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International Meme Fund Fireside w/ BuildforWeight
Recorded: Sept. 11, 2025 Duration: 1:05:49Space Recording
Short Summary
Exciting developments in the DeFi space as IMF prepares for its token launch and strategic partnerships, aiming to set new standards for transparency and institutional investment in crypto.
Full Transcription
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Can you all hear me?
What's up?
GM Wolf.
Yeah, we could give it a couple more minutes, I reckon.
But I just wanted to say what's up.
I'm sure we'll get more people in here soon enough.
I'm sure we'll get back the bunny in here sooner than later.
And yeah, no, I hope you guys having a good morning just had a proper day
um and uh i'm excited to learn some more stuff here dude
yeah he's uh back the bunny's just on his way in he Just DM me, so he'll be coming through, so just look out for him.
But yeah, been a good week.
How about you?
Oh, dude, I'm just trying not to get caught up in the fatigue, LOL, of the timeline.
But just glad there's something productive here that I can try to help contribute to.
I'm excited to learn about the merger acquisition side of things and what it means now in DeFi.
It's nice to see high-functioning up here too.
Nice to see Swish down there, Pablo, J-Chan, Mikey Sho.
Nice to see NoMogSelf.
That's good, Josh. Yeah. and Mikey show nice to see no mock self
it's nice to see yeah some of the familiar faces like it's it's really it's really cool to see you and uh yeah Mikey show remember like reaching out to
him ages ago he was he was wet way at the start for imf big support
all along so yeah thanks mike i do remember you from the early days awesome to see you still here
gm guys how are we all doing
Yo, Gmog
Gmog
I just spent 0.2 ETH
minting a Harry Potter Obama backpack
this morning, so it was like
1200 Australian dollars
so my day's off to a great start
Hey yo, you said you
minted a backpack?
Yeah, the tick of Bitcoin
they released a backpack
it's like made of leather it's got
like a laptop sleeve it's faraday protection so i'm uh i'm 0.28 poorer than i was yesterday but
yeah we'll see how the purchase goes i've wanted to own one of those backpacks for a while so
how are you guys doing
you guys chilling fucking uh like we've said excited to have something to talk about here
other than you know this tragic death that took place earlier today um interested to have
dimitri on i think he's coming through um or one of the guys from built for weight uh i think that
will be a good conversation to have because i think that's like an aspect of this protocol
that a lot of people like really don't understand um so it'll be cool to like have somebody hear from that if he is coming and uh
just like be able to ask some questions and like maybe just like the discourse will give people a
better understanding of like what it could mean for the future of the protocol especially as it
becomes more valuable you know itself absolutely uh yeah I'm really really excited about the build for weight stuff
but there's a lot of specific uh you know verbiage we have to use words we have to use so we'll let
we'll basically hear from the man himself he'll probably give the best rundown of it
um because yeah it's uh it's pretty awesome uh and i'm looking forward to sharing more. But just while we wait for Dimitri, I've just pinned at the top.
We do have a community, a Credit Cartel community on Twitter.
If you guys want to jump in, you can join 263 other chats
and just post memes about the IMF, get all your info from there.
So that's one thing that we're building out.
But, yeah, looking forward to it.
I think it'll be really awesome to hear from Dimitri
Let's see when he jumps in
The markets looking good
That's for sure
Honestly, I haven't even looked at any real charts today
I just try to get outside and try not to stew. You know what I mean?
to get outside and try not to stew you know what i mean um but i'm glad it seemed like the market's
doing like i saw that bitcoin was doing all right that east looked okay pepe was doing okay
and i was just like ah that's good enough for me yeah bitcoin's struggling with that 114 level but
uh it's definitely uh kind of nice close today at the eight it today. I actually started my day.
Yesterday I had a job that I was doing and I was out pretty late.
I got them at like 4.30 in the morning.
Like I went to sleep and then I,
I didn't realize I didn't schedule anything for today,
but I woke up and I went to the job that I'm supposed to go to tomorrow
with like three hours worth of sleep.
And I was like,
so like I got there and the lady was like, yeah, I thought you were coming tomorrow. And I was like, oh,
so I just went home and went back to sleep. And here we are.
I see, uh, uh, Demetri up here now. Uh, what's up?
Thanks for joining.
Hello, friends.
Yes, yes, yes.
That was a great story.
I caught the end of that.
It's a happy ending.
It's better to not be there,
or it's better to be there when you're not needed
than to not be there when you are needed, right?
So I was like, all right, it's a win.
Wise words.
Very wise words.
How are you doing tonight?
Good.
Very good.
Busy and stuff.
I just wrapped up a call just now.
That's why I was, you know, a little bit behind.
So thank you all for joining and the interest.
And yeah, just super salutary focus and research and writing and lawyer calls and partner calls
and just really cool energy you
know like something's always being discussed and um really invigorating to see the interest and uh
what the message is attracted and also what the message is producing insofar as copycats of which
i have been introduced to three so far uh and i know they are copying sides here because i know
the guy who's spoken with them who you know where they read it so like i'll preface but saying like when when this gets seen and live i i think it will
happen i think quickly so uh it's already spawning people who are borrowing lifting directly from
the white paper or the explainers or the messaging so it's positive in its own way
it's positive in its own way yeah i mean this flattery and uh i think what was that piracy or
something copying is the highest form of flattery right yeah yeah uh mimicry uh or yeah i know what
you're saying i forget or is imitation mimicry yeah most sincere form of flattery yeah i remember
years ago i used to have a t-shirt business and um i saw someone
on the london underground wearing one of my t-shirts in a colorway that wasn't one of mine
and i asked the guy where did you get this from because i was just like this is this is
fucking pirating like what the hell and he was like oh they're selling them in camden market
you know they were way they'd undercut me and i went over to this stall with my business partner and she
was mortified because she was like holy fuck like they're ripping us off and i was chuffed because
i'm like holy fuck we've made it because people are copying us so it's kind of it's kind of a good
thing in a way right it shows that uh yeah if people are out there watching it and and and kind
of ripping you off in a way yeah compliment i agree i agree like my initial
reaction is a little bit of alarm but then i realized that we are farther along than any of
them and also they're like they're all doing it in a very like uh they're picking little parts
that they like but they're missing the whole you know in way. So none of them are, they're all structurally a little different, but taking like some core things and modifying them. So, um, I think they'll
come to their own realizations once this has shown how it, how it operates. But, um, yeah,
it is flattering in its own right. And I have, it's been just the initial reaction that I've had
is like, you steal like thieves, you know, but then I realized it's natural. And I fully expect
there to be copycats once we're out live and out there. So that's just part of markets, you know, but then I realized it's natural. And I fully expect there to be copycats once we're out live and out there.
