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Leading Bitlayer: A co-founder's View on Bitcoin, Builders and the Road Ahead
Recorded: June 19, 2025 Duration: 1:26:30Space Recording
Short Summary
BitLayer is making waves in the crypto space with its innovative layer two solution on Bitcoin, boasting over 200 deployed protocols and an upcoming Token Generation Event. The project is focused on strategic partnerships and yield opportunities for BTC holders, while emphasizing the importance of real innovation in the industry.
Full Transcription
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Well, what a weird day it has been for these X spaces.
Yeah, I think we can get started.
Linda, do you mind doing a quick mic check?
Yeah, hello.
Hello, everyone.
Could you hear me clearly? Oh, hello. Hello, everyone. Could you hear me clearly?
Oh, yeah.
That was perfect.
You're welcome.
Well, without further ado, let's get started.
Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the Partner Spotlight.
I'm Sergio, your host.
Today we are diving back into a project that's pushing the boundaries of what's possible on Bitcoin, and that's BitLayer.
If you tuned in to our earlier episode, which happened a couple of months ago,
if I remember correctly, you will remember we explored BitLayer's technical foundation, so how it's building a layer two on Bitcoin using the BitVM
paradigm and introducing Turing completeness um which
well we had another co-founder of um bilayer explained to us um i could understand a little
bit of it i don't know how you all did um but yeah today we are super happy to have all the team members of BitLayers with us. And well, that was our deep dive into the how.
Today we are shifting the focus a little bit to the what now, what's next.
And with a very fresh look at BitLayers growth, leadership, partnerships, and of course, broader impact on the ecosystem.
Now a really quick heads up before we jump in. Charlie, so BitLayers
co-founder, well, who is mentioned in the title as well, is currently in Prague for
ETH Prague, right, Linda? And he's speaking with builders, attending panels, of course, and soaking up ideas from the Web3 ecosystem.
Yes.
Great.
Yeah, he will be joining us shortly to share both his reflections from the event, hopefully,
and the broader perspective on BitLayer.
Before that, we are super honored today to be joined by another key member of the BitLayer team,
someone who's been deeply involved in the project's direction and development.
So Linda, welcome to the show.
How are you?
Thanks for having me.
Yeah, it's great.
Yeah, I'm based in China and yeah, it a middle night in China but it's great to share Bitlyer's picture with
all the audience yeah oh my gosh um yeah thank you so much for making the time um that's okay
because everybody knows the crypto is like 24 hours no stop just to work very hard yeah
is like 24 hours,
no stop,
just work very hard.
Yeah, exactly.
I couldn't agree more.
It's a 24-7 thing.
Definitely, I must agree.
You know,
and I think we all can say
that we have been in,
I don't know,
3 a.m., 4 a.m.
watching charts at some point.
I have done that.
You probably have too.
Yeah. But still, thank you so much. It's definitely an honor to have you here today.
And well, Charlie mentioned that Linda knows a lot, probably even more than him. So yeah,
it was a great opportunity to learn more from someone as knowledgeable as Linda.
So could you start us off by introducing yourself and also telling us a bit about how you joined this beautiful industry and what you do at BitLayer?
Sure. Thanks for your time.
Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. Let me introduce myself briefly.
Yeah. I'm Linda, the BD Director at BitLayer.
Actually, I work for blockchain since 2018, like seven years ago.
Yeah, my first job in crypto is I work for exchange.
It's a decentralized exchange and we work based on the EOS
because it's very early of the crypto.
So people do not know very well how to use the word, the keyword.
So actually our exchange is run like three years and we did a good job.
But we also have a lot of very strong competitors.
And then the second job work for OpenOcean.
It's a DAX aggregator.
It's similar like a one-inch.
And my third job is like I work for a VC.
It's like do the invest post. and now I work for Bitlyer.
Actually, I joined Bitlyer the last year very early, at the beginning of the year.
So at that time, Bitlyer just begins.
So for me, I have worked for Bitlyer one half years, so I know exactly how does it grow up.
So from the beginning to now, we already built almost two years.
Yeah, so that's my work experience in blockchain and in Bitlyer.
Wow, exciting to hear.
Sorry.
Yeah, no wonder Charlie mentioned you You probably know more than him.
I think you could consider yourself half a co-founder.
Yeah, it's like, yeah, I know every step is a bit there.
When I joined, our team only has around 10 people,
and the highest we have 60 people. And now we have around 40 team members.
Wow, that's amazing. Great to have you here.
I think we can forget about Charlie now. No, just kidding.
We love to know what's been happening behind the
scenes of course and yeah very familiar names um i think we joined um at the similar time i joined
in early 2018 as well and wow when you mentioned eos i was like oh yeah at the time they were super
popular with their um super nodes and whatnot and then they were kind
of uh competitors of cardano right and at the time it was kind of a yeah kind of a you know a war
well i don't know if it's uh correct to say it is but there was like a competition right between them
competition right between them and yeah i remember at the time um making some some gains from both
cardano and eos but unfortunately yeah i i was a new at the time and and whenever i made a little
profit i just um sold them and yeah but well that's uh what keeps motivating us, right?
Yeah.
And yeah, super, super happy to have met somebody from around the same time now.
And good to know that you made it to continue in the industry.
And yeah, we'd love to learn more from you today.
And yeah, we talked to Kevin a couple of months ago, I believe, if I remember correctly.
And Will, it would be, you know, great to know what are some of the new directions or priorities that BitLayer has been exploring after that, you know, session happened. Is there anything new that you guys discovered or are working on?
Yeah, definitely.
Yeah, actually so far we have two products.
And the first one is our BitLayer, the Bitcoin Layer 2, the sidechain.
The second is our BitVM bridge.
Yeah, and this BitVM bridge we just released early this year and this bridge may not
launch in May. It means last month. So this is a big strategy change. So last the whole year we're
trying to build our ecosystem. Actually we also achieved great goals. Like there's over 200 protocols deployed on BitLayer,
like it's including DeFi, SocialFi and GameFi.
