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Options Talk w/ @thinkingvols @vec0zy and @0xmerp
Recorded: April 9, 2025 Duration: 0:42:27Space Recording
Short Summary
In a lively discussion, crypto enthusiasts Merp and his co-host explore the evolving landscape of trading, the impact of COVID on workplace dynamics, and the current trends in market volatility. They emphasize the importance of strategic decision-making and the potential for growth amidst challenges, while also reflecting on the broader market's performance.
Full Transcription
Welcome, welcome. Today is Wednesday, April 9th, and we have with us Merp, longtime acquaintance
in the industry, fellow vault hard, world traveler, fitness expert.
What's up, Merp?
Hello. How you doing? Good, good bro thanks for having me of course why don't you for the people that don't know you the way that we do give a a little brief self intro uh yeah so i've been uh
buying coins or whatever for like six years now, I guess. And started using Twitter around the time of COVID, I think.
And then people knew me as like some options guy for a little bit
because nobody talked about them.
I talked about them a little bit.
So everyone thought that I was smart for some time.
And then I just started shitposting all the time and then people realized
uh that i was a retard and then so here we are today you know um just been trading this whole
time um and uh i've worked for a couple funds and that's pretty much it. I used to be in hospitality.
That's what I went to school for.
And then COVID happened.
And then I was like, well, if you can't work from a computer, you're probably fucked.
So I like found something to do on the computer and stuck with it.
And now it kind of feels like the opposite.
It's coming back, right?
People are wanting to go back to the office a little bit,
and some teams are forcing them part-time.
But not even back necessarily.
I don't mean in the way that work happens,
just the way of the world and what the world values.
Yeah. I was going to say,, for me, even though like,
if you asked me a year ago and it has nothing to do with like current
marketing conditions, it's just length of time doing it.
But if you asked me a year ago,
if I would ever want to work like at a physical location again,
physical location again, I would have said, you couldn't pay me enough to go into an office.
I would have said you couldn't pay me enough to go into an office.
And now, like a year later, after like working remote for like the better part of a decade,
I like kind of want just physical presence of humans, like not even for the conversation,
like, you know, just to be around other people because i sit in my
office all day long by myself and the only people i'm exposed to are like my immediate family my dog
yeah i think the physical uh and social stuff will always have like some value or i mean i think the
value is increasing going to increase in the near future as well yeah i think it's different if you're like working on
like complex problems i don't know ai math science things that you need like a lab for
you need to be in person but if it's just uh i don't know, like, look, let's take my buddy, for example.
He makes presentations for orientation days at hospitals, for the military, for hotels, for shit like this.
He does not need to ever go into an office ever again as long as he shows up and provides.
But there is still some stuff that you should be in an office for,
complex equations, national security stuff, and science where you need it in the lab. But for us, shitposting all day, I think it's better to be on the computer anywhere.
I agree that there's not a need for every position to be back. And I think that's why there's now like this economy of and
job selection of jobs that are available to do remote that used to require you to come in.
But I think that like the point of it is that people a few years ago, they all wanted and were kind of allured by the idea of working but not having to go into work.
Whereas now after, you know, people have become kind of accustomed to that and maybe scarred from lack of physical presence of other humans because of COVID and just like the after effects, you know, the dwindling effects that that had on people's psyche.
Now they're starting to kind of just crave the presence of people.
Slowly.
Slowly.
I don't mind not being in an office.
I think it would be cool to have an office in Rio if you had like a bigger
trading team, but know we're we're
around the world partners have families and like that that you know maybe it's it's best that they
stay stay across the pond and you know we're here holding it down in south america uh merck what
are you thinking for i mean what what do the people want to know merck they want to know
everything about you but they mostly want to know about the tariffs
and how this flip-flopping, it's not even a retard in this, honestly.
One day we have 100% tariffs.
The next day we're pausing up for 90 days.
And I think that he came into it a little gung-ho.
