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Decentralized X-spaces w/ Tenacious_DeFi Host OPENMIC 🎤
Recorded: Aug. 24, 2025 Duration: 1:01:15Space Recording
Full Transcription
Welcome crypto night, let me know if you want to come up
Just do a microphone request
I'll get you up here I'm kind of sharing some posts please share the space if you
can I'll be back in a minute Thank you. welcome welcome I shared I think I shared the telegram up there and maybe the proposal if
you guys know how to share you could share stuff up on top and then I think there's a couple other
things that pinned below this one Theo said he'd be showing up, so hopefully it comes pretty soon.
I guess we'll see.
I'll see if I can get you up.
And plus, I'll check into the Telegram here, too.
I'll try to keep an eye on it.
And I don't think there's anything, right?
Cool.
Harmonats, let's see if I can get you up here. I don't think there's anything, right? Cool. Harmonauts.
Let's see if I can get you up here.
Again, if anybody wants to talk, just request a mic.
Let's see if I can get Harmonauts.
I sent you an invite.
If you guys can share the space, that'd be wonderful.
Again, we're hopefully waiting on DOB to show up, maybe some RMC that they come to.
If not, we'll talk about something else
Did you see the requests are not the other or did you not want to you don't have to come up, I guess.
I was kind of hoping that this would be recovery space.
It is what it is.
I don't know how to say your name.
Let me see if I can get you up here.
I know you said you maybe have a little bit hard time speaking English.
We can definitely try there, but I don't know.
Is it Mauricio?
I know you've been working on some, building some actual infrastructure, which is cool.
So if you wanted to talk about that, you definitely can.
And again, this is a recorded space, so people can listen at their leisure whenever they come.
Got spazzed out.
Let's see if he wants to come up.
I think last time you were a co-host of spazzed out.
So if we can get you up here,
we'll see if we can get you on as a co-host too.
And that worked out too,
because I think I did get the boot and then you saved the space.
Are you on?
What's up? Hey'm not there let me see if i can get you for a um for a co-hosting all right nice and my power went out last last night
just for a second but the internet's been good for a while okay hey hey braven what's up what's up
Hey Braven, what's up?
What's up?
All good.
Yeah, thanks for having me experiences.
Yeah, you bet.
Thanks for coming on.
Happy.
I think it might be a new ETH all time high happening now.
I'm not sure.
It's trying to push for 5000.
So that's kind of exciting.
Yeah, I just saw the post.
Yeah, keeping going for five.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's nice. It's weird. Yeah. Yeah, that's nice.
It's weird, you know, seeing, you see Bitcoin going down, but then another, you know, seeing
ETH and other coins kind of going up.
So hopefully the transformation is happening.
Yeah, some of what I saw, they were like, look like the alt season, BTH go high, then
ETH, then the next could be the alt coin.
Let's hope that it will repeat all right i mean that's that's the biggest part that's going to help uh recovery is uh one appreciation you
know and and trying to get our stuff organized and showing up to meetings is a good way to start
that's all right
sounds like uh how old are you how old are your kids everything
uh 7 11. all right i'll keep you busy oh and then uh yeah meta one said he might try to come
to he can't talk but we'll see you know everyone's everyone's busy that's why these spaces are kind of hard but um yeah i don't know i don't know i don't know i was
uh talk i was hoping that we'd talk about recovery and appreciate maricio come in kryptonite and
arm around stout spazzed out um we could talk about other stuff for sure um that's fine um
again if they show up i guess we can ah there's the other so let's see if we can get him up here because he's our featured guest here.
So one second.
I sent you an invite.
Again, I'll try to monitor the recovery telegram but no promises there if if people
actually join and start talking stuff but throw some black some flashy gif up or something maybe
theo what's up man are you working yeah i think so can you hear me man you sound fantastic welcome
Yeah, I think so. Can you hear me?
Man, you sound fantastic. Welcome.
Thank you. Yeah, getting all set up.
We had the Wi-Fi set up a few days ago, so getting settled in.
Oh, really? Oh, did you move?
Yeah, yeah.
Okay. California to Virginia.
Holy!
Yeah.
Yeah, that's not just across town.
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So still so still getting i mean there's like
i'm just like standing in an empty room right now but soon there'll be some furniture but we
still gotta wait on shipments but the way you got wi-fi wi-fi power maybe computer you're good
um all right since you're here we'll officialize this and uh kick this off sound good
perfect all right so this is very um
uh impromptu basically but i figured i'd write some stuff down all right so we got welcome to
decentralized x spaces i'm tenacious d5 today is August 24th. Nothing heard here should be considered financial advice. Like I said earlier, I'll try to keep an eye on the Recovery Telegram. I think the link is posted above so people can check that out. And I also think the CLD recovery proposal is up there. If not, it's below this X Spaces.
recovery proposals up there if not it's below this x basis today we'll be joined by the op so
he is from harmony core team for anybody that doesn't know that there was a few rmc that said
they'd come too so they can come or not come i i'm r i am rmc so rmc is here uh so we have that
RMC is here. So we have that. And RMC is the recovery multi-sig custodians.