And we work very deeply with Avalon,
the lending protocol and Bsmally and Bcall, the DAX.
Yeah, and we also, yeah,
there's over 200 products deployed on Bidler.
And this year, we will focus on BTC5 and about, yeah, with our BVM bridge.
So, what does it work?
How does it work?
Does BVM bridge?
It means a native BTC holder can bridge their native BTC to different chain networks. So we also cooperate with like three network,
Coinbase, Aptors, and Polygon Plume,
this kind of network.
It means we cooperate with chain networks.
They are not our competitors.
We just try to expand our BVM bridge branding.
to expand our BVM bridge branding.
And actually, we already signed contract with the three foundation.
It means we will provide our BTC liquidity into three network
and into their DeFi protocols.
For example, their Navi and the top two lending protocol on three, right?
And the next step, we will cooperate with Solana,
and we will also cooperate with AVAX.
AVAX, we cooperate with Fox Finance,
the lending protocol on this side.
All the work we cooperate with masterly is like we provide liquidity.
We provide the BTC liquidity to this kind of network with our BN bridge because
we know the BTC market cap is very huge, much, much bigger than Ethereum.
But the activity access, the activity BTC access is not very too much.
is not very too much.
So we do this job just to like to activate more BTC,
like help users to earn yield with their BTC
and in the safety way and with higher yield.
Wow, that's exciting to hear,
especially how quickly things are evolving, right?
And how widely you mentioned 200, right?
Yeah, yeah.
Over 200 protocols.
After one year building, we feel like if you want to build a very successful network,
you need to have your culture.
You also need your focus.
Some networks, they focus on game files.
Some networks, they focus on consuming.
And some networks, they focus on defy.
So actually, yeah, among these 200 practicals,
some they did very well.
Some they like just died maybe because the market and also some maybe because of
the funding they do not have enough money. So this year we would like to focus on BTC5,
focus on our Bitfam bridge because this we think if we find the right direction and we set our goal, we know the strategy and we just follow our strategy step by step.
We think we will do well.
Yes, of course. That's actually, I believe, quite a big number, right?
When you said you have 200 protocols and inevitably some of them will do better, some of them will do a little bit worse.
But in any case, I'm sure that you have learned and you have gathered experience
from every single one of them, which is what's most important.
And hopefully you can, of course, replicate the successful ones and mitigate, you know,
what happened with the ones that unfortunately either ceased activity or they're
just no longer active um but yeah thank you so much for the detailed insight on how bitlayer
has been doing and i think um we kind of well you of course kind of um tapped a little bit into the current state of the B-layer ecosystem.
And I was interested in knowing what types of projects or builders are the most active today.
And what kind of energy are you seeing from the community?
Are they happy? Are they active?
Are they, you know, what's, yeah, in short, what's the current status?
I mentioned about the community. So far our community is like 200k community members.
Most of them follow us from the beginning and so the one half years, they know what we did.
Actually, last year, we cooperate with, we hold a season campaign, like what we call it in Mining Gala.
The first, the season one, we cooperate with the Particle Network.
And the second one, we cooperate with the OKEx Cryptopedia.
The season three, we cooperate with Binance World.
And these three campaigns help us gain a lot more new users
and help us expand our branding.
And each time, each time the campaign,
we will bring our ecosystem to help them to gain more users with our incentive with the big brand.
So the community members are very happy to join this kind of campaign because they will get incentive from Bitlyer and from the protocols.
And this is the one.
And the second point is like they will know that Bitlyer is doing very hard to make more popular through or cooperate with the famous branding.
And so far, like we released our Bitvm bridge and we cooperate with three foundations.
and we cooperate with three foundations,
We will announce cooperate with Solana.
Yeah, they know we are like,
get stronger step by step,
but there's one more question.
Like they always like checking,
hey, when TGE, what time TGE?
Of course.
Yeah.
Yeah, actually about the TGE,
we are working on this,
but because the TGE, the thing is not easy to fully determine with a short time.
There's different elements to affect the result.
So we are working on this, but actually I can say maybe we will teach like mid of July.
And also, before the last half years, we always like to do the community AMA to talk with them.
Like our co-founder,founder Kevin they always like message
into the group communicate
with the members to know
what do they want to learn more about
BitLayer
what do they think about BitLayer
what's the feedback of their feeling
we take care of the
community members
feedback and we will if the feedback is very useful take care of the community members' feedback.
And if the feedback is very useful,
we will update our project or update our strategy.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's a great energy to have.
And definitely can say the same about Kevin and Charlie.
So if I remember correctly, Kevin was also,
so he did a first partner spotlight with us.
Yeah.
Answered a lot of questions.
Yeah, he's our co-founder.
Like Charlie's a co-founder.
Charlie is good at like the marketing
and the fundraising and the BD.
And Kevin is good at the, is a CPO. He's reading and the BD. And Kevin is a good at the, he's a CTO.
He's a good technology side.
He built a hacker team and he is an OG on the technical side.
Right.
Yeah.
They definitely seem to be a super nice team in this sense of duo.
And then you are also, I sure a very strong you know arm
of the of the company um and yeah um i think we we love that energy um we had kevin twice
with anchor um answering a lot of questions to be really really honest with you uh some of the answers that i got from kevin i didn't fully
understand uh but of course um he's uh yeah he seemed to be a very technical focused person
and um you know um once i during during our previous session i told him oh you remind me of
uh our cto and co-founder um stanley and he was like oh yeah
he's a friend of mine we we speak a lot you know we together we do um we talk on dm and then also
um over um calls whatever whatnot and i was like oh yeah now i understand um and yeah it's always
um great to hear about you know know, these early use cases.
You mentioned some big names, OKEx, Binance, you know, like I'm personally also, well, I don't know if to call myself customer or user, right?
I think probably both.
And yeah, great to know, you know, that the real innovation starting from there.