So that's just part of markets, you know, and we're just the, we are,
we're the ones who figure this out. We're the creators of it.
We know how this operates at a very intimate level.
And if you want to copy our homework, you know, fine.
I will probably make very, very consistent use of the Walter White meme.
It's like, you know, I'm, do you want,
do you want classic Coke or whatever it is you're making? Because I'm the cook.
So, you know, that kind of means you use it kind of regularly.
I will be very aware of how this market develops and people are already sharing it in our group chat, kind of highlighting it.
So it's good to see.
And it demonstrates the PMF that I know is there.
We just need to create this vehicle that allows, give investors a genuine investable asset that they can hold
that reflects company fundamentals.
And once you build it, they will come kind of thing.
Kind of like Henry Ford and faster horses and cars sort of stuff.
I think also just going back to kind of being the first mover as well,
just with sanity in in mind here i mean so
i might just give you guys all a bit of background context as well so the salutary relationship um
it's it's not a new idea for us this has been um part of our blueprint for for months and i think
gummy first tweeted about it like six months ago um back in April so this has
always been part of um part of our plan um we've just never really kind of like brought it to life
it's always been on the docks it's always been there in the background and like I say Gummy's
tweeted about it in the past um but we're going to start kind of talking about this now that we've
ticked off a lot of the other stuff um with regards to the business so the
business is kind of up and running and it's kind of operational and you know there's still kind of
um kinks that we need to iron out get that all good but but in general the the business is is
is moving and it is moving in the right direction which is great so yeah yeah and to add to that too
like um gammy's been incredible to work with, really smart, organized guy, like true believer. His mind is like, his mind is also an extremely transparent value building place. Like he just intimately understands like the motivations and doesn't need any explanation behind it.
frankly on my end um putting together the mechanics that make this operate in a concrete
way from day one because we don't want to just release it and it's not fully there and it's you
know we don't want it to ever be a vibe is the is the point here and um so you guys have been
actually been waiting mostly on salutary to your credit and now we're ready so um yeah we're we're
good to go here but it's been gammy's been great to work with and um yeah you guys have been
committed for for a while so yeah gammy's got like a he's great guy like I've been working with him for a long while now I love
I've got a really solid working relationship with him the thing I most love about him is he's
actually got this like innate ability to kind of peep around the corner and look at the future
before the rest of us see it coming and I think that that's kind of evident with a lot of the
work that he's done in the past like he was one of the first Azora I think that that's kind of evident with a lot of the work that he's done in the past like
he was one of the first to saw I think you know or probably the the first like he just kind of just
he just gets things way ahead of the line and um and yeah and salutary um is obviously one of them
so you know I'll just give you guys a bit more of a background context on like why IMF and salutary
and then we'll kind of hand over to Dimitri who
can kind of talk to this uh with with much greater expertise than I can I'm the the creative side of
IMF um whereas uh Dimitri is the um expert here so we'll let him talk about that if you've got any
questions but look a long time ago we kind of you may have heard the term IMF is power.
And the reason we kind of came up with that was we realized there was a lot of tokens out there in the world that just junk.
And so we really wanted to kind of like, if we were going to look at our own token and what IMF does,
IMF has done videos about this.
It's always wanted to separate the dog shit from the blue chip and fund the tokens that had kind of cultural and economic value.
So if we were kind of going out there, popping shots like that, we always knew that our own token had to be of value itself.
And that's how we kind of came up with the tagline IMF is power.
So when we came up with that tagline, we weren't playing.
We really wanted that to happen.
And we wanted IMF to the token to have real
power and um and one of those ways is with salutary and salutary like you know i've been kind of like
reading up about this a lot recently because i've now my job is to start pumping out content so that
everyone else can kind of understand what's involved here so you know any questions you
guys have got now is great because that kind of gives me good insights on like, you know, what I need to kind of understand to help you guys.
But at the heart of Salutary, and correct me if I'm wrong, it over a threshold of the tokens it actually triggers a
change of control rights over imf's business and what that means is a couple of things um
whoever the business is working well so you know there's kind of this there's there's monthly
revenue coming through um there's
a decent treasury size going in a bunch of assets and that sort of stuff token ownership that owning
the imf token can actually give you control of the imf business and correct me if i'm wrong to
reach you i think this is a first or we are the first to, to, to go with this.
Is that right?
Yeah.
Your understanding is,
is pretty darn good.
I would just augment it a bit,
but your functional understanding is,
is great.
And you are actually going to be the very first life site tree partner.
we have a handful of commits,
but they don't one.
You're the one with,
already has a token life.
So I don't have,
we don't have to deal with any token issuance there.
So which is more
convenient. But yes, you will also be literally the first one. And assuming we continue on the
same path and another partner doesn't jump ahead for some reason, you will also be the first DeFi
business, not project, the first DeFi business to ever do an actual audited earnings report,
which is, I think, a seminal moment in financial history for crypto, just as a new
parallel, new paradigm of finance. No one does them. No one does any audited financials. No one
does any basic business things that are clearly required and necessary that we see in the business
world. So you'll also be at first there, which will be a very substantial marketing event,
I hope. And we'll make that extremely visible and hopefully elevate everyone's mode of being
and responsibility to what's expected of them and what's mode of being and responsibility to what's
expected of them and what's accountable of them and that they're issuing a token.
They're asking for money in exchange for that.
They're raising capital.
And if you do that, you need to be accountable in some way.
There needs to be something binding that token to that company.
It can't just be a vibe.
It can't just be promises that can vanish at a whim.
It can't just be suggestions, which are what votes basically are in this space because there's
no enforceability. Any vote you carry out with a token, unless it's algorithmically enshrined and
it immediately happens. And typically someone has code that can thwart that if they want.
But barring that sort of like smart contract initiation, it's a suggestion. The team doesn't have to do it.
Salutary's tokens are very, very different.
Salutary is like legitimately the first enforceable business asset in DeFi.
And I don't say that hyperbolically.
I say that in that if someone, to go now to like the value proposition of the token,
if we look at how equity works and how it exerts value and how it accrues value and exerts control, it does it through very specific mechanisms through M&A, through proxy fights, through acquisitions, through mergers, through ways that always legally bind that stock to that company.
And because that stock can always acquire or take over or control that company, the stock tracks the value of the company.
It's almost like simple arbitrage logic. If one asset lets you acquire another asset,
the value of the acquiring asset must track the value of the acquiree. If it doesn't,
that's an arbitrage opportunity. And functionally, that's basically what private equity,
what Carl Icahn, what KKR, that's kind of what these guys do. If you want to zoom out a bit
at their behaviors, which there's a ton of history on the side of your website, I encourage everyone to read and
look through that goes over the extensive intimate understanding that we implement here.