And I think that they could have said hey we're gonna start these tariffs in 90
days these are the numbers and you have 90 days to negotiate with us or 60 or 30 and if you don't
go get fucked but uh for yourself how are you trading this how are you feeling bro uh yeah i
mean i don't know it's pretty hard to, to actually like trade off any of these headlines because like you said,
he just will flip flop the next day. But I think, you know,
when stuff, when things are like this,
you just have to make a decision and like go with it. And like,
if you think at 80 K or below,
like that Bitcoin is like good relative value for whatever on like some time
basis you know like then you can be buying it uh and like hopefully you don't own a bunch of alts
uh that are down 70 percent but but once they're down 70 percent yeah you know they go down 30 that's what crypto twitter thinks
they didn't know it could go down another 99 many such cases but i don't know for me i just have a
lot of hype and a lot of bitcoin and a lot of stable coins so i haven't been doing like all
the trading i've been doing in the last couple of weeks has just gotten chopped,
like in P&L wise, just pure chopped.
I had a god year short from a couple of weeks ago, Murph,
that was like the only thing saving me or making me any money.
I forgot what event was happening, but we were streaming on Eden in the morning
and there was just like
I'm trying to think
I think ETH had almost like a 10% daily
but it was like
it happened over the course of a couple hours
while they were talking
maybe it was when they had the conference
or if it wasn't
it was just before the conference
when they were talking about some shit
and we pulled up the VeloChart and we're just looking at or if it wasn't, it was like just before the conference when they were talking about some shit.
And we pulled up the Velo chart and we're just looking at Bitcoin and ETH.
And it was such dirty work.
It was just no bounce.
There was not a green fucking candle for days.
After it, yeah, yeah.
It was just straight up.
And I'm like, dude, this is disgusting.
There's no way that this should be happening on a fucking, I forgot what day it was. Like, you know,
it was like Monday morning or something, right?
Early as fuck and nothing else is really moving hard.
ETH is just up like 10%. And I'm like, yeah,
this is like recipe to just short the hell.
And we haven't gone, we only went up past that once. Like it rebounded.
We went up to like 21 something and then it's just been Shrek ever since.
Yeah.
I think people are off sides right now.
I think everybody piled into the bottom.
Well, I think everybody piled in at 1800 long.
Let's call it ETH, right?
Last, the beginning of the month, last week.
They were piling in like that 1800, absolutely gigarex to 1400.
Then they piled into shorts again.
And now we're seeing a nice relief rally, not just crypto, but all markets.
markets nasdaq's having its best day since 2008 up 10 11 um i mean when you're when you're trading
NASDAQ's having its best day since 2008, up 10, 11%.
normally mercer are you a directional trader you're hedging you're market making you're a
spot guy you're a hundred bucks you're a hundred x leverage guy clicker just about clicking retard
retard like just a normal person yeah no but that's right i mean you don't need you don't
like just a normal person
need to be fully on algos you don't need especially if you're playing like a medium to longer term
time frame like okay i'm gonna buy this thing and for the next month i think it's gonna go up like
you don't unless it's some sort of arbitrage thing like you don't need
perfect execution of course you should try for limit orders to pay less fees but granted you
you don't want to do that you only want to just ape in mark it in sure um how are you mostly doing
this merp you're mostly doing spot perks i mean i like to get into like if you're using perks like
how you look at funding and things like that interested to hear because i don't think we've ever talked about trading oh no yeah that's true
only bikes and six packs and stuff like that
um yeah uh for me mostly mostly spot some perps.
The perps trading for me goes in and out of Vogue.
In the beginning of the Trump stuff, I was trading a lot of perps,
as well as last year, just farming hyperliquid.
But once I start doing a lot of perps volume,
I start getting out of line on my, on my timeframes and like,
I'll start switching up my timeframes a lot. And so for me,
the easiest thing is just spot trading and like trying to use things that are,
that seem to be early and, and like, you know,
just actually genuinely trying to be early to somewhat
to trends and things like that and uh we haven't really seen one for a really long time now it
feels like um like the pump fun meta like homogenized almost like every opportunity in
the market for for like a straight, it feels like.