It is right now I'm one of seven members and we are in charge of a five of seven multi-sig.
And we send approximately 110 million or 9 million per month,
110 million per year to the recovery partners.
That's basically my spiel.
I think I have a couple other topics maybe if we don't touch on them,
but at least we're time stamped.
Going like that.
Just listening, background, while working.
Okay.
So for anybody who doesn't know, hopefully I'm not botching your name,
Mauricio's been building some infrastructure already.
It's been kind of neat, seeing people care about recovery.
So for now, I'll pretty much try to be quiet for a little bit.
Theo has some things that he's brought from the Harmony team build, some recovery updates and voting infrastructure and maybe some other things.
It's been a long time since we've had like kind of an official recording.
So I appreciate you taking time to be here, Theo.
And the floor is yours.
Yeah, that was great.
Yeah, and Mauricio was saying about his English,
and we got to hook him up with one of those AI tools
that would just speak perfect English
and get him on his face.
But yeah, I think recently,
a lot of new people have set up different proposals.
And I think a lot of that comes from everything that
happened with R1 and different recaps that we don't necessarily have to go right into. I mean,
we can if there are questions, but I think the main focus that people are kind of realizing is
that the current structure of recovery is ongoing and there's like a long road ahead.
And it's like, okay, what do we do
if we kind of look at what we've done so far,
what works, what doesn't, how can we optimize this
and how can we actually improve it
to finish it within a year?
There's some big things at 50% recovery. There's marketing unlocks for different
listing exchanges. So that's not like any name in particular, but there is
it's affiliated with one of the big tier one exchanges that would unlock more marketing.
And that's a budget that we have access to, But again, we have to get to 50% recovery.
So there's an incentive, I think, on the protocol side
to advance and speed up recovery as well on token sides
and not necessarily token appreciation,
but just, I mean, we all know marketing helps, right?
Like you can have the best product, but if nobody knows about it, then normally it's going to use it. But then it gets
to where we are now, which is heavily dependent on one price is where the speed of recovery
kind of relates to. So right now people are hoping for better exchange rates. So what they need to do is hope for better one pricing.
So as one price appreciates, we can recover more funds and people are recovered at a higher rate.
But what happens is that people are waiting for that.
So recovery doesn't happen in the meantime.
Everyone's kind of holding out and waiting.
And it's this long waiting game that on both sides sides people don't really know what to do about it um so the alternative um and this ties in a little bit
with with um the the product that mauricio has has created um and is finalizing um but this is
flipping that on its script where you have the one allocation immediately. And then,
so recovery happens, recovery kind of speeds up, you get to the 50%, marketing gets unlocked,
and things start moving for Harmony as a whole. And then people can hold on to their one that
they get recovered. And if they hold on and appreci their one that they get recovered and if they hold on and
appreciates then they get recovered at a higher rate so it's it's kind of flipping the script of
rather than waiting on one appreciation to then get a different um recovery price it's having the
one immediately and then the user gets to choose whether they want to hold or not. So either way, it's all one dependent.
That doesn't change anything. But it's just the way that it works now
can't really accelerate recovery the way we need it. So there's different proposals,
different proposals going around. There's also different things for recovery partners,
since having one recovery partner makes no sense.
And it's definitely a security risk.
So we want to get at least two.
I know CLD and the U1 team, UtilityDAO, I think they're called.
I've both set up different partner proposals.
I think in the ideal sense, there would be no partners.
I think that we've found that in previous times that kind of what we want to do is maximize recovery.
So if we can go directly from the recovery multisig to vulnerable wallets,
then, I mean, they're going to get more
for the same amount of one. And then it's going to a centralized exchange to get the pegged assets
is like, I think it's like three unnecessary steps of accumulating extra tokens. And then you have
like almost 20% slippage when you get off of the centralized exchange. And then you go through
the bridge to get back into pegged assets on Harmony, which is just way too much. I think
people would rather be kind of recovered at a higher rate than go through all of that slippage. So with that, and I know this is a lot,
so bear with me a little bit,
and then we can open up questions
and then kind of break it up into different things
because I'm sure I won't cover everything
because that would be quite difficult.
But with that, of having just the RMC,
essentially what we can do is have a bit higher of a threshold that people can recover at.
And then they would be based in one or wrapped one.
So you would have, I think wrapped one would be with the contracts.
And Marisa has a good post on this and people in the Telegram or I think a talk forum can go more into it.
But with the recovery being directly in one, people wouldn't have to worry about the 10 to 20% slippage on going back from an exchange.
And the way that they would do it is just put their depegged assets directly into this kind of like vault and would receive direct one.
And then we would burn it, which leads to kind of the repeg and all of the removing all de-pegged assets that are on Harmony.
So that's kind of a quick overview, a recap of where we are now.
I can get into governance stuff as well.
I can touch more on recovery.
