All right, gm gm gm welcome
Let's uh, give it a little bit of time. I was still pulling a few guests onto the
um, but I guess in the meantime, uh, i'm gonna just uh
So yeah guys what a day what a day
Um, I don't know if some of you are returning guests. I do see some familiar faces
But if you are returning listeners, uh, some of you will have noticed that we have rebranded
Um, and if I had my soundboard all the horns and bells and whistles will be going off right now
But yeah guys what used to be rev motorsport is now the motorverse
Um, it is something that we've been cooking for the last two years
Um first debuting with torque squad which is now finally coming to fruition as the new chapter
Of the motorsports ecosystem of animoca brands
Uh kind of brings a tear to my eye not gonna lie. Um, so with that
Welcome to episode four of the rev show mega space. Um, I guess it's now the the
Motoverse, uh show if you will
Um, so i'm your host matt solomon. I'm a form the three and gt3 racer
And have been a full-time deejan with animoca brands since 2020
I'm the brand ambassador for uh rev motorsport. I mean, I mean the motorverse
Um, and also the founder of torque squad, which is the official pfp of the motors of the motorverse ecosystem
All right. So segment one today is gonna cook
Um, we have the animoca brands family all here
Um, and we're going to be talking about interoperability the big word the big scary word
So quickly if you're new here how this space will work is we've got three segments with some incredibly
Wow, incredibly decorated. Uh, i'm getting my words mixed up. I'm too excited
Incredibly decorated builders founders and contributors from all over the web3 space
So each segment will last around 45 minutes and at the end of which we're going to rotate the speaker panel
So let's get into it to kick things off with first segment
With the animoca fam. We have our great friend and ceo of animoca brands. Robbie young. Hey, Robbie
Hey, how are you? Great to be here. Thank you for having me
Thank you for being here. It's exciting to to have you here
Um, yeah, what an exciting day. I do want to ask you
Especially with all of the animoca family here
Interoperability is something that we love to talk about right? It's a big scary word, but we love talking about it for good reason
Tell me I guess first of all
How are you and second of all tell me more about your view on how like, you know
How we as an as an ecosystem as an animoca family?
Um can leverage each other's strengths and I guess ultimately be interoperable with one another
Cool. Um, well, i'm good. Thank you
Um, the the weather's a little bit rainy here in the uk where I am today
But uh, but i'm excited particularly about the launch of the motorverse today
Just because as you said, it's something that we've been you know cooking up behind the scenes ourselves for a while and and
It's great to be able to share it with everybody else
And and also I happen to have a particular passion for the content category. So I have a biased opinion here
Um, but I think you know talking about uh interoperability
I think interoperability speaks to the heart of
What it is that we love about web 3 which is?
The true superpower of web 3 it's the ability for us to have
Interoperable value, you know in the in the form of fungible tokens that we can exchange between
games and projects and metaverses
To allow us to be more powerful as an interconnected group of applications. Um, and I think that
hopefully, um, you know going to demonstrate this in part with what we're doing with the motorverse because
You know going and playing
Five different racing games and having to buy five different cars and five sets of tires and five paint jobs just doesn't make sense to me
And why can't it be simple enough that if I have my favorite car?
I should just be able to use it anywhere just like I can drive it
You know my physical car on the road I like regardless of who I bought it from
That's so incredibly well put
And is definitely a sentiment that we've you know, we've been echoing for the last you know
I remember when I joined in 2020, you know, i've been with rev this whole time
It's really that's something that we've been talking about and I think finally
We are in a place to be able to to realize that
Um, we've also got some uh other very exciting speakers on here. Robbie i'm not not to cut you off
No, please do please do but I do want to bring on mr. Will Griffiths
Who you know to to address the elephant in the room with this massive rebranding of animoca's one of animoca's oldest web3 projects
Will my boss? Uh, how you how's today been? Um, and what I guess what have the last 18 months been like for you?
And what does this all mean?
Yeah, i'm pretty good. Pretty good. This is this is so I think in the in the trailer we published this morning
It says it's powered by racing hearts
uh, the motor bus that is and i've been looking at that thinking oh, that sounds nice
But like now like I am one of those racing hearts like I can feel my heart racing
It's like playing sport or something. This is
This is really incredible. So
I've been here like you say for for 18 months and I
Was given this sort of lego kit of different ip and the rev token
This amazing community and history and you know what you're doing with talk squad and everything
And it definitely has been a journey putting it putting it together into something and I think
I don't know man. Like it's just I I kind of want to sort of swear it sounds a bit cheesy, but like it's seriously
Amazing to see something that we've all been working on come to life and that you know, the motorverse.com
Live today, you know, you've been looking at it testing it localizing it and all that good stuff
And just having it live I showed it to my kids this morning
They haven't got a clue what it means because they're very young still
But they you know, they they played around with it
It's it's awesome and it is as Robbie's saying like it is all about interoperability. So that's where we see
Uh where that we we can really use cars to demonstrate that in a really kind of effective way that just makes sense, right?
People are used they've learned the wrong way
Basically, like buying these things in these walled gardens in different games and we want to change that. So yeah, it's great
I feel great. How are you?
This has been taken talk squad too
You know, I I kind of joked about, you know having a tear
Brought to my eye, but you're not gonna lie. Like it is quite emotional, you know, it's been a you know
I've been with the company for three years. Um long, you know launched talk squad two years ago and a lot of these ideas
or like at least the early seeds of these ideas and and the kind of the
Artwork and a lot of the the lore and stuff came from a lot of that. So it is a proud moment. Um, i'm excited to you know to
Have been you know ridden that roller coaster and and when we're finally here, um, but it really is just beginning
Which i'm super excited for
Now you've you've touched on a few big points there and i'm gonna definitely come back to you on some of those
Um, and I understand that we might have you for a lot of this space. Hopefully all of it
Um may not be speaking the whole time, but i'm gonna come
To you for some big nuggets. So, uh, i'll i'll be right back
Guys, so time for some introductions. Uh, we have a few new faces to the megaspace. Um, we also have some
Um, uh, actually most of most of the animoka family here are uh new faces, but i'm gonna start with stephan who?
Uh, I believe has been here almost every time. Um stephan. How are you doing?
Okay, stay hanging around here. Thanks. How are you?
Good good stephan introduce yourself quickly and then we're gonna pass it around
Sure, um stephan my name sitting in germany joined animoka a year back before 15 years 14 years
13 years something around that between 10 and 15 years
Of a two product development, right?
So, um a lot of free to play stuff client stuff mobile stuff
And now trying to bring basically gaming to web 3. That's why i joined animoka together we see
interoperability and everything we are
Trying to achieve with the motor horse, right and everything that's under the hood of that
Um to create some exciting experiences for the gamers out there and that's one year
Amazing. Thank you stephan. Yeah, one of the motorverse chefs if you will
Um, all right, let's pass it over to ucif. Uh, actually ucif who first interviewed me at animoka
Yes, you're right. It's been a long time like, you know and
Good to find out. Uh, i'm glad that we we met at that time and you're still with us like, you know
That's really great. Hi. I'm yourself
um, i've been with animoka for a number of years right before it was animoka and I it's
It's great to see kind of I won't call it passing of the pattern but the evolution of basically rev into the motorsports and we were
animoka was early in basically thinking of motorsports as kind of being uh,
Kind of magnet to attract blockchain enthusiasts gaming enthusiasts, right?
And I think as more and more brands as we've demonstrated are basically attracted to it which brings
an interesting set of audience
Confident that will stephan and many others in the motorverse team. We're basically
Take it beyond what you know, some of us started off to do
Definitely definitely no usef, uh is understating the fact that he is a you know
Really a founding father of animoka. Um is one of the you know, definitely a lifeblood of the entire company
Um, it's awesome to have you here usef. Um, we're gonna pass it over to chas stanton
Hello. Hello gm. Everybody
How's it going? How are you doing?
Good good. Yes. Yes. So, uh, yeah, i've beef beef info for those of you. Uh, i've not yet met
Um, so chas stands down the cmo here at forge
the subsidiary of animoka brands
And a big part of the animoka brand's journey the last couple years as well
So i've had the pleasure of sitting closely with the web team and seeing what you guys are
I'm up to from from the very early days. We've done a couple of things with you in the past
Um, and uh, and look just as everybody else is just so excited to see, you know
How this this uh, the motorverse kind of kind of really grows this incredible sort of motorport
Ecosystem in web 3 and I just yeah, it's it's such an exciting thing. So, uh, yeah really happy to be part of it and uh
Definitely. No, very excited to have you here. I still remember, you know is like with the forge team again one of the very, you know
Members of the animoka family. Um, I remember, you know, very early calls with with you guys, um early days
So yeah, super excited to have you here
Yeah, exciting. Uh, let's chug it over to mark mcginley with the ghost talk squad. Pretty cool. How's it going mark?
So, yeah, i'm mark mcginley. Um, uh, I sit on the economics team at animoka branch
I'm kind of a game designer, uh, but also help out on economics. Um been doing game design for about 15 years in
Mobile free to play triple a pretty much everything
Um, so yeah, I like sitting on the economics team
I'm kind of helping out from an advisory capacity, uh, all of our projects at animoka
Um, but i'd say that there's a couple of projects specifically that i've been working really really closely with in the last couple of years
um, one of them i'm i'm proud to say is is the motorverse and uh,
I feel like you guys are my adopted family. So, um, so yeah really it's it's been a pleasure working
On this interoperability stuff for the last last couple of years. So, um, yeah excited to to talk about it today
Yeah, definitely. I mean if there's anyone here, uh that can talk about exactly what the motorverse is doing in terms of interoperability
It is mr. Mark mcginley. Um
And you must be you must be tired. You've just been on a on a tokenomic space. Um
But uh excited to excited to pick your brains. All right
So we've got a few big talking points, um, and I know like I said, you know, interoperability is that big scary word
But something that we're really tackling head-on at animoka
Um, so we're gonna keep it civilized. Um, you know with free flowing discussion. So if you're on mobile, please raise your hand
Um, it is weird that i'm telling kind of all my bosses to raise their hands if they want to want to speak
But if you're on pc just wave at me frantically with that, um with that hand waving emoji and i'll call on you
Um, so let's jump straight into it
How can the interoperability between different blockchain gaming platforms studios and whatnot enhance the gaming experience for players?
Who wants to have a go at that?
Will does will's waving at me
Hey, yep, the the waving system works
Um, i'm clearly on pc. Um, so yeah, I mean like it makes a huge it makes a huge
uh difference and this is one of the things that i've been really focused on so my part of my background is in
uh on triple-a games but also
So i'm very much about find looking to find a way to find product market fit
So a way that the mass market and typical gamer would find this interesting
Because of course at animoca, like we have this amazing web3 community and it's an awesome way to like grow projects and get interest
But then longer term i'm thinking what could the motorbirds turn into?
When I when i've thought about that interoperability seems to be the the way forward. So I think it was around
Let's say august last year
We're playing around with
um a few different concepts and I went out for dad drinks with some of the dads from from school
And I was chatting away to these guys
And I was trying to explain what the motorverse was and they were you know
Kind of they weren't web3 native and they were like kind of
So hang on a minute. So what does it mean? Like why do why do I want to buy an nft?
