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Market Talk-100k BTC incoming!!HUGE WEEK FOR MARKETS!?Emergency update
Recorded: May 5, 2025 Duration: 2:27:12Space Recording
Short Summary
In a lively discussion, crypto enthusiasts explored the upcoming FOMC meeting's potential impact on market volatility, with bullish sentiments surrounding Bitcoin and altcoins. The conversation highlighted trends in token launches, growth opportunities, and the influence of macroeconomic factors on crypto markets, suggesting a positive outlook for the near future.
Full Transcription
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. so
what is going on guys welcome back welcome back hope you all had a fantastic weekend
welcome back to another edition another stream of market talk brought to you by because bitcoin
i'm your host wabi and first and foremost i want to hope you all had a fantastic
weekend i sure did i really did moved into a new place feeling really great went to the beach all
that stuff ate some good food got some uh got some arms in i think i told the story of how i
injured my tricep about uh two and a half ago, and I'm pretty much back at full strength now.
So that is very, very exciting.
And I want to thank you all so much for coming back.
Whether you guys are tuning into the recording or listening right now, I want to welcome you all back to the show.
We're going to go ahead and have
a pretty interesting discussion about all things markets. We do have FOMC coming in. I think it's
Thursday and Friday. That's when the FOMC is. And I'm sure we're going to experience a lot of
volatility, specifically, in my opinion, to the upside. I think this has been a rally where many people are offsides.
And you see that in the banter on, you know, anytime Farcoin and Hyperliquid make new highs,
it seems that we're truly seeing disbelief out of many market participants and also including
select tickers that we see on Solana and on base approach 100 million in market cap, some even past 100 million in market cap.
And I think slowly but surely you will start to see at the very least what I consider an echo bubble of what we saw in these markets in Q4 of last year.
markets in Q4 of last year.
Similarly to how we saw an echo bubble within the market in Q2 of last year in comparison
to that massive parabolic growth phase that we saw in these markets in Q1 of last year.
So these market cycles have been more so than anything these mini bulls and mini bears right every every single quarter
you always see a trending sector in the market that's truly just been ai and memes but the
specific names we really don't see the same names continue to make higher highs for more than two
quarters really or for more than two seasons and you, we can see that for some of the AI names like a Fett or a Render or a Tao,
where they had these huge performances earlier in the cycle.
And then in Q4 of last year, they didn't really perform that well against majors.
But nonetheless, guys, I do think we're in for a pretty interesting setup going into FOMC.
There are rumors of a truth social token, which I really do hope that the, I guess you can call it the Trump ecosystem, right?
You have the NFTs, you have Trump coin, you have Melania coin.
have the NFTs, you have Trump coin, you have Melania coin. I really, really do hope that
there isn't another token that extracts so much from the market as it has been a couple of months,
I think about three months since the Libra launch, which was that last cabal token that
extracted liquidity from these markets to an insane degree, right? You guys will remember that you had countries launching little shitcoins on PumpFun,
and they would reach close to a billion in market cap within 48 hours.
And anything that showed any sign of life just completely fell flat on its face.
So it's been about three months since the PumpFun craze.
So it's been about three months since the pump fun craze.
We don't really see those high volume runners that reach 100 mil plus in two days.
But we are seeing some runners that run very, very slowly and methodically similar to some of these names that were prominent in the market in the summer of 2024.
Things like Giga, Moo Moo, Retardio, Smoking Chickenfish, right?
You guys remember these tokens on Sol where they would come out and they would slowly
reach 200, 300 mil market cap, even things like Billy. And we're sort of seeing kind of the same
thing happening right now with some names on Sol and even on base, right? We saw KEDA reach a market cap of almost 100 mil
when it first came out about a month and a half ago.
But nonetheless, guys, these markets,
despite them having these periods
where we just chop and consolidate,
there's always some signal to watch out for.
And the signal to watch out for right now
is this FOMC meeting.
I do think it will be important because so much has happened since the last FOMC meeting, right?
We saw the S&P and the NASDAQ essentially speedrun an entire bear market.
And I do think Powell is going to preach some dovish tailwinds, right?
Tailwinds, I think that's the Polish term.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
Not headwinds.
More so tailwinds.
And look, Powell has 12 months left in his term, right?
The S&P right now is trading just below 5,700.
The S&P all-time high is just below 6,200.
So as of this moment, I'm thinking to myself, all right,
is Powell going to be happy of an S&P that's barely above its previous all-time high at 6147 or are we
gonna see SPX 6900 are we going to see 6900 on the S&P by next May and that's
kind of a bet that that's that I'm on right now I think at the very at the
very least I do think we have have about 12 months left in this
quote-unquote cycle before a perhaps more longer bearish consolidation period, essentially
extending these choppy environments we've experienced from March to August of 23 and
24, perhaps something a bit more longer than that, but definitely not something
that lasts over 12 months. At least I certainly hope not personally as in bear markets, guys,
most people don't really make that much money. The downside happens a lot quicker than people expect. And some of these mean reversion
moves happen very, very, very quickly. And some assets just straight up go to zero and have no
bounce. So in bear markets, things look super, super oversold. And you tell yourself, man,
it's down 80%. It has to bounce, right? and the reality of it is the market doesn't know
any specific asset a bounce at all whatsoever right you take a look at something i don't want
to mention any i don't want to mention any names but there are things that used to trend in these
markets right and were the darling eye of these markets, and
they just went down 80% and just never came back, right?
Screw it.
I'll mention some names, right?
Things like a roll bit or an injective, right?
These names that simply just did not bounce back against majors after they caught a substantial
bid.
So that's kind of my opening statements, guys.
I got Donnie up here.
I got Prometheus up here.
I think we're going to have chill later on in the show.
If any of you guys in the audience, by the way, want to come up and join us,
feel free to do so.
There's a little mic button to the bottom left.
If any of you guys want to come up, talk markets, talk your book,
give us any questions, feel free to do so.
I'd much rather prefer um you guys come up
and talk markets rather than something like a q a i find q a honestly quite boring because it just
doesn't really it doesn't really create a thoughtful discussion right i'd rather hear you
guys talk about like your thoughts on the market what you're seeing out there and stuff like that um so if you guys want to come up and talk markets feel free to do so but we're gonna
go ahead and get started guys so if you guys can go ahead and uh do me one solid favor you guys
always do a great job at it and that's to show some love to the space now you might be asking
yourself wabi what's the best way that I can show some love to the space?
What's the best way to show my love and support to you guys at BecauseBitcoin, who loves to banter about all things crypto markets, price action, narratives, and dubious speculation, right?
The best way that you guys can show some love is by opening up the spaces tab once you
guys open up the spaces tab you'll see a nice beautiful user interface with all of our profile
pictures you'll see uh this giant yellow square that says because bitcoin.com you'll see donnie's
profile picture you'll see prometheus prometheus's profile picture and right above that you'll see
a little box that says becausebitcoin.com.
And there's a little link.
If you guys click that, you'll see a little link that says x.com slash i slash spaces.
And the best way that you can show love after you do that is by smashing up the like button,
smashing the crap out of the like button as if your life depended on it.
If you want prices to go up guys smash up the like button if
you want your favorite all coins to go up smash up the retweet button once you smash up the retweet
button does a number of things not only does it help prices go up right which i'm sure all of us
here want to get the pump on our coins but it also helps out with the x algorithm helps bring
more eyes and ears to the space helps bring more awareness to the brand and also who knows maybe
we'll talk about your coin i'll bring some of you guys up here we'll talk we'll talk some shop
and i'm sure it'll be an interesting discussion so spaces are recorded as always guys so for the
next hour get ready we're gonna go ahead and uh
talk all things markets guys we're going to talk all things markets we're going to talk
tradfire we're going to talk crypto and uh narratives and dubious speculation as i said
so welcome back guys i'm grateful for all of you that are on here. So without further ado. I'm going to pass it on over to Donnie.
Donnie.
What's going on,
Ben?
Welcome.
Welcome back.
That's a fire post that you made,
by the way,
a couple of hours ago or yesterday,
your time.
But I want to welcome you up here,
man.
Once again,
thanks for joining me.
I hope your weekend was swell.
And we have the big event that we've been talking about for quite some time the may fomc which i do think man i do really think this could be the event that will proceed btc
going over a hundred thousand which i think we can all agree is really the green light for some of these altcoins to have multiple daily 40-50% candles within a week.
And we've all seen how quickly some of these altcoins can recover, man.
So welcome back, brother. It's going to be an interesting talk.
I also see Joe in the audience.
So Joe, I'm going to bring you up here, brother, because you were sending me some messages that were honestly terrifying.
to bring you up here brother because you were sending me some messages that were honestly
terrifying joe was telling me that there's an imminent meltdown worse than october of 2022
he was telling me to short the piss out of everything because the structure was broken so
joe i'm gonna need you to come on up here and uh soothe my fears man i'm gonna need you to
to sing me a bullish lullaby you remember donnie when we
were singing uh ain't no mountain high enough during that crash in february
that was an interesting space man but uh donnie what's up brother hey bro thanks for having me
back on um wait did joe say that about like um today's market? Or was he saying that when the stock market was...
He told me this last night.
And honestly, I couldn't sleep until market opened.
Because of Joe, I stayed up until 9am to watch the market open.
Just in case Thanos appeared and snapped his fingers.
Crazy.
I'd love to hear his reasoning for that.
Yeah, markets have been shaping up pretty well over the last almost month now.
Actually, I was just measuring how long BTC has been pumping from the lows,
and it's literally been like 26 days straight.
So, you know, not a surprise to get some pullbacks eventually, right?
And, you know, we've kind of been mentally preparing for it, but also on the charts.
I guess I'll just show one chart, which is not updated at the moment, but you'll still get a good idea of kind of the technicals behind it.
But basically, you've got, I shared it in the nest, by the way.
Basically, you've got Bitcoin and SPX side to side.
And, you know, there's a very high confluent point around 5,800 for the SPX
where kind of you reclaim that level and you flip bullish, essentially.
You've broken the market structure that was the origin of the move that sent us you know rapidly towards uh the past cycle
highs so if you reclaim that level the market structure shifts bullish right there's a whole
bunch of moving averages i think around there as well that other people are looking at and things
like that so the basically the three scenarios around here are
we either do nothing until FOMC and we kind of shoot up from FOMC potentially being dovish or
positive for the markets, whatever you want to call it. And SPX kind of pokes its head above
that 5,800, which I think late bulls would just get trapped there just for a local pullback.
And we poke above it.
Maybe we even deviate all the way up to like 5,900, let's say.
Maybe even close to 6,000 before like a sharp pullback
back down to like kind of these levels
or maybe even a little bit lower.
Even though our backdrop with like liquidity
and sentiment flipping back to positive
with kind of the pullbacks on tariffs and these sort of things
is a really good backdrop to just continue going higher. You should expect
some pullbacks just to shake up the positioning of people who enter
late, essentially. So yeah, maybe we just chop around
until FOMC and get something like that, or we just start pulling back
now. You've got kind of the prior trend line break on the SPX there that, you know, we chopped around
for a little bit, you could potentially revisit that zone. Or you could even go lower to where
you've got a gap kind of around, what is this level 5300-ish around there before going higher, but ultimately
I still think you're putting in
locally until you break
the all-time high, higher highs
and higher lows on this local trend
to get out of here.
To me, it doesn't really matter how
we get to the new all-time high.
I think it's
inevitable for the SPX just
based off of the backdrop that we have.
And I did post that thread last night comparing the 1998 situation in the stock market, you know, pre.com all-time highs before everything kind of came crashing down.
And, you know, you can say it's like just a fractal and all this kind of stuff but it's the context you know behind the charts that really makes it uh such a good
comparison to what we have right now so i'll just share that first post so you guys can see the
visual of how it looks and the reason why it's contextually so interesting is because you need to understand for any asset and any market
cycle that you go through, the people who hold the largest positions in this said asset, they need
lots of time to exit their bags, right? So you can't just have something, you know, appear into
the market, something break, maybe something that was like a black
swan or unforeseen by even, you know, these people that have the largest positions, they
have no time to exit.
So you can't have kind of a top forming from a black swan.
You always get the recovery, you get the euphoria, and you get a prolonged topping structure
to where, you know, retail gets euphoric,
the sentiment completely flips, and then they can exit their bags
for the big nuke that follows after.
So that's kind of the main reason why I think the SPX hasn't topped yet.
And you can argue for the longer term,
there's going to be less demand for potentially U.S. equities. There's this whole narrative around the end of US exceptionalism, right? If we're going to have less demand for US treasuries and stocks because of this new trade regime and things like that, I just don't think it's going to happen at the snap of the fingers and it's already happening in this kind of stuff purely because these large holders of the spx they didn't have
time to get out so you know best to flip the sentiment uh maybe that's a trump or fed put
which you can kind of see the trumpet uh already in play they've started backing off from these
um tariffs ever since we had kind of this nuke and you know that spike in bond market volatility
to where they started publicly saying things like
tariffs are going to come down substantially with China
and he just softened his tone.
