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Kuru Live! - Hypurr, Puerto Rico, Chogtober, and More
Recorded: Oct. 1, 2025 Duration: 1:38:10Space Recording
Short Summary
In a lively discussion, crypto enthusiasts explored the latest trends in the market, including the resurgence of Bitcoin, the potential for new token launches, and the impact of strategic partnerships on growth. The conversation also touched on the evolving landscape of NFTs and the importance of community engagement in driving innovation.
Full Transcription
Thank you. Oh, God. I haven't seen you in a while, how you been.
Have you changed your style and the faith that we've brought up differently?
Don't sing, say, since you've lost your feet over me.
Since you've lost your feet over me
So let's leave it alone
Cause we can't see eye to eye
There ain't no good guy
There ain't no bad guy
There's only you and me and we just disagree.
Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh.
Oh, oh, oh, oh.
I'm going back to a place that's far away. We We were friends
But not the end of our love song
So let's leave it alone
Cause we can't see eye to eye
There ain't no good guy There ain't no good guy.
There ain't no bad guy.
There's only you and me and we just disagree.
Ooh, ooh, ooh.
Oh, oh, oh.
So let's leave it alone. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh.
That was a ridiculous song to pick.
Dude, I love that.
That's such a good song.
Can I play one
like a short song just to get the energy
going? Dude, that's
one, that's a great vibe
for a Wednesday morning. It was a good vibe.
It was a good vibe, but I feel like
we need some energy.
Yeah, alright.
I'll give you two minutes.
Okay, okay.
No, no, sorry.
No, we're keeping, I'm keeping, I'm keeping my vibe, but no, Cat5, I love you, dude, but that's not no dude no you can be you should i need you
though i need a speaker daniel come on up kb's not here today it's a big day i it's actually
not a big day it's just a regular old wednesday i wanted to pop in guys i feel um this is good
i'm glad to be here i'm happy to hang with you guys we should hang
chogtober is doing their space right now so i do feel a little bad but i was thinking you know
consistency is key with these things and so i wanted to pop on we can do maybe just a quick
weekly crypto round if we can look back at how things have gone over the last week have some fun
but we don't have to do a full-on space here i just
wanted to get together for any of the showing up showing up is key consistent just like you said
you you can't skip a week just because kb is gallivanting around the globe with with her
crazy kuru money that i i did that i i yeah i kind of i agree i agree i know i think that's i
i've not not no no zero shade to the old crypto baby 777 but yeah no we're here we're here it's
good to be here and since when have i i'm not worried about you know last time we had chaos
walker as the co-host cat5 you can be my co-host today this is how we're gonna run about, you know, last time we had Chaos Walker as the co-host.
Cat5, you can be my co-host today.
This is how we're going to run.
You know what?
I trust you.
I'm going to hit you with the co-host.
You're welcome, my friend.
I can be very professional.
I clean up very nice, Coach.
Yeah?
Do you?
They're like, what do you do?
You're like, oh, i have a coin on pump fun
i won't chill the coin i won't chill the coin if if we want to talk about ccm in general i'm fine
i won't chill the coin but every day i'm djing on pump fun you can find the link in my bio you
don't have to buy the coin. You can just come and
enjoy some good music. Headphone Sal is one of my strongest supporters. So if you enjoy good
music streams, I've been DJing on Web3 for years. I got in here through the Decentraland Rush.
I got in here through the Decentraland rush.
I DJed parties in Decentraland for Playboy, for NASA.
It was wild in 2021.
Obviously, that died.
The metaverse is effectively dead, unfortunately.
But I don't want to.
I mean, there's still a strong community there.
But there aren't MSNBC news stories about the price of land right now.
True.
No, true, true.
Man, the metaverse is a total throwback.
And, dude, I mean, I think that's just awesome, dude.
I'm still iffy on the coin piece of the, yeah, PumpFunCCM thing, which, yeah, let's not go all the way into it.
But I think what you're doing is really cool.
Like, I think that the way that it's opening up doors for people to monetize is really cool.
I think it is like, it is a crapshoot.
Like, I've seen influencers with many more followers than me and launch and not even bond.
And they're a lower market cap than I am.
And like it, it really does.
It takes consistency.
I do believe, I do believe in PumpFun as like a legitimate streaming contender just because the kind of fee structure and like if you are an
incredible streamer and you're generating volume on your token for perpetuity like you are going
to make more money than twitch elan just hasn't like figured that out how to onboard these big streamers yet okay well okay now you've
really okay now you've intrigued me so maybe we okay we're not gonna go super deep but i do think
this is an interesting uh question how okay so how here's what i think is the hard part of the ccm is
the creators and pump are incentivized for volume yes the holders are the only party involved in
this scenario that need the number to go up i feel like there's kind of something broken in like the
incentive mechanism in that way like how do you feel like something needs to change because i I mean, I do like as as like crazy and dystopian as it sounds like, yes, like market cap generally reflects your value to the system as a creator.
Like that, like a market, a free market is, is in my opinion, one of the ultimate sources
of truth. And so now, like, I don't know, I've proven that I've been there every day. I think
it's just about consistency about like, there are this, this pump from app is being downloaded more than any app a day, pretty much like the the audience, I truly believe will come.
And then like the question is, is if you can turn a large audience into traders and holders?
Yeah. Yeah. No, right on. I think that and i think that's fair i i agree i think
that it's i think that it's probably a bit too simplistic to say the only parties that care
about the market cap are the holders like the the people like the you know because if your market
cap is low and it just keeps on going down and going down like nobody's going to trade your coin so like yeah yeah i mean there's there's studies done on chain on fucking um uh what's on on like uh what's the
website with all the charts for uh fuck boy i'm i'm blanking on this um Dune. Dune dashboards. Yeah, yeah. There are Dune dashboards that scientifically prove that Solana traders cannot hold a...
The average Solana trader holds a token for less than 30 seconds.
Like, that is the state of the trenches.
Yeah.
It's...
I mean, if that's true, it so that's so i mean dude it's
just unreal i am dude i'm like single-handedly like increasing the median hold time because
like i buy a coin it goes down and then i just buy this forever oh man not really actually it It's almost forever. Oh, man. Not really.
Actually, it tends to go up.
I don't sell.
And then I'm holding it.
And I continue to bullpost it.
So that's kind of my life.
The charts are starting to look good for me.
I think I might make it.
Yeah, yeah. But I, so Amor, do, do you think that PumpFun will be able to compete as a legitimate streaming platform?
i the coin is really tricky for me i i just resonate i don't know if you saw like what
thread guy wrote about like well i think launching a token is like a pretty big
decision it's like a pretty big change to like the form factor of like how you're going to run
your business and i don't i if there's some way for pump to make almost like stream uh the coin optional which
i don't even know if that's feasible that i've i've heard people talk about that and and everybody
says like there's no fucking point they'd be getting viewers on their platforms without
generating any revenue from fees yeah i mean you'd have to you'd have to
be serving ads or something like that at that point right like you'd have to be doing something
something different to monetize your creators to feed them fees i i'm not i don't know if it can compete. I think it can be its own thing is kind of what I.
True.
I don't know if it will.
I don't know if you can get, you know, Ninja or like any of these guys to like launch a coin.
But, but maybe.
And also they have a billion dollars.
And like they've executed decently well.
I think two billion dollars in cash.
Yeah.
So I don't know.
My gut, if I'm being honest with you, is no.
I don't think they can do it.
But I think that they can do something interesting.
And I'm curious to see.
I guess I would just say I'm not a long-term believer.
But I'm also not going to fade them. I guess I'm just f I'm not a long-term believer, but I'm also not going to fade them.
I guess I'm just fenced sitting at that point, but I'm not going to buy Pump.
It's also just not really aligned with my values in the space, but I don't hate them.
I think that what they're doing is cool, and I'm curious to see if they do something interesting.
I think what they've already done is interesting.
Your values in the space, you're launching a launch pad my brother i mean fair but i do think that
i'm more i think that it's more so like the ethos of pump i think is just less i think that well i
i think okay totally fair totally fair i think that it's more of like the, we're allowing people to deploy markets.
I think that it's pretty different than being like a launch pad as like a dedicated option.
But yeah, no, I mean, look, it's a fair, it's a fair glass house.
No, but, but, but the improvements they've made to their mobile app like if you just log into
your mobile app and find my stream like you can pop it out and do whatever dgen shit you're doing
and and still view like their mobile ui has improved fucking like a thousandfold.
Yeah, no, I downloaded the app. The app is good, I'm not gonna lie.