And then that was actually kind of an interesting experience. I was like, oh, you know, basically it works like this
You you buy a car once and then it just works everywhere
And if you and as you use it more just like your real car
You can have all these experiences and you can add
Basically metadata and a story to the the car you own across multiple different
Games doesn't have to be games could be almost anything at all including in real life
And you can keep it you you own it you it's not something to do with that game
It's now yours and they were like hang on then that's actually that's actually like quite a lot better than the way it is right now
That's part of it. And then I think also
You know, it it leads to all meaningful purchase decisions
So people are very considered about the way that they buy things if they think they can sell them
And I think and especially if they know that with respect to time they're going to be able to use those things in more and more places
That becomes a very different paradigm. So the way that we often think about it is in free-to-play games
Buy things at quite a low rate actually
So if you're playing like clash of clans or something like, you know
You might play it for months on end and then eventually you cave in and buy some gems and you know
Feel kind of guilty about it. This is a very different kind of proposition
So I think we'll see a lot more people, you know
Once we get once we get the blend where we see a lot more people
Buying these things because they know they sort of understand the value of them with respect to time
Essentially increases the value of the ecosystem
So yeah, that's what I think about it
I don't want to go on I could probably go on about it for hours, but we've you know, we've got a few more hours
But i'll let someone else
Yeah, I love it. I think robbie
Uh, actually i'm sorry tina. I realized I completely missed tina. It was on on my row tina. I'm so sorry
Yeah, no worries at all. Hey guys, it's such an honor to be sharing today's face with you
Amazing news on your side and on a motorverse launch. That's absolutely amazing. So quick intro
I'm tina. I work as a head of partnerships at gamee for some of you who are not familiar
Gamee is one of the biggest mobile gaming developers in this space
Uh, we are exiting already more than 9 billion gameplays across our channels
You can enjoy our games on arcade app arc 8 or on telegram
where you will also find, um motorverse branded game, which we did last year in collaboration with the
And that's actually one of our most, uh popular and famous games on telegram
So I encourage our audience to check this out
Amazing no, thank you tina. Um, yeah, I mean I guess while we have you have you up here
um, I think arcade is a is a great platform to show off interoperability in terms of
You know interoperability from a collaboration standpoint
Um, tell us more. What do you what are your thoughts on interoperability? And how does that enhance the gaming experience?
Yeah, definitely so interoperability is one of the most fascinating aspects of blockchain gaming for sure along with the digital ownership which
so nowadays we see like a lot of
Individual interoperability experiences happening with different games or metaverses. We also see
a lot of um web 2 famous brands going into
Sephora and ikki for example and exploring this area
I think this brings like ultimate fun and ultimate biggest experience for users where they can go with only like
ideally with only one avatar in future and
Basically experience different games and trade different assets. So we are also very active in the in the interoperability side
We have hosted multiple experiences
For different pvp projects such as mocha wars and cool cats the holders were able to access
With their avatars to arcade platform where they could play the branded games like a cool cats game the mocha wars games
And they were able to gain some points and get some rewards
So there was like very fascinating and very entertaining experience and of course very rewarding as well
also, we did like collaboration with the decentralized games where our
NFT holders were able to basically get the
experience in the decentralized game side with the same visual identity and
Get the all the fun and all the benefits from the decentralized metaverse. So
Like huge area where there's like a lot of potentials which we are already aware of or not even aware of like there is like
No limitations whatsoever
Also with arising with the generative ai and with the chat gpt. It just gives such a
opportunities for interbody to expand even farther and to expand even like different metaverses and eventually get to like one ultimate metaverse where
People have the very smooth and very
Rewarding a fun experience while being there
Wow, that would be that would be amazing. Um, you know, maybe we'll come up with a ready player mocha
Kind of a kind of ecosystem. All right, it'll be amazing
Thank you tina, um, I I think I saw robbie's hand pop up at some point. Um, robbie. Did you want to chime in?
Um, sure. Sure happy to um, I guess first i'm quite excited to learn that I can actually use spaces on my laptop
Now I didn't realize. Um, I thought we were still stuck on mobile. So that's that's a good innovation
Um, but I think going back to your question about interoperability. Um, I think a lot of this also comes down to
Two things and I guess one is sort of at the beginning of the process of building a project and one is more
You know throughout the the life cycle of a project
At the beginning of a project. I think interoperability can really help you
with user acquisition and building a user acquisition funnel, um and
Interoperability allows you to
connect with disparate communities
To basically incentivize them or reach out to them and I think some of the best examples we've seen, you know for
Throughout the beginning of this year one of the big
Air-dropping of tokens to people who holds certain nfts
And this is a way to reach out to specific communities and engage them to go out and try new experiences
and so this is a way that we can lean into those network effects that are um, you know created by
interoperability of tokens to
Growth hack in a way that's you know, quite web 3 as opposed to the sort of traditional web 2 way of buying ads
I think the second part about interoperability
life cycle of a token and that you want to have all of your
tokenized assets whether it's value in the form of fungible tokens or it's
playable assets like, you know cars in racing games or you know things that are tokenized as nfts
able to travel as freely and widely as possible across
blockchains across protocols and standards because
What we're trying to do is we're trying to restrict the limitations that have been placed upon gamers historically
And allow them to do what they like with their content
Just like you should be able to do what you like with with anything that you own
Yeah, that's a that's a fantastic, um
looking at how you know, we leverage those network effects through um, you know through airdropping i've seen a lot of those campaigns and
They're they've been very very uh, uh successful in in doing so
Um chas, do you have your hand up?
And I see stephane waving as well. So go on chas
I do. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, just I mean just to quickly and these are all just incredible incredible points and I completely agree with with robbie there
Um something that I think about, you know in my own experience. I I grew up, uh with games like grand to isbo
And you know back in those days, of course
um, you know, it's the first time we've seen vehicles really kind of being um,
kind of produced digitally in a way that that made them feel real, you know, at least that's how it felt to me and I think
um something that that perhaps it isn't always talked about but I think is as important is the uh,
The importance of of transfer of identity as well
Um, so I know obviously with the mocha verse and and um,
I love the digital id element is becoming more and more important as part of our web 3 and digital interactions
um, but but when it comes to asset ownership and the ability to take an asset that you identify with and
People identify with you in a game. So for example, you have a specific car very rare car in a racing game
Um, you know and you are you're known as you know, the the guy with the bright green car
Uh with with this uh particular pattern on or whatever it might be
You want to be able to take that asset and use it in other games even if it doesn't always come with you know
Kind of status or experience points or whatever it might be although that would be great
Um, and that's obviously depending on what game you go into or whatever
But the ability to take that identity as well, I think is super important and I think that's something that gamers perhaps
Don't appreciate and don't realize they need but I think as they come to understand this technology and what we can do with it
Um, you know as you mentioned in in the example, um earlier of um,
Uh, you know your friends and non-web two friends trying to understand why this is important
Well, that's one way that I think it's quite easy for people to understand why this is so unique
Yeah, a hundred percent. Ids is something that are you know, you've got gamer tags, right?
And and i've seen so many people who have just uh, you know, just just
Either front run someone to a new game or taken someone famous is someone famous i've taken their
Um a username and whatnot. Um, and I think I guess the most famous case of that is being the the person that owned at x
Right, um when when twitter rebranded
A hundred percent that's that's a very good point. You got a name as well, of course. Why not? Yeah
Yeah, so so definitely there's a lot a lot of application for this and interoperability. I think is just is one
Yeah, you imagine taking at x and taking that to all the different platforms would be amazing
But anyway, um, we'll leave that one for for elon for another day. Um, stephan was waving at me
Correct. He was waving at you. Yeah, basically, I want to chime in on what rose said and also the trail said
Um, so basically we can create
Experiences now right for those kind of players. It's not only like simply straightforward, but it's been said like it's not only about racing
You just imagine you can drive your customer your your user to different experiences
Either on purpose right you can you can create a whole questing system based on that
So hey go go there and drive five laps here and then go there and explore
um the mountain with your freaking racing car and go up the hills and and you know
Get the flag from top of the hill
So whatever this is just like the idea that you can really create different gaming experiences
With the same asset, right? It doesn't need to be like a racing game as such
But you need a car there's different cars and all the different games, right? So just imagine the kind of
How wide you can go in regards to a very fun and new experience something with chaser set, right?
Necessarily, we don't even have the experience today that we are talking about here, right?
But everything is super possible and that's that's fun
Right to play around with it and to make users move from product to product
Um otherwise themselves or they can explore I just imagine at the same time as user come to a platform and experience
Wow, um, this is now the whole vast environment. I can experience
Uh with maybe a single purchase
So that's really like just charming and on this kind of wideness of experiences of gamification that we can do
Another other thing, um, it allows for example
Also, like guilds and alliances and um to kind of create new experiences for them
Right because they're also like pretty much like game focus sometimes
Um, and now they have the chance to kind of allocate their resources much wider
And if they want to go for an investment or like esports, right it opens another door for esports as well
Um, if you if you talk about interoperability
So that's additional aspects and angles you can look at
Yeah, no, definitely there's so many different ways it's it's amazing the more the deeper you dive into it just really becomes a
Um, but I see indor the founder of pixel links is on the stage now. Hi indor
I'm very good. How are you?
Yeah, very well. Thank you. Thanks for having me
Yeah, excited to have you here for for those in who are listening who may not know you can you give us a quick intro?
Oh, yes, of course. I'm indor ceo co-founder of pixel links. Uh, we are an animaker brand subsidiary
Founded the company about three years ago with
Deadmau5 and richie hawton both icons in the music
Industry and we came together to really reimagine. Um, you know the future of music and entertainment
We have a platform called chorus which enables co-creation between artists and fans
You can literally come onto the platform remix and own music from grammy nominated musicians and there's a whole
Really fun points and quest system that we've introduced into the platform as well
So if you love music definitely check it out. Um, and we've also launched a new project with uh, the black mirror franchise
Which we're bringing onto web 3
So again, if you love the black mirror ip and not only want to get close to put that franchise
But also co-create with the ip and earn with one of the most iconic
Uh ip's I guess in tv and uh in entertainment, uh, check out the smile club
It's a new project that we're launching as well
But you know our goal is alongside the animaker brand's ecosystem, you know to help build the open metaverse and um, yeah
Really help enable, you know a new form of creation and shared um ownership through
You know through web 3 and uh, yeah fun co-creation tools. So yeah, really great to be here
Awesome. Thank you. Ender. Yeah, i'm so excited for the uh for the black mirror collab
I mean, it's so relevant, isn't it with everything that's going on right now?
Um, I do want to ask you what are your thoughts on on interoperability?
I think especially in the music industry. I think that's something that
It seems to me just off the top of my head, uh seems to be a bit of a no-brainer
Um, but yeah, tell me tell me more and pick your brains a little bit. Yeah, I think um music and interoperability is a really interesting
A question or a space I guess to explore to some extent I think at like a really foundational level music is this
Universal language right people love it and consume it everywhere actively and passively right you'll go to shows and listen to it
Or you'll just be playing games and it's in the background. So
Music's presence I think has always been
Interoperable in some form right? It's kind of everywhere and uh the way people consume it is so
Multi-faceted, but I think in gaming there's a real huge opportunity to reimagine the music experience, you know, not only
Allowing people to listen to the music that they love everywhere, but also in some ways grow with their favorite artists, you know
You're seeing musicians like dead mouths, for example, who would build
Uh, you know spaces in platforms like the sandbox as well as platforms like chorus
And I think what's really fun is how artists are able to then take their fans on a journey through these different platforms
helping build out their sort of um, you know, creative universe and
Just extend the storytelling and universe that they kind of engage their fans in I think the biggest challenge with music is it's almost
Uh not really evolved in comparison to the rest of the world if we look at sort of gaming and interactive
entertainment and I think things like interoperability are just going to help push the music industry into
New new spaces new mediums that not only allow music as an asset to be consumed in different ways
But also let fans can collect and consume the music that they love in
environments that go beyond spotify for example where they can actually really dig in and get closer to
Their favorite artists and support them. So to me interoperability in music is it's a broad concept
but I really think what's exciting is
artists re-imagining how they distribute their music and taking fans to all these different platforms that they would have never really had the chance to
Take them into and uh build a journey with them
So yeah, there's a lot of fun stuff I think to to dig into there
But for me for sure it's definitely about what the new
Medium for artists means and how their music will actually grow in value as it starts to travel into these new spaces
So yeah to seeing where where that all goes and especially with chorus very exciting. Um
Cool. Do I have any more hands? I'm not i'm not sure I can't really
Uh, i'm not gonna lie. I can't really see them right now. Um, I do see will waving. Uh, hey will
Yeah, just quickly off the back of that. Nice to meet you. Um
basically about the about the music I
I think there's a really interesting
thing, uh, you know kind of thing between music and cars
You know that a lot of us use cars as a very specific
Place to listen to music in a certain way
Have often turned them turn the music up very loud. It's it's there's an opportunity to potentially do something so we should
Think about that and maybe talk more because we're going to be
Selling lots of really really cool cars
And we already have a lot of trainers with this awesome soundtracks and stuff
But like I really want to try and get your soundtrack kind of gta style involved
I love that we have that sounds amazing
Yeah, it really does. Uh gotta love a bit of uh on the fly collaboration. Um, but speaking of collaboration
Um, here's a question that I might want to throw towards ucif and mark
Um, do you guys believe that interoperability will lead to more collaborative efforts among gaming studios?
