We'll be joining in, or we'll be getting started in just a few moments, everyone.
We had some technical difficulties to get things started.
Lana, looks like we've got you up here already.
Let's just do a quick mic check on you, please, if you don't mind.
Yes, I can hear you loud and clear.
Let's get Max up here and Vassal.
Let's send you a request as well.
Vassal invited you to speak, Vassal.
And then we've also sent Gateway a co-host invite, if they could approve that as well.
Let's do a quick mic check on you too, please, sir.
Yeah, I hope you can hear me as well.
Just one more moment and we will get started very shortly.
We're going to talk about Gateway, Haast, Wirex.
How are they supporting the ag layer?
How are they leveraging Polygon CDK technology?
It's a pretty exciting one if you're interested in the growth and progress of ag layer.
So sit back, relax, and we'll get started in about 30 seconds or so.
Okay, looks like we got Wirex up here as the speaker as well.
Or I accepted Wirex as a speaker.
And Gateway sent you a request as well to be speaker.
And do we have anyone on the Gateway handle by chance?
No, I think it's going to be only me who will be speaking.
Okay, just double checking there.
And Wirex, have anyone on the Wirex handle who will be speaking?
Can you hear me all right?
We can hear you just fine.
So let's go ahead and get started.
Thank you, everyone, for joining this very special Twitter Spaces.
This is going to be CDK and ag layer focused.
So I think without further ado, I think we should just go ahead and get started with some introductions.
We'll go around the horn as I see it on my side.
So, Lana, if you could just give us a little bit of a brief introduction about yourself and your background and, yeah, what your role is as well.
I'm Lana, the chief marketing officer and host network.
And our project focuses on developing an EVM-competible layer to blockchain power by ZKRLabs.
And we are incorporating egg layer as one of the key components.
And I'm super excited to be here today to discuss our innovative solutions and how we all aim to improve the defile escape.
And so looking forward for the great conversation, guys.
So I'm Georgi from Wirex.
I'm a co-founder and head of partnerships dealing with business development and all the external partnerships that we have.
Been there since the very beginning.
Prior to that, my career was neither in finance nor in IT nor in blockchain.
It was actually in aviation.
And it's quite an interesting analogy because the only common term between the two industries is, interestingly, airdrop.
Because there, my last project before leaving the industry was launching flights in Antarctica where we would literally airdrop cargo off the ramp of the aircraft from the air.
So you couldn't complain about fair or unfair airdrop because you just got supplies to survive.
And now we're talking crypto airdrops.
Enjoying every moment of it.
I got kicked off of being co-host there for a second.
So thanks for moving on without me there.
Let's kick it over to Max.
I'm a product manager in House Labs and currently working on House Wallet.
So my background, I got a few inventions from real world, not from blockchain, kind of.
I was building some Web2 sites mostly, solutions.
And now I'm in Web3 world in DeFi and working on House.
Thanks for that background, Max.
And Vasil, am I saying that right?
You're asking me all the time.
You know, like I used to this kind of stuff.
Every time I'm traveling to France, like I'm always Marcel.
You know, like, okay, let's call you the city name.
I'm, yeah, I'm head in the business development partnership in Gateway.
And just a couple of words about Gateway.
So I guess, like, if you're, like, familiar with Polygon, you're familiar with us and the work that we are doing.
So Gateway is the team behind the development of Aragon Client for CDK that is meant to improve the throughput of the network by 10 times in the same time improving the hardware requirements.
We have Presto platform that allows everyone to deploy ZKVM rollup.
You do, like, a couple of clicks.
It's super user-friendly.
And then, like, 10 minutes after, you have your own Polygon CDK rollup with the Bridge Block Explorer with some basic analytics with integration to MetaMask, right?
So you can just, like, click there, change your name, and so on.
So, yeah, that's pretty much it.
Yeah, also super bullish on ZK Tech on the ag layer and use this technology on a daily basis.
And Virex and House Network, they're both our partners.
And, yeah, super excited to be here.
Yeah, and let's kind of dig into, let's start with Gateway because I feel like Gateway is kind of the foundation here.
So this deployment, these deployments that projects can make with Polygon CDK through Gateway, like, how does Gateway utilize the Polygon, like, Polygon CDK to deploy Layer 2 solutions?
Like, can you walk us through the process?
And, like, I think it'd also be interesting to know, like, you know, how did you get connected with Virex and Haast?
Yeah, that's actually quite a great question.
So, you know, like, I like to think, like, in analogies, right?
And, you know, we use Polygon CDK technology to power our rollups and power the press platform, right?
So just, like, think about, like, a Polygon as an engine, right?
So we make a car and Polygon is an engine, right?
So, and, like, this engine is, like, a key component of any rollup, right?
So you have, like, weak engine.
