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$HBAR Open Mic - Kabiplaza #120 🎙️
Recorded: June 12, 2025 Duration: 1:02:51Space Recording
Short Summary
In a recent discussion, crypto enthusiasts explored the exciting developments within the Hedera ecosystem, including the launch of innovative tokenized products, strategic partnerships enhancing user accessibility, and the potential for HBAR-backed ETFs to attract institutional investors. The conversation highlighted the ongoing growth and infrastructure improvements that position Hedera as a competitive player in the blockchain space.
Full Transcription
Thank you. See you next time. Thank you. so so
so music Hey everyone, how are you guys?
Welcome everybody, I hope you're all doing super well.
As you will see today we have a different host, Neu is having some days off.
He's gonna be the whole week resting, so yeah I'm gonna be taking the lead today.
Again I hope you're all doing very well, welcome to another Cavi Plaza. This is a 120.
It's been a while since the first one, you know, the first one, you know, started by Jack and me.
So I can't believe it's already 120 Cavi plazas. I mean, we're going to keep doing them.
So as you know, we host these spaces every week for the HBAR community to connect, discuss news,
get a pulse in the ecosystem, and of course, spotlight all the HBAR builders and creators in this
ecosystem. So let's get some more people, let's see we're getting some more people
in the space. Of course if you can help by liking, by reposting, you can comment
below so we can get, we can spread the word of this space and we will start in in a few seconds by the way Brandon I know what
happened I'm gonna give you access again okay all right here you are. Perfect. Okay, so, well, first of all, welcome to all the co-speakers.
Patrick, hope you're doing well. How is everything going on Earthlings? By the way, I've seen,
well, we will get to that, but I've seen some very, very nice sneak peeks.
Oh, it's going to be a very nice sneak peek end of the show, I think.
So, I'm not going to say anything
about it. You'll see.
I'll post it above.
I need to wait a little bit
because someone else is also
showing something. So I'll wait
a little bit and then I'll post the extended
version in this Kabila space
on top, okay?
Definitely. I can't wait, man. I can't wait to see that.
Brandon, how is it going? how's everything going on your side it's good exciting week um for putting all the stuff together for
my show tomorrow i have some really good interviews i have one with a team yield fx
that's doing tokenized deposits um which is essentially a competitor to stablecoins. It's a different
way of doing fiat on chain. And of course, we've seen what's happened with stablecoins,
not just on Hedera, but of course, the broader stablecoin ecosystem is what, at a quarter
trillion dollars at this point. So, you know, there's obviously a massive market for that kind
of stuff. So excited to see what YieldFX is
doing. I also have an interview with Andrew, who was with the Hashgraph Association, is now with
Valor. And Valor is an ETP ETF issuer, was the first one to issue an ETF on Hedera. They actually
have three products now. And I was surprised because I remember when I first saw that ETF launch, I checked it after a few months.
And I don't know, it was like at $40,000 or $60,000 or something like that.
And I was like, oh, well, you know, that was a bust.
I didn't realize that now it's up to, and this was just last year.
So it wasn't that long ago that this launch, it's up over between the three ETPs that they have is over $12 million. So I know, you know,
it's been kind of a grind. That's not a huge number compared to the Bitcoin ETFs out there.
But, you know, it's always been that shift from some of these foreign products to the United
States when we see huge run ups. But the fact that we're starting to see that demand in those
initial products is fantastic. And of course, last week I had Duncan Moyer on from 21 shares. He's going to have that as well. And it looks like everything's
in a really good place for those HBAR-backed ETFs to hit here in the United States this year. So
I think that's going to bring in a new class of investor to the HBAR space. And we could see some
really interesting developments as we go into the end of the year as far as the market.
And then, of course, there's all kinds of cool retail stuff going on.
We have Wild Tigers, which is doing really well, an NFT project in the Hedera ecosystem.
We had the Mouth team docks this week.
That was exciting to see as well.
And I have plenty of other stuff that I want to cover, but that's enough for now.
Oh, definitely, man.
I am starting to get, you know,
track of all the things that are happening in the ecosystem.
So good to have you here, man,
to remind us, you know,
what is everything that's going on on Adera.
Lian, how's it going, man?
How's it going at Import?
Bro, it's wonderful to hear your voice.
So unusual to hear it on kabila open mic i know
that you're often lurking in the audience but it's really nice to have you as a host
and i think new is having a much needed break which is cool um i'm okay i'm i'm experiencing
some intense burnout at the moment because i've as many of you know i've been djing for 17 years
and recently gave that up and it actually actually is unbelievable, the dip in energy.
It's like every time I think that I've gotten through the burnout,
then there's like another layer of exhaustion that just hits me,
looks it up on AI, and it said it can take anywhere from six to 12 weeks
to recover from this kind of burnout.
So I'm trying to pace myself, but we've got a lot going on,
lots of cool stuff happening.
Keen to get into that with you in a bit.
But I just wanted to bounce back to Brandon quick before we move on to everyone else, going on lots of cool stuff happening keen to get into that with you in a bit but um i just
wanted to bounce back to brandon quick before we move on to everyone else because uh did i i don't
know if you mentioned it brandon you cut out for a bit when you were talking there but i see that
the i see an article that says the sec did delay the decision for polka dot and hedera etfs um
if i missed what you said and you touched on that please let me
know but I would love to hear if that is legitimate and what your opinion on that is that's very normal
that you would see a delay like that the main person that I follow for this and I actually
didn't interview him about with him about hbar ETFs is a gentleman named Eric Balkunas. And he follows the ETF space,
the broad ETF space, not just crypto, really closely. And he still has HBAR at a 90 or an
80% chance of getting approved this year. So it getting delayed isn't surprising.
So it getting delayed isn't surprising.
The thing that we saw with Solana, so there's two portions that need to be filed or a set of documents that need to be filed for an ETF to eventually get listed.
The first one is the S1.
That's what we see from the issuers itself.
We've seen those from both Canary.
That's been a big one that a lot of people have been excited about for Hedera and HBAR.
