good morning guys. Good morning um you know how you doing? You
know when certain smells like a perfume or cologne remind you of
a specific time of your life the court memory.
Uh, it happens more frequently with sound for me. I'm an audio file.
I understand what you're saying.
Music, yeah. Whenever I see Dil's PFP, I think of, um, I think of this.
When I see his PFP, I think of, uh, Dr. Crypto is one of his OG names and I think of a core
memory back in 2019 when I threw a crypto party with some of the LDA guys and he was
up on, he was up on a table with his outfit. Um, just wrapping away, just wrap wrapping
away, man. I have a, I have a video of it, but it was a, it's a core memory. I'll never
forget it. Cause there's other dudes, like drunk ass dude runs up, takes his shirt off
and messes up the whole show. Um, but anyway, I just wanted to, I just, every time I see
Dil on stage or see him in person, I'm like, Oh my God, I love it, man. I love it. Yeah.
I know what you mean. Sometimes like, uh, some perfumes will give me that, you know,
uh, all kinds. I know exactly what you mean, but, uh, yeah, man, that was some crazy times
long ago. Hey, we'll have to run it back. One of these days, you know, it's all going
to come back full circle with, with Dil's permission. I would one day of course post
the video and people will see what I mean. It was, it was fire. It was a fire show. Please,
post it any time, man. Meme the shit out of it. By the way, uh, that'll have to wait
until your, your leg heals, Noah, but, uh, I'm, I'm game. Oh, this, this broken leg
isn't going to stop me from going to any conferences. Tell you that much. Okay. That makes it even
more desirable for me to go to these conferences to watch you hobble around in person. Um,
maybe I will go to eat. When is it? I'll push my Vietnam trip to, to watch you hobble
around. It's okay. There'll be plenty of other conferences. We have consensus. We have Bitcoin
Nashville. We have rare Evo. So M a T dot NYC lot going on this year. I'm excited, man,
to be honest with you. Uh, for those who don't know, welcome everybody. I'm now a representative
for a new chain, uh, called rails network, which we'll be talking about on the spaces
which we have had before. That's not this space is about, um, it's a, it's actually
a cool, it's a really cool concept. It's about vetting builders on your chain and the impact
that it has on the ecosystem. I think it's going to be interesting to watch. And I think
it's going to be a precedent. Um, I see a future where, uh, chains are bifurcated or
trifurcated based on which lane you want to enter. And you wouldn't be entering them like,
uh, necessarily very consciously. You just be choosing which, which avatar, which identity
you wanted to enter with, you know, fully, fully and on pseudo and on docs or what have
you for purposes of what you're going to do within the ecosystem at that time, whether
it requires KYC or AML, so on and so forth. And I do think that ZK technology with polygon
and that will spread to probably every chain will, will play a large part in choosing how
you want to act within the evolution of the metaverse. So, um, morning Noah, I'm Maureen
Dill, morning Joseph, Ryan, welcome Doc, Davos, Caesar, CB, Hideo, RDC, welcome. Um, why I
love these spaces and I love doing them with, you know, as well. And all these speakers
and guests is, I guess I get to have the conversations that I'm, I'm dying to have in other spaces,
but either it's not appropriate or to be frank, the, the, the level of intellect just
isn't there or more realistically, the level of interest just isn't there. Right. The brain
power is being spent on which, which, which meme coin did bitch tits poly just launch
and how do you not know that Pepe is draining while pork is going up and it's literally
just the washing machine of liquidity. And all that's happening is Paulie is just making
money off your backs by manipulating you through ecosystems, but that's not what this is about.
And this is not going to be about Jup. I prefer to talk about things a little bit more high
level and, and seeing the forest from the trees. So I know this space is titled IP identity
in the future of metaverses and NFTs. Sorry. What I really want to talk about is the evolution
of trends and how they impact the market as a whole, and how it changes the things
that we've done that kind of seemed ridiculous and puts them a little bit more into perspective.
What do I mean by that? Shit coins, I'll use as an example, as I then transition to NFTs.
We are seeing a massive surge in airdrops and, and meme coins that are being dropped
differently than they used to be and being utilized differently than they used to be.
You're seeing major chains use tokens as essentially their marketing arm. And if you
watch closely, right? Solana is not directly promoting Bonk, but it's a very good chance
it's behind it and supporting it, right? Why? Because Bonk is a massive attention beacon
that doesn't require a lot of management, right? With an NFT project, there's holders,
there's, there's spaces and chats that the founders need to organize and there's deliveries
and an announcement, but it comes to a shit coin. The memetics that Web3 has promulgated
in a very interesting way becomes a lot easier, right? The community takes it on. You're fast
eddy having spaces about other people's projects, right? That are mostly anon. And so what you're
seeing is airdrops being used as a substitute for marketing, right? And also a way to drive
attention to chains and to bring the communities that they were trying to bring with NFTs. Same
thing I'm seeing with metaverses and then I'll pass it to the audience is NFTs at this point,
right? They are an identity, obviously, and they do have functionality, but their functionality
is not, is not highlighted within the use cases of the identity for the most part currently,
especially since the hexes have been taken away on Twitter. And now you don't even know if you
actually own the NFT, right? That was like a small quote unquote utility that doesn't exist
anymore. So what would I have to read? There was never a straight answer unless I'm mistaken. If
anybody else knows, I don't know. Any ideas? I don't know, but it sounds like Twitter to not give
a straight answer and just take something away. My hope is that it's technically based and not
that it's they want to distance themselves from web three. Either way, it took away an aspect of
otherwise you have just pictures, right? Without the proof that they're on chain,
which is what the NFT is, don't get it twisted. NFT is not the picture. The NFT is the receipt
that's immutably on chain that says you own this in whatever capacity it was transacted to
or transferred to you at a given time. And that's memorialized on chain. It points to something and
that's what it says you own. With hexes, it added another layer to the identity,
which said, I also own this outright and nobody else can. And whatever else comes with ownership
that was granted with that asset. We just saw the launch and I'll quit my diatribe in a second.
We just saw the launch of Nifty Island, which essentially, in my opinion, stands up
and returns the value that an NFT gives a JPEG. Meaning you can now wear this identity that you've
been wearing in social media in an actual dynamic 3D experience, right? This is just the start.
Metaverse is now validating additional value propositions to NFTs,
quote unquote utility, that I think we're going to see more and more of and to Dill as well.
I believe that metaverses are a massive, massive solution for value add to music NFTs.
Meaning token gating, right? If you are a host in Twitter or you've been around,
you've seen a lot of people getting deplatformed for violating IP rights. Meaning they start a space
and they don't play the beautiful Twitter music that we played at the start here.
They play Drake's Never Gonna Get You, right? And then they get DMCA'd and then they get
automatically deplatformed and they don't know why. Well, it's because you can't prove that you own
the rights to that music if you did and therefore you're likely violating the IP rights and Twitter
doesn't want to be promoting that violation. In metaverses, and you're seeing this already,
this exists in Roblox. Music NFTs, i.e. proof of ownership of music and the right to use that
asset in the way that you want to use it, right, irrefutably is now a value proposition for music
where you own a nifty island, your own island, and you can token gate, you can't do it yet,
but in theory you could token gate music so that you could curate the experience. So not only are
you building upward on your island, not only are you creating games, but you're also, much like in
the real life, right, when friends come over you choose which music you're going to put on
and what sets the mood, right, but along with your aesthetic and token gated music NFTs
can accomplish controlling that legally and rightfully and obviously then also
controlling the flow of monetary resources connected to that. So if you could charge somebody
a certain amount of money to then turn activate the music, right, and that could be connected to
your NFT and aggregate data in a way that hasn't been done within gaming and metaverses. So that's
what I'm excited about. I'd love to hear your guys's thoughts. We are finally seeing the metaverse,
I remember six years ago I was at the Chinese theater with some of the biggest metaverse
builders and they were saying there also happened to be blockchain builders but they weren't
connected and I think blockchain provides a ton of solutions for other technologies like AI,
like metaverses. So I'm super excited to see what this does for NFTs and by definition then
if you look at Nifty Gateway, I mean Nifty Island, there's blooms i.e tokens and you just saw
Mochaverse just announced today that they're launching two more tokens, shards and another
one but these are tokens i.e what we would call shit coins or meme coins or alt coins depending
on how much a market cap or stability they had accomplished but now they're being used
in the way that they actually are which is it's tokenomics, it's incentive-based ecosystems and
as long as there's businesses behind it and there's revenue being generated we're getting
away from the Ponzi as long as the funds are being used properly. So I see these evolutions
of tokens that things that start as quote-unquote scams and then infrastructure and
use cases get built around it and all of a sudden they're no longer a scam. I believe soon NFTs will
not be speculative, there'll still be speculation, but they will be your identities. You add a 6551
contract to that, now you're collecting assets through an ecosystem, now you're collecting
token-gatable rights, provable on-chain rights and ownership throughout ecosystems. Joseph,
what's going on dude and thanks for listening to my rant guys. Hey no worries man, good to
be back on. Can everybody hear me okay Noah? Am I coming through okay?