You cannot, yeah, you cannot use the car or so on.
So, yeah, like, 90%, 90%, I would say even, like, 95% of our chains that are based on Polygon CDK technology.
And as of now, we have more than 2,000 chains deployed through Preston, right?
So, of course, like, majority of them, there are, like, some devnets, rollups, some, like, people just experimenting, like, just playing around because it's so simple to deploy.
But nevertheless, like, majority of them, they're built on CDK.
And those devnets, they're not connected to egg layer, right?
So you need, like, if you want to have a connection to the egg layer, it's, like, a separate process, right, that you have to go through.
You have to run the prover and so on.
So it's a little bit more complicated.
But the idea of simplicity to make everything, yeah, smooth, easy, you know, like, I've tested this platform with my mom, and she could deploy ZKVM rollup.
So I think it's quite an interesting indication.
So, yeah, in terms of the process, it's super easy.
You go to the website, you press, like, deploy, deploy rollup.
Then if you're just, like, a regular user like me, right, you just go with, like, a standard default settings.
If you're a developer, there is a kind of special section for you where you can do the customization, right?
And there are, like, a lot of things that you can customize there, right?
So you can go, like, a totally bananas.
You can change data centers, like, settlement layers, like, yeah, like a gas fee.
You can make your own gas token.
You can do the token distribution.
You can make it kind of gasless for some specific whitelisted users or so on.
And, yeah, and then after all of this customization, you just press deploy and wait, right?
So it usually takes around, like, 10 minutes.
And the longest time that we need is actually to wait for Ethereum network to deploy, like, a smart contract, right?
So we could have done it faster.
But, yeah, we have the bottleneck, which is Ethereum.
But I think it's already good enough.
And so you're talking about, like, that customization and flexibility.
And I'm going to ask this specific to the Haast and Wirex team as well.
But, you know, just kind of in your words, Vasil, like, what kind of customization options does Polygon CDK offer through Gateway?
And how does that cater to the specific needs of projects like Haast and Wirex?
So there are, like, 35 different customization options.
Like, probably more if you just, like, combine them together.
But I would say, like, the most popular one and the one that we use for Wirex and for Haast was, for example, settlement layer, right?
Where you submit your ZK proofs.
So you can go with, like, Ethereum or theoretically you can do any EDM-compatible blockchain.
For example, like, multiple data centers, right?
So Polygon Stack allows you to deploy the network in, like, multiple data centers at the same time.
So, for example, you can have, like, multiple provers, multiple sequencers, like RPC infrastructure.
So you can make it, like, extremely redundant.
And that was, like, one of the requirements from Wirex's team, right?
So for them, security and redundancy was, like, number one issue, right?
So the setup for Wirex was built, like, I believe, like, two different, like, or even more, like, data centers, like, extreme amounts of RPC nodes with, like, SLA and so on.
So also what is interesting, like, again, what Wirex is doing is basically they have this idea of decentralization of the chain.
And one of the key benefits of Polygon CDK that you can actually fully decentralize chain, right?
So right now it's – the node sales is going on right now.
So everybody, if you're interested, just go to the Wirex page and see what they're selling.
But basically you can participate in validation of all of the transactions in the chain.
So you can buy the node and be – and run the part of the chain.
So it can be RPC node, data availability node.
And, or, for example, the share sequencer in the future.
And you can earn some, like, a small part of the network fee that will be going to be generated, right?
So, like, one of the benefits of CDK that you can decentralize everything, every single component.
So it's a little bit challenging to decentralize sequencer right now.
But, yeah, it's very close.
And I believe it's going to be available out of the box very, very soon.
And the same narrative is in-house networks.
So for them, decentralization is basically one of the first words that I've heard from their team.
And, yeah, and things got Polygon allows us this ability.
And, like, one of the last things that I want to mention, which is interesting, for example, you can also control the frequency, how often do you submit ZK proofs to layer one, right?
So you can make the network, like, super fast.
So your bridge will work in just a matter of a couple of minutes.
Or you can make it a little bit slower and less expensive, right, in terms, like, L1 fees.
So that's also, like, an interesting thing that you can customize there.
Yeah, just a lot of customization that gives developers, like, the opportunity to build what best suits them instead of, like, adhering to, like, the pre-determined rules of an existing layer one or layer two blockchain is kind of what it sounds like.
And another thing I want to ask about is, of course, like, the scalability and efficiency aspect of using Polygon CDK through Gateway.
And, you know, like, how does that enhance scalability and efficiency of these layer two solutions?
Is that really what teams are coming to Gateway for, for that scalability and efficiency?
Or is it more on that customization side, which you touched on earlier?
You know, like, this is the funny story because, you know, like, very few teams in the market, they actually understand how much, for example, TPS they need, right?
How much, like, RPC infrastructure they need and so on.