Why or why not and I want to ask that especially in reference and I guess ucif maybe you take this first because
You obviously have a close relationship
Uh with you know the app store the google play store
Um, and I think looking at that as a kind of somewhat of a walled garden versus what we see in web 3
What do you think is uh is going to be the outcome?
so I think it's uh, basically if if studios
Or if gaming studios were to see
As effectively a unified liquidity in there, right? So then they can basically say
Okay, if I were to participate in an interoperable layer
I can tap into a much larger audience than if I were just basically being in a silo by itself, right?
you know one of the reasons why everybody loves to plug into the internet is because
They can what is the internet? It's a network of networks. So by definition, it's interoperable. Nobody says hey, you know
There are nation states, whatever which are closed. They can't participate right? So you expand the reach so
Everybody looks for distribution, right? So I think in the you know
There are also external gator, you know gatekeepers right now, which may evolve over time, right?
Or you know the web will become you know
Maybe people will transition to kind of a web environment or some other environment where that will happen
I think it's I feel it's in the best interest
game studios to basically be interoperable right and to some extent the blockchain is also
Permissionless, right? So, you know if people are putting it on the chain then I can basically say hey
I'm giving this experience without asking me like I'm you know, I could basically if a game
Uh tower defense game decides to accept ref
As a payment token, it's more than welcome. It doesn't need to take permission from anybody, right? Because it wants to get that
audience and basically play the game
I don't I don't really have anything to add to that. I used it in such a great explanation with this liquidity layer
Exclamation. Yeah, I love it
I feel like that was a very you answer as well mark. I feel like it's something you would have said
Um, but I guess I guess I do want to ask you mark, uh in terms of you know, interoperability within the motorverse, right?
Being that we're on the motorverse space
You've been working very closely with the team with the game studios
What has that experience been like because I think you know, we all talk about this, you know, very utopian
Uh kind of future of all these game studios working hand in hand
Uh building standards that they're all you know, allow everyone to kind of play happily with each other
I know in many cases that isn't always true
Whether that's from a technological standpoint and there's certain barriers that that people have to overcome
Um or cultural maybe um, but so what has that experience been like working within the the you know, motorverse ecosystem?
Hey, it's it's been a real journey of discovery for me. Honestly, like, um, if we go back to like 2020
Um before I was with animoca, I was I was involved in the the web3 space. Um, you know, it's a
As a participant in the in the economy. So, you know as an investor as a
NFT um mentor and stuff like that. Um, I did crypto kiddies was my first NFT that I mentioned. Um
You know, I coming from a more traditional kind of gaming background
I was very much on the the naysayer camp of interoperability or never worked like it's stupid. You shouldn't even suggest it
Um, think of the poor game designers think of the poor teams that are gonna have to implement this
It's how how are we ever gonna get it to work?
And and I think my viewpoint has massively changed, um over the last four years, um, you know from
The position of uh, let's you know, let's be open-minded to it
Let's let's think about how you know, what would it take to make it work?
And when you start digging deeper, um, you discover there's actually multiple layers of interoperability, right? There's like, um
You know having the same object taking different meaning in different different games
Um, there's having the same object have the same meaning in different games. That's obviously a lot harder to do
but with the rise of things like
AI and technology and you know
And there's a strong desire for for games and brands to work together
I think those challenges are a lot more solvable, um today than they were four years ago
So i've definitely changed my opinion completely
I think everyone within the animoka network
Is fully open to this idea and fully on board with pushing this they see the valley, you know, it's like
Um, I i'm gonna want to implement your car in my game because I want your users, right?
And then that's like that's kind of an easy sell for us. Um at this point
So the hard thing is how do we make it work, right?
So we've we've been developing a set of standards. Um
There's a kind of first layer to you know, how do we get how do we build a language of vehicles so that it can?
Each game can talk talk to the vehicle and I really understand what that vehicle is and how it should work in each of those games
I think the great thing about motorsport vehicles is that these things are very much
A common language anyway, um, there's a common vocabulary if you look at a shooter game
You know you have shooters where their third person shooters their first person shooters their sci-fi or their fantasy
You know fantasy, um role-playing games like character can't easily just be converted from one game to another
It's a lot more challenging for the car. It has wheels. It has a kind of known set of properties
Um has a very clear visual look so it's it's a lot more solvable for us
Um, and i'm really excited about how our studios are collaborating together. Um on solving this so, you know
We're working with with some assets at the moment, uh
Yeah, I mean we're gonna make it happen. It's it's it's a real thing
Alpha alert, I love it. I love it. Thank you mark. Um, that's it
Yeah, it's it's great to hear from from from you know, someone like you who's who was very much. Um, you know on on one
Side and it has been converted and now you're you know on the
On the on the front lines, um doing some pretty cool stuff
And and I guess it was kind of a loaded question because I do know what you are working on
So, uh, i'm very excited to see what comes from that
Guys, we're coming up to the end of segment one. I know it's been an incredibly rushed segment
There's so many amazing guests on here
Um, so I want to thank you guys, uh so much for being here. First of all
Um for all of you guys listening, um, if you're enjoying the space make sure you go and throw us some purple hearts some thumbs
Whatever you want to do. Um
Follow go and follow all of our speakers. Um, all of them are building uh in the animoca family
All building some incredible incredible experiences
And if you do have a question, um going to the bottom right little chat bubble, uh, throw us a question
We'll try and get your answers or your questions up to our speakers
Um, send a like retweet, um and reply and uh, yeah if you're enjoying this, uh, just just keep listening, I guess
All right before we rotate to our second panel, is there anyone that wants to uh wants to say some final words before we boot you are?
Don't worry about hands just free for all
I think it's it's all been said
But thank you so much for hosting this and i'm really glad that uh, we can all you know be here to
Chat on the uh, the launch day of the motorverse
So it's it's exciting because frankly i'm looking down at my screen here and uh, and there's a lot of turkeys out there
There are there are thank you so much robbie. Thanks for uh, thanks for giving us your your valuable time as always
Hey, you know, I thank you for having me on the show like it's uh
I'm really glad that you know to see all this hard work come to fruition
You know look forward to there's a lot
I know the team has a lot of things in the roadmap and
I think all of you gonna many of you are going to be at nft paris
I won't be there. I look forward to seeing photographs of you know the event soon and hopefully will can give us
You know, uh stayed as a page shortly after nft paris
Amazing. Thank you. You said thanks for being here your first rev mega space. So hopefully come see you back for a lot more
I like I think that you have requested an update after nft paris. Well, definitely be getting one of those
It's like it's really I mean, I don't know like we've done a few of these spaces and they're all
Great, but it's so it's so good to be talking about the motorbears now. I keep pinching myself
I was talking to the guy who
Who uh, jason who put the website live this morning and we were just sort of virtually high-fiving on a zoom call about
Because we because just all of the the thought that's gone into it. One of the things that mark was saying was
About this, you know, you're basically creating this ecosystem that incentivizes all of the different people who are part of it
So you're able to if you're a vehicle brand
You're interested in publishing your vehicles in the motorverse because you know that they're going to have utility and we've seen loads and loads of people
As nft's and they've kind of done. Okay, but they haven't had the utility necessarily
And so when we start talking to these brands, this is the sort of thing they're worrying about
They want to they want to find a place where they know there's going to be utility
but they're not they're not experienced builders they're not making games or
Anything that kind of fulfills that so they this is this solves that problem for them
And also they know there's going to be this sort of growing demand and this expectation
There and so that solves their problem
And then you go and look at the studios
Like mark was saying you've got these guys who are making experiences at the biggest problem studios have as user acquisition
It's really hard to get people to come into your game
So if everyone who owns a car gets a notification that there's now a new place for them to go take their car
It's a pretty good chance they're going to turn up in that game
So that solves part of the problem for them
And then the other thing that is a big challenge is their licensing
And so if we've got these guys these big licenses publishing
Cars that these game studios have access to then
Everyone wins and also the users to get the interoperability thing. So it it makes sense
So yeah, I just wanted to kind of
Expand a little bit on what mark was saying
Yeah, no, I mean that's that's great. That's literally, you know, you basically answered the question I was gonna ask
Which is around, you know, what does interoperability mean for the motorverse ecosystem?
But no, I mean you answered it very very well there, um in terms of having a playground, um for all of these
Um, you know with with for example with the the torquays with the torque squad
PFPs or everyone to come and play because they know there is somewhere for them to play right?
So if if if that was going to be your question is that there's a little more as well like so
The forecourt of the internet
So, you know, it wasn't going to happen like immediately but like in a few years time
Would be fantastic if the car brands are thinking oh, we're going to launch a new car. We better
You know call the motorverse and publish it there too because then this is then you're basically creating this
place where you can start to
mirror the real world and that's really what we're doing we're trying to offer this experience that people have through real
Car ownership in the real world, but online, you know, it takes some time to be perfectly replicating that
That's the goal. And I think that can you know, then you start to get into the territory of people
um, you know trying out a car before it's even being
Uh launched in the motorverse, you know, like in five six years time like well, let's try this concept
Let's launch it here and see how people react to it. Um, so yeah, I think that interoperability enables
Really really exciting times. Um
All right. I think we have a lot of speakers up from uh, our
Second speaker panel. Um, so everyone give them a throw them all the thumbs and hearts and whatever
Um, let's start off with some intros first off. We have our good friends
Definitely on mythical. Uh our great friends nfl rivals gm. Welcome back
Um gm thanks for having us
Yeah, thank you for being back. Um again, I guess for for all the new people listening. Why don't you kick us off with an intro?
Yeah, good morning everyone gm, uh, i'm jonathan head of community at nfl rivals
Which is built by mythical games where we're trying to build blockchain enabled games for the masses
Um nfl rivals is a mobile game which you can is fully licensed with the national football league
That's american football and the nfl players association and you can download today for free on the app store and on google play
Thank you john i'm gonna definitely gonna ask you about uh
Probably about licensing at some point because I think will touched upon it there
So i'm gonna come back come back to you on that next up. We've got defy kingdom
Um, good morning. Good morning. Glad to be here. Uh, yeah, we are defy kingdom. We are a
Game of i defy platform and building out a
Full-fledged rpc on top of that
Uh, so everything gamified start to finish
Love it. Love it. Uh, it sounds like you're driving. So be safe. Um
Eyes on the uh eyes on the road. Um
We're all about safety here at the motorverse
Um, so yeah, uh nitro league welcome
Gm thanks so much for having us. Uh, my name is travis over at nitro league. I do uh bd and
Um a lot of our communications and such sorry about my computer being in there
Um, but but no, thank you so much for having us. We we are a racing game where we're live with an early, uh
Beta you can download it for free now. There's no token gating or anything off our website or off game swift
Love it. Thank you travis. Uh very on brand. Um, so yeah, very excited to see another
Project on here. I know that you guys are partnered with our good friends over at drivers and I do see mr wedge in the
listeners, um and also andy, uh, so i'm gonna give you guys a big shout out, uh while i'm at it
Um, all right, who do we have next? We have evil plan
Hey, what's up guys? Uh, sorry, I was running a little bit late. Um
Yeah, i'm really happy to be here. I I guess
Tldr on on us. Uh, we are
And this gets tossed around a lot, but I think it's fair here. We're the first, uh
generative ai entertainment and gaming platform
So we're focused on a platform. We build we call ai sports. It's focused in the sports vertical
2019 we've been building around the intersection of ai and blockchain as it pertains to entertainment
So yeah, we have um two titles right now. One of them is pre-launch them is launch
uh our launch title a current launch title is called bernard dao, which is a
A like on-chain squid squid game show where people compete for large cash prizes in an elimination game
Which we're really excited about and that's that's just launching now and then
Kind of in the in the background we're working on a more of a sports league concept. We call secret fight club
To compete in online streaming tournaments for for cash and prizes. So super super excited about both of those and really happy to be here
Amazing. Thank you so much. Um, I see we have mr. Yatsu the godfather here with us today. GM. Yat
Yeah, I just arrived. I just arrived in paris for nft paris. So i'm here and just uh, literally
Um, you know if you're hearing me unpack and unzip that's because i'm basically taking my luggage out. So
Great well, I hope you had a hope you had a good flight. Um, and I guess uh
Yeah, we'll quickly finish off some intros and i'll come back to you in a sec. Um, I see we've got mr. Wedge gm
Yes, yes, mr. Sully, how are you, mate? You good?