And then the other one is Grayscale. So we all know Grayscale from the B—excuse me, frog in my throat—from all of the Bitcoin products that they've put out.
The second one is actually put out by the exchange, in this case NASDAQ, and that's called a 19B4.
In this case, NASDAQ, and that's called a 19B4. Both of those have been filed for HBAR. But the second one was filed, the 19B4, in February, February 24th of this year, where Solana was filed, I believe, about a month before.
So the fact that we're seeing Solana get requests for updated S1s, which is usually something that happens a few weeks before the ETF gets listed, that's not surprising.
So we're kind of a month behind where Solana is.
So if we go by what Eric is saying, he thinks that it's possible that we could get Solana as early as July.
So then we could be looking at HBAR maybe in August or September, sometime in that time frame.
I really think it could be an impetus.
It could be a catalyst for alt-seizing.
You know, Bitcoin has had this at their back for some time.
And, you know, it's time for the altcoins to get the same thing.
And I think this is going to be possibly that catalyst to do it.
Oh, and I can't believe, hold on. Before before I move on I was looking at my list here I didn't
even mention what happened with the Accenture right so Equity Lab we know
about how they're embedding Hedera technology into their chips and
that's I'm sorry Equity Lab is doing it in collaboration with NVIDIA
and Intel. And the question is, is who's actually going to use this once these products start
coming out? Well, we got one of those answers. One of their first customers and collaborators
is going to be Accenture, which is a huge company out of Ireland. I think they had
$65 billion worth of revenue last year um and that would put them
if they were in the united states at 61 on the fortune 500 list so another really exciting
development but i know we we were talking about etfs there but i saw that on my list and i can't
believe i forgot it right amazing cheers for that and then uh i mean just to touch on what you said
about maybe it could start the bull run ironically i'm not so down for solana etf because i really don't care
about solana however i think if anything is going to start the bull run it's a solana etf so if
that's going to happen first i think that's actually going to be more beneficial for the
hbar etf after that than if hbar was actually before because there aren't that many eyes on
hbar do you know what i mean but i think if Solana goes first and then HBAR after that,
I think people will be watching very closely.
What do you think about that?
So last year, and I will get to your question in particular,
but I saw last year when it seemed very clear.
Again, Eric Balkunas was saying the Bitcoin ETF is almost a done deal.
It was sitting right there at about like 75% and then 80% and so forth. And just seeing odd things happen in the market,
like Bitcoin going down or, you know, and it had a good year last year, but it just seemed a little
bit odd. I'm sorry, this is going back to 2023. And just seeing odd things in the market, I'm like,
I bet there are entities out there that
are screwing with this market because they are acquiring in anticipation for these ETFs to get
approved. I feel the same way about alts right now. I think there's some, you know, we know that
the crypto markets with, you know, a lot of these shady exchanges and everything else and shady
entities that are trading in these markets,
they'll push these markets around to get the best prices they possibly can. And I think there's
some of that going on in the alt space right now. That market's being pushed around. Odd things are
happening. Things are going down, even with great news. I mean, Polymarket getting integrated into
X, absolutely huge news. And I think since that time, Matic, or now I think it's POL, is actually down, which is crazy to me.
We see this stuff with Accenture.
We saw Arrow hit the market with Hedera, and HBAR is down.
I'm not worried about that kind of stuff at all.
And, you know, yes, Solana is going to be the first one,
but then there's going to be these other individually backed ETFs,
and then there's going to be basketed ETFs that are going to follow right after that. And it's going to be these other individually backed ETFs. And then there's going to be a basket at ETFs that are going to follow right after that.
And it's going to be like a clean slate.
I'm going to talk about this in my show tomorrow, but it's a clean slate for a new crop of
investors that don't have the normal altcoin or crypto biases that we see.
They're going to look at these ETFs.
They're going to look at the networks that are behind these ETFs, and they're going to make their own conclusions.
They're going to see the things that are being developed in the Hedera ecosystem.
They're going to see, you know, the benefits we know about Hedera, you know, the ABFT security, the time to finality, the fair ordering, which leads to no MEV.
And, of course, we have exchanges being built on Hedera,
like what we're seeing coming out of the Kenyan Digital Exchange. Of course, that's from Hedera
Governing Council member Nairobi Securities Exchange, things like that. And I think it's
going to resonate with a lot of these new potential participants in this market that we haven't seen
before. They're going to look at it with fresh eyes.
They're going to be older investors that have had their brokerage accounts for years. They're going
to look at these things and they're going to say, you know what, this resonates with me. I understand
this. And I think that, you know, it could be a renaissance for the HBAR as well.
Yeah, I mean, I really hope that. Even if, you know, i i don't care when but if this year we get
you know finally that hrydf approved i think you know it's going to be a big big milestone so
you know where whenever it's coming uh we need that kind of investment as well so yeah i really
look forward to it um equwa, how are you doing?
How is everything going?
Hey, Manu, good to hear your voice, bro.
We don't get to talk to you very often.
So, yeah, it's a cool change, you know, to have you on your call.
Yeah, all good on my end.
Pretty busy week at work.
So, yeah, been going through the works on that yeah but yeah
really nice to be here as always excited for the conversations excited for the open mic
Patrick dropped the news that there's going to be a couple reveals by the end of the space so
now I'm super excited to see what comes up yeah and how And how about you, Manu? How you been?
How's your health?
How's the family?
Well, man, I mean, good to see you as well.
Like, all good on our side.
Busy.
You know, when things are growing, you get more busy, I would say.
Now I'm dealing with a lot more, you know, managing stuff.
You know, I used to like more working on product, more working more, you know, managing stuff. You know, I used to like more working on product,
more working on, you know, community things.
But now I'm, you know, the Kavila team has been growing.
We're now like 13, 14 people.
So I'm trying to manage the whole thing, you know, trying to scale things up are always, it's always challenging.
But I'm doing very well.
I'm excited.