I can touch on certain numbers.
I can touch on what the marketing budget might look like.
But yeah, want to open it more to questions
that people might have.
So yeah, before we move on too much.
So Mauricio is building.
So why is he building it?
Why not somebody else?
Well, I think it's open to anybody.
And I think it's just a time that, again, like it's community driven and seeing like, oh, people are like, oh, wait a minute.
There should be a way for people to exchange kind
of if they want one directly and i know there's also one usdc uh but essentially a um middle
ground of contracts um between rmc um and then um like the the pre-hacked wallets that were affected
so essentially it would be it wouldn't necessarily like,
it's not Mauricio that's just the middleman
that's holding all the funds
and then allocating them.
What he's doing is with smart contracts.
So the essentially RMC or anybody can fund the contracts
and then anybody who is a pre-hacked wallet
can go and claim.
But I don't think it's
necessarily um that it's marisa that's doing it it's more that other people haven't necessarily
done it yet um or haven't just taken the time to do it like at the end of the day it's it's
taking time out of people's days and not everybody has the expertise to do it, but it's community driven. So it's not, it's not anything that was assigned. It's not anything
that's kind of paid positions. It's something that that's just, again, community driven
with somebody who has the knowledge of how to set something up to improve recovery.
I mean, like for instance, CLD put in a proposal
like several months ago and, you know, I don't know.
I just, it seems like we're kind of leapfrogging things.
So I mean, so is this something that other,
so if utility doubt, should they try to build a vault too and TLD builds a vault and then we vote on
that? Or, I mean, I thought, I guess my order of operations,
or I thought we had to kind of vote something in,
is this going to be like Carmi just says, okay, this is how it is.
And this is the mechanism we're going to use. And I just kind of,
I feel like we kind of got leapfrogged.
Yeah, that's a good point. And it's good concerns um i think it's it's more on on ongoing first with the development so in this case it
would be um that what mauricio has built or is almost completed building um is that there is a way for it. I think everything will be eventually a
governance proposal. I don't think we would start allocating all the funds to the vault,
the exchange vault immediately. And we would definitely want kind of validator and community
inputs. So it is, it's still, it could be that people vote on and they would rather have partners
and continue with how things are going or potentially an updated CLD proposal.
But in this case, it's kind of building before the proposal, which is fine and allows people i think um
better kind of insight into what they're voting on um where essentially it would be that that
mauricio has essentially front-loaded the um the product and has built and is is building the
contracts currently um and then people would vote on kind of,
if it were to be voted on today,
would be kind of the development wherever Mauricio is.
I think that the contracts are still being finalized,
but it would be kind of that option
versus continuing with how recovery is currently
versus potentially different adaptations of it.
But I don't think it's necessary with recovery moving forward that we would want too, too many partners.
At the end of the day, we want to maximize the pre-hacked wallets.
And if it is a vault, or potentially there are multiple vaults
that might be different and it gives
pre-hacked wallets options. I think that could be a good differentiation of rather than partners,
maybe it's vault partners or a new name or something around it. But again, at the end of
the day, we want to maximize pre-hacked wallets. I don't know if that answers directly.
Yeah. I mean, my idea would be that everybody could join, but then there could be perks or bonuses for the official pre-hack waltz.
And another concern that comes up, and I don't know how many people this affects, but people that provided liquidity, they weren't counted in these pre-hack waltz, according to some testimony on the recovery telegram.
Yeah, I just kind of feel like if,
and we're in a group together too,
and I understand like RMC has a conflict of interest,
but we can't, I've tried to step down for three months
and there's no way to get out.
So here CLD has been building for three years,
two or three years, holding the spaces.
And since I can't get out RMC, it's a conflict of interest
where if I could have dropped out two months ago,
we could have built something too.
And we weren't offering, we were offering to do it for free too
because we want to have recovery.
So we wouldn't be charging X amount of dollars per month.
It's all on chain.
It's all visible.
All the stuff that I've been crying about
that wasn't happening before. I'm not just saying like boohoo, you guys didn't do it. We wanted to
do it too. So I just want to put my two cents in that CLD could build the infrastructure as well.
Like I said, we have already stuff that's been tried and tested and true that's out there and
it could definitely be a vault or be a build. I mean I agree that just being able to potentially have RMC send the money to the
smart contract that's pretty efficient you know so any way we can get there with being efficient
on-chain and transparent fair you know I think those cover everything I think that's super important you know and empowering community that cover everything. I think that's super important, you know,
and empowering community that's been here, I think is important too, you know, of course,
I'm biased because, you know, I'm representing CLD, but I just don't want to, again, I just
don't want to get left out of the picture. Yeah, no, those are all great points. And I think that
the biggest kind of in the past few months has been a transition, I think, away from partners.
I think the conflict of interest was more on CLD becoming a partner.
