All righty good morning, say community. How's it going everybody? I think we got everybody that we need to at least start and get the convoy going. How's it going?
Vesco, how's it going Alex? Sorry, Alexander. Alex works perfectly. Okay, awesome. Vesco works good as well. Go ahead and great guys. Happy Friday gentlemen.
Yep, happy Friday guys and I'm really excited for this one. A lot of people have heard the name, you know, GCR and have kind of seen them around. So this is going to be a very informative and exciting space for the SAE community. So before I
hand over the mic to VASCO and Alex to introduce themselves. I'm Joe. I'm a community manager as well as the marketer behind the SAIT Tweets and the SAIT Twitter. So it's nice to be here again and without further ado VASCO would you like to introduce yourself? Yeah absolutely.
I lead ecosystem growth at say labs so teammate and yeah, we've been working with say for quite a while Previously co founded vortex protocol, which is the first perpetual futures exchange building on say network Got acquired by sushi swap and worked
with labs ever since. Right now we're focusing to on building the best infrastructure for exchanges during the ecosystem, making sure that you know, innovative and secure applications come and build with us on our novel L1. But yeah, we're going to talk about this during the
AMA as well so I'm going to let Alex introduce himself as well. Hey community this is Alex from GSR. I have been with the company for about two years now for just a quick background on myself if that makes sense.
been in crypto personally since 2013. Previously was at investment banks in equity derivatives trading and then at high frequency trading firms doing derivatives, extravagant sales and trading at GSR specifically.
I lead a team based in New York that focuses on liquidity providing, market making, trading services, also ecosystem partnership and venture capital. So excited to be here, excited to be with the community and look forward to productive conversation.
Awesome awesome as am I so yeah without further ado I've taken the liberty to kind of collect some questions from the sake community as well as If you do have questions like feel free to post them in the replies to the space or in discord I'll be monitoring and and
stuff like that. So yeah, without further ado, I would love to pick your brain a little bit, Alex, and kind of ask some like high-level questions about market making and specifically crypto market making. So if you don't mind like, you know, how does crypto market
making different from market making, what are some high level things you can kind of tell us about, to give us some context about what GCR does and all of that. Since you guys have been around for over 10 years now, which is insane. Yeah, of course. Just a quick, quick, a connection. It's GSR
I keep thinking of the bird. You know, so yeah, of course, so I think just to start off on the crypto side the term market maker definitely gets way
around a lot, right? People use MarketMathing to describe a lot of different functions within crypto. The type of functions that it's used to describe are everything from arbitrage to proprietary trading to actually providing liquidity to
sometimes people that are investing or sometimes people that are just trading. What we do at GSR encompasses a lot of things, but specifically the market making side of our business is facilitating and providing liquidity for tokens on centralized and decentralized exchanges.
Now what is liquidity, that's something that we're certainly going to dive into a lot today. But just to break it down in simple terms to core functionality, liquidity is the ability to easily transact in an asset. If there is a lot of liquidity, transactions can go through with
not very much slippage and not having to pay wide-fidast spread. So just from a basic level, that's a little bit about market making. Happy to dive into differences between traditional markets and crypto markets if you want, but I'll hand it back over to you for a second and then you can take in whatever direction you think makes sense.
For sure I would love for Vascular time and Vesca. I know you do have some experience Market making and stuff like that If you don't mind like what why do we you know have these liquidity alliances with you know market makers like GSR like what is the reason that save?
needs to have partners like this. Yeah, absolutely. So I think it all tries to our core principle, which is building the best infrastructure for exchanges. So what we believe at say and what we're seeing is that exchanges are at the core of every application that has been built with blockchain technology so far that found product market fit.