Like, there's any, I mean, like, most of the apps, I feel like, that have actually made it onto the app store, like, pretty good.
Like, I've tried Vector now, I've tried FOMO, I've tried Pump.
They're all, like, pretty well done, I would say, for the most part.
Yeah, it's impressive. What's up, Nick Lachey? How you doing, I would say, for the most part. Yeah, it's impressive.
What's up, Nick Lachey?
How you doing, bro?
Good, good.
I had a question for Cat5.
Yes.
So do you hate abstract now and like pump?
No, I don't hate abstract.
I am not a person. I will FUD things to death. I am not a person.
I will fud things to death.
I am not a person.
I am not a person who likes to kind of like outwardly fud things on the timeline or in spaces.
In private chats, I'll cook you to death.
But I just think it's very foolish to be kind of bearish on the timeline.
You're just asking yourself to get fucking clowned when whatever you're talking about flips you.
The problem, like I started streaming on abstract day one and the, the tips were okay. Like, sure. I'd get a couple hundred
tips a night in the beginning, but they definitely dropped off and I haven't been paying total
attention, but apparently like TVL is just Abstract and drones, and that's not necessarily good.
I do think there's some fun stuff on Abstract.
I think Gigaverse is cool.
Like, at first, their streaming platform was cool, but Pump kind of blew them out of the water.
platform was cool but pump kind of blew them out of the water and i guess it was almost three weeks
ago i launched the coin and like i'm very glad i i like front ran that crazy ccm exploding meta
like by a week and i'm very thankful for that because if I had launched later in this CCM meta,
I think it would have been much harder to get attention and generate the fees that I generated.
But I don't know.
If Abstract makes some changes, if I figure out how to play Pudgy party on my mobile connected to my obs i would
definitely do some abstract streams with pudgy party i am one of the best players in the world
on pudgy party so i think that would be a fun stream but no i have, I was actually talking to Dyla.
Dyla is pretty big up on abstract and she was like, bro,
good for you moving in pump fun. Like you made money. Like that's,
that's insane. Like I support all creators doing whatever.
So that, that was cool to hear from somebody from abstract, but I,
I'm, I there's But there's always the possibility.
There's always the possibility of me doing a couple streams on Abstract.
Yeah, I think that makes sense. What are your thoughts?
Now that we've had over six months on abstract, what are your thoughts?
Yeah, I mean, I do think Pump coming along
and doing the streaming side, right,
did probably vamp a lot,
just because, as you mentioned,
for people that are streaming
and there's a monetary incentive,
it just makes more sense to be on Pump,
unless you're just trying to get your your xp ranking high or whatever is
an abstract but i think i think there's a couple things that are tough um one i think streaming in
general is very difficult to succeed at we're still talking about very short time frames i'm
sure none of them are profitable on it um so yeah so i think that's a challenge. But for me, I still, with Abstract,
like I think Luca obviously has done a great job
with Pudgy and all that stuff.
And Pudgy continues to have Mindshare
and all that stuff, right?
So the Penguin stuff is great.
But I think that's always been the question for me.
Like how do those things come together or do they?
And if you have to pick one
of them to be our priority, which one is it? And I don't know, like my personal take would be that
if he was forced to pick one, he would pick Pudgy. And so to me, it's just a prioritization thing.
And I think I just want to see how that all plays out. If abstract is a coin, how does it interact with Pengu? Like all those kinds of things, right?
That aren't as probably clean.
Just because it's different chains, it's different products.
I think the blending of that is probably a longer road.
Whereas pumpkin, everything's contained.
Do I think they'll succeed in like overthrowing like whatever facebook and tiktok and twitch and
all that no but they're gonna try and it's all like a self-contained ecosystem abstract is in
my opinion a bit split because of the pudgy side and yeah so i don't know i don't know where they'll
go with it i just think when abstract was starting streaming like I said this back
then like it's just such a hard space to do and most of large streaming
companies they got bought up because they weren't profitable and they serve
as a secondary arm right to the primary business and so for pump that kind of
somewhat functions right streaming can serve as a function to their primary
business which is still tokens for abstract I think that use case is a little bit trickier, right?
Like, what is the primary use case for Abstract?
Because they don't have a token yet.
And they're not like a launchpad or whatever it is in of themselves.
themselves. So it's an interesting thing. Like, what is it in support of?
So it's an interesting thing.
Like, what is it in support of?
So you mentioned a lot, these like, let's say like Twitch,
Tick, stuff like that. Those,
those entities are actually not profitable on streaming.
Yeah. They are not.
And it's because of just like the bandwidth they pay,
like the infrastructure.
Yeah, it's kind of one is streaming is costly on the server side, compliance side, maintenance side, plus all the deals that they make.
Right. And they're not keeping all the revenue either.
So. Yeah.
And then they're signing deals. Right. For other groups to have streams on and stuff like
that so i just think like it's it serves a different purpose right um for them in terms
of what they're able to do through it um and i think for now like there's some obviously like
ad revenue and all those kinds of things but um yeah but i think twitch again is very different
than kick like
i don't i don't think those are comparable personally interesting i don't think those
are on the same playing field i don't think they're anything alike in product either
they're both streaming platforms but their intent is totally different um yeah well what um do you is there any path that you no nick you're basically nick you're just like but
you would say you're just not a believer in pump's ability to execute on i think is there any way we
were taught we were just touching on this but like is there do you think there's any way for
pump to like serve ads and i guess then you just just become a shittier Twitch in a way.
They are.
Dude, in the past couple days, there's a giant Myriad ad under my stream.
Yeah.
Really?
They have to do ads.
You can't not do ads.
Myriad is shilling out.
Dang.
My comparison is not that they can't succeed.
It's that the crazy things that they said they were going to beat or overthrow is, that to me is a ridiculous ceiling, right?
So when they launched, we talked about it, I think, on this very space, but they were like, we're going to take down Facebook, Twitch, and TikTok, like all of them.
To me, that's ludicrous, right?
It does mean they can't be successful.
I think they can be.
It's pie in the sky stuff.
Yeah, yeah.
So for me, it's like that level of hubris,
I don't think they will ever reach.
But do I think they can be successful as a company
and continue to find ways in a crypto-native way
to attract some streamers and to have content,
to have platforms run ads
and test product, whatever, sure.
And have a war chest right to do that with.
But it's a wide gap between overthrowing
like the top social streaming and like Zoomer app
all in one through a token creation platform.
I do like that in the past week,
they did respond to some community feedback
and do some devving.
There was a huge bot problem.
It was insane.
Just bots spamming, scam telegrams.
And a couple days ago, they instituted token-gated chat.
So you have to own like a Cat5 token to participate in the chat.
And that really kind of culled a lot of the bots.
The next obvious development I want to see is token-gated streams.
I think that would be a very unique, very bullish thing for everyone's token.
Yeah.
I guess it's like a sub-model, right, that you would have on another platform,
like sub-only mode, those kind of things in the chat.
Yeah. sub only mode those kind of things in the chat um yeah it's i do think though like
it's it's close relationship to pump fun is in my opinion sort of like what kick is right to stake
so both are like for whatever principles you have or what you think about it, that put aside,
I think the relationship will immediately have people second guess
using that as your streaming platform.
So that's why I think like a Twitch or whatever other neutral platform,
you'll always get kind of a bit more adoption wider
because there's no overhang of sort of like,
do you agree with this or not of the overarching company that's really benefiting from it?
So for kick,
it's obviously a casino and for pump fun,
it's sort of a casino.
So I think that's kind of the,
but I mean,
but I will say like,
let's,
if I tried to do what I'm doing on pump fun,
playing long DJ sets with potentially
copyrighted movie potentially copyrighted music I would I would get
booted from kick I wouldn't be able to put my like VODs up on kick because of
music I'm playing pump fun is very much the Wild west no one gives a fuck about copyright and i like that but that's
how kick started too they had it was free range to do anything right but then they eventually
instituted it because the only way you can attract a wider pool of streamers and things like that is
to have some semblance of like rules and components so i eventually like PumpFun has to go that way
if they want to attract bigger entities.
So like, let's say like something that streams
and gets like hundreds of thousands
of simultaneous viewers, unique, right?
Like League of Legends Worlds or something like that, right?
Where you get just like hundreds of thousands of viewers.
Like to get those entities to decide
that they're going to shift that,
like it takes a ton, right? For them to want to decide that they're going to shift that like it takes a ton right for them to want
to do that um and i just think the overhang of your parent company basically being stake like
a casino or pump fun like it'll bring in some audiences right it'll bring in other people that
you wouldn't get but the larger entities i think will always opt for the safer platform to be on, personally.
