Hello everyone, we're here with King's Roundtable episode 5 featuring Light Protocol. Going to bring them up to the stage here. We might be having a slight technical difficulty, but let's see here.
I'm inviting light up to speak and Jorit. If y'all can accept, that would be great.
Alright, looks like the Light Team can hear us now, which is great. So, work on getting them up on the stage now.
Justin, you should definitely put some music in.
We'll do, I think we're trying to get these guys up here, so don't want them music to interfere with that.
All right, can everyone hear me? Dylan Aleshivas, Danny. Cool.
Almost makes me want to sing a song, but I'm bad at singing Everyone came to hear you sing Shiva's I think that's why everybody will leave. All right, looks like a Light has accepted the speaking role that is exciting All right
guys, hey there, we finally figured out how to accept. All right, is this one? This is when yes, I'm joining in from the live protocol account and then Joe is joining on his personal account. Great. I just invited Joe to speak. So once she accepts, we can get this started.
How was your time at zero knowledge week at the pit in Chicago? That was really good. We had this super surreal experience of being there with one of our engineers and basically working to
ship our test nets, which we then announced on Friday that week. And so, yeah, it was just like this very surreal experience of like barely sleeping, cranking away, while some of the other teams as well were working there. And it was just amazing. The content was
was really good as well. We had this workshop, so Joe, my co-owner, helped us workshop on how to build private Solana programs there. And reception was quite nice. Was good. That's exciting. All right, looks like we have Joe on here as well. So I'll start the show off now. Hello,
Everyone, this is episode five of Kings Roundtable. We're super lucky to have two of the co-founders of the light protocol, which is the leading zero knowledge researchers and protocol on Salana. For those who aren't familiar, zero knowledge is a way to send transactions where the sender and the receiver
or don't know each other. In another way you can send anonymous or private transactions which currently is not really huge in the slanta space as you can just go on soul scan and see all transactions and track all funds from past wallets and such. So a really big innovation to slanta and a really big innovation
and technology in general. I think like two of the leading researchers, research fields currently in technology that are in my opinion the most important are artificial intelligence stuff and zero knowledge. So again we're super excited to have the light here. Joe and Shwen, I'll let you guys just like briefly jump in and talk about your career
that brought you to founding light. Awesome. Yeah and thanks for having us on big fans of the Dad King society as well. Yeah so I mean I'll start briefly so Joe and I we know each other since forever basically childhood friends and we both got
So I started in 2017, something crypto. On my end, I personally, I mean, after doubling with some, you know, want to be investing in 2017 last bull run. I don't know, maybe some of you remember, you know, I basically went, you know, I got a little bit delusion with
And what was happening in crypto in 2018 and with Ethereum, proof of work and barely any applications at that point. To my regrets, I did something else. I went into web development, worked with a couple of projects and startups there for a couple of years.
Yorid was pursuing sort of crypto. He was writing his master thesis in about building private voting and, you know, forking, you know, to an education time on Eve and like making it, you know, the idea was to make it run on Solana because, you know,
There was Solana, early 2021, was like the super promising new tech and super cheap. And so the idea was to make private governance where it can change. And that was the initial hobby project that LiPiracle really drew out
off. I think it was summer 2021 when we caught up and he told me, back in the day we were actually living in Berlin and Germany and so we just met up and he was telling me about what he was doing in the last couple of years and I found it super interesting and he was
like, "Oh, do you want to help me build out this hobby project of mine?" And yeah, we did this. We got a grant from some American investors at that time. I mean, it was, you know, it was in '21, so peak of the latest bull market. And we decided, we want to try this full time. We want to basically prove
ourselves that we can make on shine zk-snark on chain verification work on salana right because like salana you know technically speaking is like very constraint you have like very limited amount of bytes that you can send on chain with each transaction and a very limited amount of compute that you can execute any strand
So like the real challenge was at that time making the case not verification which is this super you know computationally heavy Stuff make that work on Solana and So last I think 21 was was the ignition
Hecathon. I don't know, maybe some of you remember and we went to Lisbon locked this up in this Abbey and B, just trying to ship that stuff. And that's really the origin story of LiProgon and went from there. Open Source Version 1 in January
2022 which was you know private open transfers so for those of you who know it's a little bit like Zcash but on Solana and you know raise the seatground in early 2022 and just took it from there you know building out light light we three which is now this this thing that we launched
last week I think. Very exciting. Yeah for those who don't know, Lite currently has V1 of their product shipped and it's been online for a while. It's shield.liteprotocol.com and it allows you to send private transactions. If you haven't played with it yet, I highly recommend it. It's really fun to use and it's also very mind-blowing.
opening in terms of what the technology can do. So yeah, V1 is out. It's been out for a while. I guess we'll just talk a little bit about V1 before we jump into V3. So however user growth number is there, I think I've seen a chart on your Twitter from a few months back. But it seems like there's a lot of growth there, but be happy to hear y'all talk about it more.
