I don't know if that's my mic or what.
that's perfect thanks okay all right how you doing test oh I'm just plugging along and hanging out
on threads and you sent me a message and said hey can we do this and I have to admit I don't
have much of a life so I was available to ask is always reliable last minute you need somebody
he's right there for you unfortunately Matt couldn't be here this week but he has good
reason he's in Berlin at that web3 conference if anyone knows Matt they know he loves to talk and
he's really good at it so he's making all kinds of connections and networking and doing good stuff
for hive out there so shout out to Matt and tasks stepped up this week last minute and we're just
going to have an improv show just talking web3 great thing about talking web3 with Task and I is
we love this stuff so we can just you know just talk about it all day so it's not a problem with us
but we also have an open sort of AMA if anybody wants to ask any questions throughout the show
more than welcome actually encouraged so yeah anything you want to say before we start Task
yeah just to let everybody know I did set up a thread cast I send it out on my Twitter I also
send it out on threads so anybody who wants to join in and converse there's a thread cast on
leofinance.io where you can ask questions I'll keep monitoring it and I'll go through and give it up
votes and maybe later in the day Dan will do the same yep you can count on it I'll be hawking those
all right I guess we'll start I see I already see a few questions we got one from Cuba he's saying
it's impossible to add a timer to delegations so they could have a base for a subscription system
idea I never thought about that maybe building a service around it where you can say here is a
you know 10-month contract where it's locked so you know you get it the delegation for the next amount
of time yeah I mean that that is an interesting thing that would be a base layer operations I would
presume unless that would be something that you would build on a layer too but I would presume you'd want
that at the base layer you'd want at the base layer it sounds like one of those features that
shouldn't be too complicated but you never know once you start tampering with the base layer
if it's an easy ad I say sure why not that would be good then you can build services around delegations
because you can trust that the person won't cancel before you know your 10-month contract or
whatever you agree to so interesting idea hive Cuba I've actually never thought about that I think
it's a good idea thumbs up for me all right let's see I think I am non so he's a OG hiver he says
maybe discuss the SEC issue can hive be classified as a security if that happens what do we do
what do we do if we're classed as security um task whatever will we do uh could we be classed as
security sure they can do whatever the hell they want what would we be what would happen um they'd
spend six months trying to figure out who to who to mail the subpoenas to um I I mean it's how do you
how do you sue somebody and and that you have to keep in mind the SEC files civil lawsuits they they
don't file criminal charges they have to refer that bet over to the department of justice so they
actually sue people how who are you going to sue and I you're going to sue me you're going to sue Dan
you're going to sue uh uh Matt who are you going to sue uh and then the other thing is I mean the only
thing that I see could happen and tell me if you disagree with me Dan is maybe they push to have
hive and more likely hbd because it's an algo stable coin that'll be pushed and won't be allowed on the
debt on the centralized exchanges but outside of that I don't see what they can do I mean you know
who are you going to sue if you if you have no mail-in address to mail the the lawsuit to
there's no lawsuit filed yeah we've already had a miniature version of this where someone tried
to sue over the name that if anything is the easiest thing to do so if you couldn't do that
it's going to be very hard to then sue to try to prove that we're centralized because obviously you
can't um I you know me I this whole SEC you know it's like people are focusing on the little barking
dog when I'm looking at the big end boss and the shadows behind that no one seems to pay attention
to and it's like it it really doesn't matter if you're a security or not okay sure if you if you
want to be on more centralized exchanges if you want more liquidity if you want more um access to
capital and be more government friendly quite frankly then sure you know you can be friends with
the SEC or you know be class not as not a security like bitcoin um but to focus on it and to actually
make it either pivot from your game plan or make it a devastating thing then you're you're too reliant
on liquidity a meaning you don't have a good good enough use case on the outside world which most of
these projects let's be frank that's what they for they're they're for liquidity they're for making
money and I have nothing wrong with that people do what they do speculate on the technologies you
have have fun um been there done that so you know I can't don't hate the don't hate to play the game
but when it comes to what we're trying to do um we see a very forelooming shadow we see the world
getting very scary and becoming very centralized and overly controlled in all kinds of areas I mean
people should have been woken up to this for a long time ago um and now we're getting to the point
where they're trying to sniff in your bank account you got six hundred dollars what are you doing
um trying to introduce overly centralized you call them cbdcs you know just blockchain currencies where
they can know exactly what you have control in every aspect limit you in all kinds of ways
trying to bring in a centralized social credit score where
that's going to be held depending on the politics of the time um you know you could be either a good
a criminal or a hero depending on the switch in politics and the politics are so volatile now
that you really can't even build a social credit score in a centralized way around any kind of system
because everything changes so much um you could be building up credit in one system and that could
like screw you in the next system and all that screams to me is there isn't an alternative system when
you have a system and it's like is this all we have and it's really shitty that just means that
there's no competition that means the free market is getting thrashed it's getting destroyed it has
chains on it there's a wet blanket on it for some reason the status quo has is so shitty and people are
just accepting it because they haven't figured out an alternative so we're trying to do is everyone
talks about this matrix bullshit and you got to get out the matrix and all that like we're trying to
create a real outside the matrix in the digital form because we live in a digital world and that's
what we're trying to do with high so when you're talking about sec and all of this crap it's a can you
be shut down by powerful forces with lots of money and laws that can lock you in a cage can you survive
that regardless of sec whoever is coming after you can you be shut down physically by force the answer
is yes then you have a problem the answer is no or maybe really because you can't really ever say
no that's kind of arrogant you can say a hard maybe you can say try it but you can't just say
we're invincible you can say we're damn strong and we're very resistant to censorship um and we're
constantly culminating that and nurturing that and becoming stronger with every upvote with every
distribution with every well with every park with every new person joining the chain um but definitely
not invincible so too much focus on the sec and that's what you know you see the crypto twitter
influencers talking about what polygon or matic or what what coin is and isn't and what world has
ended and what coins going to zero and all this and it's just like palm head palm i wish war crypto
twitter was actually about real crypto it's basically about its investment you know trying to catch fake
fads and trying to catch um market bull markets and bear markets short here pump there that's really
all people seem to be focused about what shows you a sign of the times we're all so desperate people
are so desperate money because you can't get a decent job you can't make a business because of all the
regulations so people are forced to just sort of be desperate we're seeing that in the market that's
where we're seeing all this forced
yeah there there's just one other thing i want to add to this idea of hive as a security keep in mind
with hive there was nothing sold so there was no pre-mine hive was an airdrop so the idea of going
after hive in the same way they're going after ripple they may end up going after ethereum
they going after a lot of these other projects they went after eos is because they were actually
selling the the coins there was not one single hive sold it was an airdrop on march 20th of 2020 or
march 19th of 2020 whenever it happened so how can you be accused of selling an unregistered security
when nothing was sold so that that's another point that it it a lot of this stems from the fact
the distribution and people used it to raise money either for development or you know to pad their pockets
but either way that's what the sec has a major problem with
yeah by all definition we're not a security but the thing is no one's
very few people are aware enough to realize technically and from a governance standpoint what
a real security is and what isn't everyone's just kind of hoping that their coin is on the right side
of the fence so you know the sec can really do what they want they can say oh hive's a security and
like very few people are going like they'll just agree to be oh that sucks i thought it wasn't but
they they wouldn't comprehend how it wouldn't be only a few of us would and we'd be crying in an echo
chamber censored somewhere so you know by definition of course not right like we're the opposite of what
a security is we didn't have any bc capital there's no centralization really anywhere um when it
definitely none when it comes to raising money or distribution of of the coin in any way
um there was no sale as you said but it is what it is we'll see what they do um it doesn't if if we
are labeled a security it doesn't affect us because i've always looked at bitcoin as our fiat and all
we need is a dex with a big thick liquidity pool of bitcoin to hive and you have a kyc list decentralized
way to go from hive to bitcoin i could give two shits less if we're on coinbase or any centralized
exchange because i'll always just catch up to bitcoin and then bitcoin is my fiat i can just
go cash out to any currency i want thank god there's bitcoin it did all of that work for us
we don't need to focus on the things we have no control over thank god right because we could we
have no matter how hard we try we can't say oh you know don't make us a security or uh you know
accept us on this centralized institution or inside these fiat on on ramps we have zero control over
that it's all who you know what's in it for them so for bitcoin to have all that dirty work done for
us and all we have to do is build a pool to bitcoin that's a beautiful thing so i don't even look at
dollars or any of these fiat currencies it's just bitcoin to hive as far as i'm concerned so the svc at
the end of the day hive is not survived off its liquidity it's survived off its hodlers of last
resort and its use case as long as the coin and people say what do you do during hard times and
my advice isn't for you you know it could be you do something different um my goals and investment
is have a strong belief do enough research where you're very confident in what you believe in
meaning someone smart can't just change your opinion on a whim like you you're you really
knocked the hell out of it you're really stable in your opinion okay now you have you put something
together now don't become a distressed seller you know so that as long as the the coin is high
enough value for the validators to get paid for the distribution to continue for there to be enough
incentive for the wheels to keep turning the oil that's what the liquidity really is you don't need
too much oil to make it go just enough um which we've seen at eight cents right we've seen at the
bottom we've seen we can survive um that's all i'm really concerned about when it comes to liquidity
i'm not looking to cash out um yeah it sucks being a distressed seller i've been a distressed seller
i've taken the roller coaster all around i've taken what they call the round trip i've lost 90 95
percent of my portfolio a couple of times it's not fun um but i've mastered the art of not becoming a
distressed seller it always happens it sucks it burns when it does happen it stings when you sell
something that you know is uh you shouldn't be selling at that price at least in your opinion but