But I think building these tools that we're going, if it is going to be smart contracts, I think that this space, I think, would really great to clear things up that it, it wouldn't be a conflict of interest. Um, and especially if we have multiple
sources of, um, uh, people providing volts or different, um, contracts at the end of the day,
if the contracts are open source and people can audit them, especially kind of internal team, but also validators who will be voting on this.
It's not a conflict of interest moving forward with that style of recovery.
Uh, now if it is going to be back to partners and people vote on partners, yeah.
Okay.
Obviously, because essentially you don't want to, um, have a situation where people just
pay themselves or, um, can, can manipulate the, I mean, that's all conflict of interest
stuff, but I think now what we're seeing as a potential accelerated recovery is going to be like one or wrapped one based claims
through smart contracts and only pre-hacked wallets.
But it could also be pre-hacked wallets until we unlock the marketing budget.
It could be pre-hacked wallets and we focus on recovery, but then we have the RMC or potentially eventually
like an emission DAO that then allocates recovery or a portion of it to like active LP wallets,
the LP users that were not included in this accelerated recovery, but still want to be recovered. Like the big, I guess, big picture
look for where this is going, where this is headed, is recovery completion, and then having
RMC, the funding that you mentioned, the 110 million one per year, being completely in community control.
So if there's any funding, if there's any applications, if there's any tooling, if there's any burning, the RMC, if voted on by community, could burn the 110 million won per year, which
would be a lot more than the previous tokenomics that had the transaction fee burns.
There's a lot of things like that that we're trying to push to open the doors more for community-driven things
where there are community-driven things, but there's not really the community-driven funding behind it to back it.
And that's where this transition is hopefully going towards.
Nice. I mean, that works. And I'm all for smart contracts, right? That takes the human
factor out because, you know, humans want to exploit stuff and humans do exploit stuff. So
if we can, that's kind of the beauty of
blockchain verifiability open open, you know open ledger sometimes open source
You know Take the human factor out. I'm all for it. That's cool. So I'll pass it on so we have somebody asking can you
Ask if we need to wait for a snapshot X platform to complete to start using the Vault platform. So that leads into a nice transition.
If you could and would want to talk about where the status is of the voting infrastructure,
I think.
And then I had another idea too, but if you can give us where we're at, where we've been,
estimated time of product, all that fun stuff. Thanks.
Yeah, great. Great transition. I always love when you host the spaces. So nice. But
I think... So the reason why I'm hesitant to answer quickly is because right now there is no governance structure.
So technically, no, we wouldn't need to go to governance if it was the better option and we wanted to speed up recovery.
I think also there's one partner right now.
there's one partner right now. So that's a vulnerability, which kind of following in the
HIP that was passed now that that HIP specifically for recovery, recovery has changed since that HIP.
So continuing exactly like that HIP says doesn't stand. But there's also like best ways to do things. So in this case, rather than kind of
the anarchy or just going with any proposals or validators or anybody kind of having a say,
it's more about we have a clean slate on governance and how can we do things.
There's been several HIPs through the years.
If you guys have been tracking the talk forums of like validator flags that want to opt in.
So it's only the stake weight.
For those that know how voting works, it's 66.67% of the network stake weight.
That is your quorum. And then 50% plus one vote is passing. So if you have those situations, then
potentially with large validators, it becomes very, very hard to reach quorum
and you can't get anything passed. and your chain essentially has no governance,
even though it has an established governance. So that's been something that people and validators
have wanted for years, but there's been no, I guess, technical match to get where that is.
And then we switched to snapshot, which snapshot allowed for governance to continue,
but again, without those flags.
And then now, because snapshot has kind of ceased support,
we've moved to snapshot X.
So snapshot X is our own internal kind of voting tool that we're still reliant on the tooling that
they have available.
But again, it's under our control and it's open source.
So it allows us to build and improve on as we go.
But it also means that things that were on-chain for Snapshot, I guess they weren't technically on chain for for snapshot online but for snapshot
x now we'll have some aspects of uh snapshot which is a bit confusing but um the gist of it is
snapshot that used to be off chain is now on chain uh which is nice. So that means on-chain governance for Harmony. But then a few unique
positions about Harmony's kind of quorum and validators that opt in and also validators that
have delegations. So a big thing that has been absent from Harmony voting is when a vote goes live on snapshot,
you are locked into whatever your validator voted for,
because the snapshot was taken at the beginning of the voting period.
So if you were a delegator and you delegated to a validator and you didn't want
something to pass, but your validator does and says, yes,
you're locked in. If you switch, your delegation won't track that. So what we've discussed and had validators talking about is that in this new form
of governance, it would be a combination or I guess a hybrid of on and off chain. So on chain
snapshot would happen in the beginning.
Same as usual.
Everyone's used to that.
But we do want to give that unique opportunity to those who delegate and want to have opinions
and want to essentially what this voting is supposed to create is that you vote with your
stake.
That's how it should be.
And that's how it's always been.
But in this case, people would have to be really attentive on talk forums.
And then they see an official vote go live and they're like, oh, shoot, like, I don't really stand by this, but I guess I'm stuck now.
