a little over a year. I've been working in the NFT department with my buddy Jake here. Just kind of working feverishly to be making sure there's tools for people to
create NFTs on chain. Jacob pass it off to you. Hey everybody I'm Jacob I've been working with the big GUI here at the end of the NFT department over here at the TELUS foundation for a little under a year. I'm a NFT collector and creator and
Awesome, I guess we'll go next. So hello everyone, my name is Majd on the founder and CEO at Altera and we build gaming infrastructure for Web 3 games that basically helps all kinds of game developers seamlessly come into the world of Web 3. I'm a software engineer at heart, but I'm also a gamer. I've been playing video games since pretty much
much. Even before high school where Counter Strike was my favorite video game and Web 3 Gaming is the intersection of all of my favorite things. Jason I'll pass it on to you. Cool. What's up I'm Jason Hitchcock. I lead the ecosystem programs at third web. I work
We're a complete developer framework. I also run an organization that runs called forum moons. We run validators in the cosmos ecosystem for like canto and osmosis and advise hedge funds on
DeFi investing strategies.
in the space. So Jason, do you want to kind of kick off how it is you got involved in this crazy, crazy circus? You know, I bought Bitcoin just like anybody, like, you know, years after, you know, whatever that's holding tokens. But then I remember when, right, when DeFi summer happened, I was my friends asked me like, what are you doing with your
And he he worked at a DeFi company and I was like what do you mean? What am I doing? What do you do with these and then he showed me how to like collateralize it on maker and mint dye and next thing you know I was yield farming and I was just doing all the DeFi things and I was realizing You know that that was my like entry into realizing oh these are actually
apps. I've always been excited about crypto because you can build apps with new properties. Now I'm curious to see what people are going to build. How about you, Mitch? How did you get into this mess?
So I used to, I was kind of interested in investing in high school. It was off the back of like an investing course and I started watching Graham Stefan and then I started to work a part-time job in high school. So I started accumulating a little bit of extra cash and
I couldn't get into the stock market because of my age. I believe I was about 18 at the time. I couldn't open any investments account or invest traditionally. I started looking at alternatives. I started searching investments for 18-year-olds. I ran into Bitcoin.
late 2018. So I started by just literally investing in Bitcoin and then I started you know as a technical person I got down the rabbit hole, I read the white paper and then I learned about it theoretically and that just blew my mind and I started learning about smart contracts and solidity and the EVM and then from there I just kind of fully got you know
tangled up into this mess as you say and just kept learning and learning and it's really been my life since 2018. Love to hear it. Well, I think the thing I've learned the most about this space is like when it iterates so fast upon itself and you know spending any modicum of time in here
a year plus, you gained a bunch of skills, a few series about sitting in the environment. I'm curious now to interrogate, what is it that you think about the purpose of your app, what brought it forth, and why was it so important to create something like this?
in the crypto ecosystem. Magic, do you want to start on that one? Yeah, absolutely. So the question is, what brought this application forward and why I believe it's important? Yeah, yeah, exactly. Sure. So, again, I've been playing video games for most of my life and I think Counter Strike is actually a fantastic
a case study of digital assets and secondary markets for digital assets. So for those who are unfamiliar, CounterStrike is a traditional Web2 game, but it has a sprawling item economy where basically people can unlock these assets from loot boxes and then they can actually trade them amongst each other.
And once you open up that functionality for this item to be traded, it develops a secondary market price and an entire economy emerges. And just as a normal player of Counter-Strike, this whole idea of video game items being able to take on real world value absolutely blew my mind. I saw people trading, people profiting,
people trying to make money, people trying to invest in these items. And this was a completely new kind of revelation to me. It was super cool to me. And this is before I kind of got introduced to crypto. And then, you know, the NFT, I got into crypto and initially it was just Bitcoin, Ethereum and tokens. And then the NFT market sort of started emerging.
or like it was already around but it started gaining popularity and traction in early 2019 and the kind of foresight that this technology would be used in video games was just so immediately obvious to me. I was a huge proponent of crypto and basically custodian your own assets, your own value and I
I automatically made the connection of like, hey, these kind of resemble video game items or they very much could work as video game items. And you get kind of like all of these fantastic different qualities, which is like the ability to freely exchange them on also the ability that all of the value that crypto comes with.