as long as you don't become a distressed seller hodl what you believe in and um that's the best you
can do an investment there's no guarantees that's all my advice there there's one other thing with
this uh pi pi as uh put in the threadcast they can sue justin sun and ned scott with a laughing face
and you know it's kind of a joke but that's true they can go after steemit inc they can go after
individuals who are associated with the ownership of steemit inc um but hive we didn't have
that yeah and there's no one to go after there's no one to mail and if you try to take down a
validator legally that would just piss everyone off and we would just rally around we're worldwide
so it's like whack-a-mole you try to whack one down people will move the people can't move
well they'll get voted out or they'll bow down gracefully because they're no longer capable but
they'll help in some other way and then validators will step up in other countries
the less validators are in the top 20 the more incentive for there are the backup for backup
validators to step up the system is so graceful in that way it's so anti-fragile that if a country
was to just say you can't do this and it was to put a stop to validators even if it was a big one
it would not cripple us in any way oddly enough it might energize us because hive is that way we get
better when you punch us just something about you know we wake up very tough strong jawed and it just
takes some kind of um some kind of motion some kind of threat to really bring us back right because
we've seen the lethargic voting but what happened when you attacked us we had you know a 50 100
increase in voting people coming out of the woodworks um so that's what is unaccounted for so
i'm very comfortable regardless of the sec's decision on hive i don't think there should be
any reason i think hell throw us a fucking bone we've been you know if you're just gonna label
us as security then you might as well just you know piss off it's all it's all fugazi at this point
um and maybe it'll give us a little boost who knows but i'm not i have very little concentration on
whether it's security or not it's still relevant to me i'm not in that kind of jurisdiction where it
matters i'm very mobile i can move to the jungle if i need to so um but it might matter to you you
know you might be in a jurisdiction where you have to pay more closer attention so well i'm still in
the good old us of a at least till i get to uh eddie spino's pool and then uh i might be living in his
on a lawn chair by his pool and maybe that'll be safe uh another question that's in the room and
i've written about this in fact it's even mentioned in here and what are your thoughts on it any
thoughts about hbd and the apr this is from j fang i think the 20 is fine and i follow taskmaster's
sentiment but i want to i keep seeing more people asking about whether or not if it's sustainable
lately my simple view dan is there is right now i'm looking tether 83 billion 206 million tether there's
like 30 million hbd most of that's locked up in the uh dow so you only have like 11 million or 10
million out on the open market to go from 10 million or even 30 million to 83 billion if you
want to rival some of the top uh stable coins even usdc has 28 billion that's going to be a lot of years
at 20 what are your thoughts yeah right now 20 it's not a threat um regard i mean we're currently voting
i think for um i think it's 12 last time i checked but i'm totally fine with the 20 and the consensus on
it we have to keep an eye on if it starts to get very popular and hbd starts to go up as i said it's
not this whole haircut rule um it's very important but we have to take in account market cap and
liquidity um right now it's a very small fraction of the market cap so it's not a threat the only time
it does become a threat is when the market cap of hive gets so high and then hbd starts to become a big
number let's say 100 million um that's a stable coin stable-ish right there's no guarantee but
people are expecting at least around 100 million um of whatever it's paid to when they cash out
and that's different from a hive token because or a hive coin a hive coin can fluctuate in price people
aren't expecting that right and go from 100 million go to 50 million go to a billion regardless
you can fluctuate the stable coin camp so even if hive is like 20 billion market cap
market cap can be fugazi it can be propped up liquidity is not fugazi um that's you know it's
either real or it's not and um if you have the high even if it's a fraction of the market cap of hive
if it's a very big liquid number you got to watch out for that so yes i say always be smart as a
community don't ignore it make you know i've seen it's been hitting all-time high lately in terms of
amount blocked which is great blocked hbd means a more secure market cap for hive because that's
just taking hive off of the market um but also be smart about it it starts to get too big of a number
let's like i said don't always focus on the percentage you got to focus on um the liquidity
and as we get bigger there's going to be better tools where we can monitor that so
but yeah right now 20 is fine well and it's been doing so well lately as well keep in mind this
has been a brutal market and um to be able to offer that so long it's been nice yeah i i think there's
two points to this uh first point is and we do call it stable-ish from the market perspective but
you have to keep in mind hive hive stable or hbd stability comes from the hive conversion and so
everybody says it's stable-ish but really it's a stable coin because at any time you can convert it
to one dollar worth of of hive so you have to use the conversion mechanism to realize that but it is
available there again as long as we're up above the the haircut level which at this rate we're nowhere
close but the other point that i think is very important with the stable coin not so much the value
captured coin hive but hbd and you said 100 million down and just picking a number out of the air but
here's my retort to that what if 25 million of that is in sucre and they're using that to buy food and
medicine and sandwiches and and paying bills and you have 25 million in the sucre economy just going back
and forth around each other that's not a threat to your system realistically because people are
holding in their wallet not for the conversion to hive not for the financial aspect they're holding
it for the commercial aspect and that's why i've used uh you know like the the gaming uh realm if you
have people who are using holding hbd because they're gamers and they're involved in games or or gambling
that utilizes hbd i mean if i keep 500 in my wallet just to go gamble with every sunday in the nfl
i'm not going to convert that to hive i'm keeping that in my wallet because in two days there's another
game i'm going to be gambling so that's where i think with hbd we need to keep building out the
utility on that the more utility you have both commercial and financial the better your insulation
then is against your backing or your reserve which in this case is hive yeah that's great foresight
there um it's so the more of a circular economy you have the more people are not going to cash out
they're going to hold it for the apr they're going to hold it because it's fast and feeless they're
going to hold it because it's um associated with games the thing with you know not to pick on i usually
don't call out names specifically you can usually talk about know what i'm talking about as i
describe it but you know take was it luna um the reason people got into luna was because the apr but
you didn't have businesses accepting it they didn't have they didn't build the economy around it it was
really just a cash grab wasn't built in a way where they're actually trying to build ecosystems around
it where hive is the exact opposite right it's boots on the ground a lot of these countries
and places find the fast and feeless and apr and named account and just how easy it is to move
around very easy and they love it and so you're right they're not immediately going to cash out
and it might get to a point where they never cash out where you just have this floating hbd that is
there you know quote unquote forever it's or at least it's incredibly sticky because they they want the
hbd for their businesses they want to hold it in their accounts it becomes where they store their
value um so that's yeah i i completely agree so if we if we theoretically ever got to a hundred
million dollar hbd market cap you would also have to take into account how many games are built how many
how much how many circular economies because hive already has some circular economies out there they
may be small but they're they're there and these things are incredibly fast it's like gasoline and fire
it doesn't take long the hard part is starting the fire spreading it's much easier so we've already
have these little these little fires these little circular economies everywhere and as more games
more use case um happens with the named account the reputation um it's going to create these sticky
economies for hbd and that will make it to where yeah you might have a hundred million but maybe
50 50 or even 25 of that's floating around in a realistic liquid manner as a threat to convert to
without a doubt and for those who are in developed countries i just want to remind you that there are
many parts of the world where there is no visa cuba is one of them i think venezuela might be another
uh and if there is visa a lot of times anything to do with money credit financial transactions
it's a preposterous an onerous a loan shark type rate where you sit there and say oh as a as a merchant
i get charged one and a quarter percent by visa they if they have that option they may get charged at
10 so we have to keep in mind that a lot of times there's services that hive is providing that in
the developed world it's like not that big a deal because we may hate our banks but the banks are
fairly stable they're protected a little bit you know visa does work you go onto your bank account and
the money will be there you go into a lot of these third world nations you can't count on any of that
stuff so this is the this is the stuff that satoshi wrote about i don't think satoshi really was able
to present the solution but i think we can present the solution with what dan just said hbd fast
fearless transactions no commission no merchant uh service charge none of that you send 100 hbd
100 hbd arrives at the other end nothing's taken out of that um one thing that uh was mentioned in
the room here in the threadcast dan and this is by uh the time travelers a shout out to the ragnarok
game that is taking shape under the guidance of they call me dan um i know this is web three but
maybe you want to give a quick uh run where ragnarok stands for everybody yeah it's actually good
timing monday we have the new ui and pretty much all the bugs are fixed we are putting the art
together with the names and the stats and then it's nft time so very close very close if you haven't
played the alpha if you haven't gotten in there you should get involved there's going to be some prizes
you know there's going to be some rewards for people who've been participating and that's what you
have to love about hive right you you can go you can test out a game you can earn reputation you can
earn some hive you can earn some rewards just for trying out a new game that's going to help the
underlining protocol that you're on anyway so that's just a synergistic loop and of course i'm all about
distribution so you know people who are putting in the effort definitely deserve the rewards and we've
had so many good testers um pointing out you know dozens and dozens of bugs over the months and
helped us shape the game give us ideas but it's you know the the strategy is there the gameplay is
there um the theory is there it's pretty solid at this point i don't see too much big changes it's
just a matter of um getting there and anyone who's known game development it's um it's definitely a
beast this was my first game i kind of jump into things head first i have maybe i don't think there's
such thing as too much confidence but i always believe i can i'll just get it done no matter what
regardless and um it was definitely an eye-opener it humbled me a bit but it's been exciting and
we'll see it's a community game it's a first of its kind we'll we'll see if if people like to play it
we'll see what happens maybe if you can uh also follow that up with i think a very interesting and i
know you and matt have talked about it over the last couple years but i think it's a very interesting
aspect to this game and i presume it'll be part of other things created going forward uh could you
explain for those who aren't aware what the sip is and what that does for the hive community
so the sip it's sort of evolved as these things evolve they get simpler and simpler to their core