Good yeah perfect okay because I have like this weird wi-fi extension at my house that sometimes
kicks off but anyway yeah glad we're getting back to you know really what NFTs were supposed to be
used for. I'm going to forget about Metaverse for a minute because I'll tie that in a second
but then like NFTs were always meant to be a digital representation of something physical
right? A physical asset, a physical good, some kind of service, something right? And that was
always what after we got rid of and flushed the kind of art wave from the last couple bull runs
what you know NFTs were going to get to. So that's number one. Now that that being said you know
Fidgetl I think you're exactly right in talking about building the ecosystem and you know from
a legal point of view I just want to make sure that everybody understands is if you're going to
launch an NFT or launch a project make sure that ecosystem is already planned out and built already
especially if you're a U.S. company. You know I specialize in this and this is not a show at all
I'm just a regulatory and compliance lawyer in the U.S. and I have been in crypto since 2015
and the biggest mistake I see projects time and time again which you kind of touched on is
raise money and not have anything planned really outside of the first couple months a few months
roadmap and don't have anything built. Joseph just to just to add to that it's important for
people to remember whether it's a security or not is only one part of the legal analysis there is
what we call common law there is fraud there is right there's there's things that are separate
so agree Joseph please correct correct and absolutely there's a whole you know ecosystem
that's been developed and people that still think this is a wild west are out of their goddamn
minds at this point really because it's not right there's Mika regulations in the EU that are that
are going into effect or already in effect there's very stringent KYC AML laws globally that have
been adopted there's U.S. specific sort of ish frameworks that are being developed by enforcement
I mean we can argue that all day and I don't think it's been developed yet really but we know
and there's there's guidelines so that you have to follow in order to have a successful project
and I think you're exactly right so people that are developing it and watching NFTs now
please make sure that you have some kind of plan that is clearly communicated to your community
and perspective investors because a lot of them are securities clearly please register with the
appropriate agencies if you want to have a long-living and successful project and just consult
an attorney and people that have been in general you know before you go too far into the project
and can't unwind because that's the biggest mistake I see with developers that come to me
six months twelve months after they launched it and they're like now what we've been either you
know contacted by somebody or we are worried about this and it's like well yeah I should have
worried about it from day one you know and you've taken 15 steps in furtherance of some kind of
legal issue that you're going to have down the road that we're seeing on a global scale so I think
you know that's kind of that we're like I said we're going with NFTs and it's just a little bit
of a legal overview now tying into meta versus I think you're exactly right as well we're going
to see a lot more of those digital slash real world hybrids now with NFTs what I would call NFT 2.0
and you know a lot of the companies are going in the right way you're seeing major major players
in the last year or so get into the NFT market and not just do it as art but do it as representations
of ownership or brand advertising or marketing or whatever and you know I think you're right
at the next three four five years we're going to see a major shift there and that is where it's going.
I love that and I like that if you step back there's a balance between how the legalities
are evolving right and as you said right there are laws on the books the the argument that this
is the wild wild west and that there are no laws that that is a lie by somebody that's either a lie
or an ignorant statement by the by the speaker there are plenty of laws and anything in between
that there's a strong smell test that let me tell you right now if the sec decides that it smells
bad you lose so if you're building probably act accordingly if it smells bad right if you're if
you don't know why you're incorporating in the seashells it's probably because you're trying to
hide something or you're choosing a jurisdiction that makes sense for your business plan and you
be able to explain that so I agree wholeheartedly and I think that the advancements of these
integrations push our understanding of of why these things exist and what they can do and fall
more clearly into legal guidelines right now that NFTs can and this is just a small part now that
NFTs right like nifty island you can rig you can go in with your token get NFT and now run around
in your identity which hasn't really been fully done well till now there's been a lot of companies
building them but there hasn't been a highly successful ecosystem to play with them within
the heart of web 3 and you're going to see more and more and more of this and you're also going
to see ip marketplace is coming up it's already happening with overpass so all these things
flesh out what it means to be an owner of an NFT and helps you understand what it is you actually
own the jpeg via the ownership of the NFT or the the control of the NFT at any given time
and so I'm super excited about the evolution of these and how everything kind of plays out
and becomes clearer I had a whole space yesterday about what it means to promote a token
and if you're an influencer if you're a kol what do you have to disclose and
it became pretty clear that there's a balance between what is actually legal and what people
want to be considered illegal right they want to say that there's no clear legalities as to
promoting something yes there is there's there's promoter laws it's like it's not this is not a new
world run of mars if you are promoting something you must disclose if you hold it and most likely
how you got it it's not complicated um so I can go on forever but dill love to hear your thoughts
and we're going to meteorite yeah I think it's uh it's great and I wanted to comment on the
meta versus the discussion as well but yeah I think it's really important that founders understand
some of the regulations and legalities and build some actual products and use case behind
your ecosystem because that's super important um and making sure this you know when people buy
your coin or your NFT that they're going to have some active use cases for that so anyway I wanted
to comment on meta versus I think that's actually a great active use case that you see a lot of
tokens a lot of meta verses out there I've been active in different ones and you mentioned how it
goes with music a big part of what I've done is doing shows in meta versus uh performing I think
it's great for music you've seen some really big artists do that as well um you know Snoop Dogg
and Marshmello or whoever you know big artists are tapping into this right so I think
just to wrap with you correct me if I'm wrong I think I'd be crazy if this wasn't accurate but
my guess is you're also now thinking about ways to reward your your holders of your token
and integrating it into these ecosystems would that be correct yeah definitely I mean I I think
that's the future right is being in the metaverse and and seeing a lineup of artists that you know
picture your metaverse music festival or concert and instead of just enjoying the artist you can
sit there and say you know what this artist is really amazing and boom right there behind the
stage or next to the stage you're gonna click and buy their token or buy their NFT and support them
and so it really gives this uh fan integrated experience right or maybe you say oh my god this
this song is uh perfect I want to license this song for my web 3 game that I'm building because
you know this is an active artist in web 3 and I want to license the song and then do some
collaborative promotion with the artist right this is something I do all the time and when you
buy the token you can actually get rights to use that music and license it right so it just
adds this completely different element to uh a metaverse experience but yeah for me it's it's
been a lot more just about connecting with the community networking right because for an artist
and at the place we're in right now web 3 like there's huge potential for the future but let's
talk about where we're at right now which is really about bringing more artists and bringing
more community together and so as an artist when I'm looking at a new blockchain or I'm looking at
a new metaverse I'm thinking this is a great opportunity to connect with new people in web
3 who might be interested in this other chain right and if I can drop an NFT on there have
something available for them to buy that's great even if not um you know perhaps I send them to
some of my other music or some of my other NFTs whatever the case may be it's a great
opportunity to network so I think that's one of the great use cases for music and can I can
answer a question of course I don't do you know of any NFT projects music NFT projects that that have
uh intelligently and intentionally delineated out the rights of use for the music on the NFTs
does anybody like given like given mechanic uh like like licensing or or masters rights or
anything like that yeah of course uh we have that through the dill music license so by holding a
million dill or a dill NFT you get access to that license and so when you read through it it
basically gives you limited rights to use the music and it can be used in a different web 3
apps as well and games that's actually some of the preferred use cases but yeah we detailed that
and uh it's really came inspired by spotty wi-fi for a long time he's had a great license out there
and so he was uh you know originally I was selling my music as NFTs and when I learned
how to make a great license he was one of the inspirations so I've kind of fine tuned
our license for our use case but yeah basically just outlines what any holder is able to do and
there's limited rights on monetization so you can't just take the song and put it into a movie and
make 50k and run off with the money of course you don't have the rights you know 100 rights to go
monetize on all the music but you do have rights to use it for limited use cases such as building
your own apps building your own games promotional videos all the stuff that you would normally need
to license music for you can actually use the dill music for so it's pretty cool use cases
and obviously the the um that's super cool the the top of the pinnacle of this kind of use case
is when the smart contract actually functionally controls the use and rights right and and finances
which also requires the uh both sides of the transaction right so the metaverse would have
to be token gating and read or whatever verse you're trying to use that asset in would be reading
and and and functionally required to honor that honor it code is law right only be able to use
the asset as the grant of code allows and then and then flow the fun the financials through that
asset as well so for example keep it simple uh music you have you get 50 percent of uh of revenue
from the use of of an nft music nft for a year uh and then you port that into your metaverse
and people who want to turn on the music or or use the music in their own ecosystems
have to have to buy or license or rent that asset and by definition the monies then get sent to
the asset i think something like a six five five one contract that then get distributed automatically
50 50 to the nft holder and the issuer in your case dill right and and it's those kinds of things
that if you step back and think about it yes they're jpegs yes they're music but what we're
really talking about in nft is we're talking about an actionable receipt and i think we're getting
closer and closer to these things becoming automated which i see as the future right these
are the things that in a business you could automate accounting and you'd have to token
gate inputs and outputs and so many use cases that the blockchain itself provides uh metarides
welcome to the stage and i think this is a really cool day also welcome metapanda welcome doc tammer
darius um davo everybody lucas uh people like metapanda who are building 3d rigged projects
right meta metaride who built a 3d project that is now getting ways to actually use them
right you don't have to build your own metaverse necessarily you built the assets that was your
project now you have a place for people to actually use these and your bets on the future
of development of things like the metaverse and nfts will likely pay off so meta rides i'd love
to hear how your what you think of nifty island the development of metaverses in general and how
the how your you and your community or and or your investors are responding to kind of the future
of use cases uh i appreciate the warm welcome fidgetl i think you yawned in the middle of that
you're not supposed to yawn in web 3 anymore um mobi media fidgetl thanks for having us i appreciate
it um everybody in the space before i get rolling uh repost the space um it's spaces like this that
i think that we all get nuggets from and it helps with our own you know internal build so make sure
that you're retweeting reposting whatever you call it these days um i'm gonna circle back to joseph
real quick um i feel like not only do we need to play by the rules of the laws but we also need to