And then the Fed made public statements
saying they're ready to help stabilize the market if needed.
A lot of backing off from the narrative
that was exaggerating price to the downside.
Again, I think it ties back into, you know, if there is a big shift, there has to be a lot of time given to these big positions to exit.
So they don't have to, you know, reprice to the downside while these guys are holding massive positions.
positions. It just doesn't work like that for the people that are at the top of the game.
It just doesn't work like that for the people that are at the top of the game.
So, you know, we are waiting, you know, as you can see, as I can see from pretty much
any like smart investor or anything, they're basically saying that this market's not going
anywhere until there's clarity either around the Trump admin or around the Federal Reserve, right?
So by the time you wait for that, by the time you get your clarity around that, you know,
prices are going to slip away. But what that's going to do, just like it did in
essentially 1998, when that
20% new cap is the Fed
intervened. They cut rates quickly.
And I think it was three rate cuts in the span of like 30 days
or maybe 60 days. And that
gave confidence back into the market
when it was shattered prior to this like FUD event.
And, you know, they ended up getting a euphoric blow off top
after this Fed intervention.
And, you know, as you can see after that,
if you scroll down like in the second post of that thread,
you go into this massive like one year long distribution phase
before finally
getting the big nuke. So I just think it'll play out similarly. You're not just going to get a sharp
nuke and then it just never goes back up to the highs purely because they can't exit the market.
And I just don't believe that's how it works, just from seeing so many technical setups and
then looking at how each cycle top has played out previously. So I think you'll get something similar
and the market seems to be waiting
for that same intervention here.
So what better way to draw exit liquidity
and then to break the whole time high one more time?
So I think that's going to be imminent
for the SPX this year, right?
We'll see if it happens over the next three months
and all that. But in my view, it's kind of inevitable, purely based off all of that.
There was another important chart I wanted to share kind of with the Bitcoin situation
and kind of this whole thing around liquidity conditions and the business cycle and all this
stuff. Literally, if you just dumb it down to this chart right here,
which is basically the DXY going all the way back to 2017
versus the setup that we have now.
I posted it in the chart.
And bear in mind, in 2017, you had Trump
coming into the office in 2017,
after that 2016 election.
You had this pretty much blow-off in the dollar.
It comes into a range.
This was in 2016.
And you have one final rally going into the Trump inauguration
that breaches this range high.
You go into this manipulation phase right before the inauguration and you finally complete this bearish PO3 and you
expand to the downside. And eventually the dollar trends towards 90. You kind of have that easing
of financial conditions because of a weak dollar and the cycle ends up playing out. You can see,
and I don't care if
like you know m2 is the greatest liquidity measure and all this kind of stuff if you look back at
history by all measures of liquidity by some of the best who track all the stuff you know michael
howell whatever liquidity started trending up from that point right it's just simple the dollar was
low for a long period of time uh you know financial conditions have the legroom, sorry, central banks around the world have
the legroom to be able to ease conditions when you have a weak dollar, right?
And their business operations just run more smoothly.
So that manipulation phase in DXY is very similar to the manipulation phase we had in
Q4 of last year.
And you can see with global liquidity below
that you did have this contraction period,
which essentially has a delayed effect in risk assets by about three months.
So it played out very similarly.
In Q4, we did have this manipulation phase
in the dollar where it shot back up to 110. People were calling for new all-time highs for the dollar
as well. But again, it was just a deviation of that range prior to the inauguration. And then
you had the follow-through to the downside. But you can see what follows this liquidity hiccup,
even in 2017, is just new all-time highs.
So this is why I wasn't really kind of concerned about why the dollar was nuking, essentially.
There's a lot of narrative-driven whys and this kind of stuff that can confuse a lot of people as to everyone's exiting the US, anything US, like the stock market,
the US treasuries, the dollar, everything like that.
It's just all a narrative driven thing, right?
But, you know, just
the simple way to kind of look at this is basically, if you're looking at the global picture of what we had since the COVID cycle with this massive blow off in the dollar,
is essentially you've had the dollar above 100 for the last three years.
You've had many global economies, their central banks,
all kind of in this very tight financial situation
to where things can't get better for them
because they don't have the legroom unless the dollar is going down.
So even this whole thing around this new trade regime
and all this kind of stuff, why the dollar is important is it's just
it essentially stimulates global trade
and kind of like the capital flows, right?
If you have a cheaper dollar, it basically boosts US exports
and increases the global demand for that dollar.
Sorry, just give me one sec.
I'm just, I keep getting this call on my phone.
It's really distracting me.
Just give me one sec, sorry.
It's Larry Finkelstein larry finkelstein is calling
donnie telling him that uh we're gonna we're about to get uh the pump on our coins joe what's going
on man i'm terrified with that text message that you sent me what's going on uncle joe hey why are you doing the seven foot wonder the 1942 elect for the fed chair
at the federal reserve the man that's gonna bring us qe5 and zirp what's going on brother
not much how are you soothe my fears man uh there's no reason to be afraid. You should just be prepared. Happiness is all about
expectations. You should be, I guess, in a proper place with expectations given the macro outlook.
It was interesting. I don't know who was, maybe it was Donnie who was talking, he was bringing up
Michael Howe. I don't know if you saw his note about how he thinks that basically the top of the equity
market's in for the year uh based on his assessment of liquidity conditions which I thought was
fascinating um I tend to agree you know I think you're in for a long range of chop for most of
the summer um hope I'm wrong in that but of, because I don't trade the equity market, but I think you're in for a really boring year.
I think that people are looking at, and they continue to get confused by this, like, oh, it's just another cycle.
I mean, there's, I don't know how many more signs people need that this is a completely different market than prior cycles.
cycles. You could see it in the altcoin market, how they're trading. You could see it in the
You can see it in the altcoin market, how they're trading.
Bitcoin market. And, you know, there's this narrative on Bitcoin Twitter that like, oh, well,
if M2 is expanding or liquidity is expanding, that assets rise. I mean, go look at Japanese
stocks. Go look at European stocks. There's numerous, there's so many different examples
throughout, you know, 40 years of research where, you know, OK, Europe expanded its equivalent of M2 by 15x and its equities traded sideways for 16 years.
I mean, like, OK, so we think we think that I mean, what you have to look at is the transmission mechanism.
And the reality is Bitcoin is doing fine because, you know, Bitcoin has significant institutional buyers like michael saylor
um and retail's tapped i mean retail has you know first of all they're bombarded by way too many
coins um you know and i and i see this like in you know some of the cases i'm involved with like
a guy's coming to me with like 15 coins it's like there are 1500 excuse me coins uh and i'm like
what what the heck are you doing what is this portfolio here um and the only reason i bring it up is that just like this this narrative
that like all this cycle is just like previous cycles i think is there's too much evidence to
sort of think that way through i mean across all time, you know, when I was texting you, he was like, look, like, you know, right now, arguably, based on some of the forward-looking indicators,
my particular bias is I think the stock market is more expensive than it was back in January.
And we can go into that.
I know you guys don't talk as much fundamentals here, but I think fundamentals are important.
They're showing you that they're important through some of the data. And, you know, what is most important for me is like, you know, of all the trades that I would look at, you know, what is the most attractive right here? And quite honestly, I don't see a whole lot.
particularly the S&P 500, is particularly attractive at these levels. I think it's a poor
risk reward. I don't think small caps for certain aren't. You've got ISM numbers, right, which
fascinating. We had 51 on the ISM, but then people are like, well, the Fed's going to come and ease
and provide liquidity. Why? Why would the Fed come and ease and provide liquidity,
given the current economic backdrop? Now, if your argument is, well, they want to be ahead of the curve and they're going to move
earlier to provide liquidity, even though they have inflation closer to three than two,
I would say why? And when have they ever done that in history? They tend to be reactionary. So
I would expect them to do that from much lower levels so i don't i don't really spy that narrative that like oh the fed is ready
to ease to support asset prices when they're specifically wanting to do the opposite um you
know the reality is most of the central planners right now i don't care if you're taking a besant
powell etc they would rather have equity market down than up. And, you know,
we can talk about why that is, but I don't understand like this narrative that people
keep perpetuating on, you know, crypto Twitter that like they're coming with the bazooka of
liquidity. Why? So, yeah, I mean, like none of this stuff makes sense to me. I think what you
need to pull back and realize is that there are two things that gave us those epic bull runs in the past.
You had direct stimulus, not QE. You had direct stimmy checks pumped into people's hands.
So they go YOLO and call options on Robinhood or buy meme stocks or buy all sorts of speculative. That pumped a lot of things for prior cycles.
We don't have that.
And number two, you had a roaring economy
because the businesses were also incentivized
by very low interest rates, massive PPP,
a consumer-driven demand impulse based on the fact
that people were locked in their homes for three months
and had a bunch of built up extra cash cash and then they came roaring back into the marketplace
alongside the stimmy gun.
So to me, like it's analyzing prior cycles, there's nothing like any of these prior cycles.
You know, in 2017, for example, you had, I think I was looking at this, there was a total
traded of like 2200 coins, You now have 1.6 million
in the altcoin market. Somebody was sharing this to me today, like 2,600 coins versus 1.6 million.
What do you think the dilution effect is going to be there? So, you know, this, I just, I don't
understand some of these narratives. And generally when people are wedded the narratives, that means
they're positioned according to those narratives, which means that people are going to be sorely mistaken moving into the next year.
But again, I'm not negative on assets.
I just don't think they're ready to rip-roar and 3, 4x across the next six, eight weeks.
I don't know what people are looking at to suggest that.
So anyway, I'll shut up.
Joe, why would Bissett or Powell
prefer the equity markets to be down?
Because he's trying to bring inflation to target
before he sets sail and goes off into the sunset
as a Fed chair.
He would love to be able to cue.
I think Powell's dream scenario
is going into Christmas as he's sitting here
and, you know, CPI by the official stats is
at, you know, 2.2%. I think that would be a dream scenario. No recession, 2.2%, and he has effectively
curbed the demand impulse, which is being driven by, you know, a lot of wealth effect. So I think
that would be, and again, he doesn't want collapse, right? He wants sort of to strike a good balance.
He wants it to be not too hot, not too cold, like a Goldilocks type of scenario.
Goldilocks economy is as follows.
It's like you're not running too hot, you're not running inflation too hot, but you also haven't spoiled the porridge.
You're not in a recession and having unemployment skyrocket. So if he can thread the needle by pushing equities in a range, you know, say that
range is 5,300 to, you know, and the S&P to 5,700, that's like the dream scenario for him.
Prometheus, go ahead, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let me, let me respond to that. Um, no, I mean,
I'm, I mean, basically on the same campus, Joe, I mean, I'm basically on the same camp as Joe.
I mean, Joe, what happens when freight stops?
You know, what happens when they stop, you know, trucks stop shipping freight across the country?
What happens when ports are empty?
What happens when cargo container ships are a third of the way full?
What happens when material prices are 100% to 200% higher for businesses?
Growth slows down.
Yeah. Growth slows down. And I completely agree.
Like, why would, why is anybody thinking that we're going to rip, you know, to new all time
highs and valuations are going to go back to what they once were. I think that's ignorant. And I
think that's pretty asinine personally. I mean, if you look at the metrics, which I've been talking
about on these spaces for, i feel like months at this at
this point or at least weeks at this point um but you know joe mentioned ism you know i mean
largely manufacturing since post-covid has been anemic and we've been a services-based economy
and if you go and you look at the cpi on this latest print everybody's like oh yeah everything's
great and dandy you know where you know cpi is coming down. We're coming into coming into the target.
But if you go and you actually look up at the you look at the metrics and you look at the services side of CPI, the services side is come down.
And it's actually negative to the point to where.
Yes.
Yeah.
To where.
Yeah.
So it's like, OK, we're relying on services.
Our economy is relying on services. Manufacturing is already anemic and it's getting more an you know, as well are ticking up.
And if you go and you look at non farms payroll, I mean, that's largely coming down as well.
So the the, you know, employment is starting to show like the labor force is starting to show cracks.
Right. People that have gotten laid off are finding it harder and harder and harder to go find new employment, right?
They're finding it hard to go find new jobs.
Tiny cracks, but let's just talk about this for a second.
So, again, I think it's really kind of juvenile, to be honest, because people mostly on FinTwit, they run between extremes.