point so for me now when i look at it when i think of a sip i think of a sun surrounded by planets
and the planets are liquidity pools and the sun is the what you would call the sip the pool where the
fees go and then the community can vote on where those fees go so to understand the sip better is to
understand the goal of this what what the sip is trying to accomplish i've said this a couple times
now there's a very wise man goes by to handle disregard fiat and he said a token or a coin
is nothing without a dex because it has no price discovery it has no transfer method it has no means
of exchange and i thought about that for a long time and i realized okay well if the liquidity
if the exchange is is so important to a coin if it's so foundational why in the hell are we giving
our power to cz why the hell are we giving our power to justin sun and all of these centralized
exchange owners why are they getting all the fees why is he a billionaire why are we giving all those
fees away we don't have to so the idea of the sip is to create a decentralized monopoly
for each liquidity pool it's a community pool it's not owned by cz it's not owned by me it's
not owned by anybody it's owned by the hive community or the community in which that lp is
associated with but the sip is always owned by the hive community and that's where we're going to vote
on where the um the infrastructure goes so each pool can have its own sip you can have a sip for a game or
a liquidity pool for a game you'll have a liquidity pool for hive and bitcoin and let's just focus on that
for for a second if you have a liquidity pool and you have a way of trapping value where the keys of
that liquidity pool cannot be rugged they're they're multi-sig in a decentralized way where nobody
has centralized control of that liquidity pools community owned and what goes in doesn't come out
in in terms of the liquidity pool itself yeah you can have you know sell sides on each side like
you could sell for bitcoin or hive etc but if anyone knows how liquidity pools work you can't
rug the liquidity inside you can't take all the tokens or all the coins out of the pool so once you
have this foundation of something going in but not going out you'll hit a critical mass when it comes to
exchange where do people go what's the biggest thing people want liquidity they want the least slippage
so if the hive and bitcoin pair gets so thick and so liquid that you get a less slippage here than you
do on binance or elsewhere people will just go there and since it's kyc list it doesn't discriminate
it can't be shut down it's worldwide in theory and this should work in practice this is all new though
we don't know but as a theorist i can see this very clearly how it's going to work if you have a thick
enough liquidity point there will be a tipping point where everyone starts to go there and once
that happens it's a synergy synergistic loop because it's already the thickest now it's just going to
become rock thick where there it makes zero sense to go to an exchange and the best thing we can do at
that point is get delisted from centralized exchanges because we no longer need them because all we need
is bitcoin we do not need fiat get fiat out of your head i don't want to be on coinbase screw those guys
i don't want to be on any of these centralized exchanges i just want a kyc list way to to
exchange large amounts of high for bitcoin and then bitcoin you can do the coinbase and whatever
the hell you want to go um that's fine so the fees from that instead of going to cz they go to the sip
and they sit in a multi-sig and now we can vote on what they can pay validators they can play
off-chain infrastructure when people look at the speak network they don't realize how intricate
and how important it is to hive this is foresight we're understanding what a blockchain is for and
what it's supposed to be used for data availability and incentivizing off-chain data you do not want to
post all of your lol comments you do not want to post heavy data on chain you need to post that off-chain
you want the the base layer to be as rock tight as possible with just immutable truth you don't want
to be posting irrelevant data on it we can now we have the luxury but one day we won't be able to
do that and resource credits will become valuable and it will be more of uh okay i'm posting this
because it's important not because you know there's no other alternative and then most people are going
to want to post off-chain so incentivizing off-chain infrastructure of all kinds is critically important
so to have a way where we can raise funds without inflation we can do it off our own liquidity
where those fees were going to a centralized middleman anyway that's the whole idea it's a
new experiment and we're hoping the end goal the grandiose goal is it gets so thick that everybody
always goes to that lp we live off our own fees we always have the inflation we can push the button at
any time but maybe we turn it down because the fees are so high we can pay validators we can pay
infrastructure providers and and we have you know even the dow whatever we need um that's the end
goal um but at the very least we'll at least have these decentralized lp liquidity pools where we don't
have to rely on centralized middlemen and then we also get to harvest our own fees i think that's so
powerful i think we've given as a community too much power to decentralized exchanges and what
have they done for us except screw us so it makes zero sense to live in that world and give them
anything if we don't have to i don't know if that explained it for you anybody has any more questions on
the set it's a big big idea so it's hard to explain in one go and i might be
it might make sense in my head but somebody might saying oh this doesn't make any sense so if it
doesn't make sense just let me know yeah it makes sense i mean to me because i've been following speak
since you guys really started talking about it but i think the the big key that people need to take away
from it is this stuff is being built there there we're still at the phase of infrastructure and
everybody like wants the oh moon the price of everything now this isn't about mooning the price
of the token this isn't about making hive scare so the price goes up to a hundred dollars a coin this is
about useful infrastructure that then can be tapped into by different projects whether it's speak network
whether it's as part of the speak network sip and whether it's ragnarok tapping in whether it's
other applications tapping in whether it's us reaching out and basically pulling bitcoin into a
liquidity pool that is paired with hive or paired with hbd so then we can take the value that we have on
hive if we want to get it into fiat then we have a mechanism where we could use uh bitcoin as the vehicle
currency back to the exchanges and this is being built this is not something in the planning stage
this is not a pipe dream you go to disregard fiat's uh uh post on peak d and he's explaining
where things are going so this stuff's being put together
yeah we have to look at the speak networks example when you are buying larynx minor tokens
for that lp to get um your miners you're putting hive into the ecosystem and then that's being paired
with speak to create an lp um that's sort of an idea where we're also locking up hive
in a liquidity pool where it's not going to be removed central by a centralized force
so this idea is also making hive more scarce taking hive off the market while simultaneously giving
you liquidity and harvesting the fees so you know just when you really sit back it's
pretty elegant and um very synergistic so that's just the idea you can do so much though there's
so many ways you can create your own sort of sip because there's going to be sips
i used to call them sips there's one sip and then there's liquidity pools that live outside the sips
and with those liquidity pools you can have your own kind of rules but each one is going to have
a tiny fee that goes into the sip so if you see all these different communities with their own lps
basically decentralized lps and it's just it should be just plug and play create your own lp you don't
have to worry about bringing your own multi-sigs you don't have to worry about any of that crap right
you just basically plug and play um the fees will be smaller than a dex or a centralized exchange anyway
so there would be no reason um to go there due to fees um and then yeah you can create your own sort
of economies whether that be um you have some sort of thing you have to purchase and that starts to
inject into your liquidity pool like you know more liquid like we do with the larynx miner
um that's where you can get creative and then you're going to start these because the idea of
liquidity pool is so primitive right now but what you can really do with it it's amazing once it becomes
autonomous and no one owns it it's fascinating to me what we can do with that so we're we're at the
cusp of something really big damn word we're joined he uh requested to speak uh he or she i hope i my
my espanol is leaves a lot to be desired la hojita i think has joined us you're on mute if you uh care to
unmute and share yeah hi everybody sorry for the parrots in the background you hear me enough
yeah i can hear you and excellent excellent so uh cheers uh dan and taskmaster and all the other
participants just um a small comment from here in el salvador because um with hive growing and actually
the the link between hive and bitcoin we really or at least personally but i i share that with other
people here we consider hive to be like the the closest uh old to bitcoin and like the the really
the the royal uh path between our daily life as as people having an easy access to bitcoin and a social
platform which is high for the beginning or or at its core so i'm really excited by by what you've
exposed then around uh the steep and those decentralized liquidity pools uh and maybe
it could be coupled with highlighting the importance of uh hive lightning that you know that uh brian of
london uh developed application because uh i took to other salvadorians explaining that if they
began publishing on hive it'd be so easy for them at some point not necessarily on a systematic basis
but at some point to convert their hive or hbd to bitcoin uh that's it would be like yeah i would
almost say the salvadorian social network for people already having uh embraced bitcoin so that's what
i wanted to mention and and many uh congratulations for the work you've been uh unfolding in the last year
so no that's really great to hear what what did you say your name was again the name of what mine
yeah your name actually on on uh hi i'm a hat i j-a-t-c uh-huh okay cool um that's really great to get
your insights um and the lightning bridge is so important that's what i say you know bitcoin has done
so much work for us that's why you can never accuse me of being a maximist i always take the tools
available right i'm not going to be a um a screwdriver shovelist and i need a or a screwdriver
maximalist i need a shovel right it's just like um bitcoin is our liquidity maybe it's not in the
future but right now it is so we have that bridge to lightning lightning network is penetrating many
countries in a very centralized way of course but it's still doing the work as long as there's an
alternative system people can earn hive cash out easily to the lightning network um so that's very
exciting to see and it doesn't take much to spice that up with a few initiatives get some contests
going and um get the uh that's why you know it's all about injecting capital into various different
locations where people can find it useful and then the network effect grows and hive is so incredible
at that with the social and the incentivized um stakeholder distribution proof of brain it's it's very
very good at that so um thanks for your insights any comments on that task
test might be there it is um one thing that uh this leads into and i i believe this is only in the
planning stages this is not being built yet but maybe you would care to explain your concept of
hive perhaps someday be in the transaction layer for bitcoin since bitcoin seems to be outsourcing
its transaction layer since it is high fee and slow and hive is just the exact opposite so do you want to
delve into that a little bit okay yeah sure um so bitcoin is what we would call it was funny matt was
matt and i was talking about this while he was here big bitcoin is our trojan horse it's a crippled
data availability layer with high fees thus you can say let's put on our little hats the elites love it
because that means the transaction layer is going to be pushed to layer two aka centralized layers because
if you can't incentivize them somebody will do it and they'll ask for kyc they'll become a convenience
monster everyone will use them aka chase bank or or whatever right people will love convenience and
there's no alternative that's what they'll use so no one could have comprehended no elite that's
