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Memecoin Mania in 2025/2026?? 💥 The Aggregated Ep. 130
Recorded: Sept. 19, 2025 Duration: 3:33:27Space Recording
Short Summary
In a lively discussion about the future of meme coins, participants explored the potential for growth and community engagement in 2025 and 2026, while highlighting innovative projects like Crypto Cock Coin's new raffle app and the importance of strategic partnerships and fundraising efforts in the evolving crypto landscape.
Full Transcription
Thank you. . Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. The best thing about today so far
is that apparently anyone that requests
to get on the stage is just let up immediately
except Timmy.
Well, yeah, we don't want him here.
Literally, I haven't let a single person on the stage yet.
Except everyone else just requested and got up there.
So you know what's funny?
I didn't even request.
I joined the space and it was like, do you want to speak?
And I just clicked, yeah.
Haha, same here.
How's it going hey ivan
so meme coins is that what we're doing meme queen mania yep is aztec rugged already
Yep. Is Aztec rugged already?
I don't know. Aztec, are you rugged?
i don't know aztec are you rugged
This is the reason we never put Aztec in the co-host position.
He can't be trusted.
Well, Rock's here in the audience, too, and I see Dash here.
We had a really productive conversation about meme coins yesterday on crypto quorum
yeah
all right
that was totally random okay
everything was fine
I didn't have to request
to be added up
I just immediately joined
because it just asked me
and then
when you sent over the co-host invite
I accepted it and immediately got rugged
nice
yeah I did say that
this is why we don't make you co-host you're not to be trusted yeah
yeah I heard that part I'm like that's absolutely true bro like like it's bound to go wrong if you
put me in the co-host spot but anyways guys it's meme coin mania 2025 2026 question mark the aggregated 130th episode i'm happy to be here with all of you on a
friday thank you to everyone that is here with us i i don't know if uh because darren just said
anyone could join it seems like anyone could join the space without even requesting so i don't know who was actually invited and who's just here to party with us
but uh i'm happy you're here so let's jump into this conversation as always we just
introduce everyone i go left to right on my screen no particular order
uh so let's go ahead and do that.
Oh, Rock's here.
Hello, beautiful people.
There he is.
There he is.
There's the man, the myth, the legend.
Thanks, man.
It's been a long week.
It's going to make me blush.
It has been a very long week.
It's been a long week. It's going to make me blush. It has been a very long week. It's been a good week, though.
Crazy, great stuff happening in the industry.
Swill all the stuff we're working on.
It's intense right now.
Things are heating up for sure.
Definitely.
I feel like I heard your voice on Monday and then took a thousand calls and here I am today talking to you on Friday.
But I didn't get to talk. It was pretty busy this week.
We actually didn't know if Rock would be coming early today, but he just loves meme coin so much.
He told me that.
Yep.
Can't miss the meme coin talk.
It's just my favorite topic.
He just knew cock was going to be here
and he loves cock.
Whoa.
No, I see him. I see him right
here. Crypto cock coin.
This is not cocky new this is another cock coin yeah very nice okay well let's jump into let's start off with you uh crypto cock let's introduce you
so uh the way we do it we take 30 seconds don't Don't, don't go too long. Just, uh, let us know what you're doing in the space and, uh, tell us a little bit about yourself. Maybe a milestone
that if you're working on a project that you recently hit, you can throw any, uh, big posts
that you've dropped recently in the Jumbotron up above. If you don't know how to do that,
just send it over to Darren. He might be able to help you get it up in the Jumbotron up above if you don't know how to do that just send it over to darren he might be
able to help you get it up in the jumbotron and um yeah so let's start with you
all right thank you thank you uh yeah i'm uh chris co-founder of crypto cop coin um
i've spent my years over on polygon funnily enough, and over the last couple of years moved over to base, got to know the space very well.
And yeah, we had some really good ideas and decided to produce CryptoCopcoin, which is a meme coin, but we are building big.
building big. And, you know, we're making sure we're present with our community and in the space is constantly, constantly posting every day, building on base through Farcaster and the base app. You know, the apps almost ready to be released. And yeah, just, you know, making the little steps to progression on a daily basis.
just making the little steps to progression on a daily basis.
Very cool. Well, it's good to have you here.
Since you're a founder here or you're building MemeCoin and the community there,
we'll have a lot of questions for you in just a second.
So right after we introduce everyone, we're going to jump into some dynamic conversation.
I like to say it's like a bunch of friends sitting around a table.
Rock likes to say it's a bunch of friends in the Roman bathhouse discussing philosophy,
drinking wine.
So you're going to join us in that in just a second.
But I'll pass.
But I'll talk.
Good times.
Good times.
Good times.
Good times.
Let's, you know,
Rock, tell us about
yourself, bro. Pass the mic on over to you.
I'm Rock
and I like turtles.
I like turtles.
Nice, man. I think you like more than turtles.
Someone said that to me once and I just read out the whole thing from start to finish like back here live at the waterfront village we've got my friend that zombie Jonathan Jonathan's got
an awesome Facebook job what do you think I like turtles I don't know why the whole thing's in my brain but have you guys tasted turtle soup no how dare you dare you
it really is good you sick human being why it's just you know i just i uh reptiles i i can eat
like uh you know they hunt so in puerto rico apparently they they um they hunt. So in Puerto Rico, apparently they, they, um, they hunt these, um, I think they're iguanas. They're huge. They're like massive. They're like, they look like a
Komodo dragon or something. And I'm like, God, I don't know if I could hunt one of those guys.
They're too nice and cool. Um, I guess, but they're, they're not a native. So they,
the farmers hate them because they eat all the plants and stuff.
But yeah, turtles, I just have too much love for.
I've had too many turtles in my life.
I don't think I can do it.
I had a tortoise once. She was called Chelly.
I mean, we eat other reptiles, right?
We eat alligators, we eat snakes and stuff.
What's in real?
Alligators's good.
I had alligator with Cindy
in New Orleans.
Alligator is delicious.
Alligator is delicious.
So is rattlesnake.
Snakes are good.
They taste it because we only have
small ones here. There's no meat on them.
Doesn't alligator just taste like chicken though
i mean i've had it a while ago yeah it's a little bit different so does rattlesnake everything tastes
like chicken if you try hard enough yeah so does so does uh rattlesnake though aesthetic
interesting there's something there's something us humans uh there's something to us where we just
like if you have any
kind of relationship or like something is cute, you just think it's messed up to eat.
But if it's like, you know, a mean looking animal, you're like, yeah, we can eat that
thing.
It's a weird, it is a weird thing.
They're all just like clumps of protein and you know, it's like, but yeah, we, as humans
have emotions, I suppose.
The way we reason things as apex predators.
I could never eat a turtle.
An alligator.
Yeah.
Rabbit.
Yeah.
But a turtle.
Don't know.
Is it because of Nemo?
Why are rabbits okay?
Cause they're cute too.
Why do, why do we, why are we okay with eating rabbits? Some people do eat rabbits.
Um, but like, it's not, okay. too why do why do we why are we uh okay with eating rabbits some people do eat rabbits um but
like it's not okay so i've known people who raised them who raised rabbits to eat them and it was
pretty crazy um but like you know you see that pita board like where do you stop i mean cows are cute
goats are cute lambs are cute chickens are sometimes cute like they're all kind of cute
maybe it's the law of stupidity
like the smart of the animal also
you kind of don't want to eat it if it's smart
what were you saying Luke?
just saying
yuppie barras for example
the timi rocks
I think they're delicious as well
and shiba inu dogs
most likely as well
so just saying hey what about bugs guys
and then we need to get to the topic because we do this but uh what about like i know the bug stuff
sounds crazy but realistically i mean again it is just superfood clumps of protein and you know
minerals and vitamins and stuff if we could cross if we if
someone could process a a insect burger that was better for the environment cheaper and if it
tasted as good or better than a burger would you eat it i would i mean if it had good flavoring yeah
yeah it tasted as good or better well the thing is as well is just the bias that we hold like
anthropods for example like you look at a scorpion you're like i'm not gonna eat that you look at it. The thing is as well is just the bias that we hold. Like,
anthropods,
for example,
like,
you look at a scorpion,
you're like,
I'm not going to eat that.
You look at a spider,
like,
absolutely not.
But then you look at the sea anthropods,
and you're like,
a little lobster,
a little shrimp.
It all depends on the seasoning.
I ate all of what you just said,
basically,
in Thailand when I was there,
and it was delicious. It just depends on how Thailand when I was there, and it was delicious.
It just depends on how much salt you put there and what seasoning.
We actually had a retreat for LDA in Thailand last year,
and like six of us ate huge scorpions.
Scorpions?
Yeah, like big ones. Big, crunchy scorpions. That big ones big crunchy scorpions that's bad vibes i'm glad me an aztec never went like like big enough that you could barely fit one of them in your mouth like
they were one of them was huge the one i ate was massive i didn't even know you could eat
scorpions man it was not it was delicious, I'll tell you that.
Interesting.
I also think it's interesting that you brought up the hamburgers made out of cloppers.
Hang on.
Hang on.
I actually... No, last time.
Go ahead.
What's up?
Sorry.
I was just like, can anybody hear Dash speaking?
No. Can you hear me at all? Yep. You're there.'re there not at all yep yeah volume is just a little bit low uh joe but okay well yeah you can't hear
me i've been literally the first 17 minutes of this just struggling trying to be heard
of being a semi-white male out there in this deiI world. I've just seen you pop up barely right now.
I was looking at this screen, and now you just barely popped up.
This has been the most glitchy space in all of 130 episodes,
but it's amazing to hear your voice now.
I can hear you.
Well, thanks.
And if you want to be glitchier, make sure that Nicole hosts,
because then it's always going to just crash.
Yeah, it's Rug City.
Rug City, I love it. Do you start on a laptop that might be the issue i have to because if i'm hosting the dash space
then i have to i have to use the laptop because i'm a delegate yeah has anyone else noticed that
Anyone else noticed that since Rock went to that conference and spoke to the head of the
SEC and stuff, he's been pushing some weird stuff, he's been pushing CBDCs, he's trying
to get the World Economic Forum stuff, he's trying to get us to eat burger bugs.
Yeah, I pointed that out to the week of man i was like rock came back
to bed no i just you know like sometimes people's opinions changed i'm not i have not been co-opted
mm-hmm i heard white river rafting with people and different things out there
I can't talk about. I am supposed to go
meet Howard Lutnick from Canter Fitzgerald
next month, but
no, I'm not.
They haven't gotten to me, don't worry.
That's what you would say
if they had gotten to you.
That's what they told you to say.
Yeah, the whole panel over here over here bro is kind of sus
good times good times but rock you know i i basically passed the mic over to you
to introduce yourself and you just said you like turtles and started talking about eating
animals and let's redo this.
Please tell everybody and you will eat
bugs. Someone's going to make a
meme coin about turtles
now. Like eat turtles.
I think
Rockwax is talking about memes.
How about the what rock can fit
in his mouth coin?
What's that?
What about the what rock can fit in his mouth coin? Because's that? What's that? Joe? What about the what rock can fit in his mouth coin?
Because I heard that one.
I was like, did you really just say that?
I think that oh, nothing and be happy is not a terrible concept, by the way.
They got me boys.
I mean, just like I don't own a car.
And I'd rather enjoy it.
I like Ubering.
And as soon as it'll be Uber self-driving, I enjoy that.
I mean, eventually it'll be jetpacks.
that that is what i'm waiting for man yeah actually for the first time yesterday just
That is what I'm waiting for, man.
seen a walmart drone fly over while i was driving it's like i i'd never seen one and i i for a
second was like i think that's an alien or something but it was just uh either an amazon
or walmart drone is it which one is it is it like a normal drone or is
it the one that had called like tether or something where it drops down a rope
oh i didn't see it delivering a package but uh pretty beautiful size yeah no pretty big like
you know those little gray drones that everyone owns are in like, you know, all the,
you know, like in Best Buy shops, it's like this drone was probably 20 times that size
and it had a package underneath it. It was white and blue. So I think it's a Walmart.
As they're just driving along,, maybe Arizona, maybe Ukraine.
Yeah, I was like,
I don't know about this, man.
By the way, Ivan, I think you've tried to speak a few
times. Your volume is at like 30%.
Yeah, you can hear me?
Can you hear me?
Yeah, it's like 30% though.
I debisted him
after he talked about in Turtles.
Is this changing something no no no sounds like you're not near your mic or something maybe I'm super I'm like
sounds like you're in the other room shouting through the door there we go next there we go. Next to it. God damn it. There we go. What did you do?
Did you come in this room?
No, I just started
shouting suddenly.
I think I'm going to continue
speaking like this and everybody can
hear me.
The kids are off to
do musical school so I can
keep shouting. It's fine.
He's going to lose his voice in the
first hour. Shout louder.
I get the same
thing with you, Rock, by the way.
I hear like you're
way, way far from your
mic. I don't know if you guys can hear
me clearly. I can hear everybody else clearly.
I mean, Rock is at like
60, 65 percent but yeah you
you were down in the theories until you started showing us i'll fix it it's
we're we're like 22 minutes in guys uh let's introduce everything we did two intros
uh we did like we i don't know does rocks for? One and a half. We'll call it one and a half.
One and a half.
Okay.
All right.
Let's pass the mic on over to Ivan.
Yeah.
So, guys, Ivan, I'm marketing at Doge Chain.
For a lot of people, I don't know who and what Doge chain is, it's a layer
layer 2 for Doge
which is the first layer 2 for Doge and it's
It's a way to give more utility to the OG meme coin
Get it trading on taxes, get some
and get some more utility through,
more utility through
like you can trade DRC20s as well,
which are dogenal NFTs,
a bunch of stuff that you can do on the chain,
and we're prepping some cool launchpads.
Some core contributors actually are working on some launchpads
that we'll be launching early next month, I think, to make sure of the timeline.
So, you know, people can actually launch meme points with bonding them with Doge,
graduating them with Doge. It gives like a more meme narrative to the meme creation like from the front and stuff like that
but you do it with not like an institutional point like Solana or something like that
instead with Doge. So yeah we're here we we're still around and uh after three and a half years i think uh
penny i don't know if he's in the in the room here just uh with the the check yeah
we've been live for three and a half years uh august uh 2000
two and a half years not great so we're still much love to our friendly doge friends
um thanks ivan and great to have you here of course it's uh i think we've merged spaces a
couple times in the past and uh always great conversation i'll go ahead and pass the mic on over to Joel. What's up, bro?
Hey, how's it going, everyone? Thanks for having me today. This is Joel, business development
and marketing for Dash, which is a fantastic digital currency focused on being the best
payments and money system in the world, and also focused on hosting the most fire spaces that
are not called the aggregated in the world.
So yesterday, which is Thursday at 1 p.m. Eastern or 5 p.m. UTC, as is our weekly time slot.
We had one on meme coins.
Are they all a scam or not?
And there we go.
This is sort of the continuation.
We went a good three and a half hours on that.
It was awesome.
Set it all up.
It was a great space. Well, thank you. She's totally not paid hours on that. It was awesome. It was a great space.
Well, thank you.
She's totally not paid to say that.
Right, yeah.
Good times.
And much love, Joelle.
This is someone
you want to follow.
Joelle makes you think
and he has awesome points
and you all should follow
the Dash
handle that's right here on this
panel
Much love though
I'm going to go ahead and pass the mic on over to Luke
Yeah, hi
I'm just here because Darren told me
it will be a MieCoin mania
not MemeCoin
so he lured me in and said we speak speak about media all day, but, uh,
apparently we speak about meme coins. No, just kidding.
I'm the marketing and BD for medieval empires. And, uh, yeah,
Darren forces me to come here. So he plays Fortnite with me today, most likely.
Otherwise, uh, he wouldn't do that.
Good times. We love when you're here, Luke.
And can confirm. There we Luke. Can't confirm.
You can't confirm.
Okay.
Well, I love playing Fortnite with you guys.
I just haven't played in, like, months.
I think there was a time when I was, like, almost dying
and just trying to keep up with my –
just things I had to do for work and everything
and missed a bunch of...
Aztec, you're not allowed to play video games.
Yeah.
You're only allowed, all you're allowed to do
from when you wake up, you get,
we've allotted Aztec four hours of sleep a night
and he gets...
That's what almost killed me.
He gets three,
five minute breaks a day and he gets one time to stop and eat.
If he otherwise eats,
he has to be working while he eats.
But,
but we speak about crypto the whole time we play 90% of the time we speak
about the market and everything.
So it's basically work that we're doing.
Oh man. So you guys are doing voice comms when you play? Yeah. time we speak about the market and everything so it's basically work that we're doing oh man
you guys are doing voice uh comms when you play yeah yeah yeah they've done that since
that's when i stopped gaming and when i was playing everquest so that makes sense
well brockman there's meetings that darren's that Darren's being a little distracted while you're
in them? Yeah, he's
playing Fortnite.
It's kind of like
good to hear your voice, Caleb, but that's
kind of like SBF playing
what was
one of my favorite games? What was it called?
I think it was League of Legends.
I mean, to give a look a plug,
it is really easy to play Medieval Empire.
I've known Darren for years.
I can confirm.
There you go.
If you guys want to...
Who said that?
The crypto-cock coin.
Oh, it's breaking up for me. I'm not sure if it's breaking up for anyone
else the the coin is breaking up guys is it me i think it might be you
oh no who's breaking up i'm not hearing
Who's breaking up?
I'm not hearing anything.
The cock is breaking?
What?
The cock is breaking.
Yeah.
Sorry, guys.
I couldn't hear anything for a second there.
I don't know what's going on.
But all right.
Much love, Lug.
I'd love to join again at some point.
We won't tell Rock.
It'll be our little secret.
Dude, let's play the league.
He's in the group as well, by the way.
No, I don't believe...
What'd you say?
I said he's in the group as well where we
coordinate when we play Fortnite, but
we'll find a way on how
to mute him then.
I actually made that group as a joke
to convince Luke to let me stay
at his house because I wanted to go to Berlin for a night out.
It's actually a very active group.
I'm always, like, catching up with random things.
Wish I had time to play more.
But, yeah, and then Rock says,
let's play League of Legends and never plays.
Like, I think it's been over five years.
It's literally been five years, man,
of you saying, let's play League of Legends, bro.
We'll play for
sure this weekend and then they never show up man no i mean well we we just never have time but
good times um let's go to pass the mic on over to nerd girl hey guys i don't want to take very long. I'm NerdGirl007. I have three crypto jobs. One of them is working for LDA or working with LDA. I do like writing, public relations, podcast booking, and a little bit of strategy. I also help produce the Dash Space Crypto Quorum that Joelle was talking about. And I do bookings for Paul Barron.
And icebreaker question, would you eat bugs if the burger tasted as good as a regular burger?
Probably, yeah.
He is absolutely a world economic forum plant.
He's trying to squeeze in his WF Paul just pushing the agenda
All right, what should I talk about next show Tom about the CBDCs, okay
That was never that was just a joke. Sorry, sorry.
