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Fastest Native BTC Cross-Network Trades - Now on radFi Powered by SODAX
Recorded: March 20, 2026 Duration: 0:33:48Space Recording
Full Transcription
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Music Music Music Music Music Music Music Music Music Music good morning
scott david Good morning, good morning.
What's up, what's up?
Hello, hello.
How's everything going, David? Long time, no talk.
Long time, indeed. Our faces are all over YouTube. Can you hear me well?
I can. What about vice versa?
Yeah, that's all good. Get Sodax to be the co-host. Invite Sodax to be the co-host.
Invite Sodax to be the co-host.
Perfect.
Perfect.
There we go.
All right.
So we're trying to get John on as well.
So John's in.
We'll have him speak with us.
I see him just as a listener.
How do I bring him up?
Invite to speak.
There we go. how we doing john having some technical difficulties john having all the technical difficulties in the world i'm looking at john now. He is looking like a panicked man.
He fell ill earlier. He's falling ill again as we speak. So I think we should just get going and see
who hops on, who doesn't. Yeah, I know. Hey, thanks for jumping on this space, Scott.
Yeah, yeah. Right back at you.
Yeah, yeah. Right back at you.
So you and I, we spoke about the RadFi integration with Sodax.
It's a pretty special one because it benefits both of us both ways
with the big orange Bitcoin logo plastered all over the middle of it.
I think for people who haven't come across us yet,
a small introduction is in place.
I guess I'll kick it off.
My name's David.
I lead the marketing at Sodax.
And yeah, we try and get every builder to consider building with Sodax because we enable
cross-network transactions, logic, reasoning, access to any app in Web3 out there.
And there's a future where I see Web2 and potentially even Web1 integrating SodaX.
So that's it on my end.
Scott, if you can do a small introduction.
Sure, yeah, of course.
So some people know that I actually used to work with you guys, you know, so we go way
back.
So my background, I've been in
the space since 2018, started working with Icon, which is now Sodax. That's where I started my
blockchain career. And before that, I was in traditional finance. And yeah, after leaving
the Icon slash Sodax team, I, you know, kind of started thinking, how can I build products around Bitcoin? One of the,
obviously the, you know, crypto that has the most staying power. It's kind of the foundation of our
entire industry. It's, you know, something I know will be here for many cycles to come. And, you
know, that's why I wanted to start building products around it. And now we have RadFi, the fastest and best user experience around trading on Bitcoin layer one.
And we have Bound, the BUSD stablecoin as well, which will become more and more prominent as we make progress together here.
Right. So yeah, multiple products on and around
Bitcoin or the Bitcoin ecosystem, is it? Yeah, that's right.
So today we're talking about RadFi in particular. For people who haven't come across it yet,
could you give us the short version? What is RadFi? Who is it for? And what is it kind of solving for users on the Bitcoin mainnet?
Yes, it's in short, the best place to trade Bitcoin and Bitcoin tokens.
So we built RADFI around the Runes protocol, which was launched back in April of 2024,
around the last having,
or on the last having actually.
And yeah, we built the trading infrastructure needed to support
the DeFi experience that users would expect,
but directly on Bitcoin Layer 1.
I think if you give RadFi a try, you'll be pretty surprised
that there's no technology other than Bitcoin underlying all of this.
Yeah, because it's built on,
it's Casey Rodemore's Lightpools concept, right?
Like I've read that a couple of times
and I have no idea what that means.
I could Google it and get a wild explanation.
I want to hear it from you.
Sure, yeah.
I mean, the concept we drew from Lightpools
was basically like the problem
with trading runes at its core was that both parties that are engaging in the trade need to be online at the same time.
And in order to give like a smoother trading experience, right?
Like trading how much you want, when you want.
Both parties need to be online to agree to the terms. So we see ourselves as essentially a light pool operator
where we are always online with a quote in the market.
And that's the role that we play.
So yeah, that's how we address the problem of both parties being online at the same time.
And then before the SodaX integration,
what did the experience look like for BTC holders on RadFi?
And what has changed now that you've integrated with Sodax?
Yeah, I think the key thing is giving access to outside opportunities, right?
Like before Sodax integration, the only thing you could trade on RadFi was Bitcoin against Bitcoin meme coins.
Yeah, meme coins deployed on Bitcoin.
And, you know, obviously taking a look around at the market,
meme coins are not, you know, it's not meme coin season right now.
I don't think anyone would really argue with that.
If you are arguing with that, I think you need to take a long, hard look in the mirror.
But yeah, so it's not meme coin season.
And, you know, we need to expand our product offerings.
So there's more to do on RadFi, more reasons to stay home on Bitcoin.