Sure, yeah, so we one was this like really nice, you know, experiment basically proving that proving that is the case not verification is possible on shame and you know, we put it online with this user interface that you also mentioned That basically lets people fund their burger
know what it's privately. So the exciting thing in the last couple months has been that people, so we see people using this mainly for NFT collecting and trading actually. So people go there with their Phantom
wallets and they fund fresh phantom wallets privately so that they don't have to go through centralized exchanges to conceal the traces and links between the different wallets. That's been super interesting. It was kind of a
You know, like a like a chill grove. I think everything is not definitely not going through the roof. Um, but you know, it's like some steady growth. And we did publish numbers. I think now at this time, we're at about two million, um, you know, sold
in use to see, where from use to see shielded and on shield as sort of like volume gun through the protocol and there's a couple thousand of wallets that have registered that have created light light accounts and so there's like this you know very niche
group of Solana users mainly NFT traders and collectors who use this and Yeah, we've been getting some feedback obviously, you know one of the challenges is Oh Yeah, actually looking up the serial transactions we have
a little bit over 12,000 shields and unshields processed so far. One of the more difficult decisions then is how much do we focus then on continuing to add features and improve
one which has this like loving small user base versus then like putting effort on the next direction which now we three private-sluanop programs obviously has been this like super big engineering effort. That's amazing.
So yeah, I guess we can start talking about V3 since that's where the combo flowed but last week or you know we can have a go light put out a tweet discussing how about nine months ago they started working on V3 which allows developers to deploy swana
private Solana programs, which is pretty awesome. I'm super excited for that, but yeah, I'd be really interested to hear how much work you guys have been putting in on that, what the kind of work looks like, and what functionality a private Solana program can have that current Solana programs do not have.
For sure, yeah. So I mean, you know, naturally, I think this is like a pretty complex topic. So I'll try to try to keep it short and then maybe we can have dialogue around whatever you're most interested in. Basically, you know, if V1 was this like private token transfer, ZKash on Salana,
We three now is arbitrary private computation, which means that now you can basically move anything that you can encode in a ZK circuit, serenade circuit. You can move that off chain and then execute it.
interesting example that we're super excited about is private, private NFT trading, right? So like private ODC. And for example, what that would look like is you have, well, you know, you have a public listing because, you know, you want everybody to see that there's a listing and you could even optionally put a price there.
for what you're selling. And now other users can go and make offers that are completely private, or they can even just take that offer executed straight completely privately. And the whole, I mean, there's a couple of fundamental aspects to how this actually works and you have to
makes a private state that is encrypted on chain and you have a mix of public state that is not encrypted. So for instance, if you have a listing that would be unencrypted because you want everybody to see that there's a listing where counter office and the actual trade want these two to be encrypted. But the NFT
The Darkpool is a super exciting thing in my opinion that you can build with it and it goes from there. We've seen a couple of interesting use cases, governance, private voting, and most of all gaming as well. For example, if you have any multiplayer game
like coup or magic or even poker or any sort of round-based trading card game that you want to put on Shane, you cannot do that right now because players need to be able to commit to a hand, right, without the other person being able to see the hand on Shane. So, you know, otherwise the game is cheatable.
And that's one thing where privacy is really, really important. And other things as well, like Treasury management for companies, payments as like the most basic, but you know, with payments, you know that as well, like right now and chain payments are worse than internet before there was SSL, right?
now if I send you tokens, you have access to my whole financial on-chain history. So there's a bunch of these use cases that you can build now. Yeah, I think that's a really important point. So currently, how most people transact value, we use credit, debit cards, and we use physical cash, and we use crypto.
basically that covers most of Earth. But cash, physical cash is an anonymous form of transacting value. And as we, as time passes, cash will obviously become less used. So zero knowledge becomes more important to a functioning society in my opinion there. So super exciting stuff.