You have the Melt-Up boys who are saying we're going to
7 000 and then you have the epic doom posters who's saying like you know we're going to be under
a bridge eating cat food and the reality is most of the time markets kind of trend they trend
sideways yeah they go on little bull runs here and there but most of the time they trend sideways
and there's a lot of data on that um you know, the equity market, I mean, look at the S&P 500. We were in a period for decades in the 60s, 70s, where we were just basically chopping around,
you know, within a range. And then we broke out. Now, emerging markets, right? Emerging markets,
despite all the liquidity bros and the M2 bros, emerging markets are breaking like two decade
long downtrends. Okay, you can look at these things. Like, so the, this,
this, this childish notion that, oh, everybody just prints and that's why equities go up. Well,
that's true for the United States, right? But the United States is not the world. And there's plenty
of equity markets where like the central planners did massive amounts and equities went on a tear
in the United States, but nowhere else. Why is that? Maybe it's because the United States has some of the greatest, most innovative companies in the world. Apple, Google,
Amazon, Netflix, Tesla. I mean, you can go on. Maybe that's like the distinguishing factor.
It's that they actually have a fundamental growth in these companies and they're eating the world
because their tech is like unrivaled and it's AI, Nvidia, et cetera. My point is that like,
it's not just all about liquidity. Liquidity is very important, but it's AI and NVIDIA, et cetera. My point is that like, it's not just all about
liquidity. Liquidity is very important, but it's not the only thing. And the crypto bros,
like they just look at like, Oh, liquidity in the last three cycles, which is not a statistically
significant range for anything. So all I'm saying is I agree with you. Like, I think that there's
some signs of deterioration and there's signs of slowing that shouldn't mean panic. That shouldn't
mean short the market. It doesn't mean that we're going to like 3,200 on the S&P or some nonsense.
It just means that there's probably a lid on us from the top. And there's probably some floor,
you know, similar to where we were at. And I went very long. I was very long and, you know,
had a great move this year at the bottom. I tweeted it publicly. I went along with call
options. I sent the screenshot out and I made a banger and i don't want to lose it i don't want to like you know
get messed up and you know because we're chopping around and being overly aggressive you can ruin
your year doing that so to me like i think you know uh the the the phrase for 2025 wabi is curb
your enthusiasm yeah yeah. And Bobby too,
if you remember,
I came on these spaces and I've mentioned that.
And actually,
if you break down,
I remember back in September,
brother,
back in September,
you made out a scenario where like everything is front run going into the
inauguration.
And then a month later,
shit could get real.
I remember that was one of the scenarios,
even Donnie. Like I remember back in December it was,
we broke down from 108 to like 95 or something.
And then right when we retested 103,
he gave a scenario where like, you know,
the market could take back a lot of the gains but go ahead prometheus
yeah and i mean something that i mentioned too in regards to the m2 i mean i've been debating
some people in the discord on whether or not it's you know relevant uh relevant statistic or not
and if you go and you look in and you break out the numbers by sector right you have the eurozone
you have u.s you take japan China, and you separate them all out.
The only one, I mean, what's really making up for the large surge in M2 is China is just, I mean, just hit hammering, hammering the button and is largely the one that's responsible for the large increase that we're seeing in the M2? And does U.S. equity markets really benefit from China printing?
I would arguably, I would go out on, you know, on a pretty thick limb, I would suggest,
and say that, no, we do not.
And, you know, it's just been something that I think has been very apparent.
I'm glad that Joe has a very similar stance as me.
Yeah, yeah, just Prometheus, check this out, okay?
Everybody wants to point out, throw a chart up of this, if you want to, like, debunk this theory.
Look at the M2 chart of Chinese M2, okay?
Just look at the Chinese M2 chart, which you can pull, and compare that to MCHI.
Okay, MCHI is the iShares China ETF. Okay. The, just Bobby, just, just for context here,
the M2 has exploded and the China iShares ETF is back at the level it was in July of 2011.
Okay. To like, like 15, 14 years, right? 14 years of not even making a new high,
just trending back to where it was.
You've lost money,
absolutely gotten crushed in real terms.
And then people, they'll come on these faces and say,
oh, stocks only go up because of money printer go burr.
Well, why isn't that working in China?
Because they've absolutely exploded their money supply.
Yeah, and I think, I mean, to your point as well,
from, you know, the whole growth perspective, I mean, I, I do agree. Like, I don't think it's
a doomer scenario, but I think there's real signs that people should urge caution. You know, it's
not like, let's go max long Palantir. Cause it sounds awesome and everybody's hype on it. You
know, it's like, you, I think need to be very,
you probably need to take some chips off the board, play with, you know, relatively less
size than you might in an environment like this compared to what we saw in 2021. Yeah, in 2021,
you know, when we're in an environment like this and really largely when liquidity is actually constrictive in nature,
you can't, there's no, it's not like we're not just going to the moon and everything's flying
and you can pick whatever you have to be very, um, you have to be very direct and you have to
be very intelligent in the manner in which you're investing. Otherwise, I think a lot of people are
going to get wrecked expecting us to just go into this full-blown alt mania, full-blown everything's
going up, you know, money printer turns on, oh, they're reducing rates because that's bullish
or because they're cutting, that's bullish. Guys, historically, cutting is not bullish.
Historically, they cut because they need to ease because there is, you know, deteriorating economy
or underlying deterioration in the economy. Right. I have discussed people are like, oh,
you know, I want to cut. I want the Fed to cut on Wednesday. And I'm like, no, you don't.
You do not want to cut because I think that spooks the market. And that would signal to a lot of
people that there's something that the Fed is seeing in which they need to enter, you know,
they need to start cutting and reduce a lot of that pressure on the economy. And maybe there's
some numbers that they're looking at that the rest of the market might not be. If you do see a cut
on Wednesday, which I don't think there will be because it's not, I mean, it's not priced in and it's been in their MO to just, you know, steady as she goes, right?
Whatever the market expectations are, that's what they're doing.
And I don't see anything different.
Just like what we saw with rate hikes, you know, they started to, they slowly eased into it and eased into it.
eased into it, eased into it. And then they kind of went, oh shit. And you saw the velocity and
And then they kind of went, oh, shit.
the veracity of the rate hikes rapidly increase, um, in, in size and, um, in, in the nature of
the timing. Right. And I think you're going to see something similar with rate cuts where we're,
they're going to try to slow ease into it and they're going to hit there at some point we're
going to go, oh shit. And they're going to start rapidly cutting and they're gonna hit there at some point we're gonna go oh shit and they're
gonna start rapidly cutting and you're gonna see the velocity and the veracity of that similar to
what we saw on the upside i think it's very very similar and i think yields are damn near topped at
this point donnie go ahead brother yo um man there's so much to unpack after that Prometheus and Joe part.
But yeah, sorry, I had to cut off a little bit earlier.
I was getting spam called by someone.
I kept losing my train of thought.
It was so annoying.
I had to answer it.
So I shared a chart up there.
And the reason why I was kind of extremely bullish at those lows to actually position yourself is because now you don't have to overthink from that position that you took.
Because if you get invalidated on the upside thesis, you can very, very easily exit because the entry was so deep.
But this whole thing of the Fed has to do something, liquidity doesn't matter, all this kind of stuff.
I disagree to some point just because basically this whole move to the downside was pre-priced in with that DXY rally to 110, right?
So we had an overdue kind of future correction that we needed to price in.
that we needed to price in. And timely enough, we had massive, maximum bear sentiment around
this Trump tariff narrative. So it assisted that liquidity drop off, exaggerating prices to the
downside. So that's why I feel like there's a big disconnect between the real market, which you guys
are arguing is still strong, right? There's no job losses. Economic numbers are looking good versus actual sentiment. The sentiment is still insanely bearish, but actually, you know, all of
these economic numbers and stuff, they're not actually that bad. And now we've had an improved
liquidity backdrop in the back end, meaning that we should actually be correcting prices back to
the upside to where they were prior to this liquidity hiccup because now as we know liquidity is at all-time highs so you're having this negative sentiment being
slowly dwindled away by the trump admin kind of backing off their stance and posturing over these
tariffs to where you know we're literally correcting prices back up to the upside just with a better
liquidity backdrop so why would you not want
a position for that? Right? That's the argument there is you should have actually bought the
bottom. And you should be riding bags because you can actually start building an uptrend from here.
If the economy starts to slightly skid, which was kind of the situation that we wanted to happen
anyway, we wanted a slow skidding of the economy so that the Fed doesn't have to do anything crazy by any measure to spook the market.
Their stance is kind of easing into this position of easing financial conditions instead of something breaking and then having to essentially drop rates down to stupid numbers and start QE.
drop rates down to stupid numbers and start QE.
That's not really what we wanted.
We wanted just a slight deterioration
or things stay kind of how they are,
but inflation completely nukes,
which if you look at oil,
it's been holding down at those low levels for so long now.
That's a really good measure of inflation.
Plus with this whole liquidity thing,
okay, you can say M2 is bullshit,
but look at the price of gold.
Like gold has been soaking up the liquidity
that's being injected into markets
for the last however long this turmoil has lasted.
So now you're at this crossroads
where people are waiting for this Trump and or Fed put,
which I keep arguing.
The two main drivers of the market are 100%,
it's liquidity conditions and risk appetite.
So liquidity conditions are improved,
and risk appetite is returning because the posturing on tariffs
is slowly starting to dwindle away.
You even had Scott Besson tell you that the VIX was topped.
So every little article that keeps coming out now from Trump's side is
kind of bringing back this risk appetite into the market. Again, with an improved liquidity
backdrop as well, right? If you have the risk on window, you know, tilt towards risk,
you're going to have a correction in gold and you're going to have risk assets essentially be a beneficiary of a liquidity shift out of gold.
So to me, it's kind of like asymmetric upside if you bought the lows.
And kind of the bearish thesis is not really there for me, to be honest.
to be honest, right? Hey, Johnny, real quick, where do you think the liquidity, if we do have
an environment where liquidity is expanding, where do you think it's going right now?
Well, clearly gold, because you've seen it go to 3,500. So I'm arguing if you have a risk on
pivot window, that liquidity, which has been soaked up by gold, is going to go into assets
that are in that risk class, not a safe haven asset. So it was absorbing liquidity during the turmoil.
If that turmoil starts to dissipate, where do you think it's going to go?
So, I mean, one with gold, right? We had mentioned that China's M2 is rapidly expanding.
And China was largely one of the reasons why we saw the bid that we did
in gold alongside you know a few other um few other factors that kind of culminated for the
perfect storm for gold all in all um but you know to your point look uh gold is not necessarily a
risk on bid and if you have that majority of that liquidity,
liquidity, that China, it's a safe haven. Right. And, and so they're entering into,
you know, they're bidding it as this, you know, fight against inflation, fight against the United
States, whatever you want to call it. So that liquidity is in the hands of one of the most centralized governments in the world. And if you have
material costs rising at a substantial rate, then any injection of liquidity at this point
is not necessarily realized in the markets because the costs of goods and services are
drastically increasing.
That's where the weak dollar comes in, right?
So this is the whole setup that we've got.
If you've got DXY trending towards 90 and you have a risk on pivot window about to flip,
I just don't see how risk assets don't go back up.
And then you're waiting for a slight skidding of the economy
for the Fed to intervene.
On top of all of that,
it's literally a recipe to go to new all time highs.
So I don't know. That's how I'm viewing it. And like, it just makes sense to me, right?
Easing of financial conditions, risk on pivot window, risk markets go up. I can't see any other
kind of, you know, you could have a slight chopping environment. But again, we've got an
improved liquidity backdrop. And you've got sentiment starting to flip back to, you know, more positive. I think we've had the peak of the Trump
fear with these tariffs. Like, I don't see how I could go back to max fear after that, with kind of
this new posturing they've had on the media really backed off. Right. But again, it's still uncertain. But if you bought the lows, you're chilling.
If it gets invalidated, you sell.
So yeah, I feel like as these things start to slowly confirm, which all of these concerns
are actually correct, even when you take some of these best people in the games, these macro
heads, Michael Howell, he's not confident that we're going to have a new all-time high
anytime soon and all this kind of stuff. But he's basically waiting
on that Trump or Fed put to position, right? These guys have massive amounts of liquidity
to where, you know, once they enter the market, they're looking at, you know, three to six months
ahead of a trend they can ride. They don't care if they're late. But that's kind of the setup that
we've got is most people are sidelined.
Most people are unsure as it incrementally confirms prices will slip away.
They enter at higher prices.
We continue going even higher.
So I don't know that to me, it's just such a perfect setup that, you know,
I'm just glad I bought the lows and I see it playing out more, more likely than
not playing out just based off all of these things
yeah i i don't really know how like we're gonna enter a market where we just chop around in
equities for the remainder of the year like that that just hasn't happened in equity markets
uh for over 10 years over 15 years really like usually wherever
the market's trading at within two quarters we're either trading significantly lower or significantly
higher um especially since call it 2018 since that bottom in december of uh 2018 which basically marked the peak of the prior trade war and all that all that stuff so
i i think we're either going to end the year with the s p going to near 7 000 or we're going to be
at like 5 000 yeah and the thing about this rate cut right it's not the actual rate cut that's
going to unlock like a ton of global liquidity and oh my God,
like they're going to start printing
and all this kind of stuff.