Because usually we start our discussion with the partners that, like, oh, we want, like, a 10,000 TPS.
No, you don't really, right?
Like, you don't want to pay, like, that amount of money for that scalability because, like, it's really hard to achieve, right?
Because, like, majority of the chains, they're going to be in, like, a OK range, right?
Like, up to, like, 500 TPS, which is absolutely possible, right?
And this is, like, easy to achieve.
So, yeah, scalability, this is the question that we usually address, like, every time when we talk to the new partners, to the existing one.
And because, like, our goal is to make sure that our customers, they don't burn money unnecessarily on the infrastructure, right?
So, we make everything, like, supermodule, right?
And, like, if you need, like, more scalability, we can add, like, a prover or add more resources to the sequencer within just a couple of hours.
And then also we can remove those resources from the network and save money when it's not necessary, right?
But I do believe that the current stack, especially with the Aragon client that I mentioned in the beginning, is good enough for 99% of all of the blockchain projects on the market, right?
Because, like, look, the latest tests that we did done with Aragon client showed the throughput of the sequencer of, like, 280 TPS of, like, heavy transactions, right?
And theoretically, we did some tests so we could go all the way up to, like, a 500, at least, like, an Aragon client.
But the beauty of the egg layer, right, that you don't really need right now to actually, like, increase, kind of, like, a hardware, right?
Like, add more power to your roll-up.
With the egg layer, you will be able to deploy another roll-up, right?
And then both those roll-ups, they will operate as, like, one blockchain.
It's just, like, think about it as you just, like, go to Google, you Google something, right?
You have, like, a different links, right?
And when you click on this link, you don't care that, oh, this website is hosted on AWS and this website is hosted on GCP or whatever, right?
It works as, like, one organism, right?
Like, everything is, like, interconnected.
So the same is going to be with the egg layer.
So in the future, when you need, like, a more scalability, you just deploy another roll-up, right?
And the platform is, like, automating tooling is, like, super easy to you.
You just go there, click, click, click, and then you have another roll-up for a couple of days.
Then you – everything went well with the traffic, right?
And then you simply delete your roll-up.
And then you have all of the data on layer one already, kind of, as settled.
Then you have proofs submitted to the egg layer.
And the data availability also has, like, all of the transactional data and so on.
So the scalability is going to be super easy to solve, right?
So we have this kind of, like, Aragon client at the sequencer that can do, let's say, like, a 300 transaction.
And then, like, if you need, like, a 10,000, you just deploy, like, a – I don't know, like, 30 roll-ups, right?
And, like, connect them to the egg layer, let them work as, like, a one roll-up, right?
So you can achieve infinite scalability.
You don't care right now about hardware.
You don't care that, like, you need some special data centers to run it.
You just – yeah, just operate it as, like, a one blockchain that, like, this merge all components.
So that's the idea of scalability.
And this is the future that we're bullish on.
And that's the reason why we're so bullish on the egg layer.
It's just infinite scalability.
And thanks for shilling the egg layer so much.
That is, like, such an important key component to, like, the user experience and what we're working towards building and achieving here.
So that's – yeah, all of this is very, very centric to the egg layer as well.
Let's move on to Haast Network.
Haast is leveraging, you know, Polygon CDK through Gateway to build their project.
So let's start – I think Lana wants to answer this one.
But just – if you can just give us, like, an overview of Haast Network and maybe, like, the primary objectives that you're trying to achieve here.
The vision behind Haast Network is striving to simplify and enhance the DeFi experience for – by providing intuitive and user-friendly products, which is offer the native field generation.
We are – I would say we are aimed to improve the DeFi landscape by addressing key pain points, which you all know.
It's a complex user interfaces and the security risks, of course.
So, as you already mentioned, and as Vasil also told, we are developing a Layer 2 blockchain and range of products on it simultaneously, which – this blockchain generates native field through the interesting mechanism.
We name this Haastory, which enables native field generation by efficiency, managing liquidity across the multiply DeFi protocols.
I probably will not go too deep right now with – technically in my introduction, but essentially it's a set of smart contracts which interact with different DeFi protocols across various networks.
And using user liquidity as a collateral, and then distributing the average profit to its wallet in the native field to ensure speed, cost efficiency, and security, we employ one of the best technologies on the market available, which is, of course, Polygon, CDKZ, Carol Labs, and the egg layer, also account obstruction technology, and so on.
But despite the complexity of these technologies, everything complex will be hidden under the hood.
So, for our users, our products will be intuitive and easy to understand.
And our mission is to provide a user experience where one can easily and quickly utilize their crypto assets, move them from network to network without relying on too many bridges, reduce risks, and, of course, earn the native yield.
And maybe it's a big words, but I would say that we are aiming to simplify DeFi right now.