Very good. How are you doing?
Yes. All right, mate. All right, another busy day as always, but yeah, good, man. Good. Can't complain
Very good, uh for those who don't know you quickly introduce yourself
Yeah, cool man. So um, yeah, i'm mr. Wedge. I'm the founder of the drivers project uh dr slash vrs
And um, yeah, we we have generated a pfp project
Uh, yeah launched in back in november 22, but yeah, we we do lots of things drivers related basically
And yeah big fans of the motorverse and the talk squad and yeah a lot of time for it, man
Amazing another another very on-brand project. Love it. Um, thanks for being here. Mr. Wedge. We've got ivy alley next
I was almost confused right there. Yeah, thank you very much for having me. I'm juju key
I'm there to bdm marketing for ivy alien and ivy alien is the first person to shoot a bridal royale game
Launching on polygon with the idea
Dear and goal of not just being a gaming project but a brand as well for gamers and not gamers
I like thank you so much for having me
Thank you very much, um, all right, who else do we have we've got night web3 night gm
Good evening from my side though. Um to be here guys
Love car racing games sadly. We're doing a shooter game, but but uh, you know, I was excited to chat with everyone
Um, i'm the founder of haven's compass
Um a first person shooter game currently it's you know free to play everyone's on alpha
Uh, super excited that I just saw your top 50 on that radar
So on data active users and monthly activities, so, you know, super excited looking forward to hopefully also play your game
Yeah, cool, thanks for being here and uh and congrats on being top 50 that's exciting stuff
Last but not least we have call of the void
Hey, thanks for having me. Um, so
I'm from call of void. I'm matt i'm the founder and uh, we do a top down arbg
shooter on mobile so we're out on um
We're just signed up with immutable. So we're going to be building on zk evn
And we've got some really exciting stuff coming and i'm really happy to be chatting interoperability because that is everything we're about
Amazing interoperability. Love it. Um, and I am going to throw it back to yat. Um
So, uh, don't get your fingers, uh toes caught in any zippers right now
Uh, i'm gonna go to throw it over to you yet. I remember when I first joined animoca, um
And I emailed you to which you replied with like 150 links
That I watched over the weekend. Uh, then I came to the office and then you know, the rest was essential history. Um
Back then I joined rev and have been part of that journey ever since
It was relatively small team in hong kong as you obviously, you know, remember
Um, and you were I remember you were almost in every one of those meetings
And it's now grown to what it is
And I guess for those who don't have any context we have rebranded rev motorsport to the motorverse, which is very exciting
Um, so yeah, yeah, I guess, you know
How do you reflect on the roller coaster that you know that rev and I guess now motorverse has been on over the last three to
Well, I mean it's been quite an incredible journey
I think one of the things that uh is worth mentioning is that when rev first launched
It was one of the very first gaming tokens to come out at the time and a lot of lessons obviously in that experience
and I think the combination of what is happening today with with you and the folks of
Of rev and and of course talk squad and a motorverse all building
Is a reflection of you know, these lessons and these changes because after all the market has changed quite a bit
And I think also the markets matured in a healthy way because in some ways the early part of the industry was
Very much driven by a certain type of participant
Which was more speculative in nature and the market was sort of wild in its own different ways
And I think 23 was very much sort of this cleanup year right this year where everyone was really sort of
Finding their way, you know, basically people who were in there for the wrong reasons ended up also
Getting I guess perched out a little bit in in all in all the good ways shall we say?
uh, and we can see the foundation of what's happening now in web3 is built on a foundation of
People who are there for you know, again, you still have people that are trading for the benefits of trading
But you also have a lot more active gaming participants
Most of the people who joined the web3 space over the last two years joined because of culture as an nft's
Gaming broadly and culture as a as a broad context
So so I think uh, I think the timing is great 2024
We think is going to be you know, like pivotal year for web3 gaming
It's already started out really well as you
May know a number of projects that we backed including psi
You know root and a bunch of others
Um have uh, sort of recently had very successful launches
uh, and of course we see, you know, we're strong sort of comebacks from you know, access and um excess I mean and sort of
uh, you know x infinity and ronin, uh is really sort of
Becoming a really really sort of um, you know important gaming chain as well
So all of the things that have been developing over the last couple years are starting to emerge
And I see same happening for rev the motorverse and every other gaming projects that are out there
So, you know, it's I think 24 is going to be a great year for the whole industry
Love it. Love it. We are bullish. Uh, we are back as the as the kids say
Um, yeah, no, thanks for that. Yeah, I mean it's it's it's so exciting
And I yeah can't wait to see where we go next now. I do want to ask about interoperability. I asked robbie in the first segment
Um, not not to say that, you know, i'm not glad that you were not in the first segment
I don't know if that came out, right?
Um, but i'm glad that you're in the second segment, uh, because then obviously, you know, you guys both have to have your own time in the spotlight
Um, so I asked this in the first segment, but you know animoka has over 400 portcos, uh to you know
20 plus subsidiaries mocha versus the flagship project that sits across all of these
Um and really leveraging that that network effect
So how do you see interoperability working across the animoka network and then ultimately, you know, how does that expand into the rest of the ecosystem?
So first maybe it's important to talk a little bit about how we think about tokens generally which includes non-fungible tokens as well, right?
So one of the things about blockchain and web3 particularly because in the sense that you know
A blockchain and web3 are intertwined is that you're building on a shared network
And you know, take it take aside bridges that basically hop from, you know, network to network effectively as gateway access if you will
uh, the main point really is is that there's really
uh, no way to sort of create, uh, sort of, um
ways in which you can restrict
The value and the and the transmission and whatever other forms of um, sort of like you would say interoperability that one would develop
Within the chain or the chains are given up across so whether it's an nft or whether it's token
You can build on it in a permissionless basis
So this is the foundation of things like defi. It's a foundation of you know, what we end up building in sort of, you know
Different forms of I guess staking protocols is the foundation of now when you launch a web3 game
Or when you do web3 marketing or when they do air drops
I mean all these things can happen because of the permissionless nature
Of web3 and particularly because it's on blockchain and also what happens when you build on blockchain
Is that you're benefiting from a shared network in which the value of the network ends up compounding on top of each other
You know gaming for instance is only as valuable and as powerful as it got over the last couple years in nfts
Because it can intermingle with defi because it can intermingle with on-chain liquidity and with all the activity that takes place
This was something that wasn't really possible in web2 before because all of the different systems were on their own rails
Like you had a payment rail that was its own network
You had a gaming layer actually that was fragmented across, you know, a thousand different game companies that had a thousand different networks
For instance, right you had, you know, you had your own e-commerce rails
Which was powered by separately by amazon and another one by ebay another one by alibaba
And you know the list goes on right every web2 company was basically building in effect their own chain
If you want to give it as a parallel and so in web3 that's changed
Everything's in one chain the payment layer the transaction layer the the the gaming layer the whatever layer you want
And if not, it's at least you know
Sort of operating in a way in which it can be bridged across
So now you have one common network and in that common network you have now the ability to do
But normally closed platforms want to build within themselves, which is basically network effects
But those network effects in traditional platforms whether it's a social media platform like facebook or gaming, you know environment like roblox
Are actually ones that can only create network effects within their own network because you don't have the ability to compose on top of it
More network effects than you're allowed to do and this is a thing about web3
So so so the foundation of course is that web3 gives superpowers to network composition network composability
And therefore creates compound network effects and interoperability
Is essentially network compounding?
Basically compounding network effects on top of these assets
And this goes down to the other fundamental point about how we view tokens
Which is that we think of tokens essentially as proxies for network effects
Whether they're fungible tokens or whether they're non-fungible
Its value comes from the power of the network it represents and the activity of the network that it generates
This is another sort of important factor because sometimes people look at nft projects and say well
It should be valid based on the revenue that it generates or they look at for instance
You know token ecosystems or l1 l2s and thinking about well, you know
How much you know cash flow or gases does it generate so that it has value?
And the answer is it's none of them because it really is a representation
You know the fact that it generates gas or the fact that the game generates revenues
Is only a fraction of the value that the asset in the form of a token represents?
For instance, you know if you if you
You know a classic example would be if you look at instagram as a network
The the profit that facebook makes on instagram is only a fraction of the value that someone who basically posts on social media
Generates, you know the millions of followers, which of course instagram technically owns
Um the value that the person who owned who sort of leverages that million followers
Is actually more valuable to the person in itself than the kind of profit that facebook can generate from it directly, right?
So so it shows that the whole value of the network is actually bigger than the profit that can be generated from the network itself
Um, and therefore the network has amplification power that uh, that you know
The company itself can generate and that's when you look at for instance something like ethereum or the solana or something like rev
For instance or or sand or ape or whatever token infrastructure that's out there
You know valuing it its economy is based on the network and the network effects it can generate
Uh vis-a-vis sort of let's call it the pure value composition of that, right?
So which comes down to interoperability
The more interoperable your assets are the more composable the assets are the more network effects it can construct the more network effects
It can construct the more the more valuable and useful it becomes because it increases the utility and increases its network effects
Which can basically compound infinitely in web3
Yeah, that's yeah. I mean
Please write a book and read the audiobook because I I almost forgot to unmute and reply
I mean, yeah, who wants to follow that? I'm just gonna put that out there. Um
No, thank you. Yeah, I mean it's always dropping such incredible gems every time, you know
Every time you speak and you know in all your videos and everything. So
Appreciate your infinite wisdom. Um
Yeah, I mean I I guess I should probably ask the the panel some questions now, yeah, thank you
Um, all right. Let's uh, I see some hands. I see evil plan and call the void
So we're gonna we're gonna jump to evil plan first
Hey, thanks. Uh, yeah, how's it going, man? Uh, I don't know if you know who this is, but i'm personal handy account who?
Was CEO of rumble monkey which you guys invested in back in 2017. I think 2018
Great to see you or hear you in this case. Yeah, it's great to connect with you again. Um
I'm I have to say like, uh super happy to see how well animoka has been doing over the past few years
It's just been pretty incredible what you've done for the ecosystem. So, you know kudos to you for that
I think my question is really how are you thinking about?
uh, the number of tokens that are launching around each
game with respect to kind of like network value in the ecosystem like do you see that as
Kind of some of the parts or do you see it as fragmentation? Like what's what's your view on that?
I actually think of it as some of parts, uh, and I actually see them as value accretive
This is not a view that's necessarily shared by a lot of people
Uh, because I think um, you know the the classic thinking and this is the difference about us versus others
Is you know, one of the reasons we make um all these investments we have actually
Over 450 investments in the space at growing
uh versus maybe others who are focused on building that one network is
Effectively, it's about how you build and align in in in the incentives that you think you're growing, right?