I am, you know, i'm not like that like i'm not
following the news and the ecosystem as much as i did like because again now it's hard for me to
you know to follow up with all the news good that i have you know the random videos every week um
but i am very bullish at least from the development side you know what we are saying in terms of
infrastructure being developed on edera and projects joining the ecosystem,
I think I'm very optimistic on that.
I think we are seeing a lot of new stuff,
a lot of infrastructure that we didn't have in the last bull run.
And if this year, you know, we have an old season
or we have, you know, a good cycle,
I think we're going to see a lot of that, you know,
coming into light, coming into, you know, a lot of that stuff, you know, getting out there in the real world.
I think we're also going to see a lot more web to adoption, like some of the frictions that we
were having are finally being, you know, solved. So yeah, we're building, we are, you know,
creating some new stuff on Kabila that, you know, we cannot talk about it yet.
But we are definitely always, as you know, we're always building and very optimistic and very excited about this year and years to come.
So, man, yeah, good to see you.
I think we also have here the ruler.
Man, how is it going?
It's been a while as well.
Yes, sir.
Manu.
Man, I'm at work, but I heard you were on Spaces today doing the hosting.
So I'm like, you know what?
I cannot miss this opportunity.
I got to come up on stage.
It's like Jeff Bezos or Mark Zuckerberg hosting.
You got to come up and say hi.
And also, bro, what is this?
When did English become your first language?
For those of you listening, Manuel was speaking like, I don't know,
two, three years ago.
And, you know, he had a little accent.
But now it sounds like, bro, you're like a native speaker.
This is absolutely incredible.
This is the biggest, biggest progression I've seen, man.
You're, man, you sound absolutely great, brother.
So whatever you're doing, it's working.
Please keep going.
And I appreciate that a lot.
Like it's been, I used to, I lived one year in the States, in California,
but that was like 10 years ago.
And now, you know, it's hard to me to practice every day.
So I really appreciate those words, man.
I really appreciate it.
We have here someone from Smackem.
Good to see you.
I don't know if we have one there.
It has to be.
Hey, it's Joe.
Yeah.
How's it going, man?
Hey, man.
Good to hear your voice.
Yeah, Joey.
All right.
All right, man.
How is it going?
How is everything going?
It's good.
It's a day full of excitement and announcements for us, but just in general, it's good.
Brandon nailed it on the head. So much good news, so many exciting things, and price goes down. So I just,
I don't even worry about that, but just keep building, watching Kabila build amazing things
with an amazing team. So just happy to be here, happy to be in this space. And I'm actually going to try to get out and touch some grass and pavement
while you guys are chatting.
And I'll jump back in if I feel like there's anywhere for me to put something insightful in.
Definitely, Joey.
I mean, so glad to hear you, man.
And yes, we have that same you know philosophy like we just keep
building uh we know we are in the right place so you know we just keep building more and more and
um i i think this year we'll see a lot of you know those results coming so it's coming um so
i wanted to ask you patrick you know what what what is what is coming you know the next two three months i i whenever i see the images from the game whenever i see you know, what is coming, you know, the next two or three months? Whenever I see the
images from the game, whenever I see, you know, some of the stuff you're building, like, I just
can't wait. Like, I used to do a lot of video games before. But, you know, having like video
games with real ownership where, you know, with real community, you know, assets, I mean, I can't
wait. How is it going? And what can we expect, you know, in the i can't wait how is it going and what can we expect you
know in the in the next weeks and months yeah so the the main focus now was it was also a bit
by the community decided that we open up the city first so that's coming we're going to post you
something on the jumbo tron in a bit towards the end of this show where you can see we're also
working very hard on game the gaming side and i think you're gonna love the the quality there as well because we don't want to under
deliver on on gaming so after this um because the well let's get back to that at the end of the show
because more more explicit gaming is what i'm working on now and fine tuning as well. But you'll understand what I mean when we show at the end of the show
what I'm posting.
So, yeah, the coming months, it's just the first years,
it's actually just visualizing, conceptualizing,
building all the assets of this immense world.
And now the last few months, we're putting it all together.
But it is still a big build.
And, of course I
see people I hear and see people thinking it's it's too big it's it's
impossible and actually I think it's good that some people say that because
they see the immense job that we are doing we also have a big team like like
you have as well and being naive about it um
that's actually the wrong approach but we're still building we have an amazing team we're getting
there we we have some amazing plans to also um do gaming well no no i'm gonna say too much there but
um yeah we're still we're still building on I promise we'll be building the whole year.
We're not going anywhere.
That's my word that I can give you here.
And we're hoping to open up the city soon for the community
to already get the feel of the whole world.
And meanwhile, we'll also be building up the Europe map.
But I think what I see and hear is that, of course,
and I know that, is that gameplay now is something
that people really want to see.
So that's what I'm focusing on a lot now,
while also building the whole world out.
I can wait, man.
At least from the visual side, the aesthetic side, it's, I mean,
I just want to be there in that world.
So now I just want to see more
on the mechanic side, like on the
gaming side. And we hear that.
The community is asking for that, of course, and we
see that. But the thing is, you can't
build this quality that we want
to... I'll show you a snippet
at the end. Well, not a snippet, but I'll
show you the quality that we're making at the show you a snippet on at the end well not a snippet but i'll show you
the quality that we're making at the end of the show so just that is not clickbait for people to
stay in the show because they can watch it after as well but the the game needs to be of the same
quality of course as the world we are building and and that's um that's not something that you
do in three days people don't expect um blizzard Blizzard or Epic Games to build an amazing game in a few weeks.
And I think everyone who would think that we can deliver everything,
and we always communicated in the community as well,
that we're going to open up in phases, of course,
because the whole thing that we're building is so immense.