Yeah, I think – see, I think that's like one of the really exciting things about Polygon CDK is that, you know, you do get this like very creative and innovative type of infrastructure that projects can build, like with this native yield generation that you're talking about.
And so, I know you mentioned – you won't go too deep into the details on this, but I just want to make sure – just clarify.
So, the yield is automatically – or the assets are automatically spread throughout various DeFi protocols, and then that's where the yield is generated from through, like, LP positions.
And what kind of benefits do you feel like that brings to the users as well?
Well, I think I should – yes, I should explain maybe more deeply about what is it, the house story.
And then I will explain this in my woman way, of course, because, unfortunately, our CTO is not with us.
So, I will explain that in-house network, we implement a smart contract mechanism, which is manage the redistribution of user token across the lending protocols and rebalance the receiving yield.
So, these smart contracts, they activate when the user transfers tokens into the house network and redirect tokens to the selected lending protocols.
So, simultaneously, in the host network, a token minting occurs, generating each H tokens equal to the nominal value of the token and sent by the users from the donor network.
But saying donor network, I mean, if we are connected with the lending protocol on Polygon, like, for example, then Polygon is the donor network, and so on.
So, these H tokens will have a one-to-one nominal value ratio with the original tokens, and we will mark this with the letter H.
And users can also stake these H tokens and use them at their discretion while earning yield on the original tokens.
And when profit generates, house story funnels them to the user's account automatically.
And this mechanism combined with the platform handling of the transaction and the low fees make house storage the crucial part of the house network offering and ensuring that the users can maximize their DeFi returns with the minimal effort.
And additionally, this mechanism enchants the security of the end user's funds as they are covered by the liquidity in the host network.
Even if one of the lending protocols fails, the user will not lose anything.
The user funds will remain safe because one of the house storage tasks is to balance and monitor all of these assets.
Hopefully, it's explained a little bit.
I think that was very clear.
So, yeah, thank you for sharing that.
And there is, like, an integration with Telegram as well that y'all have.
So, and maybe Max will be the one who wants to answer this one.
But, yeah, how does the integration of Haas network with Telegram, like, simplify that user experience?
It's definitely a trend we've been seeing in this space lately.
Like, everyone knows that Telegram is a popular platform right now within crypto enthusiasts and a lot of people in the crypto space sharing their ideas right now.
And even when some new projects appear.
So, one of the first social media is registering a Telegram.
Like, literally, like, maybe a few years ago, it was Twitter at first, but now it's, like, kind of, you know, Telegram or Twitter, right?
So, and also, the Telegram always reaching 1 billion active users monthly, hopefully soon.
And Telegram itself got mini apps within it, right?
So, it's kind of a web application, which one runs inside the Telegram messenger, which one is actually a key feature, especially for us, right, for our implementation.
And the Haas wallet, it's exactly mini app, right?
Which one allows not only send, swap, or receive tokens, but also supply and borrow them.
And as Lana was mentioning, and also, you can get the native yield on your tokens, which one basically came to Haastoria.
And all those mechanics, there is CMLX UX, right?
And our wallet is non-custodial, so it's all coming in a non-custodial way kind of manner, right?
So, basically, for the end users, what it brings is bringing more simplicity as to interact with Haastwallet.
You don't even need to go out from a Telegram messenger.
So, basically, all features of a native Haastwallet application, which one we will have iOS, Android application, web versions, will be in a mini app version as well.
And I think another question that I think we'll want to address here is, you know, like the security measures that the Haast network is leveraging.
Like, yeah, what security measures does the network implement to ensure the safety of users' assets, especially with something like very DeFi focused?
I think that's something that comes to mind quite a bit.
Yeah, that's an important question.
And let's look at it from different angles.
So, the first one, and it's technologies which one implemented within blockchain.
And the second one, it's security of smart contract, right?
So, if we are looking from implemented technologies at first, right?
So, from the outset, we will have account abstraction.
It's basically standard ERC 4337.
And what it brings, so it ensures security and simplifies the process.
So, basically, by replacing traditional private keys with smart and safer methods.
Like, for example, instead of using private keys, can use more familiar methods for us, like any biometric scan, like a face scan, or even password.
And actually, account abstraction even simplifies the recovery process.
For example, if you lost your private key or someone just got the access to your wallet, basically, so you still can get it back.
Like, through account abstraction, right?
So, another feature which one we got and which one Lana spoke about already today, actually, it's one of the standard feature to ensure security and privacy for our users.
It's zero knowledge relapse, right?
Because, because it's playing a crucial role in maintaining user privacy and boosting transition efficiency.
So, those two implemented technology.
And also, we still have to discover the smart contract security side.
So, the smart contract security, we are ensuring in a few different ways.
So, the first, it's consulting with security experts during development of smart contracts, right?