So now it's now it's corrected and it would be hybrid.
So on chain, there's the original snapshot and we have an idea of what the stake weight will be and what certain things will be.
And then at the end of that voting period, there's the official off chain finalized stake weight and delegation voting.
So it allows people who are delegated to vote again with their stake while the vote is still live.
to vote again with their stake while the vote is still live.
And then once the vote is over,
again, still with that kind of two week span,
it would be finalized.
I think the other side of that question was ETAs
and when is this happening?
So it's, the on-chain part is built, that's all done.
And then making sure that we have the off-chain part is built. That's all done. And then making sure that we have the off-chain handling correct is still a bit tricky.
There's a little bit of language barriers, but there's also, I mean, it's a unique governance model.
So you can't really copy it from different chains.
So that will be on Tuesday.
Actually, no, that'll be tomorrow. What is it
today? Sunday? Yeah. So that's on Monday. And then hopefully that goes well and everything
lines up and we're all on the same page and people understand where the governance needs to go.
And then it's live on Tuesday. So in the case of waiting for voting on these proposals,
I think it could potentially happen as early on Tuesday, but I think it would be better
to continue the discussions to see exactly what we're voting on and what could potentially be
passed and what are the best options moving forward. Because if we vote on a vote model,
best options moving forward because if we vote on a vault model but then the governance model
and recovery don't vote on it then we voted it vault into existence but it's not going to be used
which we don't want to happen so there might be a little bit more communication from all parties
but again the main focus is accelerated recovery and getting governance back in action.
So I'll have more information on that probably end of day Monday or Tuesday.
Awesome, awesome, awesome updates.
One quick thing for sure.
Potentially after the voting infrastructure is live and working, maybe Elena or yourself or whoever, Stephen, the infrastructure. Like, like myself, like I don't,
so going after saying that statement and trying to understand for yourself and
hopefully for everyone else right now, or not right now,
but back the most recent voting infrastructure that was on harmony.
Basically you had to get behind your validator. So if you delegated one, you
wanted to make sure you were in line with your validator. If not, you could move your one.
That's gone now. So now, will the validators still have a voice or is the governance all
delegators and that people can use any other staked one for a voice? is the governance all delegators and that people you can use any
other staked one for a voice can you have one in your wallet for a voice can you kind of try to
dumb it down for for myself at least so like how the initial infrastructure will work how how you
use how how people that have one or staked one or any of that will be able to use the infrastructure to be able to vote.
Yeah, excellent clarification.
And it is confusing.
I think there's been three different stages of governance as we enter this one on Harmony.
So the most recent one that was established with Snapshot was completely off chain.
And then people were locked in.
Delegators were not able to change their votes as the vote was open.
And validators were the ones that voted.
So now what we have and what's coming out with Snapshot X is validators are still the one that vote.
They're the ones that kind of keep the network running.
And they're the ones that have the voting power, but their power is given to by delegators.
So delegators have the voice, they have the numbers, but before they used to be locked into their validators.
So how this would work is exactly in the normal staking dashboard. That's where your vote would have a certain say.
So if you go to Snapshot X, which will have a website and you'll go see a proposal and you
can go through the list and you see people that vote, you'll see a list of validators.
So validators that can vote don't necessarily have to be elected. It's just validators.
Validators in general are the ones that have access to it. And then people that delegate,
you can see on SnapchatX kind of your validator, what they voted on, whether they voted yes or no.
If you agree with it, great.
You don't have to change anything.
If you don't, you can see that list on Snapshot X and you can go to the staking dashboard and then you can change your delegation to a validator that you align with.
That's pretty cool.
Yeah, I like that.
Something I'm just totally throwing something
random because I was watching
a Chainlink video earlier.
Could Chainlink
be something that could
eventually be used for this
off-chain part of the
voting infrastructure? Do you know?
Is it
totally opposite things? Is that a thing that could happen? off-chain part of the voting infrastructure or do you know or is that like not even is it like
like totally totally opposite things or is that like a thing that could happen there um
the easy answer is yes and no but um like with the the option results and having Chainlink integration, like API endpoints for Harmony comes at a cost.
So currently, I don't think the Treasury would install it.
But again, this is like part of the reason of the big push for funding to essentially be a community Treasury.
for funding to essentially be a community treasury.
So the 110 million one that are allocated yearly.
So about, like you said, the 9 million per month
that could go towards an integration like that.
That can go towards different things.
And essentially what I would hope for is potentially even for me
and the resources that I have or the time that I'm doing things
is to also give connections to the community directly and have the community vote on certain
things of saying like, oh, here are options that we could possibly do. And it could be a situation
that the internal team doesn't want to spend on something today that
the community really, really wants. There could be a few of those instances. There could be no
instances. There could be a lot of instances like that. But with that community treasury,
hopefully we would eliminate them because then the community would have a direct say
not only on fund allocation, but on actually
using those funds. And I don't know, maybe one day I'd be hired by the community or something.