Prank caller.
That was like some world leader or like overlord.
That was Charles Klaus.
Oh, no.
Oh, no, no, no, no.
All right, let's pass the mic on over to Cameca team.
Welcome to the show. Hi, guys guys uh it's pleasure to hear you it was a huge
challenge to join the space i was cut it off like two times but yeah finally i'm here i'm sir hi
with from cameca team we are initially started as a part of solana super team but now we are pushing
web3 in ukraine generally and supporting startups, distributing grants, running acceleration programs, events, and so much more.
And at the very beginning, I was thinking I will be like an imposter from Solana on the EVM space.
But I'm really happy to see Dogein.
It was my guilt pleasure playing for two years.
for two years, I still have a huge bags of Dotsuki and other runes.
I still have huge bags of Dotsuki and other runes.
And yeah, just happy to be here and discuss some meme coins, many of you.
He's from Solana guides.
Let's get them now.
I'm joking.
Well, he's up, but he's also from Doze chain.
So we're going to give him a pass.
Just kidding.
Just kidding.
Hey, I think it's pretty cool that you were with Super Teams initially.
That's really interesting.
We should, yeah, I'd love to connect with you at some point in the future,
but great to have you here.
Welcome to the show.
And we have four more people to introduce, guys,
and we're about 33 minutes in.
This is probably the most ADHD we've ever had.
We're actually ahead of schedule.
Are we?
I don't think so, man.
We're ahead of schedule for the standard that we have set.
But by the way, we are a little alpha.
We are building some super team style stuff to the Polygon Grants program.
But that's some alpha alpha we'll talk about that
another time true true all right two cent timmy what's up bro gm how is everyone's friday and i
feel like uh because it's meme coin mania this is like the perfect i't know, it's on point to be a super ADHD.
If that's what meme coins are.
No, I work on the Polygon marketing team.
I don't know.
Recently, I would say I started to, what I would say, like, quote unquote, get meme coins.
I came in to the space through Dogecoin.
I thought it was like, after, after i don't know losing on meme coins
i thought they were stupid and like seeing them as financial aspects but i think i like finally
get the uh the community element to meme coins where it's like you laugh and then other people
laugh at a certain joke and then you're able to build friends and that's like really fun with
meme coins so i don't think it should yeah i don't think it should be 100% of your portfolio,
but like, yeah, if you want to have fun and connect people
and like use it as a social channel,
like meme coins are amazing for that.
Yeah, first you laugh, then you cry,
and then you buy Bitcoin.
Exactly, and then you buy whatever harry potter sonic inu bonk whatever shit like with the bitcoin ticker but it's not actually bitcoin or or you you buy doge uh and then it does 1000x like
it does every cycle and then you just go laughing all the way to the bank
so you know what we someone one of our executives at lda was looking at some stats and this can't
be true but he said doge and i think it was xrp are the only coins to ever uh outperform
bitcoin after their all-time high or something What was the exact stat Aztec?
Do you remember what he said?
Well,
I don't know this stat.
Yeah.
I'll have to find that.
But that's,
that's it.
That's interesting.
Hey guys,
super ADD.
Is it safe for,
there's a cat in my backyard,
uh, drinking out of our pool. Is that safe?... There's a cat in my backyard drinking out of our pool.
Is that safe?
Should I tell that cat to stop?
Or should I eat it?
You should tell it to stop, but it's not going to die from that.
If you go behind it and make it jump, it'll probably jump in the pool.
Make it eat some bugs.
Someone from PETA is going to ban this show, man.
We were talking about eating animals in the beginning.
Then now we're talking about eating a cat.
You know, I've actually, it isn't going to sound good,
but I've had to contend with PETA in the past.
Brock, you set that up like you were about to say you were about to,
you've eaten a cat.
No, no. I was like, where is this going? we were rock you set that up like you're about to say you were about to you've eaten a cat no no i would never scorpions now cats no we um no we were doing the first rule
the first rule of meme coin holder if it's cute you can eat it so there you go now we were doing
uh surgeries i can talk about it now because it's been so long but yeah we were doing surgeries. I can talk about it now because it's been so long,
but yeah, we were doing surgeries on animals, testing out a cancer removal technique
called the nano knife. And PETA was not happy about it. I mean, my argument is like,
we're saving human lives. If some pigs or rats, et cetera, in in the process of the testing i think that's probably
better than us trying it on humans and them dying but that's just my opinion i'll post a picture in
the comments either way they all taste like chicken including meme coin traders
do meme coin traders taste like chicken?
According to the KFC...
The real questions of our time.
Yeah, well, there was that KFC commercial,
and I think that maybe the person that walked into that lake
was a meme coin trader.
I don't know if you guys seen it.
He basically walked into a lake, and they pulled him out in the KFC commercial,
and he was a chicken nugget.
My big question is, did he have any cock?
Any cock points?
All right, we're back off track again, guys.
Are you going to do this?
I wanted to say for after after two cent timmy was
much love to polygon everything they do to uh help us with the show and um and the quick swap
and lda and everyone but uh much love to two centimeters instrumental and making this show
happen every week so thanks for being here and uh can't wait to break your brain
as well i'll pass the mic on over to defy granddad yeah hello hello everyone as always appreciate to
be here it's actually probably the greatest space i've ever attended um I'm a product manager and gross hacker for the last six years building products in Web3.
And today I'm on the help of Protifier.
We are one of the biggest development DAOs existing in the space,
building different great products from multi-sig wallets to different DeFi solutions,
quite complex ones like derivative ecosystems.
And we have a really nice relationship with QuickSwap.
That's probably the most used quote from my site,
usually when we join in the aggregated,
because Rock knows our team very well,
as well as the whole QuickSwap team
is having a really great relationship with us.
So thank you for having me here today
definitely much love and you guys are also at LDA we're incubating StratX
and you guys are the backbone behind that as well so you guys are crushing it
you guys are an awesome team great to to have you guys here. Yeah, one of the greatest dev entities in the industry, like hands down.
And we love you as well. Like QuickSop team and LDA team, actually one of the greatest we had so far in our partners. Like, honestly, your qualification is really good.
And answering on the question from Rock,
yes, I would eat the burger with Bucks.
Nice.
So that's one yes for the World Econonic Forum polling
that you're doing there, Rock.
Nicole said yes too, so we're two for two.
Oh, two.
Two for two. All right. All right. This. Nicole said yes, too. So we're two for two. Oh, two. Two for two.
All right.
All right.
This isn't looking good, guys.
All right.
We Crypto Cock,
we introduced you at the very beginning.
So let's pass the mic on over to Caleb.
Good to see you again, man.
Yo, what up everybody
darren said y'all were gonna be a little lifeless so i needed to come and spice things up
no um i'm caleb i'm one of the i'm gonna go say i'm here to make take notes so i can sue
lda for copyright infringement i meanCoin Media. I've hosted,
with the aggregated, much love in the past MeanCoin Media show, where I, at the time,
I was the face of one of the more popular MeanCoins on Polygon, which was Goon. Still
in that, still have a core group. It's kind of quieted down a little bit uh to say the least might have
something to do well we won't get into politics but uh yeah love meme coins love polygons love
lda love the aggregated let's talk and crickets are no rock you're you're hanging around the wrong
crowd buddy good times man great to have you here great to hear your voice again You're hanging around the wrong crowd, buddy.
Good times, man.
Great to have you here.
Great to hear your voice again.
I actually asked Darren if you were going to lead this conversation,
but I think you declined.
He asked me to do the show. I said, hey, hello.
Yeah.
Yeah.
This is a...
I asked him
and all I heard was
so presumably
they got to Darren too
he was eating burgers
no I have it on good authority
that Darren
has not been taken by the
WEF yet.
It's just Rock.
And maybe
Nicole.
Yeah, Nicole
can be sucked sometimes.
I don't know. I feel like you're passing the blame
to deflect attention for who's
involved with WEF.
And if Rock is involved, I don't know.
Is Aztec involved?
That seems like a reasonable theory.
Yeah, I'm probably the least...
Aztec was trying really hard to mess with themselves.
Yeah, I've not spoke to Rock since Monday.
I'm the most anarchist dude on the team, so...
What?
That's never going to happen.
What?
I don't know if Anarchy has anything to do with eating cricket birds or Aztec.
Cypherpunk.
Cypherpunk.
But yeah.
Yeah, I'm not into any of that stuff. I mean, I have been relatively supportive of BlackRock buying buying bitcoin and things uh so maybe i am
maybe they have gotten to me but my my thing here and actually uh joel is it just starting to hit
you bro we you know sometimes you know you get a little older and you you just you know
he looks at the guy in his cold wallet and maybe it's not so bad to be part of the Illuminati.
No, but...
There you go, guys. There you go.
What's that?
Emphasis on the naughty.
But actually, Joel, we were both just commenting on a post by Peter McCormick about bitcoiners losing the fight in them and uh
and how like you know we're cheering for banks and governments and black rocks to to buy yeah i mean
that like that meme of like shooting the dude and then why would someone do this is like so
applicable to so many people in the Bitcoin space.
I see so many laments from people saying like,
it used to be a freedom.
It used to be about sovereignty used to be about this.
And I'm like,
you were literally the one who did this.
Like you're one of the key people who was pushing it to war.
Peter NGU.
Nonsense.
Yeah.
Also,
I mean,
listen, I, I mean, listen,
I'm going to be nice to Peter because he seems to be in almost all the right places
in terms of like,
he's not like a big government lover anymore.
And he seems to be kind of backing away
from like the maxi stuff a little bit.
He seems to be more aligned,
but I have beef with them
because there was at one point,
it's something like 2018 or so um there was a dash team on the ground in venezuela and the caracas area that
painstakingly onboarded over 3 000 mom and pop merchants in the general caracas area when we
have tons of video evidence proof of all this this, you know, archive and stuff.
And we got CoinDesk headlines, stuff like that from like, oh, Dash is big in Venezuela.
Got so big that Venezuela's first CBDC was a fork of Dash.
And they forgot to change the smallest denomination from Duff after Dash's founder, Evan Dufffield.
Like this is tons of stuff.
And he was like, no, nothing's happening.
He flew to the border of Venezuela.
And then he says, I asked a couple people
and they said they didn't hear about Dash.
So therefore the whole thing's a scam.
And I'm just like, you motherfucker.
The amount of fake news bullshit
that this dude was doing, live it.
And of course there's tons of people roasting him from back in the day.
Then he personally
insulted me saying that I
looked older than him, which I
think is just adorable because it's clearly not
true. But anyway, so
plenty of beef from back in the day. But I like
where he is now. I think he's getting...
I'm willing to forgive it all.
I like Peter. I think he's like
Peter now?
Peter McCormick.
Yeah.
Okay.
I like Peter Schiff, too.
I mean,
I just don't like his cadence
when Ollie talks.
It's like that.
Yeah. I think he's like reasonably
i like people who can see both sides of any any issue like you know whether it's left versus right
or bitcoin versus other things like he was one of the first people to kind of move the overton
window on bitcoiners accepting other things.
You know, like to me, the first thing that Bitcoiners kind of accepted or some did was Monero.
And that was, you know, in the 20, like whatever, 14 through 17 era that they would kind of accept Monero.
And then he was one of the first Bitcoin maxis that said you know maybe there is a use
for stable coins i often reference him as like being one of the people that shifted the bitcoin
or kind of being open-minded to these things and then i think that helped lead to why people
started accepting ruins and ordinals and bitcoin defy and all this so i generally like peter mccormick
but uh he didn but he didn't
say that I look old
you know what I think from here
since we got everyone introduced
we should just carry
the conversation
that was going on on Dash
Nerd Girl, Joelle where did you guys leave off
uh it's difficult i mean we we went into several tangential rabbit holes but let's see what are
some of the main points that we ended up talking it's something we've talked about on this show
before too why do we classify meme coins as all scams when, you know, when we look back at different times and even at today, there are coins, you know, projects that claim they're going to do something and never deliver on their promises.
If you're buying a meme coin, at least you understand that you're buying it as a meme, not because you think that it's going to somehow change the world.
And in that way, I think that meme coins are, you know, more fair than a lot of the things that come out.
We also talked about insider involvement with meme coins and, you know, like rugs happen in
seconds or minutes, you know, and that we need to become self-regulating
so that the government doesn't step in and try to regulate it.
We talked about memes as an inspiration for meme coins becoming something more,
becoming something like community coins instead,
where it's like they develop utility over time,
like Doge specifically we
talked about um as something that has absolutely evolved into more than a meme coin conspiracies
with meme coins meme coins as casinos like you know people are just putting in small amounts
of money that they can afford that they can afford to lose um and so it's like you know
if we don't stop people from using casinos why should people be stopped from buying meme coins
and also maybe think of them more as fun and the money that you put in as entertainment money this
way some people do with uh like with you know football betting or sports betting right like you make a bet make the game more entertaining, not because you're trying to
get rich. It's just like pocket change or something like that.
What were some of the other major... Why don't we pause there?
Because that's a lot of topics. Anyone want to jump in on one of those?
I would like to say there's definitely... I'm not sure if this was
discussed yesterday on the show, but there's definitely, I'm not sure if this was discussed yesterday on the show,
but there's definitely a difference between the type of meme coins.
So there's,
there's cults,
there's a meme coins like doge,
which they're just,
they're really strong.
There's a,
so almost like a cult or maybe it does fall in the cult category category
uh you have like meme coins with utility where they're kind of sitting in this gray area of
having a meme kind of community but at the same time they actually have utility and then you have the casino coins that just drop on Solana and honestly just trade momentum and speculation.
And then usually like usually fizzle out immediately, like within, you know, immediate, immediate or, you know, the next 24 hours to 48 hours.
So there's like different types of meme coins i
i like doge and i like one one meme coin uh which is um squid grow but it's a it's a utility meme I'm not the most bullish on the casino meme coins.
But yeah, so there's just differences between types of meme coins.
Wondering if there's any other thoughts on this from you guys.
Well, Joel has his hand up.
But yeah, we did get into this creation of cults,
meme coins as religions, cryptocurrency as religions.
Joel, I know you want to say something.
Yeah, well, that was it.
I mean, surprisingly covered half of what I was going to say.
But basically, when people hear meme coins in 2025,
they think of the just like soul-destroying,
pump.fun kind of pipeline of just register something,
live stream something horrible and graphic,
and then pump and dump in like two seconds and just all that horrendous casino
stuff.
But then we're sort of trying to define like a community coin,
kind of like what Dogecoin was or is where it's people actually buy and you,
but not just buy and sell,
but send it to each other for fun,
for the memes,
for the love,
the community.
And I'm sure there's just so many other,
like a utility meme coin is like what I would say that the community version
plus some extra utility where Doge also turned into this.
Doge is,
it's funny because Doge has sort of been all of these things,
right?
Doge started out
as the community meme coin where it's just fun and people sent it around and traded and then it
became the utility meme coin because while it was still that it also was a cross-chain exchange
arbitrage tool for many years because it had fast block times and low fees people actually used it
to send,
if they wanted to take advantage of an arbitrage opportunity,
they'd sell all their Bitcoin for Doge,
send to a different exchange, and then they'd rebuy the Bitcoin on that at a better price.
And so that was like the utility meme coin segment.
And then the degen part started with the Musk era,
which funny enough, as people mentioned in the space, after the Musk era, when Doge skyrocketed to where it is today, they haven't seen Doge memes that much since then.
Like in all the channels or on X or whatever, no one's doing straight up raw dog Doge memes.
straight up raw dog doge memes everything's something else and uh also it killed the utility
Everything's something else.
case as well where because of the price the the fees were i think it was like one doge per
transaction or something like that and it was sort of hard-coded in and so when the price
spiked it became super expensive to use and um one of uh the more more active of dash's master node holders um he goes by age of doge
because he was a big doge guy he actually has been using doge since doge was created just like
on and off and he said that it's a nightmare to use today because like the wallets aren't maintained
the infra sucks like can you know things crash all the time the fees are expensive and it's kind of crazy so like
dogecoin is you know the it's like the eldest child goes through all the stuff before anyone
else does takes all the arrows in the back um that's kind of what dogecoin did is it it it
life cycled uh it kind of i wouldn't say speed ran because it wasn't it wasn't speed but it life cycled all three use cases of the
general meme umbrella well that gives uh i know it's unfortunate everything you said but
that's the product market fit for coaching it makes you know you can use like uh
like wallets that are regularly updated like Ravi for wrap doge and you know
transfer it very easily from one person to another pay not cents but micro cents
on the dollar I think that the current average fee on those chains is 0.01
doge meaning like a fraction of a cent.
So, yeah, that's why scaling projects like Dogechain exist.
Because it is understandable, you know, it kind of fell off.
Yuan also lost a little bit of his oomph regarding Dogecoin.
He kind of put it on the side after 2021, never actually really talked about it, except
when he created the Doge government agency, but that was completely unrelated one with
the other. The point that I'm making is that Dogechain is there for them.
Dogechain improves the user experience and allows people to use Doge in and out, cheaply, fast,
without any friction with the Doge wallets that that can be kind
of problematic yeah I agree I think innovation is always important crypto
cock you don't have to raise your hand just jump right in I forgot to say that
at the beginning of this show yeah sorry i have a
tendency to cut people off when they're like mid-sentence saying something very important
speaking of cutting people off mid-sentence crypto cock i'm going to cut you off mid-sentence and
just say i have a work call in like two minutes so i'm going to jump off and do that but i'm
probably going to be back so just give everyone a heads up now please start speaking again so i
may cut you off again okay you got to come back joelle we got we want to flesh out the things that were
talked about on your show uh but yeah see you soon um but yeah so so as tech and dash actually
covered it really well and i just wanted to talk from like a meme coin perspective someone has
launched a meme coin and is running it on a daily basis
putting 20 hours a day into this without a day off um you know it's like you you have to put
different meme coins and it needs to start getting to a point where you're putting them in different
categories like they've just done you know you can't just look at a meme coin and go that's a
joke that's a rug you know because when you have
like a coin like mine where yeah I mean we look like a joke yeah like I I put a lot of marketing
into this like before a lot of market research like weeks of it to figure out exactly what I
wanted to do with the products that we're going to be building um so to say like like every coin is just a joke and a rug it just i think some projects it's like
they can go up and do a one hour pitch where they say exactly what they're building they're not just
a meme coin they're actually putting time and effort behind it with utility and giving back
to the communities and the holders and then at the end of that space or that pitch,
they'll get, oh, yeah, if you want to hold this amazing DeFi project,
then buy them.
But if you want something fun and for the community,
buy CryptoCockcoin.
You know, there's nothing worse uh people just generalizing your your projects and not
actually listening to you know what you're saying and what you're putting out and not
doing the research because they just think it's just another shit coin
yeah definitely there's differences between different projects. And I don't know if you can even call Casino Coins projects.
They're literally just memes.
Let me jump in here.
Follow that up.
CryptoCotCoin.
Okay, so you just said that your project is not just memes, right?