Then, also, we're going to do several different audits with different audit companies, and, as well, bug bounty program.
Hopefully, it covers your question.
No, that definitely did answer my question.
Thank you very much, Max.
And let's, yeah, let's hear from Gregory over at Wirex.
Just wondering if you could just provide, you know, a brief overview of Wirex and what the primary objectives of Wirex are.
And then we'll kind of get into, like, all the details.
So, I would say the primary objective has always been, has been for nine years now, because we started quite a while ago, quite an OG in the space.
It has always been to make crypto easy.
So, my key learning from today is that I'm far less technically advanced than Vasile's mom, because I could not launch my upchain on Polygon myself.
So, unfortunately, but that's okay, because at Wirex, we're trying to do things even simpler than that.
So, back in the days when we started, that was actually pre-Ethereum, right?
So, the first card that we launched in 2015 was a Bitcoin card, not even a crypto card.
So, the objective was to allow people who held crypto, or rather Bitcoin at the time, to be able to spend it.
Because if a currency is a currency, it needs to be a means of exchange.
If you can't spend it, then it's not a currency, because it's missing one of the key fundamental features of money.
And we made this possible back in 2015, as long ago as it may seem.
And since then, have been just iterating, building, innovating, improving.
By now, we are pretty much a new banking app.
Although we're not a bank, we're a licensed e-money institution, regulated by the UK FCA.
Think of it as your new banking app and your crypto exchange app put together,
because you get your bank accounts, your Visa or MasterCard, depending on the region,
your crypto wallets, your loans, your savings accounts, your leverage trading, if you're brave at heart,
all within the same app, licensed, regulated, and all that.
And to the user, it really doesn't matter whether they know anything about crypto,
whether they don't, they can just start using the app and the card instead of their standard banking app,
whichever they're using, traditional bank, new bank, and they will be better off by default,
because of all the cool features and perks and cashbacks and all of that.
And now, thanks to Polygon, this technology, and thanks to partners like Gateway,
we are able to make that big step to not just link those real-world payment instruments
to custodial wallets within our own app or ecosystem,
where users first have to deposit their crypto or fiat in order to be able to spend it.
Now, we're bridging this gap directly from a non-chain wallet to real-world payment instruments.
Yeah, thanks for that overview.
And I'm wondering if we can dig in a little bit more on like the decentralized payment network aspect of it,
So can you elaborate on how WirexPay functions as a decentralized payment network
and like the key features that make that possible?
So like to get there, it probably makes sense to make a little bit of overview of how it worked and still works before.
So as you know, transactions on the blockchain take a while, like Bitcoin, whatever, 15 minutes at best, right?
Ethereum, not too fast either.
Transactions on Visa, MasterCard networks or in the banking system.
On Visa and MasterCard, it's like milliseconds, right?
So for us back in 2015 to be able to give users the opportunity to spend their Bitcoin instantly with their card,
we needed to have their Bitcoin deposited with us, right?
Otherwise, it's just technologically impossible because the speed doesn't match one another.
And that has been the case from then up until now.
And many companies still launching or trying to launch that kind of cards even today.
But we're taking the next step.
Because of this layer two technologies now, it's possible to do this directly from the on-chain wallet.
So how it works within the WirexPay tab, the user is creating a smart contract wallet.
And that account obstruction on one end is linked to your Visa or MasterCard, to your iBands,
to your other payment instruments from the real world that we'll be adding.
We'll start with cards and then we'll add more.
On the other side, you can link any externally owned wallet, whether it's your whatever, MetaMask if you're using it,
And then you grant, as a user, you grant the smart contract the permission to spend, let's say,
500 euros per day or per transaction from your on-chain wallet.
Then the transaction happens in real time.
Whenever you swipe your card or withdraw cash or whatever, that's when funds get pulled directly from your on-chain wallet.
So as a user, you never give up custody of your funds except those milliseconds of the transaction.
And we, as a payment provider, we never touch your funds, we never hold them.
So there's no third party risk there whatsoever.
Funds go pretty much directly from you to the merchant or the other side of Visa ecosystem.
And not only we're not taking custody of your funds, but the actual settlement with Visa is happening in stable coins in USDC.
So that's kind of innovation number two, which is quite breakthrough for Visa themselves.
Because, yeah, the logic for Visa is, you know, if they do nothing now, two, three, four, five years from now, depending on particular geography, where it's easier, where it's not so easy,
you could probably be settling or paying directly in stable coins to a merchant.
And A, Visa doesn't want to be left out. And B, they've already got all the infrastructure, all the merchants onboarded, all the cards issued, you know, so everyone knows how to do it.
So let's just use the same familiar infrastructure, just with stable coins, powering it on blockchains like Polygon.