But the thing is, when we release everything it's
going to be so epic and it's going to be one of the first web 3 games with the look and feel that
we everyone just wants in in web 3 and that that's something that i spoke about um in another show as
well because what you see um now in in web 3 sometimes people are a bit spoiled in a way that what happens a lot is that a
millionaire comes to goes to a game studio that has a team of 60 70 people whatever and says build
me a trailer build me some with some gameplay and and I just need to launch it fast I don't care
about it's being the best game ever but i want it to look
amazing and i want it to look like the game is ready so that's what they do they pump in two
million and that's what you see on these other bigger change where there's a lot of retail and
they they they show the the trailer a few months later they show the the gameplay like it's already
uh ready they make a lot of money on the on the tokens and on the nft sales and then they go live and then the game slowly dies out because
I always say it's it's just a slash from a to z where you can't die you you rake up a lot of nfts
and but then it's okay because they were not a rock between brackets because they delivered a game but
fun game but to build to get to double their money and unfortunately that's what gave web 3 a bad name among others so yeah that's much more sense in it as
well I see some hands I don't know if that's for me or something else someone
else and after the gaming talk, I have some questions
for you too, by the way, but that's going to be
about Kabila.
Definitely, Patrick. Thanks, man.
Darula, go ahead.
If Impart has a question for Patrick, you can go ahead.
Otherwise, I had a question or statement
for you guys, Kabila.
Liam?
Yeah, I do have. Liam? Probably.
Yeah, I do have a question for Patrick.
Go ahead.
You know, so people think
how are you guys going to achieve that?
It's obviously a reasonable question, I'd say,
although the quality,
every time I see it,
it's just unbelievable
what you guys have achieved
and it gets better and better every time.
It's incredible. And I can tell that you want it to run as well as it
looks that's essentially what you're saying and that got me thinking about like the future of
gaming in terms of servers and performance do you think that that like all all digital experiences
such as gaming are going to be decentralized in terms of their operating capacity?
Are servers going to be decentralized?
Is each player going to dedicate processing power to the games that they play in the future?
Is decentralized gaming going to become a thing anytime soon?
Or do you think we're really decades away from that?
No, actually, I don't think think so I think it's coming it's I think main let's say it like this so the digital euro and dollar
they are coming as well and most people in in in crypto know that so all this adoption is coming
and it's it's the thing is you need to use it as an enhancement on your game and
tool and not as a selling point for instance what we just saw on that that's but this new technology
and all this these things I see bigger studios we already see that also now now using this and
these web three options so yeah I think it's coming. But I think it's not decades, I think a few years,
but it will be done in a better way than we've seen so far.
That's the whole difference, I think.
Yeah, definitely.
I think, you know, there is, I think, if it's not one year,
maybe a few years, but there are a lot of things that are,
you know, coming to that point where Web3, I think if it's not one year, maybe a few years, but there are a lot of things that are, you know,
coming to that point where Web3, I think, is going to be unlocked.
For example, we've seen that also with the App Store.
You know, there were a lot of restrictions for NFT trading,
a lot of restrictions in different areas.
So there was like a recent code rule that said, like, you know,
Apple cannot restrict users from
trading nfts in their in their app so again there's like web 3 at the end of the day web 3
it's a revolution in many in many industries in many areas so it's not going to be easy even though
we have the the the apps ready or almost ready but i think there are some you know big part big
players you know banks and you know big platforms and there's there's always are some, you know, big players, you know, banks and, you know, big platforms.
And there's always going to be, you know, this kind of pushback.
But I think we are a few years away from that happening.
So, yeah, we just need to be, you know, a bit more patient, you know, and keep building.
Deruler, I think you had a question for us.
Yeah, not a question, but more of a statement.
But before I do that, man, you got some awesome people in the audience here as well.
Just a quick shout out to Maui, the legend.
Make sure you watch out for his coin launch and maybe a last chance to scoop up a wild tiger for cheap
because those things are flying off the shelf.
We also got Escobar down there.
Escobar is, I believe, now staking with candy.
So make sure you check them out as well. Man, we got Jordan. We got Higher Grar down there. Escobar is, I believe, now staking with candy. So make sure you check them out as well.
Man, we got Jordan.
We got Higher Grounds out there, the machine that just keeps popping out content.
And, of course, my beautiful PFP was created by the Bobber CTO, guys.
I love this thing.
So if you guys are looking to see a real CTO workout,
that's the team that I highly believe can achieve that and with that said
talk about building kabila is always uh talking about others giving them flowers but man that
latest update you guys had with uh now us being able to buy hbar within the wallet itself are you
kidding man that's absolutely incredible so people that don't want to use Coinbase, they don't want to go on these DEXs and other places can just directly come into the Kabila wallet and get their HBAR.
And I believe KBL as well for now.
And it's less than 1% for a fee.
So that's absolutely incredible.
I want to give you guys a massive shout out for doing that.
And you can use Apple Pay, your debit, your credit card.
So that's massive, man.
That's massive. So now it's less of a struggle to get that. And you can just do Pay, your debit, your credit card. So that's massive, man. That's massive.
So now it's less of a struggle to get that
and you can just do it there in-house.
You don't have to branch out too far to get your HBAR.
So congrats.
Yeah, thanks a lot, Ruberman.
I think that was like a feature we were waiting for a long time.
Like I've been also in conversation with the HBAR Foundation
saying how important is that we get more on-ramps, on-ramps and off-ramps on other app. Because at the end of
the day, okay, we can simplify wallet creation, we can simplify, you know, features and tooling,
but, you know, everything starts by having H-ware, you know, having some crypto in your wallet.
So, yeah, I think this was a partnership we did with a company based in Spain.
They are registered.
They have, you know, everything, you know, like all the paperwork, everything ready.
And they were very nice to work with.
And they offer also these, you know, Apple Pay options.
So, you know, we've been working very hard the last weeks and we did integration pretty fast.
Now we're working with them. We will see
when, but of course we're working on
off-ramp as well.
And we're at the same time working on
other payment methods.
Everything we can do for new
users, new Web2 people that
simplifies buying or using
wallets and getting
payments with a credit card, I think
it's going to be a big win. So yeah yeah we need more um i've always been trying to get a stripe but i think the volume sony there
are still not you know too sexy for them but i know they will they will come so yeah hopefully
hopefully eventually uh patrick i think or liam I know who had a hand raised.