We were talking about this on the morning stream, right? Where if there's like incentives
in DeFi, we go over there and we farm the shit out of all of them, whatever it is, right?
If it's mostly all one things, right? Like we're looking at the Arbitron, the AVAX, stuff
like this, where they're actually the treasury is backing these crazy incentives.
And we go milk those.
But then we always come back to our island, as Cozy puts it.
We always come back to our home, whether it be Arbitrum or Mainnet with all of our funds.
We don't stay over there.
This time on Hyperliquid feels a little different because people stayed which was rare right even
like dydx people left even though what's the one on base bsx was instantly minus 90 percent uh people
left uh hyperliquid was the only following that actually stayed and it was last year they launched
the token this year they had some weird hack it wasn't even a hack i'm not
even sure a manipulation of the market maker of some markets some market manipulation they handled
that averagely well but what is it about hyper liquid that keeps the people staying over any
other decks what i want to know your thoughts on it as being a hype whale.
I think it's just like, obviously there's just,
there's this airdrop effect, right?
And so people want to see their bags do well.
And so they're going to work for that. But on top of that, I think that it's kind of it's i don't you know it's like hard to know if
anything is true in crypto in the long run but it feels like uh it's one of the only
teams where the people who build this product and uh work on the decks and like, you know, own however much percent of the supply. Think about
token holders like as if they're team members as well, as that's what it feels like. And that's
what it has felt like for a while. And I think that's, you know, probably one of the biggest
reasons outside of that airdropped effect that people are willing to to be so bullish for lack of a better word i mean and you always have this effect of bag holders
holding it to the fucking bottom but all of the big players that i know they're still accumulating
so if if you're retail listening maybe there's still hope for you i mean i think you're retail listening, maybe there's still hope for you. I mean, I think you're pretty cooked if you bought 30 and you rode that wave of the influenza
telling you it was going to 100 next week.
I think you might have a better opportunity here at the, well, before this morning, right?
right at the 9 10 handle whatever it was um it's interesting to see that the ups and downs
At the 9, 10 handle, whatever it was.
and the beginning product wasn't that great right they liquidated their users twice on a bad mark
price they built through that even now they're getting hit on uh hlp and to see that the cult
members still colting so it's interesting to see that it would be
interesting to see looking out you know not even five years is too long a year two years and see
if people uh change or or move because like before we saw dydx was the gold standard everybody was
following dydx and now i mean you couldn't get people to trade on dydx even if you
paid them yeah i mean that's that's like one of the that's where the founders slash the team thing
comes into effect i think um like the way that someone like dydx operates it's clear that their their goal was like up front like front
loaded extraction as quickly as possible and uh you know it feels like hyperliquid is is maybe
the inverse of that so the volumes keep growing too like the fees keep growing like so it's i mean it's really easy to be
in alignment with the bull theory if you if you already have an extremely low cost basis because
of the the because it was free because it was free yeah i mean if you were adopted for free
you're still up mega right but if you bought 30 you're you're cooked for sure yeah of course as is with
everything right oh sure imagine buying even of or solana just hit all-time high in february
uh january january february i forget all-time high and now you know hit hit 99 or 98 bucks i mean
we're getting absolutely hammered and we're getting saved by a tweet at this point um i want to know how you're
kind of navigating this i don't know if it's tariff news but it's more this flip-flop like
if somebody was listening in and they're getting chopped the fuck up i mean you can always say oh
only risk one percent of your book on a trade or stop fucking trading and get a job is usually what
i say right not get a job but why not just stop trading and wait for some clarity? Like there's no,
it's kind of like what you said earlier on, Marty, you know, like you don't have to always
be doing something. There are, and like, if you're looking at things more medium or long-term,
you don't need to pull up the chart every single day. It's fine to go like, I think that Bitcoin is going to
be, you know, I think that Bitcoin is undervalued under 80K. And I think by the end of the year,
it's going to be over a hundred and just buy spot. You know, I think the people's biggest
problem is over trading that they sit on crypto Twitter all day. They see flashy PNLs from the
one out of a thousand trades that some guy, he removes the size from the PNLs from the one out of 1,000 trades that some guy won.