this is why i love hive like i i'm i love game theory i'm a nerd when it comes to theory i think about
this stuff all the time i like trying to put myself in the enemy's shoes and destroy myself i love doing
that so that's how you can find holes looking in the mirror um if we were to go back in time and
they say oh bitcoin's crippled high fee excellent right mr burns excellent and everything's in control
right everything else is pre-mined coin voting perfect we have this under control we control
the liquidity etc etc let bitcoin infiltrate get into all of society do what it's doing right
how in the hell could anybody in their right mind say okay well in order to scale bitcoin
in a censorship resistant way we need a non-crippled data availability layer that has its
own layer one censorship resistance which you can't force this is magic some magic here some serendipity
a bunch of people all over the world volunteering to come here to help on their own accord you can't force
that so there has to be appreciation for this this is why you couldn't predict it because it couldn't
be forced that they would then because once you have your own layer one security you don't need bitcoin
security so why the hell would you scale something that you don't need but what they didn't foresee
and no one could was the fact that it became our liquidity layer we can scale it by becoming its
transaction layer and since it's done all the damn work it's done the trojan horse it's done what we can't do
aka infiltrate centralized institutions all we do is latch on like a parasite and we just suck the
liquidity out when we need it and they can't stop it because we are censorship resistant on our own
accord we don't rely on bitcoin at all so they're like what the hell this censorship resistant layer
one transaction uh this layer one transaction layer came out of nowhere and now you know they can have
a whack-a-mole lightning network system if you want or you can just wrap your bitcoin and live on the
hive network and cash out when you need to but that's what most people don't realize we're moving if
bitcoin is to succeed because you have to do two lanes not successful or successful if bitcoin is
successful in its current state the fees need to be astronomical thousands and thousands of dollars
it's the only way because the mining reward is going down and in that world everyone 99.999 percent
of people will live on the layer two aka the lightning network they will never interact with the layer one
therefore the layer two becomes their de facto layer one and if that layer two is centralized the whole
world lives on a centralized layer then so that's where you can see where the elite are like excellent
like that's going to happen without hive without hive or a censorship resistant transaction layer to help
bitcoin that is the guaranteed outcome i would bet all of my money on that because there is no way
in practice that it ends up any other way so if you look at what we're doing with hive it's sort of
a black swan no one could have foreseen this that's why it's so awesome i don't know why people aren't so
so excited with the potential here um and people say oh we could do it for for ethereum i don't mean to
pick on it there and it's like why in the hell would we want to scale a centralized chain we have no
use for it ethereum is a computation layer computation is mechanical we can easily build
those pipes it doesn't offer anything in in in terms of you know what bitcoin can offer us we
you know we don't need the smart contracts we can do it a much more efficient way we believe in layer
two smart contracts not layer one smart contracts there's data availability there's data and a smart
contract is a computation of reading that data and making it into something so why the hell would you
combine both why would you say you have to hold the data and you have to do the computation to
to reference that data it makes zero sense because now you have high fees for nowhere for no reason
you niche this shit out you have the data holders right you've got hive witnesses we hodl the data
and then any layer two can use their computational force to reference that data in a way they want
but you don't make the layer one guys or gals validators do all of that work because now you ruin
um that layer with high fees if you have high fees you can't do anything that's why the scaling trilemma
is such a scam is that's why i plan to disprove this month it's the biggest misinformation and it's
led to so much damage in crypto because people think you need a slow high fee base layer when it's the
opposite it's like trying to bulk on on on a cut it's like somebody's telling you to eat a thousand
under maintenance to to build muscle it's like no matter what you do you're not going to be able to do it
that's a scaling trial so
plus you throw in a weightlifting uh analogy
dan did before the show dan was at the gym he said so he it's on his mind um well one thing to
throw by you dan that i've i've never talked to you about this i've written about it and i'd like to
get your feedback my view of web 3 and i i don't disagree with what you and matt talk about all the
time because certainly it is the core it is the basis account own your own account uh censorship
resistant which not only can go and and be applied to speech it also applies to financial transactions
and defy and all that other stuff but to me when i look out in the future and people say well what is
web 3 to me it's the merging of social media and finance and how social media and i i go back to that
that very famous dan larimer post from a number of years ago where he talked about the the trojan horse
and social media is something that everybody knows that that's the way to get people in but when you
have social media and throughout that woven throughout that is value capture tokens are stable coins are
tokens that are given for a variety of different reasons and built into the tokenomics of the application
itself of the game itself of the game itself of the ecosystem itself and then you have financial
services tied to that where people can swap it for other tokens people can uh collateralize it
potentially people can use it for a variety of different things suddenly you are now in a completely
completely completely different realm and i think the big thing that separates what we're talking about
with web 3 as compared to elon with his everything app and all that other stuff is he may be able to
duplicate this in fact i have confidence elon will duplicate this he will take social media he will
merge it with finance he will have finance interwoven the thing is it's still going to be
elon's account because you're going to need twitter's permission to have your account so hence at best and
he's not even pretending to be web 2.5 he is purely web 2.0 he has no problem with regulation he has no
problem with the establishment that's in this guy's dna he's not a web 3 person so in that regard i think
we are only increasing the counterparty risk by moving everything to twitter i mean it's bad
enough with jp morgan and bank of america and twitter and facebook being separate but then you get the
financial tied into twitter or tied into google or tied into facebook and all of a sudden zuckerberg zaps
your account not only can you not access your facebook or instagram you can't access your metaverse
stuff you can't access your nfts you can't access your bitcoin or any of your other tokens that may
be wrapped and tied to these ecosystems and to me that's a problem and this is where and i always
go back to give it some time we're building the infrastructure because this account ownership when
you're looking and i actually am starting to move away from social media and say we are looking at
combining media and finance because the mainstream media companies are are imploding uh what are your
thoughts on that you know i would say web 3 is exactly what you're saying to me it also means
censorship resistance which is something that twitter can't offer most people say ah people don't care
about censorship resistance and it's true they don't care about it until they absolutely need it
and you know let's be honest most people don't absolutely need it um until it's too late then then
they can't do anything about it so we're in this conundrum where it's like well um how do we get people
to wake up and the answer is you don't um what we have is the ability to demolish and burn and melt
red tape we have no strings we don't need permission there's no one that can get in trouble from a
crippling protocol standpoint the ultimate goal is having tokenized communities something no one else
can offer and it sounds so basic and so simple but the core idea is you have an immutable list of people
these are people that you can either remove them but no one outside of your group or your permission
can move censorship resistant way to store followers lists you can now build a foundation on top of
that and once people start to build these liquidity pools these native community liquidity pools with
their own coins and or their own tokens tokens are layer two coins layer one with their own tokens
and they find ways to incentivize because everyone inside a community if you're inside of community a car club
you want reputation within that car club because at the end of the day what do you do with your time
right you you want a group of like-minded people and you want to be respected and you want to be able
to share your opinion and you want camaraderie and all of that that's what everyone seeks so there's value
there people will do infinite amount of free work if they can get build reputation within the niche
communities that they enjoy you see this with video games and all kinds of arts and crafts everything all these
things all these different communities basket weaving right all these things that people do
they go up and beyond they don't do this stuff because they're paid they do stuff because they
love it they want to be recognized within their communities if you can learn which is 100 possible
because what we perceive as value thus becomes valuable if you can learn as a community to focus
and create value within your community and tokenize that value and harness its power
and combine that with what you call defi true defi not this defi 2.5 you become sustainable
it's a sad world because a lot of people have so much talent and i see so many people who can't make
ends meet they can't open up a business they have to work for some oppressive company that they hate
that that this doing things that they don't agree with we're in a very sad state as a world like money
has become a big deal to a lot of people and there's a magic sauce out there there really is and the idea
of tokenized communities allows the very deepest darkest of places to rise up and to overcome the odds
as we've seen what's happening in ghana and that's not even a tokenized community yet but that's the beginning
of what you can see a community with with with that comes together and what they could do with this
technology that's what i'm super focused on and we're very close and of course we could just slap
something up but when you ask me a question on how to get something done i start at the very very basic
oh you need a database now this database needs to be distributed across the world oh now you need to
come up with a governance on how to improve and upgrade the protocol and make changes like you have
to start with every little thing oh you if you have a tokenized community where's the infrastructure
how do you incentivize infrastructure how do you have this in a censorship resistant way
yeah you might own the community list you might own the tokens but what about the infrastructure
you don't want aws to own that you have to think about everything every little bit before this works
and there's still we're going to miss but you know we we like to think we've covered the core
components to make it to where you don't need anything to do with web2 we don't need web2
like we are coming to a place where we can really you know incentivize physical infrastructure across
the world in countries that are becoming more friendly to this stuff um so tokenized communities
are so powerful and that's something elon could never do no web2 person could ever do that so it's
not a matter of oh you know competition this i look at twitter's everything app is just a
marketing tool it's an app we can use to market to to raise awareness so i love it but it can never
be in competition with hive and the more time that goes by i start to realize there is no competition
to hive just like there is no competition to bitcoin these things play fundamental roles humans are too
damn lazy it's too damn hard to have people come together all across the world in a voluntary way and
do something it's just so damn difficult and to think that you know some other data availability