So I think it caps your growth.
Are you a league guy?
Are you a league guy, Nick?
What do you mean?
I follow it now.
League of Legends.
But I'm too old now to play it anymore.
Oh, of course. Same thing.
Last Worlds
was one of my
best polymarket PNLs.
Just riding the Korean teams.
Here's some alpha.
Here's some alpha.
If you see it on prediction markets, League of Legends, bet on the Korean teams.
Is this real?
This is real.
Nick, tell him.
100% real.
Gen.G is probably the best team in the world right now.
And T1.
T1 almost won.
Yeah.
And then T1, HLE.
All the Korean teams right now.
I like T1 for Worlds.
I like T1 for Worlds.
That'll be interesting.
All right.
Okay.
The pump talk has been really good.
Why don't we,
I mean,
I appreciate you two carrying the show.
I just got my,
I just got my coffee.
So I'm kind of just chilling.
Yeah.
check out Ticker Cat 5.
I'm just going to chill it once.
Ticker Cat 5 on Pump Fun.
It's 27K market cap.
I DJ every single day.
I'm committed to growing with this platform.
One day I will DJ Alon's wedding.
I'll be the official DJ of Pump Fun.
So the token is free.
You're early.
Hardly.
All right.
All right.
That's on my show.
That's all my show.
All right.
All right.
He is the co-host, but I do not.
He is the co-host, but I do not.
Kuru.io does not formally endorse Tigger Cat5.
Not financial advice.
Do your own research.
But we do like Cat5.
We do like Cat5, the man, the myth, the DJ.
So, okay.
One more thing we can pop into here.
Yeah.
You know, Chogtober's going on.
I'm just recapping things from the last week here.
Did I miss the deadline to mint my fucking Kuru monster?
Yeah, bro, if you didn't.
Oh, my God.
I mean, whatever.
Here's the thing.
You'll still get one.
You'll still get one.
But it's just whatever you saved last.
Okay, okay. As long as I had one, I'll get one. Yeah's just whatever you saved last okay okay as long as i had one i'll get one
yeah yeah yeah yeah you you missed the deadline to customize it however you wanted it but whatever
your last save was should be minted and sent to you yeah yep but uh but speaking of NFTs, it's a testnet NFT. But speaking of NFTs, yeah, we can, I mean, guys, we had hyper.
I mean, I don't know that there's a ton of like deep stuff to go into here.
But this, I mean, it was just kind of wild that like a random Sunday, you just wake up and what was it?
Like $300 million, like five people, 5,000 people.
It kind of felt like i mean but five thousand
if if you've been following hyper liquid since launch and the hyper evm since launch like
on their main nft trading platform they had otc deals like featured for these hyper NFTs and they were always going for ridiculous valuations.
But like I was in the hype years I've been in hyper NFTs like everybody was kind of talking about like what the fuck are going to be going to look like.
But nobody really cared because it was the actual hyper foundation
NFT. So they had OTC trading on these for almost six months and it was kind of crazy. Like they
went live kind of out of nowhere and it was wild to see the volume on these things. Yeah. Yeah,
no, agreed. It was cool that they dropped it out of the blue
it was not front ran on polymarket which i thought was kind of cool that they actually
like were able to keep it a secret and it was in okay did you guys like the art
it's not i i am i am incredibly picky on nft art i only like MS Paint-style puppets and 3D-looking Nihilings.
My tastes are concentrated in a few things, but these cats look decent.
The line work is decent. The colors are decent.
The hyper cats look pretty decent.
Oh, okay.
Moonboy, get in there.
Oh, sorry.
Sorry.
I just saw Moonboy did a thumbs down,
so I want to hear from him.
What's up, brother?
Am I audible?
I think I'm rugging.
No, I can hear you
there probably is a lag let me let me just reconnect with the internet and i'll be back
in like a couple of minutes cool okay sure sure yeah nick phil please jump in bro yeah
like in terms of otc side like i looked into it at the end of last year um because there were still some brokers
that were doing otc and yeah like it was hard to come to an agreement just because i think even
back then i think the going price back then was like 20 to 25k but even then like people were
hesitant um just because of where it went and then obviously it went a lot higher since last year
um but i think the art is fine but i think it's just it's like any nft
art in my opinion like there are some stuff that's like horrendous and some stuff that looks nice but
everything else is kind of based on is it worth a lot of money so yeah yeah i mean i don't know
like the art to me for something like this doesn't matter as much but i do think it being a chain specific
nft um in my personal opinion i don't think that's a bad idea like if if the use case is correct
i think it's a good thing um and not not that it's right for every chain but i think
whether you use it as skin in the game right in? In terms of like, sort of like an ICO type thing,
whether you use it as some sort of benefit
where ecosystems are going to give to it.
Like, I do think having something that's official
is kind of nice, but I think they did it right
in that it launched after, like Hype Bios and other stuff.
I think the mistake would have been
if it was the first thing well i think well i think it was the i mean it was the first it just
wasn't yeah exactly so there's no price so like in my opinion like they knew that was coming but
the fact that they didn't like if it just dropped like immediately before any other nfts showed up
in hyperliquid i think it sort of creates this vacuum sense and everything else is sort of like
a derivative or whatever yeah i think i think what what one of their w's was what a a smart
strategy was to let the hyper evm ecosystem kind of develop and grow.
Yeah.
And go up in price.
I mean, I think that helps for sure.
Yeah.
No, agreed.
I think that
I agree with Nick
basically, I guess.
And Kat, I'm not an art expert,
so you probably i
also liked the big i mean i i am like a total heathen like i don't know what good art is i
just know what my gut says but i thought the art was just fine i thought they just looked like
generic like somebody said that they looked like fiverr like nfts like no to come out and like i
didn't think that was a crazy take but i also think that it's
just one of those things where like you see they looked azuki like they looked like azuki cats
which i don't know azuki's but uh here's one thing i will say about art and pfps like i i love art. I'm a stickler for art, but I also realized that PFP art has a very kind of different,
um, a different, like a set of boxes to check off than actual art. Like, like some, something that looks like a great art piece might not look like a great
NFT.
Like when I'm evaluating an NFT, like it, it's about the colors.
It's about how it fits in the circle.
It's about the eyes.
It's about the facial expression.
And like, if you can't get those things right, even if your art is insane, like you're kind of doomed to fail.
And I think these hyper NFTs have a pretty good PFP art style.
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, sure.
No, I'm not.
Look, I'm not. And there are some of them that I think not i and there are some of them that i think are cool
there are some of them that i think are cool i think it's more just like i saw the cats and i
was slightly underwhelmed but then again maybe i just have like this you you almost i think have
like a negative right for insofar as like if you got a hyper NFT and it's worth like 50, 60, 70, 100 grand.
And you're like, this is the most beautiful thing that I've ever seen.
If you didn't get a hyper NFT, maybe that maybe this is just my like subconscious just being like, these things suck.
They're disgusting. And the art isn't even that good, actually.
And I'm just like coping. So I wouldn't't be surprised if that's it as well.
Yeah. Moonboy, did you have a big, any hot hyper takes?
Not in particular but I do feel that for the stature that hype is at right now,
I do think the NFTs, the PFPs are slightly underwhelming.
the nfts the pfps are slightly underwhelming but yeah i mean the the the value prop isn't isn't you
know about how how the aesthetics come across but more more about oh the kind of value prop that
they provide to to the hyper ecosystem i mean it's it's actually uh it still is like a pretty
decent buy at like 40 or 50k if you if you consider the kind of growth that hyperliquid as an ecosystem
as and also as a bootstrap protocol has had over the past one year but i mean for for me
for me the aesthetics about pfps have always you know been about about how how you could represent
your own brand in general and i don't know i mean i do get the
load that there's there's all these uh hyper liquid maxis paring on on the timeline but i do think
that uh you know some and it could be a bias of course but i do think that something like a mad
that kind of a collection does call out to people more in terms of aesthetic, surely because, like, humans could relate to human PFPs more rather than animals or anything of that sort.
So, yeah, pretty generic in my opinion, but, yeah, that's all I think.
Yeah, I mean, I do think there is, like, the flex factor.
I mean, I do think there is like the flex factor, like almost like kind of like board apes at the at some of these people that claimed their hyperliquid airdrop,
they have been diamond handing it.
They are up six to seven figures,
and I could see them seeing this NFT and being like,
oh, this is the hyperliquid flex, you know.