Give it to Liam because for me it's short.
The ruler actually said it all.
I had some questions about that too, but man, that is in between.
I love it.
So let's go to Liam.
All right.
Thanks, Patrick.
Well, the first thing I'll say is that it's so interesting to hear how the ruler phrased that of course there was c14 on kabira before this but it's like i'd like it apparently it didn't even function correctly so
this is such a huge step i guess the question i have is like was it difficult to get those
integrations done because you know this is not something that i often see in web3 is like those
types of payment providers being available, especially like somewhere like Hedera,
which is very low key.
And then you mentioned that Stripe was difficult to get.
Is that, I mean, that is odd.
Weren't they at Hederacon
or am I getting like confused about something?
I would have thought that maybe they were a bit more bullish
if they actually spoke there,
but maybe they were just an honorary guest.
No, at least I don't know.
I mean, I've been trying and, you know, because if we get Stripe
on Edera, I mean, that would be, you know, one of the most important things I would say
for adoption. But at least for now, I don't know. I don't know if there is any conversations
going on. I'm trying to push it as much as I can, but I have no idea if there are, I
don't know if someone, I know if if brandon you have any idea or news on
that sense but at least for now i saw that they recently uh bought a company uh like a wallet
provider company um and they so they are definitely putting a you know big bet on the crypto industry
and they're probably going to be coming together eventually now the question is one no
but yeah so this is again this is one of the main issues and and and frictions that users were
reporting when they were using the whole thing like we are actively trying to get web to people
to the ecosystem and the first thing is always okay account creation okay it's not the best
experience because you always have to live with cheat phrases, at least for now.
But then when it comes to, you know, buying crypto, it's always a nightmare.
So, yeah, hopefully this helps and we're already seeing, you know, some, you know, great feedback on that sense.
By the way, Brandon, I wanted to mention because, as I mentioned, I've been, you know, a bit not like super connected with all the last ecosystem news.
But I wanted to ask you, you know, based on what we've seen, you know, since the start of the year, you know, these last four, five, six months, what is that makes you, you know, most bullish on it?
What's the news that gets you most excited for what we've seen right now, at least for this year?
you most excited for what we've seen right now, at least for this year?
Well, like I said, I think from a market standpoint and HBAR standpoint, it's got to be the ETFs.
But I think the green shoots that we're seeing across several different verticals really
is exciting.
You know, what we saw with Vera in our refi space, regenerative finance, the environmental stuff, what we're seeing with the Guardian,
that's really exciting.
And what we just saw yesterday.
I mean, the news, the question I kind of had,
especially after I did my interview about the Equity Lab thing,
is, you know, they certainly have the partnership with NVIDIA.
They have it with Intel.
They're working with Dell.
But is there going to be demand for that product?
That's the issue that we saw with our biggest use case to date at Mio is, yes, Avery Dennison was all about it.
They launched the product, but they didn't have the demand from
their customers for that product yet. That doesn't necessarily mean it's gone away. They still have
that on the back burner and that they can bring it back if they ever do start to see that demand.
But here we have Accenture, you know, clearly making it very clear that there is demand for
that AI product that Equity Lab is putting out.
Now, how much is that going to impact the network?
We'll see, but it was one of my questions with the whole Equity Lab thing.
So it was a huge story when it came out, but now that we know that there's a huge customer that's sitting there, that has me pretty bullish.
that has to be pretty bullish. And then also CLSQ. CLSQ is one that I think fits one of the
And then also, CLSQ.
narratives that should have us all excited. Decentralized physical infrastructure is massive.
The fact that we could have, you know, we're seeing these robo taxis now in Austin with Tesla.
These objects, whether it's the smart meters that they deploy 20 million of them
in the UK or, you know, autonomous vehicles like we're seeing in Austin, they are going to need to,
you know, transact back and forth, whether that's for tolls, whether that's for smart cities,
whether that's for fueling up, you know, charging, whatever it may be. And CLSQ and YSAT are at the absolute cutting
edge of that, and they're dead serious. One of the things that Jonathan and Carlos, the CEO there,
wanted to make clear is they want to wait to launch the token. They want to wait until they
have five major customers.
Now, I mean, some of the customers that they've already announced,
including the Department of Defense and the 20 million smart meters
that I mentioned in the UK, that seems like it's pretty big already.
So the fact that they're looking for additional partners
that are going to be even bigger really has me excited. Like he says,
you know, of course we want to onboard the next billion users, but we want to onboard the next
trillion objects as well. And I think that's going to be huge for Hedera. And then the AI
narrative is another one. I think that Michael Cantor, the newest seat on the high road technical
steering committee, he has a vision for HBAR being that medium of
exchange for AI agents and users of AI agents. And I think that's another thing that we should
really push as a narrative because stable coins certainly are going to have their place.
But when HBAR is a tenth of the cost of stablecoins on the Hedera network.
And, you know, one of the cheapest options across the entire space.
That is what AI agents are going to gravitate to.
And they're going to be making a lot of their own decisions. So, again, just like when I was talking about with the ETFs, they're not going to have the same biases.
They're going to find the thing that is easiest and cheapest for them to transact.
is easiest and cheapest for them to transact. And that's the direction they're going to go.
And that's the direction they're going to go.
And they are going to care about, you know, I don't know if Solana has half the transactions
don't go through. They're going to be testing that stuff out. And if the transaction isn't going to
doesn't go through, they're not going to use them anymore. So I think that that's a great,
not just from a practical standpoint, using it because it's cheaper, faster and everything else,
but, you know, also from a narrative standpoint and all it because it's cheaper, faster, and everything else, but also from a narrative standpoint.
And all of these things that I've been talking about,
it is about building a story.
The interview that I did this week with Andrew from Valor,
he was saying that the thing that retail investors want the most
from all the conversations that he had is a story, is a narrative.
And we have that in spades across all these different verticals
that I just talked about.
Yeah, man, definitely.
