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Grateful Show #199: Building Marketplaces w/ Snag Solution
Recorded: Sept. 19, 2023 Duration: 1:31:30Space Recording
Full Transcription
Basketball, they're playing basketball, we love that basketball, they're playing basketball,
we love that basketball, they're playing basketball, we love that basketball, they're playing basketball,
I'm a rapper, basketball, number one, Curtis Blow, basketball is my favorite sport, I like the way the trouble up and down the court,
just like I'm the king of the microphone, so it's Dr. J and Moses Malone, I like slam dunks and take me to the floor,
my favorite play is the alley, I like to pick and roll, I like to give and go, cause it's basketball, I'm Mr. Curtis Blow.
They're playing basketball, we love that basketball, we love that basketball, we love that basketball,
I used to go to dinner, then take the girls, see Tiny Fred, against Earl Pearl, and Will Diggle, and Jerry West,
play basketball at his very best, basketball has always been my thing, I like Magic Bird,
and Bernard Kane, and number 33, my man Kareem, is the center of my stalling team.
GM, GM guys, beast, if you can pin the giveaway tweet, we're gonna be announcing some stuff here,
and we still have two more minutes of intro, so chill, sit back, you know, grab a water, tea, coffee,
whatever you want, and we're gonna be starting soon, let's go!
Let's go!
Let's go!
Let's go!
Let's go!
Let's go!
Let's go!
Let's go!
Let's go!
Let's go!
Let's go!
That I provide, I provide the U.S.T.
Besides the ghetto vibe, make me feel like juggling hot.
Of course, I come across with the pure, for sure.
Unadulsterated, uncut, raw, disgusting, busted.
You want to touch it, too hot, you forgot.
You're not ready, your head could get ruptured.
Hit between the eyes, I plan to ban the lot.
I supply the statics, I ruin your background.
The villain's good, I'm lighter than the fighters.
See the big black picture, if you look inside of.
My mind is graphic, expressive, graphic.
Kill a copycat, I can't it all master.
Directed it, what y'all please expect.
Let's go, everybody.
If you have any questions through the space,
hop into the comments, you can ask there.
You can say hi, you can share what you're doing,
and you can share whatever you want there.
Also retweet or repost the space,
so more people can vibe with us.
And yeah, let's go, Grateful Show 199.
GMGM everybody, super pumped for today's episode.
We actually talked with SnackSolution and CryptoZack
almost exactly one year ago, 24th September.
We talked about AIP 98, so super happy that we have him here again.
But before we invite him on stage, I want to say hi to my co-host today, Beast.
What's good, man?
How you doing?
Yo, GM grateful, GM everyone here.
Oh, shoot.
I don't hear anything.
No way!
You can hear me?
Do you hear Beast, guys?
Okay, so I'm stepping down and I'll be back.
You do?
Oh my god.
I hear him.
Okay, so Zack hears me.
Okay, I'm stepping down anyway and I'll be back.
What is going on, guys?
I don't hear anyone.
That's amazing start of the spaces.
Let's go.
I really don't hear anyone.
I don't know what's happening here, but Beast, maybe you make it back.
Oh, CryptoZack, can you say anything, please?
I can hear you right now.
That's magic.
I hear everyone.
That's amazing.
I will get Beast back.
Yeah, this, you know, iOS 17, that's our first space.
You know, new Apple software is out and I couldn't hear anyone.
So love that, Beast.
I don't know what you said, but let's go.
I'm back.
Can you hear me or still nothing?
Yeah, I got you.
I got you.
I hear you.
No way.
Let's go.
Let's go.
So, man, how are you doing today?
What's good?
I didn't hear anything.
So you can repeat it.
You can say it or you can say something completely different than you said before.
Whatever you want.
Man, I had such a long speech, but yeah, let me repeat it.
I said I'm doing well.
I'm really excited.
And what I didn't say, but what I wanted to say is that there is that ongoing discussion about NFT marketplaces, about royalties, whether to enforce them or not.
And if so, how to do it.
And I'm super pumped for the conversation.
I'm also super pumped because I know that was it September or when did you say that we had a great first show with Zach?
Like, man, it feels like ages, but I remember it was fucking epic.
So I'm excited to be here.
Amazing.
And guys, one more thing.
There's a giveaway pinned tweet.
So if you have heavy metal, you can retweet, you know, you can comment your energy, how much energy you have in the forge and take one of your friends and we will pick three winners.
They will get bonus pack and there's a lot of juicy stuff in it, so you don't have to clean your tiles, et cetera, et cetera.
So let's invite our guest today in a proper, in the right way.
Let's fucking go.
GM, GM.
GM, GM.
How are you doing, my fellow pink ape friend?
Feeling papish today.
Good to be up here.
And thrilled to vibe with you guys.
Always have a great time coming up and chatting on The Grateful Show.
Amazing, man.
This is our favorite topic, actually.
We talk a lot about marketplaces, realities.
You know, there was a huge discussion some time ago about what's happening in this space.
So I think it's going to be really interesting.
And what you guys do, and it's crazy.
So we got to go definitely deeper.
There's a lot of stuff to talk about also with the Snack V2 and ApeCoin proposal, right?
So can't wait to talk about it.
But before we start, man, could you tell us a bit, how do you see the situation right now
with the marketplaces?
Like what's happening in the space?
You know, we saw OpenSea, you know, removing the royalties.
What do you think about it?
Well, it's brutal.
I start kind of from my own entry into the NFT category.
I chose to start Snag Solutions in large part because I took for granted that royalties were
a piece of the NFT model, right?
We all back in 2021 thought that these things were enforced on chain.
And it's my belief, not everyone holds this, that royalties are a key piece of what caused
NFTs as a technology to have such robust product market fit back in 2021.
And it's, you know, upstream from all of the provenance and unique experiences that can
be created with NFTs.
They're the reason that creators, artists, brands would want to be building new technology
on top of NFTs as a primitive.
And so without this revenue stream, it's hard to get the best folks building in the category.
And that's really what's going to drive growth long term.
So we're super focused on how we build a set of tools that help creators start to enforce
these again so that we can help get NFTs back to having, you know, product market fit and
getting us into that next bull run.
I 100% agree, man.
And we talk to a lot of artists here.
And especially I think for artists, it's like without royalties, it's pain in the, you know,
where.
So we heard so many success stories here, you know, like how artists started and how
it helped them.
And everyone believed that actually royalties are enforced on chain.
And, you know, I remember Gary Vee saying like, yo, that's such a great thing back in
2021, right?
And now we know that it's not true, right?
So we have to figure out a way.
And I definitely want to talk later about, you know, how actually artists and projects
can generate revenues outside of the royalties too, right?
So that's another very interesting topic.
But yeah, Beast, do you have any questions for the start?
I wanted to add to what you mentioned with Gary Vee, because I remember when I was joining
the NFT space, it was one of the first explanations that I got that artists can create art.
And then if they become successful at some point, they can sell their NFTs and even the
next generations can profit from that, which was super cool, right?
So yeah, I guess to open it up, I mean, what's the current stage?
I mean, what's the, you know, how can we fix that, Zach?
Yeah, so there's a few things going on here.
What's most interesting to me right now is that the biggest creators are not jumping to
enforce royalties in a kind of on-chain way, at least not with any speed.
And when I talk about top creators, I'm talking to create a category here about, you know, Yuga,
Azuki, Proof, Artifact, Pudgy Penguins.
Let's just call it those five to start.
And we're in reasonably active conversations with most of those folks.
And where their head is right now is really around how do we incentivize royalties?
So how do we reward users who are paying royalties, who are not listing their tokens,
and start to create, whether it's an ERC-20 or an off-chain loyalty point, or just, you
know, a requirement for upcoming airdrops, APS participation, et cetera, how do we create
a system that rewards collectors versus traders?
And so that's the first thing that we're trying to lean into is building tooling that's more
of an operating system for these projects as they look at what behaviors they want to
reward.
Does that mean something like, let's say, this is just an example, you know, don't take me,
but if you didn't pay for royalties, maybe you can claim tickets for APFest or something
like that?
Spot on.
And that could be done, right?
And this, not to make this conversation specific to you, that they are a great example
or a use case, but yeah, it could either be, hey, if you have paid royalty or minted your
token and you haven't listed in the last 90 days, then you get first access to APFest.