And as Alex mentioned earlier, liquidity is a core part of exchanges that enables tight prices, efficiency across the market, it's prices covering for assets. So it's something that it's extremely important to have both on-chain and off-chain. And this is what the liquidity alliance is all about. Creating a framework
and network around the SAE ecosystem to provide the best advice and products and help to builders that want to build the next generation of exchanges using the SAE tech stack. So given this in the specific Alex, I wanted to pick your grain a little bit more towards the decentralized
side of market making. There's a ton of different market making strategies, both on centralized exchanges and decentralized exchanges. I wanted to have your take on how to date, how do you see the current landscape for IMMs versus order books, for example, and how does market makers job?
change with respect to the underlying exchange. Yeah, of course. So I guess from a starting point of where the market is today, it's the majority of volume is still transacted on centralized exchanges.
You know, the stats that I see are somewhere between 70 and 85% of spot trading, still at least 60% of perp trading, derivatives trading is a bit mixed, but generally centralized so far in the crypto market, it has been winning.
And that's one of the great reasons why we're here today. And one of the awesome parts of partnering with you guys is trying to change that, right? What can we do to bring really the ethos of crypto decentralized communities and trading more on-chain and make it more effective and make it competitive?
with what's happening on centralized exchanges. So for decentralized exchanges, the history of the landscape has definitely developed, right? An AMM and automated marketer is a novel concept that has allowed people to write smart
contracts that facilitate trading on chain, but there are a lot of inefficiencies with it. And that's one of the problems for us and seeing the development of these on chain technologies for GSR has been around for 10 years, as I mentioned earlier. So we've seen a lot of
these life cycles and part of the difficulty with the first iteration of decentralized trading was frankly gas. So, you know, part of the problem is when Ethereum gas, like in 2021, 2022 was very high and you were trying to execute transactions
To place and pull orders you were paying, you know, frankly significant sums of money sometimes relative to the amount that you wanted to trade and from a market making perspective and this is one comparison between You know traditional markets and crypto markets is that you know the most efficient
The efficient way to provide high quality liquidity involves high frequency trading. Because you need to be able to trade quickly and effectively across multiple venues and across multiple price points to be able to arbitrage out price discrepancies. And what that does is actually presents
users with the same pricing across different venues and it ultimately helps the retail, helps institutional traders with the end users of the system because they won't be checking uniswap and sushi swap and seeing two different prices. If you have the ability
to effectively arbitrage between those two venues, then it ultimately can facilitate and lead to more trading. I know there was a couple of different questions in your question to me, Vasco, but why don't I pause there and then follow up on a couple of the second parts as well?
That makes sense. Do you have any questions about that or I can just go into kind of what I know you asked about some of our strategies, but at our core, a lot of it is being able to effectively deploy capital and arbitrage between conchained venues. Yeah, absolutely. I guess like every single phrase
that you pronounce in the last 22nd has a whole rabbit hole that we could go through. And to be honest, it's interesting that you touched on arbitrage and latency, which is something that obviously is kind of like a decor of our value proposition. So say is a high performance chain and next generation we've seen a lot of innovation in last
few years on blockchain technology and that has enabled us to build a technology that from a UX standpoint for the average user may look like feature parity with centralized exchanges. But there is still the lower bound in terms of round-trip latency of having a decentralized network ordering
and processing transactions. And that's obviously bounded by the speed of light, which is something that from a physics perspective, it's very difficult to go around. So I'm curious to know if you have a take on what does it take for exchanges
to bust that hurdle and achieve future parity also on the high frequency trading level and the market making level on the centralized exchanges. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, to take into traditional markets for a second, if you look at how trading works in the equity markets with Citadel with a number of their competitors, Susquehalla,
Even some of the players that have traditionally been in equity market, high-prepancy trade, gain-street, jump, etc. That have come in to crypto. One of the ways that majority of those players' institutional markets were successful was, as you're saying, the speed of light for
In action, they would actually co-locate their own hardware, excuse me, as close to the matching engines for the New York Stock Exchange, the NASDAQ. So they all owned this real estate in New Jersey that was as close as possible to
the exchange that they were actually looking to match with. So it was their rates. So they created this crazy arms rates with international markets. And part of the problem with that is it takes a large amount of capital to build this real world infrastructure. And so the barriers to entry for high frequency trading and market making
firm in traditional markets where it was is extremely high. One of the great things about the crypto market is that as this exchange software develops, particularly on the deck side, speed is very important, but it also
So having a maximum speed that is set by the actual blockchain, I do think in some cases if it's fast enough to be efficiently used is a feature not a bug because it's not going to incentivize this arms race for force
speed. But traditionally, you will also have issues with if there is slow finality, which means by the time you're receiving orders and actually getting the fill, there is some concerns around MEV, which allows people to rearrange
locks and change fill prices before transactions are finalized. And I think that's one of the great things about what you guys are building is from my understanding almost instant planality and a very high throughput on the chain. So right now on the central
exchange is just to break it down and kind of simple terms for people is if a market maker is connected to 10 centralized exchanges and on one exchange the price of Ethereum moves $10. The market makers have the
ability to very quickly adjust the price of Ethereum through their internal software and magic engines on all of the exchanges they're integrated to and close any of those gaps. But if there's a slow throughput on decentralized exchanges,
then it takes more time to close that arbitrage and there are scenarios where people are paying the wrong or not wrong but paying a different price from what should be reflected as a result of trading in the system.