And now with the SodaX integration and the work that we're still doing together, there's a lot more opportunities, right?
Now you can trade ETH, Solana, and USDC. And we're going to be, over the coming weeks, just layering in more lot more opportunities. Now you can trade ETH, Solana, and USDC and we're
going to be over the coming weeks just layering in more and more opportunities
using the Sodax SDK and building a lot of unique products around it.
Alright. Do you think there's anyone in the audience who would actually want to
come in and argue that it is still meme season. If so, give a little thumbs up.
I tend to agree with you, Scott, that it is not.
However, it is terribly convenient to be able to trade in and out of Bitcoin natively from
other assets on other networks like Ethereum, ETH on Ethereum and Sol on Solana.
Looking ahead, I guess there's mention of Rune trading
potentially extending beyond Bitcoin mainnet
through this same execution system?
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, basically, now that we've contributed to the Sodax SDK and RadFi is basically like, you know, as far as your SDK isTH into RAD tokens. For example, one of the meme coins on our platform
just directly from ETH in your ETH wallet
to RAD tokens in your Bitcoin wallet in a single signature.
Now that we've added native Bitcoin to your SDK.
Yeah, cool, cool, cool.
And right now, what does it look like for users hitting up RadFi?
Like what has changed compared to, let's say, two weeks ago?
You mentioned Ethereum, Solana, and USDC, I believe.
Is the interface, I guess, has it been updated?
Yeah, yeah. So now you have the opportunity to connect an EVM and or Solana wallet.
So you can get, yeah, that's, yeah.
So now basically you have that cross chain experience
that you didn't have before.
And this is really just the first iteration
of what we're doing.
We want to get the product out there, troubleshoot,
you know, catch any bugs with our early users.
And there's, you know, a lot more changes coming
both to the interface and the product offerings
that we're working on together here.
Mm-hmm. I would really consider this like an MVP where we're at right now.
How does the coordination work between RadFi's native Bitcoin execution and then the Sodak's solver component,
which is actually helping with the cross-network part of it.
Yeah, I mean, from our perspective, the solver is basically just another trader on RadFi,
using a RadFi trading wallet. So it has the instant settlement trust assumptions that RadFi has developed. It's just another trader, and that trader happens to be making markets
between different networks. Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah. So from our perspective, it's very much just like any other trader.
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
We don't mind that.
You said that, well, look, in the announcement, you said that this is not just an incremental
improvement, this integration.
You mentioned it's a new primitive.
And I guess that's a strong claim, but I'm sure that you can back that up.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, by far the fastest way to get in and out of native Bitcoin. And I do view that
as a new primitive. I mean, using the trading wallet infrastructure that we've developed,
we can do a lot more cool stuff, right? It started with just trading meme coins. Now it's trading a handful of cross network assets. And, you know, and then I
think what I'm really excited about that's coming next, or not necessarily next, but one of the
things in the pipeline I'm excited about is just the low slippage trading of Bitcoin against BUSD or stablecoin on Bitcoin mainnet, being able to provide,
yeah, basically high volume, high liquidity, low slippage trades directly on Bitcoin mainnet,
directly from your Bitcoin wallet is something that, you know, this hasn't been possible without
some kind of trust assumption in the past. And right now it's possible between Bitcoin and USDC in the RAV5 platform, right?
Like there's a way for Bitcoin holders to kind of directly access…
Yeah, that's right.
That's right.
…the stablecoin.
Yep, yep.
But one of the differences that I would highlight between doing it directly on mainnet versus using the cross
network swap is there is still the cross network settlement kind of trust assumptions that come
into play. While when we do the Bitcoin against BUSD swap directly on mainnet, like a Bitcoin
signer, someone who has, you know, like when they're signing the transaction, they can literally
see like in what they're signing,
I'm giving one Bitcoin to the Sodaq solver and I'm receiving, you know, what's the price of Bitcoin today?
Like 70,000 BUSD.
And they can confirm that agreement rather than just like initiating the transfer and then receiving the ETH on the other side.
It's like you could see it all in one atomic transaction, which is something I'm really excited about.
You said this is something that... That's in the pipeline, yeah. We've developed that, but we're still working together on integration on the solver side. Is there any
more alpha that you can give us around that? Is it going to be ready next week? That I don't think so. Next week, in terms of alpha,
our pipeline of token listings that I'm excited about,
we're definitely looking into hype.
That's my second favorite coin outside of Bitcoin.
So bringing hype onto the platform,
making it easy to go from native hype to native BTC
and vice versa.
Why is hype your favorite token outside of Bitcoin?