That would be a pretty logic-based way to do it.
A more kind of like point style way to do that would be, hey, for each day that you don't
list and had paid royalty, you get 10 points and you can actually spend the points for your
ticket or you can keep accruing those points and you would then spend them in the future
for some other event or experience like Mutant Saturday or whatever else.
Man, isn't there like issue with the old collection and BAYC?
I know that the metadata are frozen and I think they don't even have access to that collection,
right?
So they basically can't change the smart contract, right?
So they can enforce it for new marketplaces.
So what can these collections do to actually enforce royalties?
Like is there something other than you just mentioned?
Yeah, so for old collections with locked contracts, no, all you can do is incentivize royalty payments.
For new collections, there's a variety of tools.
What's really interesting to go back a little bit is Yuga actually for their other side,
no, not the other side, when they split the vessels out from the outside and forced upgrades,
right? That's when they were forcing folks onto the OpenSea operator filter, which is kind of ironic
or funny today. I have to say that that's the big shot they took on goal with respect to royalty
enforcement. But what's interesting is it actually really worked for a week or two before Blur was
able to use Seaport to work around that operator filter. And so the new thing that we're pushing
folks towards, and I think there's any of these things are equally good. There's a bunch of
new solutions in the space today, but ERC-721C is something that was developed by Limit Break.
They do Digi Daigaku, I can't pronounce that, but they do that one and a bunch of other gaming
focused projects. And so they had a strong incentive to solve the royalty problem because their view,
back to what I was saying initially, is that if they can't maintain royalties, then what's the
point of building all these games on top of NFT technology, to put simply. And so they have this
standard ERC-721C, which is pretty much a better version of that OpenSea operator filter that is
its own standard so that you, versus blocking certain marketplaces, you allow only specific
marketplaces to transact your token. And so that you can limit secondary sales to only approved
marketplaces. So it's just a better set up version of that initial operator filter construct. And
critically, it's one that is not controlled or maintained by OpenSea.
Yeah, I don't understand the technical side, but why actually can't we force the royalties on the
smart contract, right? So...
Yeah, so the simple way to think about this, and this is true even of ERC-721C, to jump ahead to my
thesis, it's that we need to actually both block royalties using ERC-721C or whatever else,
and to incentivize royalty payments via that logic-based or point-based system that I described
earlier. So I think it needs to be both carrot and stick here, or it won't work. And then the reason
you always need the carrot on incentivizing royalties is because I'm going to call out Blur. Blur can always
wrap the token. And we've seen that with CryptoPunks most recently, where that's a contract type that
isn't even set up to trade on standard basis or OpenSea. And so they've created a simple process for
punk holders to wrap that token in a 721 wrapper, so that it can easily trade on their marketplace.
And that's always going to be true of any asset. It doesn't matter. There are people who are like,
let's create a whole new chain for NFTs, or let's create this whole new blocking solution for NFTs.
None of it will ever be any better in my mind than what Limit Break has already done with 721C.
Because as soon as you wrap the contract, none of the prevention mechanisms apply anymore.
And so instead, what's better is start with a pretty good and well-built prevention mechanism,
which is already readily available. And then two, create an incentive system so that if a trader,
right, like we know Grateful here probably isn't paying his royalties. If Grateful grabs my ape off of Blur,
he actually wouldn't get access to the upcoming ape fest, the upcoming airdrop, etc.,
until he pays the royalty or kind of brings that token back into compliance with the project.
So where our thinking is, how do we create that system on both sides?
This is an interesting idea. And, you know, right now I'm thinking about what about people that they don't know
that they will use the utility if they don't pay royalties, right?
So there would be a way, for example, you claiming the tickets and there would be a pop-up,
hey, you didn't pay royalties, you need to pay for it or something like that?
That's our current thinking. And I mean, I'd love feedback from anyone up here today. We put some
of this thinking on a, so we've described two sides of this royalty tracking system within our current
ApeCoin proposal. Piece one is a admin or project interface where you could come in and say,
hey, payments after date, let's call it today. If royalty is not paid, then that token will not
receive benefits ongoing, right? So they could set that time whenever they want it. And they would
also have options for how much does that holder have to pay to make royalties right? IE, is it based
on royalty times four price the day they purchased? Is it royalty times four price today? Whatever that
logic is that they want to utilize to determine what the appropriate payment would be. And so the
first piece is we need the project to be able to determine that. We as a, you know, infrastructure
business can't say when you got accounts and doesn't count royalties. And then the second piece
would be a, uh, user interface where they could go in the case that their token was out of compliance
and bring it into compliance based on those inputs that were set by Yuga or other creators.
And so that's kind of how we're thinking about the system. But as we describe that, we feel we hear
from folks that the concept of paying to bring a royalty or to make a royalty right is not something
folks are excited about. So if you all have any thoughts, we'd love to hear from you.
Yeah, man. From marketing point of perspective, like imagine buying Ape for like 30 ETH and then
figuring out that you can go to ApeFest after like six months, you know, uh, that you have to pay
some extra money. Uh, that would probably piss me off a bit. Right. So, uh, it's definitely not easy
beast. I saw you unmuted. So if you want to, if you want to add anything,
I was wondering Zach from the technical side. So is this possible because of that 721 C or is this
possible because of that payment processor from limit break or how does it, how does it work?
Yeah. So I would actually differentiate. These are two, there's a stick system to put it simply,
and that's the 721 CM payment processor. And those two things work in conjunction to block
other marketplaces from selling tokens. If they're not enforcing royalties, put simply.
So it's the same kind of like front end enforcement mechanism, but we know that people will work around
that enforcement mechanism. At least if you guys involved, right? Like if you got just because
blur blur did it within a week or two before, I don't think they would work through this one in a week
or two, but within a month or so they would have some solution in place to allow these tokens to trade.
And so we would need to have this, uh, system built as a, uh, uh, creator owned system that lets them
provide value to the holders that are actually, uh, contributing, paying royalty, et cetera.
Got it. That's interesting.
Do you actually think there's a future without royalties or there is going to be, uh, you know,
fight for them that, uh, the projects and companies will really, really try hard to, uh, to keep them.
I, I, I think it's interesting. I think there will be a fight for royalties where creators will make a big
push. Um, like I said, all of the top creators are actively thinking about how they incentivize this.
Many of them are not yet ready to go down this kind of like ERC 721 C route, at least for the biggest
projects, because they have a lot to lose. Um, and it's worth mentioning that the SEC plays a big role
in all of this right now, due to their kind of overreach on compliance. And in, in the most recent,
sorry, I'm going a little bit down a rabbit hole on the SEC, but for these top projects, it really
matters. Um, for, uh, this motion action that they served against, uh, Mila Kunis's project,
stoner cats, they named royalties as a primary reason that those tokens were viewed as securities.
Um, which makes no sense and has no legal basis. And there was a bunch of dissensions from other, uh,
uh, members, but the current state is that the, the creators who would be in charge of making the
big push on royalties are feeling very constrained in their ability to be vocal about the issue right
now. And so what I think we'll see is a new set of creators that have upgradeable smart contracts
that can more easily enforce these likely starting to lead the charge on this to some degree. Um, and
then that was all a rant. So coming back to the core question, what I, uh, I believe NFTs will still be
super meaningful regardless of royalties, but I think they'll, they'll be more interesting
as property rights for, you know, tickets, real estate, et cetera. I think it will be much harder
to build digitally native brands around these assets because if there's no unique value prop where
these native creators can monetize secondary sales ongoing, it just won't be that easy for them to break
in and kind of create a new category as compared to a hundreds or a Lacoste or any of these other
other, you know, LVMH, any of these other brands that will start experimenting with, with digital assets.
Yeah, that makes sense, man. And it's such a complex topic, right? Like, uh, because I remember back in
the day there, there were projects that really, you know, had some issues and people started selling
their NFTs, but, uh, the project was making a huge money, right? So, uh, there, there, it's so complex to
think about how to deal with the royalties. And, you know, we talk about a big project, but
there are also so many artists and I think for them, it can also be like, uh, you know, game changer for,
for, for, for the future. Uh, let's say you spent like few years in this space and you have like
multiple collections, like it can bring some money, uh, so you can afford maybe some, you know, photo
gear or some trip or something like that, that can, you know, uh, bring you more into your business.