structure our business in a way that helps us individually whether it's you know tax benefits
or whatever whether you need to s corp or c corp or whatever um meta rides is in that process right
now we're figuring out the best you know path for us with raising um so i think that you know first
of all make sure that you're building your you know your brand the right way your company the right
way etc um secondly i'm going to go back to dill um i think that what's coming is you know with
music in general and fidgetl you touched on this it's going to be about the masters right it's going
to be about licensing it's going to be about um who can use the music and where uh how it plays
out financially etc i've been explaining to musicians in spaces for a long time now be prepared
for a wave of unity and unreal worlds that start to open make sure that you're ready because they're
going to open they're going to have two or three weeks of excitement and then they're going to be
circling back trying to figure out how to keep daily active users and at that point you know on
top of any music plays that they've already done i think that they're going to start trying to
integrate you know with musicians more and also with each other and start to play nice in the
sandbox and and you know start to work together um i will touch on nifty real quick uh nifty island
is unique to us because nifty's model is that they're going to the brands and bringing the
brands into their ecosystem and underneath their umbrella you know meteorites is a little bit
different we're creating the assets to work in any world where as a user you can build out your
digital identity and own your vehicle and if it's a pink Cadillac for instance and when you see that
pink Cadillac drive by in any world you know that that's digital drive in that car and that's
something that you know we're trying to bring with the digital identity side of it but it doesn't
mean that we can't you know bend and play by nifty island's rules um we're trying to reach out to
them right now to get that built out but that's something that's not necessarily in our our
initial vision so we're not going to push the envelope too much on that but i do think that
it's important for you know you to figure out what your model is and then you know there's going
to be pivots web three we're all pivoting almost every day uh but don't pivot off of your you know
solving your problem and making sure that you're building what you need to build to you know to
utilize web three in a way that that you know build your dreams or whatever but um i do want
to touch on the assets a little bit too so i think that you know i don't want to go too far into
interoperability but i think that metaverse worlds are you know i think in some cases right
now in web three gaming circles not getting the attention that they deserve and i think that
what's going to happen is is that not only will you be able to utilize your you know let's just
say vehicle for instance inside each of the titles that meta rides creates but also inside other
worlds you know meta ops uh is a gaming platform that has nothing to do with racing but they from
the very beginning of meta rides wanted vehicles because they think it would be cool to be able to
you know spawn a vehicle and get out of a bunker where you're in trouble and ultimately go somewhere
else to fight your fight and i think that there's going to be a lot of interoperable plays there
and in addition to that i think that it's uh going to be a longer term play where you know
you get to utilize those assets from a gaming environment inside each of these metaverse worlds
and that's what we're building right now we're talking to over 100 metaverse worlds right now
in an effort to be you know either the native vehicle or you know some sort of first vehicle
inside each of those locations so i think that there's going to be a lot of play between worlds
i don't think it's going to be initial because everybody wants to be the biggest and the best
but i do think that music is going to play a big role in that as well like for instance we're
playing meta rides radio inside every car dills on the radio darius is on the radio i saw coup de
ville down below i know that he's providing his music and that's also a way that we can give back
to musicians to be able to share people from our ecosystem with what they're building and then send
people back their way but it's i think that you know you know the bottom line on everything that
i think i just said is about collaboration and then ultimately understanding the legal rights
of what you're doing with the musicians and figuring out a path to making sure that you're
doing it correctly and that everybody you know gets paid accordingly but masters is going to be
where it's at digital i have a feeling as music starts to integrate into gaming web3 gaming and
then ultimately into metaverse worlds whether you walk into a building and music's playing
or whether it's music inside a vehicle or whether it's a concert i think it's going to come down to
the masters and who owns what percentage of each track is going to be pretty interesting on how that
plays out shut up man thank you for putting the music in the meta rides i played the game it's
awesome i just wanted to shout you out i meant to shout you out before actually so love what you're
doing it's amazing one of the best use cases for ip and what i love by the way is we had a thousand
quote unquote nothing no insult we had a thousand meta rides what i mean by that is
and we've had these for years i i remember in 2020 2021 you're going to drive your you're going
to fly your flying car through the metaverse by the the metaverse token those companies are not
around so i think everybody should take a note from meta rides and nifty island is doing the same
thing yo just a just a short pitch to you physical and meta rides um i think something that's
overlooked on the nifty island side is the same way that the ethereum chain did the erc 1155 and
standardized things they have something called mixama where they basically have a platform standard
for how you can put things on there which you might think oh they're gating it because they
use you know basically uh autocad level stuff to put their stuff on but they're not they're
setting the standard for how things should be implemented and then you you know you go through
the white paper i know most time warmer in these spaces digital people don't read those things but
it is a good standard and it shows what is what is reading yeah exactly yeah for for real man like
this is a totally monstrous space i love that there you have joseph on here talking about laws
and stuff i this i'm so glad you invited me to this man this is rad but like they're setting
the standard to let you know that this is the jumping off point and they intend to grow and so
you know if these types of things are of an interest like you know if that's your if that's
your play then you know you know that they at least have a plan which is what you guys alluded
to earlier most projects don't have that 357 because you know when you're consistently
recycling other people's things it's hard to make a new thing from a bunch of old things right and
so i don't know i think spaces like these are are super important and oftentimes overlooked
because you're teaching people how to be adults in this space so big thanks man joe's follow you
memorize all you guys thanks rdc and uh honestly the reason a big reason why i go into other spaces
um there's there's several reasons one is to keep a finger on the pulse the best way to do that in
my opinion is you it's like it's like super downloading the information you want instead
of rolling through the feed or reading much articles you can get a good feel for what's
going on just what people are talking about and kind of sentiment it also helps to build product
market fit right which is a double-edged sword you got to understand what people want in order
to build uh what they want and that doesn't mean panda that just means understand what's
what's making sense at the moment because that's gonna i'm sure andrew like this that'll make your
marketing either a lot harder or a lot easier to do in this space explaining what your product is
is an amazingly complicated endeavor because everybody's skeptical from the beginning that
you're you're shit is shit but another reason is i get to meet people like rdc and and metapanda
and probably everybody in this space by speaking in in spaces and engaging and then being able to
cross pollinate communities and have people like rdc in this space and yes thank you rdc for the
compliment i do consider this space an adult space which is probably why we don't have a lot of
the degens on a regular basis but i'd rather have education information than popularity any day of
the week so thank you rdc and thank you guys for joining someone has to build the toys on the
playground right i guess there's nothing else there's nobody else to sell it to if there isn't
i guess but uh we like to talk about why things are being built here uh why tokens are being used
why chains are making the decisions they're making uh and and how how you can navigate this
place from a higher perspective no pun intended ryan you have your hand up welcome brother how you
doing yeah yeah i'm doing great love the space um i i was just gonna go ahead and agree with
what you're saying and and i guess you know plus one that i think it's critical for builders in
the space for anyone working in the space to to join these discussions and listen in if you're
not crypto moves so quickly and what three moves so quickly that if you're not on twitter spaces
and and listening to the developments happening and staying up to date with ecosystems and
actually you know boots on the ground participating i i don't know how you build a business or build
an application that that you know grows and and keeps up with the trajectory of the industry it's
there's not a lot of industries like this which is one reason why it's so addicting once you start
working in the space but also so i think addicting as a user is that once you kind of get a little
bite or a little taste of the culture and crypto and then you start to learn about what's being
built and why culture matters and and how it's ingrained in the the entrepreneurs and the users
and the collectors in the space you just it creates this feedback loop that i don't think that you
you get in any other industry and so i agree it's completely critical it's great to have these spaces
where people can talk about what they're building talk about the new innovations i mean if if twitter
or x is you know the the global town hall for crypto it's you know it's it's even more so because
so much of it happens on on twitter and x and so i completely agree with that i think it's a mistake
for uh builders in the space and entrepreneurs in the space to not participate in these and even
though some spaces out there are a lot of noise and chaos uh that's you know for better or worse
that's part of the culture if you don't understand that then you might not be in the right industry
ryan in in a funny way and it's gonna sound terrible but it's just reality if i meet somebody
that i'm planning on like partnering with or in this space or do business with and they don't
know who i am i'm surprised but it also instantly tells me that they don't they either don't have
their finger on their pulse or they're in a completely different ecosystem and therefore
they also don't have their finger on the pulse they only have their finger on that ecosystems
pulse so i think it's exactly sorry go ahead please no i say exactly i mean it's it's it's
just part of the job honestly is you have to you have to be out there and spend that you know i
constantly feel like i spend way too much time on twitter um but in the times where i've been like
on a vacation you know for example where uh i've tried to stay off my phone and you come back and
you feel like you've missed a year of innovation and a year of development and and not just news
flow but you know the new applications people are using the new ecosystems that have popped up and
and you it's really hard to make that ground up once you once you've lost it so i was uh just a
funny anecdote i was at a uh i was at a talk with eric belchinus who's the bloomberg uh senior ETF
analyst uh last week and he's obviously been covering spot bitcoin ETFs uh for the past six
to nine months and he it was really funny because he's been in the financial industry for i don't
know 30 years and what he was saying was that he uh has now been spending 80 percent or more of his
time in the crypto world and his twitter feed is now just full of crypto stuff and he even said
once you get a taste of it i don't know how you go back to a traditional web2 or financial job
once you get a taste of that culture it's so addicting and so exciting and innovative it's
hard to find fulfillment uh and not be bored going back to a non-crypto space ryan let me
let me tie together right and i have people all the time they reach out to me i like to i like
to help i guess whatever mentor or give advice if i can to people but it happens all the time
and often i get the question of like so i'm gonna go back to you know i'm gonna get a web2 job
and it reminds me of what you're you're really talking about and it's from this little a little
interaction i have my girlfriend the other day um she's not she's cleaning so that didn't sound
good um she's doing stuff um no the cleaners are actually coming today she's not clean uh but she
so she she has the luxury of being able to to do her passion which is modeling and acting and all
that good stuff and she is successful at it and then she also has a day job running at a fortune