layer is going to rise up and get censorship resistance and get this distribution without
vc funding i you know i as a poker player that's a fold for me um i'm all in on hive in terms of its
potential i'm not saying put all your money in the hive i'm saying with what we have when i look around
the tools we have hive stands out like a sore thumb thank you for that feedback i'm glad i'm on the right
path uh little housekeeping george lee had sent a send request i botched it up and i don't know if he
fell out of the room or what happened so george if you're listening uh you sent a request to be a
speaker resend it and i will try to to get this going uh we also have john snow joining us john snow
is down in venezuela so dan and keeping with our going global we we hit up uh el salvador now we'll
hit up venezuela and uh john's not exactly in sucre but he is very involved in the community not far away
and uh if you would unmute unmute john and and give us some idea of what's going on there
yo hello guys can you listen yep yep clear nice nice sorry if my english is not that understandable i'm
kind of rusty but i'm gonna do my best uh what's up dan how are you friend what's good touchmaster
what's good everyone hope you guys are having a great weekend uh i'm currently working alongside
the high sucre team we are promoting web3 and crypto adoption all all over the place we have managed to
establish some alliances with local businesses we have currently 45 businesses accepting hbd as a mean of
exchange we have some data and some numbers we have the community as a whole has spent around a
thousand and a half dollars and counting in local businesses so we are proving a great example that
web3 tools such as a hive wallet specifically can work and it works actually as a mean of exchange and
this is great because this proves everyone that web3 might be a solution in many aspects in our case in
the economic aspect because a our country currently likes the enough liquidity to make proper transactions yes
we have liquidity in regarding us dollars but when we want to do some when we want to receive
change change back when we do our purchases it's it's really a hassle and it's really a horrible situation so
hbd and hive fixes this and it's fixing it actually because we are proven already that hbd actually works
as a means of exchange as a means of exchange right now we are having a campaign where we are going to
add more businesses to our network and we are very proud and happy with what we're doing uh web3 is a
is a new tendency of the internet it needs a blockchain to to be a web3 tool and we are we are very happy and
we are very proud what with what hive has provided us the opportunities that hive has has provided us as
venezuelans and i i believe this is the blockchain of the present and the future
yeah john well said john is a legend for anyone doesn't know he's in venezuela he's been on hive for
as long as i've known um always putting in work boots on the ground um so definitely shout out thanks
for the valuable insight um as you can see hbd with this fast and fearless transaction you have the
social media aspect cool thing about hbd we're in a very new time where people are excited about
circular economy so you know we can easily run campaigns and you already see it people say oh look
i made this purchase with hbd and then they'll post it on their social media with ease from their cell
phone and before you know it they get a few bucks and up votes maybe and it's just a very fun experience
that you can't get anywhere else and i look at that as you know some of those people are going to power
up a little bit of that we're getting more governance coin distributed in a very fascinating way and
shout out as well as have been one of the best on all of high for so long and they've just been standing
out um plan on visiting later this year matt and i actually so can't wait if i could jump in uh to
to echo what you said and sucre gets a lot of attention uh john maybe if you could speak to
there's another initiative in a separate part of venezuela where there's a group of venezuelans
going to the local chamber of commerce going to universities talking to teachers and students
there uh i forget exactly what the name of the the group is are you familiar with that and could if you
are could you share a little bit about what they're doing yeah absolutely and they they are high
barkisimeto high parkisimeto barkisimeto is another state of the country is is more like in the west
and they are working really hard to promote hive through education via universities they recently went
to the chamber of commerce here in sucre we went to the chamber of commerce as well like a month ago and we
had a great meeting there and this is great because the word of hive is spreading around venezuela quite
rapidly and people are taking because we are a community project and we don't have any ceo or
you know someone that clearly represent us we understand pretty much what the concept of hive and
we know that we as a community have to put work on the ground in order to get to know more of
blockchain among among the country and internationally of course so yeah many there are many groups in
venezuela establishing themselves and they are really hard to establish a good base so we can hopefully
in the future all of us work together and do some more great things for hive
excellent very good john i think um we're just going to see this thing really take off
so many people are finding so much use cases for it and it's just really good to hear that it's helping so many people
Dan when when you see what john just described uh and by the way uh neo has requested to be a speaker so
neo we'll get to you uh in a second here but uh when you see what's going on and as john described in venezuela
when you uh read about what's going on in in cuba uh ghana some uh somewhat in nigeria and you see
what's going on in these developing nations then you also start to see uh some of the infrastructure
build out that and the progress not only is speak network making but ragnarok uh three speak you're
obviously intimately familiar with those you you see uh leo finance and the strides they're making
uh maybe cyber x and and rising star and some of these other games uh essency what they've been
doing i know there's uh some cross pollinization there essency and three speak are are doing some
uh collab uh then you see some of the open source projects that like peak d is is putting together
uh and then of course we we cannot uh overlook the work that's being done at the base layer
when when you take all of that into account and and not to to nail you down to this or anything but
how do i ask this how close are we uh in your estimation i i mean what do things look like over
the next uh i don't know six to twelve months in your opinion and i mean do you feel and and that's all it
is is just a feeling uh there's really not a lot of metrics to go by do you feel that
we're getting close and that there's going to be some big breakthroughs here soon
yeah i believe in the slowly and suddenly um it to me i mean it's the shorter the time frame the more
um difficult it is to predict anything the longer the time frame i become very confident i never ever
saying anything's 100 because that would be um that would be a lie but as far as confidence goes
with the amount of time and research um i think anyone can really see a clear path forward and the
need for censorship resistance you don't even have to be a conspiracy theorist at this point
um if we're talking six months to a year i really can't say i would say
in the next couple of years you're going to start to see people really wake up to the fact that
most of these chains are centralized not just because of the security label and not they weren't
sustainable you're gonna see vcs walk away because that's the whole problem a lot of these are propped
up but why are they propped up because someone wants to make money well if they want to make money
they're going to make money off someone's back and these things are going to become less and less
sustainable as hive was really born through fire born to scale on our own it was either scale or die
we're at a point where it's really efficient to run this stuff we're getting smarter we're building
the correct tech stack at least in my opinion um you get a couple more splinterlands you get a couple
of more games it doesn't take much and what you need is a foundation before the overnight success as
everyone likes to call it and i i just take a world view and i see where we're at and where things are
bubbling and percolating and it's hard to keep up they're really everywhere you know there's so
many little things happening across the world that are leaking over the bigger and bigger things and
before you know you hear oh well you know this so-and-so governments is interested or this
this big charity or this institution or this school um more and more of that you know where does it hit
a critical mass and you hit the right the right um connection and it really puts hive on the map in a big
way it could be tomorrow to me i'm surprised it hasn't happened uh it's kind of like we're dodging success
like people it's like we're we're the only one left and people are and there's like a team of 10
we're playing dodgeball like we're just dodging these balls somehow like they're coming at us
and it's only a matter of time before something hits um so that's how i feel you know in six months
i would be i would be just as surprised now as in six months if that critical hit hadn't happened
and i'm not saying this because please don't associate this with price you never hear me talk about
price i don't talk about price targets because i have no control over that the market is crazy as
hell the free market is crazy as hell i don't it's like a mental patient i don't tend to comprehend
try to comprehend that i tend to comprehend what the free market is going to settle down after all
the fugazi because there's so much ill awareness right now a lot of people don't understand but they
will understand by show and you're either censorship resistant or you're not in the next two years that's
going to be black and white for anybody to see it's gonna be very clear because they're making
their move i say they the centralized powers out there that want to control the financial system
and beyond are they're they're making their throat grab it's very evident now you can feel the wheels
are in motion there's no stopping they've already made their move so in two years it's going to be
cutthroat if you're if you're not censorship resistant it's gonna you're gonna be exposed in a very big way
um the funny part is a lot of these bag holders a lot of these people holding these centralized coins
will probably just say yeah you know centralization is okay in some areas because you know maybe it
does rise the price of some coins i don't know that's why i don't predict the prices but um it
sure as hell be evident that it's not censorship resistant and then you'll look at something like
bitcoin and hive and they'll be so far separated by then you'll have you know at least some savvy
investors they're like hmm these these are different and different is good in a portfolio
um so that's that's that's i guess all i can say um but i wouldn't hold this thing if i thought it
was going to zero i hold this thing because i think it's going to be valuable because of censorship
resistance and a lot of other things and my goal now is to just not be a distressed seller so that's
always been my advice you know um if you're distressed selling all the time you're probably over
leveraged you probably have too much in and you don't have other sources of income it's not smart
to go all in on something and then have to sell it all at the bottom you know you want to you want to
play reasonable and um keep yourself above water for as long as you possibly can until either right
and uh going back to what we've been talking about hbd is a wonderful way to store some value and put
some money aside when you need it that's what i've been doing and over the next year and a half i can
tap into it before i have to even think about other things so it's kind of a nice position to be in
uh one thing uh before we get to neo uh i missed it earlier nifty ass dan i'd love to do some testing
how do i get involved maybe even showcase on cryptoholics podcast i presume he's referring to
ragnarok uh for those who want to do some testing for ragnarok how do they go about getting involved
there's a discord right now they also have a twitter with the links but um it's a ragnarok discord
um pm me or eddie if you don't have that link and then you can ask to get in the mastermind group but
really it should just be open now um i think there should be a pinned version somewhere in the open
room if there's not i'll have that done but yeah anyone can join and then you can just download
the latest build keep in mind monday we're expecting a new a lot of new updates to the game in terms of ui