So I'm interested. So for those who don't know, like Ethereum has a lot of ZK things taking place. On sole we have like protocol and elusive as basically our top leaders. But so you guys pay attention to the east side of things at all. I know there's a lot of companies getting funded over there, but obviously you're
I'm kind of curious the differences between ETH and Soul, ZK. That's a great question. And I mean, personally, just slightly on my end, and maybe Joe has some other thoughts to it as well. But, you know, ETH is the interesting thing with ZK on ETH is that there's
One really compelling use case on you which is scaling for ZK right like because essentially with ZK zero knowledge What you do is you can have off chain computation and then you can prove on chain You can just push the proof on chain that proves that the computation is okay So now you can also, you know roll up and you can
do more computation and just verify the proof on chain and that's really good for scaling for instance. So, you know, there's like mostly if you look at ZKVM, ZKVM's, they primarily focus on scaling, whereas with like
like protocol or just generally with Solana, much more compelling to just focus on privacy because we inherit the scalability of Solana and the fees as well. Scaling is an interesting one. Obviously there are other projects like Ashtag Network, if you've heard of them, they're built
building essentially something that is very similar to what life protocol is trying to do. And obviously, you know, Aztec has raised enormous amounts of money as a huge team. So like it's super exciting to play that, you know, David versus Goliath sort of game there.
Yeah, for sure. What's on about the jump? Yeah, I just wanted to expand a little bit on what Sven was saying. I think the essence of what you're saying is that in the Ethereum space,
most of the projects who want to also build privacy apart from the project which outright are building scaling. They need to solve scaling at the same time because Ethereum is not scalable enough by itself for them to make sense to deploy privacy directly.
on Ethereum. So I would say that's a very big difference between the Solana, Zika ecosystem and the Ethereum Zika ecosystem. Apart from that, I think there are a lot of interesting Zika projects, for example, in the Cosmos
ecosystem as well or just stand alone, like ALEO, which have the same issue that I have to build how blockchain and then their use case, which usually is private computation as well.
Thanks so much Joe. Yeah, so I could we keep talking on scale. I said just very quickly for those that don't know east. Obviously came out, you know, that gave or so ago. Didn't consider hardware improvements into the protocol over time. Salana takes into the protocol all hard.
where improvements therefore will scale much better over time. So that's an important point we keep touching on to figure it out. Yeah, anyone from the King's group have any questions for these two gentlemen? If not, I'll continue on my way.
All right, I'll jump in real quick. How do you guys monetize this?
Great questions. Eventually, right now there's no monetization really. Eventually we want to build building out this sort of ecosystem and essentially there's a bunch of approaches that we're thinking of taking.
And you know that could involve you know having to sort of relay our system where you know essentially Relayers are web servers that that forward that pay for transactions on behalf of the user and that
that this trust list because the whole thing is encoded into the ZK proof as well, which relay are you using? What is the fees? And so you could then have
Yeah, relares that trash reason that you have a sort of ecosystem. But right now, it's still, it's going to be a very interesting question to answer and a very tough problem to answer, but right now, there's no focus on that, so no specifics.
Awesome, thanks. Any other kings want to jump in with any questions?
In terms of like, in terms of because like the mean like focus here is a privacy layer and like encryption, right? I'll ask another one. What is your marketing strategy to onboard people?
Imagine your most dedicated user will be someone with a whale that wants to hide their money. First of all, is that the case in Second of all? How do you plan on getting average retail users to use EKE?
Great question. There's a couple of different approaches there. Generally speaking, I mean we're in contact with a bunch of NFT Wales wins and so are very excited. But if you look at
If you zoom out a little bit, it's you'll figure out that you need a really specific use case. You need to solve a really specific problem with ZK in this case. And what we're going to do with like me three is really
work with third parties, so really good partners in the space that can go into different what it calls, for instance, NFT trading, and work with them really closely to like, you know, dock food essentially.
This very specific use case that would be, for instance, NFT trading. And you can take that, basically, that approach, and you can do it for each vertical, like payments, gaming, and so on and so forth.
So the idea is that while we're the infrastructure builders and provider really, you know, dock food-owned use case and try to be as close to the end user as possible.
Awesome, thank you. Danny, you can jump in. Yeah, I have a question. With upcoming regulation, I mean, it's going to come right to the crypto space. Do you think you're going to be a target for that? And if so, because obviously,
I mean, you're going to be in the forefront, right? Because people are going to think that basically people are using your system or your protocol to hide their transactions. Have you guys thought about how to attack that? Is that something that you're concerned about?