Those guys arbitrage basically the difference between business value and stock. If they see
a company that's poorly run, something they want to own, manage, they swoop in, they buy it up,
and they do their thing. And because they can do that and their whole industry is designed to do that, I mean,
that's a large amount of finance does that. That stock tracks that company because if it doesn't,
Carl will step in and buy it. They'll just take it out. So again, those things have to track now
since they credibly and forcefully acquire the business. So Salutary isolates just that.
So we bind the token to the
company in an enforceable way. And I can go through the details of what enforcement concretely means
here. It's not a vibe. It's actually like a very serious, you know, men with guns thing. If you
guys read my work, like that's a, you know, I take, I take words very seriously. I don't use them
like casually here. But through Singaporean court and enforced globally, if someone accumulates enough
of IMF's token, you can control the business. A legally valid enforceable change of control
event M&A will happen where you can acquire the company and all of its assets.
So in addition to that, we also do financial auditing on a quarterly basis that will be
abiding by a blend of GAAP and IFRS standards. And for those
who don't know what that is, GAAP is the US accounting standard and IFRS is the European one.
They're a little different in terms of how they account for certain things, but they're
relatively similar and will be practical about how we do it for DeFi businesses.
But your token is concretely bound to your company in a very serious way to where you
can actually invest in it.
That's a very,
the point of salutary tokens,
the goal of them is to be
institutionally ownable assets,
meaning something a private equity firm could own.
That's our goal.
That's who we want to please here.
And if those guys will own it,
anybody can own it.
Because those guys don't own vibes.
They don't own memes.
They own something that has enforceable rights.
Otherwise they can't touch it.
And so if those guys can touch it, then everyone can can so that's how we're building this for and that's
that's what imf's token will represent it's really cool i can see this uh some hands going up already
if you kind of popped up uh wolf do you want to uh decide who uh he gets to ask ask some questions
first i think it's fascinating like especially the whole institutional
side yeah totally totally i mean that and that's also true i want to emphasize the reason why i
mean you you kind of you speak to the shareholders you want you speak to the token holders you want
we are speaking the language of business to guys with a lot of money and once once a couple whales
because again this is something that mna has done by guys with bigger pocketbooks.
The same in finance too.
Once those guys see this, everything else falls in line.
Once charts start reflecting these fundamentals, then I think magically everyone will start to get it.
So the charts will be our best marketing tool.
Having them reflect the fundamentals and the earnings that we're doing and making sure that the market gets what's going on here.
the fundamentals and the earnings that we're doing and making sure that the market gets what's going
on here. So we really need to make sure that when big boys, when whales look at this, they understand
like, wow, I'm getting something with a very direct mechanism here. This is something I can own,
I can invest in. And I would say that salutary tokens are right now the only investable business
assets in DeFi. I say business asset intentionally, I wouldn't call Bitcoin or Ethereum or any
gas token. As far as I'm concerned, those are commodities with how they accrue value.
They accrue value for very utility specific reasons. But you are issuing like a legitimately
enforceable, investable business asset that we want to bring the next wave of equity on
chain comes from institutions and private equity. And that's the language we want to
speak in. Hopefully it acts like a huge light
to moths for capital for Salli-Jay Partners. Life in glory, bro. Welcome. Did you have a question?
Yeah. Hey, thanks, man. I'll be quick because I'm cooking supper right now. But
the question I had, I think, I don't know if it was answered in previous spaces or even tonight, but I haven't been able to come up to ask it.
But when you do talk about IMF being acquired, what does that entail and mean for shareholders or holders of the token if the business is sold?
Great question. So, you know, and I want to preface that too with a very important
comment. You don't need to be acquired for salutary to work. And in fact, there's very
clean empirical evidence of this. Most companies don't get acquired and their stocks track,
right? So it's not like if M&A doesn't happen, the stock doesn't mean anything. It's like
there always needs to be the credible threat of that occurring for that asset to always track the business's value.
So I want to clarify that too, because some people are like, well, what if we don't want
to get acquired? It's like, I would expect most partners to not get acquired. That's my personal
expectation. We'll see how it plays out. But empirically, it doesn't need to happen.
Yeah, that's kind of like whether you go public or not in a traditional market, right? Either you
do or you don't,
depending on what you need in terms of raising capital. But yeah, that's my question. If you do
decide or it does happen, what does that entail? Oh, totally. I just wanted to preface that with
that response in case someone else was thinking it. So in the event of an acquisition, so when
that occurs and someone does an M&A, and when that happens, what Salutary will do is
we need to know who that acquirer is.
So we will always know our counterparties
very, very intimately.
A team can remain anonymous
if they're already anonymous publicly,
but we will always know who they are,
like very intimately.
So including their business structure
and same for the acquirer.
So when the acquirer, if he accumulates these tokens,
affects the vote, we'll look at it
and we'll certify that it's valid.
It's not fraudulent.
He didn't do a flash loan, didn't manipulate anything. He's not a North
Korean or on a sanction for us. We're going to confirm all that. And if it's valid, then it gets
certified. So once that happens, then what we do is we liaise with the acquirer and say, okay,
what are your intentions? And there are one of three buckets, and this is laid out in detail
on our website under the minority token holder protections.
And there's one of three buckets that he can choose.
One is continue operations, maintain the same token.
And in that case, everything basically stays the same, but you have to management.
The second option is continue operations, issue a new token.
And in that case, the business remains as is, but he wants to have a different token. And so all minority token holders at the point of certification are legally entitled to a pro rata holding of the
new token. So you might hold a different amount, but your percentage will stay the same. Okay.
That's enforceable too, because I either will have our teeth in here and we're not going to let
anyone just decide to slow run. If he decides in the third bucket is, I want to
shut the whole thing down. And sometimes private equity does this. They might acquire a business
and they want it only for the treasury or only for a certain little piece of intellectual property.
They don't care about anything else. And they basically got it. That's their right. That's
their business that they acquire it. If you own something, it's your right to do with it as you
want. Now, the important thing under these situations is what happens to minority holders,
right? Because if someone, and we'll use IMF as an example, your acquisition threshold is 33%,
lower than say the standard 51%. I actually think that might be good for you guys in terms of the
token tracking the fundamentals more closely. But say an acquisition happens and the guy picks one
of those first two buckets where he wants to continue operations.
So you will maintain your proportional ownership from the snapshot, from the certified of acquisition date.
And then for six months thereafter, Salutary will have a negative consent or a negative consent involvement with all with major transactions or anything considered related
party. So remember, we're also acting as an auditor this whole time. So we see everything.