And then you have the community that's the ones that are having the funding attributed ecosystem
wide. Nice. And for people that may not know, like one of the last two or three HIP or Harmony
improvement votes was HIP 30 V2, which actually took 25% of the staking rewards and directed it
towards the recovery multisig custodians. So that's how this, so I mean, altogether,
the emissions from Harmony are like, you know, approximately 441 per year.
Recovery multi-sig custodians get 25% of that or 110-ish million won a year.
So it's pretty neat that the community actually voted this in.
So that's been a dilemma before too,
seeing things like DeBank and snapshot x and
maybe some other things it's like why couldn't the recovery multi-state custodians or that these
you know funds that are being supposed to be used for recovery be used to pay some of these bills
that you know whatever it is kind of like what theo was saying there um where maybe the team
wouldn't want to part of the recovery is having recovery is having stuff on chain that people want to come to Harmony One to use,
dApps and things of that nature, stuff that used to be there, people used to having that kind of stuff.
So I think that'd be awesome. And it's neat.
The people agreed on this before.
The infrastructure and guidance needs to be hammered in. And for people that don't
know, I mean, the RMC has been there almost two years. Some of the people on the initial RMC
didn't want to take a stance on anything because they figured the community would shit on them
either way. You know, if people didn't agree, then they get there. And I know this because I've been
in the weeds like this for every
for years um because he i take a stance i have to take a stance you know um but for people to be
able to uh if we can have rmc you know go take some of these votes if rmc wants to uh our rmc
wouldn't have to decide if we could have the voting, like, say there are two or three different ways, then the community could vote.
Like, what's the allocation? And then RMC is just there to sign the multisig, you know, and then deal with some of these other things, unforeseen things.
You know, we've had to overcome things that I don't have to go into now.
I mean, we had to, you know, the recovery multi-sig, seven people had to come together several times to change allocations, to not give allocations, to voice concerns and other things like that.
I mean, we're responsible for, to me, it's a lot of money, you know, so we want to be on the community side.
So being able to give a voice to the
community or back to the community will be awesome. And for people that may not know too, you know,
RMC and this recovery stuff that's happened in the last couple months has given a push for the
internal team to make this a priority, which I enjoy. I mean, we're trying to be decentralized.
So this name of the X basis fits in great, you know, as far as I'm concerned.
But we're being decentralized.
I think you have to have some kind of voting so we can all move together.
You know, we all have on-chain authority.
If you want to spend more
and be more invested in one, then you have
a larger voice, but at least it's there
and available for some of
the stuff like this instead of going and
chatting for multiple days
and not coming to anything.
You could put a proposal out,
it bombs, then you change it,
you tweak it, you get A, B, C, get abc one two three proposals but at least you're moving together and uh voting
on it and it's and it's all community driven it's not centralized so uh i appreciate the push from
the team whoever's listening i'm happy that the voting's a priority i'm happy that maybe Tuesday it could be live.
Yeah. But yeah, and I'm all in favor of any kind of communication. But I see there's a lot of people here. I appreciate every I appreciate everybody coming.
You could share the space. That'd be wonderful. If you want to come up, just do a request.
Request to Mike. I'll get you up here. We have Harman on Stow up here.
But anybody's welcome to come up. It's open mic.
But until then, did you have any other kind of stuff that you wanted to bring that we haven't covered yet?
I think a little bit tying into as like protocol things improve.
And again, daily updates are on the GitHub, like slash progress. If people are interested, they can go through kind of everybody and see certain things.
We don't put everything on there.
I do want to say that again, because some things are kind of still in development or
different things, but gives an overview of where we are.
gives an overview of where we are.
But I think just kind of tying in
like all of these,
all this kind of community development
and kind of encouragement
ties into that like era of sustainability.
And I don't know if anybody saw
like our quarterly videos or anything that kind of
Elena has been putting out on the videos, which are great.
She's doing a great job with those.
But a lot of people might ask like, okay, like where's the Harmony Treasury in this?
Why aren't we using those funds for recovery?
I'm trying to think of other things that I've seen and I've noted down.
1,000 Bitcoin from Kratos.
Yeah, 1,000 Bitcoin from Kratos. And even for me, even internally, I don't know exactly the extent
of the treasury, but I do know what
on what we're working on.
I do know what we're focused on.
And I've also been here for a few years now, so I know what's worked and what hasn't.
And then for those that don't know, I was part of the community for two years before
I joined.
So if we want to talk about like ViperSwap and Wagme and all this stuff, we definitely
can. But for me and the point that I want to get across is that previously we launched swap
and we launched lend and kind of started like this journey of DeFi primitives.
And the next one that was going to be was a perpetual exchange, which is code complete.
So the project is done.
We also launched the meme launchpad as well, Pump.1.
But again, a lot of these things, the liquidity was heavily subsidized by the Harmony Treasury.
by the Harmony treasury. So what that means is the kind of LP positions and the lending liquidity,
and then what would eventually become the perpetual exchange liquidity, which you do need a lot for
to have an effective perpetual exchange and get people incentivized and trading.