So how would you describe CryptoCotCoin?
Sell me it not as a meme coin because it's called
crypto cock coin yeah i mean the the the meme side of it we are crypto cock coin so uh yeah we
we look like a joke uh the the posts i put out i wouldn't really say they're a joke you know i
don't really do much shit posting or anything um but you know we're we're in the back we don't like to do what
most projects do where they'll announce something work on it a year and then either run out of money
and run away without even a word or you know just just not put anything out and say oh it's going to
be another year um you know so so that's that one side of it where we're a meme coin.
We know what we're building,
but we like to build it, drop it, and then announce.
So define building for me, because you keep saying building.
Tell the audience what building is.
So built, at the moment,
our first mini app that we'll be developing for Farcaster is a raffle-based app where you can play it all day.
You want to play it as much as you want.
And if you're at the top of that leaderboard at the end of the day, the link that you put in to that app, everyone will be redirected to that as soon as they rejoin the app um so you know when you
look at it from an onboard onboarding uh position or if you look at it from you're just a project or
an influencer or someone like wanting to show your art or whatever you're you're getting um
so many more eyes on your product.
So that's one thing that we're doing
and what we've announced after.
You sound like a meme coin, a meme utility coin.
Yeah.
That's almost, I would say we are a meme utility coin.
You got to drive you there.
You know, I know we're gonna be,
I can't say much about the next mini app we're releasing,
but it's going to be the same sort of aspect where we're bringing eyes to your projects
or, you know, like a project discovery kind of experience.
And on top of that, you know, the long term we are preparing defy products
um because you know my developer is a serious developer is a seasoned defy builder so um it's
like we are building for the long term and we do bring that across in most spaces that we join
uh we just don't like to show what what we're doing because i just don't think
any project should do that unless you've got one thing that you're concentrating on
good times man i mean you you did get to speak about it here so that's that's cool man i'm glad
you had some time to talk about the project i actually have a hard stop uh usually the show
goes to about uh two to three hours i have a hard stop today in the first hour.
But before I jump off, I wanted to,
so it's not going to kind of push this hard stop back just a bit.
I want to introduce or say that Imagine AIs here.
Also, Kay Irwin, Matthew have joined us.
So much love to all of you guys.
Jump in, you know, throw an elbow in.
It's all good and uh before i go i'm wondering if anyone knows what miko was doing on pump.fun the other day i i watched it for
like 20 seconds it looked really trashy and i just stopped watching it but uh what there seemed to be a lot of uh conversation around some stream she was doing and
I just wondered if anyone knows what that was about I don't yeah GM all I don don't. I saw that PumpFun brought back streaming and I've just kind of been avoiding it since then.
I will never go back to PumpFun. After what happened last time, no way.
Speaking of eating cats.
What happened last time?
Do you not remember what happened uh last time and it was basically just people dropping coins
and saying get this to one mil and i'll shit on myself or um they're locked in a cage and
you know getting whipped by someone it was just absolutely nasty and that's why they stopped it right because like those are the mild ones like i thought it
was so i saw stuff like that and yeah i'll be honest i thought what was it bro i thought that
stuff was funny but then it started turning to like i just remember one stream where it was a
couple essentially beating their kid if they got bids and that was when the lk the sec and obviously
you know the police in general are going to be coming down on this like a ton of bricks
uh neither of which happened wasn't there one where the the young kid he was like 11 or something he
his mom was doing it with him and it was like if it got to a certain price his mom would show her tits and I think she might have
yeah and man
like that one was awkward as shit
because like the kid
was like staring at her tits
and she was like brushing up against him
and it was real like
yeah it was real like last
days of Rome kind of shit
it was fucking awful
did the coin pop?
I don't think it even did.
They just did it anyway.
Everyone was too busy watching.
What some people do for money.
One guy was just playing
Russian roulette and then lost.
Wait, really?
Yeah, isn't that the reason that they turned the video
portion of pump fun off yeah like that week yeah yeah I wasn't gonna mention
that but yeah there was there was one where they were saying something like if
if it doesn't pump or if it pumps or whatever i'm gonna like keep beating my dog or something
yeah but i i think we need to recognize that this is just the world in the internet right they were given a platform from pump fun but these people still existed
far before pump fun ever came around so it's just it's so they were on 4chan yeah yeah wherever yeah i'm with you there like
pump fun created a platform right and then people did what they did with it so i have no idea to
what degree pump phone is complicit in all of this but like i don't know
i think that that pump.fun found a way to monetize degeneracy.
And they did a really great job.
That's similar to like what's going down with Pornhub the past five years.
Right.
And so Pornhub has been massively investigated over the past four years since
2020,
and they've taken down 85% of their content because they,
it was found that they had one person
uh that was actually vetting uh content to see if it was like you know rape or incest or crazy child
stuff happening and even if you create a platform um you know it doesn't you know separate you from
a platform, you know, it doesn't, you know, separate you from the actual regulation of
some of the more serious aspects of what's occurring, just like Elon Musk has X here.
And freedom of speech is super important, obviously, to daddy, to daddy Elon. But the
thing is, is not everything gets through, right? So it's like, absolutely essential that, you know, we don't look so far, like, I know we got some libertarians there, and I don't really like align with anything in specific, I would say I'm more libertarian than anything, but I'm really, you know, just try to not align with any of that.
not align with any of that but basically like you still have to have some checks and balances because
like that's a perfect example of them being like content is king there's one organization that
owns all of the porn industry and so it's like i'm just making that as an example you have to have
like some checks and balances there so that like children and people and women and others are not
being like you know um abused or monetized or whatever.
Cause these people are literally putting out content that's completely illegal and
disgusting and monetizing it. Cause there is absolutely filthy people in the world.
Right. Um, so yeah, you, you'd think you can just like, um, have, um, like algorithm,
algorithmic moderation and like people just reporting videos like if enough people report
that a pump fun video or an x video or a porn hub video is you know causing harm to someone
well what they were actually doing is their their their standards this is why policing is needed to
some degree is with porn hub their standards was 14 reported videos. Reports would actually then bring it into
the one person that would be looking at it. And then they would be backed up by 10,000 videos
because they only had one person. So the policing needed to happen where they needed 50 or a hundred
people actually vetting videos and 14 misdemeanors on a video or reports, there were some videos that they actually found.
This is crazy.
That were like clearly underage children,
trafficked like human beings that had,
that sat for three or four years with 13 reports
and didn't make it to 14 reports.
Right.
Wow.
So yeah,
this is horrible.
That was like very horrific. I agree. And yeah. And like the parents, this is where some of the moderation knew, but couldn't find them. It was awful.
over the place i live in canada for the other half of here it's this massive weaponized thing
here gender but it's like there's some degree of like need to like uh curve absolutely demonic
debauchery in our world right and so where that them as an example if this is pump.fun we're
talking about they have to care enough to actually moderate to a point of you know of that where you like uh these porn sites blah blah
they didn't until they were held accountable and now they you know like 90 of their content was
taking down it was actually the biggest removal of content in all of history because they had
they were the in 20 in 2019 they were the second or third most visited website in the world
right um so it's you know if you let it go too astray,
then disgusting things will go astray as well too
because our world is disgusting.
Yeah, see, this is the one thing that I kind of, like,
so yeah, I would say that I have pretty libertarian standards.
But that comes down to, you know, adults,
like consenting adults should be allowed to do
whatever the fuck they want as long as nobody else is getting hurt.
So one of the things, you know, Imagine AI is very much of that mindset where we allow you to essentially make whatever you want with AI.
But we do have some safeguards in there.
Like we pride ourselves on being, you know, uncensored and freedom first.
But there's a lot of very simple stuff that we can do
to just make sure that we don't allow for essentially illegal content,
things like that.
One of them is child detection.
Like we have a secondary AI that runs across everything that gets generated
and it looks for, is there a child in this photo?
Now, child detection, as you know, was it generated by AI or is it a real child?
It's the exact same software
like it's very easy to detect children in photos or in videos stuff like that we just have that
running at all times to make sure you know before anything gets published is there anything in this
which you know looks like very illegal content this is stuff really that any platform can
integrate it's not expensive to run
like it's probably the cheapest part of our entire stack it adds about half a second to one second
to our calls which you know when you're looking at diffusion time or an upload time or what have you
of at least you know 20 seconds it's a you know a fractional increase less than you know it's like five percent of an
increase on workload on your hardware which yeah it does scale but for what you're actually
protecting against i think that's pretty important one issue that we are seeing now though is after
such panic over you know ai being able to oh sorry oh and i just have to say kudos to you, man, for doing that.
I think that's awesome that you deployed that type of protection for children.
And I have to roll.
Unfortunately, I usually don't hop off this early, but I'm passing my imaginary co-host
mic on over to Nerd Girl.
Much love, everyone.
Much love, Rock.
We're here every friday different topics
and we have awesome discussions like owen was just discussing so uh sorry owen for interrupting i
just have to go man yeah much love everyone great speaking with you dude but yeah um as i was saying
this type of stuff it does not take up much in you know hardware compute workload anything like
that it's easy to integrate.
But the problem we're seeing is that so many AI platforms are being used for,
you know, how do we call it?
Non-consensual content, stuff like that.
That payment processors, even though they are taking a step way too far to begin with,
even coming down on Steam for adult games and stuff like that,
AI platforms have become
absolutely toxic for them, that they just assume every time they see them that, oh yeah, well,
this platform is going to allow you to generate, you know, highly illegal content, things like that.
Even though we have all these protections in place and we have moderation panels, you know,
like I said, we're very much about no censorship freedom first but
no illegal shit it doesn't give us any leeway with a payment processor like right now if you look at
the payment processors that we're using they're awful it's nearly impossible to for like a regular
person to get their paid account on imagine ai it goes through like you have to it's a system where
you have to buy like solana with a credit card and then that goes over into like a payment system which is half working like we have a new
system that we're bringing online over the next couple of days but we were about one month without
you know real payment processing and essentially all premium usage completely stopped so the power
is kind of on these payment platforms now,
too much power on those platforms
to be able to shut things down.
So when you see stuff like big players,
like Pornhub and the likes,
that are able to have quite literally
trafficked children on there,
well, we sit here with saying,
well, we've actually developed an AI solution
that ensures that you can't even make imaginary fake children
in those situations
like it's very cabal like where you know Pornhub and OnlyFans the likes they get away with it
they just get a slap on the wrist and then you see you know people like ourselves who you know
want to have that freedom first approach and allow you to generate you know consenting content and so
on but we still get come down on and tired with the same brush because oh it's ai
like it's made it very difficult for any business that is either just directly in adult content
or like ourselves where about you know 90 of our content is safe for work that we still just get
slammed down on which is you know you look at pump fun the reason they're getting away with it is you
know there is no payment processor it is all going through you know it's look at PompFund, the reason they're getting away with it is, you know, there is no payment processor. It is all going through, you know, it's all on-chain transactions.
So it's created this really strange environment where if we want to essentially make sure that
we're able to bring in, you know, revenues and stuff like that, we have to nearly bring in payment
processing solutions that are on par with the likes of PompFund or platforms that, we have to nearly bring in payment processing solutions that are on par with
the likes of PumpFun or platforms that develop non-consenting content, things like that.
So I think that there's this rift being created where platforms like PumpFun are actually going
to get bigger because people are going to move to those on-chain payments because they don't like
the idea of being mothered by visa or mastercard
when it comes to stuff like you know i want to watch somebody shoot themselves it starts pushing
that boundary and then you've got people like us who are trying to you know say we want to allow
people to have freedom of expression freedom to create stuff like that but we want to stop
illegal content we get put in the same boat. And now for ourselves,
we found new processors, we're going to continue on as we are, we're not changing our methodology,
our mindset towards this stuff. There are other platforms that see that and say, well,
if you're going to lump me in with the people who allow you to create all this content,
maybe I'll allow my customers to create that content, because you're going to put the same
restrictions on me anyway.
So that kind of push, I think, is what's creating all of,
you know, these pump fun like platforms where it's like this nearly merger of dark web with clear web.
It's, yeah, it's strange.
And I think a lot of us, like the blame is being laid down
at Visa and MasterCard that you're now getting rid of this kind of,
you know, consenting adult
area, apart from your little cabals that you've got here and there, and you're tiring everybody
with this brush of no, that's not to our moral standards. So you go use the payment processors
that human traffickers are using, essentially. Can I add like just a tiny bit of context and
maybe a little bit of devil's advocate, but I feel pretty strongly about this one.
Just in reference as well, too, because like we were talking about a couple of weeks ago, like the balance between centralization and decentralization.
And I had brought up a comment about being a token 2049 last year and seeing Vitalik speak on the main stage and him you know publicly voicing that you know obviously coming
from being the creator of ethereum and being a massive you know uh um proponent for decentralization
um he had talked about the conversation around centralization and decentralization
needing to meet and find a happy middle ground for crypto to move forward as a whole
for democratized finance for decentralization as a whole needs to move forward as a whole, for democratized finance, for decentralization
as a whole needs to move forward because of parts of centralization and vice versa.
And so in this case, we talk about the moderation aspect of things.
And I have very strong morals and beliefs about what I feel is right and wrong.
A lot of that is based in God.
A lot of that's based in my own experience of different religions around the world or
spiritual practices or cultures, because I've traveled a lot and seen a lot of that's based in my own experience of different religions around the world or spiritual practices or cultures because i've traveled a lot and seen a lot of different
stuff and experienced a lot of stuff and have had a deep spiritual practice for about 15 years
so even though i think something is wrong which i don't think porn is great i don't think it's
great for men i think it's a suck of time and i think it's you know uh not not not a great thing
but that for me is just my opinion and people can do whatever they
want to do themselves as consenting adults i completely agree there but in the case of uh
these these payment systems with porn hub um the fact that the way that that 85 to 90 percent of
their content actually got taken down is because they went directly to the credit card companies
because these guys don't give a fuck about anything else other than money right obviously actually got taken down is because they went directly to the credit card companies because
these guys don't give a fuck about anything else other than money right obviously if they're
allowing for that type of like you know information videos pictures like the most vile disgusting
shit and i'm not just talking about some titties or people getting whatever you know it's it's
disgusting shit um they were like okay the only way we can actually moderate these guys is
by going directly to the credit card companies and holding them accountable for their payment systems
and that was the most centralized place that they could go to and hit them directly right so it's
really interesting when we have these conversations about moderation to the highest degrees um because
obviously censorship and centralization is wreaking havoc in many places around the world
and in many of our systems.
Obviously, the financial and monetary and currency systems in our world is ancient and very centralized
and is probably the number one thing I believe that is making things difficult for people in this world
and one of the deepest evils.
But that's kind of like a devil's advocate here because like in that case being able to
attack that vector allowed for you know 90 of the third most visited website in the world
uh to be taken down because it was not vetted or verified and was host to a lot of child
trafficking a lot of disgusting demonic shit right so it's like how do we how do we find the middle ground you know in
being able to be effective and efficient but then also not be corrupted by people's you know
obviously that pull the strings their desire to have power and control and those type of things
so it's very much like i don't like to see that you guys get put in the same lump or the the same
place but also you know when things get so loose to a degree where
anything like that can happen, it's something needs to step in. So I wanted to just bring that
up as like a kind of clear point around what happened there and kind of some of my beliefs
and ideas there, because I think it's kind of a little bit, uh, is a devil, a devil's advocate
thing. Um, but yeah, anyways, I appreciate the, the the the opportunity to speak yeah absolutely
yeah absolutely man and i completely agree and in my opinion when it was found that you know 85 to
90 percent of content on porn ho was related to trafficking or non-consensual etc they should have
been cut off like it should have just been straight, like no way. No, sorry.
85 to 90% was unverified.
So it wasn't actually, it doesn't, it doesn't, it didn't mean that it was all that type of content.
It meant it just wasn't looked through and wasn't verified if it was or not.
And the way they, I think, you know, verifies, I think they have to, I'm assuming they have to upload like KYC and they have to upload like
probably copies of the girl's IDs to show they're not.
At all.
What it actually was before the actual regulatory stuff came in and before
they attacked the credit card companies,
you know what the verification was to actually upload content it was a fucking email address that is it
that is it you had to put in an email address there was no age check there was nothing
their slogan was content yeah that's fucked up that's that's not yeah yeah i appreciate you um uh appreciate you uh clarifying
that i thought you were saying 85 to 90 percent was taken down because it was you know trafficking
and stuff like that which i was thinking wow that's a high number but yeah um but in cases
like that i think what we're seeing right now is that knee-jerk reaction that after discovering that
there was so much content on there now we have you know platforms like ourselves and let's be honest imagine ai compared
to the likes of porn hub we might as well be you know a couple of people in our basements
developing on things like we don't have that kind of resource we pretty much are you well
i know i've got um i've got a nice apartment so you know the basement though i do have
storage down there.
I was thinking of renting it out.
That's where he does the trafficking side of it.
No, I just sell it to students that are looking for, you know, college housing.
$3,000 a month.
But yeah, that's a nice thing.
Oh my God.
Traffics.
That's so funny you say that, bro.
I was literally thinking the same thing.
I was like, hmm, that's maybe a little bit too edgy to say and then you just came out and fucking busted it out that was hilarious
nothing too edgy for this guys i mean in the case of pump fun like they have so much fucking money
they have no excuse to not have better systems in place and yeah that's basically what i'm getting to if we can do it from our basement
yeah because tiktok i mean tiktok obviously takes it to the other extreme right where
they have um automation tools that are basically i'm pretty sure like ai tools that are looking at
every video as it's being uploaded and so like some videos will be censored before they're even published. Um,
which honestly, like, I think given how like honestly dark, um, and evil, a lot of people are,
I, I think that's just how the cookie has to crumble because you have to protect people for
the greater good. And, um, I think like, you know know this sort of philosophical idea of like ultimate hardcore
freedom no matter what at all costs like that's like a kind of a pipe dream because people haven't
earned that and like i don't know like people just have to be less shitty and i mean what we
saw with pump fun like apparently that that suicide was fake um by the way i know that was brought up earlier um someone wrote about
it and debunked that um it was fake but what you said suicide was fake yeah the pump fund suicide
there's an article saying a shock suicide pump fund prompted outrage and it was all fake um so anyway so yeah i mean twitch has to
deal with this all the time this like issue as well of live streaming and content moderation and
and what do they do how far do they go how how far do they need to moderate how much do they
need to moderate and it's like partly community driven moderation it's partly like automated but like in pump funds case like they have so much money they should be using top of
the line ai automation um it sounds like they i mean and they're basically a press release that
they put out when they shut down their platform previously, the live streaming component, they basically said that we will
improve our moderation and we will potentially bring it back when we do that. And so given some
of the recent streams, I don't know if that's the case. I don't know if people feel like the moderation has gotten better and that things are better. Um, but yeah, it's like, it's, it's
very dystopian to see the streaming platform and, um, some of the stuff that's, that was on it in
the past. Yeah, no, they just waited until people forgot about how bad it was. And now it's back up and it's essentially as bad.