So the guy cannot just siphon off resources. He can't quote unquote maintain operations,
but slow rug you by pulling out money to his bank account. We will see these things. We will make
them publicly visible. We will have the ability to veto certain ones. It won't be a fiduciary
obligation or anything, by the way. It's just negative consent and disallowing certain related party transactions.
And for six months after, he has to maintain sign-to-sign. It's not a choice. And we'll
have the ability to enforce that. So he has to do right by minority holders. If after six months,
he fulfills his obligations, then he wants to be a shitty business owner. He can be a
shitty business owner. There's no law against a guy who owns a company
deciding to just keep most of the revenue
for his own company
because he just wants to do that.
So we'll make that public,
but we ultimately don't tell businesses
how to run their operations.
But for acquisitions,
we do impose certain standards for six months after.
So that's what would happen
under the first two buckets.
For the third bucket of,
he wants to shut everything down
So this guy acquired 33% of the token. He acquired him at imf
Uh, he just yeah, I don't want to I don't want to keep running this. I actually just want xyz asset close account
Well, we okay
So you have to uh, uh, you have to buy out
The remaining uh 67%
Of token holders at the conditional amount that the acquisition happened at. So
whatever sum that the acquisition occurred with his 33% will be the amount that he has to provide
a cash transfer for, for all of the tokens. So everyone will get spot out in that circumstance
situation where he discontinues. So the long story short is no matter the option of which he has three,
minority token holders are taken care of
and Saitre will make sure that happens
through the acquisition process
and either maintaining a relationship
or if they just decide to close the business down.
Does that make sense?
Yeah, sorry.
It takes me a second to get to the phone.
But yeah, thank you.
I like that explanation.
And thank you very much.
What's for dinner as well? I'm curious.
Freshly speared halibut.
I had to go out.
Freshly speared?
Did you get what I said?
I do. I'm an avid spear fisherman.
Oh, man.
Oh, that's so cool.
I had. I just... I had to get underwater today after what happened in my country. I'm an avid spearfisherman. Oh, man. Oh, that's so cool.
I had to get underwater today after what happened in my country, so I just went and
killed some fish.
I took some aggression out.
That is super wholesome.
Where do you live?
Do you live in the States?
I do.
I live in Southern California.
Good for you, man. I'm not doing well with what happened today either.
That's a good way to channel the energy. That's awesome to hear.
Man, I'm impressed if I go to the shops and buy shit
and this guy goes out and catches a fish with a spear.
What the fuck? I'm eating bowls of cereal here.
He's a classic dietary man. I've been doing it since I was 11 years old. I grew up with a family of cereal here. He's a classic dietary man.
I've been doing it since I was 11 years old.
I grew up with a family of watermen
here in Southern California so it's
kind of second nature.
Kudos to you. Enjoy your meal.
I've got a question for Dimitri.
I come from
a bit of an accounting and financial background
so I'm familiar with some of these
terms you've been throwing around.
But just make it really left-curved,
because we do have some people fighting the IMF who,
as far as I understand, are actually literate and can't read,
let alone write.
So I'm just curious, how do we break the IMF down?
How do we break salutary down super simple for the left curves?
Because even the acronym M&A might fly over some people's heads.
Remember, like, I think some people don't even understand that the IMF, like, isn't a main coin,
you know, that it's actually, you know, generating revenue from performance fees and has TVL,
right? So, yeah, like, what would you say is, like, the simplest left curve explanation for what salutary is?
Yeah, good question.
And I want to also point everyone listening to our website.
And under the what is salutary section, there's a brief explainer.
And it's my intention that that document within about three minutes,
maybe three to five minutes of reading,
will get you totally up to speed on what we are.
And it explains the what, why, how, all this stuff.
So in terms of condensing it for like certain degrees of people,
I want to emphasize too, like you,
there's a well-known quote in finance that you get the shareholders you deserve.
And based off what you manage your business towards,
based on what you communicate,
you end up attracting the capital you should.
You kind of get what you deserve in a way. It's sort of what that's saying, but in a more elegant fashion that kind of says what you manage to is what you, who ends up owning
you and holding you.
So the messaging for like, by and large is we are, we are trying to get big boys to get
what's going on here, because this is something they can concretely own.
For the messaging for like, say more retail types who like they're not necessarily
maybe going to partake in M&A, they're not big enough to do so, they might not get why they
should care. We will distill this down in very concrete bites, kind of what I've done now,
which I think everyone on the call probably mostly understood, can make it a little shorter and
succinct. But we'll explain these core terms, there'll be some financial education going on
here that will probably go on IMF's website we'll hold spaces like this you know regularly
where we can answer these questions when we do earnings reports we'll also emphasize
yeah awesome thanks for that i think just personally like looking at some of the stuff
that you said i think the the real word here is control, right?
Like if you want to take control of the IMF, you can.
And this is enforceable as opposed to other DeFi tokens, right?
So my guess is that, you know, and maybe you can walk us through some other examples of like where governance is just a suggestion and it's not actually enforceable.
Do any like examples in DeFi or any tokens,
do you want to call out any bad examples of like governance in the DeFi
world?
Like,
is there anything that really sticks out for you where it's not
enforceable?
Governance or vote.
It's just like a suggestion.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So one,
they need to understand the core mechanics of why this matters for tying
the token to the business.
There needs to be a little bit of effort and understanding. It's not one of those things
that we can have really short package things and say control or whatnot, but I think there's some
merit in having them need to spend at least five minutes of their time to get what's going on here.
It is a very seminal thing for DeFi that is extremely well-known in finance. I want to
emphasize here too that everything I'm saying is a very old new idea. Like these are not, these aren't concepts where
it's like, whoa, who's to say, who knows? Like, no, we know. You just have to look outside of
crypto to see it. It happens in finance all the time. Like there's 400 years of history
that kind of speaks to this. So we want to keep that messaging, you know, I think clear and out
there so people can kind of see the seriousness of it.
And then on the more day-to-day communique, we can emphasize the control, emphasize the
only enforceable asset that's actually a rights-bearing and legally enforceable, Singaporean
recognized instrument that you can invest.
I think that terminology will attract people's attention. It'll also attract
people who will want to instinctively object. They're just going to want to, well, how? How
can you say that? So glad you asked. Here you go. And it's like, that's the kind of, I think,
language that lets us differentiate ourselves. It is not hyperbolic, it is genuine, it is sincere.