Yeah, absolutely. There's this guy in quantico i am not aware of of who he is but someone did actually tell me about him and he's
in kz as well so so the guy had had thousands of hype tokens airdrop to him then he bought in
more at at like $8 per height.
And he has been holding it since then.
And effectively, he has a shit ton of money.
Even more than what Kizzy managed to raise.
So, I mean, yeah, that's the kind of power that, you know, community brings to the table.
But it is what it is, I guess. I mean, they look prettier at 250K per NFT too.
So yeah, that's it.
Yeah, I think that, okay, so here's my question now.
I mean, you'd have to probably have,
well, look, I don't want to speak for anybody here.
Let's just say in like a theoretical world,
I don't know that any of us are necessarily like going in and like sweeping like you know i don't know if any of us are at the
port size to like go in and like sweep 10 hyper nfts or no but like let's just say that we let's
just say that like you are or you wouldn't you wouldn't be hearing from me for a while
well fair fair but like do there are people that are making this play right like there are people
on the timeline that have like publicly called their shot some of them up this is also the funny
thing about the hyper liquid community that i i appreciate it but they like are apologizing for
selling they're they're like they have to they have to like give like for the mac it's like the
alignment anons for
Hyperliquid. It's actually kind of wild, but there's something kind of, I don't think that's
the worst thing in the world that people have brand loyalty or they're, they're loyal to a
community, which is good. Um, but, uh, would you, are you in a theoretical world, right? Like say
you have the port to where it makes, it it's a it's a reasonable bet for you
are you a buyer like do you think because future utility is uncertain right but also future utility
there might you know there could be a hyper EVM drop there could be eco project that was the sell
on Hypeyo which now Hypeyo boom down but of BTF-o'd. Although maybe they'll still have a future, right?
But yeah, what do you guys think?
So I was, I'm going to FUD things in public, which I don't like doing.
But I was a pretty earlier Hype-io holder.
And it was a cool project.
Like I bought on base.
I bridged over.
I made a decent amount of money.
Also, a couple of my Hypeos got drained, which was very sad.
But the Hypeo community got very into, like, PvPing other communities.
And I think that's one of, like, the most bearish things a community can do.
Like, and so that, that, I feel like that kind of killed their pump. Also, also the parabolic
pipe hype move killed their pump because in, reality there aren't like i haven't checked the
numbers recently but there aren't that many people using daily active users on the hyper evm
and and like that kind of concerns me about like a low liquidity ecosystem, NFT ecosystem.
So like, I don't know, maybe, maybe if hype hits a hundred dollars,
we see a crazy hype PO run again.
But if, you know, it, and it really depends.
Like if, if I had been using hyperliquid a lot, a Hyperliquid Maxi, if I was up exponential amounts on the airdrop, sure, I grab a Hyper NFT just to signal that I'm here.
Yeah, no, right on.
What I think, I mean, we have had these conversations earlier as well.
I remember talking about this in the in karma space and what i do think is that uh okay i'll draw a reference here
hi hyper nft is at like 50 60k let me let me draw a cheaper reference which is mad lads of course
so what so the playbook is actually in front of us and i think the market is efficient enough to you know acknowledge that so if if you could buy in like 10 uh mad lads right now would you do it cozy uh no
why exactly would would you not buy into into uh into into a project that that has a crazy amount
of market share in europe could actually have even better market share in America pretty soon.
And there's an inevitable, very plausible, in fact,
backpack drop coming on the horizon.
There's the community aspect of it.
So what I'm implying when I say all of this is that
the market has, over the last couple of years,
the market has efficiently showed us that
i mean it's easier said than done of course that when you back an nft project with a killer product
a product that is actually market fit and there's demand for that we've seen it with hype we've seen
it with kaito and we've seen it with backpack as well so when you back that up with an nft and a pfp i mean it's of course relative to
to your net worth if if at all you want to sweep 10 hyper nfts or mad lads but if you could i mean
there's enough and more bias for all of that so so nick did talk about the kind of volume that
hyper nfts pulled otc and i i think uh of course i'm not a buyer uh for a jpeg at like 50k right now
nor would someone else be but of course there'd be people who would want to align align with hype
ecosystem like that believers who actually believe that you know that there could be a breakthrough
that dap upcoming like a couple of years time in in the hyper liquid ecosystem here's here's what i'll say
about mad lads one positive pot let's let's go with the positives first um they they have a team
of operators they have a team of people that know what they're doing and that's that's important that's important in an
nft when you're looking at it on the bearish side I think mad lads look like
absolute shit they're bad pfps I I would never have any desire anything
don't you think they look better at 50k per mad lad no no yeah no i know that's the meme
like oh the art looks better at as it goes up not with mad lads i i just i i just don't know and
and like so like the big speculation is mad lads are gonna get a monad airdrop well so are seals too so you might as
well buy a seal for a tenth of the price and get a fat monad airdrop now the the rr isn't there
right so at at at 7k per mad lad a very plausible backpack drop i'll be so happy if they don't get
a monad drop surely because it implies that, people are going, people who bought in for the Monad drop
are going to dump it,
and you will get cheaper lads for a very plausible backpack drop,
plus, of course, the ecosystem drops
that have been pouring in for the last couple of years,
plus, of course, the kind of community movement
that mad lads are, you know, undergoing.
I mean, it happens with all major NFT projects, right?
We've seen it happen with DGOS too.
It went down, of course, for very obvious reasons,
but I don't think that happens with the lads.
I think, yeah, I don't know.
I think it's just hard to buy. I think it's hard to nail the...
And I don't disagree with you, Moonboy, that buying NFTs that are associated with projects that have strong underlyings is wise.
But it just feels like you're at maximum PvP when you do that right like in the sense that i and i don't know how all of the math
of this works out but i just think about like buying a pudgy penguin to front run the put the
yeah the pudgy drop like then the pudgies go down you get a big airdrop but then the pudgies go down
and you have to offset the loss of the value of your nfts with the airdrop that you got you're
dumping it immediately maybe probably
unless you're a big time believer say like it would just be hard to buy like i mean like and
maybe mad lads will be different because it's a sex you know and like maybe they have some like
more but i don't know how much yeah i don't know like and then what's the value of that token long
term you've got to think about what did
what are the value of mad lads after a drop like that and all of the speculation goes away like
like if there's anything that sets apart hyper liquid it's that you feel probably pretty good
that the community equitable it was equitable yeah yeah and it was also yeah it was also really pretty well it was well done um and
it was given to maybe the thing that is so bullish about hyper is that it all all the people that
own them are rich you have to be in the top 5 000 wallets to get a hyper out of t so like they don't
even need to sell right like they like it is it's a lot of money and some people's lives were changed
by that but these are people that generally i I think, minimally, what, had high six-figures, low seven-figure ports, right?
I mean, to be able to qualify.
So, I mean, pretty bullish.
The min, so basically for everyone that qualified, I think the last, the worst person that qualified,
if they had held their entire airdrop, I think they would have, like, a couple hundred k um today and that's if they didn't do anything with it so they didn't loop
it they didn't get any other airdrops which of course they did right so it's more than that but
if you kind of totally total assets that they were dropped it's probably closer to like half a mil
with everything else if they held everything um but i just think like NFTs, I think we've learned enough since last cycle to now
that it's, unless you have insider information
as to what the functionality of that NFT is, right?
And you know something, information of,
they're gonna receive this, that will offset it,
or you have more information than other people.
It makes no speculative sense to sweep something
unless you just don't care, right?
Unless you're just doing it because you like the art
or whatever it is, or you just don't care about that number,
that amount of money.
Like those are the only reasons you'd ever do it.
Like there's tons of other places to put your capital
unless one of those two things are true.
You're like a random rich art collector
or you have other information.
So if you do have that information, Cozy, just share that privately.
Nick, you mentioned the R word, retail.
Do you think there is any chance we get a retail rush like we week like we had in 2021 for nfts for for anything for meme
coins for these decks protocols like where is where is repot where is where is where is retail
going to come and park their money yeah so um my opinion is that and this has been like i guess a
year or two old now but it's this cycle has been about like the tradification of crypto institutions
the institutions the people that we hate the people that we wanted out of here but those are
the first groups that adopt right like if you look at any sort of tech or tooling, like the initial groups that adopt at scale and put money in are institutions.
And so you need those rails, the financial rails.
And I still think the majority of crypto products are based on financial rails.