globally, very easy interoperability, like very easily can they be exchanged, can they be sold. And so I decided that I would put out an initial product that allowed game developers to use this technology. And at the time there was very little infrastructure and the whole Web3 gaming
Space was like an in its absolute infancy stage and there was a few other kind of things that sort of that helped me continue to formalize this idea in my head One of that was basically AMAs with the with CZ the founder of finance I kept hearing in part about web 3 gaming and how it's going to be big in the future
And sort of you know, I kind of jumped into this vision that I had and we built an initial MVP and it was very well received by the crypto community and from there it was kind of just history where games started using it and It's been incredibly fun since Love to hear it Jason. How about you guys work? We're breaking
So, you know, third web actually started as it was originally called pack protocol and one night there was like a hackathon during like during JPEG Mania like when things were first taking off and you know the phenomenon was like wow everyone wants to create these NFT projects and
Now they've seen pong, they've seen Fadenza's Me Too. And so FurCon, the CEO of Third Web, he, him and Jake Liu, they created a simple way to let people have, you know, like what if your NFT project could also have that cool
open a booster pack like a top shot and like NFTs came out. And so like they made a protocol that enabled anybody to have that. And then in the process of building that, they realized, oh my gosh, there's actually not very many dev tools to help in this effort of building. And since they're like hardcore developers, they then sort of pivot
to actually solving that problem, which they anticipated to be just a much broader problem. Tools in, like if you want to build in Web 3 right now, it's super fragmented. A lot of tools that do one thing, they don't integrate with each other very well. A lot of space, a lot of surface area for
errors as you make a Frankenstein of like different services. There's a lack of security. So like smart contracts are getting, you know, you got to get them audited if they're not. Like there's all sorts of risks. And then there's also like a steep learning curve. You know, you got to learn solidity.
These devs are unicorns, they're hard to find, they're fought over, they're expensive. It's a new language. They wanted to build a platform that addressed those things. Third web came about, and they cut on hammering and hammering to build a platform that they wanted as developers. They've built for themselves.
Like if you wanted to build anything from a DeFi protocol, a game, and a T-project, a DAO, or whatever the next thing is that people, you know, Vitalik blogs about, they want to complete, you know, build a complete framework. And so that means like, and a complete framework means everything you need in a developer experience.
from wallets, like all the puzzle pieces, wallets off, you know, RPC nodes, contracts, deploying things, managing it, all the analytics, these are all things that people have to set up, and all the innovation going forward just completes the framework. So, you know, we recently came up with mobile, people want to build build there,
We have a Unity SDK. Later we'll have an Unreal SDK. When Vitalik blogs about Soulbound tokens, we're super interested in also the development of this big computer that is the blockchain. When thought leaders pose cool ideas like Soulbound tokens,
We have a hackathon and then they're in the product a week later or like we just came out with like a smart wallet that's like built based on EIP 4337. We met with like the people that wrote that and so That's what we're doing moving forward. It's like kind of scratching their own itch and then it's actually more about
I know I've seen a few videos
was where he's he's repping your stuff, but I know the frustration of like, I'm not a dev and I made it through his compiler back in 2021 and it almost killed me because I just was so frustrated, but it's it's so helpful to have these tools laid out in a way that is one easy to understand for people and to use it execute on like it's
I can't tell you what a difference it would have made to have something like either of your tools in front of me two years ago. And I think it brings a lot of... I'm excited to see how people build upon that entry point now as opposed to what it was like even two years ago. We hear that all the time.
It's one of the most common things we hear. I wish this existed two years ago. I just think what's interesting about right now is if you think about the arc of who was building in crypto over the years, it was initially people that were cryptographers, cypherpunk,
that we're very interested in that level. And then in like 2015, 2016, people fascinated by operating systems kind of came in. What kind of OSs can we build? And then 2018 came around, Maker comes out, we're starting to see early DeFi primitives, DeFi summer highs.
So, now we're seeing more of the use cases.