And it gets the conversation calibrated towards where people need to start thinking because right now they think in terms of hype cycles um the kol that's pumping it just
just a you know ephemeral vapor style thinking about how do we get this how do we manipulate
this number higher so we can sell then move on to the next number that we can manipulate higher
like that's not what investing is and there are actually very serious reasons for why things accrue value over time. And this token has that. So I think we need to like set the tone of what does or token in DeFi is a very powerful message,
and it's completely defensible and entirely true.
And it'll be an ongoing process with earnings reports and messaging we do that keeps reaffirming that.
And what'll get this adopted as a standard, people are not going to gravitate towards this
because they think I'm a nice guy or they want to do the right thing.
We're going to be honest.
Those are good messages, but that's not what adopts a new standard.
What makes a standard a standard that is something we converge on naturally is when everyone makes the most money by doing it.
And once the fundamentals start showing that they matter, they show up in the token.
And once the guys start realizing the way they make the most money is by building the best business, then you see behaviors start to change naturally.
And to that, I'd also add that there's no greater wealth creator in human history than equity.
Like that's the wealth creator.
That's how billionaires are made.
So once guys see that if they behave in an honest, open way, they get the best reward. That's why the company is
called salutary, which is just a fancy word for healthy. We're aligning incentives around healthy,
open, transparent, enforceable behavior where you can't fuck around. You can't be fraudulent.
We see everything. It's being made public. And the reason why you would want that accountability
is because of the financial rewards and investability that comes along with it.
Same as in equity markets. I have a question. Have you explored or thought about the side of
does this start to push this into the realm where you could be considered a security? And I know
that's probably not at the forefront, but maybe for some American investors that might matter.
And that was just something that came to my mind while you were speaking on these things. Great question. Yes, that is a very high
concern. We don't want to step on regulators' toes or flout them. We want to maintain that
good relationship there. And I want to lead by answering, we are being like,
the sanitary is probably acting as the most above board, honest, like transparent mechanism
you could possibly hope for. So it's like when they look at us and I hope that they do,
because that's a sign of success. Like it's a cost of doing business basically that you get
so big that eventually, you know, some regulator knocks on your shoulders like, Hey, how's
everything going? You're following the rules. It's like, well, not only are we following the
rules, we're kind of implementing yours. We're, we're listening to them. We're, we're drawing
from your history in some ways in the way that makes these things investable, but maintains the spirit of DeFi.
So to your securities question, officially and technically, what these tokens are, are change of control instruments, which is technically a governance tool.
I don't like that word really because DeFi has kind of diluted it into nothing.
It doesn't really mean anything, but it is a very serious thing with Saitary. It is an enforceable way to change
the control of the company. And I want to emphasize too, we say change of control and
not change of ownership intentionally. Ownership is what securities do. Control is what a governance
vehicle does. And the way Saitary facilitates these acquisitions, should they happen, utilizes
a foundation structure that we create and manage. A foundation is not technically ownership, it is control. That is just
a vehicle that everyone uses in this space for obvious reasons. We are going to do that too.
So that's why we're sensitive to that language. If you go on the white paper on the website,
you will see these qualifiers. This is a change of control instrument. Market forces determine
the price.
These events are governed in this way.
All these necessary things to stipulate, there are no promise of profits.
There is no claim to any company assets here.
There's no right to dividends. There's no all of the academic language of what a stock officially does.
There's this, this core mechanism.
And I want to emphasize too that just because those rights aren't enshrined for you from us like the securities you know doesn't mean biz partners can't do that if they want to
do a fee switch if they want to do a buyback if they want to do things for their tokens they can't
but sayutari doesn't doesn't impose that the only thing we impose is the mna and the auditing
um so in that there is a very defensible leg to stand on on the securities front
um in terms of us following that rule clearly on
the governance before you you proceed sorry to interrupt everybody i just wanted to give a moment
to charlie kirk um very devastating news i hope you guys raise your flags halfway yeah yeah yeah
no it's been a very rough day for that i appreciate that yeah. Sorry about that interruption, by the way. Thank you, Habibi.
So, what was I saying?
I lost my train.
Oh, the security's fine.
So there is a very defensible leg to stand on should anyone come knocking.
And if we get big enough, by the way,
like that's going to happen.
And I fully expect that to happen.
That's just part of life.
And when that occurs,
we are, again, behaving in ways that
auditors and regulators already do. We're recreating the best parts of that and putting
it on chain. So one, we're all behaving incredibly honestly here and out in the open by design.
The whole nature of this is non-fraudulence and integrity and open accounting and enforceable
contracts in Singapore. A very upstanding country too, by the way.
Sayutari isn't out of the Caymans.
I didn't want to optimize for tax jurisdiction.
I wanted to optimize for enforcement and credibility and pedigree.
That's why we landed on Singapore.
So it is very defensible from that lens.
And should that day come, it's a sign of success as far as I'm concerned,
and we'll deal with it when it occurs.
But that is the official stance on what these are
and why they are not securities.
And you'll see language on the website
that will reinforce that
and all the partner communications,
which I've been working on Pablo on.
They will be very strict on this,
which also goes kind of a long way with regulation.
Like they don't want,
if you're not like rubbing your nuts on their forehead
and like being like, I don't care about your rules.
Like we're showing respect in how we're framing this too.
And I actually think that's very important as well.
So our language and our presentation
will communicate that as well.
Just another question as well, Dimitri.
So what's the road, like let's take IMF, right?
So it's the first token launching
with the salutary standard.
What is the pathway for institutional adoption
like with the IMF, for example, right?
Like how would you like frame this in a way where we can get some of Wall Street's money
or some of, you know, some VC money and explain it in a, you know,
and pitch it in a way that we can actually grow outside of just like retail,
you know, retail like traders and speculators.
How do you see like Salutary evolving in that way
where people get a pitch deck and they're working for a VC
or they're an investment fund
and they work for a big four bank
and they're like, okay, well, this actually has more features,
more equity features than I would have thought.
It's not a worthless governance token.
There's actually some teeth here.
So how do you see that road building out?
Because it'd be awesome if the IMF could attract, you know,
an offer like the, I think the APR right now is 11%
by depositing USDS into the vault.
It'd be really awesome if we could tap into some Wall Street money
or some VC and get some actual kind of big boy money from that side.
So how do you see the path to kind of big boy money through salutary? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um,
I want to emphasize that the way the relationship is set up, uh, is very aligned for mutual success.