I think there is, again,
what happens with it,
there's big news almost every week,
every two weeks.
There is a lot going on.
There's a lot of real infrastructure,
real use cases being built.
I think, you know, that will come to a point that, you know,
it will be heard by, you know, all the other, you know, people and industries.
You know, because we, for example, in our case, we ask ourselves this question, like,
every one, two or three months, like, is there still a place to be?
Is there still a place to be building this stuff?
And the question, the answer to that question is always the same.
We analyze other chains.
We analyze other infrastructure stacks.
We analyze documentation from other little ones.
And the answer to that question is always the same.
So hopefully this research is something that is, you know, this research, you know, this is
something that is being done more and more by other companies. And there's definitely a lot
of companies that maybe we don't see at least here on Twitter on the, you know, in the, in the,
in the main, you know, community space, but there's a lot going on. A lot, a lot has been
building on this, on this chain. So again, I am optimistic. I was optimistic last year.
I was optimistic three years ago.
And, you know, the more I know, the more I see, you know, the more optimistic I am.
So I think we just need to be patient and consistent.
Yeah, I mean, I want to go to Liam here.
I want to give him an opportunity.
But I'm in the exact same boat.
Like, I've gone through and gone back to first principles and looked at Hedera from the bottom up over and over and over again.
And are there issues that we need to address as far as utility and getting adoption like we want to see?
Absolutely.
You know, there's concerns that I have all the time.
But I think a lot of the other issues on other networks is even more so.
And I come to the same conclusion like you do all the time
that, yes, this is the place to be.
Yeah, yeah.
Of course, you know, if we are asked, you know,
we always want to have, you know, more market cap,
more marketing, you know, more awareness, that's for sure.
But at the same time, I see the complexity
of building something like Edra.
And, you know, you don't want to rush in some stuff.
So I think we are on the right track,
and at least we are very optimistic on what's coming.
I had one thing that came to my mind now that you were mentioning
some of the things that could be improved on Edera.
And you and me, we have some discussions about the that, you know, could be improved on Edera. And, you know, you and me, we have, you know,
some discussions about the H-Pour Foundation,
you know, or now the Edera Foundation.
You know, there's been some changes
or there's been some, you know, leadership
and there's been, at least we've seen, you know,
some real changes in that sense.
And to me, that was one of the, I would say,
things that needed some urgent action or improvement.
What do you think of this new H-Corp Foundation?
Brandon, how do you see it or how do you see it, guys?
I'm going to jump all over it.
I do.
I've seen Liam down there with his hand up for a while, but I am going to address what you asked.
I just want to figure out what Liam has and then we'll go from there.
Liam?
Yeah. Thank you, you brandon appreciate that no i i just recall j cool i think when he came on the live space disagreeing with you about hbar being the method of transaction for ai am i getting that
right and it wasn't j it wasn't j it wasn't j who was it and why did they disagree with you about that? Like, what was their view on that?
It was, who's behind the barking game?
What's his name?
If anybody knows.
Ash, I think.
Ash, that's right.
I'm not sure why, like, we didn't get deep enough into it to really come to a conclusion.
I know that he said that because of the volatility, he was leaning more towards stablecoins.
And I disagree just because volatility doesn't matter when something's 10 times cheaper, right?
The stablecoins are a tenth of a cent.
H-bar is one one-hundredth of a cent.
So I don't think that the volatility matters. And, you know, that's you just manage that. You know,
you buy it as you need it from day to day. And then the volatility doesn't matter. And who cares
if it's going up and down by 10 or 20 or even 30 percent when, you know, a medium of exchange is
is 90 percent cheaper for whatever you're using it for.
And eventually that's going to even out over the long term anyway.
We could have a longer conversation about it.
There's half the people up here use the HBAR economy.
So to argue against using HBAR as a medium of exchange, I don't buy that.
And I think that AI agents and for Deepin and everything else,
HBAR is only going to make sense.
I totally agree.
And surely there can't be anything faster or more useful than HBAR built on Hedera.
I mean, it just doesn't seem possible in a way.
I mean, it's integrated into the very fabric of the hash graph.
I can't imagine something being better minus the fees issue,
but you could just program, you know,
an auto purchase whenever you need to use fees anyway.
I don't know.
Anyways, I just thought that I'd ask you about that
because I was super confused as to why someone would say that
and I couldn't remember their response.
But back to Manu's question.
We should give Ash a little bit of a break there
because sometimes you don't necessarily think through things all the way or it's not something that you've focused on in the past before, you know, it's brought up in a space like this and you give your opinion.
So, you know, it would really just come down to a longer conversation between me, Ash, Michael, and other people to figure out, you know, if that really does make sense.
I think it does.
Yeah, I definitely agree.
And yeah, but Brandon,
what we were discussing,
like what we're talking about,
you know, the H4 Foundation,
have you seen any things
that you'd like from,
you know, the new,
you know, leadership change?
Again, from our side, at least.
I've seen, you know,
some things that, you know,
were refreshing to see, at least. I don seen some things that were refreshing to see.
At least, I don't know if everything has been improved, but at least the processes are now
faster.
Now, at least when I refer a project to them, they get a response, they get an email back,
whether it's yes or no.
I see a lot more.
Everything seems at least more efficient.
But I don't know what's your opinion or how do you see, you know, the last.
There's been a massive improvement on execution.
There's no question about that.
I mean, from what we've seen with the on ramps and off ramps infrastructure around stable coins, around USDC,
that has opened up the doors for all of the businesses that want to leverage USDC and stablecoins on Hedera to actually do business because they still have to do, you know, pay their bills and everything else in the dollar.
So to have those on and off ramps, which now pretty much cover the entire world between crypto.com and Binance, is invaluable.
And it's other things like that.
And you see them executing on other fronts as well.
And you see them executing on other fronts as well.
My main concern was being efficient with the H-bar and the treasuries that they have.
And I've seen improvements on that as well.
I wish they would – I think a lot of the improvements that they've made on that front, they've been quiet about.