So if you are building on one token ecosystem
Or you building in your own particular gaming system
Then you naturally have an incentive to create as much network effects in your chain to try to or in your ecosystem
To create more accretive value which makes sense
Which which then in itself?
Creates a mechanism where you're obviously trying to promote your ecosystem, which is a classic competitive capitalist environment, which you think is healthy and necessary
Um, but one of the problems you have in let's call the traditional businesses or which are operating in traditional networks
Is that once you build these monopoly effects those very large platforms we call it facebook google amazon
whichever you want to call it then basically start to dominate the space and because of the way that
You know monopoly networks have impact and they have a compound larger network effects and therefore at the end of the day
Um, you know can out compete everyone to the point where they turn monopolies and actually, you know, turn capitalism upside down
Which is what we see today, right?
So for instance, if you were to launch a game yourself
You probably have to use the app store or google play or steam
Because you will have a very hard time replicating the network effects that apple or google have, right?
So none of that is true for web 3 because what actually happens is that you know
Whether it's vampire attacks whether it's incentives or if there's air drops
You can reach the customer directly because you basically have access to at least a way to you know
Proveably go for the kind of customers that you're looking for because you know what and if t's they have you know
What tokens have done, you know the transaction history, you know, you know on chain
History is your on-chain reputation and based on the on-chain reputation
You can receive rewards or or get benefits which is beneficial for both sides
uh, you know the person is doing the activity and a person who's um
Who's uh playing uh, who's um, who's who's who's you know, owning the nfts?
And so this comes down to our approach which we think in a shared network. We can't have a monopoly
It's not possible to do that because you know, everything is, you know in trouble
There is no ability to have a monopoly effect
In fact everything benefits from the growth of a general network if ax infinity grows actually the entire gameplay industry grows, right?
If pixel grows, you know people who join pixels will have the ability to actually will have the ability to go to any other
Sort of you know, um sort of a game that's launching on ronin and you know through bridges
They can then move their chain on chain liquidity to ethereum or to somewhere else
Um and trade it out and put it into another game, right?
So it just grows the entire ecosystem
Which for instance in in web 2 if if you know fortnite, I mean it gets even bigger
That's great for fortnite. Nobody else gets benefit from that, right? Only only fortnite or as an epic gets the benefit. Nobody else
Uh can sort of um share in the network effect of the growth of that because you can't move your assets out
You can't kind of these benefits
So to the question of what it therefore means when you have multiple tokens
I see all of the token ecosystems emerging as effectively, you know proxies for the network effects of their particular games
Which however can trade with each other meaning we don't have to have every token be a billion dollars
I mean that'd be nice, but you know, that's not really what's important
In the same way that we don't have to only eat in a restaurant
You know that can generate a hundred million dollars a year we're fine to go to a michelin star restaurant that might generate
Smaller types of revenue, but there's a bespoke experience for literally just you know
Thousands of people a year and that's just fine because it's sustainable and it's a craft and it's the art and it makes sense
Uh, you know for for that community. So so I see them really as networks
Sort of I guess you would say personified whether it's individuals where there's companies with the structures
In which you can then participate and grow your networks from it like that like tokens themselves
Are proxies for those network effects and and platforms for them
But because we're building them in web3
You can you can share liquidity you can you can you can have a way of interoperating with them through tokens
And because you're running your own game economies
It doesn't really make sense to sort of depend on the game economy of something else in the same way that nations have their own currencies
Right while they would obviously still trade through the us dollar or through the yen
if there's you know, you need more volume or transactions, but but you know, you still have a
Because you have your own economies
You have your own deflation or inflationary mechanisms that are uniquely designed for whatever purpose you're trying to do
So we do think it makes sense to have your own token economies
Which will be rebalanced in an open market as they are right now
And I appreciate such a full answer I have one other kind of random follow-up
This is probably really stupid. Nobody. Nobody else will care about this, but i'm just kind of curious
Are you guys still in the same offices and cyberport or have you guys expanded?
We're still in the same office, but we are
Um, so I you know upgrading in the sense that our lease is up
You know part of the reason why we haven't moved is because our lease wasn't up yet
The other reason this is that um, you know, most of our growth happened during covid
And so a lot of people didn't actually go to the office because of covid especially if you were in hong kong
You know base, you know, it was it was pretty you know, the city was pretty much in lockdown
So it didn't really make sense to do anything. And then as you as you know in 23
Well parts of 22 and and most 23
Was uh was a pretty tough year for web3
And everyone had to sort of you know focus and make sure that you know saving portfolio companies and investments that obviously were struggling
You know because of the fallout of ftx and terra luna and and so on so we were just focused on you know
Basically doing what we had to do
And and moving offices was not on the top of our agenda
But now we're forced to because our lease is is coming up. So, you know, we're we're we're investigating
Don't know where we're going yet. But um, you know, um, the team's looking into it
That I was I was just gonna ask that was the next question. I was gonna say yeah
Where are we where are we going? But um, I guess we'll save that alpha for next time. Um
Thanks evil plan. I I see some more hands up. I see cold void. It's been patiently waiting. I'm gonna throw it over to them
Yeah, so talking after yat is a bit like stumbling in from a frat party into uh, a harvard's lecture
It's um, it's fantastic to hear you speak and to be honest
I'm i'm kind of sad now like after hearing this that we we didn't take the animoca investment. Um
Which would have been paid out in I guess
uh tokens for your driving game, um, which is
We would have ended up in a much better position and i'm just uh, i'm i'm
amazed at how much you think about this space and I I do sort of
See like the whole point of there is no monopoly
But I mean at some point you've got to weigh up the fact that
With so many investments with so many things with on-chain data
They there could be potentially a data monopoly. Um
And do you see like this is I guess a question for everyone and also the app
Do you see that this is this is a value proposition or do you see that?
This is something that could be essentially the undoing of this place and bear in mind. I I like I personally believe that there is
The reason there's so many scams the reason there's so many sort of things that go wrong and hacking on on
Web 3 is because there's demand there's demand for a decentralized system. There's demand
That everyone to get access and and avoid all of the all of the crazy
difficulty of dealing with banks and transfers and all this kind of stuff and and the ability to actually
Just play a game and earn from a game or win from a game
And then be able to exchange that for digital goods like tickets for things or like uh passes
It's it's such a different ecosystem that someone fights against it. Do you think there will be a data monopoly?
To kind of control access to this or do you think this is this is going to outgrow?
The ability for someone to control it
Thank you for the question
So maybe i'll i'll take a first stab and if anyone else obviously wants to add
So first of all, I don't think that there's going to be a data monopoly
And the reason why I don't think there's going to be a data monopoly is because the on-chain the on-chain
Transparency allows everyone to build and compose freely on top of uh on top of it
This is some backward noise by the way. I don't think that's me
And um, and so so what we think will happen instead is that if someone you know
So if you look at for instance how data how you create value from data
It's because of the fact that you have access to data and you basically, you know
Whether you scrape it or whatever and you create sort of, you know, you know like with ai or whatever
Or for instance accessing customer data or knowing what the customer does you have sort of proprietary access to to that data
That's that's typically how it works. But because it's on-chain the data is not really proprietary
So so what then happens is that if I wanted to reach you if everyone wanted to reach a mochaverse holder
Or anyone reaches wanted to reach a board ape holder they can do so
They don't you know, and and even you know, maybe having have created mochaverse or yuga haven't created board apes
We can't actually stop someone from doing a vampiric attack
in fact vampire attacks are probably one of the sort of most competitive elements of
creating a true anti-monopolist and a very capitalist environment where
You know the customer will then come to you because you will give them an incentive to try your product
That doesn't necessarily mean that you want to use that product
But it means you're giving an incentive to give it a go, which is what we do when we spend advertising
Well, I mean just think about the average the the game industry in itself
I mean something like a hundred billion dollars is spent in cpa and cpi ads
Which is a tremendous amount of money and the successful conversion rate of of a successful paid user
Is on average 86 per user right now, which is crazy, right?
So if you're an indie game developer
You're basically screwed which is what's happening to 99 percent of all indie game developers because in the traditional wave 2 element
They can't afford those type of cpa cpi costs because the fact that the game could make more than 86 dollars
Uh lifetime value, uh per paid user is also not a guarantee and that comes from the fact that the gateways themselves
Um where there's facebook apple google and so on which have the proprietary data, right?
Are now essentially charging your premium to that if you if you were in the gaming industry
You know earlier say during the rise of the early days of mobile
You might remember that paying for ads was 10 cents 50 cents then one dollar then two dollars then five dollars, right?
and eventually the cost of the advertising is as large as it is not because
The value of the user is such but because the platforms through the algorithms
Want to tune up their profits and decide well, that's the price we think you can pay and we'll just
You could uh, sort of tweak it up because the the platform that does it doesn't have a transparent framework
You don't know what the demand really is. I mean if you advertise for a game
You don't have a way of reaching the gamer you want
You just have the way you just trust your algorithm
I mean just think about it
You just trust the algorithm that facebook or google or apple are going to send ads to you know
Roughly this profile of people that are roughly saying this type of stuff and in the name of privacy
You'll never know who they really are, right? It's kind of like sort of, you know shooting an ad into
You know, basically a facebook group page. It might have 10 million followers that you know
You know basically follow Ferrari, but we know that there's not 10 million Ferraris sold
There's maybe at most, you know, I know hundreds of thousands of Ferraris out there
right and what you care about are the people who own a Ferrari not necessarily the ones who
Would you know like the Ferrari logo for instance as an example because you can't actually target which is ironic right because
The online advertising industry was supposed to give you better targeting not worse targeting
So anyway, my point on this is is that I think data monopolies can't really form
The way they do in web 2 because of the fact because of these open frameworks because the ability to to to the vampire attacks
And and what the benefit goes directly to the end customer
Which which will create this open market anyway, that's our view
Thank you so much for that. Sorry to just um in like interrupt the hands, but it's it's
A fantastic take and I I do think that even though there's a kind of utopic vision
There is also the whole thing of money as a moat like the amount of uh currency or the amount of
in our case in our space, um attention that you hold it's kind of a moat to this so
I think it's really important that we we have this kind of
ability to do these things and to reach out to these people and like as someone has been
building in in games for 18 years and in
I do remember the times when you user acquisition was the app store and the app store
Was essentially if you've got a feature you got downloaded
Um, and then you became rich and I do think in web 3 there are no king makers
But I I kind of do want to like suggest that
We are moving now to I would say more like an influencer world
And um, I wonder what animator is taking general or like everyone's take is on the influencer world
And the fact that it's really about the people if you look at say for example
Zuckerberg a universally hated figure barely regarded as human by a lot of people
Literally sat down in a living room sprayed
With a lot of fake time to make it look like a person
And basically shat on the apple product people actually listen to this if you look at elon musk
I mean it just goes to showing how bad shit all of the takes are on twitter
But it's really becoming personality culture
Do you think this is going to impact web 3 or do you think web 3 is a hedge against it? Maybe?
No, I think web 3 is uh, okay
And maybe I'll have others respond to this because I don't want to monopolize the conversation
Too much, but first of all, I think it's a hedge against it
but it's not a hedge for maybe what you might think in terms of necessarily allowing for
You know allowing for sort of um, sort of I guess a more democratic aspect
It's the fact that you can have competing networks that form value that form benefits for the participants in it
That aren't in within these type of exclusive. Um, uh sort of network
So for instance elon is a network in itself, right?
I mean, you know, he doesn't have a token but imagine if elon had a token or you know
What would that look like? Right?
Um, so so the point being though that he has a voice and a reach because he has a network
And the network is him and it's amplified maybe because of his ownership in twitter and a bunch of other things and that's the same
It's true for for zuckerberg, right?