That's a very interesting take that I haven't really heard so far. So the lower bound being a feature, not a bug, and that's definitely interesting. I know world in which everything trades on chain. It's obviously an ideal scenario to look at. And it lowers a lot to buy it to entry for market makers.
a deployment which retail users can engage in that as well. And we've seen that with the rise of liquidity pause. I guess I wanted to touch more in this specific on, obviously you mentioned the risks of providing liquidity on shame and how latency affects those risks.
I'm curious to know if at GSR, I know you guys have a lot of info on your side, I love expertise and then probably pretty huge technical machine going in the background and I know you guys want to hedge at risk as much as possible and I'm curious to know how you do that when plugged into liquidity pools on the central
So just from a starting point from a market maker for us, before we're going to be deploying capital and actually market making on decentralized exchanges, we have an integration process. So we don't just like any crypto user,
user connect wallet deposit funds go from there. We have a slightly more sophisticated process where we look at the code, we integrate via API, we have the ability to actually take price inputs that are coming from trades
executed on that chain. So we have, you know, plugins to block explorers. So we know what's actually happening on the chain and on the decks before we start trading. And then, you know, once we are actually integrated, as I said, to
hedge our risk. I think a lot of people on this call would know what some of the risks of trading on liquidity pools, you have in permanent loss, which has options like convexity to it where if you start a
a pool with equal parts of an asset, call it USDT and ETH as the price of ETH relative to the USDT goes lower, your USDT amount will go higher and ETH will go the amount of
the price of the ETH goes higher, the amount of USDT you have goes lower, relative to your starting point. So you have this risk that is convex basically in these tools. So we use options a lot of times for very liquid assets. We use Professor
controls in futures and then we also use just good old fashioned spot trading to try to do it you know quickly as the balance of assets that we have in our pool is changing so that we can effectively you know maintain our risk neutral position
while also providing liquidity. So, you know, with some people deploy assets into Quiddipools, they're doing that either to earn yield and earn fees or they want to take, you know, a position on one asset or the other. We do want to earn yield, we do want to earn fees on a lot of what we're trying to do.
As I mentioned is on the actual facilitating liquidity side and to do that we don't want to have outright very large Capital positions that are unhacked so yeah as I was saying we use You know the instruments that are available combined with our integration to quickly
and physically add your heart for this. Man, thank you very much for the insight. This is definitely pretty useful for anyone who wants to learn more about, you know, hedging strategies also fairly technical. I guess, you know, going a little bit more on the non-technical side of things and since we are
running this liquidity alliance, it's campaign specifically for builders. And you mentioned the integration work that you guys have to do at GSR every time you want to plug into the centralized exchange and provide liquidity and make sure that price is in place on these exchanges. I know that can be kind of a lift, you've got to spin off everything.