50 company running socials and marketing and she complains about the job that job is the easiest
corporate job you'll ever have in your life you don't have to go into the office you you post at
your own uh free will if you're doing your job right nobody bothers you and she tells me how
much she hates her job i had to explain to her you don't hate your job baby you hate corporate jobs
period and it's because you've been ruined you get to do what you love for the most part
and that that feeling can't be replicated the convergence of doing something you love that
also is your job right that that that is also something you're intellectually passionate about
it's no longer your job right for ryan albet and most of the people in there i'm thinking about
crypto wherever i am it's not crypto i'm thinking about how blockchain can can innovate uh and solve
problems i could be traveling and i go fuck this ticketing system just doesn't make sense
i can't wait for for tickets to be fungible right it just makes sense and it will happen so i
wholeheartedly agree but that taste is not necessarily crypto for me at least unless you're
a degenerate gambler and you just had a big come up and then you're just in love with money which
is fine but this space is not just what it's made out to be crypto and gambling it's infrastructure
it's technology it's ideology it's it's philosophy it's community it's like-minded people you can't
have these conversations at a bar around the corner or it takes two hours to get to the point
where the conversation even makes sense so there is a beauty in in this space go ahead ryan and
then we'll go to andrew yeah no i just agree this is the intersection of so many amazing schools of
thought and and it's technology its philosophy it's uh it's about social interactions and game
theory there's so many fascinating topics that meet at the intersection of blockchain technology
crypto you know decentralization things like that that um you you just could never get bored and so
i i completely agree with that and uh and yeah it's just it's it's a wonderful thing and it's
you were you were kind of mentioning like you can't help but be somewhere and think about you
know nft sticks this or like this this or this and i it's it's such a funny meme in the sense that
like crypto fixes this blockchain fixes this but i think until you're out in the out and about in
the real world doing something completely unrelated to work or whatever you're building
and you start having those thoughts like whether it's the grocery store or the airport or uh you
know shopping online or something like it starts to just can be a continual trickle into the brain
like oh man blockchain will fix this eventually and uh it's it's not just a meme it's the reality
that i believe in and yeah just completely agree with that and what a cool time to be in
and there's a perfect segue to andrew um what a beautiful time to be in where i
a lot of us have been there for a long time and i remember when we would say blockchain
could fix this right and it was dependent on a whole bunch of factors crypto the regulation
legal uh greed gambling web 2 onboarding now for me at least and i think most people it's
blockchain when will blockchain solve this meaning it will happen it's now just a matter of time and
i think we've passed the we're getting past the speculation point there'll obviously be
speculations for the next phase but we're we've reached a tipping point in my opinion
um from all factors that this that this is real these solutions will happen ticketing will be
revolutionized it it it's just fighting money right uh weed will be legal it's just fighting
big tobacco money so uh not to get too esoteric but i wanted to pivot to andrew because
andrew is really good at what he does from web 2 andrew is a dgen and has translated that
pretty much uh unfortunately without replication so i can't fucking hire him or somebody like him
but i will i will rape his brain at lunch um in an hour in three hours um i'm looking forward to it
but that convergence uh right is a beautiful thing and it's a beautiful thing to see as well
wealth of knowledge so andrew welcome i'd love to hear your thoughts on what we're talking about
besides for the raping of your brain in a couple hours i was gonna say if you if you don't want to
take advantage of me uh i've got i think i'm on a space today at uh two o'clock um called marketing
for dummies so if you want to jump in i'll i'll share a lot of knowledge there um and honestly
a lot of it is is like dispelling myths and i think like misconceptions about a lot of this stuff
um but anyways i wanted to actually go on a serious note does that mean we're supposed to
do lunch at 130 so does that mean no lunch oh no we're having lunch yeah oh okay can you
can you say you have a space at two o'clock uh at uh two o'clock eastern time yes okay um so i wanted
to go back to the to the conversation about keeping your finger on the pulse because i think
this is like a very important one um and i think it applies to to so many different things it applies
to you know if you're a builder if you're a community leader if you are even just a trader
right you know i think again there's a lot of valuable information out there it's just the
challenge and just to kind of give some context like i built a um or helped build a media company
that was literally built on the back of social platforms of the day so i've worked with you know
all these platforms directly hit at the highest levels and i think like this is no new news to
anyone but the way they build their algorithms is they're prioritizing things like engagement right
so i'll give you an example like if you're in one community and you start liking certain posts
you know obviously the algorithm is identifying those and serving you more of that content right
because that drives higher metrics that they can point to from an ad sales standpoint right so i
think the key thing you have to always remember is that for you page is literally for you and it's
for keeping you in a very small bubble right so so i'll give folks a little bit of like a tutorial
and this isn't rocket science just like how do you keep your finger on the on the broader pulse
um it's really about twitter lists and i'll give you an example so um let's uh let's use arbitrum
where i came from right so see more of arbitrum um i would have first you know one list that
includes all my employee handles uh all my company handles uh you know maybe even investor handles
right and then what i can do is i can monitor that every single morning quickly and see kind
of what is the chatter across kind of my own you know oh and oh um project right then i typically
would have you know competitor lists right so i might put you know who our top competitors are
i might also put the founders of those companies in that list and then that gives me a sense of kind
of what are the competitors talking about today tomorrow every single day you know etc um influencers
like there's different types of influencers right so again let's say i'm focused on you know a DEX
i might have you know one group of influencers that are more kind of native traders in the
you know let's call it five thousand to fifty thousand follower range right i may have a separate
list for what i would call like the mega influencers that have kind of over 500 000 followers right
and and the value of this is is what happens is you know you might have one for news outlets you
might have one for vcs it really just depends on what your vertical is but then what you basically
have is now you have curated feeds you know tied to all of the things that can potentially impact
you or your project or kind of the alpha that you're seeking and and what also starts to happen
by doing that is because you're scrolling over those accounts and you're liking those posts
the algorithm identifies that and starts to serve it so like just by creating these these very curated
lists not only can you get a better sense on like the pulse but you actually have the ability to
impact the algorithm for the better and so instead of all i'm seeing is my friends all i'm seeing is
the project that i'm a community member of you'll start to see kind of more of this broader stuff
and then obviously you know another tip is is rss feeders rss readers because not only can you add
like crypto native sites but you can add you know crypto related press from tech sites you can add
international news outlets and simply use google translate but i think again like great marketing
starts with with research and i think at the end of the day pretty much everything starts with
research and that i think this has been a hack for me that really helps me keep my finger on
the pulse and not get locked into a bubble i guess is the best way to put it so hopefully
that's helpful for folks damn i didn't know any of that um and i'm gonna hopefully somebody wrote
it down i literally just started peeling through lists just like yeah i was like what i've never
heard of this black magic foolery it's fucking genius by the way if you don't follow andrew um
uh do so uh if you are planning to launch a project if you're planning to do business in life
marketing is critical and there is nobody that i know that has their finger better on the pulse
in terms of web 3 and how to analyze and deploy that andrew so give him a follow and not listen
if he's in a space and you see purple around it you are going to learn and i'm telling you right
now it is stuff that you will not learn from anybody i've not heard anybody come remotely
close what you're going to hear from everybody else about marketing is okay you need to have
this many kol's and you need to you need to do this much of free giveaways and then you need to
get this alpha chat and let me let me be very clear that stuff does work right in this space
if you throw enough capital and don't fuck up right no matter how much money you throw in there
if you ruin your reputation doesn't really make a difference go ahead and jerk yes one thing i was
gonna i appreciate all the compliments um one thing i was gonna add is i'm trying to help people
yeah yeah i mean i think that the challenge too is like this industry is so new like everything's
kind of being invented right like a lot of the marketing models it's test and learn you know
something works um there's a great book that i've always loved called you know steal this art which
basically talks about no marketing is actually you know different or new everything is is
effectively something that's been done before that's restructured or re-scanned or made to
feel kind of novel and new um but like you know you can look at points for example you know points
obviously is a big kind of marketing narrative right now and i think where this comes from and
i'll go back to like arbitrum odyssey that i did when we were at arbitrum like right after that
you saw you know optimism quest you saw mantle uh the mantle journey you know all these things
um the first thing is like don't be territorial right because if you as a marketer or you as a
project can crack the code on a new model that works like you know obviously imitation is this
sincere form of flattery but also like it's going to move the broader space forward right because
people are starting to lean into tactics that are effective um but but the thing i wanted to talk
about for a second is you know i've talked about this before you have you know different tactics
for natives different tactics for normies different tactics for different channels against those
audiences right but i think like one of the biggest misconceptions right now is that everything's
organic and and the reason i'm concerned about this is let's talk about kind of the the um the
speculation phase right so when you're at a project that's kind of pre-air drop you have
the ability to basically upper funnel bring tons and tons of people in right but then the actual
airdrop moment is very important because if you align with expectations or if you outperform
expectations those folks can actually convert into you know loyal users um loyal supporters
you know long-term value customers is kind of the web two way of saying it um if the airdrop does
not live up to their expectations and and again that's not just from a gas fee standpoint it's
also from a time standpoint right then what effectively happens is you burn those people
not only do you not convert them into long-term customers but you also then have effectively
you know negative sentiment that could impact you know new customer acquisition the reason i'm
bringing this up is because i think there's a little bit of a misconception that everything's
driven by kind of community and height and speculation all that once you get past that
speculation moment aka that giant airdrop you're you're now in a completely different world where
it's about you know one um you know customer retention um and two continued growth you know
against whatever those metrics are for your project and it's very hard you know once you
don't have that giant incentive hanging down sure you can do influencer campaigns that give you kind
of reach and awareness you know sure you can do incentive campaigns that drive you know trials
and repeat trials but but i i'm a little worried about projects that get you know and maybe this
is part of why a lot of people say you know don't buy a token that was here for the last poll but
like this the same phase beyond the speculation phase is very challenging and and a lot of these
pozzonomic tactics that i see are not going to work and they're also not going to work
for mass adoption and bringing normies in so i i do think again you've got to really think about
marketing in terms of the life cycle of the product and you can't assume that that speculation