And I'm speaking of growth of big names.
There's one name that's very big for me personally, which is Anchor.
Yeah.
I remember like last year, early last year, I also had a call with Anchor.
And at that moment, we tried to cooperate with Anchor.
Because at the beginning, I joined BitLayer.
I'm not only focused on the BD side.
I'm not only focused on the DApp BD.
Also, like cooperate with the infrastructure partners side. I will join the call with the infrastructure partners side.
Like I will help, I will join the call
with the technical side to help them to do the BD part.
And then the technical guy will follow the tech side.
All right, so you probably have been following closely
the process of teaming up with Anchor, right?
Yeah.
Oh, that's lovely.
Yeah.
I was just wondering,
how has the collaboration...
Well, I mean, since we have you here
and you have been involved in every step,
how was it?
And yeah, how has the collaboration helped
bit later, accomplish the goals?
Whether it's infra, developer experience, whatnot.
How did you guys reach the conclusion that we want to work with Anker? Yeah, the first impression for me,
like I feel Anker is very professional.
I remember when the first call,
I asked a proposal,
like the proposal is very detailed.
And yeah, and that is a focus on the technical side.
And so far, like I'm not sure, because at the technical side. And so far, I'm not sure,
because at the end side,
at the next few months,
our team becomes stronger.
I think that other people
instead of me to follow up with Anchor.
But from my side,
so far our notes have not released to public.
And if we choose, because to be honest,
before we try to cooperate with Anchor,
we also find other partners similar as Anchor,
but finally we feel Anchor is the best choice.
Yeah, I think once we released our node to the Republic,
I think we can work together very deeply
to help Bitlyer how to build the network more safely
and how to make it more easily
for the builders to build on Bitlyer.
All right, yeah.
Loving to hear the story right behind that.
You are also very popular and famous in the blockchain industry.
Oh, okay.
I thought you were saying me personally,
and I was already going to open my champagne bottle.
But, yeah, thank you. me personally and i was already going to open my champagne bottle but
okay um yeah thank you thank you so much for your kind words linda and um of course for sharing more insights you know on how it happened and um yeah i'm i'm glad to to know that uh you know there's
a nice first impression right when somebody um either reaches out or they're looking for a provider.
Yeah, it's definitely great feedback and I'll definitely let our, well, marketing
and sales know, right?
Thank you so much for that.
And yeah, we will see how how that develops right you mentioned we will probably
have more to say in the coming months right yeah like about the node plan like normally maybe we
will release like after our TGE but I don't know that exactly time.
The first step is we list our tokens,
then we will launch our governor's program.
And at that time, I think that's the best time
to start the deep cooperation.
Of course, of course, yeah.
Hopefully, you know, well, I'm sure that this collaboration
will somehow translate into momentum
and definitely, you know, we will, yeah,
with all of our features, you know,
try to, well, do the best for BitLayer
and do, of course, whatever is in our hands to support
BitLayer's success.
And also, I was wondering now if moving to a more user point of view, right?
Either it's a developer or it's an end user that comes today to BitLayer, right?
What does the journey look like BitLayer, right? What does the journey look for,
look like for this person, right? How accessible is it to start building or interacting with the protocol? Like, yeah, what would I do today at BitLayer? Yeah, okay. Okay, let's start from the builder side.
Yeah, BitLayer is EVM compatible,
and we will release our recent tool,
may not, like, in the next month,
it will be more, like, you're more builder-friendly.
So, like, for the builders, like build Bitlyer,
we have a builder community.
If the builder have any problems on building Bitlyer,
people will help them to answer a question as soon as possible.
So this is how we have the builder community.
The second is like if we see the builders as a protocol,
like if a protocol would like to deploy on BitLayer,
we are happy to grant them.
Like if their practical is very potential and they know exactly their
operation strategy, they know how to go to market, they know how to gain users, they
know how to scale the BTC, DeFi.
We are open or we'd love to see this kind of practicals deploy on BTC.
We will support them with grants and we will also support with our operation source.
For example, we will help them to design the campaign and we will also offer the incentive
to help them to launch the campaign and to help them attract more users.
And we will also like fund more like the media and the influencers, they help them to promote them.
So we support the practicals, not just offer the money.
We will support them very deeply.
So this is the practical side.
The builder side is like I mentioned, we have the builder community.
And we also have the bug bounty.
Like we released our BitVM bridge because this is very new
and this BitVM bridge built based on BitVM
it's a technology innovation
so we launched the bug mounties
we are welcome to the developer OG
to challenge this
and if they find any bugs we will
incentive them
like the friendly
incentive to them to help them
to help us to
make our BitBank
bridges stronger
yeah this is the builder
side and about the retailer
side the retailer side is like
we are trying to, like, for example,
we cooperate with three, we cooperate with different network.
The purpose is like we try to find the BTC yield case.
It means every BTC holders, if they want to make money on their BTC, they can just go to the Bitlyer website.
There's a BTC5 webpage.
Here is a different yield product.
You can deposit your BTC to there to earn yield.
You can see different APY. You can just
make your decision based on
your preferred because there's
some projects you need
to stake your
Bitcoin longer
like three or six months.
Some projects you only need to
stake one month.
So for the retailer
users, they can see this project.
They can make money from this site.
And also, once our BTR list,
we will also do the different incentive.
Actually, let me explain more about the BTC bridge. If the native BTC bridge to other chain with BTC, it will generate
the YBTC.B. It's a lock mint model. And this YBTC.B is a yield bearing assets.
It means once you bridge, you hold the YBTC.B, you will earn money.
And the yield comes from where?
It's from like the holders can share the gas fee, the BTC.
They also can share the bridge fee.
They also can share the bridge fee.
And the third part is like we will also do the CD5.
It's called like the quantity trading.
We will cooperate with the CD5 protocols.