there might be a few bugs because the ui was completely overhauled
for the one of the final versions we we think um before we go testing
um yeah and then it's a good way for you to earn some rewards and future nfts um so you want to get
involved if you you know think you're going to play the game very good uh neil the floor is yours if you
want to unmute hey welcome hello can you hear me hello how's it going good good i just uh i mean
nothing specific i just want to add something to the previous topics as well and then i realized oh
i haven't clicked the request uh and also audio is better when you are a speaker while i'm recording
because i'm shorting all the time you know this is my job to do and also i can share some links at the
at the top here so people can see and they can join threads as well so nothing specific at the moment but
uh i will stay here and maybe i would like to add something later thank you yeah shout out to neo he
takes the videos live and cuts them up and um puts them out on social media and puts them in a document
where other people can download and share them and then we have a rewards system where you can
actually earn rewards for doing that so it's not like i said i don't know i've been you know i grew up
real poor i understand what it means to have nothing and there's so many opportunities on hive to earn
little bits here and there it's like man you know um definitely get involved if you can this is a good time to
be making a reputation for yourself because when it's a down time there's not as much competition
for a lot of things including reputation and you see people like john you know he's doing a lot of
work and it doesn't go unnoticed and when it's good times his reputation is going to be even better so
it's just you know a lot of role models out there to look up to and learn from and get involved
especially if you're new on hive or you feel like oh what can i do how do i make a difference
lots of ways to earn and you don't always have to change your world you know maybe you're a little
maybe you're a tester for a game or you you give some good advice or you just show up
you just keep showing up right so get out there earn some hive
yeah neo is doing a lot of good work for for not only what's going on with ctt but also i presume what's
going on with the the future of hive and some broadcasting and some good stuff uh before we
get to george lee uh having some difficulty approving him as a speaker it looks like it's working but
dan there was a question for you and uh in the threadcast and and alex rourke said what's this
fugazi that dan keeps saying so maybe you should explain fugazi to everybody before george
comes in and asks what he has to ask it's fugazi it just means like um nothing
bullshit basically smoke and mirrors somebody says it's all fugazi it means it's just nothing basically
hi george how are you doing good a while george appears how are you sir i'm good i'm good uh you speak
french i do not i speak a little spanglish and english i'm sorry i don't speak very good english
ah okay well it seems okay either do we and we're we're american yeah you'll fit right
oh it looks like he's you just muted yourself he's he's about to say his title and then it
disconnected him so he might be he got kicked yeah he does he just said that he's an asset manager
ah okay i i just heard him say i'm an ass
oh wait he was referring to me oh that's great i think i think he has uh uh connection problems i was
having a tough time getting him to uh connect so uh yeah i mean it's when you and dan you and and
starkers kind of coined the term uh web 2.5 when you see what's going on out there obviously
you've given us a good summary on this call of of where you think hives advantages are
and we all know the fudge from gensler and and the elizabeth warrens and the different governments
in the world and and all that crap but when you look at the web 2.5 projects you know the the uh
ones that are being built under the guise of web 3 do you see that as being uh how how do i describe
this not not competition because that's the wrong word um do you think that that'll be an area of focus
and that web 2.5 will ultimately be successful because people don't understand that it's not web 3
to me if you're going to go to what why would you go to web 2.5 and leave web 2.0 if you're not going
to go all the way to web 3 even mistakenly they can like uh dangle little trinkets before you but
unless you're truly web 3 i mean you could say that elon's trying to make web 2.5 not really because
he's not trying to fool anybody but i mean isn't web 2.5 really web 2.0
page and dan are you still there glitching matrix i think
dan dan you need to unmute we can't hear you
at least i know neil i'm not talking to myself i guess we lost we lost dan uh yeah i think so
yep i guess he he's gone well while we're waiting to see if he comes back
let me uh go through the thread cast see if any other questions came up
paez said so much happening with hive can't keep track isn't that the truth
he also said fugazi sounds like a baskin and robin's flavor by the way fugazi was in
the uh uh wolf of wall street uh matthew mcconaughey talked about fugazi and uh so
dan are you back man that's a great thing that your co-host because that would have just ended the
space we have like a a distributed uh hosting setup going here on twitter with our decentralized spaces
elon we're going to decentralize your ass whether you want to be decentralized or not
um what was the question again uh basically what what i was saying is
at web 2.5 is is something that i believe you and and and mac coined uh maybe you didn't you're the
the first ones i've heard mentioned that and when you look at over over the two point web 2.5 web space
my question is we have web 2 there's obvious flaws with that will people move from web 2 to web 2.5
not understanding that it's not web 3 because web 2.5 they dangle some trinkets like nfts and and stuff
like that but at the end of the day web 2.5 isn't anything other than web 2.0 so why should they move
from web 2.0 so my question was do you see web 2.5 actually becoming a focus for users and for people
because to me it's like well let's be honest if you're going to go to to dorsey's web 2.5 you might
as well stay on twitter because you know twitter has has a lot of things on it and dorsey's probably just
going to try to copy that and you're you're not getting any sovereignty anyway so what do you
think the impact of web 2.5 will be so i think web 2 with 2.5 whatever you want to call it is going to
be very dominant um for some time it could always be around i think a lot of the skins the the thing is
it comes from convenience so you have to throw censorship resistance out of the window when
you're talking about mass adoption because that's not going to get it for you it's not enough it'll
be good for like a base layer for games and things like that who have to who it matters for like for
a game operator or for like an app developer it matters if you know there's censorship resistance or
not um so they're going to do the research and understand it so yeah censorship resistance has value
but if we're talking about mass adoption for like the user base or just people adopting
they don't care about kyc for the most part where an ownerless account layer really thrives
is you see what elon's trying to do i believe um jago was i think that's who i saw it from he
retweeted saying that you know twitter is basically giving you email to the people that sign up so you
can quote unquote bring them if you leave twitter which is just obviously a very primitive um
not even form of hive but just like a primitive version if um you didn't have the right technology
to do it but that's where hive thrives and we see that the account to site model is old archaic and
broken and no one likes it it's definitely outdated and is primed to be destroyed and you can really
only do that with a neutral account layer you can't do it with a centralized account layer because
then the centralized account layer might not like rumble or it might like like you you see the
problem like the account layer has to be neutral where it doesn't it doesn't discriminate versus
the site you go to it's your responsibility and it's at the end of the day your reputation on the line
um what you interact with with your account it's not up to some centralized authority to say oh
you can't mess with this site because of your political views xyz whatever
so if you see that just from a convenience standpoint that people want to own their their
communities their follower list their supporter lists their their account in terms of being able to
take their followers and go to another skin because you have to look at these sites of skins if they
don't own your account if you're not married to them it's like i'm gonna sign up for twitter but
twitter owns my account like holy fuck man it's hardcore like you own me you own everything i can't
take my shit my energy and go somewhere else with it that's brutal so to be you know people understand
influencers understand that and they're like hey if i can have a way to like easily port my my list
because that's all it is at the end of the day a list and the other skins and skins are receptive to it
then you're gonna have a um a critical mass where enough skins go then yeah um people are going to
favor that so i see but i see these skins they interact with being heavily centralized
so that's it's going to be like oil and water you're going to have your account system but everything
that lives that's why people these maxis they think it's going to be a like oh censorship resistance
is going to win it's going to be decentralized everything it's like no you're going to have enough
censorship resistance to where there's not tyranny and then the convenience of web 2 is just going to
flop its big fat ass right on you and there's nothing you can do about it all the most of these
skins are going to be centralized especially at the start and what you're going to see is eventually what
i hope and this is where web 2.5 can become sort of outdated where these tokenized communities rise up
because people will flock to where there's incentive flock to where there's opportunity
and it only takes a few leo finances to show what is possible um so there's that world where
because you can't do that on the web 2 but anywhere centralization can poke it's going to so and that's
not a bad thing like centralization is badass it's awesome it's great it's very convenient it's bad if it's
if it has total control that's not cool like you need balance obviously and there should be
a healthy balance of censorship resistance and then you on your terms can interact with whatever
the hell you want centralized not centralized but there's going to be a huge market of centralized
skins that offer a superior experience for selling your data and people are going to be like sell my data
please i don't care i want the better experience and for those people they'll have an option but
they're still going to want to own their account in their account layer so that's where hive really
is going to be needed regardless
yeah let me uh let me get your views because i'm uh i'm up to my eyeballs in it so maybe uh you know a
lot of times when you work on projects you get involved with projects you you're involved with
the team behind the project your vision can be skewed but you mentioned uh you know a number of leo finances
and i know you keep an eye on things but you're not exactly immersed in leo finance you're not spending
your day on the platform you're not in the meetings and stuff like that so what is your view as
a hyvian but not you know a daily leo finance user what is your view of leo finance and what you see
taking place well from my personal insight i've seen somebody who has put together tokenized community
before is really technically possible so that's great great foresight but i see because i've learned
a lot a lot of this stuff i didn't just pull out of my ass i've learned from studying and studying
human nature and studying how this stuff works and i've studied leo finance and how they've come
about and how a tokenized community can really rally around a subject and you can see how reputation is
important and how people rally around a common cause so i think there's huge potential for that to be
replicated um as far as leo finance i i study it more from a um a game theory point of view just to see
how these things function as far as you know investing and all that um that's really funny
enough not my cup of tea um i'm a i'm a real long-term trader and you know getting a real estate and stuff
so i'm not necessarily looking to make short-term trades but i know people that love leo finance i've
heard um people talk about leo finance that were off of hive that i've actually just met so i see that
they're really good at getting the word out um but yeah it just showed me the potential