phase is a repeatable thing you know at this point the information is so good it's probably
not even illegal to stalk andrew like real time like i think that's how close you should follow
them just to be weird please don't
did i rub yeah i mean maybe oh sorry he was talking yeah i guess
and uh uh should i blame twitter is probably my fat thumb um i love when people like it's
glitching yeah it's glitching just for you you're that important and i bet you believe in god too
have a great day um you're not that important motherfucker uh i think i just hit the head of
the nail on the head which is that there's a difference between marketing that works
short term and marketing that works long term i.e for a business right and so when i said if
you're listening to other people market and talking about marketing 99.99 percent of the time
you're listening to both sides of one coin which is a hype and that works it works right to get your
project up the ground but let me tell you right now that that founder and you see it on the timeline
it's so tough this is oh my gosh web 3 it's so it's so rough being a founder around here
it's tough making businesses it's really it's even tougher making businesses
in nascent ecosystems especially one that's wrought with gambling and doesn't believe in
substance so if you're really trying to launch a project with substance you really really have to
think about what's going to make this less painful which is a bonus to you and a bonus to your
customers because it means they're happy means you're delivering what they want um meteorites
and then andrew yeah i'll go and then meteorites i'd love to hear about by the way for those who
don't know earlier on i mentioned about disclosure i will reverse disclose so for all the all the
grifters and haters this is not a paid show with meteorites he is a human that has good takes that
happens to be launching a project who's smart enough to be wearing his brand because he can
slip in his projects and i don't mind because guess what meteorites has been here consistently
i remember you i know if i join if i join a space that's not our own spaces i'm joining
on the moby account i'm not joining on my personal it's a way to do it agree completely
but meteorites not but meteorites i'd love to hear you've been here you you've stayed around
you didn't run like like most projects did how has the journey been how are things right now and
then to to your to your topics so um first of all andrew i sent you a dm we need to connect um
secondly uh being in the space for a long time you see things that work and more importantly
things that don't work i think that marketing and web three there's 98 of people are doing the
f around and find out approach and i think that you know it's it's really really tough because
listen i'm gonna back up a little bit and look at the macro my partner craig and i we've been a
business of marketing forever right but it's been traditional web two businesses um you know major
sports leagues etc but getting into the web three bubble um it is just a different animal it you've
got to really you know figure out whether you're going to play the dj card whether you're going to
play the full web three card whether you're going to play 10 web three and then go after the web two
audience and try to onboard and all of those decisions have to be made to figure out who your
target audience is ultimately going to be and how you're going to approach that audience i think that
there are so many people that are just focused on today's sale i think that they're so focused on
today's market and it scares the crap out of me because you know i learned pretty early on i've
been in web three twitter spaces for what almost three years now and i learned early on that
focusing on the sale was stupid just focus on your brand you know build out what you're doing
be trustworthy help when you can if somebody is behind you in their journey give them a hand help
them out help them with their twitter bio for crying out loud whatever it is you know if you
can help somebody it's ultimately going to still build that network for you whether for me whether
it's under my hermy pfp or the meteorites pfp and by the way fidgetl some spaces won't pull me
up under this pfp so i appreciate you for that um by the way it's it's it's because they're part
of the problem and i don't mean that they are the problem right it's it's because they they haven't
taken the time and like and you said to research and understand the difference between being
afraid that you're shilling something and educating if we don't let projects up because we're afraid
that we'd be seeing that we're shilling and i made a point to try to bring a project like i want to
hear what metapend is building not because like oh we're afraid of shilling it's it's a cool project
now if you if you come if you come up in your project as shit i will rip you to shreds but
that's also good right go ahead right for entertainment purposes as well um the the
point that i wanted to make and i actually have to jump pretty quickly because i got to take my dog
out he is not going to want to pee on the floor for me um wait wait you paid you paid for two
hours like this oh that's right my bad um yeah just keep it so the uh i want to i want to talk
real quick about the title of the space the future of nfts and metaverses right we've already seen a
world where nfts are they going to be digital collectibles are they going to be called something
else because web2 isn't receiving nfts that term very well i also think that we also need to figure
out what metaverses are going to be called whether they're going to be v worlds or e worlds or
whatever that case may be that term is going to change because the term metaverse has a negative
connotation in today's web2 market so i think as we're building out the future of nfts as we're
building out the future of web3 gaming as we're building out the future of metaverses i honestly
feel that this is such a big point again we all know how to talk to our web2 friends about what
we're building we also understand how to talk to our web3 people if you talk to somebody at web2 as
fast as i'm going now and mention the word blockchain you just lose them immediately right
so you need to slow down show some passion but not necessarily over the top like i get when i'm
talking to my web3 peeps and i think that by the way if you want to if you want to practice that
just talk to talk i'm not i can't practice it i've practiced it enough with investors and i've
screwed it up a few times too but i think that it's important to understand that terminology matters
slowing down and explaining matters share your vision on somewhere on your website share your
vision in a way that people can understand it if you're onboarding web2 people make sure that you
can explain it to them and give them an entry point that's separate from the web3 entry point
and build that into what you're building i think that it'll make a big difference for everybody
just i agree completely meta by the way and that's what we're really highlighting a lot in
in a lot of these and this is an undertone that people just aren't recognizing really is
is that because in this industry you don't have to raise capital
right it's a good and a bad thing it's a good thing because it allows for more liquidity and
more creation right it also leads to many more car crashes to get to the to the to the advancement
of the tech but it's because you don't have to sit there and explain your product and your marketing
roll up and your runway and your burn rate and your and your long-term strategy to get the money
in the first place right and so there's reasons why raising from the public is illegal and why
securities laws exist it's for it's for protecting not just consumers but also founders there is
there's a skill and an art to understanding your product being able to articulate it both to
an investor for long-term business and also how you're going to market it which means you understand
the short and medium term of getting people on board getting them to stick getting them to use
right and that's one thing that we really lose and again i agree with the renaming right we're
literally cleaning up that's cleaning up the mess that that lack of uh uh business knowledge
requirements cause right so gambling has go ahead sorry to interrupt i do want to jump no no please
listen this is super important for everybody that's listening
if you are talking to any sort of investor any sort of potential you know user or community member or
your hiring whatever your first question should be what is your experience in blockchain or nft's
or web3 then when you find out where they are you could speak intelligently to that person
based on where they are it is so huge not to assume where they are not to assume that they
know what you know and ultimately you know build your pitch based on that depending on who you're
talking to couldn't agree more at the first i think the first question is what's your twitter
and then you just run through that and if that's not sufficient then you ask for their wallets and
then you go through that agreed andrew you had your hand up i wanted to go to you
yeah i mean i'll hit that one real quick i think you make a really good point like i i do agree
that's a best practice like you've got to understand your audience before you try to educate them
and then like one thing i've even learned over time is like my definition of natives was was
very wrong right because being an arbitrum the definition of a native was someone that was you
know quite technical and candidly probably came from a developer background and then what i find
is on broader ct the definition of a native is typically someone who's been in the space longer
um you know has obviously interacted with numerous products but again they may not understand topics
like mev you know and things like that or or they may not even understand what a node is or what an
oracle is and i would just say for folks out there like the best tool to educate yourself is chat gbt
you can literally say explain crypto notes to me like i'm five years old it'll create analogies
and in 10 minutes you'll now understand those those topics right um but anyways i wanted to
pivot back um into what we're talking about in terms of this notion of like long-term thinking
um versus kind of short-term land grabbing so i i want to just like give an example to kind of
maybe help folks think about this and this is something you can apply to i i really think any
sector um and it'll make sense kind of when i'm done but so so here's an example of like how to
approach it from a long-term perspective in in terms of customer values so um so i work at at
hassler which is obviously a multi-chain decks we're now across chain decks right we recently
launched on solana we basically built the ability for you to you know swap between both um ethereum
and arbitrum natively right to solana right um why did we do that right because you could
andrew andrew andrew for the for the audience would you mind just briefly explaining what
natively means and why that yeah why that's why that's a positive thing yeah so there's no synthetic
assets so i think like one of the things people you know don't always understand is when you're
making swaps sometimes you're not actually getting that token you're getting obviously
like a wrapped version of it or you know a synthetic version of it the other thing is
you know typically um you know bridges tend to be one of the places that get exploited the most and
usually it's due to human error but i would argue like there's two moments obviously for you one
when you're getting on the bridge and two when you're getting off the bridge where there can be
vulnerability right so if you're able to make that swap again natively with no synthetic assets
and not even touch a bridge one you're getting a better asset and two you're really mitigating
and minimizing the risk you have of of having an exploit happen right um hopefully that that made
sense to folks um but anyways um what i was going to say was you know when we were deciding to build
this again we were thinking at it from a long-term perspective and what i mean by that is is why solana
number one solana is very accessible very fast very cheap what that says to me is when we look
towards mass adoption when we look towards the bull run when we look towards normies entering
the market that may end up becoming kind of a first destination for them because again they
don't have to bridge to a layer two you know it's it's an easier experience for them right so so
there's less friction or less barriers is kind of the way to think about it the second thing why
solana is you know i know that this is airdrop season i know there's going to be a ton of
airdrops in solana what that's going to do is it's going to add liquidity to solana and then
obviously when folks get those airdrops you know some may sell immediately some may diversify that
amount into multiple projects you know some may cross-chain it but again like you're looking at
a surge in liquidity that's going to be there right so i'm looking at these as like longer
term factors as to why i would want to have um an operational you know DEX we're actually a DEX
and an aggregator right um and so i knew that right now jupiter is going to control you know
a hundred percent of mine share in solana right because there's a huge incentive there everybody
wants to get the jupiter airdrop once that airdrops over though what what i say to myself is
those users are not all sticky right there are some users that may become very sticky there are
some users that may um what percentage what percentage what percentage do you think jupiter
token is dumping right off the bat just look at course it is the typical thing that happens