I think the next stage are like apps, but I don't think like those are still not quite there right and i think that's what do
you mean like a fidelity app to buy no no no like consumer consumer side fun apps right that are
much more widespread i'm fun pump fun but like more broadly acceptable euphoria no like still
more broadly acceptable like those are still trading apps
right like if there was no point system there was like those aren't fun like it's not people do it
because it's fun people do it because they can make money yeah and so i think you get retail
adoption when the primary thing people get out of it is that they enjoy it then you get everyone's
adoption if the primary thing is still i mean i'm farming it for an airdrop
you get a very small segment of retail because it's not that enjoyable it's just like a way to
make money and the majority of retail have jobs are working for their money so they're not gonna
spend their time farming a protocol and i think that's the irony of all these dexes right it's
like perp dexes like all the people on the perp DEXs, the vast majority aren't good traders.
They're just farmers.
So CT retards.
Yeah.
So I think retail requires those kind of much more highly enjoyable.
The apps themselves are amazing and great.
And I don't think we really have those yet that are broadly speaking where the first thing is fun or utility and the second thing is monetary. I think right now it's still
fully flipped. So I still think we're a bit away from that. Like, I don't think it's happening in
the next year. Well, I have strong belief in the SEAL ecosystem, which will be bridging to monad i i think those boys
have been cooking for years on a game they've got a token that they're going to be bridging to monad
you'll be able to buy and provide liquidity to it on kuru and uh so maybe that's it maybe that's it. Maybe that's it. Maybe the SEAL games are it.
I mean, is it crazy? Like, if there's going to be a retail wave, I know that retail is not more mature.
But retail is, they have scars that have healed over, I feel like, at this point from the crazy 2020, from 2021.
from like the crazy 2020 wait from 2021 and then like even some of them like touched the hot pan
a year ago and like downloaded phantom and traded you know like moonshot yeah like poopy santa cat
and like they got like they got like wrecked by like the phantom trending like coins or whatever
and like if there's it feels to me
like if there's going to be a retail wave i think it might just be that they'll allocate to bitcoin
like some amount of their percentage or like their 401k or like i i feel like people are coming around
to and i think the next psychological barrier that needs to be broken and i'm actually surprised like is sailor
sailor is like i i just don't see sailor around as much anymore maybe he's still on the on the
stump like doing his thing just bought he just he just made a buy well fair fair i think we like we
need some kind of like reasonable person to like norm everyone that i talk to in real life is like
yeah bitcoin wow like great trade
can't buy it here though they feel like they can't buy it at like over 100k because it just
feels too rich for them but like i think the next anchor that we need kind of or not need i think
this will happen regardless maybe i'm i don't look i guess no one will think i'm crazy for
thinking that bitcoin flips gold event or someday or know, still just has a lot of upside, regardless of if it flips gold.
But like, that is the thing.
Like, there's a crazy thing here, right?
Like, there was a crazy ceiling that people just don't recognize.
They're like, oh, well, Bitcoin is topped.
Like, it's, it's over, you know, and it might, it might be topped.
It might be tough, although we should flip in a second here because we're pumping right now.
Although we should flip in a second here because we're pumping right now.
But yeah, people have this psychological barrier always to buying Bitcoin, but even more so now that they kind of think of it as a good investment to buying it over $100K, which is sad because they might be sidelined.
If the easy road really was the $250K, it just wasn't going to happen in a month.
If the easy road really was the 250K, it just wasn't going to happen in like a month.
That would be, I actually want people to like be invested in Bitcoin to like have this as
like a part of their portfolio as like, you know, resistance money, store of value, hedge
against inflation, you know, all of these different things.
So yeah, but I don't know.
But yeah, I mean, okay guys, anything.
I mean, we are, we are, we're kind of. But, yeah. I mean, okay, guys. I mean, we are.
Headphone Sal.
I want to say hi to Headphone Sal.
Headphone Sal has been in the Cat5 streams, vibing out from Brazil.
She's a token holder.
I love you so much, Headphone Sal, for coming in and vibing in the chat.
Likewise. I do really like you and i uh enjoy stream so yep why not let's be holder until end yeah thank you headphone cell uh cat why you can call me soul cell this headphone it's my abandoned account for two
years and i'm using this account again after two years yeah you can call me that soul cell
okay okay you're you're going with the brand the brand your name is soul cell but the brand is
headphone cell was it was it used to be but i stopped using this account for
more than two years and it's been a kind of debt and this is the most regret that i have
but that's okay that's something that i did yeah but i want to add something cozy hi about the nfd
that you were talking actually nick said something that i wanted to say
uh however i'm i'm that kind of person that i really don't care about art i love the utility
i'm sorry i just want the result it's like if you if you are uh selling me a direct line i would buy it if you tell me this is a blue chip or this is something that
they're gonna be something in the future so art is beautiful i know but art without any plan
it's art my mom is an artist okay i see art every day in my life. But, yep, if my mom has a gallery,
if she's just making a lot of painting, I don't know,
using a lot of style, but she cannot sell.
So what's the point for people around her, such a thing?
So she cannot make money.
Maybe I'm very materialistic regarding but this this is
immutable art this is this is on the blockchain that will never will never die and and i i
understand never die but if you don't do anything you will forget you forget you. It's the same as a physical piece of art.
It could be forgotten just as easily.
Yeah, that's why you should just have a good marketing for that art.
You should just show people that, yeah, I'm doing something great.
If you're just doing this for yourself, just enjoying, yeah, that's okay.
No problem. just enjoying yeah that's okay no problem if you won't be disheartened when people do not
mint your project that's okay that's okay you can make tons of project nfts as long as you want so
but if you want to be successful in this kind of thing i i believe that team is important connections important utility
is important not like you have utility for everything but at least have a little
bit height yeah interesting so for example for me I don't care if mad lad
is has a good art or an ugly one I I don't care. Why should I care?
If they are doing good in the community,
that's enough for...
Yeah, yeah. Number go up technology.
That's all that matters.
Yeah. I'm sorry.
That's okay, Sol Sal.
No, I mean, I get it.
I think that's one of the main...
I mean, yeah, like, you always have to, yeah, I think
that at the end of the day, we probably, like, you, I mean, like, NFTs, buying NFTs are
almost like the, it kind of feels like that's the, buying NFTs to get something maybe down
the line that you don't know what it will be feels very similar to me of like
uh like kind of you see something running and so you're like oh i'm going to go buy the beta
like you see like pepe running so you're like oh i'm going to go buy wojack that can have a like
good play but it's just it's like the euthanasia roller coaster right like you're just again like
i just think it's like maximum pvp you're just really in like a tough euthanasia rollercoaster, right? Like, you're just, again, like, I just think it's, like, maximum PvP.
You're just really in, like, a top...
The euthanasia rollercoaster?
Yeah.
Do you know the euthanasia rollercoaster meme?
No, no.
No, I was asking.
What is that?
The euthanasia rollercoaster is where, like, it's like the loops,
and then the loops get smaller as it keeps going.
You don't know the euthanasia?
Oh, oh oh oh oh like
roller coaster of diminishing returns well i mean sure but like making everything more difficult
yeah i understood right now what's that do you that that meme is called the euthanasia roller
coaster it's it was designed by like a doctor who wanted to come up with a way that you could like
kill people without like using like using, like, violence.
You would, like, put them on this roller coaster and they would die.
I think that's a real thing.
What the fuck?
Dude, that's what that meme is.
When people are putting that meme up, that's what that meme is.
Google it.
Yeah, I just pinned it.
That's the meme.
No, I see it. I see it. I mean, I've always interpreted that on, like, CC when, like, Inverse Bra post it.
It's just, like, the hype is a diminishing circle.
Like, you're going to end up with something great and then end up holding a bag of shit.
Okay, Google euthanasia coaster.
It has a Wikipedia page, I'm telling you.
But the roller coaster of diminishing returns.
And I'm not going to lie.
I have a bunch of NFT that I really like it because they were girlish, pink, beautiful.
I just minted and I keep it in my wallet. They have zero value.
So sometimes I do this. But for example, I had a bunch of white lists for apps like I minted none.
whitelist for apps like i minted none i didn't feel like that like i was just looking at the
chart saying that the floor price is less than the mint price so i just give up this kind of things
so it's not like i am looking at everything materialistic i just want to say something should make sense for me to do it
like i am keeping a lot of testnet nfds i'm not selling any of them why because my friend made it
i'm not gonna tell it you know it's just like memory let me in my wallet so i i look depends
on the situation too yeah no i think that that i think that's the only way to i i'm just so
convinced now that like the only like nfts as an investment are very very hard unless we get some
kind of mania phase and that the best way to trade them is buy what you like with no expectation that
you'll profit from it whatsoever and i think that your mental headspace will just be much better.