And maybe that's just because they don't want to highlight it. But I've seen some real improvements on controlling costs,
which you guys know has been a pet beef of mine for a while. So definitely seeing improvements
on that front as well. But just I want to throw some flowers at the Hashgraph Association as well,
because I think they are taking it to the next level and bringing capital in from the
outside, which is a significant improvement over using, you know, our limited resource as far as
the HBAR that they have in their treasuries. So I would like to see more of that. And if that takes
a restructuring of the way the Hedera Foundation is set up to be more like an association, I think
that makes sense. But, you know, that 200 million that the Saudis pledged to the Hedera ecosystem and 40 million from Qatar and, you know, they're
bringing outside capital in for this million dollar hackathon that they're doing in August.
I like to see stuff like that. You know, I think that that could I would rather see that than, you know, always leaning on the HBAR treasury because the HBAR is, you know, our most strategic asset.
Whatever the HBAR is doing, that's going to be the best marketing for the Hedera ecosystem.
If we break into the top 10 or something like that, you can't do better marketing than that.
And, you know, I'm dependent.
You know, I have a contract with the Hashgraph Association.
I just got a small one with the HBAR Foundation.
So I'm dependent on some of that.
I'm trying to spread that out with the NFTs and all that kind of stuff.
But I will say that I would rather take a lot of the load off the HBbar and put it on other places rather than continually be
dependent on the H-bar, including almost eliminating marketing spend. Because the
best marketing I always feel like is the H-bar. And however the H-bar is doing, that's how our
ecosystem is going to do. So I'll leave it there. I was kind of rambling there.
Yeah, definitely. There's a lot I shared with you there there I don't know Patrick or like if you had any
you know experience with the foundations or you know what do you think they're doing well or do
you think you know they could be improving sorry having family life here making a lot of noise
but that's a nice thing about to be the spaces we can do that here yeah worries. But that's the nice thing about Kabila Space is we can do that here.
Yeah, I think actually
that the foundation
is doing a great job lately.
The sentiment
has turned around a lot.
Loving that.
We had some good contacts
with the foundation as well.
All positive.
So I don't have anything
more to say about that.
Let's see what the future brings brings I hope that they can indeed get to the retail to to Hedera as they said if they can do that nothing else
matters because if we can have retail Solana of course on on Hedera like on Solana, that's going to be a game changer.
Yeah, I see the ruler laughing.
Maybe there's the wrong button, but come on.
The ruler, if we get the numbers of Solana on Hedera with retail, wouldn't that be amazing?
Hey, that's the dream.
That's the goal, right?
And again, just to touch upon the question that Manu had,
just seeing in the past when you send an application
in or when you requested a conversation with them, you would just be left unread. You would
be ignored essentially, and there would be no communication. But now hearing from people that
have reached out to them, the communication is there first of all, and you do get a response.
Whether you like the response or not, you are getting it. So if you are looking for for funding if you're looking to get involved with them they will tell you hey listen we're not
interested before you were just again left on red you had no idea where you stood so even though the
answer might not be to your liking you're still getting that response from them now so they're a
lot more communicative and they're a lot more involved with the ecosystem and they're looking
to talk to as many people as possible and just again make people aware of where they're a lot more involved with the ecosystem and they're looking to talk
to as many people as possible and just again make people aware of where they're standing
in regards to their projects so that's been a really nice refreshing thing to see that they
are actually communicating at this time around and giving people responses so that goes a long
way man considering where we went where we are now that's a massive improvement. Yeah, and that's actually spot on
because communication is now,
we had the same experience before
and now they pick up the phone, simple as that.
And it doesn't matter what the communication is about,
they might like or not like your project,
but at least they talk to you and they explain why and how
because they're in their rights to support A or B or C c that's not to us of course to decide but there was no communication there were a lot
of promises you didn't hear back from them it was frustrating and now so you can see there's a fresh
wind of air and things are changing so yeah i'm very hyped about what uh what the foundation
is doing and how they really changed.
I'm trying to post something in the Jumbotron, by the way,
but it doesn't show the old buttons like before.
So give me a little, or just go to Earthlingsland and see what I just posted.
But I'm trying.
I can't wait to see that, Patrick.
I got you, Patrick.
I just found the post and put it up on the Jumbotron.
It might just show up in a few seconds.
Where's the post?
From the Eldings account?
Yeah, it's in the Jumbotron now.
I think soon
X Elon will rename
that part on top
into the Jumbotron because
come on, that's the best word for it. I have no
clue how to call that, where we can post these things.
But we need to shut up because people need
to put on their sound.
It will be better with sound.
Let's get back to the space.
Oh, Patrick, I'm watching it right
now. And I can't
wait to pick up one of those characters and start
playing, man. So you're also doing the music yourselves? Yes, so it took me for ages to get all
these people together but even the music we have an in-house music artist he has
least amount of work because yeah you can't have someone working 40 hours a
week for just music, of course.
But yeah, we have our own artists for that.
And that's beautiful to see.
Like the care you're putting in every detail.
Like, yeah, I can imagine like if, you know, we're like,
at least in our case, we're just doing, you know,
like kind of like the tooling.
But in your case, you're doing the tooling and then
a whole world you know with even the music you're doing yourself so i can't imagine you know the
level of of word that this is taking i actually had to pause uh something else that i wanted to
do uh where we were actually uh first wanted to show some gameplay and i had to pause that because we have a partner that a new partner who wants to stay on on the background
who wanted other priorities first so that's why i finished this as well but now we're also
finalizing the same quality look and feel and game feel for the game as well but i think this
shows already that yeah we're not going for anything less than perfection even with the muni and these menus and these are still being fine-tuned by the way eyes don't have blinking
and and movement and stuff but that's details that are still following
yeah it looks super great like i i see the the effects i see i i'm not hearing the music yet i
i'll hear the music after the space but all the
effects you know every single detail like it's a world like you want to be like you want to join
like when I see the visuals like I would spend you know and again it's been it's been a while
since last time I was playing like video games for for like for like quite a lot but this is
like a game I could you know I could use you I could use to go back to playing video games.