Cool, yeah, sure. So, yes, been been thinking about that a lot and you know, there's some short term measures and some you know long term and fundamental things. In terms of short term, right? Like if you look at the user interface, like
like there's actually we're using an API from TRM that's basically just making sure that you know high risk and you know you know well it's that connected to xpline so on are not able to shield into the protocol it's into the
protocol using our relay. So that's like some of these shorter measures, you know, then there's like, you know, limiting deposits, deposit size, it's for instance. And then fundamentally, there is just that thing that we think
And especially if you compare it to some of the presidents that we had on the earth with, let's say, Toneito, it's just really important for us that, you know, regulation is going to come, but we want to build this like neutral base layer that has all the tools so that people who build
private Solana programs, I able to code, you know, complines into their products, into the applications. And so if you look at something like a non-chain game, right, like there's this very like tangible use case that has that
definitely nothing to do with like, you know, any illicit activity and sort of framing it that way and like being proactive about enabling people to be compliant, I think that's the right approach here. Yeah, I love that you clarify that because like, like Dylan said, right, that
So if you have an actual use case which has nothing to do with doing illegal things, it's a huge plus for your protocol. I think that should be the basis for it. Yeah, exactly. Crypto it, jump it.
Yo yo yo, I don't know yo. I don't think Dylan can hear me, but Yeah, I'll jump in here regardless, but yeah, so quick question for you guys because you know the main focus here is the privacy, you know layer Have you guys had any?
applications on the B2B side that are you know chatting with you guys on utilizing this technology for for you know whatever their building would be curious to hear if you guys have and if so if you can share what that looks like and then yeah the more so like B2B side like just want to understand what that looks like
Yes, so we're actively in conversation with a bunch of different projects specifically in the Solana ecosystem. And I don't think there's anything at this time where we can actually
B2B is fine partners who implement our SDK, which is really the core product of what we're building next to the programs themselves, they don't chain programs, and then really work closely with them to like,
Find the best people in their field and then work with them to find a real good use case for end users that has to do with CK. Gotcha. And do you guys have like an ideal customer on that B2B site and what they look like? Or is it kind of just free?
We're talking to anybody really is interested, right? Like, have a bunch of chats ranging from like individual developers to like big projects. But the ideal partner for us is definitely people who are really, really aware and conscious.
about what you know in what market they are building right whether that's payments or games or you know trading and you know really like sort of top of the game there and like really understand where there is really good use cases for for privacy so you know that's that's the ideal
customer. Awesome. I think something we should touch on just to help the audience and all of us as listeners understand. There's a term that we hear called dark pools. It's definitely bubbling up. If you guys would want to mind running through what that concept means and how it applies to
I think that would help the audience. Cool. Yeah. So, um, doc, we'll just in a sense of, and that's a term from traditional finance really, where, um, you have different types of options, you know, see a bit of options or you have like actual matching like on, on all
books where this is not immediately published to, I don't know what the exact word in US is for this, but you have this like, these trading platforms. Does anyone know the term for sort of the
Maybe just quarter book we would understand. Fair enough. Yeah, so I mean if you take if you take it to you know these different autobokes and then if you take that to DeFi or NFT trading it's really being able to trade on chain. Better that's normal tokens or NFTs.
without the actual trade execution or even the matching without that leaking to, you know, basically to the whole world because it's on chain and it's not encrypted. So having private trade execution. So, you know, obviously the most, the biggest use case there is you have people who want to
enter or exit big positions and they want to not disrupt the public order book really and the liquidity there. Awesome, thank you. Any other kings want to ask any questions?
Alright, well, Joe, if you want to jump in and add anything, feel free as well. I know you dropped a few times and Swen's been doing most of the talking, but if you got anything to add, feel free here.
Do you have something specific in one or otherwise I think soon cover the questions Yeah, we did cover most of questions there No, I think I mean I
I guess one good question to ask would be, I'm curious of, so there's, like I mentioned, there's two products offering ZK transactions, light and elusive. What's the difference between what light offers when elusive
of offers now or in the future? Yeah, good question. So I mean, I cannot speak to what any of our competitors or other sort of projects in the market are planning to do in the future.
from what we're seeing right now, so because your name is specifically elusive, when we launched V1 right last year, that was basically Zcash on Solana, private token transfers as I mentioned, and what happened.