It's literally just the confidence that that gives
kind of how Trump has mentioned a sick market,
which is it gives you that clarity that,
okay, the Fed is not worried about what's going on.
They actually feel quite confident.
Here's a rate cut.
The market will absolutely roar if that
happens you've literally had risk appetite fully returned and an improved liquidity backdrop so
you know if you're thinking that the fed might cut over the next one to three months
the market's going to get way ahead of that and the day that it does come i feel like you just go
straight higher yes it seems like the market over the last
call it two and a half years since that bottom in q4 of 22 like the amount of front running
that people get positioned for is pretty insane right like we had the front running
when the etfs went live and we hit that premature top at 74 um and then the inauguration top at like
call it 108 109 right and i mean just look at what happens to the market anytime we front run
stuff right we usually get into a period of downwards top slow accumulation and then these
spikes up right like we've marked up by 25 bands since the low that occurred um almost four
weeks ago like you had mentioned right it's slowly and then what's that term slowly and the hole at
once yeah yeah yeah that's that's basically the uh the theme of this cycle if you want to call this
like a secular bull right let's call it a secular call this like a secular bull, right?
Let's call it a secular bull. And within a secular bull,
you have these like many bulls and many bears.
And I honestly think that's, that's, that's what we're in right now.
Just like a market that started in December of 2018 or called the COVID
crash where things are front run by an egregious degree, right?
We even saw small caps topped out within barely a year of the stimulus checks going out, right?
Like, why did IWM top out? Why did Cathie Wood's ARK ETF top out when the broader market continued to rally for about 10 months because of the front
running right it's the smart market participants that knew what was going on and they front ran
retail and then you see i mean we basically saw retail by the bath by by the top of uh bed bath
and body works what was it what was that store called bed bath and body works
yeah yeah donnie go ahead bro oh no no you you keep going bro um i was just searching up something
real quick um i was just i was i was gonna i was gonna touch on this whole SPX thing one more time with why I feel like all-time highs are necessary for it
purely because of the positioning of the bigger players in the SPX.
There's just no way they had enough time to exit.
I just don't think...
The valuation that it's reached, we can all agree, is super inflated.
You need a lot of time to exit big positions to distribute supply you
need you for our conditions to get out of that thing so i just feel like you know that's coming
whether you think it even hits all-time high or not i don't really like think that matters for btc
here um with this new trade regime shift right if it actually is how it's meant to be, or it actually all plays out,
however long the timeline is for it to play out,
you're just gonna have to have these big players
need that euphoric exit to be able to rotate
into these neutral assets, right?
BTC and gold.
So I don't know, if earnings-based assets
are gonna get devalued and
repriced to the downside there's just there's just no way that was enough time for them to exit
right so i think even if even if the stock market uh doesn't break the high it kind of gets close
and then just chops and chops and chops i think it's still going to be a positive year for btc
and i think you could get rotations out of SPX into BTC uh this cycle
you know what the JPM collar is you ever heard of the JPM collar nah
the JPM collar which has hit like 11 out of the last time 12 uh and quarterly expires
they set the the quarterly expiry at 5,300 just for what it's worth.
It's like a massive position.
It's one of the biggest institutional positions traded.
It's 40,000 nominal contracts, I'm pretty sure.
Yeah, it's freaking huge.
But we've also closed below the short put either though, except for COVID.
Right.
So, I mean, in terms of institutions, right,
that's like one of the biggest institutional positions,
just for the record.
Crazy.
I guess we'll see how it plays out.
But, yeah, Joe, you missed a good part of kind of the talk
that we had earlier.
I was basically just basically talking about the backdrop that we've got with risk right
now.
You guys are saying there's nothing broken with like economic numbers and all this kind
of stuff.
Everything's still intact.
You know, there's no like crazy job losses or anything like that.
So I was basically arguing that the DXY rally that we had did cause a hiccup in global liquidity. Therefore, we were kind of overdue for
some sort of correction in risk markets, right? They had been going up only. BTC had gone to 109,
SPX hit all-time highs. But that downside was a little bit imminent. It's just that the Trump
tariff narrative assisted that liquidity drop-off, exaggerating the prices to the downside.
So now that you've had, you know, DXY trend below 100 and liquidity improve and all of, you know, these economic numbers that you guys are talking about are actually fine.
Nothing is actually breaking.
Shouldn't we be correcting back up to the upside?
correcting back up to the upside.
And if you're having the thing that was driving
an exaggerated price to the downside,
aka the Trump tariff narrative,
if you're having that start to dissipate,
they're backing down a little bit on their posturing on this
and potentially it keeps getting better,
shouldn't that reprice these assets
that took a very hard hit back up to the upside?
An improved liquidity backdrop
and risk appetite kind of returning from that.
I think liquidity is getting worse.
And there's signs of that all over the place if you look at like the financial conditions
index.
And hang on one second.
Yeah.
And I mean, from an economic data perspective, the points that I was touching on, I mean,
things aren't collapsing, but I want to make it you know very clear that
things are not all fine and dandy you know i mean the numbers are very clearly saying to us
that the economy is waning a little bit um and but but that's good isn't it that's what we want
if we want to get uh stimulus from the fed or some some sort of double because no because there's an interim
period right like so the credit cycle leads the Fed right and the credit cycle I mean that's like
saying well you know in early 2020 it's bullish no no that's a big that's a big difference to now
no well if you're if you have unemployed listen the fed's
own metrics say they expect unemployment to rise they expect because the tariffs that you're going
to see inflation take up by the end of the year that's that's not bullish if that's correct that
that's that's a it's a very bearish forecast now they may be wrong right they're wrong frequently
forecast but um but my point is like when you're saying like, oh, liquidity is improving,
well, look at spreads, right? Spreads, they're not as low as they were. They were priced very
bullish earlier in the year. And now they've widened out slightly. And the question is,
where do they go from here? Do you expect right now with the current conditions, spreads to tighten
and you expect the economy to reaccelerate.
And my question is, if that's true, what is the catalyst for it to reaccelerate? Because all I
see is catalyst for it to actually go the opposite direction. The tariffs, I mean, to Prometheus's
point, right, that's going to cause shortages. It's going to cause a deterioration in the economic
data. The CEOs, I mean, I was talking to you right now, a guy who said, I'm putting off all further imports for the rest of the year until this is cleared up.
That's not bullish. It's not like a positive catalyst. At best, you could say it's like,
it's not overly bearish because they've got a lot of supply. There's a lot of front running in Q1,
right? One of the reasons why this GDP number got all screwed up is because a lot of companies that
were smart, they front ran the tariffs. They did a tremendous amount of imports, which actually gave us that negative print. Because the way GDP
is calculated, if you're bringing in a ton of imports. So what does that mean? That means that
they've done the early spending and that now they're going to have inventory here. But then
Q3, Q4, they're actually going to be starting to dwindle down on that inventory and they're going
to have to actually absorb the tariffs, which is, again, not bullish. That's a tightening of
liquidity conditions. It's a tightening of demand because you're going to have to either raise
prices or be prepared to trim the bottom line. Well, not only that, I was talking with a buddy
actually over the weekend and he runs his own company. And he said that, you know, for some of the jobs that they, that
his company was doing, the bids that they gave, they can't even, they can't do them anymore.
They have to send out letters to all, you know, to all these, uh, to all these people that they
gave bids to because the material costs are so damn high. Like screws went up like 150%. Like,
you know what I'm, it just and because you know you they
go to uh these people that they they bid on these jobs and and these and the people are like well
we can't afford that you gave us x number and they're like well sorry i mean we just can't do
it well i'll give you one example from atheists the the the the i talked i represent a hair
off they the the metal components they're gonna have to I represent a hair.
The metal components.
They're going to have to.
You're cutting out, Joe.
It's a sign from the market.
Can you hear me?
Yeah.
Sorry about that.
I was going to say, you know, a hair clipping company, right? right they're gonna have to because their their metal components are being infected from imports they're
gonna have to raise the price of their hair clothes four times so you know you used to pay you know
for their particular models some of their entry-level models were like 30 40 bucks now it's
gonna be 160 that they're gonna have to spend for their you know some of their hair their hair
clippers um that that's that's not sustainable and anybody thinks that's the gaze i don't know what you're smoking
do we have like finalized uh severity of the tariffs yet it doesn't matter if they're
finalized they're disrupting business now right now okay the threat of these things people people
don't just wake up and say oh we're we're going to do our production and imports tomorrow.
No, they set these things in motion two, three quarters ahead of time for supply chain issues.
So they affect longer run issues.
This is one of the reasons why inflation was sticky post-COVID.
The reason it was sticky is because they took a year to unravel the supply chain issues.
So you had this massive surge of costs across the board for a lot of
production. So you can't just say, oh, these aren't final. Okay, but they're final for customers and
businesses making decisions now for the next two or three quarters.
Hey, Joe, the company that's importing
clippers or whatever it was. Yeah, the metal components.
Why would their retail price be
going up four times i mean their wholesale price went up it didn't go up 400 so i mean
why would they i don't understand that i'm just repeating what they're they were telling me so
they're they're saying that the the metal the wholesale components right the or the components
that make up the clippers the metals the, the little screws, all the different parts,
they're significantly going up because their imports from China are going up.
So they're going to have to move production.
They're going to have to do stopgap solutions.
They're having to throw together, you know, new facilities.
And it's, you know, maybe it'll be temporary, but they're going to pass that along to consumers.
They can't just eat that.
You there still?
Yeah, I'm here.
I don't know how it's going up 400%.
I mean, look, I'll give you a perfect example.
The iPhones, okay?
What about the iPhones?
I mean, Apple itself, Apple iPhones right now,
because of the production issues with China,
when they run out of those initial supply, the Apple iPhones are going north of $2,000 per Apple. It's the same
scenario. So how do you deal with that, Grant? I mean, that's not just like a trivial thing.
And then, you know, they'll say, well, the Trump administration's exempting the semiconductors.
Well, what's the point of that then? Semiconductors are one of the critical fields we were trying to get out of China, right? We want to onshore some of that or
move it to different countries that are more favorable. Why are you exempting semiconductors?
That doesn't make any sense either. It's just causing a lot of confusion. And this is why Apple
loaded up all those planes with phones. You know, you can read it. There's public articles about
this. They were trying to front run this
and bring in a lot of supply early on
to avoid potential tariffs.
That was smart.
Yeah, no, but a lot of companies did that.
And then people were looking at the GDP numbers, Grant,
and they were saying, well, GDP is so negative, it's bad.
I totally disagree with that.
The reason they were negative
is because companies that were smart front ran them
and they moved in.
So the reason I bring that up now is because for Donnie's point, eventually that supply runs out.
Eventually, your ability to front run, your stockpile of inventory into the summer, that dwindles.
And you have to start making decisions for Q3, Q4, Q1 of 2026.
So you've got a runway here where the shock of the tariffs isn't really been felt yet
because they've been able to front run them.
But look, there's going to have to be
some confusion. There's going to have to be some
cost for us to clean the mess up
at some point.
Totally agree.
I completely agree.
Next administration, you know, maybe
I mean, I'd rather see a guy make it happen than some event make it happen.
But it's got to happen.
And, you know, maybe people need to quit buying fucking iPhones.
My family gets one every time they come out with a new one.
Now, will that cost something to the economy?
Sure, it will.
But a lot of people out there buying a lot of bullshit they don't need every day.
I agree with you in principle.
I think that is not a bullish thing for equity prices.
That's what we were talking about.
It's 100% it's not.
But look, 493 stocks out of the S&P 500 have not been doing well for a long time anyway.
Correct.
I see Jason Williams has his hand up, so it's got to be big.
So let's hear from Jason here.
Go ahead.
I was just going to add, I was looking at this this morning about imports and the activity at the ports,
imports and the activity at the ports, specifically the Port of Los Angeles. And they were saying that
specifically the Port of Los Angeles.
that port in particular receives about 40% of all imports from Asia and shipments last week were down
10% and it's going to continue. So just to your point, as the supply chain starts to drop, I mean,
i mean it's got to affect us we either have to build it here we don't have it right joe
it's got to affect us. We either have to build it here or we don't have it. Right, Joe?
yeah no listen this is not a doom or space okay i don't think we're any any of us are in here saying
all hell's gonna fall everything's gonna fall apart and we'll be under a bridge eating cat food
that's not the point the point is again like you got to realize there's going to be a cost
to taking your medicine and it's not you know there's an argument made well that you know max
uh fear has been priced in with the tariffs.