So I think it's really interesting and, uh, probably ready to, to deep dive, you know, guys,
what you doing about it, right? Um, well, because we talk, um, year ago about AIP. Um, I know that
marketplace for, uh, can we call it marketplace for ApeCoin or it was marketplace for like Yuga more?
I would say only the former marketplace for ApeCoin and we're, we're, we're chatting with Yuga.
Got that. Got that. So I know guys, you building custom marketplaces, loyalty programs, um, on your,
in your bio, you have like world of women, the plug NFT, uh, ApeCoin too, right? So, uh, could you tell
us a bit what's next solutions actually does, uh, and what kind of problems are you guys solving?
Yeah. So, um, quick background on, on us founders and I built the merchant side of the business at
DoorDash starting back in like 2016. And that included a lot of our new merchant services,
ads and promotions pickup, and eventually our white label business where we help, uh, large brands like,
uh, Chipotle, Panera, et cetera, run pickup and delivery through their own app and website.
And we started Snag really focused on that last use case, which is how do we help top creators,
top brands using NFTs as part of their e-com strategy, pull, uh, the NFT purchasing and
community experience into their own app and website. And as we were founding the brand,
it was right around the Adidas originals launch. And that was kind of the use case in my head at the
time is how is Adidas putting all of this effort into their web three brand and still pushing folks
to open C versus pulling them into their Adidas original app. So we can buy
Yeezys and all the other expensive stuff that they're trying to market to us.
Um, so I think that that's kind of a core theme that we've continued to build around,
but similar to that merchant services experience of kind of innovating on behalf of the creator,
we've started to build a more robust set of tools that include, um, kind of a micro social network
for communities, and then critically, uh, have put a lot of focus into loyalty recently as a core
product. That's actually the main thing that we're starting to monetize today, where we're helping
these top creators track both royalty payments and staking data, soft staking data, but then also,
uh, tweets about the project, hashtags for the project, discord participation, anything that
they view as a core contribution from the community so that we can start to reward community members
in points. And then we make those points spendable as part of future mints, uh, to access events,
et cetera. So again, really trying to build an operating system for these projects and brands.
So for the reference, uh, let's, uh, look at, uh, thank ape, right? Like, uh, I sign up, I connected
my wallet, uh, I tweeted something, I did something and I got rewards. So something similar, similar to
this, that it's like automatic process that, uh, you don't have to do anything. Uh, you just log in
into that and, uh, it collects the points and everything automatically. Is that correct?
I think that's spot on. And the key difference is that we're creating a new point for these projects
that is not a point, right? So versus thank ape, they they've secured a budget and they're
distributing these rewards that already exist. We're actually creating an ecosystem currency.
And you could think about this as the same as an airline mile or a Starbucks star or some of those
other kind of, uh, uh, off chain loyalty equivalents, but then they have value within
these community ecosystems. Um, so trying to, and by the way, there's a major SEC compliance
value prop there. I'm sure you've all seen ApeCoin in the news with the SEC. And so by taking all the
functionality of an ERC 20, but just pulling it off chain and making it non-tradable, that's, uh,
pretty appealing to these top brands right now so that they don't have to worry about the SEC quite as
much. Damn. The SEC is wild these days. Crazy, crazy guys. Let us know in the comments, what you
think about, uh, the future of the marketplace is what you think about royalties. Do you think we
gonna have royalties in the future or we not gonna, you know, be able to, to force them and there be
gone, uh, would be really interesting to know what you guys think. Also, if you have heavy metals,
uh, there's a pinned tweet, you can, uh, actually, uh, be part of the giveaway. We are giving a bonus
pack, uh, for three winners. So if you don't want to clean a shit in the forge, you can win the bonus
pack and get a clean slate. But yeah, beast, go ahead. I'm still thinking how to sort it out. Is that
really not possible like in the future to somehow make it enforceable? Don't you see that there's
going to be some technology or something that we will be make it, we will be able to make it possible.
The initial vision that when we talked about that artist that is, or her next generation will be
benefiting from that. Is that going to be really on that social level?
Let me, um, coming back to the wrapping concept, it's not that, that it's impossible. It's just that
the trade-offs become severe. So let's give an example. Um, I, I, I, let's say the new Bored Ape
collection, Yuga migrates and our Bored Apes are now on this ERC 721C standard. Um, and Blur wrap,
I wrap my chicken via Blur so I can not pay royalty. Um, one that there should at some point
be, if, if you guys were withholding benefits, there should be kind of some level of social
compliance where those assets organically start to trade at a 2.5% difference because users know
they'll have to go pay the royalty on the backend anyways. So that's the first thing that, that we
kind of think needs to be enforced socially, but then separate, if I were to wrap the token and
pull it out of compliance, what Yuga could do is say, if these assets trade on our place
that is not sanctioned, we're going to burn the asset. Like we're going to remove the metadata.
Right. But it, it pretty much what I'm trying to describe is it always has to be some kind of stick
or, um, you know, negative consequence for users trading these tokens. There's no way to actually
enforce royalties where they could never trade it. Otherwise, um, that that's impossible.
Yeah. I remember there was a collection and I don't know the name right now, but when you listed
below the floor or something like that, uh, they burned your NFT or something like that happened.
Right. So I think that's kind of brutal, man. That's hardcore way. You know, like if you list
pink ape under a hundred eat, you know, it's gone and you don't want to do that, man.
So, um, what's the way for the creators then? I know that you guys, uh, you know, built that
everyone can, can actually create custom marketplace. So how does it work? You know,
because if everyone has a custom marketplace and you know, for example, I love OpenSea that it's,
you know, all the collections are there. So I go there, I can, you know, skim through,
I can see what's, uh, what's selling, what I like, you know, I can, I can also discover new,
new NFT. So how this would work actually, if everyone has their own marketplace.
Yeah. So one cool thing about our marketplaces are that we, it's toggleable by the creator,
but you can toggle royalties on. And if they're toggled on, then any listing through the marketplace
will have royalty enforced, even if it's an OpenSea listing, we'll just manually tack that on top on
the buy side. And we can build the, the loyalty program, like we described, so that we're actually
rewarding that payment of royalties and helping track those behaviors by community members. Um,
the thing I would say for, for new creators or anyone with an enforceable up contract or
upgradable contract, sorry, um, is that this 721 C standard that I've been talking about is
I'm going to say in my mind, the best thing on the market today. And what's great about that standard
is you could set it up to only allow trading on our marketplace, but you don't have to, because we
ultimately want to like a core value prop of NFTs is interoperability. And anything we do to limit
that interoperability is bad for the asset. And so with 721 C, it's really an allow list where
you could set up our marketplace to start, but as other marketplaces, I'm not up to date on the
latest, but maybe magic even or X2Y2 could be examples here who are talking about coming back
towards the royalty enforcement side on Ethereum. Uh, you, you could, uh, enable those marketplaces
as they enforce royalties to, uh, accept your collection as well. So it's a pretty flexible tool
that lets you enforce royalties. And by the way, if you're anyone other than Yuga,
or maybe some of those other top five creators, um, no blur blur is not going to work around their,
their enforcement standard or do wrapping, et cetera, just to get after their collection. So
I think that's the best thing that I would recommend for most creators today.
Yeah. A hundred percent, a hundred percent, man. Uh, of course they gonna, they gonna enforce
it on collections that do a huge volume, right? So, um, how actually the process, uh, work when you
create your own, uh, marketplace, you have to actually mint, uh, you actually have to mint your NFTs,
uh, there. So everything you have prior that moment, uh, you cannot use it or how, how that works actually?
So regardless of whether you're upgrading an existing smart contract or creating a new one,
you would just set up the mint for the 721 C standard. As an aside, we'll be doing minting
in our marketplaces in the next four to six weeks. And we'll have 721 C available out of the box for
new creators who want to use this standard. Um, but overall it's really just setting it up no
different than a 721, but including that, that new logic to include the allow list within the,
uh, the, the, the, the contract, the, the smart contract itself. Um, so it's not wildly different from
the normal setup process. And I think, I don't know if manifold has this already or not, but I, I know
this is in progress for many of the top minting providers. Yeah. That was exactly my question,
right? Imagine that I'm a photographer or a collection. I already minted. And now I would
like to actually move into your marketplace and create my own, uh, is there a way to use it for my
current collection or I have to start, uh, from the new one.