technically, probably you have a dedicated devs or a team also. And I know there's no clear framework yet, a normalization of framework for API integrations on decentralized exchanges. I'm curious to know the question basically is,
Hey, basket basket lost you there for a second. Sorry, right when you said what the question is I lost him. Oh amazing. Yeah, sorry receive the phone call No, I was just about to say what would you suggest builders do to to make sure that this is not too
much of a lift. Is there any solution out there right now to which Texas can plug into and have a normalized integration framework for market makers like you guys? You know, that is a great question that I don't have the answer to. I wish I did for you, but so far, our
team, you know, advises the our partners that we're going to integrate with on, you know, specs that makes sense for us for easier integration. And, you know, we do talk to other market makers and have some cooperation around what's easiest for a lot of market makers in the
in the industry. So there is some push towards standardization or at least some suggestions from the market makers. I'm not the most technical dev engineer, so I don't know exactly what those recommendations are from the technical side that we push, but happy to follow up.
with you and anyone listening, builders on say, "If you want to reach out to GSR and talk about what you're working on and be connected with our dev team and figure out ways that you can make your venues more efficient from an APA office section, please feel free to reach out."
Yeah, I went a little out of script here and apologize. I mean, this is definitely a question that has to be answered. And there's a lot of efficiencies that we're losing here, given this kind of like point, point, the builders and market makers encounter and integrate.
creating a providing liquidity on chain. I guess maybe changing not completely topic but quite a bit. I'm curious to know what you think about the new iteration of IMMs and Dexas that we've seen out there recently, Trader Joe published a wide paper
under liquidity book, UDV3 also deployed the model that it's kind of like a hybrid between an order of a quarter and AMM model. So what do you see the space going and why do you think this is happening? Yeah, I mean I think these new developments have been
in great, mostly people in the community within DeFi across chains across protocols are taking feedback on user experience, on trading experience. And frankly, on the V1, V2 versions of a lot
I had deployed to this pool. Why didn't I have the price went here? I was expecting to make money. What happened?
There was transparency, but I think what there wasn't is even with transparency without an efficient model for actually earning those fees and providing liquidity. It was hard to make money. GSR found it hard to make money. So I think these new iterations
with concentrated liquidity, liquidity fans, and more efficient gas, as I was mentioning earlier, has definitely improved the user experience. I mean, on Ethereum, the L2 community, we've seen the explosion of DeFi on Arbitrum.
with what you guys are building, the movie, ecosystems are working on, you know, a, a, a, a, a, fish and D5. So there's definitely a couple great, you know, great developments that are in the works, but ultimately, and it's one of the items that, you know, I think you and I are gonna certainly
So far no one has do you am I can you guys hear me? Yeah, sorry. I got a call similar to you. So yeah, what I was saying is you know so far no one has effectively
built the, you know, sex competitor central limit order book on chain. And there's a lot of them in the works. There's a lot of things that are that are going well. And particularly excited for what you guys are building. But, you know, it ultimately
there's going to be some, you know, convergence towards central limit order books versus ANMs. And I think there's a place for both of them, but we need also a more traditional set up white
essential limit order book to allow some traders who are used to that style come on chain. There's a lot of people who are frequent traders who come from traditional finance who like to be able to see liquidity laid out in certain ways. I know you can view some of
that stuff in bands and other things that concentrate on liquidity. But you know, this blob central limit order book, you know, setup is very familiar to people. So lowering the very entry for familiarity and efficient trading is definitely a high priority on that front.
Yeah, totally agree. And you know, all the technical developments that we've seen in the space and you know, ultimately with what's says trying to bring to the table, there's probably going to be a lot more space for builders to, you know, to come and experiment with these kind of models on chain as well in a fully decentralized way. So that's, it's going to be an interesting, you know, couple of years ahead.
of development for exchanges for sure. I guess, you know, going again, addressing concerns of builders in something that could probably help our audience that it's interested in just liquidity alliance campaign. I'm curious to know what your take is on the role of incentives on the centralized exchanges.
in terms of token incentives. So we have talked a lot about all of the pain points that traditional market makers and also market makers that are native in the space have when plugging into the centralized exchanges, all of the risks, inefficiencies, potential permanent or impermanent loss, MEV. How do you see the role of incentives?