And I would argue like the narrative has been priced in, but the actual effect, the economic effect of the tariffs probably are going to be felt for the rest of the year.
Yeah.
Valuations have not priced it in one bit.
Mark said.
Right.
Kind of a real material difference.
Yeah.
I don't look at this as a doomer conversation. For me, I look at these
as like, how do we make it? This is an opportunity for US businesses to step in potentially and
either be very competitive or fill the void, you know, if in fact the tariffs stick. I mean, I'm
not, you know, my job is to make money, whether it's Republican or Democrat, whatever, wherever I live. So, yeah, I'm not I'm not trying to fear monger here, Joe.
I didn't say you were before. Part of this is context before you guys got got in here.
Before you got in here, there are people making the argument, as I understood it, that like, oh, this is all narrative.
There was peak fear because of the tariffs. And I agree, there was a lot of
fear because of the uncertainty, right? But at some point, like public policy takes effect and
hits the bottom line. And when it hits the bottom line, okay, that's the question is like, how big
of an effect is it going to be? Is it going to be a modest thing where it just causes a slight
contraction, then they, you know, onshore more workers, and then they get the production ramped
up here over, you know, the next year. And this is all, you know, onshore more workers and then they get the production ramped up here over you know the next year and this is all you know resulting in more revenue and very
favorable yeah i could see a scenario like that but i mean these things take time you're not going
to run this through in like you know two quarters and be done with it so joe and prometheus think we're not going to pump until q4 i think is that correct
are you talking about the equity market no btc no i mean i think there's like a positive catalyst
for btc in particular i do believe that there is real buying from MSTR and elsewhere,
right, that is pushing it. The question is, are you going to have this broad across the, you know,
across the spectrum risk on rally across, you know, small caps and large cap equities and
every... I think so, Joe. I think we're going to go into a melt-up, to be honest. Yeah, so put me down as skeptical of that, the overall melt-up theory.
And again, anything can happen, right?
But to me, I think you've got pockets of strength, and you've got an economy that's doing reasonably well.
So I expect BTC to perform.
I publicly said my target for this year, the high is $130,000. I think we're
going to hit it. I think it's going to be a strong year for Bitcoin. I don't believe in the $400,000
theory or whatever people are pushing out there. I think that seems like pie in the sky, hopium.
I think you're going to see select alternatives run and run pretty well. I think some meme coins
are going to do very well. I think a lot of the alt coins are going to just be trash um but you know that's just my bias you love you love far coin
joe joe's a far coin i mean look look guys like like honestly like i don't i own zero far coin
i wish i did because it's it's been like one of the best performing assets the last like
joe joe joe joe come on man i told you to buy some far coin at 10 cents i own
i own zero yeah no to your credit like i own zero far coin um it's been unbelievable i don't you know
but like why why why far coin why did far coin do well and everything else is kind of like donnie
pull him pull him on the farts bro pill him on the farts really it's joe it's really important that you participate in this economy so that you can record your conversations with your accountant when you're talking about your buys and sells a fart coin.
I just want to hear those conversations and explain the fart coin.
If you own Fartcoin and your family trust, I'd like for your estate to also get together and talk about the wise decisions that you make and make investments at Fartcoin.
I think it's fascinating. I'm being 100% serious, Jason. I think out of the million different meme coins that there are right now, I think it's fascinating's one of those things I think about at night, like what causes the fart to rise?
I don't quite understand it.
And I'm nowhere near as smart as some of the crypto folks on stage because I'm not an expert in that.
But any guidance, Wabi, you have?
I mean, I do remember you being an early farter.
So tell me how you clued in on that
you know it's it's really all it's all about feelings donnie look donnie isn't it's about feelings right it's how you feel joe i wrote a piece thread on it i'm gonna send it to joe
joe you know i like to to train right so my thesis was on far, was don't try to get by or you'll get dealt with and trapped.
And if anything, you don't want the market to peck at you.
You get it?
Don't try to get by.
Yeah, I don't follow.
I'm sorry.
Like your tricep, your bicep.
Don't try and get by.
You'll get dealt with, your shoulder,
and trapped.
The trapezius muscle.
You get it?
Or the orange juice joke.
Remember, you need to focus
on your intake of
concentration
or the market will pump
so high you'll think it's pulp fiction yes it'll squeeze so high
the market is able to squeeze you so much that it'll seem like pulp fiction
get it so i kind of use that analogy with Farcoin.
And also because I missed Peanut.
That's why.
I missed Peanut.
And that's probably one of my regrets this cycle,
was not rotating into Peanut the Squirrel at like 50 mil market cap. No, I think it was at 110 because i remember donnie sent me that message
he was like brother this thing is about an app about an absolutely rip okay i have to i have
i have to pivot the conversation just slightly robbie because i want uh because i i don't want
the compliance people to be upset with me so here's here's a question a real question for the
room and the brain trust here um so it looks like this Ruben Galeo from Arizona,
he posted this press release about stable coins and the stable coin bills on the ropes.
Apparently there's some question whether it even gets passed this year. So the Democrats seem to
be making a huge mistake and coming out against it and demanding certain restrictions before they vote for cloture. So my question is, if the stablecoin bill goes down in flames,
does that have any impact on the market or is it just completely irrelevant at this point?
Say we get a news item that stablecoin legislation off the table for 2025. I see Jason's hand,
so I'm going to shut up. Go ahead.
Well, I think it's a signal in terms of like, I thought, and I assume that the regulatory momentum was in our favor. And I was expecting each state to continue to do things like, yeah,
we've adopted a Bitcoin standard and we're going to put 2% of our assets on balance sheet.
Every time the Democrats stop this, it makes me feel like we really don't have consensus.
There's still an entrenched opposition that's powerful enough to stop this progress.
Gold keeps going up.
Bitcoin's kind of flat.
They start killing the stuff around the perimeter
periphery excuse me joe the momentum gets killed in my opinion like in arizona right like did
everybody think exactly vetoed like it's kind of surprising right i i see my buddy gary cardone
as i recall he was very bullish on the arizona governor putting that into into into uh into law
so i'd be curious as to his take and I I think uh
I heard uh dark side another one of the commentators here said that this was going to be the
beginning of the Bitcoin era with Arizona leading the charge but it looks like that bill was vetoed
hard um any thoughts on this anybody Donnie go ahead Donnie's sending me stuff dming me about far coin yeah okay
it's okay no but but i but i but i actually i commented on that in particular because i was
like who's got this person in their pocket this was an older lady who's what is she the governor
or something to veto yeah some some irrelevant political position. Right. I was like, who is this person? Like, I've never even heard of her. Why is she opposing Bitcoin? Well, it looks like she's a a one term governor, that she's done, that she's completely cooked now that she's taken on the Bitcoiners.
So I'd be curious his take as well.
If you want to invite up Dr. Donish as well, that might be a good add.
Hopefully I'm not interrupting you guys.
No, no, go ahead, gary i want to take hey when you were
talking about arizona sorry i didn't have any pants on so i was scared you don't need pants
to talk on spaces i was scared we can't see you just needs creatine you just never know yeah well
jason i have increased my treat creatine to 125000 milligrams as you and Alfred are doing.
I must say, although my penis has stopped growing.
Gary, I've been taking a gallon of creatine per week.
If you want to see my results, I'm going to go ahead and put them up on the nest.
I won't need my glasses, I take it, right?
Can you
die from creatine
if you consume too much of it?
Anybody know?
Only if Arizona puts it on the...
I understand that Arizona is actually
thinking about putting creatine on their
strategic reserve, Joe.
Dennis Porter's with the group right now.
No, listen, Joe, I don't think I remember saying that.
What I think I did say is that if we have a state do it,
it'll be an energy-rich state like Oklahoma, Texas.
I thought that's what I said, but, you know, it's cool that we have –
look, I'm surprised.
We literally now are finding out who our enemies are to Jason's point.
We might lose this,
but I bet every governor that denies it is going to be,
is going to really struggle next for the next election cycle.
Yeah. She's up for reelection, right? That's curious um yeah uh one of my my my friends on
here john reasoning joe her reasoning was it's not a proven asset or something what was her bogus
little response yeah yeah effectively that you're paraphrasing but did that surprise you that she
would stick her neck out no no listen i i hear that all the time i'm sure jason's heard
that for like 10 years the the the reality is that most mainstreamers it's so easy to say oh it's
unproven and what i always ask them as a follow-up was when will it be proven and what does it have
to get to a 10 trillion dollar market cap do you have to have a year a hundred years of price
history before you it becomes a proven asset i think that's the natural reaction to that question.
If you ever get from a TradFi person,
well, it's unproven.
Okay, tell me what it needs to do.
Does it need to cure cancer?
Does it need to actually cure cancer
for it to be a proven asset?
Because I think that's a totally unhealthy bar.
You have it being, you know, just on paper,
it's one of the biggest assets in the world.
You know, it's got a trillion plus market cap.
It's got massive exposure. It's been through multiple periods of high volatility what is the bar in
which it becomes proven what does it have to do and i and i would love to hear the tradify people
answer that question i've never gotten a good answer gary maybe you can answer it
yeah the answer is when their margins don't get impacted they'll be glad to approve it
Because when their margins don't get impacted, they'll be glad to approve it.
I don't follow.
That doesn't make any sense to me.
It affects their margins.
There are plenty of TradFi people who can take a percentage.
I mean, BlackRock takes a percentage with their ETF.
It's in their financial interest to get people into Bitcoin.
Explain why it's not. More assets under management.
Explain why it's not.
More assets under management.
Joe, let me jump in here for a second because this really hits close to home.
One of her statements was this.
Allowing the state treasurer and public retirement funds to invest up to 10% of their holdings in virtual currencies like Bitcoin.
Arizona is not the place for this type of untested investment. Now, she should be fired
immediately. That has been shown to drastically improve the performance of pension funds
and retirement funds. I mean, how are these people, these financial illiterates in positions like this it's absurd I'm
taking max creatine what will kill me because what what what amount because
right now I'm taking I don't know 50 50 pounds I snorted today I'm fine I'm just
angry how much can I take to get off this planet
they're talking about creatine man yes Are you talking about creatine, man? Yes, I'm talking about
creatine, man. How much? 50 pounds, 100 pounds, how much? Look, look, so what you want to do,
right, the first thing that you want to do right when you wake up is add a scoop of creatine to
monster energy. And then you add in some ice and then you add another scoop. And then you add in
some Nutella because you need to have your sweets, right? So then you add in another scoop of
creatine and then you add some chunks of watermelon and some Belgian waffles, preferably
non-GMO and organic. That way you get some carbs in then you add another
scoop of creatine and then you mix that all up and you know it's uh day one of 700 of uh
well you can't you can't kill what was never really alive right because if you don't if you aren't born with
creatine then like you just you don't know what it's like to live so those are my thoughts on
that but no no real talk i would say the best supplement man that has creatine included
is from this uh company called muscle meds um and and if you don't believe my book you just go ahead and check up on the nest
it's the first picture you'll see um a nice handsome well-built man with 22 inch arms um and
yeah muscle meds carnivore cookies and cream you'll see a nice sculpted physique of a handsome young man who is capable of moving a lot of weight
on any lift that you can think of including including shoulder pressing 400 pounds worth
of creatine monohydrate so don't try and get by or you'll get dealt with entrapped
gary what's up, man?
It's great to have you on here, man.
Your brother was on here a few months ago.
Do you have, yeah, we just,
we bounce from room to room to fuck everybody up.
Has Dr. Donish given you an approval certificate
on your formula for improving muscle mass?
Well, I actually got on a call with Dr. Donish, and he said to pay attention.
I want Dr. Donish to be my doctor.
That's what I want.
He told me to pay attention to my levels of concentration.
Otherwise, the market...
Which ones are those, bro?
Which ones are those?
I haven't seen any of those yet
donish what's up man maybe you ought to drop the sugar i was gonna i was gonna say that um
i got into trouble with some of my physician friends today uh for my stupid tweet about
how doctors don't talk enough about health uh and because I said no to, I said that we should
just tear up Obamacare. Both of those have gotten me in trouble. I might get kicked out of my
doctor group chat, which is, you know, for doctors, that's a pretty big deal.
Dr. Donish, you can join my medical nurse assistant assistant group chat.
We welcome you. It's a nurse's assistant assistant group chat,
highly skilled assistant assistant nurses. Come on, be a part of it.
But Jason, what's, what's funny is first of all, you're not that, but secondly,
it's like, you know, he'd fit in well there, Jason. I would, I would. Cause I actually,
but I have to tell you, like, all I said was that we should have access to health care, but that Obamacare has failed us.
And I gave actual evidence, but it just upset everybody.