Um, that, that depends on whether your contract's upgradable. And if you minted in the last nine to
12 months, it probably is because we knew that this was a problem. If you minted in 2021, it probably
isn't. And in that case, I, I don't have any silver bullets for collections that have already minted and
have non-upgradable contracts. One pretty strong approach. So, so I'll, I'll highlight two partners.
The plague, they did a, and it all depends on collection size, et cetera, but the plague did a
full airdrop on it where they just dropped new royalty enforced assets to all members. Um,
shredding sassy, which is one of our smaller partners, but have a pretty exceptional team that,
that continues to build new product for their community. Uh, they did an airdrop via polygon
because the, the cost of an airdrop for some of these smaller communities on Ethereum is just
quite cost prohibitive. Um, and so they did the airdrop via polygon, but with layer zero bridging
enabled so that users can easily bridge right back to Ethereum if they wanted to for only the cost of
a polygon transaction fee. And their collection is done pretty well maintained floor price,
despite the transition. Um, the, the collections that really have no good options are the ones that
are somewhat provenance based. So if it's a, you know, a real artist versus more of a PFP play,
that makes it a little bit harder as you lose the provenance of the art by upgrading the contract.
Okay. Yeah. Oh my God. It's not easy, man. It's not easy. I would just switch on the,
the toggle, you know, for royalties and that's it about it. It doesn't work like that. Uh, guys,
I also see a few people from ape coin here, you know, SSP, uh, DMing me that he want to also talk
about, uh, V2. No, I'm kidding. He, he doesn't, but he want to talk about it for sure. Um, we got to get
there guys. I want to stick a bit, uh, about, about your solution because it's really, really interesting.
And, uh, you know, I know many artists that are actually thinking what to do, right? Like, uh,
what's the best way for them to operate, uh, for the future? So, uh, what would you recommend, uh,
to artists and projects that may be thinking about, uh, new collections that they want to drop? Uh,
what would be the best process? So they, they actually secure their, their royalties for the future.
Damn, are we rocked again? I don't know if Zach is there or. Oh, that was the alpha only me.
That was the, he might be saying some alpha. It's always like that, right? Grateful.
Yeah. Every single time when there is, when there is some alpha, it just goes quiet. I don't know why
Twitter or X is doing that. Yeah. So maybe he's laughing now. He might be back.
Can you hear me? Yeah, we get you. Yes, you're back.
Uh, I was going to just say the seven 21 C it, I can follow up on, uh, best placement. We'll have
it available soon. Uh, but you know, shouldn't be that difficult. The repos are all readily available
with limit break. And that's going to set you up for success as you navigate the royalty
situation. Does it mean, uh, Zach something for open C? Uh, again, I have a little lower level
question, but just trying to understand that because I even saw tweets that people are actually waiting
with, uh, minting their collections, uh, for seven 21 C. I also saw some tweets that it's a game changer
for collectors. And, uh, so are there some like other consequences also do expect like most of the
new collections will be minted on that standard.
So I, I don't want to make a comment on most new collections. I think a lot of the leading creators
will use seven 21 C moving forward. The key trade-off with seven 21 C is that you can't list
on open C. So I think that's what you're seeing there, which just to say it back seven 21 C, it
blocks all marketplaces and lets you add only the ones that honor royalties. And so because open C
doesn't honor royalties, they get blocked through the solution today. Um, and so if you're a new creator,
that's scary because you have to, you know, get your marketing, how they're using open C as a
platform. Um, one thing I'll say with that in mind, I think the, the leading creators who have
established brands, they should definitely be on seven 21 C. And I think most artists should be on
seven 21 C. I think the, uh, on the art side, artists perceive there to be much more benefit
from being on an open C or a, uh, foundation or what, whatever their, their, uh, app of choices,
then their act is. And so I think there, there's a, a stronger and more obvious value prop for folks
who really have the, the smaller communities that are really engaged to move over onto the standard
more quickly. Got it, man. So there is that risk that if you don't have the established collection
already, uh, you might risk that people won't find you because you won't be on open C, right?
The, that's the other side.
Spot on. That's so funny. I mean, I remember it back in 2021, like we knew nothing, man. We were just,
let's, let's mint everything we have and let's go, baby. But, and man, it was much easier. Yeah.
Not knowing, right? So it was less complicated. Yeah. It was crazy. Whenever I talk to someone,
you know, real estate is going to be on blockchain and, uh, you know, imagine you selling house,
there's royalties. Okay. Not that simple. We tokenize everything, right? Yeah. I tokenize everything.
I put it into 4k protocol and, and I use it as collateral. Love that. Love that. But, uh,
we got to get there. Zach, what, how do you actually think the, I like that you can actually
integrate your solution into your website, something that you mentioned with Adidas, right?
Like why people should go to OpenSea to buy Adidas NFT if they can buy it from their app or maybe from,
uh, maybe not from the app because of, of Apple, but from their website, right? Uh, what is the future
for the collectors? Um, because we talk a lot about onboarding, uh, you know, um, our vision also
change a bit because we know that it has to be seamless. It has to be super easy for the collectors
to buy it for the masses, right? Probably maybe using also credit cards. So what do you think
that is, that is the future for collectors so they can easily buy the NFTs? Uh, and one more thing to
that, uh, self-custody future, uh, versus non-self custody future. What do you think about those topics?
Yeah, uh, great question. So, um, we use dynamic dot XYZ. I'm a huge fan of theirs. Um, and we'll be
launching a couple more kind of web to marketplace experiences in the next month or two here that as
a default are sign on with email. And when users sign on with email, they have new wallets spun up in the
background. There's also still a sign in with MetaMask option underneath, but we're really, uh,
pushing most users through the email based account creation flow. And so that's the, the, the non-self
custody side. And I think as we target, you know, onboarding and adoption based use cases for new users,
it's not about removing crypto. It's about abstracting crypto so that that default flow
crypto is as easy to use as any other web to experience. And there's no need to think about
crypto, you know, it's login with email, it's purchased with credit card. And then the first
time you really need to think about crypto is as you think about a sale event or a liquidity event.
We like talking about standards today. So is that all possible because of that account abstraction,
the 4337 or whatever standard is that? You know, it's actually still almost pre that
technology where we were chatting with dynamic just yesterday about a V2 of the product that
would be built on 4337. Um, and that's going to create, um, several improvements on, um, how the
user can kind of extract items from their account and upgrade to, to a self custody wallet in the
future, but it doesn't really change the like initial sign up flow. The really painful part on
most of these kind of magic wallet and other, uh, non-self custody experiences today is on the
extraction step because you either need to get gas into the wallet or you need to cover the cost to
extract items from the wallet, et cetera. And so, uh, 4337 will really help on that then.
Nice. So what's the progress in terms of the technology, Zach? Because you've been
active in the space for a while, you actively building, uh, you working with the technology.
When we talked to each other a year ago on spaces, like, do you see some progress in terms of that?
Yeah. So to me, um, I have some concerns about the timing of the next NFT bull run entirely based
on the topic of royalties and how that plays a role in, in pulling the, the, the best builders
back into the space. But talking about crypto at large, and I have to copy out, this is my first
cycle and I don't know anything, but talking about crypto at large, I feel like all of the core
infrastructure problems that led to us not sustaining product market fit in the last
cycle are gone today. And the first one is new user onboarding. I could take a lot of credit for
how easy it is to sign in with emails, spin up a new wallet and purchase your first asset.
But really we integrated two applications, dynamic and paper for, for credit card purchasing.
And it took us not more than a week or two of development to get that all plugged in.