Like, and yeah, that this is like the grand point that was eventually coming to us, our guys in our basements, that we can get all of this integrated.
We can still allow for full, basically, freedom of expression and uncensored content.
But we have AI that can very easily detect you know is there a child here
it's stuff like that this is stuff that can be like we can also detect say if there's an animal
in you know a photo that's uploaded now that's stuff that you know imagine ai that 90 of our
content if not more is safe for work so plenty of people make like you know cats and dogs videos and
stuff like that which are fine so we just have context detection on it. You know, is there an animal in this?
And are they asking for something that they shouldn't be asking for? But this is stuff
that we were able to set up with essentially a basement team compared to, I mean, PumpFun
probably make our yearly income within a few minutes every day. So there's really not any excuse for allowing that type of content on there
unless you want that kind of shock content to bring in more traffic well i'm sure that's part
of it right um that's exactly yeah and to some extent that that should be okay and then there's
a we have to figure out what the line in the sand is you know um someone yelling and doing weird stuff i mean like there's
some things like i don't know someone eating poop honestly i don't care if like i don't see that as
gonna hurt anyone just don't watch the video uh but if someone wants to eat poop to make money
and like pump their coin i i'm more of like a you know free speech and this is a weird one because
it's not just free speech it's this content i don't know it's it's hard but enrich rock tells
us that free speech is being allowed to eat your own poop on webcam for money yeah okay rock we we
we sort of do the line that you're telling people can we call poop shit, please, guys? Like, please. Someone clip it. Clip it.
All right, lightning round.
Okay, quick lightning round, everybody.
Should Pump Fun ban or take off someone for eating poop?
Two girls want that, though?
Shite.
Call it shite.
If you're doing that, whatever.
But for detection purposes...
Thumbs up, thumbs down on that. Okay, so it comes down... detection right thumbs up thumbs down on that okay so it
comes down thumbs up thumbs down it comes down to individuals i think more than anything that are
actually going to spearhead bringing these things to light uh because when it comes down to it okay
like the porn hub thing like this was one woman that fought child trafficking for years and years
and years and then she literally figured out a vector of how she could actually create more impact
in the world.
That was something important to her was through actually going to these credit card companies
and actually finding out exactly what was going on and how things were being moderated.
So with Pumped Up Fun, most of these conglomerates, they are so distant from the actual harm of
others because they're so swathed in power and money,
which many people do and many people get with their organizations. And they become very separate from the actual, you know, either positive or negative impact that it's creating. It takes
actual individuals to actually bring the metrics to light of how they are actually regulating or moderating content and and clips and different things
um because like you just said like someone just said oh they got in trouble for a little bit and
they had a little bit of bad press but because it's crypto and people don't give a fuck
five minutes later people were just like trying to you know gamble and get their get their bags again right and so it's really uh in many ways
it's a cultural thing um and yeah drawing the lines and then really actually making sure to
consistently draw the lines like and bring those topics back up and keep drawing the lines because
one day all of a sudden something can be inappropriate and then five years ten years
later it's like,
you know, now it's the new thing that everybody's talking about, even though there's a huge portion
of people that still don't agree with it. But now it's being, you know, it's okay to a certain
degree. So it's really interesting. So the question is, again, where do you draw the line?
And what is the Overton window? What is the acceptable discourse in society? So thumbs up or thumbs down from audience members, panelists, real quick.
Should PumpFun or any other, you know, internet content things,
should they eat a poll in the jumbo phone?
You got an eat poop poll?
I don't see it.
Brock's just trying to get a screen recording, y'all,
so he's not incriminated by himself.
No, he's taking this back to the...
He's taking this back to, what, Klaus Schwartz,
and he's like, look,
they're more than happy to eat bugs now.
I'm kind of convinced I'm to eat bugs.
Look, guys, I mean,
I don't even know if I ever watched it.
But I just... I think it's a dangerous
thing when we start censoring more and more and more on the internet i i you know when i first
started playing on the internet in the 90s i thought it was a cool magical place where like
you had kind of freedom and obviously bad things can come from
that obviously we don't want any child porn we don't want someone like shooting someone on a
freaking stream but but like what is the what is the acceptable level like or what or what even
more importantly legally what should a platform be responsible for if okay let's let's use an
easier one to you sometimes to make these examples you have to like progress it progress
it to get people to go well yeah i'd be okay with that would i'd be okay with this so would you guys
be okay with someone progressively eating hotter and hotter hot sauce to the point of like you know
like we've seen these shows like where they eat hot wings and that's okay and these people are
like torturing themselves with eating hot stuff right? And if you've ever eaten like really hot stuff, you can actually, I mean, it's pretty, it can be brutal.
I mean, I don't want to get my fraternity in trouble, but I mean, we would eat ghost peppers and shit,
and it was pretty intense, and it was one of my greatest memories. And it was like pretty brutal.
I mean, you know.
Your greatest memory is eating ghost peppers and shit.
No shit.
No shit.
But okay.
So is it okay to watch someone, if someone wanted to try to pump a coin, they ate hotter
and hotter and more and more hot stuff?
And I'm not saying is that cool or not?
Or should, you know, would you do this?
I'm saying should a platform like legally have to ban them or should they morally or ethically have to ban that?
Is that okay or not?
Thumbs up or thumbs down.
I think people will pay money.
I mean, they'll already pay money to see people suffer, like especially if they're launching meme coins.
Say again?
And it's like a pleasure. I think people,
some people are just happy to pay to see people.
I will tell you right now, every single person here.
Enjoy seeing people suffer to some extent. And I'll give you examples.
That depends what people know. It's everybody.
Are we talking about Schaffenfreude or like,
I'm talking about if someone steps
on, if someone steps on a rake and it goes up and hits them in the face, like in the Simpsons or
in any old, you know, comedy sketch, uh, people laugh. Why do you laugh at someone getting hit
in the head with a rake? I mean, I don't like that shit. Honestly, that, that stuff bothers me
at a certain level. Have you ever you ever okay have you ever laughed with
people's experiences have you ever laughed at someone like slipping and slipping on a youtube
have you ever laughed at any none of these there's nothing ever you could no i mean i find that shit
pretty juvenile i just think you can't like generalize how people respond to content and i
think like you can't really generalize how um platforms should moderate
you can't say like oh all streaming platforms need to do this and this and this I mean like
it comes down ultimately to like laws I think um in certain jurisdictions of like what is literally
fucking illegal and then it also comes down to branding and like brand
representation. And like, how do you want your brand to appear? Do you want your brand to be
known for this? Do you want your brand to be associated with this? And then secondly, you know,
if you're doing something in web two, you're catering to advertisers. So in crypto, you're
not catering to advertisers, right? Like all this
pump fund shit would have like been dead in the water immediately on the live streaming front if
they had real advertisers whatsoever, because the advertisers would be fucking disgusted.
And so like in crypto, there's kind of a different standard where it's like you have to sort of decide, you know, are you going to get potentially like unbanked from this?
Are you going to let your brand be associated with this?
Is this legal?
Is someone going to sue you?
For better or worse in this country, a lot of things ultimately come down to some lawsuit around shit setting a precedent for how platforms interpret things.
So I'm just not like a super big fan of like making blanket sort of statements on like what platforms should and shouldn't do.
But I think like crypto platforms and meme coin platforms and live streaming platforms obviously have different incentives and like compared to, you know, Twitch, which is owned by Amazon and which has, you know, Doritos as an advertiser and things like that.
Well, this is where the free market mostly should solve this is, you know, we have laws for things that we all are like a majority of people agree are wrong, right? Sex
trafficking, child porn, murdering someone on a video. There's laws about these things. Now,
then after the laws, now it becomes either a moral thing, a money thing, a whatever. And I think at
that point, it should be up to each platform to figure out, do we want to do this? Or is it a good business model for us? Is this
ethical to us? But if they're getting viewers, I mean, it shows that, and if they're getting
millions of viewers in cases, it shows that there's a lot of people out there who actually
want to watch that content. And I'm saying, what is the content that they should block or not?
Is it eating hot sauce, stepping on a rake, uh, eating poop. Uh, what is
the level? And I lean towards let, let the, let the free market decide, don't get the government
so involved in these decisions because it's a slippery slope. And then they start using it to
censor their political opponents and all kinds of things, uh, over time as you give them that power.
Um, but I, I think it's more of let the platform figure out if they're
going to do it or not. And if their owners or founders are happy with themselves with what
they're doing. That ties back to one of the things. That's what I was saying, redrawing the lines over
and over, right? Consistently having the conversation and being able to speak about it.
This has been something that's been coming up a lot recently about people policing others opinions or beliefs outside of the law consistently conversation has
to happen because consistently lines have to be drawn based off of what people think is appropriate
or not yeah but crypto also has a very unique problem i think where, and this is actually very prevalent recently, where
people have no problem doing a certain action, and then they, quote unquote, make it, and
then they turn around and become all moralistic.
And then they say, well, that, you know, people, you know, not to bring directly the event,
but a certain public figure died recently, and spawned up on PumpFun, right?
And I saw so many people condemning this happening.
But then people are very easily able to go back through their posts and find several years back where they did the exact same thing,
where they purchased the exact same coin, it was a different event, similar, right?
And it's like people get moralistic once they've
made it and so i think that it's i think rock's point that there's an audience for this thing
and then we also had the point where you can be libertarian but truth still exists there's still
such a thing as right and wrong and the problem everyone has is where to draw that line most
people don't like the fact that you know a third of Pump Fun is slowly on the streams.
It's becoming pornographic, right?
But those same people will tell you, well, but I don't think that someone should not have the right to have an OnlyFans.
We're very microcosmic in where we're okay with certain things and where we're not.
cosmic in where we're okay with certain things and where we're not. So I think Pump Fun just
brings out kind of this dichotomy of finance and degeneracy that most people are not really
comfortable with understanding because it's not like it's a single creator on OnlyFans who people
are paying, right? And no one can see that. It's crowdsourcing. Right. And so as number goes up for degenerate behavior, that's basically acknowledgement that many, many people very publicly are saying they like this and people are having a hard time wrestling with that.
Like my, my thing here is I don't think,
I think it's up to each individual to decide what is like their moral
structure.
And I'm not a big fan of people telling other people what their moral
structure should be or that, you know, I mean, we could all have opinions.
Don't get me wrong. And that's what we're here doing right now.
But I think when you start like trying to force people to moderate or these
things, we get into interesting territory.
Yeah.
Well,
I mean,
the conversation that we were having,
like,
you know,
we're talking about,
you know,
children and animals being put in danger and stuff like that.
And I think that's like a simple hard line.
Everybody can agree on.
We all agree there.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Like,
and I think when it comes like,
you know,
beyond there when it's, you know, if you're eating million Scoville peppers or you're mixing it in with your own poop and eating that or what have you.
Like, that is kind of a point where I would say, like, maybe Darwinism needs to take over here.
You can't rely on the platform to actually do this because they won't.
They're looking for shock content.
And it's just last days of Rome shit. It just continues on. That and it's very difficult to detect if somebody is
essentially eating poop. Like if you put in images of somebody eating chocolate and poop into an AI,
you would probably think that they're just, you know, a very similar thing. Same with like a
million Scoville ghost peppers or anything like that. We can't easily detect it. You could be acting, you could be eating any pepper.
When it comes to something like detecting children or detecting animals in a stream and stuff like
that, that's something we can do, like a very binary thing. It's one and zero, and that's it.
I think for the purposes of PumpFun, know it's a gambling platform to begin with
like children if it detects somebody you know under the age you can even put it down to you
know under the age of 15 if you want to be you know if you want to give it a bit of leeway that
maybe they're a young looking 22 or whatever but if it detects you know a kid or an animal you don't
even have to automatically ban it you can even just flag a moderator and say check this and make sure they're not doing something dumb like there's
very easy solutions they can integrate for that i think that that's what kind of you know i was
bringing to you on it that when it comes to the really extreme shit that everybody agrees we
don't want to see it it's really easy to moderate that stuff it's just that a lot of platforms
seem to just choose not to
because they certainly have the resources even to manually do it.
But if they wanted to do it automatically, that's immediate as well.
If you don't want to build your own software,
you can buy this stuff or get cloud leasing on it for practically nothing.
It's very solved.
But yeah, that was what I was running for.
This ties back into
the part of the conversation that we were having yesterday on crypto quorum um and it is that if
we don't want governments to get involved in regulating we have to regulate ourselves um so
if we don't want governments to start regulating meme coins then the meme coin platforms have to
do it and the people who use them have to do it.
And I wish that Joel was on stage, maybe is, and I'm just, I just can't see it.
But because I know he would have some positions to add here.
But yeah, that was a huge part of our conversation yesterday.
So if anybody wants to talk on that.
That's an interesting one that we talk about a lot in regards to parents, excuse me,
and children. I have a 12 year old daughter who's obviously grown up, growing up in an age where technology is, is vast and interconnected and a massive part of all of our realities. You know,
she has just received a phone recently and it's very dialed back. She doesn't, you know, we don't have TVs at our house.
We watch movies sometimes.
She doesn't just get to go to friends' houses
whenever she wants.
She's got lots of really, really good vetted friends
around her, but there's other friends
that we've absolutely taken out of her life
because we don't feel like their parents are trusted
or mirror the values that we believe in.
This is maybe mostly not the same for a lot
of other people. But, you know, where this actually roots from is myself and her mother,
who I'm not with anymore, but this very much so is rooted in our own belief around self-control
and our own belief around how we actually present ourselves into the world and
you know morals and values and some of those things around like you know we personally don't
you know I don't use drugs and alcohol I don't smoke I don't do any of those things I don't
watch pornography I don't do those aspects and it's not because I necessarily 100% think it's
wrong I think some of it is not okay I I think our time, energy, and attention is the most valuable
currency that we have and using it just haphazardly is a bastardization to life. That's what I truly
believe. But this is like exactly what, Nergirl, you're saying is like how we actually have the
ability in a world that is full of so much absolutely crazy amounts of distraction from food to porn to sex,
to relationships, to media, to all of that fucking garbage.
It's like, how can we actually moderate ourselves through some type of purpose or mission,
whether that's God or something else, whatever it is to you.
And then how we can actually reflect that into like our families and our personal self,
our families and our community, right? Because, you know, money is going to want to make money
and power is going to want more power no matter what. And we can't like, you know, I can't,
I can't, I don't feel like I can necessarily trust government or conglomerates or any of those people
to actually do the best for me. So you actually have to, you know, take your power back and actually
govern yourself in a lot of these cases because the slope is slippery i've
been there before with drugs and all that different stuff it's like you know it's something that at
the end of the day you have to make those choices for yourself so great great point to bring up
because it does come back to ourselves you know it's something that's interesting though you can
think about too is like we're talking about this in a very crypto native conversation but
this this we've we've been dealing with this for a long time why is it that news organizations
publish like i don't have an exact statistic in front of me but the negative news versus positive
news it's it's astronomically skewed to negative why Why? Because that sells. Are we all raising our hands and
saying, no, no, no, please, please change your... No, we're not. We're consuming it. We like it.
So-and-so did what? And so this is not like anything new to crypto. We've been doing this
for forever. Yeah, cortisol and endorphins and all those things pumping from visually
witnessing things that are disturbing or jarring or whatever definitely is addictive.
Well, what's the news, the media phrase, if it bleeds, it leads?
Why do you think when you watch the news, like local news, it's a bunch of bad stuff?
Because humans are attracted to that for some reason.
Whether it's out of fear reason whether it's out of fear
whether it's out of enjoyment i i don't know what it is and it's probably a combination of multiple
emotions but for whatever reason humans are attracted to that stuff where they're we're
attracted to chaos and like you know i mean look at why do people watch like real housewives you
know like i never i can understand, but people love it.
Right.
As someone that reads a lot of books,
I feel like the reason that people do it is similar to why people watch
horror movies.
And it's sort of this interesting paradox thing where it's like death can
make people feel more alive.
I think about this a lot as like a
literary concept um but I digress I mean yeah I think like well really quick before you move on
from that topic I was you know trying to think because you said you don't you don't really enjoy
seeing other people suffer um or and I'm and my point was that everyone here at some point like
even if it's as simple as
watching, you know, these cat videos where they like knock down vases and stuff just to mess with
the owners. And we watched that and the owner's vase broke. That's a cost to them. And they're
suffering a little, not really, it's like minor, but my point is, I think everyone here at one
point in their life, at least, and probably millions of points in their life has laughed at
someone stepping on a rake, slipping and falling their pants splitting, you know, like, you know, wardrobe malfunctions.
And you just named a perfect one, which is, and I'm not really that into horror movies.
I don't know.
It doesn't do it for me, but I, like, my sister loves them.
I know lots of people who love horror movies.
And what are you watching?
Watching someone possibly get killed,
right?
it's literally like pump fun stuff just,
but it's fiction. So we're allowed to enjoy it.
yeah.
And I mean,
for women,
like there,
there are theories also of like why women specifically tend to gravitate
toward horror movies,
but this would be a total digression from the topic.
but there's like definitely some academic scholarship on like why women
specifically are are driven to to be more interested in in horror movies on average
can you expand on that what what is that theory do do go on i want to hear well well
i don't know that i can explain it i think think it's because we already know, but I want to hear it.
Wait, I don't know.
What do you think?
Wait, wait, wait, wait.
I want to know what he's thinking and then see if it's what you're actually going to say.
What do you think it is?
No, no, I am knocking on the record here.
I'm going to leave her.
Go ahead with this one.
Oh, it also thinks that women don't belong in crypto.
By the way, by the way.
We got two on the X-Space.
It's actually a requirement to come on this X-Space.
You have to put that forward.
And yeah, sorry.
No, no.
I wanted you to come on last week on the quorum space to tell us all that.
But you wouldn't. So I had to out you. Sorry, Owen. Okay space, but you wouldn't tell us all that, but you wouldn't.
So I had to out you. Sorry, Owen. Okay, Kate, you got to tell us.
What are the academic theories? Well, I think it's a safe space for women to experience fear.
I mean, I don't know. These academics explain that, you know, explain that, you know, we live under patriarchy
and blah, blah, blah. And so for women, it's a safe space to explore different things going on
there. That's like the TLDR. So basically women love getting murdered and choked to death.
No, no. Yeah. I know. I knew this would be a difficult one to explain.
You know,
women all get murdered.
That's your favorite thing.
I mean, I...
Can you stand on my face and get murdered?
That's the lighthouse.
There's certainly some women who like,
you know, little spanking,
little slapping.
There's some men in murdering.
Relax Wheeler coming in the door
chopping their head off.
It can also make
real trauma feel
less
as well.
On what you said,
patriarchy, blah, blah, blah.
Can you expand on what you meant by that?
No, because
this is a crypto space
full of dudes and I don't think this is the appropriate venue
for that conversation but i would also just touch on that like buddhism also discusses like non-violence
and reduction of suffering as like a very core principle so it's really just not true that like everyone loves to watch other things and people suffer
Like that's just not fucking true
And I think we should personally strive toward harm reduction and principles of nonviolence
But you know, that's just my opinion
Except for in the kinky circumstances, of course.