And then you can have pretty much the Web 2 payment experience in Web 3 from a user perspective.
And what makes it possible is we're not reinventing the wheel, we don't need another blockchain, we're just using the existing infrastructure that's already built.
Polygon CDK, the new ag layer that we started adding the functionality for recently.
And yeah, basically, so that's from the user perspective. From the payment network perspective, not only we're making it available to individual users,
but by the same token, any Web 3 wallet, self-custodial wallet, or DAX, or DAB, or like on-chain game, whoever can just connect to our DAB,
and start offering those self-custodial cards to their users with very little effort and with zero cost.
So kind of this, we're taking what historically has been quite an onerous process.
Like if you want to start issuing cards now, you have to go to an issuer, you have to, you know, onboard with them,
plus all due diligence, sign a contract, pay integration fees, pay monthly maintenance, then pay here, pay there.
We are making this whole process open and permissionless.
So the Web 3 way of making payments in the real world.
Yeah, that's pretty amazing. And I'm wondering, can you touch on, like there is the Wirex crypto debit card as well.
I'm wondering if you could kind of explain how that, like what are the benefits of that and how does that integrate with the broader financial ecosystem as well?
So the card that is available already now that we've been issuing for nine years now is a card that allows you to spend crypto.
And it's a custodial tool, so you have to first deposit your crypto.
But in return, because it's a custodial application and there's more opportunities for us to monetize those users, those customers,
we use a lot of that revenue, those small transactions fees that we take to give back to the user.
So when you're using a Wirex card, whether you're using crypto or fiat or whatever,
like even if you're just using it instead of your day to day banking card, making exactly the same payments that you would be doing otherwise with your bank card.
With your bank paying you zero, we pay you cash back at least half a percent cash back in crypto.
Right. And it can go as high as eight percent if you are like on the paid tire, if you have some tokens locked.
So it can be quite, quite substantial savings for you as a user.
And then we also pay you interest on your savings accounts and offer various other perks.
Now, all those perks are not going to be possible in the self custodial setup because there's much less opportunity to monetize.
There's just a tiny transaction fee with a very expensive underlying infrastructure, which we have to justify.
But on the positive side, if you care about self custody, that's what you get.
Right. So we give users the choice if and, you know, rightly or wrongly, a lot of people, the wide majority of people actually receive this from our six million registered users.
Most people don't care about self custody.
I'm not going to judge them. Right. Whether it's right or wrong, correct or not.
Everyone makes their own choice.
So to the wide majority of people, what matters is cool features, perks, all of that.
So here you go with the Virex app.
If you care about self custody more than about one percent cash back, here you go.
You get a self custodial Virex pay card and you can use it directly from your on chain wallet.
Whatever happens, you keep your funds. Right.
Something happens to the company. Something happens to your KYC information.
There's maybe some, you know, some cases where accounts need to be restricted, questions asked, et cetera.
The worst that can happen, you just throw your card away.
You still have your money. Right. So that's kind of the new paradigm.
Yeah, that that that makes sense. So I want I want to transition the net.
And thank you, everyone, for the for the background on on Gateway and Haast and Wirex.
Now I kind of want to move the conversation to the ag layer, which we've kind of been hinting at a little bit this whole conversation.
And this is kind of open to everybody, but I want to know we can start with Haast, actually, in regards to connecting to the ag layer.
Like how does Haast see like the benefits and, you know, like what are the primary advantages that Haast realizes when connecting to the ag layer?
And then we'll get wirex's answer on this as well.
Yeah, sure. The ag layer benefits Haast massively.
And first of all, is has put up our main net launch probably tenfold.
And if if probably a glare wouldn't exist, we need to probably make this solution ourselves.
So for our products, of course, it's critical to provide our users with a seamless experience to move their assets between networks with minimum of complexity.
And the ag layer enables users to move between chains in seconds and execute complex cross chain transaction with the single click of a button where previously chains were like like isolated islands far apart from each other.
And by using ag layer they are unified into the one big super internet of chains.
And implementing ag layer reduce the cost, of course, associated with transaction by optimizing its processes and enabling cross chain communication.
And utilizing zero knowledge proofs, ag layer ensures rapid transaction and unifies liquidity across various chains.
While for us, for our users is faster communication times and making the user experience smoother and more efficient.
And we, our team, we are seeing the future as the million of chains that feels like a one single chain.
And, uh, I think, I believe our vision here is absolutely aligned with, uh, you guys doing with ag layer.
And, uh, yeah, let's, let's move to wire X on this.
Like, you know, what, what are the perceived or what are the benefits that you and your users have by connecting to the ag layer?
So, yeah, disclaimer, this is going to be limited by my limited technical knowledge, but, uh, uh, from my understanding, uh, the main benefit from a user's perspective, it makes bridging from various other networks, safer and easier and faster.