Elusive has right now is essentially that, but slightly more efficient. So I think they've spent a lot of energy and did a great job at making that snap here. And then I think, yeah, I cannot speak to what they
or anyone else is doing in the future specifically. That is not public, but yeah, with Lyprogles is now basically we take that primitive of private token transfers and we made it generic. So to present
can really use it for anything. Great, thank you much. Yeah, I think we could probably open it up to the audience here. If anyone has questions for Joe or Shwane, feel free to request Speak Access and I'd be happy to bring you on.
You know, I have a question that might be a very stupid once then so if it is re-stupid just don't answer or just tell me it's a stupid question But from a tech point of view because I'm not a big tech guy You're processing these things off chain is that so you're taking things off chain and then
You are certifying on-chain that they're correct. Is that right? >> Well, yes. In essence, it's exactly that the client. So that might be the user's web browser or mobile application. >> Correct. >> Yes. >> Is doing the computation on
off chain in the client and then just publishing a proof in this case is the case not on chain that says, oh my computation is correct. And I'm indeed, you know, if it's a private token transfer for instance, you would prove that you indeed own the
tokens to do that transfer and that computation, that state transition. And then you send that proof on chain and there's a Verify a program, which is just a regular slANA program that is just custom built to verify this specific proof. And that's essentially how you do it.
and then update state and sort of the global single shared liquidity pool. It's a representation of a mercury essentially where these computations are inserted into a mercury and you basically can prove that way. You're on funds.
It's important to note that this is totally decentralized and trustless. It's not that there is any intermediary that is able to see your computation. So if you're declined, you own your private data and only you have access to it or anyone who has
the same decryption keys that you have to decrypt your private data. Okay, so is there any way that I could change my message or the other party could change their their competition or their message that they sent on chain in between that transaction?
No, because the verification step itself is atomic, right? So like if you change anything about your proof, the verification on chain will fail. It will fail. Okay. Okay. So there is actually no. So basically you're just putting one on one together.
and certifying that it's still one and then you accept the transaction and then it's passed through. Yeah, essentially, if we break it down far enough, that's sort of how it works here. Okay, yeah, it's super interesting. And is there any point of failure
Because you're taking these things off chain. Is there is there is there more of a security issue than if it was all on chain? Not by itself. No, there's there's a couple of things that for instance
Now, what you will figure out is that we're not so like protocol is not yet supported in sort of the you know, phantom or the other wallets, right? So what you're doing is essentially when you are
logging into lies, essentially. If you look at the actual user interface, right, is that you're signing a message, and this message is used, is basically the message signature is unique to your wallet, to your private key, without exposing your private key, obviously.
What we do, what LiPorecL does is really it derives specific light protocol encryption key pairs from that message. You're still subject to phishing or there's this client side security things where you need to be quite careful.
Similar to to to a normal wallet or you know to especially when you know back in the day before that was metamask you basically had to like insert your private key into and to the web web apps that you were using and so basically what you do is when you use an interface you're right
Now, trusting the interface to not do anything stupid with your message signature. So there's still that trust assumption, but it has nothing to do with what's going on on chain. And the whole thing has the same-- the whole on chain part has the same security assumptions that you would have just on chain contract.
Okay, yeah, yeah, because I remember back in the day, there was some talk about this optimistic roll-up where I think everything was assumed as if it was correct or something and that was different from ZK and I just didn't really understand the difference but it's clear now. Cool. Thank you.
Awesome, thank you Danny, thank you Sean. We had a few people request to speak from the audience. They go by the name of Panda and Floppa. If you would like to speak, you can request again, but you both left the speaker table.
Going once Going twice. No, don't be shy. Come on get up here Yeah, I think we might have lost them, but Anyone else from the audience if you want to ask a question feel free to request
If not, we can go ahead and wrap up. We don't have to take the whole hour if we've hammered out all these questions. I asked everything I wanted to know and nerded out and geeked out with the light team, so I'm pretty satisfied here. But anyone else, feel free.
Do you see a future that nobody's asking questions I feel like I'm taking over the space. We got a good one. Alright great great. Then let other people ask and then I'll go. Happy Memorial Day everyone. So sorry I keep jumping in and out of the space because I'm traveling from a moment. They began so sorry for keeping
jumping off and on the space can everyone hear me. I just wanted to say like I had a great pleasure initially meeting the live protocol team in break-pring list Ben and then I was actually at jumps ZK week and I met the whole core team as well when they were launching week three. Super excited for everything they're building on.
super excited for all the verticals as well. I don't know if you cover this in this space. Yeah, but can you walk through the process of setting up and configuring with light protocol and are there any limitations with what can be built with light protocol on the B2B side that user should be aware of?