He removes the size from the P&L card so no one can see it's only $500.
And they get FOMO, and then they fucking chop themselves in depth.
I think that that's fair.
I mean, it's been – not even just chop city if if you were too late to the short and you were piling in
all week or all month into the short you're late right and if you're reading crypto twitter and
people are posting pml's you're also late but we do live in this fake reality of
like yeah that pnl card or you know the people who actually do post million dollar pnls
and the people that actually are making millions of dollars and for every guy making a million
bucks there's a thousand five thousand a hundred people i'm not sure losing 99.99 percent right
for one person to win somebody else has to lose or others have to lose. That's just the game that we live in.
But it's not great when the president of the United States is tweeting, oh, it might be a good time to buy.
And then 10 minutes later, they pull off tariff.
They pull a break.
Or Eric Trump tweeting, thank you later.
Shit like that.
They should just shut the fuck up.
Just shut up like stop tweeting yeah like it's okay to say okay we're pausing tariffs or you
know this is what we think but i mean it really goes back to they should have said hey we're
gonna put these insane tariffs on you guys we're gonna give you 90 days and let's talk it out
and we shouldn't just be watching a reality tv show uh live you know and we know
it's entertainment season with trump but i really don't think we should be watching a
fucking reality tv show live people are missing sleepy joe and not even knowing where that guy is
yeah yeah i mean i i think of the same like you don't you don't have to be trading this like the uh the way to trade these
moves is to like if there's nothing much happening then you pick make an opinion and then you put a
position on and like hope that the next time you get a fucking eight percent darth maul candle like
you were right uh or you fade like the crazy moves so either you're like you're selling right now or you're buying
when it nukes to like 75 and all other times you're just like doing nothing right and just
watch like kind of half watching and maybe even finding other things to do is like the gto thing
when it comes to trading because that way you're not staring
at every crazy chart or every are you trying to hint at something merp what do you got what's what's the life alpha i know you got like a 12 pack not of beer you know on your stomach what uh
what kind of life advice do you have for the incels i mean i picked up a bike merp told me to
buy a bike like i don't know a year ago at this point and my fat ass finally got a real pedal bike i'm doing like 30
kilometers a day just around nice it's electric don't want to lie to you no i do have an electric
one but i got like a real pedal bike a real road bike thing so what's the alpha you got
but I think.
So what's the alpha you got?
I don't know.
Just have like a balance,
try to have some balance in your life,
you know,
for anyone that's listening.
It's good to have balance.
Where do they start?
Where do they start?
Dude,
on the balance part,
you know,
like a few years ago when it was actually when I was traveling,
like quite a bit,
when we first were running into each other like everywhere.
The next year I had like some really serious health issues and it was simply like related to my lifestyle, like not drugs or anything.
It was just that I wasn't eating well.
I wasn't sleeping well.
I wasn't drinking water.
Yeah.
Your fat gets fucked up.
Your joints get fucked up. Your joints get
fucked up. Like my stomach literally tore a hole in itself. And, uh, and yeah, I w I was like,
luckily, like when it happened, I noticed that something was wrong and I went to the hospital,
but, uh, but yeah, it could have been bad. I could have been just like leaking stuff out into myself
and could have been way worse but that happened from from you
know bull market fatigue from in 21 like just the market doing what it was doing me not wanting to
miss anything and having no other hobbies you know like my hobby was just staring at fucking
uh charts new listings you know had my system for our bots back in those
days that were monitoring things to see what new was coming out. And like, you just had to be early
to everything. And then after that happened, I just, I was like, does it really matter? You know,
like what is, you see all these conversations about like, is X amount enough? And I always
find them so funny because it's really different for every person. Like the question really is like, is X amount enough? And I always find them so funny because it's
really different for every person. Like the question really is like, what do you need to
be comfortable? And like, will you be happy being comfortable? And if you're not happy,
10 million isn't enough. 10 million is not enough. According to crypto Twitter.