And that's kind of like offsetting this and doesn't have any other roles in bootstrapping liquidity on the centralized exchanges and also maybe what do you think about exchanges that decide to launch without a token? Yeah, it appears to know you're taking this. Another great question and something that we think
you know, long and hard about as a market maker across products, centralized decentralized and a lot of our core business is trading. You know, I mean, it's a token issue or marketing. So we're trading on the half of projects and providing them liquidity is something that, you know, we're analyzing a lot.
And not to go down too deep of a rabbit hole, but a lot of it does stem from efficient tokenomics and making sure that things are designed in a way to not be too dilutive to the actual...
purpose of the token to have a high utility and ability to be used for potentially governance and other items that tokens are used for in the ecosystem. So back to the incentives, I think it's a great tool. I think it's an advantage
that the decentralized communities and dexes and the on-chain trading has over centralized exchanges is the ability to bring in users to build. I mean, that's one of the great parts about crypto. It's one of the things that gets me excited is being part of a community.
and being incentivized to be part of the community, discovering a technology that I might have found earlier than others and be excited and help it grow. And so, earning a token that represents utility to that ecosystem and being part of it is something that
I think is a really strong ethos of crypto, but to the first point, it definitely is some questions around efficient tokenomics and using those incentives properly to motivate communities to build long-term partners
and really keep people motivated to trade and not just there or the token ultimately but there for the community, for the user experience, for the efficiency, for the liquidity. Because if you're just there for the early high admission speculation, then you know
know, we're not going to make it right so that's kind of like my thoughts on that point. Happy to go down that any tokenomics or other rabbit holes but if we want to head back direction. No we we really appreciate that Allison like seriously thank you so much for just like answering all
the questions and transparently and in a manner that the average joke can understand. I appreciate that and I'm sure like the fellow sailors do. We also have a new speaker up Pete. How's it going Pete? Just wanted to give yourself a chance to introduce yourself or say hi and I
And do you have another question I want to ask as well? So go ahead Pete. Yeah, sorry, it was a little like guys, but yeah, I'm Pete Michielowski. I also work at GSR with Alex. I help lead the venture capital team here in the US. And I just wanted to just tack on that Alex's point a little bit about the token inside of things because it's something that I see a lot in some of the early,#
protocols that we've funded is just it's a little bit of a tightrope right on the one hand it can be especially in the early days just kind of either flat out unprofitable to to market make or to like provide liquidity into a Dex or you can be in a situation where if you're not providing incentives but all you're competing you know competitive protocols are
Then you're kind of at a disadvantage right and so that sort of spurs a lot of teams to want to provide some sort of incentive with their token But on the other hand like if you're not careful about it like Alex said and you're incentivizing Basically people to just kind of an a mercenary like way to come in farm and dump your token then and not really be aligned for the long term You can do
more damage than good and it doesn't really help you. So it's tough. I think a lot of teams are still figuring it out exactly the right way to do it. But it's, you know, things like the VE tokenomics and just like rewarding people for kind of locking in and being a little bit more long-term are some moves in the right direction. But it's definitely something that you have to be thoughtful about as a team.
Absolutely, absolutely. And it's nice to have you up here Pete. So one one thing I'm sure like a lot of people are curious about I know I am is like GSR has been around for over a decade now and what did you guys like?
start with, what other ecosystems have you worked with? Do you guys-- I'm assuming you start with Bitcoin or Eid. So I would love to hear a little bit about way back then and some other ecosystems that you guys work with.
Yeah, hey, I'm happy to take this one. Sorry, looks like I lost service. Can you guys hear me? Yeah.
Alex might have cut out for a second. Yeah, so actually I believe the back in 2013 the very one of the very first clients that we worked with was Ripple if I'm not mistaken and
we work with the Ripple team to help provide liquidity for them. I think we were also involved with Bitcoin and Ether. But yeah, I think in the very early days, it was like the co-founders work with the Ripple team to help provide liquidity when they were, you know, there was a really big vision and, you know, I think they delivered on parts of it and they struggled with other
but that was like a really big part of GSR's early days. Today, I mean, we work with over, gosh, I think over 100 different protocols. We work with a lot of the biggest names out there. Alex could speak a lot more to that. Yeah, I'm happy to jump in for a second. Yeah.