Very important to recognize.
Yeah, getting murdered.
Women love getting murdered.
But I am.
Well, Joel had his hand up a while ago.
I want to make sure that we...
And, yeah, that was before we digressed.
So, Joel.
I just, I'm on the other phone because I'm having lunch before I have to jump on another call.
So sorry for the brief interlude.
Just on that last point though, I mean, how many times you see puppies play fighting or like little boys,
like playing with guns, little fake guns and then swords. It's like programmed in training for what historically,
over the hundreds of thousands of years of our species,
have been what they need to know.
And so for me, I don't even think it requires that much explaining that,
you know, women want to be aware of threats to them,
of like people coming after them them trying to kill them and stuff
whereas like men are programmed in to want to fight those threats or fantasize about fighting
those threats like you know sitting in line at the bank and being like what if a shooter was here
would i jump behind and tackle him and everyone's sort of done that a little bit isn't that interesting
a little bit. Isn't that interesting?
Every day, you know.
That's like a common, like,
for me, that's a common
thought.
Like, you know, Cindy, we hear
something outside, like, uh, yesterday
we heard something, I heard something outside
and I said, be quiet, you know, I'm listening,
you know, and she just kept talking and I'm
like, dude, be quiet. I heard
something outside and she's like, oh, it's probably
nothing and I'm like ready to like do something, you know.
And almost like I almost want to do something, you know.
Like that's our urge as men in a lot of ways is to protect.
Roxanne, really got a shotgun with no safety pointing at her at the door.
I think it would make sense for a gazelle to watch shows and movies and documentaries about lions eating
gazelles like just just to be mentally prepared in case something like that actually happens it
makes perfect sense to me i mean war and destruction is a reality right and when it
comes down to it like uh this is a jordan pet quote, which I think is pretty fantastic. Is that like,
you know, to, to be the, you know, to be the animal or to be the monster inside, but to have control of that means that you're probably the, you know, the, the safest person
in the room because many people have those parts of themselves. We all have darker parts of
ourselves or more challenging parts of ourselves, but it's actually how we sharpen our blade and how we, you know, use that edge for any type of impact. And whether that is
literally protecting yourself or your family or how that, you know, uh, sharpens into how you go
to work every single day to hustle, to grind, to get the money so you can protect your family and
your lineage to, you know, uh, how you speak in public, how you approach people, how you,
you know, use your word and, and those, how you approach people, how you, you know,
use your word and, and those things, because all of those things can be seen as battles
as well too, whether they're larger or micro style.
So, um, yeah, I think that's very important point.
In a way that's civilization, like, because as animals, you know, I think if we didn't
have like a structured society, then you just have murder and theft and rape and all kinds of bad stuff.
And like, that's one of the beauties of humans is we found a way to like coordinate together and go, hey, guys, let's all agree that this behavior is not good for us as a society and thus us as individuals.
And so we all have to like. Kind of put walls up.
Right.
You can't say everything you think.
Because you might make someone feel bad.
Or you know.
You can't steal from someone.
Because even though in the short term.
You get something.
It hurts society.
When everyone is just stealing from each other.
I'll jump in here. With a quick update on the poop uh vote we've got 10 votes uh for
ban poop eaters from pump and we've got six votes for don't ban wow interesting
rock i'm so sorry brother i know you were hoping for that i was really open to see some you know
spicy poop rock actually commented on it as well like come on guys we need to get everyone
sometimes rocky just for the sake of society you gotta keep some of those things to yourself but
if you want to send me a dm you know i'm one of the persons that did say you know poop can happen so if if we get
enough if we get enough votes for yes on on don't ban poop eaters i will i will eat my poop live on
stage right now and post a picture you will not oh my god i'll do it i might don't say that man
you're just into the idea of us like you don't
even need anybody to validate this like i'm gonna be eating my poop anyway i'm never i'm never getting
into politics this this was this was the episode this was the episode where i threw my political
career out the window but bro you know what you can make a lot more money other ways than politics
and it's probably a lot less stress but you can can make a lot more money other ways than politics and it's probably a lot less stress.
You can probably make a lot more money eating poop.
Exactly.
I just want to jump in here and say I am flipping that.
I think it's super important that you eat the poop in your traditional suit.
Like the suits that you wear, the really nice ones you wear to
conferences. I know not everybody at the conferences are like me and you, where we actually like,
you know, like to dress nicely, but I know you like to dress nicely. So I think it would be
really, really important that you're shaved properly, cleaned up really well. And then you
eat the fecal mouth. And I should do it like at a nice dinner, a fancy dinner table. Like I put the
napkin on my lap. I have a nice, you know, fork and spoonkin on my lap i have a nice you know fork and
spoon it's part of a three you know maybe a six course you know dinner with a fine you know wine
just just a nice light jazz in the background
yeah and then have like a little butler bring it out. All right, you guys.
Yeah, okay.
So I want to bring it back to meme coins.
And I want to ask Rock actually specifically, and then we can open it up.
But has your position, we know your previous position on meme coins.
Has your position began to change or evolve in any way since the last time that we had a conversation about meme coins has your position like began to change or evolve in any way since the last time
that we had a conversation about meme coins eat the poop meme coin just actually launched guys
go check it out i'm already kate is disgusted with us kate is especially disgusted with me She's still well on bro
You're all good
Did you hear my question?
I'm sorry can you repeat it I distracted myself
Yeah okay
I'm very distracted by the subject
Yeah I see that
You're really into eating your poop
So my question was Your previous position on meme coins has always been clear. Wondering if you continue to like, think the way that you've always thought about meme coins, or if that's changed or evolved over the course of the last year or so.
What do you think my opinion on meme coins is just real quick? I don't know. So I
would. Okay. So I remember what you've said before. You don't like meme coins. You think
that they're, you know, kind of silly and a waste of money and they take away market cap from
projects that could actually use it to build and bring utility to people's lives. But I would say
that as a libertarian, you're certainly in favor of their existence and the free market doing what it wants. Pretty good. I mean, I'll say you left that one
caveat that I do have, which is that's pretty accurate when we talk about like the gamble
meme coins. I don't love those, but I do love meme coins that have like a strong community
like Doge. There's a ton of others uh that i think are really
cool and i think are fun and i think it's a great way to build community and i would actually love
to see i am sad that we haven't seen more celebrity meme coins do well um team like sports
team meme coin kind of things that you you know, have some utility where,
for example, you know, you, you buy Lakers coin and now you get, you know, a discount. If you
have enough, you different plateaus, you get like, you know, um, you get cheaper tickets or you get
like a free popcorn or something, uh, at a game, or you get, if you have enough, you get entered
into a raffle to like have a meet and greet with you know kobe bryan or lebron or something uh rest in peace kobe but um i think
there's so much cool stuff we could do with meme coins um that it just really hasn't panned out
and i think the the the pump fun stuff kind of really hurt memes, uh, in a lot of ways because it's so degenerate
and it's so PVP and, and yeah, you're right. As a libertarian, I totally, it's like cigarettes.
I think cigarettes are retarded, uh, excuse my, my language there, but I think cigarettes are
really stupid, but I will, you know, defend people's right to smoke them. Uh, and I would
fight hard for that, uh, as stupid as I
think they are. Um, gambling, same thing. I think gambling is really stupid. I never gamble. Um,
but I think people should be able to do it. Um, I don't like poop eating, but I think people should
be probably able to do it. Uh, and meme coins, I think people should be able to do it. I just
wish that there was more good success stories on like, you know, like a musician having, you know, I think all musicians should have their own coin.
And that coin gets you kind of early access to their albums, first access to like, you know, concert tickets, maybe special album art or meet and greets or virtual like concerts.
I think there's so much cool stuff we could do with
it. I just don't love the pump and dump stuff. Okay. So let me propose something and let's,
and then open the discussion. But so yesterday in the space, we were saying that like, so I come
from a religious studies academic background, right? And so we were saying that like our joke
to each other, not a joke, but was but was about essentially cults plus time equal religion.
And then yesterday I was saying I feel like the same could apply to meme coins.
Meme coins plus time and community. the perfect equation equals community coins or utility token or something beyond a meme
coin.
I wish I remembered the exact formula that we came up with yesterday.
But so that, I guess, ties into what you were saying.
Like you love community coins.
You love when they have a strong community, when they're building something beyond just those quick pump and dump memes.
And the question is, how do you think...
So if you call something a scam at its beginning because it's a meme coin or useless at its beginning because it's a meme coin, how do you know?
Or not?
So the progression might be community turns to cult turns to religion.
That might be a way of looking at it.
But anyone have an opinion on this?
Yeah, I was going to jump in there.
Like the difference between community coin and pure gambling shit coin is time and success.
Every single coin, including Dogecoin back at the start, it was a gambling shit coin is time and success every single coin including dogecoin back at the
start it was a gambling coin but as the community started to grow it becomes more than that
but okay let me let me just push back okay go finish your thought and then i want to push back
a little go for that i want to jump after you rock yeah no go ahead rock okay so i i think
there's a difference though because a part of it is intent, and that's hard to gauge early.
Like, you don't know, is the person trying to do this just to rug a bunch of people?
Are they doing this as, like, you know, a good thing for society?
Or, like, it's very hard to know.
So you're right.
In the beginning, if you just shun them all, it's hard to even let some get to the point of being community,
culture, religion, or whatever.
But like Doge, Doge was different though,
because it was launched as a fair launch.
So the creators, Jackson, Palmer, and Billy Marcus,
didn't take anything.
And they just launched it as a fun thing.
But there were a lot of players who were very early
in us who essentially mined up a massive amount of supply there were others then that kind of
just latched onto it like uh ryan kennedy and so on where once again they got a massive amount of
supply and they essentially for a short period were kind of seen more as like founders or owners
then you know jackson and billy because jack because Jackson and Billy stepped back from it very quickly.
So the intent was still malicious.
It just wasn't on the part of the original founders.
It was from the people who jumped in and managed to get a lot of supply through nefarious means.
What was the nefarious means?
Buying it?
They were just running scams, rug pulls, stuff like that.
For Doge? means buying they were just running rogue polls stuff like that for those they were trying to
yeah like very early days were a huge amount of scams that were running around doge like um i had
i i've got the whistleblower document up on one of the original ones that i had to post after
meeting the guy but uh he purchased an exchange simply to rub the entire exchange like this is how
extreme stuff was back then so i like
i don't think there was any no i won't even say i don't think like i know there was no malicious
intent on jackson or billy's part but other players came into the scene and essentially
started pumping doge with the expression express intention of dumping it or even more extreme then
on top of it was you know they ran quite literal scams some of which
wound up in prison time and stuff like that like the early doge community was rocked by scams
like to the point where i think a lot of billy and jackson stepping back in those times because you
know people lost their shirts on it they were putting in massive amounts of money they got it
either rug pulled or you know they lost it in a complete scam
like exchange or so on and so forth.
It was rough with scams.
Like Doge was seen as the original scam point back in the day.
But you apply enough kind of time and pressure and I suppose good people on top of it as
well when the community is large enough that it can kind of start its own snowball effect
and given a little bit of help from the richest and most famous man in the world shilling it it recovered and it became what it is
today but back in the day it was seen purely as a scam like on my facebook like this is in 2013
i have a post where i told people to buy dogecoin and my comments are flooded with people saying
such pump many dump stuff like that It was seen as an outright scam.
And that's what a lot of coins are now.
A lot of people like founders started with that malicious intent that they're just going to dump it.
But back in the day, there wasn't such a spread.
There was only a couple of coins.
So if a bunch of people got rugged on or scammed on one coin and that was
doge back in the day they kind of had to stick with their bags and build that community otherwise
they'll never get that value back and that's how a lot of you know even modern meme coins run today
like uh spx 6900 like that was uh basically just destroyed by the original founders it got the community take over
then and now it's up in like the top 300 on coin market cap or what have you like it shot off did
a 100x or so the founders were malicious or incompetent one or the other but the community
team that took over from there then they made it worth something and like that didn't come down to
original intent original intent was bad but it
turned out good uh original intent was good but turned out bad and then got recovered into good
again like it's just time pressure and amount of people that are essentially bagged that comes down
to yeah so like that's interesting and part of maybe the reason it is so strong now is because
of the journey because of the ups and downs and because people survived the turmoil and the people who believed in it were kind of rewarded.
What was the coin, the token, the meme coin that did the liquidity lockers?
My brain's foggy right now, running on like four hours of sleep.
But yes, yes.
So they got like rugged once, and then there was like a community take but yes yes so they got like rugged what like once and
then there was like a community takeover and then they got rugged again and then they did another
community takeover and then it went well what how are they doing now pretty good i think they're
still in top 100 or top 200 cmc but yeah so this is kind of now i'm not trying to give reason for this argument because
it's insane but when you see something on pump fund that immediately just rugs and the founder
runs off with his 80 or whatever laughing at people there is still the chance that somebody
will decide to take over that token and make it into something good you can't tell from the offset
whether this is going to be good or bad you can only kind of go in with an average of it
and say like, this is gambling
and gambling might turn into community
and community might turn into cult.
Like this is how every coin tends to go.
But nearly every token that's done well,
like every meme coin,
it has had a period where it got wrecked
either by malicious founders or malicious insiders,
or just people who managed to scam it for all it's worth.
This is why I don't like to sit here and say every meme coin
is definitely a scam.
Most of them probably are.
But there's always a chance that the next scam that you get yourself out of
turns into something like Doge or Mog or Bonk or spx 6900 or floki like they're all in there
it's you just need to view it as this is gambling and the gambling is like a set it'll be called
community and people so people know context here uh you were one of the original doge devs uh doge
contributors so uh you have a lot of uh a lot of history here and lived through a lot of those ups
and downs yourself yeah i mean i got rugged for about 20 million dogecoin from that guy ryan
kennedy he bought the exchange and rocked that from it like so if you look at that today like
now granted i never would have held it until it was worth 20 million dollars what have you
but um is that how much you would have now
yeah well it was 20 million doge um it talked out at what 81 cent or something like that so yeah
bad maths but nearabouts but i imagine it's going to go to one dollar this cycle but at the same
time there's no way i would have held it that long you don't like if i had 10 million dollars like
last cycle i it would have been gone well before that it's your proverbial cheeseburger
but um like this is the thing like i was vehemently for dogecoin like and i would never
allow people to say it's gambling or anything like that back in the day it's only looking
back at it now that was like we were all gambling every single one of us were gambling we
might believe in something but that belief is stemming from we have something and we want the
value of that thing to go up and a lot of people like you know we instinctively know we increase
our chances of this going up by you know treating it as something more than gambling and i think
that's how a lot of successful coins wind up getting born and i think there's a level of acceptance you have to have with that in saying that like yeah we're a community full of
degenerate gamblers and some things turn into something bigger than we either intended it to
be or that we thought it would be and that's kind of the beauty of it it's like you know the free
market is doing its bit it's uh you know it's even bitcoin the least, the most safe and the most kind of, in many ways, like idealistic coin. I'm sure most of us in the Bitcoin community, and I've been in it for over 10 years, most of us probably wouldn't have stuck around so long if there wasn't some price appreciation, right?
if we are fighting for freedom and as, as much as I, you know, I'm always fighting for freedom
and I'm a libertarian and, but if, if it never gained value, would I be dedicating my entire
life to it? Maybe it would be more of a side hobby to me, but you know, because there is money to be
made here, I could actually dedicate my career to this and fight for freedom, which is even better.
But I guess you can say, you know, part of, I mean, look, I was on my path to becoming
a surgeon and I read the Bitcoin white paper and I dropped my entire medical, uh, career. Actually,
I'll, I'll put a picture in the comments from my, the PETA, what we were getting in trouble with,
with PETA, but, um, of me doing a surgery, but, um, you um you know I I dropped out of that uh for for
bitcoin in this entire industry and would I have done that if I didn't think I could make money
at it probably not because you have to have money to live right you can't um you can't like be
homeless fighting for freedom so there was a I was at, and this is actually pretty well publicized as well too, from Anamokan.
So like one of the founders, Yat, was talking about meme coins and how, you know, a lot of it is fraudulent,
but the actual, the idea behind mematics and the network effect is pretty awesome.
To see how people can actually put value on something and how people's energy, attention, their time is actually what will bring the value and the cultural relevance of something.
is actually what will bring the value and the cultural relevance of something,
whether it's Doge or Bitcoin or whatever is adopting value over time.
It's not just an actual the money value of it, but also the cultural relevance,
the meaning, the mission, those type of things.
So it's really interesting to hear some of these, like, you know,
obviously like massive figures within the industry talk and those type of ways around meme coins.
Because most of it is not utility based, but the utility in many ways is actually the cultural relevance or the community and the kind of network effect that's brought from that, which is an interesting way definitely to look at it
because I think it was NerdGirl saying earlier,
like, you know, a lot of these utility coins
were actually just garbage and they were giving promises,
but they were actually just lies or ignorance
or just, you know, people not able to actually fulfill their...
Exit windows.
Yeah.
Exit windows for teams.
That's all they ever were.
Yeah.
And I mean, we saw that massively.
I'm sure not all of them were, right?
I bet there are, maybe I'm wrong, but I bet there are some, like, for example, with QuickSwap,
I've still never sold a single token.
The foundation, we generated $100 million in revenue in our first year, and I never took $1.
So there are people in this industry that are doing it for some other reason.
I would bet that there are some meme coins that the founders never sold any.
Is that possible, or are they all just degenerate pump and dumpers?
I wasn't talking on utility tokens and meme coins
all being garbage.
I was saying that there's a massive portion of utility
that were promising things were either lies
and or just inability to actually follow through
is probably a lot of the time more the case
because people aren't just like, you know,
aren't very experienced or they don't never done business or they don't know how to build community or blah, blah, blah,
blah. But because web three is such an open space and has been very open, it's less now it's harder
to make things successful now, but back four years ago, back eight years ago, and those bull runs,
you could literally throw, I like to say this one, you can literally throw a chicken nugget at a
vegan and get like, you know, 50 X. Right. And the thing is, though, it's like what nerd girl was saying before was like, you know, maybe there's actually more freedom to just being like, hey, this is something completely speculatory.
This is something that has no utility other than people coming in and saying we're going to put value on this.
Right. And then a lot of people don't think there's value,
but then all of a sudden there becomes value and cultural relevance
and money starts to stick and it has a sticky effect, blah, blah, blah.
And this is coming from someone that is not a huge proponent for meme coins.
I don't own any meme coins.
I did a tiny bit of gambling for a couple of months and I was like,
fuck this, this is a big waste of my time.
But I have friends that work in some of the biggest meme coins in the space.
You know, one of my good friends, Jordan Charters, obviously from Polygon to Polydoge.
You know, there's been success and there's been really cool, amazing people doing, you know, awesome stuff.
So, but yeah, on the utility side, it's just like there's been a lot of that garbage.