And if you're looking for, I mean, like, yeah, I don't know.
Of course, of course.
Buy art you like.
Buy art that you want to see in your wallet.
Yep, totally.
That has always been my thesis.
Of course, I'll see some of these DGN utility plays and try to ape,
but most of the utility is just like a dick-sucking circle jerk.
Yep, no, 100%.
Okay, so last thing that I think that we should dive into.
So, I mean, we were pulling back for for the last few days people were pretty people were pretty doomered and like i
think that we've both become so addicted to calling the top because of 2021 2022 ptsd but
also people are just i don't know like people want that clout. People want that, like, oh, oh, this was the top.
See me on my yacht.
Like, get out of here.
No, they want to nail it.
Ansem's gut is just on the prowl looking for any talk to call and all that.
And all that.
But, yeah, okay, so we're pumping right now.
But yeah, we're pumping right now.
I mean, like it's been.
So I woke up to.
I'm in Uber's Telegram chat.
And he was like, what if we just go straight up from here?
And I was I read that and I was like, no, there's no way.
I'm like, dude, like we're not going straight up from here.
And then I opened CoinGecko and Bitcoin is at one hundred and seven.
When was this yesterday?
No, this was like, no, he posted it overnight.
And I was like.
Okay, okay.
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, we were like, it was already, it was like creeping up.
But yeah, so like I, but I was like, no, dude, like there's no way.
And then I opened up my phone and I was like, oh, damn, like we are.
He's right.
My theory over trading the past couple weeks is we, I mean, those World War III fears were pretty wild.
But here's.
And if you've been around here enough, you know that war fears tentatively usually mark the bottom.
I tentatively usually mark the bottom.
And having that happen at the end of September, right before October, I was like, this is when I start scaling into longs.
And it's worked out pretty well.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I don't know, Nick, what do you, I know that you've kind of faded Ansem's gut in the past here, but I don't know, any market takes here?
Yeah, I just think it's people chasing clout, but I don't think the perspective has changed at all.
Bitcoin is a long-term asset, so you treat it like that and it'll go up over a long horizon.
To me, it's pointless to be like oh
like in three weeks or four weeks or two days like unless you're perpetrating it and you're one of the
few people that can do that well why does that matter like most of those people probably don't
hold the asset if you hold it you're probably holding it and you've been holding for a long time
and you assume you know it's a long-term So for me, like Bitcoin will continue to go up over a long time horizon.
I don't really care.
Even if it drops like 20 percent to me, it doesn't really matter.
But the alt side, like it's that'll always be there.
Right.
Hyper speculative assets will go up and go down.
So, well, Nick, Nick, what what are your thoughts on a large amount of CT, a large amount of traders subscribing to a typical four-year cycle?
Do you think that happens or do you think with the institutional bid, we kind of break out of that?
Yeah, so my personal take is like the whole four four year cycle thing, in my opinion, is kind of
like a very CT misnomer because normal financial cycles happen in every single market known to man.
It is not unique to CT or to crypto. Right. Like, so I think that's part one. But I do think part
two, what you're starting to see is the super volatile nature of it, right? Where you see that the highest ranking asset in crypto drop extremely steep, right?
50 plus percent, whatever it is, like these massive BTC drops.
I think in my opinion, those days of like high double digit percentage drops, like more than 50, let's say, are like not going to be that common.
Like for Bitcoin in particular. Right. But I think the problem with cycles is like, look at the 2021 chart.
Just wait a second. Like the 2021 chart. Yeah, it's a different time.
Like what I'm saying is, right. The point I'm trying to make is that assets separate themselves.
Right. So if you think about BTC now versus what it was 2021, 2017, before 2017,
what that asset is and who's adopted and who holds it has vastly changed,
which means its volatility changes,
which means that it's separating from the other highly volatile assets.
So what creates these huge drops and four-year cycles of speculative assets
is the fact that they are hyper speculative.
So when any of those become less speculative, you have less swings. So when someone says,
oh, do we have four-year cycles? I think, yeah, like any other financial sector, we will.
Which assets though receive that type of drop, like those massive zero drops, right, that just
go nuke to nothing and stay there for like multiple
years we'll 100 have those across tons of alts do i think we're gonna have that for btc no like
that's my personal take like i think those days because it's a it's the asset for bitcoin is now
different in class and category who owns it how it's traded how it's viewed than other alts so to me like the
rest of the stuff can function that way because of the volatility that exists in it but btc no
longer has the same volatility in my opinion that it did a cycle ago two cycles ago right so So, so besides BTC, name some alt mainstream coins that you think will survive.
What do you mean by survive?
I mean, just not go to zero, like you said.
Yeah, like, so I think it's to be seen.
Like, obviously, the bigger ones, like ETH, stuff like that,
like, I don't think it'll go to zero.
But I still think it'd be highly volatile.
So for me personally, the only thing I feel safe saying
that it's separated is BTC, personally.
That's the only single asset that I think is clearly differentiated from the rest.
I tend to agree with that.
It's the only thing that I'll tell that I'm confident that like when I tell people are like, oh, you work in crypto.
And they're like, oh, what do you do?
I'm like, oh, I work in crypto.
Like, oh, you know, do you know Bitcoin?
They're like, oh, yeah, I know Bitcoin.
And they're like, oh, shit.
That's the only thing that you can.
I really think like it's the only thing that you can feel confident telling someone to buy.
And at Thanksgiving, even if it's down 10%,
you can just be like, not worried about it.
You know, like, I think like, yeah, it's so true.
Which is a great thing.
That is not, I've only been in crypto for,
I mean, since early 2021.
But like, there was a time where you were like,
oh my, this might not exist anymore.
It might be over forever.
But but yeah, no, kind of wild.
Oh, man. All right, guys. Well, I mean, pretty good space. I don't know.
Yeah. So now. Yeah. I mean, I do wonder where I'll just go from here.
It feels like we've just come out of this like hot ball of money,
just like singeing people. And like, I mean, you nailed the, okay, here's one last thing.
Plasma, crazy run up. People were going crazy. They were absolutely like, yeah, they were like,
what is it? They were just really happy. They were celebrating, celebrating on the timeline,
victory laughing on the timeline victory
victory laughing on the timeline and i don't know actually maybe plasma is doing better now i haven't
checked the price today but it was kind of down it's pretty even on the day okay okay um nick
you're a i think you're kind of a plasma are Are you a plasma believer? It's at $1. Okay, $1.05.
That's not bad.
That's not awful.
But, I mean, it's off of what?
It's down like, yeah, I mean, it's down a fair amount.
But, yeah, I don't know.
Nick, any plasma takes here?
I guess maybe there was just too much hype.
I mean, the bottom today was 90 cents
we're up today we're just not we're just not as ripping as hard as some of these other alts
and majors i mean i think it's up a ton right so for anyone that did the plasma deal right
like plasma even now is at a 10 billion fdV right so you got in at 500 million right and so
you're still up a 20x and sure you were up like a 30x right at whatever like a day or two ago but
I I do think like one people are gonna take like, because people sized in, right? And so when you have
unlocked tokens available, like, and you're up 30x 20x, you're not just going to go straight to
like 40 billion. And we saw this with the hype chart too. I think it's a very different vehicle
because I don't think the raw sort of mechanics lend itself like hype.
But I do think it's the leader in the stablecoin narrative, right? And we're seeing those kinds of deals right now on the ICO and buy platforms
just get like over allocated, right?
Like by tons.
It's happened today.
So I think it'll be fine.
Like I'm not worried about it.
Like especially for people that got in kind of like the early sale.
If you bought it, like after it went past 10 billion, because you wanted to go to 20 billion,
like those are just kind of like, I'm not sure like what those people are necessarily doing,
like trading that for a 2X in like a highly early market but I think yeah I think
it's a long tail for them like they want sort of the the neo side to come out their plasma
one stuff um but all that will take they wanted yeah yeah like it's but you know even if even if
it settles below 10 billion let's say settles at like eight or seven, like that's still great.
I think we've become a little jaded.
It's like, yeah.
So I don't know.
I'm perfectly happy with it.
And I think they've executed well.
They have really strong partners still.
People are obviously moving away from the vaults too, because they had a promo period
for the vaults where you were getting like 20% plus APR.
That's ended.
So it's now close to eight.
So like, yeah, money will chase yield.