And so the fact that it's so easy to plug in a high quality web to user experience for onboarding
was just not true in the last cycle. I was still at DoorDash and thinking about how we could leverage
some of this tech within a consumer activation where we provided some type of digital asset for
purchasing on the platform. And looking back at it, the truth is that the technology just wasn't there
in 2021. And that there's nothing we could have done that would have been all that compelling as
a result. So that that's core tech problem. Number one, that's solved. And then the more
important problem is just block space demand where I mean, I think the average like mint fee or gas fee
in the last bowl, even, you know, before looking at the spikes was 30 to $50 on L1 versus today,
it's much lower, but more importantly, the scale factor on L2s, I think is up to like 35 ish X
and other L1s like Solana, et cetera. And so the, the ability for users to in a trusted and secure way,
using some of these layer twos that settle back through Ethereum, um, secure high value assets
and use that technology in a very web two way back, back to my first bullet point, like it is
all there. And as a result, I couldn't be more comfortable saying that, that we are at the bottom
or, or even back building up back towards that new goal, because the technology is there. And that's
really what, what drives the, these bull bust, uh, cycles. Man, I'm so happy to hear that.
And it's, it's all the time. Like anytime I talk to people who are actually building within the space,
who are building the infrastructure, like they're very bullish. They're very optimistic about the
space. They're very optimistic about the progress. So I think like, we just need to zoom out a little
bit, like, you know, and focus on like, what are the next things, you know, how to, how to scale,
how to make the space more user friendly, how to make the, the onboarding easier and see the progress
because the progress is there. It's just hard when you, when we, you know, just checking the NFT floor
prices and all that stuff. Like, you know, you're not, you're not gonna find it there.
Yeah, man. A hundred percent. Uh, Zach, what, what, what, what can we imagine under the,
the term, uh, token gated social networks? Is it something like a friend tech or?
Uh, not, not, not with nearly as much.
Yeah. B gave me this question because he, he, he was scared to ask. So I did it for him.
Oh, come on, come on, come on. And I'll say I've played around on friend tech. I think it's pretty
brilliant what they've done. Tying back to what I just described though, what their tech stack is,
is it's a progressive web app, which is super easy to do. Um, and then it's simple web two based
onboarding, right? Like that, that's their stack. And that's what was not right. And cheap layer two
blocks face so that the, the transaction fees are low, right? So these are the things that
you're seeing them hit on and drive some adoption with that just weren't available in the last full
run. Um, our social, uh, concept is really creator based. And so, um, I'll, I'll leave the name out,
but we're working with a leading kind of fashion and entertainment brand who wants to launch digital
assets to their community and then create ongoing, uh, video and social content from models,
participants, et cetera. Um, that is holders and let holders engage with these kind of celebrities
in a way that is unique and authentic to their brand. And so doing all of that social interaction
gated only to holders and providing additional benefits or value to holders within that social
experience, that's what we're building towards on social.
And that's, that's what we've always wanted, right? Like we wanted this utility like to get
access to something that other people can write. So yeah, that makes a hundred percent sense. And,
uh, yeah, I really, you know, I see the progress. Like also, if you just look at the token proof,
right, it got so much better. It's, it works so well. Oh my God, all the tickets and everything.
It's so easy. So just a reminder, guys, if you've got new phone, uh, check your token proof app,
because I think, uh, the, the app won't restore the tickets from backup. So if you bought new phone
and you fly to Hong Kong, you show up, uh, in front of the AFES door, maybe you will have a problem.
So please check it out. And yeah, man, I, I think we, we could go into the, into that, um,
AIP idea, uh, that I, I read, uh, on, on this course, uh, or if you, if you want to add anything
to, uh, to your custom, uh, marketplace, go ahead. Maybe we forget something, but then I would like to,
to move there. Let's jump into it. Let's go. So the idea is, uh, to actually replace OpenSea,
right? Like, uh, an ApeCoin run royalty enforced OpenSea replacement. So could you tell us
more about this idea, uh, because I know that AIP 98 was actually, uh, like ApeCoin marketplace.
So what happened since then? And what, what is this about? Absolutely. And, and as I jump into
this, I'd love to, I see, like you mentioned, several of the ApeCoin folks in the crowd here.
So if folks want to come up and chime in with a question or two, please do let the conversation
much stronger. Um, so I'll, I'll try to recap here. So we started with a
Yuga focused ApeCoin marketplace. It's still available on apecoinmarketplace.com if you want
to check it out. And we initially requested zero funding to build a custom solution that was
the best place to shop for and purchase Yuga assets. Um, we launched that marketplace almost
a year ago now, about 10 months ago. Um, and we, we saw some strong signs on market fit early.
We were doing, uh, a purchase is through the platform back in January and February before
Blur picked up steam and, and kind of started to squeeze others out. And following the Blur token
launch in February really saw a reduction in volume. We, we continue to see 30 ish thousand site
sessions a month. So people use the site as a shopping tool. We have all the ApeCoin staking
data, all the matched asset metadata on your matched mutants, uh, dogs, et cetera,
all within the shopping experience. And so it's a really high quality user experience.
The, the, the marketplace and really all marketplaces other than Blur today don't have market fit
because most volume is driven by traders who are to some degree farming rewards on Blur.
Um, and that's just kind of the unfortunate state of, of, of the, the category.
Um, so with all of that in mind, what we've proposed here is the expansion of this marketplace
to support all assets, not just Yuga assets, but every creator through a kind of horizontal,
horizontal, meaning all creators experience that, um, you know, is equivalent to open sea
on ease of use and enforces royalties on all collections while creating a source of truth,
an on-chain source of truth that's available to all creators via Oracle so that any creator can provide
rewards back to community members in line with what I described previously,
letting only payers access 8th best or only payers get into discord or get access to the next mint,
whatever that may be. Um, and, and so what we're proposing is the creation of that system.
Um, and then also some, some, um, uh, kind of natural funding where Ethereum-based purchases fund
rewards for 8coin-based purchases so that we can drive more 8coin purchasing in the future.
So that's really the, the bones of the proposal. Um, still in a stage of really trying to get
feedback from the community. Um, I'll, I'll be honest, uh, have not been able to get in touch with
Machi in particular. And given that he owns about a third of the vote right now, we're trying to
have a few additional conversations to get feedback before we take that to the final stage.
Thank you. Thank you for sharing that. Uh, we definitely go deeper into it. I just want to,
damn, I haven't seen this for a long time, probably 40 years in the, doing this show. I see two orange
backgrounds next to each other on stage right now. What the hell is happening? This, what, what's going
on today? We need showbiz on. Oh my God. You can request. But I want to welcome the lost,
the hodler collective on stage. What's good. How are you doing today? Super happy to have you here.
Oh God, I'm catching strays left and right this week. I don't know what it is. I,
Sarah told me the Libras were supposed to have fire energy. So I don't know if everybody's a Libra
and everybody's got fire energy and I'm just still kind of tame or if I just need to step it up.
But, uh, I only, yeah, shout out to Beast. Now we got showbiz. It's a party now. It's a real party.
It looks beautiful. What's going on here? I'm feeling threatened a bit guys here,
but I still have that bear snake sound, you know, since we hosted the forgotten runes wizard. So
don't approach me. Don't get any closer. And yeah, let's go.
Oh, showbiz. Also welcome on stage. How are you doing, man? What's good today?
What's up? Grateful. How's it going?
Good to hear you.
You too, man. Man, I'm so happy today. My homie, um, that went to me with me to, um,
Miami for fucking weekend. He picked up an ape sometime during the night.
I'm a Macy. So yeah, man, I'm happy to welcome him to the club, man. You keep onboarding people
into the club. That's amazing. You joined recently and you fucking doing amazing job.
I appreciate it, man. You know, um, Hey, we're all about building and, you know,
just learning from you guys, man, to build our brand out. So I'm excited about the future, man.
I'm, I'm excited. Yeah. Same here. A hundred percent. Uh, guys, one more question. Are you going,
are you actually going to Hong Kong? Uh, people on stage here and in the audience,
give us a sign, thumbs up or down. Uh,
I do have a ticket. Let's go. Let's go.
Nice. Zach, you're going also? I saw thumbs up.
Have a ticket need to book the flight still, but planning on it.
Nice. I mean, the ticket is half of the success already. So it means we all going.
Yeah, man, I was talking, uh, right now for like two minutes and I didn't unmute. So
damn, you missed the alpha too, but can't wait to see you there guys. And let,
let's get back to this, uh, IP idea. Uh,
because like we talk about ApeCoin, especially this week, I feel like the, the ApeCoin is, uh,
really ApeCoin now is really everywhere, you know, because of the Machi proposal,
and there's also Yats proposal and many others. So it's really exciting time actually. Uh, also
tank Ape is giving, uh, ApeCoin, you know, so a lot of stuff is happening. So what do you guys
think, uh, Lost? What do you, what do you think about this AIP? Have you, have you actually read
that or, or do you have any questions?