on an airdrop i mean i think most folks know this but like when when early folks get the airdrop
there's kind of that initial surge you know and then typically everyone that received it sells it
waits for the dump and then if they're you know bullish or supporters they rebuy it at a lower
price and then write it back up of course they sell it what is the token do what does it do can
someone tell me what the jupiter token does or what any of these their farm tokens they don't do
anything everyone this is literally the same thing that happened three or two years ago when people
were DeFi yield farming on different chains it's the same shit all the points in the airdrops
these tokens are worthless they do nothing you well and so you know and obviously uniswap is
very different right because uniswap had more of a first mover advantage you know i would say again
because they've been around for so long because their audience sides are so long like the brand
is much more visible they've got obviously bigger budgets to do you know brand marketing and
activations and things like that right but but i you know i can't i can't speculate on the retention
percentage but but again once that giant you know incentive is over you know traders on that chain
become a little bit more attainable right and and you know and that's really what it boils down to
is like i'm not launching something right now in solana saying i can take over you know 15 or 20
percent you know uh mindshare there what i'm saying is i think there's going to be a much larger user
base there in the future right that i can try to acquire and then two once these giant you know
airdrops are over there's going to be folks that are not you know 100 loyal to a platform that might
be willing to try and test and use and and see the benefit right because because in my mind i'm
like we have a superior product we've tested prices against uniswap we beat them 99.9 percent
of the time right we now have an aggregator engine so it's scanning every single liquidity pool
including uniswaps and then by the way like you could tap into that uni pool not pay the uni front
end fee and we're doing 50 rev share on the back right so so again i think you have to sometimes
make decisions um and also expect to not see the results immediately like you've got to make
decisions from a long-term perspective on some things and really say you know i'm not just going
to build here for the grant or i'm not just going to build here for you know liquidity and then i'll
give you another example right so so why cross chain between arbitrum and solana because obviously
right now arbitrum is the home of defi there's tons of liquidity there there's tons of traders
there you know if these folks start to become so curious or start to identify great d gen plays
well now i've got a bridge the solution to literally bring them right over to solana with
their liquidity you know natively and then i can have a trader that lives on both chains instead
of just one right so so again this is just an example but like i think at the end of the day
it's like you've got to you've got to think long term and even when you're setting up incentive
programs like i see this a lot where people create like very low friction barriers on an
incentive program right but if you're a product that's targeting let's call it like high net worth
individuals or a much more you know specific geo um you want to create those incentives in a way
that's going to attract that type of customer and so even if quote unquote your daily active users
goes up by a tenth of what it could it's going up a tenth with qualified long-term customers
versus you know 90 percent of them are not going to be sticky and they're not going to generate a
lot of value for the business you know so anyways i just wanted to use that as an example but um
but you definitely have to think a little bit long term on this stuff for sure no and that's
there's two really interesting points there um and i know i'm having a conversation that i like
when i look up and much more time has gone by than than i thought usually it's a conversation
i don't like i'm like fuck it's only been 30 minutes how is this gonna and it usually does but
it's been 70 minutes and felt like five um andra i will say so there's two big flaws right in terms
of marketing and building which is when you're choosing your and this goes back to who you're
listening to for marketing at the core of everything is mathematics right uh ideally it's things that
stick uh with the least amount of effort and they propagate themselves um if you can create that
lightning in a bottle um what you call virality um and by the way this goes to tokens and projects
memetics and virality traditionally and historically in web 3 specifically does not
start on crypto twitter it usually almost ends at crypto twitter this stuff starts at fucking hn
reddit where it starts to spin up people like metapanda who are trolling in in the creepiest
weirdest conversations but it's it's it's something that gets flywheel and gets traction
like haramba it's a it's an ape that that the the government officials care like haramba sorry
right but they've chosen because they're memetic and makes it easier to do marketing
but to andrew's point there's two things you really want to be careful of if you're targeting
the wrong audience right a you don't get stickiness but b you also get an angry consumer base
afterwards that you have to deal with and reshuffle to get the consumers that you want
so although we're talking about marketing which is in theory the the art of selling it's you're not
just selling the initial sale if you want to build a real project so you really got to think about
your selling and who you're selling it to long term and and position yourself accordingly uh i
won't i won't out the conversation we had andrew but andrew has dealt with in the past situations
where a failure there even on a large scale can mean endless work to have to refix sentiment
and tokenomics and and that can become a bigger headache that distracts you from building your
product so um i cannot overstate the importance of of understanding what marketing and doing
why you're doing your marketing and working backwards from the consumers that you want
and it's not different from web 2 it's just in web 3 you're not you don't have to raise the money
in the first place or you're usually not necessarily risking your own liquidity to have to do this
research but it's necessary to make a successful business meta i'd love to go to you panda um your
your thoughts on uh back to the title uh you obviously built a project for those who don't
know meta panda based as fuck uh you should follow him as well for the purpose of listening
um he built out on on bitcoin a full product with rigs and all that stuff betting on the fact that
meta verses would would be what everybody promised they would be so how is that journey been how did
you decide in terms of your marketing and what you were building uh and how is that what's kind
of your vision about now and in the future and also if you could incorporate how you see uh tokens
and uh and airdrop season and choice of chain playing into that yeah no appreciate you um i
mean for me you know i i've been in space for quite a while and i think just at the base level
of all these network states or you know different ecosystems as a digital identity um and we're still
like super early on meta would you mind just giving people a brief background of you so they
there's just a brief context uh yeah um you know i've been in space for quite a while
uh i'm a creative technologist i founded a digital identity offering called alu and it
basically consists of these 3d rig cybernetic panda avatars that are optimized for frictionless
content creation um so essentially that'll be a mint on bitcoin and people get those files day zero
the pipeline that we've built basically has you know this panda within the 3d
unreal engine environment performs all different creator centric functions so there's animation
loops text to speech uh he can create art memes you know 3d uh environments around him hooks into
all different apis and um a lot of other stuff but um i think at the base level people they want a
digital identity there's obviously like a war on free speech and anonymity um and you know people
are obviously mobilizing in these digital realms so like you're sure they could be an avatar you
know through meta they're not going to own it and even more so like they want to be part of this
pseudonymous economy so i think for like what we um see as like the thesis is like that playing into
network states the pseudonymous creator economy obviously like video is much more prevalent on
every platform you know the algo is like prioritizing that people have no attention span
and we're also uh betting on like human laziness right where it's like every single person if they
can't do it in 30 seconds or they can't do a few clicks they're not interested if they can't get
onboarded through a 10 second tick tock um or if it doesn't you know fulfill their their cheap dopamine
requirements then it's just not going to have any stickiness um i think memetics as well is like
just a great uh approach like no one comes on here to be sold like no one wants to be sold
anything we come here for the people um and you you just have to create these microtransactions
within culture over you know decades potentially to actually have any sort of longevity because
like the long game is the game you know like people are saying oh it's a long-term vision or
here's our roadmap or our mindset and it's like who are you i met uh one of my favorite so uh
this this will date me but uh bullocks wilshire or bullocks the the clothing uh store that most
of you are too young to know because it's out of business uh uh my law school actually uh was in
their uh their offices in in l.a their old offices of the law library and they had 12 tenants uh
carved into the side of the building gorgeous building and one of them that always stuck with
me was and it's ironic because it's out of business but it said to build a business that knows no end
no i i definitely agree with that like you know i think you had a tweet about it also where people
can spend two years building something and then the community markets it for them or they could
spend two months you know building something and then the next two years trying to you know get
that out there and you know when i look at the most successful brands or companies um they
essentially just build platforms you know they built ecosystems and virtuous flywheels
and they provided like the tools and the values to like expand that ecosystem obviously in crypto
it's more just betting on attention and cults um and you want people to be there because they
actually want to be there otherwise you know they just come for the airdrop they dump it
they farm engagement and then it's on to the next i think like you know arbitrum did a really good
job where they didn't issue a token for a while um which was like very smart on their behalf
because then you can you know uh you like test the waters and see who's actually here you know
for the ecosystem what a coincidence that andrew was chief head of marketing at arbitrum these
things are not coincidental after getting the hat tip you know like that's that that's key you know
if someone's just promising you an airdrop and you know like why would they ever say like you're
saying hey i'm going to give you free money and like that's also the approach that you know i've
taken cues from is like you know for me when i look at the distribution of like any uh you
know collection any pfp or whatever you want to call it um they they hire collab managers right
and then these collab managers go out to like every community and have connections quote unquote
with all the right people um and then they just distribute it and i think the the issue here is
that most people in this space they're not building uh you know homes they're not building
apartment buildings in the sense that they're just building a hotel or rather a motel um you know
that people would just be there for the night or for an hour uh and and panda i think a big part
of that is and this is again this wasn't meant to be a tutorial please don't don't don't don't uh
mic up again i want to continue talking um which is if if your mindset and most of the time it is
is when choosing how to price your your mint let's just use it for for this purposes and your
your response is how much or your thought process is how much can i sell this for versus how much
should i sell this for right because price is a form of marketing and andrew and i were talking
about it yesterday curating your your audience curating your users curating the stickiness you
want right if your approach is how much how much can i charge for this what you're really saying
is how much headache am i going to have because i'm going to have to deliver to that level not to
the level of what you want and are actually delivering so that's just a food for thought
but please find a convenience uh no i was just saying like you know people just building these
like transient ecosystems um and like you know that's the result right it's like the intention
is the outcome and everything's transparent it's on chain um you know we know who's who
and like you know that's so i like i've been i've been super fortunate to just learn from
you know everyone else's mistakes and all the data that's come before me um so like i've just been
personally hand curating every single individual you know to like gift these assets to um and like
have it be based on proof of work and merit and um you know not just like hey you know you have to