So right now, uh, you, to be able to spend it with your card, you would have to, uh, bridge your on-chain assets to, uh, L2 Polygon and you use external bridges.
We don't limit users on what they use.
They can use anything they want, but, um, it's no secret that, uh, bridges often get hacked.
And from my understanding, ag layer is much safer, much better user experience and faster.
I'm not, not entirely sure on that side, but yeah, basically it's an improvement on an improvement.
And I, I, you're right on the cheaper part to idealistic, like ideally leveraging like the ZK tech for that type of like shared proof, um, aggregation, uh, should result in, in lower cost to the end.
And I, I think while we're at it, let's just, let's get, uh, Vassal's, uh, thoughts on this.
Like when you're talking to projects who are wanting to build with, you know, through gateway with Polygon CDK and then connecting to the ag layer.
Um, like what, what are they seeing as the primary advantages or, or how do y'all pitch that to them internally?
I mean, like it's more kind of like a customer's pitching to us ag layer, honestly speaking, because like, this is like, yeah, your team is doing quite a great job in terms of like a position in the service and market.
And, um, I mean, demand, uh, like it's a cool narrative, of course, like everybody's talking about that and like everybody's bullish on the ag layer.
It simplifies the user's morning process as, uh, as firex and house indicated, like, um, it's easier for the users, it's cheaper for the users.
Um, and it's basically a raised borders.
But, uh, we, as a, like primarily infrastructure provider, we see a lot of benefits and scalability.
So as indicated in the beginning, right, instead of like doing like a, uh, layer three, layer four, layer 20 or whatever, you can have just like a couple of roll ups, right?
Deploy them, use them, whatever you need, then I could kill them and, uh, and basically that's it.
And everything feels like a one chain.
So that's, um, that's like a super important thing.
Like, and in terms of like a security, just, just to add to what, uh, Georgie said that, um, I mean, basically the ag layer works in a way that, uh, it aggregates zero of proofs, right?
To create the proof itself, it's required you to like, it's mathematically impossible to create a proof.
Uh, if you do something like a shady stuff on your, uh, on your network.
So the validators in layer one will not validate those proofs.
So like, it's like a one layer of security.
Then you submit those proofs to the ag layer, the ag layer validate those proofs, another layer of security.
Then ag layer will kind of aggregate all of those proofs, create another proof on top of these proofs and then submit it back to the, to the L1.
So it's another two layers security.
So like, I mean, uh, you cannot go better than that in terms of like a security.
And, um, as of now, as far as an, as I understand, uh, this is like a free of charge, right?
So, uh, you just pay for the infrastructure, right?
To actually generate those proofs.
I mean, like, uh, of course we advise to all of our customers to use it because, uh, you just pay for the infrastructure, right?
To use it because, uh, the upsides are massive and like, uh, the costs are just like a minimum.
Thank, thank you so much.
I'm going to position this as like public infrastructure where like you don't have to use polygon CDK and you don't even have to be like EVM compatible to connect to the ag layer.
Ideally, this is just a piece of infrastructure, public infrastructure that solves a big issue.
And that is like the liquidity fragmentation and just like the experience of bridging, which is, um, which just ultimately hurts the user experience.
So, um, yeah, appreciate everyone, uh, on this panel for helping to, to build on it and, uh, continue to develop.
Um, and then, so we do have just about like five minutes left and I, and I want to very quickly give everyone like their final words, but also talk about like, uh, future developments of their projects.
So, uh, Basil, it looks like you, you have your hand up, so I'll go with you to also on this, but, um, if you can just, uh, yeah, just, just any closing words from, from gateway and we'll go to wire X and in host as well.
And just like, like what's something on the roadmap that you're most excited about.
Just, just before I'm going to, to this, uh, the answer in this question, when I add, like, this is very important point that you mentioned that you can connect your chain.
Like it doesn't need to be EVM to do connected to the egg layer.
So for example, we work with one of the partners, it's called like a TAC and they're building the L2 roll up and, uh, they're very close to Tone foundation.
So like their idea is to basically bring the liquidity from Tone blockchain to, to the egg layer and to the polygon.
So it's like a, uh, it's open up like a lot of opportunities and like, I'm, I'm sharing the insights here.
So everybody can pick up this idea and like, I start building their kind of a, um, roll ups that operates like a bridge.
So it's, which is very cool.
Getting back to your question in terms of like a future development.
So we see, uh, we're trying to work with like a main pain points of our customers.
And we see that, uh, the prover cost is quite, uh, quite a, uh, big pain point.
And, uh, usually like, for example, polygon prover is like a very beefy machine, right?
It's like 128 cores, like one terabyte of RAM.
So we are trying to optimize those costs.
And to reduce them down so we can have like multiple provers for every network and so on.