They use this kind of BTC to do the centralized trading or the decentralized trading to make more money and users can share
the revenue. And at this point, you will maybe think, is that the BTC safe? Does the user's BTC
is safe enough locked in the bridge? Yeah, it's definitely because we cooperate with a CD5 protocol. It's not
means that the DeFi protocol withdraw you with their BTC assets. It's just as a
how to say in the word it's it's not copy it's inject it's like oh okay yeah
the real BTC is still locked in the bridge, but in their CFI account, they copy the same amount, BTC.
Then the CD5 protocol can trade this number, this copy assets on the binance to make money.
to make money. So it's safe and it's yield bearing. And normally the APY we are trying to set like around
So it's safe and it's yield bearing.
5 to 12. If the users also deposit this YBTC to the protocols, they also can earn the
they also can earn the APY from the protocol.
So it's like there's four parts.
The gas fee, the bridge fee, the CD5 trading strategy return,
and the protocol incentives.
So this business just stopped, and we are trying to make it big.
So this month, we are working hard with different network and the lending protocol and the DAX.
Like yesterday, actually it's Tuesday, yeah, Tuesday evening, we have a call with Morpho.
And yeah, we have very good conversation with them.
We have two cooperation points.
The first one, the Morpho, will deploy on Bitlare.
The second one is we can open our YBTC.B vault on Ethereum or on base.
open our YBTC.B vault on Ethereum or on base.
It means our YBTC.B will go to the Ethereum ecosystem to the lending protocol,
go to the base ecosystem to the lending protocol.
Yielders can earn the yield.
So this is a retailer side. We are trying to dig the BTC use case deeply and help users can make money with their BTC assets.
Yeah, thank you for such a detailed overview. It looks like, or well, it sounds like, right, we are on voice, that the retailers will have a lot to do and where to choose from as well, which is something that, well, you know, sometimes, well, I don't know about you, right? But me, me as a retail user,
many times I find myself with very limited number of options, right?
And it's either take it or leave it.
So it's kind of that situation, right?
So yeah, it's super interesting for fellow retailers,
I'm sure, to hear about this.
Yeah, it's more stable, right?
The yield is more stable.
It's like I know the most Web3 traders, they trade a lot.
The options, they trade a lot.
Mimic coins.
In the bell market, you can have another choice,
like put some assets to earn you the stable and safety, right?
Yes, of course.
Put them in there and just forget and let them work for you.
Of course, this is not financial advice.
And to all the listeners, make sure you do your research although today we have an expert on
the field in here so yeah if you have any sort of questions or you would like to learn more
reach out to the guys a bit later in in their community and also one thing I wanted to remind everybody as well is,
well, Linda did a great overview, right,
of the BitVM bridge and how it works.
If you would like to learn maybe a little bit more
and do a more technical dive in,
we have a session with Kevin, who's the CTO of BitLayer.
And there he has explained it with a lot of technical terms, Kevin, we have a session with Kevin, who's the CTO of BitLayer.
And there he has explained it with a lot of technical terms, you know, and whatnot, which,
yeah, I think, you know, well, he's the CTO, right?
So he must know a little bit more than Linda on this regard.
But yeah, what Linda has shared with us sounded pretty similar.
I guess, you know, if you hang out with them on a daily basis, you probably learn passively, right?
Yeah.
So, yeah, like you said, yeah, the BVM bridge is built by the technical side, Kevin Lead.
the technical side Kevin did.
So if you want to know more about the technical maxim,
like what's the difference of BitVM bridge
compared with different bridge, right?
We call it like it's just minimized.
How does it do them just minimize?
This question maybe Kevin can solve it.
Of course, of course.
Yeah, we have two sessions with Kevin.
So one was this Partner Spotlight, so episode one.
And then we had also a podcast episode, which is on YouTube.
I'm sure Kevin has explained everything about it.
And if not, if you still need more, then just reach out to him personally.
I'm sorry, we cannot help anymore.
Yeah, thank you again, Linda, for, you know, for so, such detailed, you know, such detailed responses.
Feel free to drink a little bit of water if you need.
At any point, we
are patient. I'm fine.
Good.
This Twitter space is more like
relaxed. It's like we
are talking.
It makes me feel very good.
Oh, nice. Thank you so much
for that.
It's my pleasure to have you
here.
Also, thank you again because we for for that you know it's uh yeah it's my pleasure um to have you here and yeah also um
thank you again because we well with such a short notice right and you you hopped hopped on um so yeah that was a you know i'm really really grateful for that um and um yeah i have one another question which might be a little bit personal, Linda.
I know, of course, you're biased and everything, but hey, this is the time for you to speak.
How do you personally see BitLayer contributing to the evolution of Bitcoin. And what do you hope BitLayer to become?
Or what do you hope BitLayer's role to be in shaping the next chapter for Bitcoin?
Okay, yeah.
So, like before I mentioned, we just released our Bitvan Bridge and our YBTC.B.
If you click on the most popular lending protocol, there's no YBTC.B on that.
So the next goal is like the next half year's goal.
We are trying to promote YBTC.B.
It's like you can see YBTC.B everywhere
and then you can see you can deposit YBTC.B as a collateral to borrow other
assets or you can deposit other assets as a collateral to borrow YBTC.B. So, yeah, so like before I mentioned, the webbts.b is more trust minimized.
If we compare with WBTC, everybody knows WBTC because they have a big backend, like they have a big company, like their background.
So everybody trusts WBTC
so that's why
he's popular but if we
speak
strictly
we're sure if everybody
swapped their WBTC
to native BTC
what will happen
we're not sure so that's why
we released
BTC.B and so the next I think from
my personal I hope we can do we can expand YBTC.B marketing you know so far like you there's
WBTC or South BTC or CBBTC or FBTC or pump BTC. We want to share this market and we also know we can do well.
So I think for me, for my personal,
I hope we, next stage we cooperate with all the top learning protocols.
Everybody knows YBT-Stolby, everybody told YBT-Stolby, with all the top learning protocols.
Everybody knows YBTC-RB, everybody told YBTC-RB,
and everybody can earn from YBTC-RB.