So look, we don't often go through exactly all of our partners because we'd like to allow them to be able to control some of the narratives on their market makers and how they present that to the community as opposed to coming from our side. But what I can tell you is
that we provide trading services for many of the top 25 and 50 tokens and then additionally for tokens that go out the tail list of assets we traded for on behalf of and with over 200 and
50 token issuers and you know some of the partnerships stem 5 plus you know in ripples case 10 almost 10 years for for working effectively with these projects and some of it comes back to the differences between crypto and
and traditional markets, but as we're discussing it as you can see, the crypto liquidity picture is very fragmented across many exchanges. Obviously, finance has taken on more and more of the
volume and the sense at TX but in general still on chain and in centralized space there is a number of different trading venues and that's one of the the huge benefits of having a market maker is to be able to you know effectively manage arbitrage and price
user experience for everyone from home and pops trying to trade $100, $200 to institutions that are more and more frequently coming into crypto looking to trade 5 to 10 million, oftentimes larger clips of tokens.
Awesome, awesome, thank you. That perfectly answered my question. You're a rock star at this, Alex. I think the Sailor community has gotten a lot of insight from this already. I have a few more questions and then I'm going to go ahead and give some time back to the team since we are running into the 45 minute mark.
One of the questions I had is it's kind of a high level one. It's, you know, where do you see the market trending from here? Like where do you see DeFi trending? I know you guys kind of touched on this earlier, but you know, what do you, where do you envision like the DeFi industry in five years?
I could take a first crack that if you want Alex. Yeah, I think yeah, so I mean I think like it's a little bit different if you're talking about the next couple months over five years. I mean over five years my hope is that I'm already I think starting to see kind of
more institutions moving into the space, more institutional capital. Basically, I think a lot of what's happened now is people building out the infrastructure to make DeFi usable. I think DeFi had it's like zero to one moment in DeFi summer of 2020 and the bull run of 21.
As Alex talked about a lot of the user experience, a lot of the trading experience was really tough. Unless you were flexible and crypto native as a firm to come in and use this stuff at scale, it's very difficult.
We're in a little bit more of a bear market or a sideways market is that that really is like the quiet time where builders come in and see what we what was successful last cycle What was what was working and also where the challenges are where the UX problems are and so I think you know and you mentioned already with some of these things like trader Joe and all these different
advances that are happening with an AMM's and hybrid AMMs, all these things are iterations on that are going to provide the infrastructure that allow the next bull run to really take off, allow more capital, more non-cryptomated capital to come in and find a place within DeFi.
And so, yeah, I mean, we're incredibly bullish about DeFi over the long term over five years. I expect volumes to pick up across the board. I expect cross-chain infrastructure to really improve. I expect projects like SAID to become a really important part of the ecosystem and provide the trading experience that actually can match.
decentralized experience that professional firms and institutional capital are used to. And so, yeah, I mean, I couldn't be more excited. I think we're, it's the quiet building period before I think the next kind of major inflow is what the way I would describe it.
Well said, well said sir. Yeah, that's go any any any other comments before kind of our last and final question Yeah, I really wanted to to dive into a very very short rabbit heart. I want to steal too much time on this but a lot of focus from from the
The SAE community and also from SAE Labs has been on the NFT and gaming side of things. Right now we've seen a lot of teams reaching out wanting to leverage the stack to build the next generation of exchanges for games and for trading NFTs. And we've seen, for example, with Derives of Flur.
The role of market making is picking up for this kind of standard that wasn't really expected, at least for my side, to this extent. And I'm curious to know what your take is on this since we're probably going to see a lot of innovation on that trend and say as well.
Paul let Pete actually go again since he's been spending quite a lot of time in the game space recently as well and I'd be to follow up with any additional thoughts as well. Yeah, I mean I'm incredibly bullish about gaming, web 3 gaming, whatever you want to call it, crypto gaming.