of what you can do with tokenized communities and once you get that technology plug and play
and not just plug and play plug and play but having sort of a blueprint on how to parameter the correct
way um and how to make yourself sustainable and all these things and i look at them to maybe even be
coaches to teach um because this stuff's going to be incredibly important people need opportunity
people need hope and i think tokenized communities is a radical new venture that it's going to be a
crazy social experiment and it when you can't put a blanket on something when you can't put a ceiling
on something like you can on web 2 these things can balloon and they can become very powerful not just
sustainable but powerful and that's that's important
do you see the uh potential for tokenized communities to
i don't know if replace is the proper word that might be too strong but do you see tokenized communities
um having a major impact on corporations and and kind of
becoming pseudo corporations or filling in for corporations and where people say say instead of
you know gravitating to abc i get what i need in in my community there and you know i don't need all
this outside stuff it's right here and somebody set up shop somebody set up stores i can make a a pretty
decent living i got nfts which are tied to assets that provide me a return blah blah blah blah blah i mean
when you start to think in those terms and then expand beyond let's say a corporation to an economy
you start to get into a mindfuck that is just overwhelming where it's like the potentiality here
is is enormous um if you look at where we are in society um the last five years have been absolutely
devastating to mom and pop businesses oh so many people i know have just had to close up shop or
just on their last legs um people don't necessarily like the walmarts and what are pretty much now
monopolies they can operate outside the law really though you know the mom pops have to close but the
walmarts can't that just created a cascade and an imbalance in power even more so so
i i like i said i love to study human nature um i definitely see a path where people are desperate
enough because of the circumstances and desperate times people are more willing to take risk and
that's how you start to turn the curve from you know weak shitty times to strong times right because
people start to get desperate enough of being oppressed and tyrannized that they they take risk and
you know i don't know if these mom and pops are going to want to go and work for the stores that
put them out of business um i think if they start learning of avenues where they can connect with
common people with similar interests with similar because they have their talents they may go out of
business but what they learn their expertise their connections that doesn't go out if these people
can start to connect and find ways to have and every community has value every community is inherently
value i'll say that several times every community every large group of humans that can organize is
inherently valuable in what way that's up to them to decide but they are valuable and they can and they
can capture that they can tokenize that value that's what people need to realize they can literally rise up
from their bootstraps and when people realize that all these people who've been oppressed they've
lost their businesses they've lost their ways of means and their dignity they're willing to take this
radical new technology risk because they have no other options we're in that sort of time where
that could happen and you can see people take enough risk to make some radical changes and then they start
rebuying their businesses they start collaborating because that's all you really need where people
get lost is when they get disconnected and censored that's when chaos happens people can organize
powerful things can happen and um i can see crowdsource community-owned businesses in the future
i can see people all these business owners that went out of business coming together communities coming
together um i definitely could see that only because of the circumstances that we're currently in
it's it i don't know it's like a movie to me it always gives me goosebumps when you look at the
path where we are and the circumstances we're in it's like a perfect disaster the perfect storm as
they call it for all of this stuff to be be taken advantage of because they're in peaceful times people
don't have the real you know they don't really have a reason you know when tyranny is not so oppressive
they'll live with it but we're in that time where the towel is being squeezed of every last drop
and everyone's waking up and that's a time for powerful change for good or bad and i think we
have at least an out at least a potential with the technology we have for people to regain their dignity
yeah i i think that's the big key for web three is providing an alternative and i don't care whether
you call it uh capturing a social layer call it community um you know i've i've torn this apart
maybe not quite as much but i i've torn it apart a great deal from the economic and monetary side like
dan has from the social psychology human nature side of things and and the potentiality of these
entities these units uh we'll just call them communities but but the units uh they can become
their own economies because since they're tokenized they can capture value which then if the infrastructure
is in place they can pledge that value as an asset of collateral they can enhance their value through
their actions and through you know whatever the community is involved in whether it's so
social media or you know basket weaving or whatever the community is involved in
their interaction creates value as we know uh you know facebook and twitter and youtube i mean they
have enormous value they can carry a message whatever that message is has a value and they can then take
that tokenization take that infrastructure build it expand upon it and create businesses around it like you
said dan the mom and pops have been obliterated in most of the world this especially the the developed
world and i presume it was even worse in the developing world and because of that a lot of people lost
their livelihood they lost equity you know not only did they have an income coming in from these
businesses these businesses you know a restaurant or a shop or a store or whatever while it was earning some
some some some some profits and while it was was in the green that was an asset of value well now
they had to close it down so not only did they lose their their income they lost equity stake in a business
that maybe was worth 75 100 150 200 000 dollars poof gone
yeah i've seen people well i've seen people there's a guy who owned um he did landscaping and um he got shut
down because of some regulations couldn't do it well the big one's good the commercial one and now he
works at the gardening in walmart basically so it's like these people are very pissed and they're very
resentful and they don't like working for these monster corporations that are pretty much taking
over and demolishing mom and pop stores um but that's who they go and work for basically these
restaurants if people lose their businesses they end up working for the the companies that help put
them out of business and that's not a good feeling that's not going to sit well with a lot of people
um no it isn't and i look at web three i look at high because first off i believe hive is at the
foundation of web three and maybe that's my maximalism if people want to accuse me of that
but i think the stuff that's being built not only the community not only the economic aspect and the
social media but the infrastructure is going in place where this concept of digital real estate
and and no we're not talking the metaverse and no we're not talking about gaming uh and you know
all that stuff although that that certainly is is potentially a part of all this but i'm talking
when you have hive tokens in your wallet when you have leo in your wallet when you have speak in your
wallet when you have whatever these the different tokens that are associated ecency if they come out at a
certain point whenever you have these different tokens associated with these different communities
you have digital real estate you have a stake in something that potentially could provide a stream of
of income to you payments to you in the digital world and this actually gets really interested when we start
crossing over into the physical world such as kind of we're starting to see wicana although there isn't
really that bridge between boreholes and and the digital world but maybe at some point there's
something that develops around that in in that country that ends up tied to hive and next thing you
know you get another sucre where not only are they using the token but all of a sudden they became a
community and like you said it's kind of neat they they share that they went and bought uh cinnamon
rolls i tweeted this out they bought cinnamon rolls for you know 3.5 hbd and i up i uploaded and it got a
you know a couple more hive that that person's going to be receiving well what if they take it to the next
level what if they start to develop businesses around this entire concept and those of us who are holding
hive everybody and i'm not talking the whales but i'm talking anybody who has high power 150 200 300 500
a thousand high power you suddenly have digital real estate that ultimately has some scarcity to it we
don't know exactly how it'll be but it has some scarcity and more importantly as activity increases
it has more value now whether the market realizes that or not you know you have bull markets you have
bear markets who knows markets are shitty at pricing value but the value grows and thus you have a more
valuable asset over time and to me that is something you don't get with twitter you don't get with working
at walmart you don't get in your local community too easily you don't have a stake in what's going on
and with high and with these layer twos many of them that incorporate the proof of brain many of the
games that have different ways of doling out their assets you don't have to necessarily and one of the
things that i look at as a negative one of the negatives of like a theorem and most of these other
blockchains you can get involved and you may have an asset that increases in value over time but you
got to buy your way in or you have to have some and then stake it with with hive you show up you get
busy you post a article about buying cinnamon buns and i so i sweep by and i give you a couple of hives
dan sweep buys and give you a couple more hives and next thing you know you're talking about cinnamon
buns and purchasing cinnamon buns and you're getting a little bit more hive or hbd to go purchase more
cinnamon buns if you want that is really something novel and if those people take some of their high
power and don't spend it all over time they're have they're they're growing their stake of an asset
tied to an ecosystem that actually is developing to its own economy and i think that's the epitome of
web three yeah i like what brian says when he talks about value for value that's sort of where i look
at the upboats on hive the incentivized stakeholder distribution that's what i call it many know it as
proof of brain the ability to say hey you've done value i distribute value to you and any business can
tokenize in this way and if you give a review there's actually an app on um hive wavio which is you know
similar you can earn coins and tokens for um posting reviews of the restaurant that you ate at
online there's so many different business models you can have um when we're talking about digital
real estate you know hive is the proof that a group of humans that come together a large community can
create value we created something called censorship resistance because we're distributed we have
distributed infrastructure and you can't shut us down that in itself is valuable and when combined
with a well-made tech stack with the fast feeless data availability layer layer two smart contracts just
the efficient stack layer it becomes incredibly useful and applications need to hold enough digital real
estate if you will to operate on and from there you can start to build these you know more top heavy
businesses um such as you know restaurants or anybody basically turning coupons into tokenization of the
company in terms of being able to get discounts being able to to get food this is an incredible way um to
distribute value and get your company's name out there because at the end of the day
if it's easy for people to give you value and you give return value as it is with this technology you
can do it with a simple upvote right you don't have to worry about payment details or any of this crap
and you have the social media right there tied in that creates a great environment for companies to