Money will chase taking profit.
And those are all good things.
And then you kind of see where it settles.
So to me, nothing is that concerning.
I think it's just people kind of looking at
like eight or nine four-hour candles in a row being red and panicking.
And a lot of them probably also didn't believe early or didn't put in money early.
They got in super late, which is, I think, always a recipe for disaster.
Like you just don't want to be late to stuff.
So I don't know.
I still think it's a leader in the stablecoin narrative, which I think will continue.
I do think it'll get really crowded, though.
So for them to be a continued leader and for them to grow their TVL, their token value,
I think they have to really push because everyone's going to be creating a stable token from every angle.
So I think the competition is going to be, in my opinion, a lot.
And so we'll see how it goes.
Okay, okay.
I have two more questions, and then we can wrap it up.
One, has anybody even been farming lighter?
No, not me, but I'm not much of a perp sex guy.
Oh my God, this lighter
airdrop is going to
fucking cook.
Oh my God, I got a couple
coats in the beginning a couple months ago
and I said, nah, I don't
have time. Wow, you faded.
My God.
So faded.
Oh my goodness. Okay, that's okay.
No problem.
It's not the first thing I do.
That's okay.
No problem.
But if anybody wants a ref code, DM me.
I have a few.
Yeah, give me a DM.
I'll give you a ref code to lighter.
This is going to be one of the hottest airdrops since Hyperliquid.
Not financial advice.
But, okay, my second question, Karu Cozy,
was what, in the title, you said Puerto Rico.
Are we going to Puerto Rico?
What is the deal with Puerto Rico?
Oh, yeah, right on. That was probably too esoteric. But the reason I said Puerto Rico
was because of the ThreadGuy taxes crash out.
Bro, bro's never paid taxes in his life, and he has a fucking crash out.
in his life right he has a fucking crash out dude and also like you're yeah man like one okay i'll
here's a few levels to this i'm glad we'll i'm glad we'll close out on this because yes the
funniest thing one actually genuinely really funny post by thread guy i know he was real he it was
funny as i was reading it i was laughing like it was actually really funny because you could
tell it was a stream of consciousness too and there's just a lot of levels to it right so it's
a funny crash out he kept going in the replies too and they were pretty funny the thread guy is
funny i'm not gonna lie i'm gonna give it to him on that one that was a good it was a great post
it's a great copy pasta just like well done that's just going to become like a part of CT lore now.
And like that's just that's just hats off to.
Yeah.
Hilarious because you're also like, dude, like they're always I mean, dude, like buckle up.
I mean, you got this is just the rest of your life.
But yeah.
But also there is the option.
I mean, crime is legal.
No one's going to come after you for your taxes.
Like, just don't do them.
Okay, disagree.
I don't.
Pay your taxes.
Definitely pay your taxes.
If you can't afford to pay your taxes, it's a skill issue, right?
Ultimately.
Yeah, I mean, 100%.
I would say definitely pay your taxes and uh yeah it's a
good oh my god but because why should i pay 27 of my airdrop or exactly any any on-chain activity
to government what did they do for me that has nothing your on-chain activity has nothing to do with the potholes in the road
okay i mean like i look i'm about as big of a government hater government fader as you can
find and i still but i'm also probably just like too much of a rule follower but i i mean you should
definitely pay your taxes and also i think that that's kind of crazy if you get if there's a guy
outside your
house banging on the door and you call the police, like the police are going to come and they're
probably going to be like reasonably competent to help you in that situation. If your house is on
fire, the fire department is going to come like this. I'm talking about the United States
contextually. Right. So like there are a lot of things that you benefit from that. It's kind of
ridiculous to say, like, oh, paying your tax. Now, look, I agree it's too high.
Like, I'm not.
Look, there's so much bloat.
I agree.
The services you described are necessary, but there is so much more bloat beyond that.
Look, I agree.
I agree.
I voted for Trump because I thought we were going to get austerity.
I was ready.
I was.
Yeah.
Yes.
So did I. I voted for Trump because I thought we were going to usher in a great American age where I could buy a dozen eggs for $1.
But that didn't happen.
It is not.
It is certainly not happening.
It's really a bummer.
I will say, like, the last, like, two or three years, I've been playing.
I play fantasy football.
And my fantasy football teams have been, like, Trump-themed. And it's been really fun and funny. Like, I was, like, I play fantasy football and my fantasy football teams have been like Trump themed and it's been really fun and funny.
Like I was like, never surrender. Then I was like, fight, fight, fight. Great. Just great memes. And it's dead. The meme is dead. It is. It is over. I'm so sad.
But Trump is just not cool anymore. I still like I still like him in my heart and I want him to succeed, but it's really so sad. What did he say the other day?
We need war so that we can end all wars.
It's like, dude, are you Dick Cheney?
That's a wild one.
Yeah.
Have you seen the Palantir chart?
The Palantir chart is what we want our crypto charts to look like.
Dude.
But okay, the only thing that is going to be interesting is, did you guys see that the
Senate is convening to talk about crypto taxes?
Is there a world where the Trump family is so embroiled in crime and crypto grift that they change the tax laws to be helpful to us?
To us?
Like, is that something that can happen?
Is that something that can happen?
It feels real.
It could.
It could.
Kuzi, I am paying taxes in my real life for my real job.
Even if I breathe in this country, I should pay the taxes.
So, not American.
I really, I really am jealous of you guys that you are living in a good country.
That you see the results of your taxes.
But, oh my God, I'm talking.'m talking is it recorded okay i love it no problem i love my taxes i love the brazilian leadership
yes i'm from puerto rico okay i'm not brazilian puerto rico noosa, I will say I agree. And like I say that about I'm just saying at a
baseline level that I think it is just to pay your taxes. I think that you I think that you should.
But I mean, like, look, I live in a state where like the roads are under construction
80 percent of the year. It's a nightmare. You can't go anywhere in our major metropolitan area.
I would normally I wouldn't even say this because it would docks where I live.
This is just everywhere.
People run through red lights.
You can't even go downtown anymore.
It's like a total travesty.
It's a nightmare.
Okay, I won't say more.
The state that I live in is awful.
And my taxpayer dollars go to things that I think are abhorrent.
Things that I think are important like i things that i think are like evil and so i i agree with like not wanting to pay taxes i guess is all that
i'm all that i'm like i get it but like i think you still need to and at the end of the day i think
the thing about crypto taxes that is infuriating is that like things about crypto taxes, this is what I agree with you.
They don't make sense. Like airdrops being taxed as income at the time that you claim them is
actually crazy. And it really sucks. Like that should be changed and it would be right and just
for that to happen. So I'm all for it to make reasonable sense. Like airdrops are not, I don't, I mean, I don't know.
I understand to be fair also,
like in a way why you would see them as income,
but like the way that you like are calculating
the actual value of it,
like there's nothing worse than like claiming an airdrop
within a day of it at like the pico top
and then it tanks in value.
You either have to sell immediately
or there has to be some way to like calculate
like a fair value. And accountants don't even know has to be some way to like calculate like
a fair value and accountants don't even know how to do this right so like it's just no one does
no you you go to the best accountant on earth and they're like what have you been smoking yeah
well it's like it's kind of like the sec saying like come in and register and then like they're
like no we you i don't like they don't they're not gonna let you read it's like gary's not gonna let you register you know it's like
because the government's kind of like well hey pay taxes on your crypto and like we you you you can
but like it is like have you guys ever seen the donald rumsfeld letter that he would send in with
his taxes every year where he would be like i have tried my best with the help of a professional accountant to submit my taxes.
I have no idea if they are correct.
I hope that you will let me know if they are or are not.
Right?
Like that kind of, it's super fun.
But you should look that up.
You should look up the Donald Rumpsoil tax letter.
But yeah, man, it's a total, it's a mess.
Yeah, Nick, what do you think?
No one pays taxes because they believe in it. You pay taxes so that you don't put the rest of your assets at risk.
Yeah.
You know, like, I think that's why you pay taxes. Like, I don't know a single person that's like, I pay taxes because I believe in what it's used for. You pay it to protect your other assets.
it to protect your other assets. But I do think the one scenario where you can take more risk,
like I think everyone should pay their taxes just because it's safer for your longer term
life and everything else. But if you're like very young and you have no assets and like the risk is
very minimal, that is probably the only time where it makes sense to take risks on that side.
I think when you're older and you have assets, you have a family or any of those things,
like it makes no sense not to pay your taxes because that stuff will hang with you for a while.
You ever get audited, yeah, it's awful.