So what happens in these markets is you see, there's the type of software that's called a point solution. It does one thing. It emerges, snapshot voting, or fiat on ramp, or wallet. And these are just things that need to get created. And then over time, as markets mature, you start to see what a platform is.
like the bundle of active services that are needed. What are all the activities people want to do when they're building? And that's rapidly expanding too, as new categories are hitting product market fit. Like we're starting to see social, like actually happen. We're seeing commerce now. So like new tools are
coming. Well, Jake, I don't want to be hogging the mic up here. I definitely want to make some space if you got some questions on deck there too. Yeah, no, you're not hogging it at all. But yeah, dude, I think I think Third Web is definitely cutting edge and it's just a plethora of tools that
that's offered to people like me, who's not necessarily like a dev, and it's just amazing. I love to see it, I love to be on there, and like you said, you're just dropping new things back to back, just so many tools for creators, and it's really exciting for me.
Well, I'm curious to maybe dig into, you know, given that both of you guys have solutions that keep, keep it very much in-house in one spot to build for any kind of creator who doesn't have a comprehensive developer set. Like, what do you think this has implications
for in the next up cycle with NFTs. I know the immediate thing is people can start building right away, but how do you think the process of iterating on top of that is going to look when people can just get in and build? Mitch, do you want to kick that one off? Yeah, that's a fantastic.
And I think the answer is simply that there's a lot more ground work now and that's going to result in much better applications all across the board. So we've seen our first wave of sort of Web 3 applications and I'm particularly speaking about Web 3 gaming because that's my world. And the first wave over the past two years was more like
that's because people are trying to put out product as quickly as possible for the bull market to appeal to their audiences and communities without there being any infrastructure whatsoever. So this time around, there are companies like Third Web and Altura that are providing all the groundwork that's needed to really facilitate a proper
So this is like authentication tools proper RPCs to get consistent data flows, you know, marketplace solutions, etc. That really allow these developers to focus on the actual application itself rather than having to deal with all the clunky Web 3 infrastructure. So I first see the number of applications that are available to you.
Next layer or the next wave of applications just continuing to improve and it's sort of kind of a continual process It's it's a gradual improvement and I think that with all this new infrastructure in the space we're going to see just the web 3 Products the consumer facing products a lot better higher quality more consistency across the board and
in terms of like signing into different applications, we definitely need consistency there. And I think we're just going to see much better experiences. That's awesome. That's great. My experience with Web 3 games has been kind of rocky. And like the field
I generally get is too much Web 3 and not enough game. And I can't wait for when we can find a happy medium so that these developers can create powerful tools but also be able to focus on the gaming experience for the user.
Yeah, that's honestly what I'm waiting for. I completely agree with you. I mean all the games we've seen they really are web 3 protocols with a game trying to be forced in there and the reason for that is because they kind of start off as an NFT collection or a token and then they try and build a game around
around that, whereas I believe the actual goal that we're going to see is more of like game developers that have been building games for decades and they want to actually incorporate crypto into their games. They want to elevate their experiences with Web 3 technology rather than the other way around, whereas like you have a Web 3 component and then you want to sort of
Also, with all of these new tools in this space, it's going to actually allow these traditional developers that have been building games all their lives to come into the space in a way that makes sense. Because they don't want to learn Web 3. Or it's almost a completely different paradigm than game development. So we're bridging that gap that kind of brings this technology closer to them.
Yeah, just what you take on that. Yeah, I think the next cycle of like building is it's all about you know that the big word is abstraction, you know, if last cycle everyone had to read and learn about how do I build in Web 3 and wait for a lot of like core tools
We'll see it built instead of reading instead of like digging through the literature to do that people will be reading blog back to blog post by Paul Graham and like how do I build my app in my business because a lot of a lot of the how to build in web 3 is going to get abstracted and be more familiar to building
So like, you know, products like third web have SDKs that let you build, you know, code and Python or JavaScript or TypeScript. There's going to be all the solutions like that. You're going to see solutions like ours bolted into the dashboards of major developer platforms. And so, you know, you're going to be able to
So like devs who are going to some other familiar place where they go, you know, to spin up hosting, like they're going to be able to deploy apps right from that environment that they're already using. You're going to see, there's a lot more ideas out there. Like people will have more examples of things that a product market fit. And so they'll be able to
be more creative in what they're able to build. And I think with more developer frameworks, like third web and full workflows, people will be doing the build measure loop faster because the build loop is going to be so much faster and less buggy.