So as far as creatine, I'm going to say, now that I'm already saying things that are going to upset people, creatine, to a certain point, obviously, if you go above, I don't know, 50 a day.
I don't know.
I don't know how many people there are taking that much, but 50 a day. I don't know. I don't know many people that are taking that much.
But 50 a day.
I take 100 grams.
Go ahead.
There is no way you take 100.
We're at 150 grams.
No, I'm taking 100 grams easy.
Just with the keto diet and my supplements.
Oh, no, no.
I'm talking about supplements separately.
Like your diet does not count.
What diet counts?
What do you mean?
Creatine and meat?
I eat like a 40-ounce tomahawk steak has 20 grams of creatine. My main point is additional supplementation to a hopefully decently
thought out diet. My point is that supplementation wise, yes, you can't take too much creatine. It
actually hurts your kidneys. Sometimes your liver, but you got to go wild to make it hurt your liver.
But in terms of kidneys, and honestly, there's some data around,
and again, it's going to upset people,
but there's some data around that some people are actually not even affected
on their kidneys because they tend to have,
some people just have better clearance rates.
So if you're younger, it's a little bit better,
but it just depends on your GFR is what we would measure.
But Dr. Donish, please contextualize.
Jason, just call me Donish.
It's okay.
But you could, Dr. Donish, you could kill yourself drinking too much milk.
I mean, you can cause yourself a milk alcohol syndrome.
I could kill myself overdosing with redheads easily.
Dr. Donish, I'm not talking about what Gary's talking about.
Dr. Donish, I'm not talking about what Gary's talking about.
Dr. Donish.
Dr. Donish.
A candy?
A candy?
All I'm going to say is that creatine,
and this is what I was going to say that's going to upset people,
I think that we should put creatine in the water.
Not that you all folks drink tap water,
but we should really put it in the water.
It's one of the most, especially for men across the board,
I think men, as they approach 40, especially for men across the board. I think men
as they approach 40 should all
be on creatine. It's insane that it's
not that way. It's insane that it's
seen as like a workout supplement
when it's like clearly connected to longevity.
I think everyone should be
on TRT after the age of 35.
That's crazy.
After 35?
The answer is absolutely not, unless you just don't want to have kids after that age
are you like a medical doctor that's correct okay okay so can you tell us about the health
of the market what do you feel about there why would i would I call him Dr. Donish? Yeah, I'm not Dr. Joe Biden.
Yeah, I don't recognize any PhD, especially in a university, for anything other than refund my tuition.
Dr. Donish, what can you tell us about the market, man, since you're up here?
It's great.
Market's fine.
Like we've been saying, it's going to be choppy this year i don't know i feel like the doomers are getting absolutely hurt pretty bad i still
think inflation is coming back i don't think it's good you know i think it's going to be higher than
some other people do but i think the markets are done astonish before you enter the room at least
two of uh the folks on the stage
anticipate a melt-up.
We're on the verge of a melt-up on all risk
assets. Do you agree with that? No.
I think it's just going
to be choppy. I think
we're going to have good days and bad days.
I think the only thing that can lead to, quote,
a melt-up would be if they came
and did another 90-day pause.
But I just don't think that that's going to happen.
It's just, guys, like, there's going to be, this is,
we all are expecting some crazy moves.
And unfortunately, this year is just going to be boring.
It's not going to be boring.
It's actually going to be incredibly entertaining.
It's more just like there's not going to be giant melt-ups.
There's not going to be giant meltdowns.
You know, I don't see any of that really
yet i just think it's gonna be choppy as hell
who on this panel has predicted a lot of pivot points in the market since the bottom of 2022
me me i'm great me king wabi the king wabi the great wow we've got a pretty good head right
and we've got a pretty good head right top to bottom and you think there's gonna be a melt up
just when i do i i i think btc over the next one to three months
in the markets just to be very clear look guys here's the thing here's the thing. Here's the thing, right? Here's the thing, right? Like, the Qs and the SPX essentially did an entire speed run of any bear market that we've had over the last 10-plus years, right?
You can fact-tick me on this. When Paul Volcker met with Barack Obama, any meltdown or any drawdown from the S&P from peak to bottom has been roughly 20%.
From the flash crashes of 2011, from the second half of 2018 during that first trade war, COVID crash, I'm not going to count that.
The 2022 rate hike debacle and cpi inflation going crazy any drawdown of the
s p that equates to over 20 the market six months later trades egregiously higher egregiously higher
and there's always what are you talking about hang on a second go to 20 20 go to 2022. What is your... Joe, Joe, when we melted down, right, from January of 2022 to October of 2022, right,
the drawdown of the S&P was about 25%, 26%.
The drawdown from the February high of this year at 6,147 all the way down to 4,800 was roughly 23%, right?
Two quarters after that, six months after any drawdown on the s p
right over 20 within six months were trading egregiously higher insanely okay okay so let
let me just show you how that's that's incorrect so in jan i'll give you the dates in january of
2022 okay we proceeded to bottom in June at negative 24 percent.
Six months after June, where were we at, Wabi?
Six months after June of 2020, we were at thirty nine hundred on the S&P.
Joe, Joe, Joe. Yes. But I the context is a bit different.
The CPI was just going agree.
Well, Joe, let's not forget.
Let's not forget.
Some singular name – I know, but you said a fact that's not true.
Yeah, it's just like I know COVID happened.
Hold on.
To be fair, it was a little bit different time.
Joe, we did melt up two months after that.
We melted up to 4,300 after that June bottom,
and some single names actually did put in a bottom.
Joe, facts don't matter.
Just listen, please.
Yeah.
You sounded very confident when you said that.
I am confident.
I mean, that's like all that matters, right?
Like, I mean, to be fair, Joe did call.
Even beyond that, using anything and saying, well, since 2009 is kind of a silly, because
the world has been very different.
Since 2009, we have been in the QE regime.
We started QT since then.
We really haven't been through a real, there's been a recession in name only, I guess.
We haven't really seen like crazy and i don't even
believe we're ever gonna have like a real one because they just won't let it happen like you
even saw trump back down right trump capitulated as soon as he saw a potential like situation yeah
i just want to illustrate this okay okay we're talking about january of 2022, right? January of 2022, we are trading at roughly $4,800.
Two years later, we're at $4,800.
That's just the facts.
This is not up for debate.
Two years later, we're at $4,800.
So you sat for two years.
In real terms, you actually lost money after two years in the S&P 500.
I still think we melt up, man.
Donnie, you were going to say something, brother.
Before I had to go under, I
just underwent a handicap match.
It was one man
versus ten Tradify bros.
You know?
Yeah.
I think I'd win, man.
I would be the gorilla.
I would be the gorilla.
But, Donnie, go ahead, brother.
You were about to say something, I think.
I lost my train of thought for that particular moment.
But I'll just say that if you're trying to predict the market and all this kind of stuff,
you honestly need super high accuracy on your technical analysis
and then apply all of the context that you guys are talking about
with things going around tariffs,
kind of the macro picture globally, right?
But you need that technical analysis
to be able to see these pivot points in the market.
So I don't know.
We've had pretty good accuracy
for the last almost three years, top to bottom.
And the way I see it,
I think over the next one to three months, BTC will break
that all-time high. Could just be a deviation.
I don't know.
Bitcoin is completely different. It's not the markets.
Bitcoin has been, I think, completely
different.
Dr. Donish, you don't
know this, but I'm probably one of the only
Bitcoiners that's routinely predicted
the price all-time high for four years. I've got it right within three days for four years. Do you know
that, Donish? Want me to give you the date? I did not know that. Give me the date. October 27th,
2025. You just write that down. Jason, can I have your autograph? 2025. Go ahead.
Can I have your autograph?
2025.
Go ahead.
No, no, hold on.
Jason, Jason, sorry, just to be clear, on October 27th, 2025, we're going to see an all-time high, so we're not going to see an all-time high before then.
Say that again?
You can send it in that we will be at an all-time high by that date.
Interesting.
Yeah, I think before.
What I'm going to do with that is donnie's saying we're
gonna move basically 12 on bitcoin or what is it 13 which is like a day and you said over the next
three months but wabi's saying we're gonna melt up like 13 over the next three months that's good
right i'm not i'm not negative on that that's great but it's not a melt up 13%. Breaking the all-time high is a significant structure break on the chart, you realize.
So if you have other leading indicators...
Hold on a second.
Here's a significant structure break.
In 2021, we broke a structure break to a new all-time high in November,
slightly above the all-time high in April,
and then we sold off hard and got smoked.
So there's your significant structure break.
That wasn't a structure break, though, because you deviated the high.
You didn't actually break structure and continue.
So it's just different.
So it didn't keep going up, so therefore it doesn't count.
That was at the end of a massive inflationary wave.
They started hiking rates.
It's completely different.
We don't have any of that.
I'm saying we've got an improved liquidity backdrop,
and you're seeing risk appetite start to renew with the slightest hint of backing off from these tariffs, which is what caused a narrative exaggerated
sell off.
Okay, just for the record.
Donnie, how does everything you just said support gold ripping like it is?
Turmoil and inflation, right?
We saw global liquidity. Contrary to what you're saying.
Trend higher.
That seems confusing.
So here's the thing, Jason.
You got to pick the things that support the bullish narrative and reject the talking points that don't support it.
That's the way you do it.
Oh, I got it.
So I am confused, but there's a reason.
I don't get it. What are you confused with?
Gold rallied because of the turmoil and, you know,
Right.
Because turmoil causes stocks to go up.
That's all there is to it.
No, but gold leads, gold has proven to lead Bitcoin, which is a risk asset.
It's a different asset. It's a different asset.
It's a safe haven asset.
So if there's turmoil, people flee to gold.
It's pretty simple.
If you have risk on, then get its window open.
You're going to have gold go down and risk assets go up.
We haven't fully seen that yet.
But if it does play out like this, then yeah, you're going to see gold go down.
I can't see gold go up and also a risk on environment
that's the thing that you're confusing me donny it's gone up now while risk assets have corrected
but i'm saying that will flip if you know some of this starts to unfold over the next
month or two so you'll see gold going down and risk going up is what i'm saying
You'll see gold going down and risk going up is what I'm saying.
I'll give you a chart. It's pretty simple.
I like to look at charts.
I don't have a lot of confidence in charts and TA when it comes to Bitcoin, unfortunately.
But I'd love to see it.
Yeah, I shared it right now.
It's nothing like crazy.
It's just kind of the divergence between gold and
I guess risk BTC. If gold were to actually correct here.
So Donnie, you don't view it as digital gold?
Sorry?
You don't view Bitcoin as digital gold?
Gold has been trading as a safe haven asset, whereas BTC has been a beneficiary of a risk
environment.
Right.
Up until now. So unless you're saying that trend is shifting then that's a different story this time is different then i
don't know but well my point is that i've always questioned that narrative so i would agree with
you it can change this is why bitcoin's kind of an asymmetrical trade this cycle if you're viewing
all of this tariff stuff is like oh people want to flee to flee to safe haven and BTC might finally break,
decouple from the NASDAQ, let's say, then yeah, sure, BTC can still be a beneficiary of that,
but it can also still be a beneficiary of a risk-on environment.
Donnie.
And actually, it doesn't change just yet.
What's your Bitcoin target for the high this year based on your analysis?
I would say anywhere between
138 and 182
for this year. If we continue into
2026, it should be above 200.
So it's more of a range
depending on how things kind of unfold.
Gotcha.
Yeah.
Well, I just invited
a few spectators that
requested to speak
see if they have anything they want to add
to the conversation
that post I shared with gold and BTC
we had a 9% correction
prior to the elections
in gold which
subsequently
BTC rallied 60% after that,
when gold ranged after a 9% correction.
So depending how the next one to three months plays out,
whether you get more clarity around tariffs and all this kind of stuff,
I don't see how gold keeps catching a bit.
You even had the top at a macro 2.618 fib extension around 3.3 get hit.
And the narrative at the highs was central banks are top-lasting gold.
Therefore, you should buy gold because everything's cooked.
It's a pretty good narrative to trap people at the top.
So I think there's more reasons to see gold maybe cools off here for a bit
and risk gets a bit of a bid over the next one to three months.
And that's kind of where the melt-up for BTC will happen.
But we'll see. We need to see more follow-through.
But I think there's enough in the tank as it currently stands
to break the highs over the next one to three months.
And we get above and keep trending.
People are excited about this discussion discussion man there's almost a thousand
people in here i haven't seen a room this big since uh we were melting down uh back in uh march
and early april so it just goes to show like this is the market where people like to front run any narrative, man, to be honest.
It's the quickest to the upside, quickest to the downside.
So if anyone on the original panel, Joe, Gary, or Jason, or even you, Donnie, want to add anything before I see what's...
No, I'd like to get...
So that's your Bitcoin target.