I mean zuckerberg's voice comes from the fact that he is the owner of facebook
And you know, i'm not gonna sit here and speculate as to how the algorithm works
But it's not unreasonable to expect that, you know, if he wants to have a push then, you know, he'll get one
Right, like, you know, it's again. It's not a level playing field. We don't know what the algorithm is. There's no transparency
This is not like a this is not like a government where you know
We have people elected into positions and where we have to basically have disclosure
Like, you know in financial, you know running public companies in the past
We had to have disclosure about our financial performance and when there was a conflict of interest and we did something
There had to be a reporting on this
But there's no such thing for for data or for boosting profiles or for marketing or for whatever that is, right?
So these are people these are personalities that have grown because of the control of their networks, right?
And in web 3 those networks are owned by the people and the people have
Ability to have that voice and you can authentically know that because you can see the on-chain on-chain traffic. I mean how many people
Influencers that we've had the same experience when we use influences for gaming in the past
We use a whole bunch of them some were good
But many of them were not great because they basically just bought at their traffic
But we didn't know that the million followers of instagram were fake or those hundred thousand people on twitter were fake
How do we know the only ones who know twitter and twitter doesn't tell us that
Because they don't want us to know that because they don't want to have that transparency, right?
So in a world of web 3, you know
I can follow people who actually have really paid money or actually have done on-chain traffic
on-chain sort of um sort of
Transactions or all these things that you can now do and eventually when sociify grows the way that it does
We're going to basically have the ability to really audit, you know
The true value of an end user because reputation doesn't just come from
Reputation doesn't just come from you know, how many people follow you it comes from who follows you
So if really influential people follow you the network of a thousand might be more powerful than network of a million
But try to scroll through
You know instagram or twitter or facebook or even linkedin to see who's following who and how do you enumerate that value?
You don't know that because they don't want to make that easy for you because that's their business in web 3
Amazing thank you guys. Wow, this this discussion is absolutely incredible
Um, I feel like i'm just sitting here with a bucket of popcorn. I could I could do this all night
Um, but unfortunately we don't have all night. Um, and I do see some hands up
I do see I believe defi kingdoms had their hand up at some point
Yeah, I just wanted to add, you know yat was talking about
Indie games and you know 86 dollars for for customer acquisition, which is uh
Not super sustainable for a lot of indie games because they just don't have that kind of cash flow
And I think that's one of the the real opportunities of interoperability and one of the things that's you know
Beautiful about web 3 is that anybody can build in web 3?
If you have an idea and you have the dedication you can make a project
But it's one thing that I think you know projects and studios that are already existing
A responsibility of sorts to really encourage that interoperability so that indie gamers can come in and potentially use their assets
Because the fastest way to lower that acquisition cost is to already have a base of of users
And so, you know, if somebody comes in and says well, you know, I want to build a
So i'm going to use moto versus cars then they already have a leg up on that user acquisition
And so it's one thing that I think is really important with interoperability is enabling those
In your communities those looking to build
To utilize your assets and and what you've built to enhance the overall ecosystem
And you know, it's not competition. It's an enhancement. It adds to your environment
It adds to your metaverse it adds to your ecosystem and it really just gives more reason
For people to be involved in both projects at that point because you know
They're getting assets from one that they can use in both
But it helps people be able to build it helps people who otherwise would not be able to fund
You know the building of a game to be able to make something really great
Thank you d. Fucking-doms, yeah completely agree, um, uh, who else do we have we've got nfl rivals
Yeah, thanks. Thanks. Ali. Um, I think interoperability is really under explored as a marketing tactic
I want to say like august of september 2022
It's a mythical and um basically kind of called the interop hack where you know
You have a bunch of people playing your game, uh, or playing your you know, your rivals game
Um, and for us, you know, it would say that mad mobile was on chain for us. We'd say, okay
Well, we got these mad mobile players. We could see their activity. We see what they're buying because the data is public ideally and um
You know, we think we can offer something more competitive. So as long as we're not violating licensing restrictions
Um in terms of like trying to put something that we don't we in our game that we shouldn't
Um, why can't we just flip the switch and say hey mad mobile players come to nfl rivals?
Um, we built you something for fun
Um, all you have to do is just sign in with your account or whatever
Connect your wallet, which ideally we don't do that anymore
Um or sign in with some sort of unified id account like discord, for example
Um, there are plenty of bots that connect wallet identification to discord identification
Um, and if you do that, then you take an acquisition cost from you know, we saw for some pc games
It was like fifty dollars fifty dollars per head
Uh mobile acquisition i've personally seen some projects get up to like twenty to thirty dollars
Um if they're cyclical or fifteen to twenty if it's if there is no season to it
And that's really expensive because it's really hard to get that money back on your ad spend
So with interoperability especially because you can really really target players that have you know
Kind of look alike profiles like they have items from games like yours
You know that or you can look at their activity and see that they play a bunch of different games
Like they like trying new games. You can see that data and then you can build your offerings accordingly
Um, it's just it's just the same thing as like with uh with airdrops like optimism's airdrop strategy right now
They're trying to reward different profiles. I think right now they're on phase four, which is for aft creators
And they define certain characteristics and and certain
Rule sets that qualify you for the airdrop and get certain amount of op token
So it's the exact same thing. You could do the exact same thing
um, and all you have to do is just build game items and build a little bit of uh,
build a little bit of the software that can like look at the chain and qualify that activity and
There you go. You have a very friendly audience
You have a ideally local like audience that costs
I don't know how much you pay your staff
But really just like a you know, probably a few weeks of work or a few days of work if you're really good at it
Um, which is way cheaper than trying to run a campaign to get a million people at fifteen dollars a pop
Yeah, uh, thank you nfl rivals, um guys we're getting very close to the end of the space
We're gonna have to rotate very shortly
Um, but I do have uh will who's frantically waving at me on the space and also messaging me on whatsapp. Uh, mr
Boss man, I I apologize. Um
I know you have to run. Um, so yeah, I guess we'll we'll pass it over to you quickly
No, no, it's all right. Um, I I thought um
It's a very very interesting conversation. It's really really cool to hear everyone's take and especially in particular yachts
We're very lucky to have you
It's part of the team, right? But
This is exact this whole thing around
You know creating this audience and using it for user acquisition with interoperable assets is basically the premise of the motorverse
So we're we're doing these licensing arrangements with these big motorsports brands that allows us to sell
And then you create this huge sort of audience of people who are all
Car holders and then we're building this open standard for racing games that lets
You know loads of different people come in and build experiences
And that solves two massive problems for these developers like number one
Getting access to these licenses, which is always a struggle, especially if you're starting out a number two user acquisition
I just think it's it's like a it's like we're publishing
cars instead of games it's it's it it makes me
Like really pleased about what we're doing because I think we're we're onto something here
Um and hearing you guys talking about it and the other thing I wanted to say about the data thing
Which obviously yeah responded to very well is that yeah
I mean like there's so much information out there on chain like you can go and
Like match patterns find users that you think are valuable or interesting or the types of people you want to
You want to require and you can go and look on chain and find other people like them
People behaving in similar ways that you need to get to know and then go and figure out where they are and
And and start talking to them and bring them into the community
So yeah, really really really interesting to to hear everyone talk about it
Sorry for frantically waving my hand and whatsapp in you. I'm lucky i've got you on whatsapp as well
Um, that's all right. Well, um, thank you for for being here
I know you have to get on a plane soon, uh to actually go in the vicinity of where yeah, it's going to be
So that's that's exciting. Um
Thank you all so much for for being on here guys
If you're listening, uh, and if you've enjoyed what has been said in this particular segment
Go and smash those purple hearts blue hearts, whatever hearts you've got thumbs up
Um go and follow every single one of uh our speakers here
Um who have all contributed to such an amazing discussion
Um nitro league while you're still here. I see travis still here. Uh, I know, you know will's talked about everything
We're building the motorverse. I'm sure we're gonna have to you know being so on brand
We're gonna have to do something with you guys at some point and also mr. Wedge, um, who I believe is is off now
But uh, but yeah, I guess just throwing it back to yak quickly for for final word before we rotate speakers. Um
I'll see you on friday and if for for those of you who haven't seen the video that I did with yat
At hong kong fin tech week. He had a pretty spicy take on pineapples. Um pineapple on pizza
Um, so i'm gonna i'm gonna find you on friday
I'm gonna do another one of those videos with you yet and i'm gonna ask you some more spicy, uh spicy questions
I look forward to that. Um, maybe we can talk about putting kimchi in pizza. That's this time. So yeah speaking of spice
Oh, I don't know how many itallians are listening right now, but uh, I I feel like I just heard some, uh
Broken hearts, but uh, yeah
Um, all right. Thank you guys so much
Um for those who we didn't quite get to this time around we're gonna definitely have you guys back on another space
Um for some more in-depth discussions
Rotate, uh the speaker panel, uh, I just want to let you guys know about something exciting that we've got going on
Which is a pinned tweet. Uh, oh, it's not tweet anymore. Is it it's post pin post at the top of this space
Torque squad staking season zero. So, uh, for those of you who don't know
The pfp that i'm rocking right now is a torque squad. It is the pfp of the motorverse ecosystem
Uh, it grants you the highest level of access, um to all things motorverse be that events
access to games, uh future, uh future nft drops and more
And yeah, we've got staking coming up for this uh, this was staying coming up this friday, uh for about a month's period
And uh, yeah very exciting celebrating the launch of the motorverse, uh hub which has been a long time in development
So yeah, super excited to uh to have that up and running
I'm gonna take a quick 30-second water break
I'm gonna leave you with the soundtrack to the motorverse
Which is a song that we produce with Tina Guo and Steve Mazaro for those of you of you who don't know
Han Zimmer's right hand woman, uh and man who uh play the cello
Um and the guitar so i'll leave that with you guys while I go quickly grab a drink. I'll be right back
All right, all right, we are back I have hydrated everyone make sure to stay hydrated it's very important
Crypto summer, uh, it's very exciting nft summer crypto summer just summer in general. Uh bull market is back guys stay hydrated
All right, we have segment three we've got some more exciting guests, uh, welcome back. Um
Again, uh, thank you to all the speakers and the audience for tuning in uh so far
Uh, if you are an audience member and you want to ask a question for any of our speakers
Uh, make sure you go to the bottom right ask us a question send a like retweet and we'll try to get to your questions
All right, let's dive straight into segment three now
Um with some introductions, uh, we have shrapnel gm
Hey soli, how's it going? It's sneaky che behind the shrapnel account
We're a triple a first person extraction shooter building on avalanche blockchain excited to be here
Yeah, super exciting to have you guys here
You've been a lot of exciting things happening for you guys recently. So can't wait to hear more about it
Um, next up we have mix mob
Hello, hello, yep, sorry guys got you my AirPods in we're having some technical difficulties
Uh, how are you doing this morning? By the way, that song was awesome
I felt like I was going on an adventure, man
It was a great way to start my morning currently
Over here. So that was a great wake up call. I haven't had my caffeine yet. Yeah mix mob
We're a card strategy racing game. We're super excited to be here
I love it. I love it on brand another very on brand
game, so we've got a definitely got to uh
We've got to catch up after these uh after this space and uh figure out something that we can do together. Um, all right
All right, we're gonna go over to wombat and we'll come back to uh to layer 1x
Hi, this is adrian from wombat from streetworks
We build a comprehensive web3 gaming ecosystem with game distribution game publishing
All kinds of things. So, um, if you if you're looking for users for your games
Or if you're a user if you're a player and you want to play games just come to wombat
Love it. All right, gotta uh, gotta find you guys after this as well. Gotta gotta get those users in
All right, next we've got block ape
Hello. Hello gm. Thanks. Thanks for having us. Uh, it's another being here
Uh, this is dan. I'm the founder of blocky of scissors. We are working on arkis champions
What we're calling a power to players game. It's an unreal engine 5
ape competitive shooter with uh, web3 protocol called skillstaking. Thank you for having us
Oh, yeah, super cool. Just clicked into your profile looks absolutely amazing. Uh, can't wait to hear more. Um, all right
How's it going everyone? Thanks. Uh, i'm out here representing for pog digital. Thanks for having me on stage x co-host and motor
Appreciate the the intro. Yeah, we're out here with interoperability. No theta blockchain
Onboarding over here with pog digital every day. I see shrapnel and everybody up here, too. What's up? Everyone retweets the room and thanks for having me up
Uh, love pog super cool. Um, awesome. They're gonna throw it over to adam
Gm, sir. Thank you very much for having me today. Um, my name is adam. I'm the co-founder of spark. That's why is he?