Yeah, man, I gotta, I feel like I gotta shout out to the, the discourse facilitator team more.
So it's myself, it's Chris, cryptologically and it's 12 gauge. And so whenever you guys put a
proposal in on the forum, we're the team that's reviewing it. We're the ones that are making
sure that the proposal goes through the community discussion stage. It's drafted into the right
process, moves on to the special council. After the council reviews it, we're ensuring it gets
on its way up to vote, coordinating with the administration web slinger. And after the proposal
is approved, ensuring and helping that the community is updated and the authors are receiving
their grants. So I'm following every proposal throughout the entire process. And it's a lot,
it's definitely a full-time job. And you know, now that it is something that is a job for me,
it's easy to recognize how much time it really does take. If you're, you know, making an effort
to pay attention, not just to proposals that are the most interesting to you, but to every proposal
and every proposal that's up to vote, it's a lot. So, um, specifically for zero wagons, zero wagons,
Zach, what's up Zach? Uh, I've, I've read the proposal. I've looked over it. I've talked with Zach and
hopefully we'll, we'll be able to, to get Machi up on these days. If we say Machi's name enough,
he might just appear. If you say like AIP 304 or AIP 304, he might just show up. We might just get
him here now. So I think Twitter's weird like that. But, um, yeah, Zach, I guess like my big
question or like my big thing, just having followed, obviously the, the proposal, the original
proposal, I think it was a 96 and then now the new one. How do I, and I think this is going to be the
biggest question is, is what is your actual plan and not just like, what are some good ideas, but
what is your plan to get people to use this platform? That's literally the million dollar
question as the current request is for a million dollars. Um, so I, I have two responses there.
My plan would be to work with top creators to utilize this royalty enforcement system that's
being built so that they're both enforcing royalties via 721c or any other enforcement
standard. They all work equally well and rewarding users who are paying royalties by utilizing this
royalty enforcement system. And the creators providing those rewards is the thing that will
enable users over to trading and collecting in this new marketplace. Um, my whole experience
is B2B2C that that's the way I think. And it's kind of the type of business problem I am personally
suited to solve. What I am not on my own suited to solve is how do we market this to the broader NFT
community in a way that drives adoption due to enthusiasm. What we're proposing is that we hire a
marketer who's better at solving this problem as part of that proposal. But ultimately what,
what's a little bit broken right now, I'd love to get your thoughts on this is there is no real
mechanic to tap into the ApeCoin community ongoing for promotion. I had initially add language around,
hey, can we do like a weekly retweet, um, from the ApeCoin handle as part of this. And that has already been
requested to get stripped out. And so I'm definitely searching on like, you know,
as the marketing columns working group gets stood up, is that the right place to plug in? How much
juice is that team going to have? But it's, it's definitely not something I have a rock solid
response to, to be honest. Yeah. I don't mean to put you on the spot either. And I'm definitely,
obviously like I'm a big supporter. Yeah. I mean, I've been a big supporter for a long time of,
of what you guys have been building. And obviously you guys are building the solution for different,
other communities and other communities that I'm a part of aside from ApeCoin. So I'm a fan.
I, I feel like what we see in this ecosystem that's successful, and I'm sure a lot of people's
mind go to airdrops, but that's not what I'm thinking. I feel like you have to have a,
like a body of people that are, are well-trusted and are using the platform. And then it's also
the, the, the two bodies of people that you said, right? So it's having the creators that are willing
to come and to list their things on the platform and who are coming and checking in and posting the
links and, Hey, go get my stuff here. But then it's also the people who are making the market,
right? It is the machis. It is the, the Cyrus. It is, you know, all these people we see who are
trading hundreds and thousands of ETH on blur or wherever it is that they're trading every day.
And you have to address, like you have to address all three, right? So you need the creators,
you need the traders, and you do need to collaborate. And not everybody likes to do this,
right? There's some people that came into web three to get away from this,
but you have to collaborate with, with the people that are seen as influential,
the people who have a voice, the people that are trusted. And it's not just about,
oh, I need an influencer to pump my shit. You need people that are trusted to use your platform,
or people are not going to connect their wallet. And people are fatigued on platforms,
so they're not even going to visit the site to even have the opportunity to visit
and connect their wallet or not. So I, I'm not sure who exactly, you know, is, is the,
the spokesperson for each of those groups or where exactly would be the right place to get started.
I have some ideas and I'm sure you do too, but I, I would, you know, I would, I would lean into,
you know, those three pools of people, as far as getting support for the, for the platform,
just as a consumer, I think those are the three main pools that I see that really drive performance
anywhere. I love that. I may personally push that the, the trader audience is never going
to use the platform the way it's being described. And so it's, if I like that, that was all awesome
feedback. I'd say it's, it's based on what you just shared. It's get the creators lined up,
but it's also get the core community of collectors lined up. Maybe that's the Yuga board that is now
in place, like Josh Ong and Miami Ape and all of them, but really good thinking there.
I don't want to, I don't want to grill you too much on it, but yeah, I mean, I think,
I think there's a lot of people that are, that want to see something like this.
And I do think it's important to have the traders there, right? If you don't have the
people who are spending money, we're not really going to be able to support the creators. They're
just going to have a pretty platform to list all their stuff and nobody buying it. So we definitely
have to have both sides of that, that equation.
Yeah, a hundred percent. The only issue for me is that I, I barely list anything since 2021,
you know, so I don't have much experience in this selling NFTs, right? Metazic in the audience.
Yeah. He's the witness. He saw that.
So, uh, yeah, I, I, I agree that we also need the traders.
It's definitely not me, but it doesn't mean that it's not, not important for the marketplace.
Right. Uh, what about a Yuga? What about if they decide to build their own marketplace?
Right. Like we, uh, I, you know, there, there's a little name, uh, called Agora, right?
We don't know if it's going to be also marketplace for something else than, than, uh, other side.
So what do you think about it? What's going on with this pro with this proposal? If Yuga decides,
Hey, we are building our own marketplace or what do you even think about the idea?
Uh, do you think they, they gotta do it?
So I, I know nothing here is the first thing I would say, but my thinking is that they're focused on an in-game marketplace and that that in-game marketplace would likely include all Yuga assets, but not certainly include them.
Um, and, and, and, and, and what makes me think that is just that their, their corporate strategy is gaming based at this point.
And back to what I was saying on the SEC component earlier, um, I, this is entirely made up on my end.
I'm filling in a lot of blanks based on what I, I, I know to be true, but my, my thinking would be that, uh, there's more, uh, kind of case law in place around that in-game experience.
It's very comparable to like the steam marketplace for, for existing games and digital asset purchasing.
And so I, that, that, that, that's kind of my gut is that that's what they're building towards and that they're likely will be a competitor from them that's in metaverse in the not too distant future.
Um, but that, that competitor wouldn't extend to the, the, the more traditional NFT purchasing use case.
I don't know if any of this is accurate though, and it's lack of clarity on what Yuga is thinking right now that candidly causes me to, to pause and, and consider our next steps here.
Because if they are not excited about this system we're building, it's not set up for success.
There, there's too much that's contingent on adoption from top creators right now.
Um, you know, there, there's an alternative version where we go and request $50 million in funding.
For tokenomics and we go compete head to head with blur.
And, and to me, that's personally the only way I see us competing for trading volume is to go secure, meaningful tokenomic funding.
Um, but I would love to hear any new or different thinking from folks.
People like airdrops, people like airdrops.
I know we talked and I, I shared, you know, some of my thoughts and some of the people in the community, I, I think that are, are smarter than me.
Everybody who have insight to these things.
If we're talking airdrops, I mean, maybe, maybe it's time.
Is it time?
We just have, I was, I've been watching optimism and they just had another airdrop hit their ecosystem.
And the way that it was set up is they hit all the people who delegated from, I think it was January to June or January to March of this year.
So everybody who delegated during that time, it delegated their optimism tokens to somebody in the ecosystem.