There's like two, two, I feel like there's two types of people in this market. Like
There's like two, I feel like there's two types of people
in this market, like people that have a quote unquote made it
or whatever, and now they don't really know
what to do with themselves.
And then the people who are like all day,
all they think about is like making it.
And they also don't know what to do with themselves.
Like, and a lot of people just go on Twitter to like, so other people can tell them what to think.
Right. But I think the biggest alpha for, for the person who made it already is, is to travel
by yourself and just goes to like the most random places ever. And meet people of very,
ever and uh meet people of very very like different lifestyles and and like levels of income
and it gives you lots of perspective and perspective is good i think perspective is
is helpful and then also uh like for the the other person too like the person on the low end
other person too like the person on the low end that that might also be you know a good idea uh
it's obviously not as financially accessible but it can be done like you know you can hostel it
you could bust it you could definitely figure it out especially if you don't have a home base and
just a laptop order i mean dude minimum wage in minimum wage in Brazil is $200 a month.
Yeah.
That's not saying that those people are living any way she performed good.
Make your goal saving the money for the plane ticket to go somewhere in Southeast Asia
and fucking, you know, you can live there as a digital nomad for, you know, less than
$10 a day in some places or in some instances.
Yeah.
And then for, like, you know, people who, I don't know, feel like they don't have enough money.
I think the alpha is, like, conservative with your money when it comes to the markets.
Don't just buy a little bit of everything, but be super discerning and pay a ton of attention,
but don't really ever do anything until you see something that's crazy.
And then if you have just most of the time if you just like your portfolio is just one or two
things like cash or or just whatever uh you can like shove a lot easier right it's like it's a
lot faster the mental like kind of like the mental groups are a lot easier to do to go around and
like uh shoving into something like pepe versus owning like 12 different coins, right?
Is like the returns, the difference in returns is like insane.
You know, Pepe was like in the worst market conditions too.
So it's like that kind of stuff is always possible.
Like Frentech, if you were sitting on Frentech with like .3 ETH,
like scamming the buttons on your phone
in the first two or three days,
like you could make thousands of dollars.
Yeah, you could have flipped a lot there.
I mean, even I wasn't that active
and I still made a couple ETH.
Yeah, and like if you're just,
like if you have like a super small portfolio,
then that's the kind of things you need.
You need to be looking for like the genesis effect.
The genesis of the metas.
Not just that, I mean like one airdrop can change your life.
That's what he's saying, like the genesis effect,
like get there in the very beginning.
Oh, yeah.
And that doesn't mean do everything.
I mean, we did every perfect change ever.
Yeah, most of it was probably like you got fucking nothing.
Well, I disagree.
I would say if it requires no capital, if it's only time draining,
then you should do everything.
Oh, for sure.
For sure.
If it's capital intensive, then you,
then,
you know,
you should be choosy of what you're putting your capital into because you
don't want to like that Genesis effect is,
it goes back to like what Merp was saying.
You,
you have to believe that it's something like really crazy.
That's gonna do well to want to like not be in seed.
You have to somehow be interested in it.
Like for hype,
I was like,
I used it and I was like,
well,
this is obviously just like a super good perp decks compared to the perp
decks that I've used before.
And like anyone who trades on chain,
like would realize this.