It feels to me like the application that's likely to break out and reach tens of millions, not hundreds of millions of users that has something that my brother who doesn't really, isn't really that interested in defy what he's going to care about is going to be a game or some sort of social game, game of five type application.
a big catalyst for the next bull run and seeing sort of consumer facing applications like games that really just provide an awesome user experience and have web 3 on the back end and kind of like you alluded to as the what's going to come with that are you know thousands hundreds of thousands of millions of of these in-game assets that are going to also you know people are going to want to
that's part of the value of Web3Gandings is to have more open economies around these truly owned and in-game assets and NFTs. We're seeing the very early days around how do you provide liquidity for that kind of a market? I don't think that that's quite been figured out.
But I'm sure, yeah, I mean, it's definitely, it's an area that I've spent time on. I think even a GSR, we've poked around some initial experiments around what would, you know, providing liquidity for NFTs look like in a broader context. It's tricky. It's obviously a little trickier than, you know, purely fungible.
tokens, but it's quite clear to me that we're going to have hundreds of millions of these digital assets at scale in these in-game assets. I mean, especially across different chains, because if you think about it, it's going to be very hard for a lot of games are going to want to be on their own sovereign
roll up around their own app chain around their own whatever just because of transaction limits and so I think games are going to be in all kinds of different they're going to be on all different kinds of chains layer ones layer two's and so there's going to be need to be able to provide liquidity across these different environments. So it's going to be a huge challenge but also a huge opportunity for builders to come into this space.
And I think, yeah, so for people building on say anybody who's interested in serving that specific market would love to would love to talk in. I think, yeah, say can can really provide like an interest in kind of like back in rail for that kind of a flow, which is going to be, you know, really important as these games take off. Yeah, I can just add to Pete that.
agree with what he's saying around gaming in general. I think, you know, the idea of community and crypto is one of the strongest things that we have going for us. And in the gaming space, I think, you know, the, that idea of community of shared experience of being able to actually feel like you're really integrated into something
thing is a big part of it. And so, you know, I also see a lot of upside, a lot of potential. And then when it relates to specifically to in-game assets, to NFTs, the other items having efficient marketplaces is, you know, essentially key to any successful community and any successful ecosystem.
And some of the advent, some of the technology that Flur has allowed where you're able to purchase multiple at once and has allowed efficient trading in more than one way. That's just the beginning, right? The NFT trading and in-game asset trading ecosystem is so
young. I mean, everything that we're doing is young, but there really is a lot of innovation and development out there that can be done for NFT and gaming on the financial side on the trading side. So I decided to see what you guys are going to come up with and see there to help work on it.
and partner. Thank you guys. Thank you guys for the kind words. And yeah, I'd one last thing before we kind of wrap it up, like make sure to follow these these chats from GSR, make sure to follow Vesco and you know show them some love for coming up here and giving us some alpha and
talking a little bit about market making. So this has been wonderful guys. I think this is a perfect point to kind of wrap up and you know there's markets to be make and there's a chain to be built. So you know we'll kind of wrap it up here. Thank you guys again. If there's anything else you want to say before we kind of conclude, now's your chance.
This is great. Really great to be here. If you're building on site, please reach out to me. I guess on my side a little bit of a call to action as well. We have multiple ways which you guys can get involved with GFR and we have also
If you're interested in building the next generation of exchanges, whether it is NFE games, spot derivatives, what not, fill in, and then we're going to make sure to put you in contacts with Pete, Alex and the folks from their team. And also Pete, Alex, thanks for coming.
coming on. It's been an amazing space. I hope to have a chance to meet you guys at RL. Are you guys in London, by the way? Well, you're off to space. I'm in New York, but we are headquarters is in London. We have offices in Singapore. We have some members of the West Coast in the US, Spain, Switzerland,
Puerto Rico. So we're kind of everywhere. So you know you're definitely always excited to spend time with people in person and yeah paying us we'll connect you with the relevant teams that goes for everybody listening and in the community and really a
appreciate the time of Asco and Joe. We're here for the long term with you guys and your community and we can forward to seeing what we can do together. Awesome awesome thanks guys and thank you for joining us. We'll see you guys next time.