do all these quests and you know otherwise like you're not going to get one it's like if the vibe
if the vibes are there right then you know and i think i'm a pretty good judge of character
then cool like you know here's one do whatever you want with it but if not then you know people
just like leaving their ecosystem up to the hands of like someone in a different country that you
know just doesn't know what they want you know and and they're not able to like properly distribute
the assets and you know that's what you see and i think for us it's like you know we're not
interested in charging money like i think that's just you you want to give people in the space
the opportunity because then they're the use case and you give them the opportunity to like
have conviction and patience patience and a thesis and pay it forward um and yeah i mean
that's just like the few things i've learned no i love it and i think what's important there is
you were able to articulate why you're doing the mint in the way you are and why you're doing the
marketing the way you are and why you are charging or not charging in the way you are for example uh
i am doing a mint uh in a couple weeks uh some of them are free some of them right and but they're
not free to influence they're free for you know other communities that that i've been a part of
and then there is a charge portion portion of it why not because i want to raise a bunch of money
it's not they're cheap but i'm pricing them tentatively at 100 bucks because what does that
mean that means that hopefully the people people who pay money for it appreciate it and then use
it because i want it to be used right it's a six five five one uh new standard eip that that we've
submitted that solves some problems with the contract with the the base contract building a
marketplace around it to to recognize it we built a way to freeze so six five five one is is
essentially uh an nft that becomes a wallet for for lack of a better word um so it can hold
uh fungible non-fungible tokens in it problem is that uh as it stands when you put it up to list
and someone accepts the bid the seller can remove the assets from it so you're actually not getting
what you what you bargained for so what did we do we we updated the code so that anytime you list
the six five five one ours it locks all the assets inside right so i i didn't build these standards
but we also have a token gate reading capability that reads assets within assets within assets so
that you can carry around ideally you can carry around your six five five one uh single asset
but inside of it has your six five five one that's your gaming asset and and that holds
all your gaming uh assets and then you can have a d five six five five one that when you plug in
your your same uh main six five five one it reads all the assets that are related to that ecosystem
right i didn't create these things and solve these problems to to give them away or to hype
them the up so that i have to deal with people flipping them because that's not what i what i
want right so understanding what you want with your with your product and often it could be
flipping sometimes it's just churn and volume because that's also marketing and attention
but it's imperative to actually do the thought process and work to understand this because if you
a lot of the pain you're seeing is really people just haven't launched businesses before this is
not your main to web 3 you don't do the stock process in any business and you have pain to deal
with right you build a bar i like to just for example i i owned a bunch of bars and restaurants
you don't understand your consumers right you're gonna have bridge and tunnel because you
mispriced the the drinks or you don't understand the the consumer flow or you haven't studied the
demographic flow or the development of real estate in the neighborhood right when i open a
bar and restaurant i'm not just going i have a great idea that's not how it works it's why is
it a great idea okay well this area has a lot of real estate investment development going on they're
turning commercial properties into multi-family real estate i see there's a subway coming in
there is an increase in living cost in downtown so people want to find places nearby that i see
an influx of single you know young professionals who are being paid to to to live in the city by
their company okay let me let me grab a a 32 unit multi-family and you know multi-family apartment
uh build some restaurants and this is how it works right the bringing in some concepts that
make sense for that demographic you put in the thought otherwise you're going to deal with an
endless headache forever afterwards and it's no different here you have to think you have to
understand the industry you have to understand your consumer base that you want you have to
understand your product you have to understand the flows and arts and ads of this ecosystem
you have to understand things like my medic propagation and panda you just threw out like
a fucking g i think you said virtuous flywheel i love that yeah i mean that's how like you know
the top companies are built like you know jeff bezos that's how you built amazon if you look at
linkedin or uh you know airbnb uber they're all designed like that um it's funny um i can only
try to imagine in other spaces we'll go to andrew and then we'll go to gram in maya um i say things
and i can tell it's going way over people's heads i would love if this is the standard
of conversation that we're having in every space um so uh for those in the audience please follow
uh everybody here andrew please uh chime in and continue to elevate yeah panda very familiar
very familiar with the virtuous flywheel from my uh from my amazon days so i think you're
almost done right but the one thing i want to call out and i do have to jump in just a second is um
i think when the nft space started exploding during the bull market and and i do trade nfts
and i've actually done quite well on them i i think it goes back to exactly what fiji was talking
about which is which is this business acumen right and and it's no one's fault you know first time
founders or founder experience you know it all differs but again like what i was seeing with
a lot of these collections when i when i looked at them or i looked at the road map is i was
scratching my head and saying the pnl model on this does not make sense to me right what they're
doing with the funds that they've you know acquired through the mint or or through kind
of secondary sales you know that effectively becomes your operational budget and when i see
for example like a large event being thrown or or whatever it is i'm saying to myself like well
that's cool but like how is that sustainable from a pnl perspective and so you know nfadwar
but like my nft strategy for a long time has been i i buy nfts um where i'm confident that
the founder has actual kind of business experience and pnl experience and you know i'll give you a
couple examples like i bought a kampai panda you know 300 it went up to four thousand dollars but
like ice bags has built successful companies before crypto right um i've got a couple little
pudgies like luka was the cmo of gel blasters and he was an early employee at ring like this is
someone that understands business building and um and third example i can give is like plague
you know pawns has launched tangible you know businesses he's launched a token on the back of
it but again like the strategy for me has paid paid well because again i think all of these folks
they may not always be doing the biggest or splashiest thing but again it's very clear to
me that they understand pnl and they're thinking long term about you know with the profits that i
generate how do i build you know a business that continues to grow but that's also sustainable
right so anyways just just thought i'd throw that out there for folks no that's a great thing
and what that really highlights we're gonna grab a second is just basic understanding of of you
don't have to be like a seasoned investor but simple questions like how much is being raised
can that be built where are funds being used the fact that we don't demand that like real simple
solution hey nft founder simple request hey can you just um can you dox the wallets of where this
is going so we can just see where the money is going like that's not crazy you're not doing
anything wrong right i don't want to know your name just just i'm giving you money in an
unregulated space uh you're making promises of what you're going to do if you're not being held
accountable by the scc or by or by investors and and such can you just show me where the
money is going and like i'm not going to bother you about it i just i just want to be able to
you know when you steal it come back after you and that's by the way uh i mentioned earlier the
rails network that i'm working with the i think that's going to be a i know it's been done a
couple times before but accountability for builders and founders shouldn't be a bad thing
right there has to be a balance between synonymity and accountability and again i've
said this almost every space uh zk zk technology reputational networks are going to be a beautiful
thing that's going to push this space forward in my opinion rdc rdc is on a computer so i don't
want to keep on chiming in go ahead rdc and then we'll go um there's uh so what you're talking
about right there there was a project that came out that was just one of the first i guess ai
type art ones it was called real goblins but his underlying content was he had
taken all of so he had a phd in computer science and he had special access to twitter apis and
they're in their back you know their back end information and he had a system where he had
every single uh influencer associated with all their wallets based on everything they'd ever
posted and all their and so he had a project in our little group where he's like oh well so and so
like this and statistically whenever they like a project it's this amount of days and i i can't
tell you i can't tell you how fast that got swooped up by i'm not going to say which major
influencers in our space but all of a sudden the project was dead and he was doing art for another
project as a phd in computer science so i mean you're totally on base with like how what what
can be done with that data because we were way ahead of everybody else on place just based on
their you know based on their scammy habits because people don't read the blockchain like
they read the newspaper and also i'm gonna say to your point andrew i didn't know you worked at
amazon do you know who a guy named karate karate is he used to be the senior security engineer for
aws like he was all the way at the top i don't know if you know him or not but man that's my guy
i know him from way back so like georgetown military connections right just man if you'd
know him man that's a nuttiest dude oh insane anyways may go ahead already say i just dm'd you
uh i need to you need to connect me with that person uh i need that uh oh yeah hundred percent
it was it was insane like we we were getting in things like dang there before launch it was
unreal how and he he rated everybody he had indices of like how correct his stuff was like
the the quantitative analytics on it was unreal it's amazing the the level of intelligence of
people in this space and i don't say that to to to not me everybody else but the part of that
thing we talked about earlier about the joy of working in this space is it really is filled with
visionaries and and geniuses and technical wizards it's a wonderful it's a every time my
partner like my dev for example is a fucking monster like the the fact that i can just be
like hey can this be built and in a day or two he'll be like yeah built it by the way here it is
it's an incredible space to work in so if you're not if you're not appreciative
nothing personal but if you're just flipping that's cool you're really missing the the beauty
in this space um and some of the stuff we've been talking about is this warm to my heart gram and
then maya welcome gram how you doing and thanks for the warm introduction talking about my uh rising
of intelligence in this space man that was beautiful and i'm gonna take back that bar analogy
i've never built a bar but i did spend years as a bar porter working behind a bartender getting
drunk in the back of the house as i was marrying the bottles and learning each ingredient that
was there and guess what i became a bartender and i was the one of them i was probably the
newest bartender at the timing i won a bartending competition because i knew all the ingredients
so well and i was thinking about the customer experience the whole time and the bartending
competition was cross promoted with playboys so i got to go there for seven days and seven nights
when i was there with three wives and all that you know and so now that's utility that's utility
right so i got a domain name you're talking about ip identity i got a couple domain names
that go in tandem with that right i have more than one a couple different ways i can hit it i
can use it a couple times flip it a couple times right but i can build communities behind these
things and i can tell a story businesses are all about a story everybody slings beer right
everybody's got the same products but you go back to the same person that cuts your hair
and all these different services for the story that they provide how they make you feel
and that's what this is all about ip identity and ip personality i couldn't agree more and
uh what i'm loving is the fleshing out of identity and people realizing more and more
and i think things like uh overpass and metaverses are adding unique value to these nfts
that are born not from the founder or the rarity or the distribution but born by use cases and