And so I'm going to just keep,
I'm going to trade the fuck out of this because there's several people that
I know who are super bullish on it. And I i'm bullish on like how they think about things uh and you know
like uh the reason that i was like farming it was because i had like some belief in the idea
yeah and like yeah so it's like alchemics when it first launched yeah you have to keep like
exploring and you'll see like some idea will just and you'll tell like for this is for like the people listening or whatever
like you'll tell the people close to you like you guys need to be doing this and they'll all just
look at you like oh okay and like that's when you know that that like in retrospect that's how you
know like that you're gonna be like cooking when everybody is just like oh whatever whatever you
say bro like okay i'll look into it and like nobody's actually using it but you're like find
something fascinating and not many people are talking about it like that means you're probably
super early to something uh so that's like the one thing to think about we've been going for 28.
we'll be going for 28
let's keep the alpha
of the longevity going
I've never been invited
to a Merck dinner but Merck
I only ever had one
that's what he says
I only had one
there was only one
like a non-starter
like a failed start
like it was a sick dinner.
You can do it at my house.
You can do it at my house.
Yeah, that would be sick.
There needs to be like...
Or we can just hire a maid and a chef
and they can do it and then we just eat.
Imagine that.
That's usually what I do.
That sounds just like a regular to me.
Yeah.
There's a lot of institutional guys here uh are you gonna go to the ecc thing is that the one in uh in france in kane
i called it canes the other day and somebody was like do you call porsche pors Porsche and I was like depends on who I'm talking to there's an escrow canes I'll be in canes if anybody wanted to meet up I will be there and
not for the event but actually I was going to on vacation and then how it
always works out is I'm on vacation and it ends up being that there's a
conference following me. So same thing.
I hadn't planned this, but when we were there for
ECC in Paris, like two years ago,
I just stayed in France for like two years ago.
I just stayed in France for like another three weeks afterwards and traveled.
And we stayed in,
in con or canes for a little,
for a little bit.
And I wasn't like super impressed.
Like it was nice,
but like,
I thought it would be fucking,
I don't know.
No, we're going to be in that area.
It's just Nice without rocks.
Really?
Well, we won't be in that area.
The difference is the beach in Nice is all rocky,
and the beach in Cannes has sand.
Interesting.
And Cannes is three times the price of Nice.
Yeah.
It makes sense.
Imagine you just live at the beach all day in Brazil and you just look at the
beach every day and then you go on beach vacations and you're like,
this fucking sucks because I live at the beach.
That's currently my life.
I go everywhere. Where'm like, this sucks.
Where are the places you go?
For us mainlanders who don't live near the beach,
us center-eyed owners, we go to beach.
We go beach.
Where do you go?
I go to the beach and I want to go home.
It's true.
I'm sorry.
I'm looking at the beach right now. I'm looking at the white sand. I want to go home. Yeah, I want to go home. It's true. I'm sorry. I'm looking at the beach right now.
I'm looking at the white sand.
Yeah, I want to go home.
Yeah, I want to go home.
And so when I go on vacation, it's shit that we don't have.
So mountains, lakes, water sports.
You live by one of the thickest, most highly stick mountain ranges in the world i can see it
right now but like like farmland like this is what we do you know like farmland or like skiing
we don't have snow in brazil so we love skiing and stuff like that that's kind of what what we
do for vacation but when we go on a beach vacation i just want to go home like we did like
10 i don't know 10 days in the bahamas maybe seven i forget and on like the fifth fourth day
i was like okay cool can i go home or i can see that like yeah it's enough i can see that part of
it do you like being on being on the water like on cruises, or are you, uh, because you live, I just got my boat
license, Captain Marty, dude. I just got my boat license. So I'm, I, I enjoy the ocean. I don't
enjoy refueling a boat. Right. It's like $3,000 to refill a fucking regular ass boat. Um, I,
I prefer sailboats. Yeah. I prefer sailboats. I prefer,boats i prefer uh jet ski and you know water sports
stuff like that if if my friend has a boat boats are great of course i don't know how
like i i would assume that having a normal just like a fishing boat's like much more uh
uh cost yeah yeah but but like a a boat of size is the biggest money sink that I've ever encountered.
You know what boat stands for, right?
Tell me.
Bust out another thousand.