So yeah, I'm going to be looking forward to it.
Liam, yeah, go ahead.
I think I'm looking at this preview.
It's actually quite unreal.
Like I have to say,
I've played a lot of games in my life.
I've been gaming since i was like six
years old which is crazy to think about that's like more than 20 years and um just like the
authenticity of the movement and how unique it feels even like it's animated but it feels so
good it like literally just it it's like that feeling you describe you've described to me on the podcast
and i've heard you describe it other times where like you know if you're gonna hit something in a
game that feeling of swinging a weapon that feeling of like shooting a spell or throwing
a grenade whatever has to feel good so that you want to do it over and over and over again
like just looking at those characters in your video it it feels incredible like like you you almost can't
decide which one that you want to choose because like all of them look so genuinely authentic like
they don't just look lame and like they slap together so and i think that's really hard to
achieve and i really just commend your attention to detail there thank you i'm actually not very
happy about grelf just yet but i have to excuse me with him, but we wanted to throw this out so badly. And also because Milan was showing it on another space. So I said, OK, let's throw out what we have now and keep improving. It's little details, but people know how I am there. but so there is going to be an improved one and now i'm finally finalizing also uh the the battle
that these guys are going to do friendly friendly though but will surprise people there as well um
because but i will only show that as well when it will look at least in the same quality as this with
the game field that we were talking about okay i'm I'm going to shut up now. It's almost the end of the hour anyway. And I see so many hands.
So I'll just give some room to other hands.
Yeah, Brandon, go ahead.
Yeah, no, I wanted to...
Well, there's a couple of teams.
I see Maui there.
So I want to tell him congratulations on the Wild Tigers.
I've been checking out, you know, Centex and Kabila.
And they're at the top of the list there. So congratulations on the success you. I've been checking out, you know, Centex and Kabila, and they're at the top of the list there.
So congratulations on the success
you're seeing there.
Also to Smack'Em.
I saw that, you know,
it's available now on iOS and Android,
and I think that was a big step.
They're going to be one of the,
along with Kabila and some others,
they're going to be one of the sponsors
for the next Karate Combat event,
which I think is going to get
an awful lot of attention as well. But they already have that Karate Combat Smack'em level that's out there.
I think it's, and it's not so much of the game, right? The game, of course, is fun and kind of
mindless. You just kind of go through the levels, but it's how they're going to help our token
issuers as well, getting those tokens out there, it's a new concept, right?
And I just want to give them some flowers as well
because getting it on Android and iOS,
I think is going to be a big step for them.
And you guys just keep grinding. Good stuff.
It's not difficult to also throw it out on iOS,
but sometimes they make it difficult
because they make it difficult because
they make you fill all the paperwork and then they come back with a zillion questions.
But it's out of the box, really.
If you have it built in Unity, you can deploy it anywhere.
But it's just that the paperwork on iOS always takes longer.
It's a nightmare.
I feel you, Patrick.
I mean, iOS, it's always a nightmare, especially in Web3
apps.
Yeah, go ahead.
Yeah, man. I just wanted to throw out
some flowers to Patrick and the
Earthlings team. The attention
to detail and the
words on the post as well, right? Not just the
world, but every part of the game gets the
attention. Yeah, it really shows, bro.
And yeah, the little details, the transitions between the avatars,
also their weapons and the, yeah, some like,
maybe there was like a smoke bomb or like a sand bomb thing.
Like the animation on that is just so unique and so, so great.
Yeah, I love that.
And I watched it till the end and there was like a Greif character
with abs and shit man like uh yeah that that just uh freaking made me laugh so much
yeah shout out on the greelf character as well uh yeah man y'all are really making the earthlings
game well worth the wait and yeah can't wait to really be in the universe and start playing it
and yeah, can't wait to really be in the universe
and start playing it.
For me, we go to the beach sometimes.
Yeah, he looks great, but he's humble,
so he usually only shows his head.
And I know we all know his head
is not the best part of his body,
but yeah, you know, why not show the rest as well?
Man, I would like to know one day in your team you know building the the whole universe man it has to be fun it's chaos but probably insane as building a kabila wallet
and marketplace and all this stuff yeah i mean here we had some some chaos but you know building
a whole world you know that that's a different level.
So, guys, I think we're going to have to wrap it up.
It's been amazing to speak with some of you again, to see some of you both in the speakers and in the space.
the space. You know, for everyone who is still here, because again, we're still a small community,
but, you know, I am, you know, I am optimistic again. Like, I think we are in the right place.
There is a lot that has been, you know, been done, you know, in these last past years. Like,
past years. Like, again, if we just look at the price, if we just look, you know, at, you know,
again, if we just look at the price, if we just look, you know, at, you know, pure marketing,
pure marketing, maybe, you know, we would like to see a bit more. But at least in terms of
infrastructure of, you know, you know, key, you know, key companies that need to be built in this
space, I think, you know, we are, we are, you know, far away, you know, compared to other competitors.
So I think, you know, everyone who is still here, who's still building, who's still creating,
you know, I want to give a big shout out.
And, you know, I really hope that we get,
you know, a good end of the year,
you know, who would second half of the year
and that, you know,
we can keep building here for years to come.
I don't know if anyone else has something to add.
If not, I'll be wrapping up.
Hey, Manu, no off ramp until HBAR hits $1.
So, sorry.
You can only buy HBAR.
You cannot take HBAR out.
Perfect.
That's why we're waiting, man.
That's why we're waiting.
We have it ready.
Well, Niwa still have his job because you did great.
Not sucking up to you.
I can, by the way because i am
of course a bit affiliated with smack em so i'm allowed to suck up no but you did great it was
fun but i'm looking forward to the space next week with evo again as well but thank you thank you for
hosting yeah thank you i'll let you know that you're missing him. Good to see you guys. Thanks a lot. Have a good one. Ciao, ciao. Thank you.