Um, we're building payments infrastructure mainly working with a lot of web3 games metaversa's marketplaces
Interoperability is is what we're kind of all about uh, helping users get onto games without worrying about what chains or tokens, etc
Our biggest client is currently portal coin, which is in the news today. So we handled their 28 million tokens
Um, i've also previously founded a web3 gaming studio myself called formation games
Um, which is developing a fancy football mobile game called club. Uh, that's entering beta now. Um, so
Yeah, just really honored to be here. It's absolutely fantastic lineup. So thanks for having me on
Boom interoperability. There you go. This is uh the topic of the space. Um, so yeah, looking forward to hearing uh hearing some deep insights
All right over to some of the things that we're going to talk about
All right over to cyberleit next welcome back
Hey, thank you. Good morning, everybody. It's jeffrey monnes co-founder of cyberleit
Um a little bit about us cyberleit's a social application with competitive features for gamers embedded with an ai anti-cheat technology
And a biometric player verification
We started this journey to stop the plague of cheating and online games creating a level playing field for all
Amazing welcome back to I guess what is now the motorverse space no longer the rev motor
For those of you don't know maybe joined late to the space
Uh, we have rebranded rev motorsport to the motorverse, which is the motorsport ecosystem of animoca brands
uh, and the pfp that i'm rocking is a torque squad, which is the
Pfp of the motorverse ecosystem. All right, let's go
Let's jump into some of these questions got some amazing guests here. So let's do it
We so first question that wasn't me speaking french. It was just uh,
Yeah, something that something that came out. All right. Um
Guys, how do you envision the future of gaming ecosystems where players can seamlessly move between different virtual worlds?
Do you think this is something that we're going to see is this going to happen?
Um, or are we going to see more walled gardens being built who wants to take it first?
Um, sure I can I can step in on that one. Um
I I believe so. I know people are trying because we're working with them. Um,
The what's interesting about this is it's not just the technology. It's also the commercial angle of it
So if you're a gaming studio, you know, you've got your own, you know, particularly established ones
They like their walled gardens, right? Like they're pretty profitable
Um, they get to keep all their users in there
They don't have to worry about the complexity of working with other people's stuff and playing nicely
Um, they have their own art style
Even even how do you overcome that if you want to like put your your game in someone else's game?
Um, so there's tons of kind of reasons why you wouldn't do it
But also in my opinion, I think it's kind of inevitable. We will see these experiences and um,
You know, you can see I think the best example right now is is even off offline off chain
You look at like fortnite and what they're doing. Um, they've managed to cram multiple it ip's into one world
Um, and as long as it's successful enough
All those brands come in so I would say looking ahead
Five years I would be amazed if that um, if that wasn't how a lot of games
Um are lining up and that you get these kind of interoperable worlds for sure
Yeah, I love it. Um, I 100 agree. I see one bat
Yeah, um, I I actually totally agree with what what Adam was saying
Um is that there is always the commercial perspective on this right? And from a from a technical perspective these kinds of things
Are possible without web fee maybe not on a permissionless
um basis, but I mean you could have or you had
Uh characters of one game in another game, right that that's that has been doable for I don't know god knows how long right?
um, but the question is like what do they really gain from this and um that question is
Maybe simpler to answer in a web 2 in a traditional gaming setting
Where you would do a colab and that means that you cross pollinate on users or the players on audience. Um
On audience. Um, and that maybe that's it. Maybe you share production costs or promo cost or whatever, right?
But uh in web 3, I think that's going to be very interesting to see
how that unfolds from a commercial perspective, so
Um, what happens if I have a character or whatever else it is weapon
Whatever item and I basically bought that from one game from one studio one publisher
And then I want to move that over to another game
um, is there going to be some kind of a compensation will there be
um, whatever right um swap models, uh, will it be rental models, um
Whatever that means or whatever it's going to look like right? Um, but it's kind of obvious that this will have to happen this commercial
Layer will have to be there this commercial like
A blueprint for how that's been being done. Obviously, that's not how it's going to start
It's going to start with like just collapse and we've seen that we've actually seen that with
Crypto kitties and gods on chain back in 2018 already, right? Um, which has been interesting but um,
yeah, it's I i'm curious to see kind of where this is going to go from a
From a commercial deal perspective and how both sides will be able to benefit from that from basically
having your assets be used in another
In other places, but at the same time allowing other assets other characters so on to be used in your
metaverse or whatever experience and um
Yeah, I think that wet fee generally has the potential of providing such tools or such standards for that, right?
But um, i'm curious how how that how it's actually going to look like
Yeah, that's a very good point, um, the commercial side of things could be could be very interesting
I think a lot of things need to be kind of
Set out before um, you know, whether it's it's you know, web 2ip is whoever come into come into this space
Yeah, I I think I can tackle this from two different angles totally agree with what wombat and adam were saying
Um, and we actually are eating our own dog food in terms of not only building these ugc tools
But also importing our own assets into other
So for example, right fortnite was brought up with their uefn map editing tool where they're allowing, you know
Different ip's to come in and build fortnite maps and we did this ourselves and we build a shrapnel map in fortnite
Where we literally took uh our unreal engine game assets from shrapnel and put them into a fortnite map
So it's like literally uh shrapnel cars shrapnel buildings all of our in-game assets
Uh in fortnite, right? And so it's like hey look at we did that we're doing the same thing with our own platform in web 3
just with uh blockchain and all the incentives being aligned through there such that if you want to go ahead and build a
Map or you want to build a mochaverse map in game mode within shrapnel you're going to be able to do so we're opening up our entire
AAA fps game engine to our community to the public to be able to build and create whatever maps and
Experience they ultimately want to play within the shrapnel universe and get rewarded for that
So whether it's motorverse whether it's yuga labs
Uh, whether it's pudgy whoever wants to actually create a map within shrapnel
They're able to do so and monetize that as the map creator
And the second angle I wanted to also bring up is on a community end
the idea of interoperability of game assets
Is still something like sort of being discovered how we're looking at it right now
Is we're looking at indexing the nfts that are in your wallet. So for example, you own a
Motorverse nft or you own a mochaverse nft or you own a board ape for example
uh, that gives you certain permissions within our universe and our game for like an exclusive gun skin or uh
Access to a specific leaderboard for a community because you know
We have a strategic partnership with them
And so then I could see how that could evolve to being like, okay
Let me see what mix mob assets you have in your game and by some like magical blender or formula or because of some partnership
Because i'm you know homies with nick I can say okay
Because you have xyz mask
You know collection, you know how this representation as well in the shrapnel universe for like cosmetics or something
I I don't know what the endgame solution looks like but I know that just sort of uh
Everyone is working toward this interoperability and i'm really excited to see it sort of come to fruition
I love that answer. Um, it's so exciting
We definitely have to we definitely have to get some motorverse cars, uh in in in shrapnel
I mean like the way you you're looking at it from the point of view of of interoperability of communities, right not just of
Of you know of tokens or whatnot. I think is really really interesting. So
Yeah, we've got cyber elite next with their hand up
Hey, thank you trap no very very everybody here good good points
I really do think like this
Collaborative approach with games and the assets is going to be
Uh the future of how this interoperability is going to work
um, there's a lot of fine tape to go with the game devs and with their assets and
I do think it will be a collaborative thing and it will be partnerships and these things will
Um greatly enhance, uh the ability to play fortnite for instance with shrapnel's
Stuff inside of it, which is a very cool
Nifty thing that fortnite is doing but now you add that to the blockchain layer now you can
Be in an unreal five metaverse engine and you can be walking around this open world
And now all of a sudden you can be in our interoperable with any chain. It doesn't matter
Essentially, it's it's a call in the back and if the assets are on the servers, it's very simple to pull in
Uh, very awesome. Uh seeing the world evolve to this because a few years ago
Awesome, thank you cyber elite. Yeah, it is very very exciting. Um, let's throw it over to mix mob
Yeah, I'd love to just piggyback off of what shrapnel was saying I love the idea of
You know combining these assets in these communities and building an event around it
I wanted to give a shout out to ev.io. I don't know if you guys are familiar with it
But it's a first person shooter. It's a browser based game
I believe it's on salona and they've actually already started going in this direction
So I think shrapnel's already like this is when you start seeing different games doing something similar
And you know these mega brains just like all coming up these same ideas
It's really really exciting right because you can tell that's direction we're going and so what ev.io did was they actually made these bonk skins
For their game and what they did was they did like a sale for like 24 hours
You can purchase it with bonk
And then what they did was they created an event within their game
You and what happens is if you're carrying this bonk skin if you're wearing it and you find these tokens on the map
You actually get airdropped some of the prize pool that they had of bonk
So that just builds off of what shrapnel is saying and this is already happening
So I just wanted to bring that to the attention because before shrapnel said that I was thinking this whole community idea of
Where you have these assets and you're building an event around it and I absolutely love that right mix mob
Imagine if we had shrapnel skins and if you had that shrapnel mix bot, right and you're racing same concept, right?
You see coins you pick them up on the track, you know what I mean?
Or maybe there's assets, right?
So there's just really cool to start thinking about that because interoperability is very accepted in web 3
I don't I think it's going to be hard to see web 2 brands start entering in web 3 games that way
But I think we're going to start seeing web 3 games do that a lot over the years
And you're going to see a lot of different ways and we're going to be experimenting a lot and a lot until we figure out
Not necessarily what truly works
But what truly works for all of our games, right?
Because we're all unique in our own way and how can we figure out how to make this work within our own ecosystem?
So big shout out to shrapnel. That was such a great point
100 yeah, and it was great piggyback. Um, yeah, thanks for that. Um, let's throw it over to adam
Thank you. Yeah, I totally agree with mix mob. That's what the that kind of open ethos
Um, I think it's it's something that only web 3 studios will do first. Um, i've worked with a lot of kind of web 2
studios as well and they just don't have this mindset it's completely foreign to them and so I think
The web 3 studios will be the one who kind of lead the way on this and then you will see web 2 studios
Following when when it's proven
Um, I also want to pick on what shrapnel was saying about user generated content. Really? I think this is super important and I like this idea of
Uh, just sort of normal people or even other businesses building building their own businesses on top of our gaming platforms, right?
I think this is a collaborative vision delivers some of that philosophy behind web 3
And I think consumers are looking to be more than just that now, uh, they don't just want to be customers
You know, they want to be kind of part of the brands they they engage with and have this kind of two-way
Relationship and when you think about things like hey, you know
How many people are about to be unemployed because of ai right across the globe people have to do something right and they'll end up
Doing jobs they enjoy and that they want to do
And why can't this be you know contributing to a game world or an entertainment experience as a content creator or
Maybe a map designer or i've even seen examples
Um like on e online. They did a an alpha
Recently for their kind of web 3 version and they're taking it to the level where
You know, there's people that are making nft insurance services for if you get your ship blown up
Um, you can get it replaced through a user generated insurance scheme
Um, or they have 50 people able to guard an area of space and charge other players in their token
Um to be able to uh mine in their area of space, you know, why aren't these things possible?
You know the I think that's that's really exciting stuff that web 3 enables and I think it's going to be a lot more than just
Kind of recreating uh gold grinding and warcraft on the blockchain. I think there's going to be some really exciting stuff coming
Man after after like every time I host one of these spaces
I just come off them and so buzzed and so excited for for what's coming and especially this year, right?
like we had yat on the on the previous segment and
Just just reinforcing the fact that 2024 is going to be huge
Um, and you know, not just from uh from inter interoperability standpoint, right?