So that's a big, a big message of salutary is like, you know, show me, show me the incentives
and I'll show you the outcomes. Um, People need to be aligned to where certain behaviors that are good or honest produce the best outcomes for them to do
those behaviors. And the reason why we see so much shitty behavior in this space is not because
everyone's inherently corrupt. It's because the assets are corrupt. So if you fix the assets and
you fix the incentives behind them, where you don't make money by pumping them up and dumping
them, but you make money by investing and holding them and building something, you'll see the behaviors change. The behaviors will
change in time. Behaviors follow incentives. And it's the same with us in the relationship with
partners. So we have a stake in IMF as part of the partnership. And so we'll have a stake with
all of our partners. That's our monetization structure right now. And a big part of Sightary
that I think is maybe not as front and center as it should
be is the marketing benefits of it.
Earnings reports are very, very visible.
They're very sexy.
They're extremely relevant to your bags.
M&A is extremely sexy and visible.
These are all not boring financial things.
These are things, if anyone watches CNBC or Bloomberg, earnings reports consume all of media. It's all they talk about, very high level stuff. So what we'll do when we
partner with you is one, those are big, I think, vehicles that will naturally start attracting and
speaking to actually grown-up capital. And then Saitre on the back end is part of our go-to
market strategy. Once we get some partners going and we get initially situated, is to reach out
and literally engage these guys through our partner networks, through investors, et cetera.
We have some past there already and some ones I've already spoken to where it's like, we want to go
out and show them, hey, we know this is how your business operates. We're speaking your language
here with Salutary. They're going to understand this instinctively. They're not going to need to
be sold on why enforcement's valuable or M&A is like good.
They'll be like, oh, well, obviously, but how do I, how can I do that?
We'll show them how Sightrade does that.
And that is a major component of what we want to do because if you guys succeed, we succeed.
So there's an entirely aligned incentive here where we want you guys to attract money.
We want you to be able to raise capital on great terms.
We want people to go in and allocate towards you.
So we will be engaging institutions, both DeFi and TradFi.
Frankly, more so TradFi.
Like my focus will be mostly, you know, once we get some traction, DeFi on medium-sized
businesses, car dealerships, real estate companies, Shopify stores, like, you know, real companies
can actually use this.
It's not like for DeFi natives specifically.
It's just the token represents the business control.
So everyone with any asset they own can have that shown on chain.
And then we'll have a partner portal on our site that shows all our partners.
Everyone will know what our partners tokens do because it's all standardized.
And then we engage institutions to try to get this thing live adopted and get you guys,
you know, allocations because if you win, we win.
So that will be a big, a big messaging component of ours. And it's a very important one too, because, um, kind of has an, how I mentioned in the white paper and otherwise, like once
institutions, once big guys understand your thing, everyone else tends to get it because those guys
move markets. Those guys take major positions. Those guys do M&A. Same in TradFi.
Retail holders of NVIDIA, your NVIDIA token is a governance token.
You can't do anything with your 0.00004% of NVIDIA.
No one cares.
So you'd be like, well, what's the difference between this micro position NVIDIA and my fuzzy bunny tokens?
Well, kind of nothing.
You can't do anything with either of them, really, in terms of enforcement.
But at certain thresholds, you can do some big things with them.
That changes dramatically. And that's why speaking to the Carl Icahn, the activist investors, the institutions, once they get this, I think magic happens.
But we're very incentivized to have that occur.
advice to have that occur. It's part of our go-to market, what we'll be focusing on.
It's part of our go-to market, what we'll be focusing on.
And that's how we hope to bring actual investable holders in IMF on chain and get these guys.
Right now, when we think institutional involvement in crypto, as far as I can tell,
that just means an ETF issuer has a Bitcoin ETF. That's just like people buy a TradFi
instantiation of crypto or something.
It's like, that's not an institution being on chain. Institution being on chain would be like
if KKR is actually accumulating MakerDAO because they want to do some kind of activist thing or
take it public or private in some way or something. We want to facilitate that activity,
like actual M&A, robber baron stuff from the 1980s and 90s, where they actually, you know,
do a lot of good. These guys are not 90s, where they actually do a lot of good.
These guys are not just like vampires. They actually do a lot of productive things for
companies. And shareholders almost literally always win when they get involved. If you study
the history, I have actually yet to find an exception to that, where even if Carl Icahn or
private equity firm loses, an activist doesn't get everything they want, they get something of
what they want and all the shareholders benefit in some way. So they're really a net good in a lot of ways for
what they do because these guys don't just target well-performing. They don't just do it for no
reason. They tend to do it for very specific reasons. So once we give them those tools,
there's no reason why guys that love money that much should not be doing their thing in DeFi as
well as TrackFi. And we want to make sure they know you can do it here now. And in a very serious
and forcible way, you have a direct relationship with us,
and we will make sure these rules are followed because you guys need enforcement. You can't
just do Vibes. You can't just do Code is Law. They don't do that. We do Law is Law. And IMF
has actually legal backing to it. So it really is control and power in that way. And we'll make
sure people know that. That's awesome. Just kind of a final
question as well. When's the first IMF earnings report coming out? Do we have a scheduled date?
Are we going to do it at the end of financial year or end of the year? I'm not sure how,
you know, how, when we can push that out because the IMF is earning like protocol revenue. So
it'd be really cool if we could, you know, draft like a proper document and share that.
And, you know, maybe we can get partners to cook some like
to earnings announcements.
So, yeah.
Like a 10K, right?
Like kind of like a sheet that you would get like normally
when you would hear like these earnings calls go and everything.
And then you start getting into things too, like valuation, right?
Like it's, it's interesting.
And you said that IMS is the only protocol that's using this so far,
the first one to use the salutary standard.
It'll be the first. Yes. We have about four or five.
So your pitch deck, your pitch deck includes IMF.
Oh, you mean like if we're right?
Like, yeah, we'll certainly touch you guys.
Once you go public as a live partner, you'll be on the site.
And when we reach out, we'll reference that too.
But yeah, you'll be the first live one.
You already have a token, which makes our life actually a lot easier.
So we don't have to go through the issuance.
We're mostly attracting, and this makes sense to me, new pre-TGE DeFi businesses.
For this at its stage, that makes sense to me.
So once this gets live with IMF and a couple others, we're already getting a fair amount of interest.
It's not like it's super public.
So I hope that snowballs very quickly.
And in terms of the first earnings, I'm flexible on that.
Actually, I kind of think as soon as we're able to, we probably should do that just to set the
tone and get it out there and get people starting to look at the things that matter and then start
reminding them, this is why it matters. And then when you get the very common refrains of like,
ah, you know, that doesn't matter. It's like it used to not because before you held nothing.
Now you hold something. That something matters relative to this stuff now. This is part of growing up.
DeFi is getting into its young adulthood stage, right? And IMF is the first kid to get a job and graduate college.