become cool with their customers and you know you have the instagram but it's so primitive right they take
a picture of instagram there's no connection um but here it's like you can be intimate the apps can
be integrated you know you can integrate you know wavio into your restaurant and then before you know it
your customers are now incentivized to give good reviews and that's the lifeblood of any restaurant
especially new ones so that's just one small little um business model you can do literally everything
should should be and can be tokenized there's so much being left on the table when you don't capture
the inherent value because there's so many things you know um people like their reputation you know
vanity being able to you know be recognized being able to transfer value being able to um build
reputation in systems and with companies um you know you go to a company enough and they see oh wow
look at this guy one of our top one of our top guys they can look at as a profile right there they
can see his reviews everything how much coin he holds all this kind of stuff um it creates a completely
different dynamic dan if if i can before we uh uh wrap up this show i i just noticed uh amundo's in
the room and and john snow if you would help me uh amundo can you send a um send request so we can bring
you on air uh amundo for those who are not aware is one of the main driving forces behind hive
soup cray he is one of the ones who uh has started it he's been been at the the start of the initiative
um he's been on crypto maniacs a couple times uh so john could you either fire him a message or just
come on and fire it at him in spanish uh so we can bring him on here and have him say hi and
get it get a little bit from him yeah i'm gonna try to set him up and i just send him a message so
let's wait a little bit unless dan suddenly uh learned spanish we're gonna need a little
translation with it mundo yeah yeah translation por favor okay give me give me give me some minutes
to to set that wound up okay uh damn well while they're setting it up uh you know what they call a
person who speaks one language don't you uh no clue american no okay i know i know spanglish i think
that's going to become a a dominant future spanish and english yeah i um i'm i'm interacting with all
these venezuelans and and cubans and people on threads i'm i'm learning to read spanish a little
bit so i i can at least catch the gist so i am improving but uh the days where i'm going to hold
a uh interview in spanish are far off yeah either have it or you don't i don't think i have it but
i can hold a basic very primitive conversation
uh oh let's see any questions uh we'll go to threadcast let's see uh oak oak oak oak coachee
i i abused that and i apologize really a juicy space good discussion and insights on blockchain
social media and finance i had a good time we are glad uh alex o'rourke i have stake in the hive
blockchain good for you alex we like to see that everybody should be uh and alex was the same one
who uh dan asked what fugazi was so he has stake and he knows what fugazi is now so he had an
educational time so this show is a success then we we entertain and we educate um what what while we're
waiting for a mundo oh here he is he's requesting let me see if i don't screw this up um
well i'm i'm messing with this dan what pitfalls potentially do you see for hive out there you
always talk about the positive but there are pitfalls what do you see that they could potentially be
i would say not getting a decentralized pull to bitcoin we're heavily reliant on centralized exchanges
right now um so we definitely need to be focusing more on the exchange side which is layer two um
so that's luckily being actively worked on um
i welcome a money attack um
of course um people becoming complacent
but the great thing about hive is it brute forces you to distribute the coin through the
incentivization of distribution which i think is going to play it plays a powerful role in bear
markets by not stagnating the distribution um i would say definitely the centralized exchange attack
because it it wouldn't destroy us but it would hurt um we would just open up otc markets and telegram
i mean it'd be primitive but we still have a way to bitcoin
and cash out the bank accounts as well otc is actually very powerful and hard to be stopped
um that's true it's you know that's why i love hive it is very difficult
but i would say the centralized exchange right now is
our by by a mile our biggest attack vector after that it's really all on our own hands since we have
the correct um incentivization we have decentralized funding um of course if the price dropped to zero but
you have hodlers of last resort um even then it would be an interesting social experiment because
even then i'm not quite sure because i still believe there'd be hope that people would just
fucking um bring back the value so you know it's hard to say if there's actual death blow to
hive right now um i can't find one so you can call me uh you can call me a hopeless optimist i guess
i think if the price dropped to the level that you were talking and started to push
really hard the sub 10 cents you'd see projects like leo finance you'd see project like speak
network three speak they step in because it's only to their benefit they're going to need if they truly
are building on hive they're going to need the the resource credits and the high power yeah hodlers
the last resort don't sell um down there right they're looking to accumulate more so it's just a um
um yeah i mean if we're just playing you know extreme kind of d-bag douchebag um devil's advocate
where it's like yeah that would happen but even then i was saying oh even if the
almost impossible happened it would still be interesting social experiment yeah edmondo miamiya
hello hello hello i thought that she can out but he is he's very brave edmundo
well dan just proved he knows more espanol than me
of course he has the advantage he lives in a country where they speak spanish so you'd think
he'd pick up a thing or two
hello hello hello hello hello hello hello hello hello hello hello hello hello okay
edmundo sounds like he's having a party there yeah yeah that's what i said
yes sir my man no te escuchamos perfect perfect perfect
en este momento estoy con el equipo de high sucre trabajando en la calle entregando material para
los negocios que se han captado los cuales ascienden a más de 46 actualmente y las buenas noticias son que se
siguen sumando mucho más comercio la circulación de la moneda sigue en pro de de la economía del estado sucre y
y bueno muy contento por lo que está pasando ahorita en sucre con los usuarios que están comprometidos
eh dando la circulación a la moneda del hvd nuestra cripto estable y bueno elgardo traducele
así esa parte porque no voy a extender mucho para que ellos puedan entender
it's okay it's okay bro so i i will catch that right you understand that pretty much personally
uh there were a couple words that uh dan and i may have confused so why don't you tell us what he said
just so we can check to make sure we got it correct yeah yeah so edmundo just said that
he is currently working with the high sucre team right now they are on the streets providing businesses
with some hive merch that have their brand and our brand together this is like a business strategy we
are working on and he has good news because more businesses keep adding to our network and are
accepting hvd and they are working really hard to up the numbers because one one of our main goals
is to make more hvd transactions in the city so so john if you could ask them dan really has an
important question it's the most important question of the day he and starkers are probably going to be
visiting venezuela before the end of the year and dan wants to know can he stay at a mundo's house
while he's visiting there he needs a bit to see oh my god oh my god
yes yes yes yes of course
of course you are welcome 100% you can stay in my house at any moment very humble but you are welcome
well the truth is that I am very happy if you come to venezuela here in the state of sucre you will be well
received and well you will see the tangible reality of how we are adding value to the chain of
the hivvd and even in the house all the hivvd in reality could be welcome because here we have
a huge price and very large with the calmidad, taxmaster, young, or with each of you really
we are very grateful for all the support provided by each of you
yeah so he is very happy and glad to have you in his house or any house or of any hiver in the state
because you are quite famous over here and you have helped us a lot in in many aspects in many
regards and he wants you to actually come to venezuela because specifically to sucre because that way you can see for yourself
and all the work we have been doing here and maybe you can spend some hvd around
if they accept hvd i will be bought
yeah i noticed i noticed you get the invitation dan and i don't
i don't get invited anywhere oh my god i invite you i personally invite you
you have to pay for your room hey don't be don't be ching
now now he's telling me it's my fault because i didn't translate that
guilty i'm guilty just no
i'm saying that i'm a i'm a bad translator
serious question for el mundo uh okay how many people are at the gathering that you're working
there and and trying to promote hive would you guess
el mundo cuántas personas están ahorita contigo del equipo promoviendo
ahorita en este momento estamos
ocho personas trabajando promoviendo
en estos momentos incluso nos faltan todavía por visitar dos negocios más para
y bueno estamos ocho pues ahorita perfecto uh right now uh there are eight people right now they are together
working they have two businesses left to visit so they can receive their merch their hive merch
and some capacitation regarding hive wallets
dan dan it's just the coolest thing we have a show we invite him on and it turns out coincidentally
he's out there from our hive on the streets of the boots on the ground actually if you check our
twitter account which is high sucre you can see that they are currently on the street doing the job
okay i i can't listen to dan i don't know if he's speaking
can you guys listen uh oh yeah oh yeah yeah
i'll just say and all of you are doing great work out there and yeah just randomly having him on
he's out there putting in the work so and i can't wait to see you guys i'm going to be there
they're going to be this year around hyphen um i'll get the exact date i'm bad with it we're definitely
going to be there matt not we are going to receive you gladly here with open arms my man i appreciate it
well john uh thank a mundo a mundo if you're still listening gracias for coming on uh we appreciate
what you do down there in sucre well down there from us uh up here in in north america we're happy with
with what you're doing and i'm very happy to keep supporting you have you on our show and and buying you
all lunch occasionally here and there dan got involved in the last one and and matt and uh you
guys had a great time and posted some wonderful pictures and it was money well spent so thanks for
thanks gracias gracias a ustedes por por prestarme el espacio para para poder conversar con ustedes en
este momento y de verdad muy contento de que estén felices con el trabajo que se está realizando acá en
cumana estado sucre con el proceso de cripto opción y todo lo que él enmarca en realidad porque esto es
más global aún de lo que se ve y nada pues mandarle un abrazo a tax a tax master de calmedan un abrazo fuerte fuerte
y decirle que los quiero muchísimo y estamos al al pendiente de todas las cosas que se vayan a realizar
saludos nice so he's very thankful for the opportunity of the of being on the show and he's very thankful for
everything you have done for the project for your support and he's he alongside the team are going to
keep working really really hard to establish our ground not only in sucre but in venezuela as well
very nice um make sure to follow these guys if you have it if you're a hiver they put a lot of good
work and they always have interesting stories to share and great insights so
i can't think of a better way to end the show dan can you i cannot wow it's already been
let me do gorilla math over two hours that flew by yeah but but just think it's about half of the
time matt will be speaking when he's on stage tonight it's true it's true follow matt's journeys if
you're not in um the other hivers out there in berlin do matt have a presentation tonight
i believe he either already has or he's going to have it's sometime in this time frame it's hard
nice i believe they are live streaming it oh okay yeah i need to watch that then yes
all right thanks you all for coming on and listening to task and i john neo
thank you forgive take care task any closing thoughts i think we summed it up and just stay
busy and think long term hive is going to do some great things excellent all right see everyone next
week ciao see ya thank you for being here bye bye