If, if you were somebody who delegated your tokens, you received an airdrop.
Um, so is it time?
Are we there?
Just, are we, are we talking about another airdrop?
Is that, is that, are you the one to bring it to us?
Zach, what's up?
What, what I can say is that Snag is not ready to tokenize.
Um, and I can point at two competitors that I, I, I feel like we're in process of putting out of business, Rarible and Origin Story, who tokenize too early and they have little control of their, their ecosystem.
And not a ton of ability to invest in building the right things based on, on partner requests.
They're, they're too distracted and spread thin, right?
Like the, the, the whole progressive decentralization playbook, it's about building to market fit prior to decentralization.
It's why I don't think Blur will be a long-term winner.
They missed that step in the playbook.
And as these token rewards dissipate, there's going to be a new tokenized competitor that's going to be right there to eat up market share.
So, so I'm not a huge fan of that opportunity at this point in time.
Um, would I request, I have an old version of this proposal that requests 20 million ApeCoin to fund token rewards.
Like, does another ApeCoin-based token allocation and airdrop help get us there?
I love that concept.
I don't think the community is likely to vote for it based on current voting behavior for high price point initiatives.
But, uh, that, that's one I'm actually pretty excited about.
Yeah.
Uh, as Lo said, you know, we love airdrops, especially the one from MetaMask, right?
I've been waiting for it like 84 years now.
Uh, OpenSea, there was also the rumor.
Uh, yeah, I don't know, where is it?
I checked my wallets, nothing there.
So, hopefully, hopefully we get there one day.
But it's been, uh, it's been a while.
I don't know what you think, guys, but it's crazy.
Yeah, we love, we love airdrops.
Just the tricky part on airdrops is that I don't know how long can people stay loyal.
I mean, we, we saw it with Luxray, right?
Like, everyone was using Luxray, everyone was excited about, but once the rewards were gone, I don't know if anyone is still using that.
Oh, this hurts, man.
I stay there.
I stay there a lot, bro.
You still have everything, right?
Yeah.
You're not selling anything, so.
It's like $10 now, but it was much more.
Oh, my God.
And do you remember SOS and all this stuff that we got back in the day?
Oh, my God.
Of course I do remember, man.
Yeah, this hurts.
It was fucking wild.
This hurts.
I think, Beast, maybe it's gonna be better if you jump into that Twitter picker and let's, let's pick the winners of that giveaway.
So, last chance, guys, if you want to get bonus pack, there's a pinned tweet.
You just retweet, comment what is your forge capacity, tag a friend, and we will have three winners.
So, there's a big chance, actually, to win.
So, you don't have to clean after your heavy metal.
You know, you will get a clean slate and much more.
So, go in there.
And, meanwhile, guys, what are you most excited these days?
You know, because timeline is kind of strange these days.
So, what are you most bullish these days?
You know, what really makes you pumped from Web3?
I would stay in Web3.
I'm bullish on major brands innovating on Web3 Rails in ways that are authentic to their brands.
Coming back to Adidas, I almost think they were the first ones to authentically enter Web3.
And, you know, the staying power of their efforts in Web3, I think, are a testament to the way that they set themselves up.
And I think we'll see a lot more of that in the next few months.
Rolling Loud is another one that we're really excited about where they're building with the NFTs as a lifetime festival pass with obvious utility at the center of their ecosystem.
So, I think more of those authentic use cases.
Man, what was their secret sauce to actually achieve that, right?
Today, I just wore those superstars.
It was called Punks Comic, G-Money, and BAYC, right?
So, they're doing a really good job.
Like, I know that the burn phase just ended, right, for the previous iteration one and two.
So, what makes them different from the other companies that tried and failed?
The first thing I'll say is on their marketing strategy.
They didn't just buy Artifact, Nike.
And they authentically partnered, they purchased an ape, they spent time building up the lore of Indigo Herz, right?
Like, they played in the way that Web3 creators were communicating and marketing at the time, upstream from everything they've done since.
And then second, they've really tied in utility on access to unique drops, merch, et cetera, to the product in a way that makes sense for Adidas versus, again, not to shit talk Nike too much here today, but I have a Clone X and all it gives me access to is to purchase Air Force Ones that are more expensive than Air Force Ones that I can purchase normally, right?
And sure, they're like slightly customized, but they haven't actually provided real value to holders yet.
And so, I think Adidas is thinking about how they do that in an authentic way that makes sense for their business.
You know what's really interesting?
And I think that was a great point, right?
They bought an ape, right?
And they actually weren't scared to actually connect the claim.
I think we claimed something through actually their official...
We actually connected TokenProof, right, to the official Adidas app to actually buy the sneakers.
And they really had balls to do that, right?
Like, some companies, I think also Porsche, they didn't even tell their customers about there's got to be NFT, right?
They had two separate groups, like NFT Group, Web3 Digents, and their customers.
So, they really pushed it through that.
And in Czech Republic here, the app was in Czech language, and I saw the TokenProof connection in Czech, you know?
So, they really put a lot of work.
Like, it was really impressive, and I showed it to many friends.
Also, the fact that they bought the ape is amazing because, you know, with IP,
and I talk to a lot of people from distributors and production companies, you know,
they're asking, what is this ape?
And I'm like, hey, look at Adidas, they bought one, and it makes my life so much easier.
So, amazing.
Yeah, they really did a good job, man.
And the ape is blue, I don't know.
It's a really nice color.
I have to, you know, lost, I agree, it's an amazing choice.
It's probably the second best after pink, but yeah, let's move on.
Showbiz, I see your hand, go ahead.
So, the first thing I'm bullish about is these four ape orange backgrounds in the room.
Let's fucking go.
So, that's an easy one.
Oh, man.
I'm also bullish about all the tech that's being built in this space, man.
You know, blockchain technology, NFTs, you know, or if you want to say digital collectibles,
because I love having ownership of all the assets.
You know, in a Web 2 game, you don't own the assets because you stop playing that game,
you lose all that money you invested into it.
So, yeah, man, I love all the technology that's building.
And I just love, you know, everyone that's utilizing their IP to, you know, build a brand, build their product.
You know, I was in a space yesterday with Bored Munchies.
And, you know, he took his ape and made a new mascot that's actually kid-friendly, you know,
and the snacks that he's building and are make, producing, and he has plans for more kid-friendly stuff.
So, I just love what people are doing in this space, you know, and I want to be part of that.
I want to build a brand, too.
You know, that's why I'm in these spaces, to learn, connect with people, you know, and build.
Absolutely love that showbiz.
And you mentioned two amazing areas.
IP, right?
We see you guys pushing it a lot.
There's going to be that open club in Hong Kong.
I actually bought tickets.
I don't know if I did it right or wrong, because there's going to be definitely overlay with AM Fest events.
But I did, because I want to see it.
And I believe that's going to be definitely big.
And gaming, man, with the Rec League, that's insane.
Like, the game is so addictive.
Like, it's insane.
I know there are some issues with Layer 1, etc., you know.
But the game is fun.
That's really important.
So, more and more games will be coming.
So, really exciting times, man.
Thank you so much for sharing.
Definitely.
Definitely.
Man, I saw the boat yesterday, the yacht.
I don't know.
That thing looks huge, bro.
Oh, that's lost.
Yacht, you know.
He probably invite us there.
I don't know.
Oh, okay.
No, I'm kidding, man.
I'm kidding.
You can't trust me.
You can't trust me here.
Man, I don't know, man.
He just needs further gas now, right?
That's why he's asking about airdrops.
Oh, man.
That's funny.
Yeah, man.
Great points, Showbiz.
Man, we always love to have you here.
Also, I really love how you got into the club.
It was wild.
You know, Monday, he bought a mutant.
Friday, he was on Fuck It weekend.
Crazy.
What a start.
And now, hopefully, in Hong Kong.
So, absolutely love that.
Lost, what are you excited about?
These crazy days in the Web 3.
I'm, like, contractually obliged here.
I got to say the ApeCoin Dow, right?
I have to shout out to the Dow.
I didn't expect that, but nice surprise, and I loved it, man.
Yeah, I'm sure you didn't expect it.
Now, when you see me, I mean, I hope you know I'm coming.
I'm going to talk about the Dow at some point.