And deploying will be so much easier. So and like more people will be able to do it. And so more more types of minds will be in the industry. I also think like it's just going to be more normalized. Will it more time will have will have had more time with crypto to like to do about it.
it won't be so abstract. And like the games, they look great now. They don't even feel like ponseys. Like wonder like what, where is the chain? And like you find out like, oh, I have a wallet. Like I didn't even realize that. I thought I just like clicked sign up. And you know, that'll be the norm. And what's going to happen is
is we're going to start to see, you know, give it time. We're really creative. I think we're going to see some amazing crypto native IP come out. And it's not just going to be an NFT collection. It's going to be like a really great game. And we're going to love the game. And the character is going to be cute. You're going to love the story. And people are going to be proud of the items they#
real fandoms that are not like these Kickstarter fandoms like oh I hope the ZNFT collection becomes something cool one day it's gonna be more like wow that content was really great what a great story like I'm we're gonna see more of that that's real we're gonna see real fandom yeah that's that's I think
I'm seeing that as infrastructure evolves, that's really leading the behavior of the space as well, given that if you can push all this stuff to the lowest kind of visibility of any of the users, like I know people wax philosophical on how to get millions of people in here, but I think
it's like, it currently we're kind of embroiled in this culture of degenerates. Like I'm not sure if you guys have been following like the Benny, the Pauli News, right? Like it just, we don't exactly have the best forward facing image, but I also think that a lot of that is people sitting in this environment that they're comfortable with, whereas I think
You guys are really pushing these tools to express different behaviors within the market because we want normies to come in and have at the space. But if anybody wandering in at the moment, looking at crypto Twitter, that's a pretty unappealing space to be in.
excited to see when people are taking up these tools to build things that push all that down further and more so focus on like we were talking about here. The game is the experience or the IP is much more front and center rather than the flip, the trade, the shit coin, right?
Yeah, you know, the Normies don't want crypto. They want something good. They want to be distracted and delighted. And there's enough like until we show them, like here's some really awesome content. They'll jump over hoops to be a part of it.
people can figure this stuff out. They just need to be given something good. They got to be able to find out about it and sign up. People need to be able to build it. A lot of builders are intimidated by Web 3. And so they need to see more success in it to be incentivized to go there. And so this is the flywheel that will steadily spin.
I completely agree with you. I think we're always talking about the masses getting into Web 3. We have to give them something to want to get into Web 3.4. A quality game that's actually incredibly enjoyable will inevitably bring people in. It's not like it has Web 3, so people are not going to come into it. We haven't really seen much
value be produced and this is just something that takes time to produce something that is of value that you know the open market can actually appreciate. Like you said, I think people will be jumping through hoops to actually have these experiences and consume these products that we put out there. But it's just a matter of incorporating Web 3 in a way that
make sense that actually adds to the experience and doesn't take away from the experience, which to this point it more or less has taken away from a user experience standpoint. And I think with all this new infrastructure coming out, we're going to see much better experiences. And earlier used that you made a good point. Like so in the last
in the last two years, or since in 2022, 4.5 billion was poured into Web 3 gaming and games take two to three years to build. And so like a ton of games are just starting to come to market and like they're not the first generation. It's like generation 1.4 billion.
of these games and they're made by real game makers. Like I was at GDC, the game developers conference, and I went to Oasis and Tellos and I went to all the booths and everybody had great games. They were all legit and so that was just the first drip of the tsunami that's coming.
and sometimes it's going to be good and people are going to be like what and like when a game hits I don't even know if any of these trends are ready for like a game that hits because the activity in a game is so high the amount of transactions that will happen it's crazy it'll be bigger than anything we've seen
Yeah, Jason 100% I was also at GDC and like we've spoken to so many games there and it is completely different from what you see on crypto Twitter and the wave of Web 3 games that we've seen Like you said, these are actual real games being built by you know video game developers industry veterans and they're genuinely interested in Web 3 and the way they see
We speak about Web 3 is completely different from the Web 3 game developers that we've seen over the past year. They're actually thinking about how to incorporate Web 3 in a way that makes complete sense and aren't driven by selling out an NFT collection. So it was completely refreshing to kind of speak to all those game developers at GDC. And I think that having quality
Web 3 games come out is more than inevitable. I mean, we're speaking to these game developers every day. We know what they're building and they're really building something of quality and good games just take time. And I do think over the next two years we're going to see our first wave of like really good games and it's just going to continue to evolve from there.