So this is about the YBTC-B,
and about the Bitvan Bridge.
I think if we, like so far,
we already signed the cooperation contract with SWE.
So it means that native BTC holder can bridge their BTC to SWE.
They have BTC to SWE to Ethereum and to AVAX.
And there's a lot of network.
So the next step is we will support as much as more network.
Like when users try to bridge their BTC, the first bridge that will think about BVM.
That's what I think from my personal side. we can do this, we can do this where, and we can share the market.
Like maybe 50% or 30% of the BTC is more about YBTC.
I think that is, for me, that is amazing.
And my job, and now my job is like,
I need to work very hard to connect with this kind of lending practical,
introduce the YBTC to them,
and to talk with them, the corporation,
like ask them to list the YBTC assets,
and we open vault on that.
And it's better we can get incentive
because at the beginning the retailer users
will focus they always chasing the money they always chasing the yield so if there's incentive
from the network foundation or the practical it will be very helpful for us to expand YBTC.
for us to expand YBTC.
Okay, so yeah, this is about the,
from my side, about the I hope or I wish
what BTC can be done in the future.
Of course, yeah.
It sounds like you are,
well, or you know, your vision, right, that uh why btc which by the way i i
shared some materials from the bitlayer account um i believe this is the most recent um and most
up-to-date so it's um right above our profile pictures and, so it sounds like, you know,
hopefully what you want to achieve
is make it become kind of a standard, right?
Sort of what USDC is versus USDT, right?
Something like that, maybe.
Yeah, USDC, USDT is generated by Circle of BigGo, right? Something like that, maybe. Yeah, USDT is generated by
Circle of BigGo, right? It's a central party, but
the webby-stoppy is generated, decentralized.
So that's why we call it Trust Minimized.
Of course. Yeah, and I think also
for WBTC, like, um, well, we probably went through the same, right? When these first, uh, wrapped versions of tokens, um, were released, right? We, we, we just didn't think much, right? They just happened. And, and that was W because that was wrapped BTC BTC, RAP-ETH or whatever.
And it just seemed to be so natural, right?
But now after a couple of years giving it a thought, yeah, of course, it makes sense to have other solutions, right?
Like why BTC, right?
And sometimes, and of course, this is just just my two things my personal opinion i think sometimes um those that just happen to be first in the market which of course that also comes with a lot of uh with
in immense courage right to to do something that's differential but they also benefit so much from being the first in the market right so yeah um all the best linda and
um you know i hope uh that you can you can make it and that you know the bit vm bridge um becomes
the standard in you know in in the industry so that yeah um so you said when people think of oh i need to
i need to make this you know transaction or whatnot and they just automatically think okay there we go you know um yeah i've just realized uh linda we at the very beginning of this session i
said oh you you're half a co-founder yourself but actually you you do speak like a like a co-founder you know what i mean like when i
yeah actually yeah like at the beginning like i do the bd plus do the assistant like of charlie and
and also like do the like help the technique the technique to have that call with infrastructure partners.
And because that time, our team is very small, like, around 10 people.
So, every people had different sections.
And after the May, after the last year, the April, like, we hired more people.
And so, at that time, from that time, I'm focused on the BD side.
So in the past year, in 2024, I'm trying to attend different conferences
and talk with any people and to say, hey, what do you do?
And to see if their practical can deploy on Bitlyr?
I connect a lot, a lot of people
and to see what do I do?
And welcome to deploy on Bitlyr
and introduce Bitlyr to them
and introduce them how we can empower you
and try to find the good quality protocols
and we can like a long-term building together
and this year like we
changed the strategy
we switched the strategy a little
so I focused on the
YBTC and
the BWM bridge
right
yeah just one
very small thing before I hop
to the next question for you
which is also a little bit personal that next question and yeah i just wanted to say you
how you how you speak you know and your story reminds me a little of um the the one of oh
what this lady's name he yi at Binance. Yeah, yeah.
The Binance co-founder, right?
Oh, she's a co-founder?
Yeah, you know.
Oh, okay. She and Steezy built the Binance.
You know, like before I introduced myself,
that 2018, we also built
we also built an exchange, right? And our
our founders is their friend. So we built the exchanges at the same time that
we didn't go in very well, but they go because they are centralized, we are
decentralized.
That's different.
And the users try to trading our platform, they feel, wow, this is so difficult. They need to pay the gas fee, something like this.
They forgot their wallet key, the private key.
At that moment, people is new
that kind of stuff is complicated
for them and the centralized
is growing very fast
He Yi is very popular
and He Yi is
the sole people of Binance
you know, other people
know He Yi and
she is very friendly
and she is very good at marketing and she
she always call herself she is a lead customer service people every people in the community
with any question she will reply very professional and I don't know how she does that.
It's amazing how she does that.
I think she's a robot.
Sorry for interrupting.
Sorry.
She works very hard at the beginning. If there's no Hei, Bina will not be so strong as now.
100%.
Yeah, I couldn't agree more with that.
And yeah, well, I just wanted to say
that you remind me of Hei.
I haven't spoken to her
in person
right
sometimes
I come across
either
Twitter spaces
or maybe
if she's on a video
or something
right
and yeah
just remind me
a little bit
just a note
for the listeners
especially those
who might be a little bit
more new to, to the industry than, uh, than Linda and I, um, back in the days, which I
think is actually your case, Linda, right.
Um, the DEXs didn't look as, um, the ones that, you know, you have right now, which
is like, you need swap, like, um, you know, whatnot, which is like Uniswap,
like whatnot.
They weren't automated market makers.
They just like your centralized exchange,
but like even UI, everything,
but it was pretty much decentralized.
So instead of having a email and password password, in the case of a centralized
exchange, you just had to log in with your wallet. But the rest of the actions look very similar to
what you would do on Binance. But for every step, for every buy-sell, you would need to pay the gas fees. You need proof in your wallet,
and you should be careful.