Well, I mean, not to start turning this into a hype shill session,
but the progress they're making is being like just breaking outside of the cryptosphere.
I mean, on Hyperliquid, out of their top 10 traded pairs,
I think only three of them crypto sphere. I mean, like on Hyperliquid, like their top out of their top 10 traded pairs, I think only three of them are crypto and they're really kind of expanding the pie, if you will.
Like what our ecosystem just as what our industry is always needed really is like
being able to bring some outside value and into our ecosystem. Now, when people trade oil like
that, some of those fees are kind of working their way
indirectly through Hyperliquid into the hands of hype holders, which are crypto users. And that
creates a wealth effect for that entire sector and can trickle through to every other asset.
So basically, if we get traditional finance involved, that's a net win for everybody.
Right.
Yeah.
That's interesting.
That's kind of, Fez was saying something similar.
Fez is the resident hype field.
Sorry?
He said the resident hype field at Soda.
No, no, no, no.
He was actually talking to the high yield treasury bills and how he likes the
fact that when you have fractionalized or tokenized treasury bills, the actual yields
coming into crypto are yields that come from outside crypto.
Yeah, exactly.
It solves the hour-brew problems that Vitalik always talks about, know, it's just a snake eating its own tail in crypto.
And to some extent, like we're borrowing against crypto coins to buy more crypto coins and all the yield and everything is fueled by demand for further and further out risk, risky coins.
this stage of the industry, we're really bringing outside value on chain and that trickles into,
you know, people who are interested in investing in coins. So I think, yeah, I mean, we're really
seeing like, this is the kind of stuff I dreamt about when I left Deutsche Bank and came to work
at Icon that I thought was imminently possible back in 2017. I was like, wow, my job is going
to be obsolete in two years. I need to get into crypto and here we are eight years later.
But, you know, I'll take progress.
You know, I'll take it.
Yeah, because when it's done right,
this stuff can be done better on blockchain rails.
And, you know, especially finance and DeFi
has proven to be the number one, I guess, product market fit for apps
and products on blockchain reels.
Right now, it took eight years to figure that out.
But I guess at Sodax, look, we've integrated HyperEVM and we make that available to all
our builders across all the networks that we're connected on.
And I guess that's not just because we like their logo.
It's a good, interesting project.
And now it's going to be your next asset
that you're going to try and pull in alongside Solana, USDC,
and ETH in your trading environment, if I can summarize that.
Yep, yep.
And then we do want to layer in,
we had a user request, Solana-based USDC,
because that's kind of their home chain outside of Bitcoin.
So, you know, we're taking this one step at a time,
one user at a time,
and trying to, you know, build products that people want.
And I think after that,
we've been hearing from our Chinese community
an interest in BNB as well.
So those are what we're looking at, layering in over the coming weeks. After that, we've been hearing from our Chinese community an interest in BNB as well.
So those are what we're looking at layering in over the coming weeks.
Cool.
Okay.
So, yeah, I guess users can keep an eye on the RadFi channels to see those updates coming in. And I guess, yeah, seeing the incremental updates to new available token trading pairs,
they can already go to RadFi right now and test out connecting the different wallets
and swapping in and out of Bitcoin if there's any appetite for that today.
I guess for builders watching or listening, Radfi integrated the Sodax SDK in a bit more of a, and we talked about this on the YouTube podcast that we did last week.
So that's online as well for anyone who is feeling that they want to hear more. But the way that RadFi integrated Sodax,
it's very much so a mutually beneficial integration.
Sodax is very happy to be able to provide native Bitcoin to all its partners within the Sodax SDK.
And we can only do that thanks to RadFi.
So I asked you on the YouTube podcast,
and I'll ask you here again, what does it mean, I guess, for RadFi to be the prime,
you know, native Bitcoin partner to Sodax? Yeah, I mean, it means a lot. Like,
I think this was like a really important proof of concept of RadFi's trading wallet technology to literally be able to come in
with a partner like you guys and just undercut the competition in speed by 10 times, right?
Like you take a look at, you know, and I would encourage anyone listening to this to go and
find me a faster cross-chain swap between, you know, starting with Bitcoin as the origination asset and then landing somewhere else
and have that other asset in less than 10 minutes,
you're not going to find it.
No one else has taken this approach.
And the value for us is continuing to grow
the amount of people who have RadFi trading wallets.
So this kind of becomes the standard
of Bitcoin on-chain trading.
And I think what we've achieved together proves that this is a better solution.
And it'll help us grow from here.
Very cool.
Okay, so I guess we get towards the end of our catch-up.
This is, we're pretty much to the point and in sync
because, like I just mentioned, we spoke to each other
for a little under an hour past week.