You know, some traits of quality games, like they talk about the game. They don't, they're not like, "Oh, here's our tokenomics." They basically have, they focus on having transactions that don't need to be monetized. They pull themselves away from being connected to DeFi. They're just focused
building a tried and true economy that is just on the block, saved on the blockchain. Right, 100%. Yeah, they're still interested in building a really good story in a game and then crypto catches their attention and that it can just add that extra level of depth and dimension to it. Well, how cool would it be
If you just looked in your crypto wallet right now and you were like, "Wow, there's a bottle with bugs in it." I got that when I played Ocarina of Time, you know, 20 years ago. I think you would look fondly on it the way anyone does that they're NFT that they minted. They'd be like, "I kept that bottle. What a great game."
Like my childhood right exactly. Yeah, or you look and do a wallet and you see like the ender dragon head and that's like a you know crazy achievement Yeah, I can't believe you got that holy crap. Let's talk about it. We're We're at a party right now and somehow I saw that in your wallet
Well, and I think to like thinking about you know what you guys have both expressed is like there's this real eagerness in in Web 3 in crypto to like put it at the front stage and center and I think it just over complicates that equation and Like you both have pointed out. I'm really hoping
that when the value prop of the game comes forward or the IP that that becomes the thing that people latch on to in terms of a cultural relevance or whatever, because I really do think that I inhabit a lot of these different spaces in Telegram or Discord or whatever, and there's nothing more
boring than sitting there talking about like tokenomics or price action or like I could really care less I think it actually in a lot of ways pushes that conversation further away from adoption so I think that in terms of you know kind of wrapping it back in is you guys have presented the tools to make that conversation more forward from
rather than you know wallow it in the mirror of like here's my minting that but you got to go over here to stake your thing and you got to go over here to you know like it just becomes this disc inserted thing that even people who are in the space for a long time it is just kind of annoying to operate in that fashion right no one wants to go through that
loop. That's its own game. It's funny. We watched all this software unfold and there were meta games of watching liquidity move around. We only had so many verbs, providing liquidity, swap,
These are the verbs of Web 3. And we have JPEGs. I feel like NFTs, they remind me of when the iPhone just came out. Do you remember before then there were no apps and the iPhone comes out and then all they did was demonstrate
What an iPhone could do, like the night sky you could see constellations and that just proved like yeah, there's accelerometers in this device. How cool is that? And like all the apps are kind of like that. They did one thing to highlight one feature of the phone and I feel like NFTs are that they're highlighting. This is the thing that's on chain. This is not
unfungable, you can swap this around and it can gain value. It's a part of an ecosystem and everyone is just enjoying that. And that's its own game and people deploy NFP collections into that game. They trade in that game. It's a big game of PVP
PVE, baby. We're going to get that I look at the whole amount of speed and ft space like like there's the trading game and then and then there's other things going on. That's how I like that's my mental model for understanding like what's going on. Yeah, what are your thoughts, our mid?
Yeah, I mean, I think that's a really good analogy the aftorn algae I think we're just like so caught up with all the things you can do in crypto And you know speaking about that tokenomics thing I mean when we talk to a game developer and their first kind of conversation or what they want to talk about is the tokenomics of their game we automatically
that they're not really focused on the game. I think all of this sort of tokenomics and wanting to just move liquidity around as the game, that's sort of a result of wanting to build somewhat of a Ponzi game. It's just not a good look for the game developers.
I think we're going to just mature out of that the same way that we matured out of creating apps that just use the flash light of the phone or just demonstrate one aspect of the phone. It's something that we cannot have fun playing with initially to experience the app.
technology of blockchain and having on-chain value, but I do think we're going to just kind of mature out of that and actually start using the technology in a way that makes sense. Yeah, both, those are both like fantastic perspectives. So I'm curious then.
because obviously we're in a telocentric space at the moment. What chose either of you here to consider telos as an option and was there anything about it that stood out compared to other chains? Jason, you want to kick that one off?