If the pool is very light,
the liquidity is not deep,
there will be a slight gap.
You should pay more attention on this.
But so far, the Uniswap,
they already updated.
Users can set this sector, so it will be more safer.
It won't be like easy to lose money. At the beginning, like some people,
like they want to buy some token very fast, very quickly. They just click, click.
Then finally they lose the assets.
Yeah. Yeah. I remember those very early days.
And yeah, we come along a long way from that. The user experience at Uniswap is pretty good, I think,
and the AMMs are pretty good.
So yeah, just some context for everyone listening in.
So yeah, just some context for everyone listening in.
Back in the day, it was quite challenging to create a Dex.
And yeah, props to you, Linda, for trying to lead that.
And you mentioned your job in Bitlayer right now.
And I just wonder, what's your day-to-day like as the well you're not
a co-founder but you are you know uh now i said half at the first at first i think you are now
0.7 or 0.8 co-founder um what does it look like you know to help lead a project like
bit layer right especially you you've been there since day one or day zero
um what is it from the how is it from the inside um your oh your day-to-day of course evolved
right but what are you how does for example your day-to-day look yeah like uh you know, I have, like, over 800 groups with Charlie.
800 groups.
So, actually, like, yeah.
So, my day-to-day time is, like, you know, actually, actually I have a practical list and in the practical list, there are some that are more
important, like the priority. And this practical, it's like
I know exactly how can we cooperate
with them. How can we do win-win? Normally, like
before I have a call with the practical, the first thing for me, I will
do some very deep research to know very well how does this practical work.
And how can we cooperate between this practical to Bitlyer and what they would like to get from Bitlyer and what Bitlyer can get from them. After doing this kind of research,
then I will try to schedule a meeting with the team
and tell them what I would like to talk with during this meeting.
Normally, the first time the meeting,
I will raise out the corporation proposal and they will think about it and then we will move to that step.
If we agree with the corporation, we will start to do some work to make it happen, you know, to do the work, to make it happen.
At this part, it will take a lot of time.
At this part, you will involve the technical department.
You will involve the marketing part.
You will involve the operation part.
You will also involve the risk control part.
You will also involve the risk control part.
You should connect to this different department to join this corporation together,
and you should lead this corporation and to know at which stage the risk control team should join
and at what time the marketing team join.
And after all the things done, the project go line,
the campaign go line,
and we will need to trace the data to feedback the corporation
if we do this is successful or not.
If not, we need to adjust some strategy on this to change it and to
make it more perfect. So this
is one whole
thing
if I try
to talk with
a practical and would like to
establish cooperation with them.
And so one
practical by one practical. And sometimes I feel this protocol is very good and the corporations is very good.
But there's some block during this protocol like for example, we also need a chain link, we need a price feed.
We also, for example, yeah, we would like to provide liquidity to Fox Finance.
Fox Finance is a lending practical. And before you provide the YBTC.B to this
practical, you need it to the YBTC.B price feed. You also need to add liquidity on DAX. And you also need to share this data with Chainlink.
And then they can help you to grab the YBT.RB price feed exactly.
But at this part, you should talk with Chainlink.
And it's a long way.
It's a long way.
Because you should talk step by step, step by step
and you should adjust again and again.
So my daily life on the BD side
is trying to find the potential practical.
It means we can cooperate with them
to win-win.
Yeah, so
find a good practical.
Second is
schedule car.
Schedule car meeting with them.
And step three is
make the deal happen.
All right.
Thank you so much for the detailed response.
To everyone listening, it sounds like the bd job yeah it's not just uh shaking hands and making millions it sounds like uh it's much
more difficult than that and yeah um huge respect uh to be honest linda jokes aside um i i always say i i like talking to people
i really enjoy talking to people but then the the bd job um i respect it a lot because you have to
have um as you said 8 000 groups right but at the same time you have simultaneous conversations
you need to remember who said what uh when did they say you know and and the synergies between them
oh it's something that i think me personally i i would just lose my mind and sometimes i already
lose my mind when i try to just organize these um live sessions right where we speak about things
and and this is only talking to the partner so in in this case, you, Charlie, right?
Which, by the way, you have been super cooperative.
This was very smooth and very easy to set up.
But sometimes, you know, because we have to cross-check dates, we have to cross-check topics.
So, oh my gosh, when I think about doing the same, but maybe multiply by 1,000?
Oh, I would definitely lose my mind.
I will filter the list and then I will put most of my attention on the important one. It's like 20 or 80, the principle, right?
the principle, right?
And yeah, like you mentioned,
when I went to join the conference
in different countries,
like you will meet a lot of people
at the conference.
So that place,
we just connect on the telegram.
When we're back,
when we're back to home
after business travel,
we need to schedule the online call
to talk with them to start the real business.
Of course.
And every time after the meeting, I will write a meeting note to share into the group.
This action will help me, will remind of what we talked about last time.
It's continual or it's just closed. Is it continuous or is it just closed?
Or is it like, yeah.
Good thing we have AI now.
And I'm sure it will help.
I use the Google AI.
And it will help me record the meeting and it will share the summaries.
But I will also update based on the summary because their summary is
too long. I will adjust more business side, like a to-do list. We need an AI for the AI.
Next one. Yeah, and when you mentioned also, of course um i think it's clear now that
you have a leadership role um and at the same time right you have to deal with a lot of people
right yeah um and i'm sure that being a leader like you um there are challenges that come you
know that they just come with the territory right and um what are
some of the challenges right the biggest ones maybe that you remember uh that you have faced
along the way um how did you fix them uh you mean along the way how to fix, could you explain that? I mean, so you have been, of course,
feel free to share experience
from the previous jobs of yours,
but maybe more focused on BitLayer.
You are a leader at BitLayer
and I wonder what problems do people like you,
leaders, right?
What problems do you encounter?
Which ones that you have encountered in your,
you know, experience working for B-Layer? Do you remember the most for whatever reason, right? And
how did you solve those problems? Oh, okay. I see. Yeah. Like the last year, we are trying to encourage more practicals to deploy on Bitly.