We love Jordan.
Yeah, Jordan.
Shout out to Jordan.
Big fan.
Big fan, Jordan.
So, yeah, Rock rock i think you missed the
very beginning but i kind of reiterated a point that i've made in other spaces with you which was
like i don't know why we need to say like all meme coins or scams when there have been plenty
of examples of utility tokens and false promise tokens that have said they're going to do these
things and never delivered on those promises
when you invest in a token when you invest in a token called come rocket or hawk tua
or something along those lines you know what you're getting that's a gamble yeah that's a
gamble that's not like oh this token is gonna you change the world. And I'll give you an example from the 2016-17 cycle, which was like Humanik.
You know, people bought into that ICO believing that their token was going to help fund, you know, starvation in third world countries.
And that token rugged.
But people bought it because they didn't think of it as a meme coin because it
presented itself in a way that wasn't
a meme coin and in that way
all coins are narrative
memes so everything
is a meme coin that just
has a narrative tied to
is Apple stock a meme
to some extent
you're depending on their buybacks you're not depending on Is Apple stock a meme? To some extent. To some extent, yeah.
You're depending on their buybacks.
You're not depending on a new software innovation. Tesla is definitely a meme.
You guys have been around for a while,
but I'm not super sure about the listeners.
But you could Google Bob Surplus Bitcoin Talk Forum,
and you're going to get this archived version of it.
And it tells this wonderful story.
And I really encourage everybody to read it,
no matter how long you've been in crypto or whatever,
it'll speak to you in some way.
But there's a couple of key takeaways that come from it, right?
And it's like, there's always the leader.
There's Bob Surplus and the guy who has the plan.
And then there's the fixer,
the guy who comes around to fix And then there's the then there's the fixer, the guy who comes around to
fix it after everything's fucked up. And we need to, we need to CTO it or whatever. And then there's
the guy in the background who turns out to be the dev, who ended up owning the token, who was also
the CTO lead who also did all of you know, the guy ran back to the triple play and did it three
times over again on him. And there's many such cases of this, right?
As far as, like, how to identify a cult from this, it's really difficult.
Like, and trying to do it from the start on Pump Fun is just a fool's errand.
You're literally just shitting, like, you're shooting into a barrel trying to nail something.
And that's kind of it.
Unless you know Bob, or you know the people that are doing some of these things, then
sure, you can have some insider knowledge as to who's taking things serious.
You know the names of the people who are at least trying to do something relevant in the
space, right?
And from the outside, it would seem like speculative gambling.
But really, you're kind of just tuned in and you know Bob.
And so it's an interesting story to read through.
Subsequently, you can also read into the network state, the networkstate.com.
Oops, sorry, tried to do a heart there.
And that would kind of give a guidebook as to what some of these people that are doing this, like if you want to understand the end outcome, you also have to understand
the process as to getting there.
And so that gives a lot of insight, I would say, that is like a universal playbook of
understanding, like what gathers people, what inspires them, what are the things that drive
them.
And with that said, I really do appreciate you guys not talking about shit coins and
other things on
my lady today. If you go to remelia.com,
you'll notice that it's 38 minutes until the countdown ends.
What does it mean? Is something happening? Something's probably happening.
I really appreciate your guys' time. Thank you. Read into Bob surplus.
He was a crazy dude, crazy, cool story, a lot of shit.
And you'll be able to relate it to well,
everything that
goes on in this space so yeah find somebody doing something that believes in something and uh
maybe staple yourself to them and try to build value to that and it builds a network instead of
trying to build something individually you'll go fast but we can go far if we go together
that's kind of the idea. I got to jump in there because we build meme coin infrastructure for Bitcoin and
I posted our usage for Doge. We're using it as a canary network because we don't want to implement
a Litecoin bridge too early. So there is utility in it. I'm not saying meme coins need to be proof
of work, but that was part of the old system that would connect people to a commitment is that there was a bunch of hardware and a bunch of people spending
electricity to make an idea viable. Now that we're disconnected from that, we're back to
keyboard warrior mode where you can make anything on pump fun real quick and then not really be
liable for it. So I don't think we need to reinvent proof of work or move all meme coins
to proof of work. That could be an an interesting exercise but the lack of commitment and the lack of stickiness between you know let's say an issuer
and a pump a dumper there's there's just not a lot in the the modern you know version of that
because it's so fast and it's so brand heavy so i think if we get closer to a realm of commitment
for that we'll understand that some websites are going to drop things from their UI that are still on a chain. And that should be enough for most websites,
because websites do have countries associated with them. And that's kind of enough to draw
the line on liability. Until then, anything should go, you know, poop or spicy or otherwise,
you know, if it's possible, then it should be allowed. If someone wants to drop it for
liability reasons, because it shouldn't be presented on their website,
then I think that's appropriate.
But the UI should be where we draw the line.
You know, on-chain should remain permissionless, right?
Yeah, I think that the bottom line of what I was talking
and what also attaches to all of this, right,
is the people just want beta.
They strive for something that can do better than the dollar
and better than bonds and better than stocks
and better than Bitcoin and better than Ethereum
and better than Solana and so on.
And down the risk curve we go.
And the people, they're always going to have that
and they're always going to create little funnels for that.
And I think that infrastructure,
like what you're talking about,
that allows people to innovate on different ways that we can, can study distribution.
This is a really important part of the study of things that like distribution is key of everything,
right? And so how do we figure out distribution better? Pump fun was the right idea as far as like,
if it were organic, and if we didn't bundle it, and if we, you know, the way that all of that works.
But the idea of it was like democratizing it.
And so, yeah, giving like giving new ways and avenues of exploring that is where
where we need to be continuing to push.
So wholly agree.
Well, Pump Fun, I mean, people give it a bad rap,
but Pump Fun itself was a solution to a problem.
That problem was that people already like meme coins, but they couldn't understand the code.
And so many smart contracts out there had a rug pull in them built in, right?
A drainer. And so pump fun came about to basically solve that.
You basically were guaranteed that there was no drainer in the smart contract.
But then people found the way to
game that so it's just going to be this ever evolving people are always going to try and
game the system whether it's the cabals and pump fun you're never going to get away from that
but i i still think and i love that we talked about the point is like a meme coin that doesn't
promise anything that would be a meme coin i still think is better than, you know, the hundreds of other utility coins out there that get to ridiculously high numbers.
Here's the word cult.
That is the perfect word.
What's the, who's that Richard Hart guy?
Hex?
Like, you want to talk about a cult right there, man.
Like, the people that were involved in that were brainwashed.
And they lost a lot of money.
And it was kind of sad.
They were happy to do it, too.
Twice.
Well, yeah, I forgot about PulseChain.
But like the point is, is like to me, that is a far greater evil than a meme coin in the space.
Personally, I mean, you know, Crypto crypto cock down there is not about to tell you
he's he's solving um let's just say you know world hunger some of the things but uh uh you know but
i can understand what i'm getting when i buy crypto cock you know hex and impulse that was
that's a straight scam right so how are you going to walk down your local law office and say that i
need to sue this guy for making crypto cocky you know you know you have to have the lot you going to walk down your local law office and say that I need to sue this guy for making Crypto Cockino, you know?
You have to lose all dignity to do that walk.
I fully agree.
Nerd Girl, do you have any thoughts on the reason?
Yeah, I do.
so without going like too far into it or defending anything right because I did make a lot of money
with hex and and and I've also lost money with it I mean overall my gains outweigh the losses
so let me say that but I also want to say that you know you can say it's a scam me say that. But I also want to say that, you know, you can say it's a scam and say that people can go to law enforcement entities to try to sue over the creation of this, like, meme that pretended that it wasn't one.
But people tried and failed.
And, heck, Pulse Chain and P pulse X were actually cleared by the sec.
So that's all I want to say.
I don't want to say that it's not a scam, right?
Like maybe it is.
I don't know.
Um, I'm just here to say that at the very least, if we're going to represent that position,
we should also reflect the reality of the fact that the sec cleared these things.
fact that the sec cleared these things and this is why women aren't allowed in crypto
And this is why women aren't allowed in crypto.
you know what i mean um sorry sorry go ahead kate oh i was just gonna jump in because we were sort
of talking about this bigger conversation of like are all meme coins the same are all meme coins
you know um useless or whatever and you know are all meme coins scams? And I think
that, of course, I think there's been some good points about adding some nuance in there.
Because basically, a founder told me recently that because of the state of like us regulation or like meme coins
have like basically been virtually cleared um that a lot of projects are when they launch a token
they just call it a meme coin even though they're not actually intending it to be a meme coin by the
the us government's current working definition of a meme coin. Basically, the sort of framework that's existed has been saying that a meme coin sort of has
no purpose and is there for a joke.
And that's the sort of working regulatory definition in the US.
But some projects are sort of just calling themselves meme coins when they're not.
They have plans for more more utility um going off that like
definition so i just think it's interesting that this can get like very sort of messy and like
nuanced and complicated when people start you know assigning different definitions and then
there's like the regulatory question of like well how do they define a meme coin um but yeah it's it's funny stuff i i just
i just think about like bitcoin maxis and how they would basically say like everything's a
meme coin except for bitcoin you know because like it's all relative but that's literally what
zora launched as right they put in the out of the't know, the intent paper, I don't even call it white paper,
they were just like, not meant to bring any sort of value whatsoever. And yet it's the
foundation of their whole chain. So it's kind of like, well, that's what Richard Hart also said.
And Eos, by the way.
I'm sensing we might have, I think I might have stepped on some toes there,
so I'm going to back off on Richard Hart part.
But, yeah.
I thought Eos was more on the computer resources.
I don't care if you talk crap about Richard Hart.
I don't care.
Richard was right about a lot of shit.
He was, yeah.
That's what's about these cult leaders is that you've got to be right.
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, it doesn't offend me if you want to
call something a scam or someone a scammer i don't care like yeah we're just here having a
conversation i uh i have this you can be right and then you can have that tiny little stupid
gucci bag and his largest diamond in the world um and his his crazy clothes but you know so early in quick swap um actually hex i think
it was hex right yeah hex when it was originally hex before like px and all this pulse chain all
this stuff but like the original one um a lot of the hex community came to quick swap and um started
um so i watched richard hart for many years and i was a big fan of his when he was a
bitcoiner and then he started like um getting really negative about bitcoin and he was talking
trash on ethereum security but then once he decided to launch and he said many times like
i i like i'm here holding bitcoin and i'm yeah i've done well but you know all all these people
i know are launching like coins and making all this money. So I should
just launch a shit coin and make money too. He was joking or whatever. And then he eventually
launched text. And that's what I felt like he was kind of doing was he just saw an opportunity.
And then he started talking trash on Bitcoin. So that made me like, I didn't trust him because
he said all these things about Bitcoin. He debated everyone about Bitcoin for years and talked about all these very clear reasons why he thought and why I think he was correct in many ways about Bitcoin versus Ethereum.
And I love both big time.
But anyways, so I had kind of a personal beef with him.
And I talked a lot of trash on him online.
And on some comments somewhere in the depths of the internet said all of his community members
were scumbags for following him and uh I think I didn't use the word scam I said scumbags
and um this was so this nobody saw this someone and then you hired someone who was like part of
that you know part of that community yeah and uh And so when they all came to Polygon and to QuickSwap early on,
and I guess, was that a prompt, Nerd?
Do you want to expand on that?
I can.
I like, you know, I was doing research.
So my research in cryptocurrency was like,
I was applying the theory behind my dissertation to crypto communities and behind my religious studies dissertation for crypto communities.
And so I had spent like a good year at that time, year, maybe year and a half, like studying
the pulse chain community or sorry, at the time, the hex community, because they had
like, because they were the next or or they were the current real, like, implementation of the mass crypto tribalism.
And so, like, in that process, I accumulated some hacks that was given to me mostly.
And, you know, like, that kind of makes you root for it, especially when your bags are on the way up.
So, you know, know like everything's going
well and at that time and i did need a job and rock um you know i told him in our interview like
yeah there's a couple of things you need to know and before you offer me the position and here they
are and the rock's like you know what i'm totally fine with wait can you say what the things were
no i don't want to say what the come were. Come on. No. Let it die.
Let it die.
I want to ride around.
Man, I want to know now.
It's a slightly juicy one.
Does that video still exist?
Wait, what?
Oh, I know what it is.
I would definitely jump into this.
This is why women shouldn't be.
This is why women shouldn't be.
The hex video, the hex meme video that I won like $6,000 from does still exist.
Because it was a contest and I entered.
The video that you're asking about does not exist anymore.
Yeah.
Wow, I'm surprised.
You're usually a very open book.
Everything can exist again with AI. Okay, so at one point, before the last bull run, there was a full harvest moon.
And people were like, oh, somebody needs to dance naked in front of the moon to summon the gods of moon for crypto.
And I was retarded at the time and thought that it would be a great idea i did
blur out like private areas of my body so it was blurred but there was a video and i was like you
need to know about this because you may not be okay with hiring me and i don't want to get the
job and then and i said no no you know that's, that's okay. It's a little distasteful, but, but where, where was this?
I just, I need to review it just to make sure it'll comply with company
policy for legal purposes.
Whenever we do get to meet in the future, well,
I have some stories for you that that's very,
I think that's very vanilla
but that's really nice of you to bring that up to your you know your potential employer but yeah
well i had actually had yeah matthew was turning tricks in thailand with lady boys
yeah so i actually had job offers right like multiple times where i had applied for a job
and like got into the final stages and not mentioned it and then
like had the offer revoked at like the very last second and like sometimes it was because of that
and I'm like hey I'm not doing this again I know right are you sure it wasn't because of the
affiliation with that they actually 100% knew about that most of the people reached out to me
because I like gained a lot of my
following and, you know, support for the research that I was doing in the Hex community. So even
though people weren't like, all into Hex, they appreciated the research that I had put in and
what I did. And yeah, it was just like slightly brain dead at the time. I'm not exactly sure
why I would think that that was guess i didn't i don't know
whatever whatever it was um so yeah so i and i was like i don't want this to happen again
i need to tell you two things before you consider offering me this job and those were the two things
and you were like if i'd be that'll be important but then also if they see the video i'll get the
job your your reasoning is also like cult 101 it's like yeah i have no idea what i was doing or why
i was doing it but it sounded like a good idea yeah everybody told me to do it i don't know
yeah it was uh yeah it was a little dumb drink they just want to be drink some cool
i've made other dumb videos that like i did not delete I just I chose that that one should be gone
If anybody's ever interested
In coming to Thailand and having some
Questionable experiences
Just DM me
I'm there from January to June usually
The rest of the year I'm in Canada
Where gender
Are you trying to sell turning tricks
On our podcast?
No dude I said,
if anybody,
I spend the other half of the year in Canada where,
you know,
the gender conversation is weaponized.
I love how Thailand's doing it.
They're,
they're amazing.
All right.
So are people allowed to visit you if they don't want to hook up with the
lady boys or just kind of, they don't want to hook up with the lady boys
or you don't need me for that thailand is very very casual around all of those
all those things actually for a place it's amazing it was the only southeast asian country that wasn't
colonized and still has ancient roots and spirituality but then also has this
absolutely debaucherous side it's it's quite the balance it's a pretty
crazy place yeah see my issue with thailand is like there's so it's a beautiful country and i've
had friends that have gone there and said you have to visit but i just can't i can't see how a guy can
go there and escape the allegations so it's like yeah no i can't go it's just simple as that that
you went for ladyboys?
You'll never get away from the allegation of that.
Like, you could have a live camera on you at all times, and you were just, you know, playing with elephants.
No, I used to play boys.
If you think that people think,
then maybe you should make other choices in life as well, too, right?
But, you know, there's a lot more beautiful things about Thailand.
It's just rocks, rocks, rocks, minds in the gutter i guess i uh well you're the one that brought up lady boys before
you said debauchery so i don't think debauchery means that i'm going to
actually i said debauchery you're the one that brought up lady boys aren't you in asia right now
aren't you spending six months there bro are? Are you in Thailand right now, bro?
Come on.
But where are these lady boys?
I'm in California, but Cindy and I are flying to Korea for Korean Blockchain Week Saturday.
I'll see you in Singapore, and then we can take a hop over to Thailand and I'll show you the temples, bro
The temples
Yeah, let me see that temple
Actually, let me take a moment to shill here because you guys mentioned a couple things earlier
So you mentioned Yatsu
He'll actually be speaking at one of our events with DNA Fund and BitAngels
So if you guys want to see Yatsu talk and get to meet him,
come to our event.
And if you want to actually,
if you want to pitch your project
in front of a bunch of huge investors,
we're going to be doing some pitches there
for BitAngels as well.
For those who don't know,
I'm the head of Global Leadership Council
for BitAngels.
We're an investor pitch network,
the longest running in the industry.
It's been around since 2013. And Vitalik actually pitched Ethereum at a BitAngels event. And BitAngels invested a good amount of money in Ethereum early. And Michael Turpin,
who founded BitAngels, his company did the PR for Ethereum launch, et cetera.
But yeah, so we'll have that event.
Would love to see you guys there.
That's in Korea.
Sorry, that one is in Korea.
We also have another BitAngels and Gains Ventures event in Korea, if anyone wants to come to that.
What else?
We have a DNA event in Singapore for Token 2049 as well.
Brock Pierce, Scott Walker, a bunch of other big people will be there we have a separate we're doing a joint event for bid angels dna in korea
we're doing a separate event or two separate events but we'll be at both um and we're helping
organize both um actually if any uh one knows big speakers who want to come and speak at these uh
we're still looking for some uh like tier one um speakers um but yeah so we have the bid angels event in singapore as well so if you're
looking to raise funds we put people in front of investors we don't charge anything it's just kind
of community good and good for our networking um and then uh let's see what else we have a network
state event that um i think sandeep might come speak at um let's see sam else we have a network state event that, um, I think Sandeep might
come speak at.
Um, let's see Sam Kazimian from Frax will be there.
Uh, my brain's blanking a bunch of, a bunch of big speakers will be there.
Um, and we have, gosh, we have like two more events we're helping with.
And I, I just can't remember cause I'm running on four hours of sleep but phoenix is one you guys have
a luma list floating around for for singapore is that something i should reach out to like richard
or yeah yeah reach out to richard yeah definitely uh yeah we do um and if anyone's interested they
can uh dm uh probably best dm the quick swap account here um and then what else? Oh yeah. So we're helping organize the first ETH Phoenix.
So this is, we're bringing the ETH conferences to Arizona. Pretty cool. And Aztec, who you guys
know who's just on the show is helping organize that with Stand With Crypto. And I think Coinbase
is involved in organizing that also. And Aztec is our, one of our newest city leaders.
He is now a city leader for Phoenix, Arizona for BitAngels. And then what else we have? Oh,
tech, LA tech week. Our team is, especially Richard is working with the city of Santa Monica.