Sure. So, you know, third web, what we do with we're a developer framework, we want developers to build whatever they want and we were adding chains one at a time, you know, Salana, Arbitrum, Optimism, we were building support and that took a lot of effort.
And so then we realize there's a lot of EVMs being built. And so we did an update that allowed third web to support every EVM. Tellos is noteworthy for just how the company is set up and like the technology stack with fast transactions.
And like there's a unique way data is stored on the on the chain and so we built support for telos There's a lot about it that tells us that telos is very serious about building out its ecosystem from the ecosystem initiatives you've kicked off your your
funds, the number of developers that are already building on you, and so that caught all of our attention as we want to work with serious protocols that are trying to cultivate ecosystems. Yeah, and on our end, well, we want to just have as much support
For the different blockchains in the space as possible, we don't want to force developers to use a particular chain. We believe giving developers, we don't see ourselves as a core infrastructure developer, like, you know, of developing blockchain technology. Altura is more of an enabler that allows these developers to tap into the core Web3 technologies.
That means basically empowering developers with as much options as possible, especially so early on in the industry. We don't know which blockchain is going to prevail. We want to allow these developers to have different choices. Tell us really struck our attention.
things that made it stand out. One of them is basically how fast it is. So half a second block time, over 10,000 transactions per second. I believe it has a lot of incredible security features. The fact that you need two thirds of the nodes plus one to actually pull off a 51% of a 51% attack
And like you said, I think the team is fantastic. You guys really do show that you're a very serious blockchain that is committed to actual progress in this space. And all of those things combined has made you guys a great contender for Web3Gaming. And we want to provide this to our developers.
I appreciate both of you taking on that. I want to open up the floor here to anybody who wants to come up and ask a question to either third web or ulcera. I know there's lots to begin on both of those sides but what we're waiting for for people to come up here.
Maybe I'll ask my favorite question in spaces is like if you could look in your crystal ball, what do you think the next year or two years looks like kind of on a macro level within the NFT or crypto space? Jason, you want to take that one first?
Sure, I think we're going to see what the world looks like when there's 10 to 20 games for all of us to talk about the way we talk about and anticipate. I don't know about Fortnite, but like big games. They're going to be big brands that we talk about.
And there's going to be phenomenon that we follow and new behaviors that will spill over into all around crypto and that'll be really interesting. I think we're also going to see way more brands getting involved. How do we know? We're talking all of them. They're all building with us. They're all building with age.
agencies that use our tools. And so brand more and more brand like they're not shying away. And then I we're going to also see like another sort of order of bang this year. I think a more devs on board as major platforms like Shopify and other like large fang companies like get involved
with their own DevStacks and on board their Dev Communities. Yeah, I think we are going to see our first real like wave of actual adoption from the Web2 masses, brands that are actually coming out and game developers that are coming out provide quality games and it's almost going to go
unnoticed in that like, you know, we're going to have a lot of players playing these games and they're going to have some kind of crypto functionality. And that's going to be the moment we realize like, okay, this is kind of the right way to implement it. And this is a, this is a, you know, proving or paving the way for how the masses interact with this technology. And
Again, as Jason said, how do we know this? We're speaking to all kinds of web-to companies and brands out there that are actually genuinely interested in getting the space. But they haven't just had the time to do so yet. The industry is so new and the awareness of this industry is so new that they're really taking their time. And when we see the big players come in and actually
to do it right. We're going to really start to appreciate this technology a lot more and it's going to open the floodgates for quality and mass adoption. It's going to take time but I do believe that we're going to start seeing this unfold over the next two years. We're also seeing Asia come on like China and Japan are like
exploding and I think we'll see a lot of IP from those regions and I think that they're going to be even more active when they find things they like. Well I'm curious based on like you know we're we've seen brands kind of fumbled the ball so far in terms of
coming in. Some have done it really well, but do you think that we'll see an emergent web 3 brand be the thing that really exposes this or kind of takes off in terms of IP or do you think that the mass adoption is going to be generated through web 2 brands coming into this space?
It's going to be things like brands haven't had a lot to do. All they could do is do an NFT drop and be like, "Look, hey, we did Web2R. But moving forward, it's going to be more like they can set up token-gated Shopify stores and more experimenting along loyalty will happen."