In the next three months,
what does the S&P 500 do?
Let me hear that, Donnie.
That's tricky because I still argue that
if the SPX doesn't break the high
and it just chops around or whatever,
if the narrative kind of flips
to where BTC is breaking the high,
it's looking very attractive,
then I think you could get rotations
out of the stock market into BTC.
So I'm not even concerned about the stock market. I just think this whole narrative around the end
of US exceptionalism and people repricing stocks to the downside is not here yet because big players
haven't had their exit, which typically is at euphoric highs. So I think there's a decent
chance SPX breaks the all-time high this year. Whether it happens in this kind of melt-up scenario or not, I don't know.
But, you know, Donnie, I'm going to throw something at you to support your narrative a little bit,
but it doesn't have to do with charts or anything.
You know, I'm an early-stage investor, and I also have some companies that are considering or going to go IPO.
And when companies are doing that, it seems going to go IPO.
And when companies are doing that,
it seems very bullish to me, right?
That was switched off for a long time.
But the fact that there are companies coming out
and we're seeing IPOs, that seems very bullish to me.
So you could have a risk on switch,
but do you understand where I'm going with that?
Now, can you expand on it a little bit more?
You got to break it down. Real simple.
All right. So nobody wants to take their company and go public and it'd be a dud,
right? So there must be a lot of sideline money, a lot of opportunity, like a lot of the value of companies is extracted in the pre IPO
market. So they want to go IPO, get access to public money, but there has to be excitement.
There has to be people ready to push and shove money in. I'm saying to you, that's happening.
One of my portfolio companies in full transparency is eToro. It's a crypto company,
trading company. They're doing their IPO. I think it's a crypto company trading company they're they're gonna they're doing their
ipo i think it's coming out next week or something it seems it's gonna be pretty big and again joe
i remember e-toro from those uh commercials of that uh of that guy in the elevator and people
were freaking out because btc was crashing No, that was Benicio Del Toro.
Yeah, that commercial came out right at the bottom in December of 2018
when you had many people calling for BTC to hit $1,300, if you remember.
And people were calling for ETH to go back to ICO price.
Man, that was an unreal crash, dude. That crash
lasted four whole weeks. And Jihan Wu and Roger Ver and Craig Wright were all going at it in
telegram groups. That was fun. That was fun because for the people that I'm sure are here
right now listening to the space, I'm sure a lot of you, like myself, came into the market when BTC hit almost 20K in December of 2017.
That, my friends, was a glorious time.
That was a really, really, really fun time. And then to have the market
and the powers that be give people another chance to buy some of these high caps at minus 90% was
truly a gift. And BTC collapsed like, I think it was 87% from the high or something like that.
It went from just below 20K to just below 3100,
depending on the exchange you were using.
And then it consolidated there for like two whole months
before I think Powell started doing QE in like late January of 2019
or something like that.
But yeah, I just wanted to add in that commentary
because eToro brings back memories hearing that name.
Hopefully, you know, they come out,
they're looking at a $4 billion IPO,
and hopefully it's a big deal.
I think Mike Novogratz is also launching,
is Galaxy Digital going IPOo or going public i think
joe right and they that's really interesting as well like again you didn't see this these
are crypto companies crypto you know crypto founders uh it's a big uh i think that's interesting
but but on the other side stub hub withdrew its ipo right and what's the other side, StubHub withdrew its IPO.
And what's the other one?
Klarna?
With Druid's IPO?
Alright, well, you know,
now you sound like Donnie.
Donnie, were you going to say something?
I was just going to say back to that setup with BTC.
You literally have gold at extreme highs
at kind of this macro fib resistance level.
And you just had BTC bottom
with a clean accumulation structure at the lows
and now pushing back up to the upside.
I just think anything that's going to goose the market
into risk from here,
you're going to see BTC overperform in a big way.
So just goes back to the next like one to three months
being bullish for BTC.
And subsequently, I think SPX will still catch
a little bit of a bid as well.
There's money that needs to flow into that
if risk gets confirmed back on.
But we'll see.
Melt up.
Why's it going to be a melt up it can be a nice 15 move that's bullish i'd love to make a new all-time no melt up melt up joe
melt up i think you're talking i'm putting my rally cap on and I blame this Dave H. Contrarian.
He's been talking about this damn melt-up for like 25 years,
and it's now permeated through Twitter.
This guy should be banned.
I mean, he's out of control.
Who's this?
Dave H. Contrarian.
Do you know this guy?
Dave Hunter.
Didn't you guys go to school together?
Yeah, we had badminton practice
every day, and the guy always schooled
me, and I've been jealous ever since.
Exactly.
Does he have good accuracy
in his goals? No.
We had him on the show
on YouTube like two times.
In May
of 23, uh in may of 23 and uh in august of 23 and he called for uh
s&p to hit 6 000 within 12 months and i think spx was trading at like 4k or something like that
yeah and then he got into a huge fight with uh Lippard because Larry Lippard started saying melt-up.
And then David Hunter said that that was trademarked, that he couldn't say melt-up because he coined the term melt-up.
So they were arguing over who was able to use the term melt-up.
True story.
That's hilarious man uh anyone can go by the way uh tim yeah yeah so so what's the reaction donnie donnie i want
to just hear you we got an fomc coming you we i think it'd be shocking if powell does a cut i i'm
putting me down he's not yeah yeah it's gonna be hold
what's the market reaction do we dump do we blast off to the the melt up you're talking about what
what's what's the what do we do it's either nothing or just can't the these kind of things
are just like to me from like a since i'm more of on the technical side. It assists whatever the bias is for that trend.
So just like how the Trump tariffs assisted the bearish bias,
if something positive were to be said by Powell,
it's just going to assist what I already think is coming,
which is a continuation of the uptrend.
It doesn't mean a straight line.
It just means local higher highs, higher lows,
building an uptrend towards a new all-time high.
So I don't know.
I don't really care what he says.
Yeah, it's either a nothing burger or just continue how it's going.
So that means it's going to either be flat or pop.
Do you think we'll get a possible pop from Powell on Wednesday?
Potentially. Did Donnie fall off, guys? Yeah, he fell off sorry about that um it's too close to the
too close to the fomc right now so i'm not sure like btc has some levels that i would prefer if
it came to sweep before going higher, which is around 91.3.
I would want that level to be hit before any sort of bigger move.
So I just think, yeah, I can't really see how the FOMC is going to trigger anything on the Bitcoin chart, to be honest.
Maybe like a day or two after.
Hey, Donnie, do you uh an opinion on this bitcoin core update
this proposal i haven't even seen it
to remove the filters for all the transactions basically allowing everything
now i'd have to read into i don't really look at any of that stuff what do you think about it
until I don't really look at any of that stuff.
What do you think about it?
I mean, normally I'd be for allowing everything.
That to me is what Bitcoin is all about.
But I've heard Bitcoin Mechanic in recent days say,
how much more can we expect of these nodes
who are already not being compensated for what they do?
And I think it's a very valid point.
Yeah, I'm not sure if it's a very valid point. Yeah.
I'm not sure if it's going to be a big enough catalyst
to shoot the price up, for example.
But I guess all things positive for Bitcoin.
You'd need something at a much larger scale.
For example, if I were to throw out a catalyst,
which get timed funnily enough with the chart,
would be if the US announced some sort of buying plan
or they did a buy, something like that. That would would probably be big enough with the current setup that we have
to you know shoot prices higher but if it's just something like that i wouldn't expect it to move
the chart whatsoever man you know uh we've been going for about two hours, guys. I do have to head out here pretty soon.
I wish I can keep the stream going.
But look, guys, if you guys enjoyed the stream over the last two hours, we produce these live streams throughout the week.
Usual start time is between 420 to 440 p.m. EST.
So about 20 to 40 minutes after the stock market closes
we go live here on these spaces so if you guys enjoyed the content over the last two hours feel
free to give us a follow we also produce a youtube show called market check if you guys are into all
things ta wizard lines and graphs charts all that good stuff we also have that for you guys are into all things TA, wizard lines, graphs, charts, all that good stuff, we also have that for you guys.
Start time on that one is between 11 a.m. EST to 11.20 a.m. EST.
So we got something for everyone, whether it's time zones or different styles of content.
So Market Check is usually hosted by some of our guys here at BecauseBitcoin.
And then Market Talk is hosted by me, Wabi, where I'm joined by typically the same panel of set speakers.
Some of these guys have been with us for a couple of years now.
Joe has been on these shows for a couple of years since we first started.
Hey, Wabi.
We've got this hand.
I don't know if you can see it because there's a lot of glitch, but it's R3T.
It looks like almost, yeah.
So are we going to answer that hand?
I mean, I called on him.
Yeah, real quick.
Bro, I just wanted to hammer, before you close,
I wanted to hammer on Jason's point about the coming pain.
Because I work in the industry, one of the top five trucking companies recently, within the last month, shifted, because I come out of port of long beach and san diego shifted over a hundred drivers
out the ports and onto dry van like there's no work coming out of the ports it's almost like a
ghost town so the the the coming pain in the supply chain is is something that the consumer
doesn't understand right now but they're gonna feel pain. So if you haven't been stocking up, the pain is coming.
Yeah, just do your diligence on that.
R3T, did you know?
It's retarded.
Yeah, I can't really say that.
But did you see that post from Fred Kruger where he has predicted?
I don't know if you know who Fred Kruger is, noted Bitcoin analyst.
Shit corner. Kruger where he has predicted I don't know if you know who Fred Kruger is noted Bitcoin analyst yeah well he has predicted that there's going to be mass riots
in the street by Q3
and that seems consistent with what you're claiming
do you agree with that?
I do agree with that
I think Gary believes this as well
my understanding
the supply chain has slowed down so much
like I said
this company that I work for is over over five billion dollar company trucking company
and them coming off of the ports is a massive their their whole restructure to downsize or
shift drivers off because the trucking industry like i could just quit and go to another trucking company same day.
Like they,
over a hundred dudes out of the port,
trucks out of the port,
supplies not coming in.
It's,
there's upcoming pain in the,
definitely in the next quarter. Is it going to affect creatine supply in the United States?
most definitely.
You might as well stock up now.
There you go.
Oh man. Oh, man.
The trucking creatine supply.
That's the indicator.
We got to add to BB Terminal, man.
It's really important.
But I hope there's no riots, honestly.
Are we talking like 2020 BLm kind of no way worse
break no fred said he thinks it's all gonna it's gonna be a massive destabilization he thinks that
when people go and they can't get their creatine at costco um people are gonna just blow it they're
gonna why do why do like bitcoin laser-eyed people that fixate on blockchain transactions
always try to price in the worst-case scenario possible?
Tradition, mostly.
It's mostly tradition, I think.
Yeah, I remember Magoo was saying CPI is going to go to 20%,
and we should stock up on our chicken because it's going to go to $30 a pound.
And then some other people were talking about, oh, no one's going to be able to go to Europe
because it's going to freeze. And how BTC is going to go to like $12,000, $10,000 because
Michael Saylor and Coinbase are about to go bankrupt because the Coinbase bond yields were going through the roof
or whatever that narrative is.
And it's like there's always room for more upside
when you have people that bought Bitcoin at like two cents
while some of us were still in school
are always talking about the most ridiculous narratives like
i just think that just because someone bought bitcoin at five bucks or a hundred bucks doesn't
make them smarter than than warren buffett or whatever it's like man you're just some dude who
pressed the buy button on coinbase while most people like didn't even have a driver's license
and i think it's that simple sometimes and to be what was it that you said joe perpetual optimism on on quality assets and crypto is not going anywhere we're not
going to have riots on the street um and there are many there are many very smart early bitcoin
adopters we know that right uh jason's on stage early bitcoin adop adopter. We know Max Keiser. My friend Brad Mills, early Bitcoin adopter, very astute in monetary matters.
Many smart Bitcoin early adopters.
And they're all saying like riots and stuff?
Yeah, where did you get those?
I think breakdown of society in general is coming is what their claim is.
I mean, I've been in a lot of these.
Yeah.
Guns, ammo, albacore, spam, rice, and beans.
Stock up on those.
You know how many times they've said this, though?
A lot.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, but if you say anything enough, eventually it comes true, right?
Melt up. Melt up. Melt up. Yeah. Yeah, but if you say anything enough, eventually it comes true, right? Melt up, melt up, melt up.
Yeah, yeah, dude.
Like, just send prices higher.
It'll all be okay.
Melt up, melt up, melt up.
Yes, yes.
Ring the melt up bell, right?
Dude, I think that's all going to happen, like the climax. If this is a new narrative, right, this whole riots or whatever,
it's probably going to peak at the higher low that the SPX sets.
And yeah, does that come with age, man?
Like as you get older, do you like just start to view things like more pessimistically, right?