A lot of that came directly from the treasury. So essentially what you're having is a one way out
from the Treasury and then spending on expenses,
which in bull markets is fine, right?
You can spend pretty much as much as you want
and price keeps going up and everybody's happy,
but it's not really a sustainable model.
So again, with recovery, it's a similar thing
of using treasury funds to accelerate recovery,
kind of accelerates recovery,
but then doesn't really accelerate harmony, right?
A lot of the validators, a lot of the delegators,
the people that are holding one, a lot of those miss out.
So essentially you don't want a circumstance
where if you heavily incentivize recovery, the pre-hacked wallets are kind of prioritized and they're very happy, but the whole network suffers.
So how do you balance this?
Well, it's not really easy, but something that you can do is you can turn that treasury rather than a one-way street into a kind of recursive model, into a treasury
that earns yield. And if you have a treasury that's in Bitcoin, which we do, and then Bitcoin
and different stable coins, what you can establish is yield within the treasury. So now, instead of
just using treasury funds, you can use the treasury to earn yield, maybe on different platforms. If you've seen the past, I think two, three months, it's been an incredible deep dive into DeFi, DeFi use cases to effectively put in treasury liquidity into those DeFi tools, extract the yield, and then deploy the yield back
into Harmony. So now what that means is a sustainable yield that can fund the protocol,
it can fund employees, it can fund the community, it can fund recovery, it can fund, I don't know,
buying and burning or buybacks or kind of infinite possibilities, right? Rather than
something that just has a one-time spend and then that's it. So in terms of
the next primitives and next products or things like perpetual exchanges, those become, or even
swap and lend that we have currently,
those become much easier to incentivize and deploy capital for because it's recurring capital,
right? We would pull from the yield and not from the treasury that would just deplete it.
We would pull it from a surplus value. So that's, I guess I did want to, I wanted to make sure to
cover that as well, because a lot of the talk is more on ecosystem and wanting to empower the ecosystem, which
is great.
And which is where ideally that's where we head towards.
Because then it's not the community waiting on internal decisions like A or B, and then
everybody has to flow in that direction.
It would flip and have the community decide A or B,
and then internal jumps on that as well, or it's kind of global kind of governance decisions that
we've had in the past. But that's kind of the whole approach that has the ecosystem kind of
becoming self-sustaining through RMC, through this $110 million one,
and then treasury becoming more sustainable at a protocol level and not just the DAP level. So you
have essentially a treasury that's self-sustaining and earning yield. So it's your earning revenue
and you can allocate that revenue throughout the protocol.
Yeah, that's awesome. And I agree too. I mean, yeah, with anything, allocate that revenue throughout the protocol.
Yeah, that's awesome.
And I agree, too.
I mean, yeah, with anything, life and crypto, LPs, you got to have balance, you know. So I've seen some people like, why did Harmony quit funding the recovery, you know, whenever
Every RMC came along, but yeah, you have to have something for the people that are on the chain now, right?
RMC came along?
But yeah, you have to have something for the people that are on the chain now, right?
There has to be something for recovery to, you know, for something to be there, you know?
A DAX, some DAPs, builders.
You can't just throw all the money towards the people that were affected and then they all leave because there's nothing here for them to say.
You know what I mean?
You have to have a balance there, so completely completely agree with that uh yeah i don't know where else to go
here no one else is uh no one else has um requested to come up you got lots of familiar faces
dio's here we're here you know i usually do this for like an hour we're coming up on almost 10
minutes till uh but yeah appreciate appreciate you taking the time, Theo.
So for people who don't know, Theo's been coming on for years on and off.
It's been his time for the community, which I completely appreciate.
Communication and what's going on and having the GitHub information there.
Honestly, I should check that more often.
Maybe I get some more questions and be able to share there i guess but um that's why we keep we keep um coming here and
we keep trying to communicate and uh sharing what's going on but yeah appreciate you theo
i guess we'll kind of give another one more chance for people to potentially come up um
i appreciate the the clarity um that you know we could maybe put out some infrastructure and see how the community likes that too.
We just didn't know how to do it, right?
We didn't want to spend our time and then not be able to implement it because there's a conflict of interest.
So if we can potentially build it and start getting ideas like Mauricio's done as well. Maybe that's definitely a possibility as well.
So that's super awesome.
I'm glad we waited to do the space.
We have more people on there.
And now we're closer to potentially having a voting infrastructure.
So that's fantastic.
So hopefully we can learn more about that
and maybe, I don't know, do a test proposal or something
just to kind of see maybe that would work for people to kind of visualize some of how this works
potentially. Let's do something kind of fun. We've got somebody in here. Just try to implement
your idea and put it to vote. Yeah. I've tried to, so we have implement, we have a whole proposal
that's pinned in here,
but we didn't know, right?
We didn't know if we needed to wait for that to pass
to be able to do anything
or if we should just build it or whatever.