I'm going to hit you with something positive or encouraging.
We had a rocky start.
It was rough.
I don't think it's gotten any, you know, easier in terms of optics from what the community
is seeing.
But as far as process and as far as when you get in there and you start, you know, getting
into your idea, you get into a little bit of work.
You get into meeting the community.
You start to, you know, build something.
You get a little momentum.
There's a lot of support.
There are a lot of community members in the ApeCoin Dow.
It's exciting.
It's early Board Ape Yacht Club vibes.
It's not only for Board Ape Yacht Club members.
And I'm bullish.
I mean, what can I say?
I'm bullish on the community.
There's a lot of people in that community that are willing to help.
There's a lot of people in that community with expertise that I would never personally
have access to in my normal life.
They would never talk to me if I wasn't here.
So I'm bullish on that.
Love it, man.
Thank you so much.
And, you know, the community, that's the word.
But it's not only about the Yuga community and BYC Mutants, but I see so many amazing people
in the audience, you know, with PFPs like Payman, Jesus, or Jesus, you know, either animation,
Trave.
Anyway, we are in this together and we have to push it together to the next level.
And I know a lot of you guys are working really, really hard.
So cheers to that.
Beast, what do you think?
What are you excited about?
Except your background, man.
Easy, man.
Bullish on people.
Except your background.
I know it's a cliche, but I'm fucking bullish on people because if you're here right now
doing this market, it really means that you believe in something bigger.
You believe in the technology.
You believe in, you know, building communities and owning the assets, owning the IP.
So, yeah, I mean, we're in this together, you know, we're going to make it through this
market.
The best way to make it through is to do stuff, you know, not just wait, but keep building
and keep being active.
So the same thing.
That's why I'm here, man.
I'm bullish on people.
Yeah, man.
100, 100 percent, especially in this market.
Like what's happening?
I think it's really amazing.
Like all the builders and because the noise is gone, it's more actually more time to connect
with other people.
So love it.
I'm actually working on IP.
I already announced that it's going to be like a window that you type your ape number
and it will change the background to Aquamarine.
So, yeah, I need to talk to SSP, but we, oh my God, thumbs down.
I'm canceled now.
No, I'm kidding.
We love all the backgrounds, all the fur colors, everything.
I was just kidding, but you know that.
Yeah.
What a great show, Beast.
If you can tweet or X the winners, pin them up.
I'll do it, yeah.
I'll say the winners right now and I tweet it out so that we have it there.
Are you ready?
Yeah, go for that.
I need some song for that, man.
Holy shit.
You're not ready.
Holy shit.
I mean, come on.
I cannot just announce the winners.
Yes, much better.
So, the winner number one is Medajay.
Let's go.
Seconds, BAC4.
Let's go.
Michael, Michael Lichman.
Let's go, baby.
Congratulations, everyone.
And yes, let's fucking go.
You don't have to clean the mess.
Let's fucking go.
Let's go.
Love it.
I will DM you guys.
So, you know, check.
Pink A, but Aquamarine Background is going to DM you and no one else.
So, just be careful with the scammers because it's possible.
It's crazy in this space.
And Cryptozack, do you have anything else that we maybe forget to ask that you would like to share with us?
Because I absolutely enjoy all the alpha, all the knowledge that you share with us and all the stuff that you're doing.
So, definitely want to see the first marketplaces made by creators.
You don't want to see that, how it looks, how it's integrated into their website, everything.
So, go ahead, man.
Whatever you want to share.
Yeah, I'll just show a couple links at the end here with that in mind.
One, we have our new self-serve marketplace product that we just launched.
And that's available at get.snagsolutions.io.
And any creator can go stand up their own marketplace, customize that, and link that into their site in just a few minutes.
So, please check that out, share any feedback.
And then to highlight one of our creator partners, Duncan from the Ape community, launched, I think, our first self-serve marketplace for Gyronauts just the other day.
That's his charity-focused project that's directly funding charitable contributions based on mint proceeds.
So, you can check that out at marketplace.gyronauts.com or just check out their Gyronauts handle and you can learn more about their project.
But it's a good example of what creators can get stood up in just a few minutes.
That's amazing.
I'm going to pin, actually, your tweet about V2 and how people can join.
It's going to stick even to the recording.
And if you're listening to the podcast recording, it's going to be in the description so you can try it out.
I believe it's free for now, right?
So, people can try that for free.
Spot on.
Let's go.
So, Beast, go ahead.
I will find the tweet and pin it up there.
Big thank you, Zach.
First of all, I fucking love it that we, it's so interesting, you know, like we, I think we completed a mission.
We went through, we went through the, how to, what to do to enforce or at least to get closer to enforcing royalties because royalties are the backbones of the Web3.
I mean, I still believe there's going to be a way at some point to make it somehow, to make sure that artists and creators will be rewarded based on that initial 2021 vision.
But, yeah, I'm happy that we, we're slowly trying to find and finding the solutions.
And I'm happy, Zach, that you're staying on the forefront and pushing it forward.
So, big thank you for that.
And big thank you, everyone.
On Thursday, we're actually going to be having garden caretakers.
We're going to talk about Azuki and Beans building around their IP.
So, I'm super curious about that because we often, or almost most of the time.
Often, man.
Yeah, we always.
We talk about apes and mutants, what they do with all their, what they do with their PFPs.
But we're going to explore what Azuki and Beans are building with their PFPs.
So, I'm fucking pumped for that.
So, if you guys want to join us, join us on Thursday.
Let's go.
And, guys, I pinned a tweet.
You can check it out.
Also, follow our guests on stage.
All are legends.
So, big thank you for listening.
It's always fun.
I love my best days are Tuesday, Thursday, Thursdays and Saturdays.
And, of course, thank Ape spaces whenever they are, you know, with the lost.
We had so much fun hosting them.
So, maybe there's going to be another one.
We'll see.
But, definitely also check thank Ape too because there's, I think, 25,000 of ApeCoin in prices or rewards.
Let's be more specific.
So, amazing opportunities, guys.
Also, check ApeCoin.
You know, yeah, I'm feeling like we're shilling a lot.
But, I think, you know, it's important.
Always remind.
Check it out, guys.
It makes sense.
And, yeah, definitely check Cryptozack and Snake Solution if you are an artist creator.
I think, what's the best way, actually, to reach out to you, man, Cryptozack?
Is it a DM?
Okay.
DMs are open.
Always here to hear from folks.
And, thanks, grateful folks, for having me up today.
It's been a blast.
And, looking forward to joining next year when we're firmly back in the bull run to chat royalties in 2024.
Let's go, 100%.
See you in Hong Kong.
Can't wait to see you there, guys.
It's going to be epic.
Oh, my God.
I cannot wait.
I'm super pumped that we talk, actually, about how creators can think about the royalties, what they can do.
I think it's super important to talk about it because, you know, if you mint on a probably wrong ERC, you know, your life in the future can be much harder.
So, think about it.
If you have any questions, DM Cryptozack.
Thank you so much.
Lost showbiz, Cryptozack, Beast, for today's show.
It was epic.
Thank you, everyone, for listening.
And, congrats to the winners.
Oh, my God.
You will have such a great bonus packs.
I will DM you right now after the show.
And, yeah.
Beast, do we have anything else to add?
I just love the statement, Zach, did that see you next year during the bull run.
That sounds fucking epic.
Sounds bullish to me, man.
I think we will have to clap our hands to that.
So, you know what's coming right now.
Have a great Tuesday, everybody.
Definitely check the proposals, AIPs.
There are some crazy ones.
So, if you haven't voted yet, go there, vote.
Change the future of ApeCoinDAO by voting and being active.
And, I think now it's time for clapping our hands.
So, have a great Tuesday.
And, let's pump it, baby.
Oh, my God.
Definitely not this song.
Definitely not.
What's happening?
One more try.
Oh, yeah.
This is the better one.
Let's go, everybody.
Let's fucking go.
Thank you, everyone.
Everybody.
Just clap their hands.
Just clap their hands, everybody.
Come on.
Come on.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Come on, y'all.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Say, I'm not tired.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Clap your hands.
Let's go, everybody.
Thank you so much for listening.
This was great for show 199.
See you on Thursday, guys.
Let's go.