Yeah, for sure. So we just one question to clarify with like config figuring like protocol. Do you mean setting up like protocol account as a user or as a developer like building a private Solana program? Just a part of more general sense.
of like as a developer. Because I think in the questions on the space underneath, there were a few people commenting here on like what the fees would be for building a PSP with your protocol and things like that. I think that was like Pandas question.
Cool. Okay. Yeah, so I mean there just upfront there's no fees charged for you know building a private salon program. We're happy for anyone to try out building with it. It's essentially that well, first of all, like vocals, all open source so you can go check that on the
line, we do have a link on our profile, I believe. And we do have an SDK and we do have a CLI command line in the face. So basically, it's just like you would, for instance, build an anchor program, anchor being, you know, one of the basically the most popular frameworks
to build Solana programs right now. You would download the CLI, the Light CLI, and you would initialize a project. Then you would name the project and it would generate sort of this whole boilerplate of project code really similarly to how anchor does it.
And then sort of one of the unique things here is really that there's two elements. There's an on-chain part and then there's the off-chain part, right? So the off-chain part is and you will see that there's like a folder where you see circuits and that's specific to
the sort of the zk element of it. So you'd actually have to be somewhat knowledgeable in writing circuits with Cercum, which is hard at first, it might be a little bit confusing, but you know we're playing on putting a lot of content out there to make it really really easy.
easy for you. There's also a couple of templates that you can use that already come with the CLI, so when you initialize the project, and then you can really go from there and add your logic. There's other circumtutorials
by other people on the internet as well. And if there's any questions for all these who are interested as developers, you can always DM us on Telegram, Twitter, or what join our Discord. And then one of our engineers will be super happy to help out.
Awesome, awesome. Thanks much, Alex for the question. Thank you, Sean, for the answer. We have Tavkin here who we brought up. I believe he has a question or they have a question. So feel free to have him. Hey, thank you guys. I'm a very slow learner and I am not a tech guy. So, uh,
Is there a B2B site on these non-devs or non-technical guys could use your protocol? How could they use it? And could you tell this, like, I'm a five-year-old?
Okay, so question for you. Do you mean like using like protocol PSPs like privacy Lana programs as you know you mentioned B2B? Like do you do you mean like is there any non-code solution where you can click together your own privacy Lana program or
Is that meant just from the end user perspective? It's like I have a private club and we would like to use your protocol. We are 10 people and maybe we would like to connect with another group of people of 10 people and we would like to
use your protocol. Do you have a specific use case in mind? Not really. Okay, so I mean the first, I think the first step that would be let's chat, you know, we can do a group chat or do
or discord can ask questions. And then we can figure out what the use case would be, right? If it's normal transfers, like you could even go and just use shield.lightprotocol.com and you know fund your burner wallets as a group or individually as you wish.
If you have any other needs or ideas for what you want to do, maybe you want to build a game or you don't want to do something with club governance or whatever, then it would make a lot of sense to talk. Maybe that's something where we can jump in and help out really quickly.
and then you not really need coding or there's something where that would be code-involved. There's no solution right now on our end where you could like no code, you know, at builder. Like there's no such thing right now. Okay, and are you planning down the line in the future?
or not yet. I'm there no such plans on the roadmap, but I mean everything's open source like we're would be super happy to you know facilitate you know if someone is interested in building such a thing and that would be cool. Okay, thank you very much.
Thank you, Tafkin. Yeah, I think we can go ahead and wrap up here. But for those of you who haven't played with light yet, please go on shield.lightprotocol.com. Shield one soul, couple soul, whatever. Send it to a brand new wallet and then check the soul scan or whatever explorer you use.
and get your mind blown at what happened and we'll see that you'll have no clue where it would address something this whole and you'll realize that is a very breakthrough technology so I'd recommend going ahead and using that. It's really fun but yeah this is an awesome show we're gonna go ahead and wrap
it here. But thanks a lot, Shwun, for your time. Thanks a lot, Joe, for your time. And looking forward to seeing private Son of Programs in the wild, and looking forward to seeing the light team crush it. So thank you everyone. Thanks. Thanks for having us on. Yeliyah, we have time for another question.