At the beginning, every people, every BD colleague, we are working very hard to own this.
But after one month or actually after two to three months,
a lot of people don't know how to do it because it's difficult.
It's difficult to ask them to deploy on BitLayer.
And once even there's practical deploy on BitLayer,
we would like to, they can build very well on Bitlyer.
So we help them.
We try to help them bring retail users to them.
But once we did several campaigns,
we cannot see the good results.
You know, you will lose confidence.
You will see, wow, we work very hard,
but there's no result.
Sometimes you will say, oh, how to do, how to do.
And I will think, then I will think like maybe there's some problem.
Maybe this protocol is not a potential protocol.
So what should I do is to find the good quality protocol and what does that mean
good quality protocol it means I need to familiar you know I use the Defy Llama a lot because the
Defy Llama there is a ranking you can see okay which one is a popular and And then you do the research.
At the beginning, you know, we are super busy.
It's like the whole day is on the different course from the 9 a.m. to the 9 p.m.
You are on the course.
There's no time to thinking.
There's no time to summary.
into summary i think this this work way is not very good so i like try to
I think this work is not very good.
adjust my work way so the first one i do not to rush to uh set the call i will do the research and
raise some questions into the groups and their partners will reply
if I think this is
good, then schedule the
call. This way will help
me save a lot of money,
save a lot of time and energy
to do...
To do better.
So the big problem is
sometimes you will lose confidence because to do better. So the big problem is like you,
sometimes you will lose confidence because there's no result
and you don't know how to do,
how to improve.
And you should think about it.
Maybe talk to the co-founders.
Maybe, yeah, they will give you some point
and then you adjust to your work way and to make it better.
So this is, for me, for the last one half years, this is a big problem for me.
And the second is like, sometimes we need to cooperate with, right?
we need to cooperate with, right?
Sometimes I need to cooperate with my colleague.
Sometimes I need to cooperate with my colleague.
You know, and we are remote.
So the team are remote.
So sometimes you will feel it's not very efficient.
And why not efficient?
It may be people who need to involve this thing.
We are not on the same page.
You explain to these people one time,
and you need to explain to that people one time.
And after several times, I try to think like if I feel this cooperation,
I need to involve different people. I just align a meeting to introduce a background,
introduce a cooperation method,
and to let everybody on the same page.
It will be very helpful.
This is the second problem.
It's like remote, so the work is efficient sometimes, not very good.
Yeah, of course. I think that's something that is industry-wide.
I think very, very little teams are fully, you know, physically in one same place.
So I think it's something that we definitely we have had to
deal as well with and yeah it takes a lot of time of course and sometimes you know unfortunately
yeah it comes with benefits of course but it comes with uh some some comms as well right
and i love that you touched on the um mental part right? When you adopt yourself, when you think, oh, maybe, you know, it's something that has to do with myself.
Maybe I'm not good enough.
I think all of us, right, we have gone through that at some point.
This industry is so fast paced.
Things change every single day.
Right.
It's very hard to keep up um and yeah so i
thank you for also sharing the the solution right that you found i think um a nice um
well it comes from from the the art of work so the sun's the bingfa right which is uh know the enemy know yourself right and you can
fight a hundred battles so the right um yeah i think that's uh that's what you have done right
it sounds like sounds like that um you do your research and yeah sometimes uh slowing slowing
down a little bit the pace seems to be the the solution um although in this industry and society
right now right uh we all want things to be fast fast right um yeah so appreciate your honesty
um there in i think it's often in those um you know hard moments that projects really find the direction right and it seems to be um that uh well what
you have achieved and yeah i think um i have one more question uh for you linda if you i know it's
a little bit late um right um yeah i think with this question we can wrap up um i think charlie unfortunately he's probably caught
up today with something very important um so yeah i think you know i have since um i think you have
been doing a brilliant job uh linda and right now for me uh you know deep inside me uh for me you
are a 0.9 co-founder right now. So 90% co-founder.
And I would love to know from a 90% co-founder, right?
What are your thoughts?
What's your opinion on the current state of the industry?
So of the blockchain slash cryptocurrency industry, right?
There's a lot happening.
Progress, friction, drama, right? Scams. street right there's a lot happening uh progress friction drama right scams so from what you see
right from your perspective um and your a bitcoin you know based project what's your opinion
yeah okay so like for the blockchain like like we go through the concept, we go through the DeFi, we go through the Gamify, we go through the NFT, and now it's RWA.
So there's different themes in the different time, and we go through several times that bear and bear market and back again.
I think for now, if a practical would like to long-term building,
because we can see there's a lot of practical styles.
Only the left one is the innovation one.
And it's the real, the practical is the real need.
It's like users need this practical to do something.
It's not like it's just a concept.
It's not just like I say this is a good vision,
but actually it didn't solve any problems.
It's not need any requirement from the retailer users.
So I think for the big picture from now on,
if we're practical or if we built our industry,
we should think about what can we solve the problem, why the users need us.
If we are really useful or if we are really innovation, I think this project will grow very strong and it will attract more users. So that is the real what we want.
That is the real industry can become stronger and stronger.
So no scam, no just a short, short, it's just no short building.
I thought about this idea.
I build tomorrow and one month later the project live and next month ITGE.
And I make money but
the retailer users lose money I think this way we're gone and the retailer
users are becoming smarter and smarter and they also learn a lot about the industry. So we need to be more professional or we need more local on the
business model, not just to focus on with this token or with TGE. That's all. I think because
no matter the VC or the retail users already see this kind of clearly.
Like this year, the VC even didn't invest protocols. They tend to do the trading, the second market trading,
sometimes maybe better than investor protocols.
So from the building side,
I think, yeah,
let's focus on how to innovation,
not copy, not scam.
But maybe I think it's a different culture. Like sometimes it's easy formal.