That is on YouTube.
Those episodes are being shared on Radfight channels
and on Sodex channels.
So if you're listening in right now
and you haven't followed them on either YouTube or X,
please do so.
Do you think we should ask the audience
if there's any questions
or if anyone wants to hop on
and talk to their RatFi experience
or their Sodak's experience?
Scott?
Sure, yeah.
I mean, anyone, feel free to come up. I'll, uh, anyone feel free to, to come up, um, you know,
I'll be on discord as well. If you have any questions,
feel free to shoot me a DM as well. Um, yeah,
I can give it, give it a couple of minutes, uh, before we wind things down.
Um, but yeah, definitely excited about what we got coming between the new asset
listings, um, better user experience that we're working on, and the future product offerings we'll work on together.
We got a lot in the pipeline here that's going to be, you know, we're working on a lot of firsts together.
So I'm excited about that.
excited about that. We are, we are. And you are with the, you know, the like on Bitcoin mainnet
We are, we are.
trade or swap from stable to Bitcoin, your BUSD to Bitcoin that you're working on. I think
while people listening in, if you just, if you hit us with an emoji, like we can pull you up
to the stage if you want to ask a question. otherwise i just maybe you could talk a bit to that scott a bit more about
how you would allow users to deleverage from their bitcoin exposure into stable without ever leaving
the bitcoin network without you know relying on third-party um risk party risk or being exposed to third party risk.
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, basically, we're working on peer to peer financial products on Bitcoin and trying
to bootstrap that.
And I think that casts a pretty broad net.
I don't want to give too much detail on what we have coming in the pipeline, but I can
say we've already mocked up
some proof of concepts of additional financial products, not just swaps. But the next thing
that's going to hit mainnet in terms of peer-to-peer financial products is definitely going to be that,
you know, being able to stable up directly from your Bitcoin wallet by trading against
the SodaX solver. And the solver can kind of go and rebalance its books
after settling the atomic swap with the user directly on Bitcoin.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think we had someone who wanted to come up here.
I think it was Anton.
I invited him up, but it looks like I had a little technical difficulty there.
Cool.
Let me go and check if we can get Anton up.
Anton is the architect at Sodax, the chief cross-network brain,
who, when he speaks, he says very intelligent stuff and usually I can't lose the plot very fast
and I'm not if he wants to come up after this introduction he's very welcome to otherwise
all right okay well look what we'll do is, yeah.
You know what?
Maybe for everyone that's safer unless you're like, you know,
in absolute pure listening and understanding mode.
Yeah, it's time's lost.
So expertise-wise, look, tell me this before we hop off.
These Bitcoin cycles, they've historically been like four years, you know, with the bull market and the bear market.
And it's programmed, bro.
So I was just wondering, seeing as you guys are absolutely building on Bitcoin, one of the hardest things to do, viewing that market every day. Do you have any, I guess, tips, tricks or insights for us normies
of what's going on in the Bitcoin world?
Yeah, I mean, basically, I think that, you know,
I'm always going back and forth.
And if I'm a four-year cycle guy, I can tell you that it didn't work
on the upside this time.
There was no massive parabolic run like there was in the previous
cycles. I mean, there was, but not nearly as intense. And I think we'll see it similarly
on the downside, like just a much less intense bear market that we're going through right now,
fingers crossed, knock on wood. But, you know, from a builder's perspective,
to kind of more answer your question, I think trying to find products that are less
seasonal and less dependent on bull and bear market cycles is always ideal. And I think,
you know, that's kind of the direction that we're trying to head as a product as well.
Yeah. Yeah, I agree with the level of intensity being off this time around.
And I'm very curious to see where that goes.
But in the meanwhile, we keep building our solid infra
and we keep growing with it.
I think I want to thank you.
And I think I want to urge any listeners
who want to build with intents across networks to check out sodax.com or the
docs at docs.sodax.com. Or if you're not interested, but your AI is, please check out
builders.sodax.com and your AI will gobble up our MCP server and build your cross-network app for you. Go try out radfi.co to do your swaps in and out of Bitcoin,
Solana, Ethereum, and USDC on Ethereum.
And with that, yeah, we come to the end of these spaces.
So, Scott, I'll give you the last word and then we'll wave bye-bye.
Sure, yeah, sounds good.
Yeah, make sure to follow RadFi, follow me.
And, you know, we're going to be coming out with more and more announcements of new assets listed and trying to bring the entire crypto ecosystem back home to Bitcoin.
So stay tuned.
And, yeah, thanks for your time, David.
Appreciate it.
You too.
You too.
Thanks.
Bye.