So I hope we do it relatively soon. We'll make sure all of those earnings and stuff are transparent and understandable and also framed accordingly. Some people have mentioned early stage startups are not valued necessarily on
the cash flows you're generating now. They're not evaluated on their earnings. That's almost a
truism, like an obvious thing to say. And that kind of goes with the concept of DCF, where you're
not being valued on the cash flows you're making now, but way out into the future. And early stage companies are known as long duration assets,
which just means the cash flows are even further out into the future. But these are also very
volatile assets because of that though, because markets are trying to anticipate, well, how much
they're growing, what their adoption looks like. So they're very jumpy. So I want to emphasize that
you are not getting valued off of your net income.
If anyone uses the term price to earnings ratio for an early stage company, they just don't know what they're talking about.
You're not supposed to have earnings at this stage.
You're supposed to be losing money.
That's actually what's very normal.
What we do want to show and highlight is growth.
And that doesn't necessarily even mean explicitly revenue, though eventually it will.
But if certain user metrics or numbers are going up, we will highlight those too. Those are management figures we'll make sure people can see. So we'll
have standard accounting and reporting like balance sheet, income statement, cashflow statements,
and we'll help you highlight. These are the things that early... This is where tech companies get
value. And IMF is a tech company. It's an early stage growth tech company. And we'll make sure
people understand that and know what they're looking at.
And I think it will be very powerful ongoing marketing tools and also an excellent educational
mechanism for a space that just sorely, sorely needs it.
You know, a lot of these concepts are very, very core, very basic.
And so a lot of guys get it, but a lot of them protest it.
They think they fundamentally, I think, don't understand the FI and DeFi, that this is finance at the
end of the day.
This is still finance.
It's just finance on a better database.
We're putting the assets on improved open access databases where everyone can use them.
But there are rules that still apply.
And we will help them understand that and we'll help them understand what they're looking
And I just think it will be a massive breath of fresh air that is so different and so unique
in this industry.
But what's also kind of poetic about it is it's not a new message historically.
It's not a new message for business.
It's a very obvious one.
It's a very like no shit one, frankly.
But for this industry, it's like, whoa, who are these guys?
This is crazy.
Earnings reports.
It's like, obviously.
Why is this
even a question? So I think once we start planting the seed, these messages that clearly resonate and
work for all of markets will start to show up here. And then I think we'll be really impressed
and surprised how the participant in markets in here, the internet capital markets, I don't know
how much I like that term, but it's fine, I guess. The participant in the ICM will get more adult-like. They might start asking you,
hey, how are your gross margins doing? And right now, if you ask that to everyone in defense,
like, what the? My margins are gross. They're cool. What are you talking about? They're not
icky. It's like, no, no. Gross margin means X, Y, Z, right? I think you guys, I think everyone will be impressed at how
we level up and grow up once we start speaking the language of adulthood. And with the language
of adulthood comes the rewards of adulthood. I want to emphasize here, we're not just doing this
because we want to be good guys and pull up our bootstraps. It's like, you know, this is how you
really make the most success and wealth and rewards. So that'll be our message. That'll
be what we put out there. And I love to do earnings as kind of as soon as you guys are able.
Yeah, awesome. We'd love to chat to you about that. Like I said, we're getting, we're in the
process of getting a dashboard built out for some more metrics. So yeah, we'd love to run some,
yeah, some of those behind you. But there's things like, for example, total use account of the IMF,
right? I'm curious in DeFi, like how often you report, because I know,
you know, like earnings reports could be quarterly, you know, like semi-annually or
annually, right? So I think it would be really cool. Like what if the DeFi standard for reporting
becomes once a month, you know, like I think that'd be really awesome. Yeah. Yeah. That's an
interesting point that, you know, and with that, I'm very open to being totally fluid there. I think we should maintain some sort of cadence that is it
no more frequent than monthly because I like the marketing value is really high here. I just, I,
if we stream it all the time, it starts to become unremarkable and not noticeable where
if you put it in a cadence where there is something to report on, then you excite people,
then they start paying attention. You know. Then people trade the earnings reports or start watching it really closely.
I don't think a quarterly is necessarily the right answer. So we can figure that out as we go.
And we can maybe stream some figures as you have them and then keep some for the official
the official earnings announcements that occur, however often they occur, one month, three month,
earnings announcements that occur, however often they occur, one month, three months, et cetera.
et cetera. But that's a question that I'm curious to see kind of what the market and partner like
best. And then also what Salutari's resources allow, because we'll be helping you create these.
They're audited financials because our guys are verifying. That's another important thing too,
is someone is vouching for these things. I spoke spoke with Felipe from a couple of weeks ago.
He seems to really like this idea and wants to help out in some respects.
And he's working with the block to do like,
they're sort of doing this,
but in a very soft way where you like self report the financials,
like you can't self report this stuff.
Like you can't self audit yourself either. Like, Like you can't self-audit yourself either.
Like, you know, they should be like, no business is allowed to do that. Why aren't they allowed
to do that? Well, because they fuck around a little bit when you do that empirically.
Like we've had a lot of historical fraud issues when companies audit themselves,
you can't audit yourself. You can't enforce your own rules, right? That's just, should be kind of
self-evidently not a good standard. It's better than not having it, but it's insufficient. So it'll also really
impress the market because when we do these, we're also vouching for your off-chain assets,
bank accounts, brokerages, intellectual property, something that they can't see on-chain necessarily.
That counts too. And that's something side too. We'll see bank statements like, yep,
here's the money. We confirm it's here. And no one else is doing that. And it's a very, very established required
thing in any credible financial market, US or otherwise, like globally. So that's a big thing
too, that I think will establish a lot of trust with you guys. And we'll set a new standard for
the space that none of these games are okay anymore. If you want to just play casino and do nonsense you can do that but you're not going
to have the rewards of being serious yeah i love that right because the word audit in crypto means
something entirely different it's like reviewing lines of code whereas you know now we're going to
be getting a completely different type of audit i have another question as well because you know
obviously a salary token is not the exact same as equity.
How would a balance sheet work, both in terms of reporting and the actual, you know, structure of that in regards to salutary?
Like, would we be able to publish a balance sheet? Because we do have a treasury.
Obviously, we have active positions that we've borrowed against.
So we do have both assets and liabilities.
I'm just curious, is that something you've looked into or earnings really the highlights? So when we report earnings, balance sheet is card.
The income statement, balance sheet, cash flow statement, that is all factored in there.
Let me just get some real quick.
So, uh, yes, like that would be all of the things that we report on.
We'll include that and more like there will be certain minimums that must be reported on the site.
Um, but if you guys want to add more, you're totally welcome to.