Also kind of like, I know that there are a lot of, um, companies who is working on the
shared prover initiatives, for example, like Sindri or Gabaloop, where you have like a pool
And then you basically send, uh, your, like a batches with the transaction, these blue provers
And then it's kind of, you save the costs.
And then you can increase the throughput of the network by doing that, which is very exciting
Also, we will start migrating all of our customers to arrogant client, which will help them to
save quite a lot of costs.
And, uh, we will increase the throughput of the network by 10 times compared to vanilla
And we are also exploring the new area.
Uh, um, just, um, BTC rollups, right?
So, uh, is it even possible to deploy ZK EVM rollup and do the settlement to BTC?
And this is something that, uh, uh, that we are super bullish about and, um, see if we
can, if we can achieve it.
And by the way, it's going to be the, the Twitter space this evening with ZKBTC as a
It's also, they work with Polygon.
So feel free to join super interesting tech and very cool idea that, uh, they're working
I've worked with that team a little bit.
They're, they're pretty amazing.
So tell them I say hello while you're on.
Um, and yeah, let's, uh, yeah, quickly, uh, let's, we'll go to, uh, Haas Network.
Any final words and just like things to keep a lookout for on the roadmap.
So Aslan was mentioned, like Haas Network is a layer two UAM based network and, uh, which
I'm using Polygon SDK and, uh, powered by ZKL apps.
So, uh, within the ZKL app, uh, the data availability question arise and it's one, uh, primary component
within ZKL apps and, uh, actually our future enhancement.
So the data will be clear, uh, guarantees, uh, for us that all transaction data, uh, remains
accessible for users at first.
And, uh, it's not being directly recorded on the main chain, right?
Uh, which one, uh, prevents, uh, malicious activities and, uh, uh, which one can be
virtually, uh, eliminated.
So, uh, uh, we're gonna implement, uh, data availability layer with, uh, in, in partnership
with NAFL apps and, uh, near DA, uh, along with NAFL fast, uh, finality layer, uh, will provide,
uh, provide, uh, provide scalability security and, uh, speed house network.
And, uh, what I would like to add on the end as kind of time is limited.
So basically, uh, we are waiting a main net and, uh, right after that going to be our flagman,
a product, a house wallet.
So please follow our social media and wait it as well with us.
Thank you so much for that.
And, uh, yeah, let's wire X, uh, any last words and just like very quick, uh, things to
look at on the roadmap and then we'll wrap up.
So this whole on chain wire X pay thing is the big focus for us, for us, not only because
it takes, uh, user experience to the next level, not only because it's, um, you know,
moving more in line, moving closer to the overall blockchain philosophy of, you know, be your own bank.
Now you can actually be your own bank, effectively keeping your funds on chain, but be able to
spend them in real world, uh, seamlessly.
And with, with no risk of ever, you know, funds being lost, locked, uh, restricted, whatever.
So that's kind of the ultimate goal for the time being also because of this whole new setup
with no, uh, no custody involved and no field involved because we'll be setting with visa in, uh,
USDC, the geographical limitations for expansion are becoming easier for us because, uh, with no custody
and no field involved, visa allows us being a principal member of visa in Europe and UK to issue cross-border.
So we are going to be able to issue cards in most of Latin American countries, in a large number of Asian countries,
I think even in one or two African countries.
So we're finally starting to get there to this, you know, uh, proverbial banking.
They are banked, uh, because let's face it in Europe, people don't like options with payments.
Um, and to further, uh, go in line with the overall philosophy of crypto.
We're looking to decentralize that on chain part of it.
And, uh, as Vasil mentioned, we're, we're doing this node sale.
Eventually it will be launched centrally just because of this whole complex fiat regulatory infrastructure underneath.
But then we intend to keep that infrastructure run by Wirex, but the, uh, smart contract,
the, the on chain part of Wirex pay will be, uh, governed by DAO and, uh, from technological perspective run by node operators.
And people can now, uh, invest in those nodes.
And later on, once, uh, once they go live, they can either run them themselves or delegate to someone
and contribute to the decentralization of this, uh, uh, web two slash web three payment network and earn their, uh, rewards along the way.
I think we'll, we'll post, uh, another link in the comments, but, uh, you can also go to the main Wirex account
or to Wirex pay chain account to get, um, more details, full overview of it.
Let's make it decentralized together.
And I just want to do one last final, thank you to everyone in the audience and our esteemed panelists
that gateway host in Wirex.
These are teams that are building on the attic layer, building the future of defragmented liquidity
in a better user experience.
So please give gateway, Wirex, Vassal, Lana, Max, everyone else, a follow on Twitter,
because that's probably the best way to stay up to date on everything that they are building.
And we will catch you all next time on Polygon X spaces.
Have a great rest of your week.