I have a family member, no joke, I mean, look, they're not in crypto,
but they're entrepreneurs.
One of them is not, but has a high paying job, right?
High powered, high powered couple and great, great people and family members.
And they live, they're like snowbirds, right?
So they like live between different states and they got audited and they were not reporting their taxes correctly.
They ended up paying 70K to hire an accountant
and get all of it figured out.
And then they owe back taxes
that they're paying to the government now.
So like, I know, and also like the reason
why I pay my taxes in crypto is,
do you really think, like the government is super slow
and they're poor at execution,
but it would be, there's no world
where Coinbase is not going to dox you and give your on-chain information to the government.
And they're going to build some kind of AI tracking thing that can calculate the exact amount that you owe.
And I think if you're not at least making a good faith, let alone an accurate attempt at paying your taxes like they will come in like
it could be five ten years down the line but like i think that they will get your ass and like chat
gbt i think will whatever it is they will be able to just scrape and scrub all this stuff is totally
public right so like it's not anonymous and like if you've ever kyc'd and onboarded somewhere
they have all of your stuff and they can track. Now they don't
know who you send it to where, and maybe you can scrub your wallets and like use tornado cash,
but look what they did to the tornado cash guys. So like, I probably wouldn't do that either.
Right. So like, yeah, I don't know, man, you gotta, I would, I'm just saying that AI thing,
scrubbing on chain. I don't even know if that's ever going to happen, but I believe it easily could, even though the government, I think, is probably the worst at executing anything.
But yeah, man.
So that is why I do.
I try.
I pay my taxes.
But OK, so what one more question before we close up?
What is Chogtober?
Dude, are you serious? what is Chogtober? Dude, are you serious?
Yes.
Chogtober, it's, uh,
they're, like, doing an activation. ChogNFT.
Benja. You haven't seen this?
It's okay. No, no.
Send me the link.
Uh, just go to, go to Chog,
go to, go to add ChogNFT.
Go to their official NFT.
Are they in this space?
They're not.
No, they're not.
They actually were.
Wow.
Wow.
That's why we've been light on people's face.
They've been doing, they're doing different events, activations.
Kuru is a part of it.
Go, you can, basically you like complete different activities and then you have a chance to win like a bunch of
big eco uh like some test net some main net um like prizes basically that whole that kind of deal
and it's like the big they're calling it i think this is real they're calling it the biggest test
net activation that has happened so far and it's pretty pretty big. Keone posted about it. It's been fun. I'm glad to be
a part of it. Oh, okay. We lost Cat 5. Well, this is fortuitous. Well, not fortuitous that we lost
Cat 5, who I love. He's been a great co-host. Okay. He's back. Okay. Right on. All right. I'm
going to wrap this up here though. It is 10.02. I've got to go work on a fun little special project
that you guys will probably see in the next few days here.
If you haven't checked it out already, Kuru just released one of our biggest redesigns yet.
So the Discover page now houses all coins on Monad.
Oh, yeah.
UI and UX is so important.
Yeah, yeah. um so we're ui ui and ux is so important yeah yeah i yeah and i hope if you guys have tried it out yet please give us your um feedback because i think that we i think it's safe to
say we've been upgrading the ui ux across the board but there's always you know never satisfied
right i want to keep on working to make it as good as it can be so So not only are we indexing all of the tokens on Monit
from any major miner decks from NADFUN now launched tokens
and from Kuru.
And let us know if there's launch pads that we should include.
I don't know that there are any other big or even moderately
or small ones that we should include.
But yeah, let us know about that.
And then also within the pages themselves,
we've redesigned the trade interface so that all of your swaps are going through the aggregator.
So you're getting better execution, better price on all of the trades that are happening within
our terminal interface. Now you can still set limit orders on any coins that have a Kuru order
book market, which is pretty sweet as well. So there's just a lot of stuff that's happening. And so I'm actually going to be filming a
walkthrough, like a tutorial to show you all the different little features and tips and tricks
that you can do. So I'm going to go work on that right now. And you'll probably see it by the end
of this week. So I'm excited for that. Yeah, but it's been great to hang out with you guys. This
was a great space. We missed KB.
Hope she's doing well.
No, we didn't.
Honestly, we had a great space without KB.
Oh, cat's bite.
Oh, let's let's.
Honestly.
No, no.
I mean, KB just yaps about La Boo Boo's.
She's very ignorant about the market.
She just shit posts. This has been an informative space. She just shitposts.
This has been an informative space.
All right, all right.
Don't say that.
We love KB, and KB and I have actually...
I think that KB and I, we've been doing these spaces for a long time now.
Like, probably a year to plus.
And we've actually, I think, hit our stride in just the last month or two.
I didn't like the change to mornings.
I liked the Wednesday night vibe.
What was the change to mornings?
Well, the change to mornings is that Wednesday evenings,
our original vision for this was, that's why we called it Kuru Live,
was for it to be like a late night show for yeah and it but the problem is the time zones right so like you're
kind of missing you're in europe and you're although there were europeans that were come
they were just insane it's late night in europe it's it's not that bad in europe
i mean it was like middle of the night for them it was
like past midnight for most of them I don't know the exact time zones and then Asia I think was
like just just waking up or it was very very early um so the mornings you kind of catch all
the different time zones and also like so we just fuck the west coast fuck the west coast
I mean yeah 100% yeah no totally they don, totally. They're not even real in my opinion.
If you live in California, you're like barely sentient, in my opinion.
Agreed, agreed.
Just kidding. We love our Californians.
But yeah, no.
So we wanted to catch the different time zones.
And also, I'll be honest, we found that the viewership was better.
Or like more people have been tuning in.
And we don't have to work in the evenings.
That's pretty nice.
I like it.
It made sense.
No, I was a staple of the nighttime spaces.
And I'm trying to get more active here on the daytime spaces.
I won a Pokemon card last week i got my first bz pokemon card yeah it's a shitty card i don't even know how to pronounce
the pokemon but whatever i have one right on no no that was super fun i'm i'm way into the tcg meta
so if uh so i'm actually i'm i'm like I'm like buying and collecting cards in real life now.
So I'm like actually having so much fun with it.
I bought a $500 lot of random old Pokemon cards.
And in my spare time over the last like two or three days,
like in the evenings, I've been sitting down and like cataloging them,
like sorting them, organizing them.
I'm not going to lie.
It's one of the most
fun things I've done in a really long time. So if anybody get it at a show, did you, or on eBay
off of Facebook marketplace? Yeah. There's like $2,000 worth of cards, but in this box that I
bought, but they're all like $1 cards, $2 cards. And so I'm like organizing. And also there's a few like 10, 15, $30 cards.
And I'm going to, I went to a show two weekends ago. I'm going to a show on Sunday. So I'm going
to like bring these and these will be almost like my bartering chips. If anyone's interested in them,
a lot of them are like vintage and I don't really care if I sell them or not. Cause I feel like if
I hold them for another five or 10 years, they'll just either retain their value or go up so yeah honestly it's been really really fun I
if you were into Pokemon as a kid not even chilling my own bags honestly like I've just
got a lot of enjoyment have you used the BZ function of pulling a card and then like getting it into your physical collection i haven't but i've heard
good things about it um yeah so i haven't actually done any i haven't actually gotten any card
shipped i did use the collector's crypt gotcha last night um and i'm down i'm down like 100
but uh but but it's fun that one is like plus ev which is like
interesting so it's like a 50 pull and then it's like 55 of expected value which is kind of
interesting uh but uh but yeah i don't know it's not plus cv though like the real mess doesn't work
yeah no 100 no you're still i mean like exactly i mean i lost a lot of money so i don't i don't
know that i recommend it but it was fun um but yeah so it's good okay all right guys i better uh
i better wrap this up here interesting final words final words check out the ticker cat five
stream all right i'm not shilling the coin i'm'm shilling the stream. Come watch amazing music on the PumpFum platform.
Don't buy the coin.
Just boost my viewership.
Have some fun times.
Okay, okay.
I do recommend the stream, and I have nothing to say about the coin.
Good stuff.
Guys, thanks for tuning in this week.
It's been really fun talking through the market with you all.
Hyper Puerto Rico, Chogtober, where we go from here.
Thanks for tuning in, guys guys we'll be back next week
KB should be back with us we'll probably stream
so that'll be fun we'll be back with a stream
consistency is key thanks so much
for tuning in today guys we appreciate you all
I'm jumping on that stream
we would have
you could totally come on but yeah
okay alright peace guys have a good rest of the day.