Like if you want to add nuance around the positions you have, you know,
salutary will evaluate them based off standard ways that will evaluate
maybe illiquid assets. And there's known ways to do that. You just have to do your best if
they're not necessarily trading actively. And then certain positions you guys have out,
you can highlight why, your intentions with it. Salutary will confirm the accuracy of it
and that it's there and present. But the balance sheet will be very much part of the earnings.
So earnings is the income statement, like the revenue growth, gross margins,
what you guys have basically been doing in terms of business expansion. The balance sheet represents
how the business is accumulating assets, basically like what do you own and what do you owe?
And then the cashflow statement shows like where those cash flows are coming from,
how sustainable they might necessarily be. Are they from financing?
Are they from operations?
You know, it lets investors understand the quality of the earnings and, you know, make
their own kind of investable conclusions on how this stuff works.
And the market has ways, you know, there's very known ways on how to evaluate this stuff.
So all of that will go out.
In addition to commentary, you guys want to add on top of that.
So to answer yes, like that'll definitely be included
and it's all part of earnings
as far as I'm concerned.
Awesome.
Thanks for sharing.
Yeah, I'll pass it back to Wolf
if anyone else has any questions,
but I found this discussion really insightful.
We're hitting the one hour mark now,
which is awesome.
And yeah, thanks for,
thanks for jumping on again, Dimitri.
Really appreciated picking your brain
and you're going to take a deep dive into the docs as well. But yeah, each, each for jumping on again, Dimitri. Really appreciated picking your brain. And yeah, you're going to take a deep dive into the docks as well.
But yeah, each day, each week, I'm learning more and more about Salutary
and I'm getting really bullish, especially being the IMF,
being the kind of first partner.
Like you mentioned, we have our token live.
I think it's, you know, hopefully this kicks off a brand new meta,
a brand new wave.
And, you know, we see other DeFi protocols
begin to adopt this standard as well.
But yeah, thanks for everything.
My pleasure.
I'm really honored by the invite and the interest.
I'm super excited to be working with IMF
and guys that take everything so seriously.
We'll really highlight,
because I think IMF has this memetic association,
which is totally fine,
but we'll also highlight, there's a lot of gammy loves like the grown-ass man token messaging i do too um i think it's very memeable i think uh the retail guys will hopefully love it when
we start putting it out there and then showing like hey you know imf is this credit facility
with both that lends with i guess all kinds of assets. It's token is like not a vibe, not a meme.
This is why.
And really like level up the presence you guys have with both like the
DJ and meme community and also like the legitimate investment community.
And I've just been really impressed the more I've engaged with you guys,
like how well you run, how serious Gammy and the team are,
what you guys want to accomplish and do.
So I thank you
everyone for joining. I encourage you to read the docs if you have any questions. There's an FAQ
in the explainer page in the what is sci-fi section. There's a brief explainer and then the
FAQs. They should cover a lot of core ground. If you have remaining questions after that, I'd be
curious to know what they are because the goal is to have between those two documents, there to be
like almost no remaining questions.
So, and then the white paper goes into the history
and the what and the why, if you're curious,
it's a little longer, but I've been told it's a fun read.
And then the core docs on there
and the history on the website will take you further
if you choose to do so.
And there's a lot of meat on the site
and you'll be seeing more of us very soon.
And yeah, thank you everyone for being here
and, uh, it's exciting times. Yeah. Thanks a lot. I just try to be quiet so you could explain as
much as you could in about an hour. I'm definitely going to relisten to this. Um, and one quick,
simple question. Um, this is already, uh, adopted the standard or when does this, uh, go live?
has already adopted the standard or when does this go live?
So it's not live on the token yet.
I am working with IMS attorney right now.
They got us all core documents.
We reviewed them.
We need a couple more things that they're reviewing right now.
So it's my hope that this can be done this month.
I don't think there's a reason why it shouldn't be.
Besides maybe some clerical delays regarding certain stuff to make sure it's buttoned up. But super soon, super soon. But it's not officially live yet. But we're working towards that. And then we have a site will also have means for PTG companies, because I'm getting this request a fair amount because, you know, a couple of our partners that are working with right now now that are reviewing documents are media companies. They're not DeFi at all. They're LA Film and
Music Studio. So these guys don't know how to issue a token. They don't want to manage a token.
So we're going to have a way to have you holistically do it with us. You'll be able to
do an ICO, I suppose. We'll call it something different, but you'll be able to list through
Salutary as well. And a way to have that liquidity managed too. We want it it something different, but you'll be able to list through Salutary as well.
And a way to have that liquidity managed too. We want it to be a holistic thing where if you work with us, you don't have to worry about your token anymore. You should not be distracted by it. You
should not be putting resources into it. It shouldn't be what it's treated right as now,
which is like a second product. And your first product is your business that you want to see
succeed and grow. And the token acts as a second product that you have to dump resources in and attention
to justify its existence once you partner with salutary no justifications needed that thing is
self-evidently valuable and forcibly so it can attract money and you don't need to think about
it anymore for the same reason the company doesn't have you know meetings like hey guys
what's our stock in it what does our stock do i don't know like how are we gonna it's not a it's not a question they have and if it is doing poorly
or well it's because the business is right so we want that to be the same the same situation
and we're going to help partners with the issuance management everything that they need so uh yeah
it's uh yeah yeah thank you very much again bro uh. Just one more question, Dimitri.
Sorry to cut you off, Wolf.
Since we mentioned, obviously, Singapore,
are you heading to token 2049 in Singapore?
Because some of the IMF crew will be there.
So if you are, it would be good to catch up if you're heading.
But if not, all good.
We'll see you online and we'll keep working with you.
When is 2049?
I think it's the 1st and 2nd of October, if I'm not mistaken. we'll see you online and we'll keep working with you. When is, when is 2049?
I think it's the first and second of October,
if I'm not mistaken,
maybe it's the second and third.
So end of,
end of September,
early October is when some of the IMF crew are heading there.
Let me find out for you right now.
I don't have concrete plans to do so,
but I very well could. And in fact, I actually think
I might come out to Sydney and help you guys onboard. And I know I saw that you guys work at a
really cool, huge coworking crypto style space with like a gym in it and other things like a,
like a squat cage and stuff. I think there's a lot of build for weight marketability in there
with that. So I might go out there for a little bit to just help onboard questions,
be there for a while, get to know you all.
And then maybe 2049 too, but all fluid.
I don't have firm plans yet, but all things I'm considering.
Awesome.
All right.
Well, yeah, I appreciate everybody's time this evening.
I can't look forward to next week with gammy being back we could discuss
some things um a lot of things were gone over tonight so definitely i have to look things over
thank you very much everyone for coming in um and we'll definitely be back for another episode soon
see you next time thanks guys