Like imagine being super early in Bitcoin and still like trying to make it
and and like you just want to get obscene prices to the downside at the expense of people's
livelihoods like ah but you think that's why they're pessimistic you think sometimes i
sometimes i think so sometimes i think like like people just want lower asset prices and they just start to think
the most disastrous thing that could that could happen right it's like dude if if like these
people were so early to bitcoin then like why are they trying to like create some narrative that
just that just sounds ridiculous here's my view on. I think that there's a lot of people in Bitcoin, okay, that are really…
Warren Buffett never did any of this kind of behavior, right?
Warren Buffett is a scoundrel.
He's an absolute cheat, guys.
Yeah.
Well, we can table the Buffett discussion for a second.
No, no, no. May I just, how he used political and inside information to structure his financial prowess.
And this is well documented.
This isn't some conspiracy theory.
I'm not a Warren Buffett stan.
The dude's a genius.
The dude's a great investor, but the dude absolutely took advantage of everything he possibly could to slant his investments in his favor, dude.
Isn't that with every major figurehead?
Aren't you supposed to do that?
The founders of all these exchanges, they all run on insider information.
And when they run their books up, they prop up these altcoins, right?
Look at Sam Bankman-Fried. insider information and when they run their books up they prop up these altcoins right like look at
sam bankman freed um people might not like him but he pumped their shit out of everyone's bags
from top to bottom and back down to the bottom um same thing with uh brian armstrong same thing
with cz like they did their part and they pumped everyone's bags um you remember coinbase's message it used to be buy
bitcoin now it's like just a bunch of shit coins like markets are markets for the most part like
the big guys they all run on insider info man all of them all of them all of them all of them like
nobody is nobody is like innocent when it comes to these large players so warren buffett amen um he retired off of coca-cola stock
but i really don't have much more to add i just i just think wabi there's a lot of people that
want to be able to point the finger at others and say look i was right how could you be so stupid
you didn't buy bitcoin you didn't buy gold or even. It's almost like the Doomer trade is one of,
you're familiar with the phrase schadenfreude?
Like you kind of want other people to like admit,
because people were made fun of for many years
for buying Bitcoin.
And I think that they had to take a lot of ridicule.
I myself had taken ridicule from partners and other people.
How could you be messing around with that stuff?
It's just wrath,
poison,
et cetera.
I remember that Joe,
when I worked at whole foods,
when I worked at whole foods,
BTC was hovering in 2019 between like 8k to 10k.
And I was telling everybody to stock up on BTC and ETH.
And they were all telling me,
how is crypto going to take off if we have fintech
like Venmo and then I went to Whole Foods the other day and then they're still pushing carts
it's funny how that works man yeah no I mean look look you did exactly what Gary Cardone tells a lot
of people which is stack hard you know only buy bitcoin don't stay away from the altcoins as much
as you can and you you you got your way out right i mean that's that's the solution you have to bid your way out of the machine i just think it's really like unfair
and kind of pompous for like it's always these like legacy people that bought btc super cheap and
like they're always wrong they're always always always wrong and then they disappear for a few
months and they come back
during the higher low right like everyone who flooded the bottom you remember joe i had you on
i remember it was pretty awful i had you on the show joe in december of 2022 where i it was back
when i interviewed some people and we were talking about like people freaking out over like grayscale and all that
stuff and now people were talking about macro and then when we pumped the 22k they all disappeared
and then they came back when we pulled back from 30k to 25 and they were all talking about like a
retest of btc and the team yeah even though we went through svb already you remember that joe
well yeah but no no i remember this so my two one of my two favorite spaces of like for the last five years one was in october
of 2022 when i was in a it was actually not a space it was a clubhouse room i was literally
debating bitcoin tina and peter schiff joined clubhouse in 2022 just to come into the room to
harass the bitcoiners at the very bottom it was like
bitcoin tina had panicked and also peter t-bond tina brother t-bond tina and then i was also in
a space with again peter schiff in august of 2024 with the yen carry trade where he he is on a space
telling me he said i'm gonna lose all my money I'm gonna be poor living under a bridge eating cat food and he said that uh as soon as the ETF because it was you
know how the young carry trade blew up at night and we were all talking about I think you were
in that space Bobby um he was saying how I was when the market opened when the ETFs open he said
this will be the first true test because everybody's going to panic sell the etf bitcoin's going to crater and it will never recover it's it's a recorded space from august
of 24 with mr peter schiff and myself in the back and forth i gotta find it yeah yeah schiffelstein
peter schiffelstein um he's always been a pretty good indicator um as far as like the peak of volatility right with the vix and all
that stuff and always always crypto people turning into macro people right and it's like listen man
the regime has always been i mean since even i mean if you i know i said march of 2009 but you
know if you want to kind of make it earlier right to just i don't know make
just squeeze in more time together from march of uh 2020 right like just buying anything within
crypto and in majors right um while the spx and nasdaq are drawing down close to 25 percent over
25 your risk reward is pretty damn good, man.
Yeah.
We just got to get you to increase your Bitcoin holdings, Bobby.
We got to get this number higher.
Okay?
Really pump that up.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That is true, man.
No one ever owns enough.
not even not even sailor i wonder if sailor is at some point right like during the next batch of qe
Not even Sailor.
if he's going to end up acquiring like five percent of the supply that's probably going to
happen isn't it man he has like two point during the next batch of qe um which i do think is going
to come probably by like 2028 i think 2028 29 is going to be qe5 or qe4 whatever it is now um i think like that's going
to be um dot com you're thinking way too too conservatively the next major catalyst is ubi
is coming yeah that's qe that's basically qe that's q oh it's it's it's qe times 10 ubi yeah i think that comes
in uh 2028 2029 something like that um and then after that it's probably 2000 to 2003 all over
again type stuff you just have too many people trying to look over this last decade stuff right when the fact of the matter
is is if all if all people have done is pay attention to the underperformance of iwm over
the last four years they missed ai they missed the echo bubble uh in the crypto market they
missed hood they missed coin and a bunch of other things too. Right. So there's always a bull market somewhere,
man.
But,
either way,
perpetual optimism is what I believe in right now.
Same with Donnie.
I just hope by the neck,
by the,
like the 2030 bull market,
Bobby,
you're hosting these in like a ready player one type arena where we're all sitting around
talking, battling each other. Do you think that's a possibility
or no?
Too early.
When do we get the ready player one, guys?
When is that coming? Because I would have thought
2045.
2045, I'll be dead.
That's not going to work.
Joe, what are you talking about, dude?
In five to ten years, they'll have things to keep you running longer bro joe is gonna be the head of the federal
reserve giving us the inside scoop on on uh on race and all that stuff man but can you imagine
like pals family members they probably have have all the inside scoop on everything.
The alpha networking move is becoming friends with anyone related to Jerome Powell or Nancy Pelosi.
And you'll giga make it.
Well, you know what Powell said?
We were at this luncheon where he was talking.
They asked him a good question, which was, what does he do for fun?
You know what he said he did for fun what just take a guess uh playing it wasn't call of duty he didn't play call of duty just if you're wondering call of duty minecraft he doomed
no no no no he said he. He said for fun.
First of all, you can always tell when somebody doesn't have any hobbies
because they search for an answer that could seem plausible.
So he was searching for a little bit to try to – he says, I read a lot.
And then he didn't have really an answer.
Then he started pivoting and saying, well, I do Zoom calls with my grandkids,
which he probably sees them once every few weeks.
And then he said, I play guitar.
That was his answer.
Man, I, I, do you remember,
I think someone, like someone had a segment with Powell
where they pretended to be like someone from Ukraine
and they like prank called him or something like that.
I think it was like a prank Zoom call
or something like that have you
ever invited him on because bitcoin like have you guys you know you are a media what are you
financial media company as you present yourself have you invited him on i got close to uh inviting
neil kashkari on why didn't you okay he he didn't get back to me um i spam emailed him and then he
finally said um hi how can i help you and then like do you think it was really him or like a bot
you actually no no respond no like these guys are pretty easy to get in touch with they all have
emails and all that stuff um if you gotta get him on you gotta got to get him on. If you look back, if you look back in December of 2022,
Jerome Powell had that emergency meeting or whatever.
And I remember back then I spam emailed Jerome Powell and the Federal Reserve,
even under their tweets, saying, can you please ask Jerome Powell
what he likes to have for breakfast?
And they actually asked him that.
And that was pretty funny.
And he actually lost. Well, you got to get him him on here especially when he leaves office for a debrief um that would be legendary um but
anyway i gotta jump guys i get stuff to take care of here but great chatting with you um you know
i'm i'm really i'm really inspired right you got to go to the youth like the people in this room
to be optimistic about the future i spend way too many time in some of the spaces where people are negative uh down i
we live in an incredible time and it's only going to get better okay we're only getting better over
the next few weeks so and months and years so uh with that uh yeah i'll talk to you soon wabi you
stay stay cool yeah yeah man um shout out to all you guys that are in here shout out to uh all 800 of you thank
you all so much uh if you guys can go ahead and um show some love to the space before uh
i shut it down the best way to show some love to the space is by clicking the spaces tab and then
once you do that right above our profile pictures you'll see a little link in
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the like button up and also the repost button up to about 50 to 100. Greatly appreciate that. But guys, as I said during the closing statement, if you are new here, guys, if you are new and have enjoyed the stream over the last two and a half hours, we are Because Bitcoin.
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Like today, we had a pretty stacked panel.
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And of course, guys, if you are looking for an inner circle community that loves to seek
alpha on all things markets, whether it's the crypto market, whether it's the
equity market, we do have a private inner circle. Details of all that is in the box above in the
nest. We also do two private live streams there on a daily basis, Monday through Friday. First
stream is our morning stream 15 minutes before the New york open in the stock market and the second stream
which is our afternoon call is hosted at 3 30 p.m est 30 minutes before the new york close
both of those streams usually last about an hour so here because bitcoin we produce
essentially what what is a full day's worth of work of all things streaming. So a couple of hours, private streams,
couple of hours, public streams.
So we have something for you all.
And in that Discord, you'll also have access to our own in-house trading terminal called BB Terminal.
And of course, we have various indicators
like spaghetti charts, portfolio trackers,
all things of the like, right?
Sort of like an all-in-one trading hub application. And soon we'll be releasing a mobile app as well. So if you guys
have any questions in regards to any of our services, whether it's our Discord, whether it's
BB Terminal, feel free to send us a message or feel free to send a message to any of our affiliates.
Go to our profile, click affiliates. You can message any any of our affiliates go to our profile click affiliates
you can message any one of us or you can just simply message um the because bitcoin.com profile
and we'll get back to you within 24 hours we accept fiat we accept crypto so feel free to send
us a message if you're interested in joining or you can just click the link below and uh click
the link above and um feel free to check that out but
either way guys if you want to keep up with our content and you think to yourself man i really
like what these guys are doing you can go ahead and give us a follow and turn on bell notifications
so you can be made aware of whenever we go live on youtube or x or whether you want to keep up with real-time crypto news, as we are one of the
fastest companies in X that come out with real-time market news, whether it's crypto-related,
TradFi-related. We are one of the fastest. So it's got sort of like an all-in-one stop shop
for all things news and live streams that are actually entertaining, by the way.
They're actually entertaining.
We've been around for about two and a half years now.
So a huge shout-out to all of you guys in the audience, whether you've been listening to us for the last few days, weeks, or months,
or whether you've been with us since the very beginning over the last couple of years.
been with us since the very beginning over the last couple of years i want to give you all thanks
I want to give you all thanks.
whether you're listening uh through the recording or here live i want to thank you all very very
very much and also want to give a huge shout out to my lord savior jesus christ for allowing me
another day of health to talk markets with you all without him none of this would be possible at all and before i shut down the stream
guys if y'all can go ahead and uh check up on the nest it's uh from our founder from our ceo max
currently right now if you guys can go ahead and show him some love i posted something up on the
nest um send a prayer for him guys please please please. Max truly is one of the greatest people in the entire crypto industry space.
So you guys can go ahead and show him some love.
I put up a post above on The Nest.
Shout out to Max for allowing a lot of us here to expand within this industry and honestly meet and connect with uh, we never thought we'd get close to.
So thank you all so much for all love and support. We'll be back tomorrow, bright and early for a
market check on YouTube at 11 AM EST. And of course, later on that day on spaces. So once
again, guys, thank you all so much. Spaces are recorded as usual. And,'m gonna go ahead and train some lower body now guys
um i usually close out these spaces with some music uh but i have to go ahead and connect
my internet i was supposed to call at&t today but that just completely that just completely uh
that just completely not just completely uh slipped off my mind i was uh busy with a few
other things but um yeah i'll play some music probably during the during the opening and
closing of uh tomorrow's space so thank you all so much take care guys peace god bless you all Thank you.