So now we know, no one helps.
We got the request here.
Let's see these ones come up.
I'm coming to find you meta one class.
Look at this.
Cool.
That's better because
uh he's a builder he is he built crypto in
you on your brother one
so had some connection issues I listened to the space, but I couldn't request
Yeah, awesome.
because I didn't have a microphone.
So yeah, just dropped by to say hello,
and thank you for all the support you guys have shown.
JOHN MUELLER
Glad you could come on. So I don't know if yes you heard the space we can talk later
too so all right we can um we can go ahead and i guess wrap it up here uh
sounds good again again completely appreciate you coming on theo i didn't i kind of had some
stuff written down i could look real quick to make sure I got all that. I think we got
everything and more basically. And I guess for people that don't know too, I guess we're pretty
close to 32, 33% recovery, I think. And Theo was saying that a lot of stuff could potentially change
at 50%. So depending on price in appreciation,
50% could potentially come quick, you know,
and I think that's something that Harmony One infrastructure kind of, including myself, right.
I wasn't involved last time. I was just coming on, on board last time,
but I think whenever the bull market came and it happened so fast and like
people was saying, money was flying from everywhere. it got taken for granted you know and people weren't
ready for it so i mean if this i'm not gonna put numbers out there but it could just come quicker
you know this 30 took you know two or three years to get you know took over two years to get here
um but things you know things move fast in crypto so um it's happy I'm happy now we have the voting infrastructure coming.
I'm happy we have builders.
Happy we still have Harmony One community.
I'm happy everybody's on here.
We'll give it to MetaOne and potentially close her out here.
Go ahead, MetaOne.
No, yeah.
Just there were some questions I could answer now if you or otherwise, yeah, you can just, we can take this offline.
Just a question for you and for anyone that if there were some clarification that were needed about the technical side of the proposal.
if there were some clarification that were needed about the technical side of the proposal.
So something that Theo said today was that CryptolandDao could start building the infrastructure.
And if CryptolandDao just built the smart contract that RMC was just able to potentially fund, you know, depending
potentially on the community opinion and votes, then it wouldn't be a conflict of interest.
So what would be a conflict of interest is if we wanted to potentially become a recovery
partner. But if we just came as a community team that built infrastructure
and the community liked using it, then that could potentially be okay.
So I wanted to let you know about that.
But, yeah, we can definitely talk more offline about that.
But, I mean, it's recorded space.
Anybody can come.
I like being accountable.
Theo's accountable.
We're all here, and I appreciate everybody's input but I will throw it unless are you good
metal on there yes yes hundred percent cool yeah we have potentially the
capabilities to build smart contracts and we'll see how what is the effort and we'll evaluate that so thank you
awesome um again i want to thank theo for coming um always welcome we do this every sunday we do
like kind of this um anything goes d5 on three or four sundays depending on how many sundays
there are and then like the third sunday we do like the official Cryptoland out update.
I usually try to keep it pinned to my account like a day or so before so people can find it easily.
There's events in the Cryptoland Discord.
We also have Tuesday screen sharing.
Screen sharing, the time will have to be different this week because of personal stuff.
The time will have to be different this week because of personal stuff.
But we're available to try to, for anybody who wants to visually learn something,
I think it's been proven that most people learn better by visual aid.
So if people want to learn more, we have a channel that people can put their questions in there.
Or they can try to get topics on for Sundays, whether it's the making coin or the decentralized spaces.
Yeah, I'll throw it over to Theo and you can close us out.
I appreciate you coming.
Thanks for answering all our questions and then Tom.
Yeah, massive.
I really appreciate you hosting this.
For everybody that was tenacious DeFi from the CLD account.
But same thing for me of just appreciation for everybody that's here
and everybody that's kind of been here through the years
and pushing through and continues to show face and show effort.
I always say that the community is the biggest asset for Harmony. It stays that
still to this day. And yeah, better things to come, hoping governance gets all settled.
And I'm hoping there's no issues, but we never know, right? This is kind of more of an earlier
production build, but we can iterate quickly. So I would rather get it out in the hands of the community
and then have people kind of playing around with it
rather than us trying to perfect it behind closed doors.
And then a year from now, we still haven't released it.
So hoping to get that out.
We'll talk with Yuri, who's working on that tomorrow,
clear things up, and then should have an update shortly.
Awesome. Yeah, that's one thing I've learned in DeFi is nothing's real, nothing's certain until
you're like verifying it with your own wallet, you know, then you know it's real, you know, so
yeah, and I think that might also be a good use case as well.
Just it could be an on-chain, not just demonstration, but just a test.
So maybe we can aim towards that, just having just a test run, test proposal, make up something fun to vote on and go from there.
I appreciate everybody.
Again, we'll be on next Sunday.
Open topics.
Bring your own topics if you want.
We're open, Mike. Appreciate having Theo if you want to be a special guest reach out so appreciate you guys
talk to you later happy weekend yep thank you all bye Thank you.