And sometimes because why people join crypto, people feel crypto is easy to reach
the money. And there's no very high requirement. It's not like the traditional finance. You should
study very hard in the college and you get the certificate, you join the
college and you get the
certificate, you join the
relations
related company, but in
Web3, it's open.
Everybody from the
2018 is new.
People keep learning.
The crypto growth, right?
Yeah. So this is
from the building, like from the
practical side, from the retailer side.
Like I think we should more real innovation and to focus on the business model, not just release a token.
Second, about the BTC5.
The BTC5 market is very huge, but the activity BTC is very smaller compared with the whole market.
So for the BTC file, like our competitors, like Bobby Long and Bouncebit and Carl and Bob, and the Bitcoin OS.
Bob, yeah, so
and the Bitcoin OS,
we are also built
as a Bitcoin layer too, and every
network have different,
have the different
focus or the
attention on different topic
or the track.
no matter what
anyone we do, I think
we should find the think we should activate more BTC.
We should activate more BTC holders and make BTC not just locked in their wallet.
We should make it go to different particles.
Maybe the DeFi is easy, right we can start with a DeFi and how to make
it more use case like users do easily to know how I can do with my business except as I make use
what other we can do or like maybe yes so far like as a payfi the payfi people are also talking like some country
or some the shop they support user to pay by usdc or usdt so for the btcfi just the transactions so the layer two what's like yeah like it's like the
2024 and the Fuwen the it's very inscriptions you mean yeah yeah inscription is very popular but
Griffin is very popular, but it's just the concept.
It's a little innovation, but it's not a huge innovation.
So that's why the lifetime is a super shot.
It's like a meme.
It's like a meme token.
So I think we still need very hard to do the real innovation on Bitcoin side.
We need to activate
BTC.
This is my opening
that two point.
Give more use
case for BTC
innovation
on Bitcoin layer too.
That's a
thoughtful take.
Definitely aligned with what we've been hearing from others in the space, right?
And I get to talk to people
thanks to these sessions that we do, right?
And of course, again, thank you so much for today
joining us.
And I think what you say makes a lot of sense.
Also, it's similar to what we hear from other people who come from similar times, right?
2018, 2017, when with the ICOs, every project had like fixed the world kind of, you know, white papers, right?
Yeah. I even remember. They will raise a lot of money.
Yeah, exactly.
Exactly.
I think, yeah, we probably have some PTSD from that era, right?
Where all the projects, they were going to make revolution happen and change the world
and whatnot
so yeah
it definitely
aligns with what I've
heard
so Linda
I think that was it
we are a little bit over the 60
minutes that I mentioned
to your team, right?
But it's a lovely conversation.
And we got to learn a lot from you.
For me.
Thanks for your organization.
Oh, no, of course.
Thank you for being here.
Thank you so much.
And it's been honestly a real pleasure.
Of course, first hearing about BitLayers continued evolution from, of course, a different perspective, right, than Kevin's. But I think it's equally important, right, to have both perspectives. we go um we like to give our guests the final word and is there a quote or a piece of advice
or maybe some thought you would like to leave with uh everyone today and please don't start it with
there's an old saying in china that's that scares me really much
that scares me really much
just for context everyone
the reason I tell Linda this
is because
many times when we say
oh can you say some final conclusion
or final word
we like to say something like oh there's an old saying in china that is
this this isn't that and then we need to translate that and then we need another one hour to explain
the meaning behind it right linda yeah yeah so that's why um but yeah course, this is your time right now.
And yeah, is there anything you would like to say to our listeners before we say goodbye?
Yeah, yeah.
So the first is really thanks for your time to join this Twitter space.
Yeah, thanks for your time.
And thanks for to to what I said.
Maybe it's not very good.
And yeah, I would like to do in the summary,
like try to introduce BitLayer again.
Okay, yeah, sure, it's fair.
It's your time.
Very shortly.
Like it's back to the beginning.
The BitLayer is, we have two products.
The first one is the Bitcoin layer too, the sidechain.
The second is the BitMam bridge. Actually, I think we have two products. The first one is the Bitcoin layer 2, the side chain. The second is the BPM bridge.
Actually, I think we did very good.
We just started last year, and one half year we have grown very strong.
Actually, we have very good background from the fundraising.
We totally raised 2.5 million,
and our lead investors Franklin Temple
and Polychain and ABCDE and Framework and OKEx and others investors. So we are really working working very hard to try to release the real infrastructure.
So please stay, please follow our traders and stay up
and we will release our news step by step.
And yeah, and our TGE will come soon,
but I'm not sure what exactly time that,
if you have any questions that would
like to know more about Bitlyers, you can join our communities or follow our Twitters or join
Yanker's another section Twitter space with our CTO. Yeah, really thanks for our time. Yeah,
it's very, I'm not sure like it's like a one half an hour. Thanks for our time yeah it's very i'm not sure like it's like a one half an hour
thanks for a time again um yeah it's uh i think it's been nearly 90 minutes maybe 85 minutes um
but again uh linda thank you so much um you know for um stopping by today and for joining us i know
for stopping by today and for joining us.
I know as a BD lead, right?
Every minute of your day count
and you have gifted us with nearly 90 minutes,
which means a lot to me.
And of course I'm sure for the listeners as well.
And thanks to all of our listeners for tuning in
into the partner spotlight today with BitLayer with Linda.
And yeah, I personally really enjoyed this conversation.
I hope everyone here as well, you know,
enjoyed the conversation.
And yeah, thank you so much, Linda.
And to everyone else, don't forget to give us a follow.
And Linda is officially now for us uh 90 90 of a co-founder um so yeah
if you want to explore the future of Bitcoin she's the right person and yeah please keep an
eye on Bitlayer's journey um they deserve the attention and yeah Linda is a super hard working
um women in crypto so yeah shout out to to you linda uh for that and yeah thank you so
much again linda and uh until next time thank you yeah thank you see you next time yeah take care
linda thanks again you too Thank you.