the assets the humans behind them so that's kind of where i was going also with the space in terms
of how this changes value propositions uh you're going to see marketplaces coming out with this data
included you're going to see revenues real revenue streams being included and driven through and from
nfts and that's going to be driven on chain ahem ahem and i'm just really excited for what this does
for this i'm really bad at showing yeah i we solved we solved that uh it's gonna be
yeah it's gonna be really cool to see how smarter contracts that govern the actual assets how
right now how i look at it a mile ago you i'm sorry but nfts in my mind as i stand right now
is a singular moment in time right right now it really just governs the the fact that that
transaction occurred and then the rights and what you actually bought
is on a website or on a twitter space or in a discord when it should be on chain and when that
transfer that asset transfers right it it does transfer on chain but it's not giving the details
of of the sales like contracts in the real world do so we're going to see nfts become trails of
the asset and the on-chain history of rights and ownerships and i think we're at the start of it
and i'm really excited and i think that metaverses have a massive impact on dynamic value proposition
for nfts and they're just starting as jpegs right i think it i think it proves out music
and now we have another asset class it's going to continue to to to add things to the receipt
so i'm super excited and that's that's what i'm kind of exploring at the moment maya welcome to
the stage how are you hey hello hello thank you for having me oh my god nfts i'm metaversed and
if i um we can't get enough of these spaces and i'm so happy that there are kind of come
doing a comeback and disclaimer for you guys i am a founder in d4n in nfts and the um the geniuses
that you were talking about those there is no way that i could come across my dev um if it
wasn't for web3 so um the my lead dev is actually the ex tesla engineer who worked directly with
ilan musk i could have not come across that person now we're building some crazy stuff and i'm like
okay can can we do this and um there are some things that haven't been done before and uh
i'm not sure if i could have done any of the things that we were doing if it wasn't for him
but yeah 100 i definitely agree with that and you've seen me fit at all you've seen me building
all throughout the course yeah so now everything is starting to kind of come to fruition and now
i'm gonna give you guys alpha next week i can't tell anything but uh yeah nfts um that that is
actually the future pfps i'm not sure but nfts for utilities and i'm doing cool stuff yeah
100 nfts are the future and you asked um i think the panda um about uh marketing there are so many
things that you can do for marketing in nfts um so it's because it's nfts and it's fun and it's
arts sky isn't is the limit so i am the artist of the project for example what i'm thinking
to do is just give one-on-ones to all the people that i find cool in in the space and use that as
a marketing strategy which is like very organic and very um natural so uh yeah there is so much
that can be done in nftn defy space i agree i will push back and by the way congratulations maya um
i was wondering what you were doing uh it's great to hear that you've been building uh and i'm
excited to see i'm sure it's some it's fitness related which is cool um i will push back a little
bit on and by the way again for full transparency maya is not a paid sponsor peta rides is not a paid
sponsor betta panda is not a paid spancer andrew is not a paid sponsor dunk rdc tardigram not paid
sponsors um the fact is people have been building uh and i don't know what you're really doing this
space if you're not building uh nothing personal you can flip all your life money doesn't make you
happy purpose makes you happy in my opinion and this space gives you an incredible opportunity
to to bring your your your ideas to life i've had a company in the past that i got booted from
i i was upset at first but then i realized that i get to my my ideas my dreams my feces
get to come to life and i want to see that succeed because i want it in the ecosystem
and because that was a piece of my passion so i think this is an incredible space for
uh for the future of remote work and kind of what ai will do to menial work
it's it's our brains and it's our ability to create and i love this space for that so
enough preaching gram you have your hand up yeah something else that i that i want to talk about
that i've been doing too like you know i haven't i've been building but i haven't been necessarily
the one creating the things right so um you see my name it says dollar gram you know what i mean
and it's there most of the time you usually always see that and i'm always out here since
the clubhouse days and all that it's even since before that but anyway so what i do is since i
don't create the nfts necessary the pfps themselves necessarily um in this one business model
what i do is i go ahead and i uh dominate that nft pfp business model period like i buy out all
the nfts not all of them but a majority of them and then i gift them the people like people have
been saying here i gift them the people that i think are cool that um that deserve some
notification some something i know that when i'm gifting it to him i have i'll have the ability to
be able to um organize and aggregate them later on and so when i launch a certain project related
to that money grand brand those people will be the people that i'm looking to and it's all organized
and i can use the uh browsers and all that to get it all together for me so gram i'm there right now
so uh right before the uh free meta happened or whatever it was time is an illusion in this space
but uh i i'd done a social experiment with to that exact end launched in a tea project completely
free uh airdropped no royalties uh and no hold back why because i wanted to and the the
the requirement to get it was much like metapenda merit-based it was what you contributed uh not just
grinding but creative assets uh getting involved being a value proposition now the uh they did pump
and then they and then they went down and people say you did a cash grab and this was a rug it was
never meant to make money it didn't make money it cost us 25 grand lost money what it did was it
created people holding assets and uh an attention towards a potential community i now am launching
projects and i get the joy of being able to reward the people who have held right what that does to
price i don't care that's not that that's not my responsibility and i have no control over that
projects don't usually rug right holders are the ones selling it's not sell shaming but it's just
a reality uh and and so it's really exciting right now to be activating that community
yes it comes in the form of rewards but more importantly it comes in organizing them and then
being able to have a loyal user base for the ecosystems that we're creating so that approach
and thinking that way i think is critical and that's something we've been talking about
why are you charging period it should always start with why are why are you charging anything you
should be able to explain that it should make sense and the more that i think people are doing
that the more i think we're going to have sustainable projects and as that mixes with
things like metaversus where your dreams or promises of use cases now become a reality
i think it has a virtuous flywheel effect throughout the ecosystem of validating prior projects
pushing the tech forward and and really advancing the the thought process of founders in this space
and i think that protects consumers as well so i really love where we're at right now i know we've
been waiting for it been a tough bear and it's lovely that it comes not coincidentally with the
fomo and excitement of of a bull coming in i hope we don't lose that with with the with the
speculative uh rush that is already obviously starting and that comes with using that hype
right so if you're going to drop a meme token do it for marketing it is a marketing substitute
but be strategic about it so i'm excited to see what happens
um and we're at a really interesting time maya of your hand up go ahead a hundred percent hundred
percent i agree with that um and i i actually love the fact that everything can be transparent on the
blockchain so where the marketing money goes where where every fund goes for me um i'm a very
good case study for this actually so i paused the mint last year because i wasn't sure that
the devs that i had could have um could possibly pull whatever i was building so i thought if i
if i raise all that money it would go to waste uh if i sell out the collection i wouldn't
be able to do what i'm doing now that's why i actually paused the mint so um being transparent
with the community and i think that's the beauty of web3 that the founders are so available to to
the community and and i think there are a lot of people who um i i personally think there are
projects that are going to be the best projects in um in web3 that we haven't seen them yet
so i'm i'm excited about that part but uh yeah and about your question definitely we are building a
fitness related of course look at me we're walking gym it's funny um so i got grok um
opened to me um yesterday two days ago so as soon as it uh it became live it gave me a roasting
session so it it literally roasted me that i'm i'm a walking gym so even grok knows that uh
that i if i'm building something it's definitely going to be something fitness related
so that wasn't a far guess um i i love that and i think there's something to be said about
the education that's happening in the space right and it's a it's a natural part of the
growth of the space as we bring on new people they by definition are less educated in the space
fortunately unfortunately they often get wrecked but it does lead to a greater education across
the board which i think is obviously beneficial for the space um we're coming up on two hours
in a great space i've been enjoying it if anybody else has any questions please raise your hand
otherwise we'll wrap this up go ahead graham i just want to add a little more about digital
identity and digital personality because i also have another uh thing that i go by it's called
the web 3 oprah and with that what i do is um you know that return on investment it's not always
you buying a pfp or an nft sometimes what i do is i go through and i find communities that are
like organized together and i'll sponsor like these web 3 identity badges for them that allow
them to communicate more easily with each other and there's different utilities that these domain
providers provide for them but i kind of like help to kind of like um you know catalyze that
kind of a conversation going on within those communities and so that web 3 that that web 3
oprah digital personality is also something that i've been building for the longest time and it's
not based on money it's based on value and that's talking about valuing um it started with myself
but now it's reached to the point of me valuing others and finding them and getting them together
uh i love that and i'll end with one thing it's just a random thought that i'd had that pop back
up if you are dabbling in shit coins or meme coins or alt coins whatever the case may be
one thing you should that is a really easy thing to think about that should help you
where is the liquidity coming from where is the value coming from if you can't answer that
you know that it's just a pure pvp and and you need to be aware of timing and i would stay away
from those things thankfully it looks like we're getting closer to revenue streams right you're
seeing little little products like otc or or uh bots attached to tokens right those earn those
those have the potential to earn revenue which means there's you can you can explain where the
money's coming from this is this wouldn't be a crazy thing to think about with a regular web
to business right let's use the bar again you have no customers how are you giving me checks
oh this must be money laundering all right not complicated so just be careful be an adult do
your research and i don't mean dyor to like find out just think critically for for a goddamn second
every once in a while and stop and and you can chase whatever the fuck you want just accept that
that's casino money it's gone if you hit great but that's my uh that's my closing uh spiel know
if you want to close this out with your your spiel and your i'll see you soon everybody thank you
for joining my emetta panda dunk although you didn't talk rdc dart gram i see you down there
bored always great seeing you i'm glad you popped in for a kind of a memetics and marketing
conversation tokens j crypto as always alan sun marco uh davo oh look it's trash i'll call you
today too brother um tamar uh and everybody that the lucas have mentioned thank you for joining
we wouldn't have these spaces without you um please share share what you've learned
things that andrew are saying are invaluable literally i can't hire him so um these are
people that are driving this space forward uh that are driving business forward uh and this is
free free advice so if you're here you're not engagement farming i hope you're writing
shit down i hope you're learning because that's what we're here for we're here to drive the space
forward and thank you guys all for joining thank you fiji uh thank you again for taking the reins
as i recover from this ailment hopefully be back in full next week acti you can close it oh well
remember that everything you hear on these broadcasts is meant for educational purposes
only nothing is financial advice so be safe out there and acti you can close it out