But just just from the fact that we have so many incredible
Builders and games that have been cooking over the last
two years two three years
We're really seeing, you know the fruits of the labor of that right now, right and and we're moving into
the thick of it, um, you know
Nft summer and you know web 3 gaming summer is is is is definitely uh, definitely coming
All right, who else has their hand up we have uh, oh i've
I've lost it. Uh, give me one sec. We've got um
Some some very incredible points have been made here. Uh that that point on insurance, uh, that was just mentioned
That just pretty much blew my mind
Uh that that sounds insane
This idea of interoperability within games is really the future, uh for all our games
I like to think of it also as as a way in which we can also funnel
You know users to to the games that they really like
uh one one real cool thing that that I uh, that I recently came across um
Is is game loop this is being built by the guys at thor fight
But it's super useful for for games like ours like we're a little bit of an indie
Indie kind of game so we don't really have, you know, the budget to do super cool stuff like, uh, you know other other worlds
Inside our games not yet at least
um, but one really cool thing that I saw is that uh, they have this game loop system and what it does is
You know different partners sign up with their nfts and essentially when someone wants to leave our game
Arx champions, they can burn the skin into their token sync and then randomly get an nft for a different game
So so the idea is that you know, once once the gamers enter the ecosystem
They always have value that they can always bring across to to test different games, etc
And then obviously the nft they bought that that's then burnt
You know inside our sink, uh, we then use to acquire another customer because someone who doesn't necessarily like a different game
Will burn their nft in that game and then potentially get ours and check out our game
And I think that you know, this is where we really start collaborating
And really like, you know offering more value than web 2 can ever dream of
Wow, that's cool. I mean like you you have
You have that sort of interoperability and network effect really kind of baked into everything that you're doing from from the ground up
Which is is super cool. Um, love that that sort of love the way that you're thinking about that
We also have uh two speakers who haven't uh, who haven't actually introduced themselves yet. We have a haunted space
Yeah. Hey guys, thank you for uh, sorry for the delay
Yeah, why don't you quick quickly introduce yourself to to those who don't who may not know
You guys oh, sorry, my bad. So regarding empty space. I will do a brief introductions. So empty space is
Our main goal is to merge the web 2 with the web 3 world and how are we gonna do that?
So we have a single player game that it's a complete web 2 game
That is going to be on steam playstation and xbox actually
Is uh gonna be on steam in a couple of months and then later this year on playstation and xbox
And the multiplayer game instead is going to be a free-to-play web 3 games in this way
We are trying to you know
Web 3 space by bringing new players because we think that the main issue that we have at the moment on the
Obviously on the web 3 world is in the gaming world is mainly that there are more investors than gamers and obviously
Other triple-a games i'll as all the games that are here in this panel are bringing out their games
There are going to be new gamers, but we will we are trying to move even more through another game
There is another part of the game that is actually in the
Mainstream consoles so and steam playstation xbox and move them to the web 3 world
So this is a really brief introduction regarding empty space
Love it. Thank you very much. Um
So you guys are doing you guys are doing god's work, uh in trying to onboard people. So
Yeah, I appreciate you guys. Um, all right throwing it over to uh enzo racing as well who haven't had the chance to introduce themselves
I don't know. Maybe have they fallen asleep
Because we took so long to get to them. All right, it's all good. It's all good. We'll circle back. We'll circle back. Um
Guys, so so all right. We've talked a lot about interoperability so far, right?
We're looking at network effect and and how we can bring people across the different ecosystems
um and leverage leverage, you know different communities
Now if we look at nfts and the classic sort of take one nft and use it in multiple different games
um, and you know one thing that comes to mind is for example with what we're building in the motorverse is
We're building this interoperability standard that allows and I think you know might be
Not necessarily easier for us, but a little bit more straightforward because let's say you you have a you know, you have a a certain car
Nisan for example, which is in one of our games right now
um, and you're able to take that into different experiences that we build so
I think for us it's it's it's fairly, you know, a lot of it's grounded in reality. Uh, a lot of it's fairly straightforward
Um, but what do you guys think how might interoperability affect the value prop of nfts?
Um, and will it increase the utility and appeal? Um, or is that something that you guys see, you know in certain cases
For example taking zelda's sword and put it into shrapnel. Um, is that something that could work?
I'll let i'll let you guys uh fight over who wants to take it
Um, maybe i'll i'll just go um
I think uh, it's a very interesting question because I mean when we when we talk about interoperability we typically talk about
Specifically that kind of interoperability that you've been but you've been introducing right basically taking one item
Into another game and that's what everyone always talks about but to to us there's always two different types of interoperability as well
Um, so one is the the kind of economic
Interoperability, right which can be
something much easier, um as in
It's already interoperability if you can flip your one item for another item in another game, right?
That's already interoperable because that's not what you have in traditional games
But there's obviously that's the simplest way of um economic
Interoperability there can be like literally swaps
Um of items you can borrow one against another right? Um, and all kinds of things that you can imagine maybe transform them
Blend them into an item that's in a in a different game and so on
and then there's for us there's the social type of interoperability as well and that's um
Yeah, that's actually neglected quite often
and what we mean with that is that
Basically just being able to show off what you got in other games
Strong, right? Maybe not as much in kind of uh millennial
Core gamers or casual gamers
But for ginsears, it's a very important thing
Um to be able to show off. I mean after all why is there such a huge?
Um skin market and whatnot, right? Um, so
It's actually pretty cool in web 3 you even without actually taking an item into another game
You could show what they have in their stash by looking at their wallet, right?
And that can obviously work across games as well, right? So you look at somebody's
Profile in the game you look at their inventory and you see not only the things that are relevant for this game
But you may also see oh look they've played this other game. So you look at somebody's whatever
Station on rpg right and you see oh they've played trap
Or they've played motorverse or whatever, right? They have this cool car in there
Um, so I might actually want to
Uh want to look at this other game as well, right? So, um that I think this is where it starts
This is this is going to be very important. Um when you define your role as a gamer
inside of well this whole web 3 gaming space and maybe even
outside of web 3 and kind of in more traditional games, so I think that's um yet who has that that's all things that that are
Um, we should I think we should be talking about those more
Yeah, no definitely agree, um
All right, I guys I can't see hands, uh, if you guys can throw me some waving emojis i'll get over to you
Um, but yeah, I know those are fantastic super comprehensive answer. I love it. Um
Uh, sure. I can do a few if you need someone to come in
I I thought uh wombat made some awesome points that I was gonna make them one around. Um,
You know, I guess the question that's one to mine is like hey
Would you want to bring your zelda sword into shrapnel? Like is that a is that a good thing? I guess maybe I think um
It could be like a csgo knife, right where it's kind of like a flex item and it kind of shows your status in other games
Um, and I think that that's an angle of interoperability
That I think about is not just your items, but it's almost like your your user profile, right your identity
Coming across with you to other games
Um, because you know, I've I played warcraft since I was like, you know, 12 years old or something stupid. Um,
And you know all that all those achievements and things I earned in that time has gone because I have hot platforms, um
I had a profile today that i've kind of traveled with me
And when I go into these games nowadays where I don't have time to play and i'm very casual
At least people would know that I used to be good at things
Um and and being able to travel travel with your profile and your items as well
I think that's an important part of interoperability
Uh that I want to see and that allows game studios to target people, right? So you might say hey, here's soli
He plays card games. I know he spends this much on on items and he's got his most
Cherished possession is this five thousand dollar nissan car
Um, and if i'm starting a new card game
You bet i'm going to be a dropping soli, um a free car and in my game and trying to get him to come over
And maybe giving him a utility for his nissan car, uh in my game as well
So that's like a whole new form of marketing. I think that would be possible as well
Yeah, no, definitely. I think the the use acquisition side through through that
Exactly what you just said I think is very interesting and a lot of games can
And platforms should definitely be tapping into it and we are seeing a lot of that network effect happening
Um, especially at the start of this year, right a lot of these
um airdrops and and whatnot, um
very very interesting and and especially going back to what you said about um
About identities, you know
Something I mentioned before but also looking at you know
For example what mocha, you know, what mocha verse are doing right now with the mocha id?
Um, and having that play a huge role in sort of user acquisition across different games. I think is really interesting
All right block ape go for it
Hey, thank you. Yeah. Yeah, I completely agree with with these points about user profiles
Um, one of the the things that we've actually been focusing on is putting rank on chain
um, this this is like a you know part of part of that concept of being able to uh
To bring your user id to to other games
But yeah, it would be really cool if like, you know someone who was you know, global elite or whatever on csgo
Uh could then you know jump into jump into another game and you know partly be able to carry that flex over right?
So, you know, they'd probably have to restart on the rank ladder at some stage
But in one way or another their their their rank like, uh, this is something I think like gamers
You know, we're focusing a lot on e-sports. I won't get into too much
But yeah, I think it would be really cool to to do this between games and it would really work
Well to bring especially e-sports players
Uh over to over to web 3, you know interoperable
Gaming rank across different games
Yeah, interoperable ranks would be really cool
I think you know if we look at e-sports as an industry
I think it's lost a little bit of that magic and I think I wonder you know is is web 3 kind of the new home
For e-sports, I think in many ways it it definitely could be
Um, so yeah, that would be really interesting to see how that develops
Um guys we're getting close to the end of our show
Today's episode has been absolutely insane. It's been
Uh, we had some amazing guests on here from the animoca fam, uh in segment one to
You know games like nfl rivals d-fi kingdoms, uh, and even you know, we had yat yatsu on there
Who absolutely stole the show?
Um, and of course all you guys here in the third segment
Um, I just want to throw it out there guys. I mean there's been such amazing discussions going on especially around interoperability
I think it's funny like having hosted one of these spaces
Uh in december, I want to say the conversation has very much shifted in the time
Uh, and that's only been you know been three months, right?
And this is also just show you know, it really shows how quick our industry moves
Um from you know in in one quarter alone with the length of time, uh of a quarter
Fundamental ideas of how we look at the space
Drastically change so that's very very cool to see a little bit scary but very cool to see
Um and everyone really aligning um on on where we want to take all this. Um, you know the the next steps
I'm just going to throw the ball up in the air whoever wants to catch it go for it. Uh, are there any final thoughts? Um
Any final thoughts, uh to to close off this space?
No one's going to catch it i'm going to catch it
I can't see hands. So someone just take it if you if you have any final thoughts, uh, no hands, if not, all right
I'm just going to uh, oh adam go for it. Oh, I was going to uh, thank you really and so you didn't have to be left hanging
Uh, we're gonna i'm gonna be in nft paris this weekend if anyone's around i'd love to catch it with anyone who likes to talk about
web-free gaming or other other nerdy things. Um, but thanks for having us. I'm sorry
Amazing. Well adam i'll i'll be there. Um, so uh, we're gonna have to have to sync up at some point
Yeah, man, it's been a it's been a good two and a quarter hours. Um, what an absolutely
Amazing space it's been. Uh, if you guys are so inclined this is recorded so you can go back and listen to it. Um
Yeah listeners, thank you so much for for sticking with us. Uh, go and follow all the speakers that are on stage right now
Uh, they gave us some incredible insights some incredible discussions
Um guys, my name is matt solomon or soli
Uh, this has been episode four of the rev show megaspaces and I guess which is now the actually you know, actually the first
Um go and check out the tweets that are pinned, uh here in the space
Um one is introducing our new rebranding of the motorverse and what that all means bringing all the game studios
Uh that are under the animoca banner, um within the motorsport ecosystem all under one roof
Um and torque squad staking torque squad being the pfp of the motorverse ecosystem
So guys, I hope you all enjoyed it. Um, go and follow the motorverse for updates on the ecosystem as well as future spaces
Uh, hit me with a follow while you're at it. It's free. Um, and uh, keep revving and we'll see you guys very soon on the next one