I think it's their department of economics or something. I forget some official department that he's working with. And I think maybe like the mayor of Santa Monica
or something. I don't know, but there's a LA tech week, bit angels event and tokenize. Um,
that'll be focused on crypto and entertainment, the bit angels event, but then the whole week is
LA tech week. Um, so there'll be some crypto, some tech stuff. If you're in LA, reach out about that.
We also have one coming up for San Francisco tech week, um, which will be more focused. It'll be some crypto, some tech stuff. If you're in LA, reach out about that. We also have one coming up for San Francisco Tech Week,
which will be more focused.
It'll be crypto and AI and tech in general for the whole week,
San Francisco Tech Week.
We have an event, I think, in the next couple of days,
or it might even be like today or something in, I think,
Cairns in France for BitAngels.
Actually, you could go to bitangels.network and click pitch at the top,
and then there'll be a list, a dropdown,
or a list of all the different BitAngels events we have coming up.
So if you're raising funds, come to these events.
I mean, just LDA's projects alone,
I think we've raised like a couple million from these events
over the last few months.
So we're definitely getting checks written for people.
And again,
we don't charge anything.
It's just like something we do.
It's like a volunteer decentralized network,
basically.
I don't know.
We have a bunch more events happening,
but that's all I can think of.
And I'll,
I'll waste everyone's time here talking about for now,
but back to poop eating.
okay.
Yeah.
Well, I was was gonna jump in
there so the the poll on that we've got 14 votes for ban poop eaters and eight
votes for do not ban okay so I'm I'm in the clear I don't have to eat any poop
for now yeah it looks like no it looks like you're getting banned yeah well you
can still eat it but okay this is actually a great idea for a meme coin and i'm partially joking but it would be
kind of funny to see this happen some people might if you're i guess the majority wouldn't
because they voted for banning but what if you had a meme coin called like poop eater coin
and to mint it you didn't pay you had to send in a video of you
eating poop what do you guys think you would be down brock if you if you make this on pump fun
and you stream yourself eating poop i will put my entire portfolio into it
uh could you imagine i certainly became very interested in this coin
i'm i'm gonna have to pass on that one.
Imagine if you got like CZ, you know?
You got like some of the biggest...
Future utility, man.
You've got to shill this.
That's a billion dollar coin.
CZ does two girls, one cup.
Anybody see that picture floating around with him with the Asian girls?
Yeah, CZ does two girls, one cup.
That would be great.
What would the utility be?
Getting people to eat poop?
Is that the utility?
It would be, yeah.
Yeah, I mean, you're pretty well connected.
You can easily get some celebrities to just eat poop with you.
There you go, bro.
That's your whole new platform.
Okay, just to be clear for everyone here,
I have never and will never eat any poop.
Bro, your political crew.
Would you eat
for a million? Would I eat poop
for a million dollars? Yeah.
Man, I'm very wealthy,
but honestly, I would consider it.
It depends how much poop.
That's a terrible way to lead into that.
That's a terrible way to lead into that.
It's like, oh, well, you know, I'm very wealthy.
I don't need a million dollars.
I don't need a million dollars.
No, no.
That's for the fun of it.
Apparently, he's not that well-willed.
Whatever he needs to do to get that money.
I mean, I think some valuable context there would just be how Frugal Rock is.
Like he's the sort of guy that flies economy.
Like, he's the sort of guy that flies economy.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I, uh, I lived, I, when I, when I was, uh, I was worth over a million and I was living
in my, I said this last week, I think, or sometime I was living in my friend's garage
for $900 a month.
Actually, if you look up Brock Zachary, Mark Cuban on YouTube, that video with me in front
of the aquarium is in a garage.
I was living in my friends, my childhood friend's garage.
I was, I was, I was pretty wealthy at the time. But yeah, I'm very frugal.
I think people should be frugal. I think especially as an entrepreneur, you should be frugal.
The first thing that comes to my mind when we're talking about a million dollars to eat some poop is
I could write 10 angel checks with that.
Darren, you need to... I'm joking, by the way, guys. Darren, you need to...
I'm joking, by the way, guys.
No, you're not.
Darren, for our new poll,
would you eat poop for a million dollars?
What was the question, Sagan?
Okay.
He wants me to make another poll.
It's like, would you eat poop for a million?
Yes, but make a poll.
Would you skip one? I think most people would, if poop for a million? Yes, but make a bull. Would you skip one?
I think most people would if it was a million.
I think even if they wouldn't admit it,
I think most people in the world,
I think I would say 90% of the world
would eat a small piece of small turd for a million dollars.
Darren, set up a GoFundMe for a million dollars
and say Rock will eat poop if we get a million dollars.
Otherwise, all funds are sent back.
And I'll donate it all to charity.
All right.
This has gone too far.
Can we delete this episode?
Because this is...
I am never getting into politics.
I am.
I am.
I am.
I am.
I am.
I am.
I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am.
I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am.
I am. I am. I am. I am. I am.
I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I am. I clips. I'll put some of the clips from this episode. To be honest, most politicians are probably weirder.
They've just managed to not tell everyone.
There you go.
Yeah, they were eating poop on Epstein Island.
So before we leave the MeanCoin Mania space,
I wanted to ask you,
there's one we haven't mentioned,
which I feel like I'm not chilling it.
I'm a big fan of it but
no one's talked about uh pengu pudgy penguins they're like the only meme coin that i feel like
has really truly penetrated like into normie society like dogecoin i think came close but
it's still i i feel like very uh internet culture if you will thank
you i i know i i have some friends uh they were playing poker some friends and i said and there
are none of them are in crypto and i said how many of you know what pudgy penguins is they all said
no no idea and then i pulled up my phone i showed them a gif of the pudgy penguin oh yeah i know
that thing yeah i use it all the time so So it's interesting. Does anyone have any thoughts about Pudgy Penguins
and this being like a meme coin
that truly has penetrated social norms?
I would say that Penguin is not really a meme coin
and that the Pudgy Penguins NFT franchise
has broken it.
They've got stuffed animals in Walmart
and all kinds of stuff like that.
So there are people who have no clue
what NFTs are, no clue what meme coins are,
and have heard about cryptocurrency and passing
who know what Pudgy Penguins is.
If this was 2021
and we're at the meme coin mania season,
like that part of it,
Pudgy Penguins would probably have
like a 300 eater floor like it's unbelievable that they're still at 10 each with just i can't
go a day without seeing them and that's my days without cryptos and i open instagram i see them on
everything i see a video of you know a live concert and for some reason there are pudgy
penguins on stage and they're dancing like Like, they have probably the best marketing team
in our entire industry.
And yeah, a lot of people have no idea that they're NFTs
or anything like that.
My partner, she knows what pudgy penguins are,
but she doesn't know their NFTs.
So I mean, yeah, they've, it's probably
the best marketing we will ever see in crypto, to be quite frank on it.
It's incredible how well they've done with that.
But yeah, if this is 2021, those NFTs would be generational wealth level.
And by the way, that was all part of Luca's vision and design from the very start.
So it's not like that just came to be.
It was all part of it from the inception.
Yeah, no, like we actually were in contact
with Pudgy Penguins really early on
when they were starting up.
And we were talking about building them,
an AI model that could build Pudgies
and stuff like that.
Now we did that for Biowassies
and they immediately shot up to, they went 3X and 4 uh that could you know build pudgies and stuff like that now we did that for by wassies and
like they immediately shot up to like they went 3x and floor and a lot of people used it so we
were on really good grounds to be able to offer this to other communities and get integrated with
them pudgies were the only ones that said no it doesn't align with our brand because they were
family friendly and we were a bit taken aback by it i said okay fine leave it then, leave it then. But they knew exactly what they wanted their vision to be.
They didn't want to just latch on to anything
that could get them a quick movement.
I have massive respect for them
because they turned down what was an easy win
in their early days because that's not their vision.
But it's pretty insane.
They really know their shit.
May I chime in a little bit about Pudgy Penguins?
And I guess more so Abstract Community,
because Abstract is their chain that's pioneering a lot of the...
I would say it's all IP,
because you guys were talking about how it's across various mediums,
from plushies uh to you know nfts
it's a meme coin um cartoons probably you know like it's gonna be a lot of stuff just with the
pudgy penguin ip but abstract chain is like a separate chain that they have and uh pretty much
everything on there whether it's the nft communities like thugs final buso bearish
kabu there's a bunch of them they're all like very high-end art it's very artist-driven
but it's all like all the ip i feel like it's kind of similar
and uh they have a huge like gaming section too they, too. They have a lot of games.
Some of them are kind of styled after, like, Fall Guys, which is a popular freemium game online.
And I just foresee, like, there's been some articles recently about how gaming, like, traditional gaming is kind of dying.
All the younger generations, you know, rather than being like a genre gamer, like,
oh, I play RPGs or I play real time strategies or I play, you know, whatever people are.
They just play a game.
They play Minecraft.
They play roadblocks.
They play Fortnite, you know, and that's kind of like and that's why all these mega corporations are chasing that next big hit. But I think with the abstract stuff, what they're doing with their gaming community and having all these games like tied into the various IP within the abstract.
So like the Fall Guys game that they kind of have where you're like running through obstacles with other people and stuff and like knocking people off.
It's all using their like pudgy penguins that they own and they were like little pudgies or like other characters and then they have like
a whole streaming platform um which is gonna probably rival twitch at some point you know
but it's all integrated with all of their ip like you can tip the streamers and all the various
abstract meme coins like pangu and whatnot um and yeah it's just like the whole ecosystem's all integrated
and i haven't really seen much meaning like that anywhere else
yeah no it's super impressive like um it's one of the few things that i get a little fomo on
when it's fudgy penguins because like for you know, apes went to this crazy floor price.
Now, granted, it was during a mania season.
But if we do see another NFT mania season, then I imagine penguins will be generational wealth level stuff.
What's their overall market cap?
It's pretty large.
What is it, 10,000 NFTs? I think they're at a floor price overall market cap it's pretty large what is it 10 000 nfts and
think they're at a floor price of 10 eater at the moment so yeah and do do mats but yeah it's uh
it's considerably low for what it is like especially when you compare it to you know
the big runners of last cycle like i mean moonbirds are kind of taking off again now that's 450 mil
if my back of napkin is correct uh yes that sounds about right big market cap
i don't know when you've got tokens that are you know just pure coins that are running over a
billion and this is an illiquid market as we know with well not fully illiquid but more illiquid market, as we know, with, well, not fully illiquid, but more illiquid than, you know, an AMM or anything like that.
But again, the market cap is 2.2 billion for Pengu.
Oh, that's Pengu, not the.
Oh, they're all related.
They're all part of Igloo.
So like that was the means.
That's where all the values value spread across i actually think
that's why they're one of the most popular brands like they have they have the the empties you have
your empty culture that loves them you have your meme coin which is on solano so your salami coin
culture loves them they have a video game separate they have uh all the walmart plushies they sold
like they have the gifts i i feel like there's not a brand in crypto correct me if i'm
wrong in crypto we tend to divide by bags or the very least you know you know your punks and your
war tapes and everyone they are their own clicks pudgy i think is the first brand that everyone
in crypto likes but truly i've never heard someone say they can't stand those pudgy penguins
i think you saw the airdrop, right?
They made a decision to airdrop to people who weren't on their native chain.
That's a difficult decision, right?
Lots of projects have failed at that state because that's a cost to maintain.
That's difficult to do.
I feel like that's the make or break decision on what you're referring to, specifically for multiple chains.
I think my mom sent me a pudgy penguin, uh, like GIF or meme or something once,
and she didn't even know that it was crypto. I'm pretty sure she did.
And that's, that's when you have brand exposure, that's some crazy exposure, right?
And, and what they've done, what they've done on the GIFs, um, they'ves, this is a new type of SEO, actually, that we're actually exploring at LDA on our marketing arm.
But you can basically do SEO for GIFs, and you can have it so that when you search Christmas, a pudgy penguin pops up.
Or if you do it, you can have it be like a quick swap Christmas dragon or whatever.
You can actually kind of hack these algorithms and people are doing this and
pudgy penguins has done it really well where like everything you search,
there's a pudgy penguin version of some GIF for that.
Yeah.
They're, they're masters in mind share.
Like it's really impressive.
Like, um, anybody would kill to have their level of publicity. Like they've, I think they've really shown crypto how it's really impressive like um anybody would kill to have their level of publicity
like they've i think they've really shown crypto how it's done and a lot of that showing it how
it's done was by barely even being crypto at all so yeah they've done incredibly well with it
but yeah i think if you if you search um litvM in the GIF section,
I think the fourth top option is a panda smacking rocks ass.
What?
Are you being serious right now?
Yeah.
Where do I search this?
Just anywhere, like LitVM.
Like if you were going to reply to this space,
type in LitVM in the gif section.
And then, yeah.
Let me try this.
Is that supposed to be you smacking my butt, man?
Yeah.
Are you trying to meme this into existence?
So should we wrap it?
I think the dogechain space is gonna start in like one minute or
maybe i have that time no no we did it already oh you did it no okay okay you're just getting
sleepy no no no it really is he was not kidding it really is a panda spanking me
from and it's over the office. That is pretty funny, man.
Listen, I just came back from work call and what
the hell did I go into?
Please, no one make
Rockspank coin on
Pump.Fun.
We're too busy making
poopy coin.
Yeah, this is actually
less uncomfortable than
the Pump.Fun.
I don't know, man.
I think they're both in maybe the same category.
You don't want to see Darren
spank me?
No, but for the right price, I will.
If you pay me to see that.
I mean, what you do
in your office is what you do in your office, Rar.
$500 an hour, we'll start talking.
I think that's the floor price.
Okay, Joel.
If you had to eat poop for a million dollars, yes or no?
No, but will I watch someone do it for a million?
$10 million.
Well, absolutely.
$10 million, Joel.
No, he's lying.
He's going to eat it for a million.
Give him a genuine offer right now.
I don't mean genuine genuine you have to pay him
if he does it and he will accept it
everybody would do it
it's a million dollars
for me I already achieved so many of the things
in life that people
use tons of money to acquire
so for me it would have to be
probably like a billion or something because
then I'm like well
think of all the good the good causes i could donate to with all that money or the the things
i could do i'm like all right maybe i'll take one for the team for that i don't think you were here
yeah that's what i said i said if i if if i did do it for a million dollars that's 10 angel checks
i could write on the poll there's uh six votes for yes and three votes for no.
So six would eat the poop for a million dollars.
Yeah.
I'm surprised Kate has not reported us and left the space at this point.
This is going to be our next Lockhearts research piece.
So for context, though, the banned poop eatersers from pump is still winning with 24 volts so like that's like 58 percent 60 percent 64 um so like 18 volts to 8 or something maybe 14 to
people people want it man people want one pump yeah they want it banned but People want pump. Yeah, they want it banned, but they're happy to eat too much to get money.
Fucking retard.
They want it banned, but if you paid them to do it, they would do it.
Interesting.
That's actually really interesting.
Human psychology.
Always fun to explore.
All right, guys.
We've been here for three hours.
We weren't supposed to go this long,
and we've definitely gone into pure degeneracy at this point.
It really goes downhill the minute Aztec leaves.
Yeah, it's true.
Aztec.
Hey, I tried to get you back on track several times.
You just were, like, not having it today.
We just really wanted to talk
about Outtower. It really
just started off weird and
just kept going.
Oh lord.
This is what meme coins do to your brain.
Wait, wait.
This is your brain on meme coins.
This is your brain on meme coins.
Literally from the quotes, Kate got her first hit political piece.
Once Rock goes into politics, Kate's going to be posting this.
Heard.
Yeah, I'm cooked, guys.
Oh, cooked.
Put up a poll
okay and with that
we're out guys
do we want to read the audience
yeah let's do that
I'm terrified
let's read some audience comments
quick swap says
took one hour and 11 minutes for someone to say
libertarian today and it wasn't even rock
wow that's a record uh yeah the poop eater poll is at uh 24 votes 58 we should ban the poop eaters from
pump and uh 42 do not ban okay and uh let's see here what do we got uh oh
here what do we got uh oh someone anthem on anthem heard us talking about poop i have so much respect
for this guy just pretend you didn't hear any of that anthem blankard uh he's in the audience uh
let's see he says why three stooges or the box cc i don't know what that means uh proof of poop help buffer cost of future colonoscopies uh guth says save me
crypto rocky uh oh i think that was when we were talking about men's men and their hero complexes
uh endogenous says when user friendly interface i'm not sure what you're referencing um
if it's quick swap we did just uh redo our website and like rebuilt a lot of the kind of spaghetti code from the early years.
And we've gotten a lot of really good feedback that QuickSwap's user experience is much better now.
I don't know if that's what you were talking about or some other project that was talking.
Let's see.
Anthem says, Meme pure, as pure jokes,
but blockchains let jokes evolve with enough holders in liquidity. A meme can fund community
projects, power games, or social apps, or act as a tipping slash micro payment later. What begins
as a laugh can morph into real economic rails. Yeah, that's a good point. Uh, he also says
patriarchy equals a long running system where men have held power in politics, work and family.
It shapes expectations.
Who protects?
Who fears?
Why do some women like horror movies?
They flip the script.
Fear in a safe space.
Adrenaline rush.
Control over scary feelings.
And even watching heroines fight back.
Fear explored.
Power reclaimed.
Hashtag patriarchy. Hasht hashtag horror movies um let's see uh yeah they
just love getting murdered guth says i hope you are listening lurky reverb not lurking with team
lurky today's a great day to sign up uh crypto cock coin says where is my fortnight invite cocker uh sounds like
cock coin wants to play fortnight with you guys uh i want to play with you guys but i know i'm
gonna suck and you guys are just gonna make fun of me and kill me a lot well no like on fortnight
like you'd be on our oh oh cool So you would bring the bot lobbies.
And you're going to yell at me for making the team lose.
I'm going to get blamed.
Jared says the number one meme on Katana is Kitsu Katana.
Anthem says Marketing 101, activate, engage, educate, offer.
Let's see. So Anthem says marketing 101, activate, engage, educate, offer, offer.
Let's see.
Caruso says first you cry, then you laugh and then you buy Bitcoin.
That cracks me up.
Crypto, cryptocurrency.
Guth says staying based on meme coins.
Okay.
We got a lot of comments from Guth and Anthem.
I'm going to skip a couple of these to get to some others.
Let's see.
Victor Brown says GMGM guys. Glad to be here this week. Let's see. Victor Brown says, GM, GM, guys.
Glad to be here this week.
Let's get the party started.
Good to see you, Victor.
You come to our spaces a lot.
Actually, you come to a lot of our other spaces too, including Dash, et cetera.
Let's see.
And BitAngels.
Curry says, damn, Polygon co-hosting a Gooner space.
That's wild. Let's see.
Leroy J says, I'm sat for aggregated episode 130.
Miss Bay says, I'm all in.
Caruso says, GMGM.
Cuban put a gif of Kermit the Frog saying hello.
Vishwishwar says, women do belong to crypto.
Take, for example, pioneers like Crypto Casey.
She's like my guru.
Yeah, good take.