We're seeing really interesting things with like just tickets, you know, and VIP experiences. And like those have been teased in things, but like it's really different when it comes from an adidas or an iKey or a Pepsi or a Burger King or you know pick an alpha,
you know, rock star. They're looking to have crypto powered experiences that are more than just an NFT drop. NFT sometimes don't even come into it really. Right. Yeah. Jason, so I agree with you. I think also the fact that, you know, these brands fumbled the bag initially, so to speak, is because like we were
in the bull market in the mania and they wanted to put something out there as quickly as possible just to say they're part of the industry and it could have even been that people within those companies were NFT fanboys and pushed for something to happen and they didn't really do much planning. They wanted to say look we're in Web 3 but this time around
Now that there's no pressure from the market to just put something out there as quickly as possible, it's not that they don't understand or appreciate the technology, it's now that they can actually look at it from a sober perspective, not sort of pressured by the bull market in the mania and can actually plan out something that
makes sense. Aside from just brands coming out there, I think a lot of massive gaming companies and also even brands that could be involved in gaming that aren't particularly gaming companies are going to start getting involved in gaming in a way that makes a lot of sense. We know this because we are talking to the AAA studios in
and they are interested in getting into Web 3, they just want to do it in a way that makes sense. And now that there are infrastructure companies out there, these brands are consulting the infrastructure companies in Web 3 and having them lead the way in how this makes sense. Yeah, great takes both.
So we've got a naman up on stage here. You got a question for either of these fine gentlemen Hey, hey absolutely team guys. Thank you. Thank you so much for this space. I just wanted to come up after you know Jacob talked about the infrastructure been built for application
around ticketing as well. So just a quick background. We at Midaskaya are also working towards very similar use cases, leveraging third way by our infrastructure. But we may really focus towards the pre-ment and the post-ment stages for creative
projects to introduce their own real world utilities to the NFTs right and take it beyond just a PFP era and focus on introducing additional benefits and we did a very interesting campaign with one of the music you know record labels
as well which did close to 120k worth of revenue in a span of a month and it's been a year since that launch and the level of utilities been provided to this holders has been you know just exceptionally well
and all thanks to the third web infras well, we were able to kind of scale it to the masses beyond just music. My particular question was more focused towards understanding what are your views towards, you know, having more and more additional utilities to be
offered to the larger mass from the Web2 ecosystem to be on-boarded towards Web3. What is that one thing or specific use cases which you guys have been super bullish on in terms of more and more real world utilities coming in to these NFTs?
All right, great question. Cool that you use third web that it helps should be DM and you know we just came out with like a wallet SDK that's really comprehensive. They big thing about it that we really like is our smart wallet that
Let's you have like sign in as guest and it creates like a local device wallet that we call an invisible wallet. And so when a user shows up to any app, they don't need to go if they're not already in crypto, they don't need to be like, okay, wait, what's a wallet?
I got to go through the education funnel now and install, you know, pick your wallet that has like a strange experience. They don't need to do that. And so they're able to just join the app. So it's things like that that abstract away crypto and make it feel more like an app.
So the next thing I think just landed. Yeah, I think makes sense as well have been seeing the SDK very closely recently and the development around the counter-straction, you know, tech stack as well. You know, will definitely shoot your DM and see this in the news to further leverage.
>> Cool. Wonderful. Thanks for coming up, Naman. We'll go to WAM and then BACSA here. WAM, how's it going? >> Good. How about you? >> You're doing fantastic. You got a question for the gentleman? >> Not really question, just sort of a sort of
joining some different spaces and just getting some people's thoughts on them. You know, the sort of next steps of Web 3.0 and you know, especially how you know, one of the most. I wouldn't say under no, but I think a lot of people don't realize how much you know, GameStop is actually leading this Web 3.0 push. And you know, is a good potential to
Sort of expose it to the masses that may not be aware of the capabilities that that can bring that that sort of decentralization Yeah, there's definitely some major contenders in here, you know willing to shape what's gonna happen now?
I think it's all pretty exciting. Yeah, I'm sure things have me absolutely thanks for coming up back so you got a question? Yeah, so are we talking about NFTs today and are we are we able to use the telos epm to do
like a brick and he brings like wax and p tokens we're doing. And can you use telosvm to do ERC 20s on telos so we can like have you know not just the p tokens. We have you know can we use the telosvm
I believe on third web you're able to deploy a ERC 20 correct season? Yep. Yes you can. Is that answer your question back to like in terms of
to deploy your own token or it was there something more specific? Well to save on the gas fees I want to know if we can use telos, maybe to save on gas fees so we can transfer around the RC20s a lot faster. Oh we just have pegged tokens for that. I'd have to talk to the cashier into
terms of like whether you know like obviously interacting in USDT or USDC on our side is going to save you a pile of money. I definitely hate paying 25 bucks every transaction on on. Oh yeah, I was also going to that was going to ask about that. Yeah, I know you guys in the telegram we're talking about EOS having official use
USDP and USDP is on like Toronto, Ethereum, EOS. We had that T-Lost D, I don't know if that worked out that well on TELOS. It was funded from the proposal system and then they got the whole Fed Connect thing coming out and there's the whole CBDC thing and I'm wondering was TELOS really
need to have USDT or we like you know have so we go back to T-bonds you guys remember T-bonds NFTs on tell us it'll it'll they'll all be there because it's up to you know what people want to use and you know whatever bridges emerge and whatever tokens you can
bridge over. But yeah. Okay, and then what were you, I just joined in that what were you talking about before this we're just talking about? Tell us NFTs or were you just talking about just the building infrastructure to onboard a billion people because I've been I've been on deep
delegate proof of stake since like bidshares and steam it and watch steam it turn into eos and then watch tellos come out of eos and then watch the trawn hive stuff and I'm just wondering like the biggest the bit there is a recent post about delegate proof of stake social media or decentralized social media. Let me try them in.
So this is like a Twitter space about infrastructure for developers building on tell us. So if you just joined, then right now people are coming up and kind of asking questions about what we were talking about. So maybe we should go to the next person who has a question who's been listening.
The the whole point is like you know, we do need to have something like steam it to have social media on tell us to get a billion people the only way to get like a billion people is to get that social media and steam it has the best system in high ventelose has a partnership So we should really look into the high of telos partnership that is an official partnership and we should get something more like that
topics and something like, you know, we should have TELO stuff while we should have a TELO social smart contract that's for social media front ends for TELO. So we should be using the proposal system and having like a system that's like proposals and tell us the side. We should be giving out the mini proposals to posts and we should really get people on the social media
I'm going to cut you off here. That's for a whole other space that we can have. This one is just kind of dedicated to talking about infrastructure for developers. So more than happy to have that conversation. Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. So I'm talking about infrastructure for developers. Yeah. So we're going to move on to work. Thanks.
Have you got a question there were? Oh, you have a customer support issue. Maybe maybe go to the telegram. Yeah. Sure. I cannot say.
Thank you, Vera. Could we make them on speakers? Yeah, I'm just doing that right now. Vera and Baxter? Yeah, sorry about that, guys.
Sometimes it gets a little chilly up in here. I know we're coming up to the top of the hour here. I want to be my full of everybody's time. So maybe this is a great spot to kind of wrap it up. If you guys have any kind of closing thoughts, I want to thank you so much for coming out. It's always nice to have these kind of more in-depth talks rather than the
surface level stuff out there. If anybody in the room hasn't checked out either third web or alter up, please go ahead over it. It's going to open your mind to what it means to build in the space and how to do it in a much easier, simpler manner if you're not a developer.
If you have any closing thoughts, have it here. >> I just want to say I'm incredibly excited for our partnership with Tellos. This is a fantastic thing to happen for developers in the space for both game developers and just general web 3 developers.
I encourage everybody to check out Third Web, check out Altura, the infrastructure for Web 3. I am incredibly excited to see how this partnership and how the industry progresses. I guess my closing thoughts are Third Web. We're free.
We're open source to comprehensive developer framework for building on telos or any EVM. And if you want to build a game or an NFT project, a store, a DAO, anything, we make it super easy. So go check out thirdweb.com.
Fantastic thanks. Thanks again so much for coming guys. This is a great conversation and thanks for everybody in the audience for coming out This is one of our most jam packed spaces. I've been a host for so that's always wonderful Hope everybody has a wonderful day and we'll talk to you guys soon Awesome. Hi everybody. He was a good one everybody