Zemheri says, do we need new victims?
Is that for eating poop?
I'm assuming so.
Yeah, you can sign up for Poop Eat Coin.
It'll be out soon.
Vishwishwar says, well-spoken.
I agree with the person
who just spoke.
I don't know what he was referencing.
Crypto Cockcoin said,
Caleb did message me
like an hour ago
and said,
I'm going to do it.
And then I was like,
what,
eat poop?
And then he just didn't reply
for like 20 minutes.
So I chased up
and I was like,
you're going to eat poop?
And then he just,
he sort of just circumvented
the question.
Maybe he was getting
cold feet.
Or warm, huh?
Crypto Cock Coin says,
Banker Bot, send $1 in cock to Darren and say,
I will give you more if you eat your poop.
Oh, my God.
The audience seems to like the topic.
We're never doing this again, though.
This dies with this episode.
Obafun says, please, I want to ask Dogechain,
why is price going down and supply increasing?
Yeah, I don't know.
Crypto things, man.
Well, the price of a crypto goes down
if more people are selling it than are buying it, and the price of a crypto goes up if more people are selling it that are buying it
and the price of a crypto goes up if more people are buying it that are selling it so i hope that
clears up any confusion for anybody who wonders why token prices go up or down i mean i'd like
to ask the same for yeah are you financially i'd like to ask the same for quick swap and i i guess
we're i'm maybe in a safe place to say this because the SEC is not
attacking people. Cause I, we normally don't talk about price, but Jesus man, quick swap has bought
back like 6% of its supply in like a few months or something. Uh, and we are doing a ton of burns.
We're the first deflationary decks in the world. And our, if you look on, um Llama, the ratio of TVL to market cap, we're like at 0.4 or 0.04 or something ridiculous.
And there are most of the other coins are at like 50x their market cap to TVL ratio, I think it is.
And we're at like 0.4, some crazy, stupid low number.
It's kind of ridiculous.
I mean, it's literally the first
deflationary decks in the world. Like I, as a co-founder have never sold a single token.
And somehow it's at like a 20, $30 million market cap, even though we're doing, you know,
whatever 50, a hundred million a day in volume and burning most of the supply. Sometimes I don't
get this industry, how things are valued. We actually, QuickSwap has more TVL and I think like 10 times more volume than the entire Cardano chain, every application
combined, but they are valued at like a hundred X or a thousand XS or something. I don't get it.
I really don't get this industry. Sometimes it's like in a normal, in a normal business,
you would look at like price to earnings and these things, but in crypto, it's,
it's all mimetic, right? Cardano and hoskinson just i guess they just did the
meme better than quick swap did it's weird it's it's just where the market is right now man like
i know everybody's really fucking tired like i think good times are starting now like we've
finally seen bitcoin dominance head down to 100 week and it's starting to drop below it like i think we're going to see three months of relief for actual like utility-based projects
as right now whenever there's anything going into the old coin market it goes into pump fund and
then that goes into usdc and it gets extracted straight out the trenches like if you look at
bitcoin uh sorry if you look at total three minus the usdt market cap over bitcoin like
it's been going down since 2022 it has never gone back up we've gotten little bounces but we just
hit a new all-time low like a month or two ago so when people are sitting around saying oh it's
alt season like this token pumped 20x why didn't you pump 20x because the vast majority of tokens
have gone straight
down and nothing but down and usually the ones that do get those little pumps they're also going
back down afterwards i think we're coming into a better time for it i don't think anybody assumed
that we're going to get to this point in the market cycle like coming into 2026 and interest
rates in the u.s are still above four percent nobody would have bet on that in 2021 there's
just no cheap if you look if you look on DeFi Llama for holder revenue for tokens like and
this includes change so if you're like maybe getting buybacks from say or like the revenue
from like Polygon to pull stickers for the actual transaction
revenue quick swap is 23 in the list out of all the protocols in the whole world for buyback god
damn in the whole world excuse my language yeah i don't get it for buybacks i don't get it in the
last 30 days the revenue for quick tokens and buybacks was in four days in the last wow
i mean that's still incredible we're we're buying back and burning a million dollars in a month and
i don't get it i don't get it yeah no honestly it kind of pisses me off it's like what is going on
it's really fucking tiring like it's similar with imagine ai like we've spent three
years grinding out everything we're building and we know we have our state-of-the-art models in 4k
like mid journey and chat gpt can't do that we beat them to the punch we have 4k native models
and yet our market cap is in the toilet like right now there is no actual speculation around utility. There's only speculation around meme.
And my faith in the industry says that this does turn around eventually.
It's just taking a very long time this time.
But like similar with, you know, QuickSwap, Imagine AI, a lot of other really good projects
out in the space that I've been building really relevant and in-use stuff.
I mean, we generate over a million, we do over a million gens per week
on Imagine.ai across all of our platforms.
We're in over 100,000 Discord servers,
over 10,000 Telegram channels.
100,000 Discord servers?
Yeah, over 100,000.
It's still growing, yeah.
Wow.
Yeah, it's like price doesn't
recognize what's happening anymore.
I mean, look at this.
Cardano is $32 billion market cap, and Quickswap generates more revenue and does more buyback and burns.
And every metric is beating Cardano.
And it is, like, a thousand XR market cap.
I don't get it.
It makes no damn sense.
There are no peer-reviewed studies about
quickswap.
Yeah, Rock, you gotta start inviting people to your
ranch and dress up like a 70-year-old
man.
Maybe a pet pig.
Yeah.
And stop talking about eating poop.
Maybe.
Maybe. Or maybe that'll help
uh again i get the frustration man and i know i get very smarmy response to saying well the price goes down if people sell the token but i entirely get what people are saying that it is really
fucking frustrating right now because you've probably actually bought something that's
good it's just that the market is not reacting to it right now a lot of stuff out there that
people are buying it's really cool shit and then we see like absolute vaporware pump i mean render
is one that i point at a lot that it's just absolute vaporware like oh yeah we'll rent out
a gpu in somebody's basement to run your ai it costs more money than renting on the cloud it's less powerful and somebody might trip over a cable and lose all your
fucking work and yet it runs to a couple of hundred million in market cap even though nobody will use
it like we won't use it because it's more expensive less reliable and just garbage and yet it runs to
a couple of hundred million like right now there there is just, you are right to be frustrated
and everybody on here is right to be frustrated
because reasonable shit
and stuff with an actual business plan
and stuff that actually generates revenue.
I mean, we had the same with Imagine AI.
We're generating more revenue
than a lot of chains that were out there
just from fiat on ramps.
And yet the price doesn't budge.
Yeah, I think like every single time this is happening
crypto it has eventually u-turned and it's gone back to utility and all that like meme focused
stuff it flows into utility and after a couple of weeks of it people are poisoned on launch pads
and things like that because why would i buy you know this shit coin when i can buy into this which
is actually generating revenue?
It just needs that catalyst to start changing the narrative on it.
And I think it is coming because Bitcoin dominance is faltering at the 100 week.
Ethereum dominance is starting to spike back up.
I think this is what brings in that catalyst that people are going to get eager to put their money into shit that matters and shit that actually you know has a chance of returning value based off reason and logic like our market has always been a little bit
without reason and logic but never to this extent and i think it does turn around and we're going
to see a flood back into good well we saw this in the internet in the dot-com bubble right i mean
projects were either like well at one point they were massively overvalued, then they were massively undervalued, which is probably the same case with quick swap or others, right?
Is at during the peak hype, they get massively overvalued and then they get massively undervalued
after.
And then over time, the market starts to settle and starts to figure out how do you price
these things?
You know, we were looking at a report for um like a research paper uh and aztec
is actually writing um a couple research papers on litecoin and like looking at usage metrics and
things in a lot of like i think on bitpay and some other payments apps litecoin has more volume
someday since stable coins and bitcoin um yet it's know, a much smaller market cap. It has like tons of
users, massive community. So some of these things are just, you know, I think the industry needs
better ways of valuing these things, stuff like PE ratios and all the traditional stuff we use in
normal finance to value a company. We need that stuff through like Masari, maybe through Blockworks.
Kate's not here anymore,
but we need more people actually digging into this stuff.
Yeah.
No, I think it does get better.
And like everybody listening in on the space
can hopefully at some point take that to the bank.
But I think we're right now at a turning point.
And I think over the next couple of months, we will hopefully see, you know, hopefully at some point take that to the bank but i think we're right now at a turning point and i
think over the next couple of months we will hopefully see you know that cash is going to
flood back into people who've actually been building shit who've been expanding who aren't
just launching pump and dump coins and who aren't just reliant on launch pads bring in money by the
day and especially when you see other coins that are you know bouncing like 10x and 20x and they're based off absolute
fucking garbage they tend to all come back down to the median like if you've been patient this long
my recommendation is just keep being patient i this shit always turns around as rock said it was
very dot-com bubble burst especially at the end of 2021 there's a lot of crap out there that was kind of flooding the markets.
And I think it does recover
because the industry doesn't survive
if it's as simple as that.
And it's always survived.
Awesome, buy my token, thanks.
Yeah, man, that's crazy.
You have it in a hundred thousand discord servers
how many images are being generated with it it's over a million a week that we do now
a million images a week are being generated yep like the minimum that we hit on a daily is about
a hundred thousand so yeah what percentage of those are uh not safe for work only about 10 or so maybe even less really checked yeah
most people it's why we were kind of annoyed in one sense saying no we have to keep the uh the
freedom first approach on it and that like we won't censor your content because if we did that
we would have been able to keep visa and mastercard and kept all of our revenues that were coming in
but we didn't want to set
that bar.
We didn't want to bow to it because we have so many protective systems that are in there
right now.
Even if you go to our homepage, you can filter all NSFW stuff straight away.
It's off by default.
I was like, no, if an adult wants to use our models for it.
A second side of it is when it comes to AI models and we found that whenever
we try to put safety rails in them or anything like that or try to bias them towards you
know what some models do in certain political stances stuff like that you make them dumb
like we did that with NIFU originally we put in a bunch of safeguards around certain topics
and for whatever reason she forgot forgot how to format a JSON
response.
It didn't make any sense.
We weren't giving it any more context or data
than we normally would.
We just put into basically her prompt saying,
don't talk about this stuff and dissuade somebody from it.
You don't like this stuff.
And then she forgot how to write JSON
and a load of other things.
We found that when you try to dilute down models and, you know, either prevent them from understanding something at a principal level, or you allow them to understand it, but you tell them you don't like that, which is, you know, sentiment is not as intuitive to a model as it would be to a human.
You make them dumb.
It's like some of their brain power gets chopped off in order to make sure
that it aligns with how you're thinking so that was one of the reasons as well that we didn't want
to start safeguarding all of our models because it makes them worse and if you get better quality
in your safer work stuff because your model has an understanding of what anatomy is in general. I think that's worth a trade off anyway.
I think with all of these systems, you need to put more trust in people.
We've got safeguards in place on it already.
And you can't make content with non-consenting characters and stuff like that.
And I think beyond that point, this is a really good platform for all things, be it, you know, NSFW or it's 90% of people use it for SFW.
We even have like automated reward systems and stuff like that.
We're one of the most popular generative art platforms on the internet, except our price is at like 3.5 million, something like that.
at like 3.5 million, something like that.
So yeah, and so trust me, when I hear the complaints
of like, why is this token doing so poorly?
I understand everybody's frustration
when it comes down to it,
because right now it feels like bizarro land,
that we have so many people using our platform.
We're growing by the day.
Our revenues-
How can people use your product?
How can people try it out?
I'm on the website right now
darren sent it to me um i'm trying to generate stuff but i do i have to go premium to try it out
no just hit generate make an account and select the model gen is pretty good that's the
bare standard one and run with it you just type in any prompt you want on discord you just add the
ni bot or you can dm the ni bot as well and we're in a we're in like more dms than we are in servers
actually but yeah if you just dm the ni bot and that will allow you to generate an image too
i dm'd you the uh the telegram bot as well yeah cool the telegram bot has a couple of bugs that we're fixing right
now on it so apologies if you have issues with that uh gen won't work uh it's all coming out
gen won't work but all the other models will and we'll get the rest of that fixed up over the
weekend we just completely rewrote our entire infrastructure over the past three months and
we're just playing catch up on a small few things there we also have all the state-of-the-art models on there as well like you know google's nano banana flux ultra stuff like
that uh cling for videos but our models are actually way more popular on the platform so we
you know we know it's good software we know people are enjoying it and yet the market cap is lower
than most like pump fun coins on day one it's insane and yeah so
just say i 100 understand people's frustration when they're speaking about token prices
it doesn't make sense right now and i think it will start making sense again over the next couple
of months so if anyone wants to oh i actually they can probably just find it on your... So, guys, follow Imagine AI and try it out.
I'm on the website.
I'm looking at a lot of the case, not case studies,
but, like, previous stuff people have generated.
It's pretty cool.
Yeah, if you switch from trending to top,
you'll see kind of the best stuff we've gotten over the last month or two.
And, like, a lot of it is really cool.
Like, our front page has gotten awesome over the last month or two and like a lot of it is really cool like our front page has gotten
awesome over the past couple of months with the brand new architecture and the 4k images all that
kind of stuff like we've a huge amount of use and for us yeah we know the token price is just
horrible right now but we're building out a lot of crypto specific stuff they're going to add on top
of it like our agentic platform is coming back stuff like that you get automated tips based off your artwork as well so depending on how many
views you get how many upvotes you get you get imagine tokens straight into your wallet and
there's no claim needed or anything they're literally straight into your wallet so like
there's a lot on here to play with and a lot of new models are also going live as well at the
moment as well so yeah like do play
with it give it a try if you don't want to make an account use discord or telegram and you can
just call it straight away so yeah um like i'm really proud of what we built over the past three
years the fact that we're able to fight with midjourney and chat gpt on their image models
and beat them on a lot of, you know, a lot of those
categories that we're in.
And this is essentially like resource wise, we have nothing near what MidJourney or OpenAI
would have.
But we've brought this and gotten it.
Yeah, I'm not.
I don't super love Grok's image generation.
I've been kind of looking for something that could do good image generation.
So I'm going to check it out, man.
Yeah, I do.
And Grok is just fluxed.
Like, their model is awful.
It literally just fluxed with a small fine tune on it.
So yeah, I'm surprised that Elon has kind of allowed Grok
to be that far behind in that kind of area.
Same with their video generation.
That's just one.
Like, it's an open source model with a little bit of fine tune.
It's really surprising they're spending so little on it, but I think they already have such a massive market share
that why would they need to improve on it?
Kingdink, Kush, I know you do a lot of AI
image generation and video generation. Have you looked at this?
I just signed up.
Nice.
Awesome.
And if any of you want a premium account or some credits
to try out the paid stuff with, like the 4K gens and stuff,
just fire off a DM with your account username.
And yeah, just your username.
And we'll get that set up for you.
And how do I?
So I'm looking at signing up here.
How do I do it in a like safe way?
If I sign up like through my X, for example, what permissions am I giving?
Is it able to read my messages?
What is, how does this work?
Oh no, we, we don't have anything like that at all.
We can't read your messages.
We're just authenticating you.
Like any way that you sign up on there is just to get like any one of the platforms be it telegram x
or you can just use email or your metamask signature if you want uh we don't store any
details on you at all like we can't read your messages we can't see what servers you're in
we can't post anything on your behalf it'll say it when you click it anyway it should say like you know it's just authenticating you and that's it so yeah you
can use your x account you can use firecaster um what else we have on there i think yeah you can
send it with your discord you can send it with telegram you can send him a metamask or you know
crypto wallet and i think we yeah we also just if you just want to use standard email
sign up and you don't want it linked at all you can also sign up with that i'm running into some
unauthorized error logins i've tried logging in with my gmail tried logging in with my x
and i keep getting this like pop-up for unauthorized really give me one second and let me do a check on
that so i know there are updates
being rolled out at the moment and I'm wondering did I shill it at the exact wrong time. Should
I try to sign in with...
Install.
I know, right?
I know, right?
Let me say it was... try control alt and f4 no alt and f4 i watch you say you've tried it
is x or uh sign the contract with my wallet no just kidding kidding put my private key in yeah
exactly let's see um i'll just try a quick sign in with x
uh i did it with email and it worked okay cool and i'll try uh yeah I'll try getting on Twitter
let's see if we have any issues
that are cropping up on that site
it's not letting me generate an image of a panda eating poop
what model are you using
I'm just on
should we wrap this up for now troubleshooting individual concerns?
We're trying to help him shill his product here, Nicole.
All right.
All right.
I did manage to...
We'll wrap up here.
I'm in now via my manual email.
But I tried also using my Google uh auto sign in and my x
and that's where i was getting those pop-up errors but i was getting with x anyway um
maybe it was a page that was logging in from i'll do a look into that but yeah
um i'd say you just run with email for the time being okay well you'll see my email probably in
your new signups king KingDankush something,
Gmail, whatever.
Yeah, if you just fire me on whatever username
that you pick on it,
you can go into your settings,
change your username or whatever,
and I can get you set up with some premium credits.
It's the same username as my ex.
Nice.
You guys, over here,
you get some free credits in premium
if you DM the Imagine X account here
and tell them you heard about Imagine on the QuickSwap spaces.
Yeah.
Hey, one.
And, Rock, if you're trying to generate a panda eating poop,
make sure you have fast mode on if you're not using – if you don't have a premium account already. So you have to have fast mode switched on,
right now that's on Discord, but we'll get you credits and you can make your 4k panda eating
poop. So yeah, just DM me on your username and we'll get you upgraded for all your dirty things.
So everyone knows I am not trying to abuse pandas. I'm trying to make, I'm trying to mess with Darren for, for making it,
for making a gif of him spanking me as a panda.
That's what it's all about.
All right, guys. Great, great space. Everyone.
Next week we'll be much more serious.
We're doing one on a digital asset treasury companies and we'll have some big
speakers on and we can get back to learning real stuff and no more.
This is your brain on memes.
What's that?
I said catch you in Singapore.
Take care, man.
See you there.
All right, everyone.
Thanks everyone in the audience who stuck around.
I see Leslie in the audience, Marilda, Ale, Luke, Lurk, shout out to Medieval Empire, Lurky, Pippi, Sheldon, Eith Daly, LDA Tesseract, Cuban, Victor Brown, Extraterrestrial, Giving the Hearts. Good to see you, Extraterrestrial Giving the Hearts, good to see you Extraterrestrial and good to see you Baby Yoda
CK Cardano
German Bombshell, Ryan Chow
Nerish, Kumar
Gage Weston, Owen Ramsey
SV Sredharan
Rajip
Saba, Alan
Burb, Protofire
one of the best dev teams in the industry
good to see all you guys,
and catch you next time.
Bye-bye.
Later, Zul.
Thanks for having us, Rock.
Have a good weekend, everyone.
Okay.
Thank you, Darren.
Love you, Panda.
Bye-bye. Aaron, love you, Panda.
Speaker
Dogechain💜
from
Dogechain