Literally.
Yeah, literally.
It's insane.
We were talking about the one day.
It's different for you.
You can keep yours in the water
all year but out here
it's like you have to pay to get it put in
you have to pay to get it de-winterized
pay to get it winterized
pay for your spot at the club
renew your spot like there's so
many fees associated to owning the
motherfucker that it's like
not worth it
not fucking worth it
Murph we're coming up on uh 35 minutes any last alpha
any uh i mean we covered a lot we covered 12 packs with murph biking with murph boats with
marty tariff trading getting a job and sitting on your hands anything else which are covering Anything else? 90 second bull run?
If you're going to trade options,
just like,
obviously, always cross the spread.
I have a family to feed.
we appreciate you guys crossing the spread.
I know a lot of people come,
maybe a lot of people listen to these things
to hear people talk about trading options.
I mean, I don't think that they probably often
don't end up being about trading options.
But I think the best way to trade options is to just,
if you think a big, big move is coming then uh just buy
some calls and if you think the best way to trade options as somebody who sells options this is not
financial advice if you want to take a directional bet you should put on a call spread or a foot
spread it because it's very simple your p l becomes if price is above x you make x or y
it's very simple so like uh 81 82 call spread uh bitcoin 81k 82k call spread your max profit is a
thousand because it's yeah i don't know i feel like there's uh like i feel the opposite actually
i think that that's all in one day at a time
that's how you feel no it's like that's the um it's like if the purpose of an option is like
well not the purpose but like if options are the way to get like a bunch of convexity uh
then leverage then that's why like you should use them.
You know, like purpose is leverage, but it's only linear.
So like your position will make just as much money.
Like if BTC goes up by 1K relative to 2K to relative to 3K to 4K, right?
So like, if you're like, if you're like if you're like okay btc is 76 000 i think
like trump could come out and say some positive like then you can just buy like some calls and
make a shitload of more money uh than if you were just long perps or something like that i think
that's not for sure but it has to be kind of like use case.
If you miss the timing, you're fucked.
Yeah, of course. But like, I think the easiest way to think about options
is like a non-options person is just to think of options
as like spot but exaggerated.
And, you know, they give you sort of a mental time frame for this trait to begin with so uh well and you come out with way less in premium like people
are like oh i lost 100 of my premium yeah but you only spent like a thousand dollars to get
access to 500 eth you know like your leverage is insane or the
right to buy 500 eph i should say your leverage is totally insane on options and you can create
any sort of payoff that you want to create with by doing multi-legs i think where people get confused
on options versus well imagine tribe i had perks like like i want to buy fucking apple at a thousand
x leverage nobody would trade options but in traditional finance does have fucking it doesn't
have perps but like futures is like such insane leverage it's kind of for sure like i made a
last week and i was like let's see like how much you know one of these yes 300x or something it's insane bro it was like
yeah yeah did you only have to put like a 50 position and it uh moves by five dollars for
every point and like these uh you have to have the mark don't tell them that like
that's like i have like 2k right i think is is the minimum deposit for a reason yeah no it's super
small but uh like you could get insane leverage on these things like well so listen to this
oh yeah the the bitcoin futures in brazil uh one contract is roughly 20 and one contract equals 0.1 bitcoin so for 200 bucks you can trade one
whole bitcoin yeah it's pretty fucking insane it's totally insane and that's intraday right
so you can actually go negative in your futures account if you guys were wondering but if you
were to hold it overnight you have to you have to post like 50 of the margin in cash or something right so it's
only really high leverage for intraday moves but yeah yeah i mean futures are insane options you
can create any sort of payoff you ever could imagine um if you're looking at trading perps
and options i hear premia is going to launch perps and options under portfolio margin in the coming
month or two. So that would be a good look for you, Murph. Maybe you can bring some volume
over and get some points, some money.
Points are always good.
I think that that's the thing that nobody's figured out is options on chain with portfolio
margin. So it'll be the first one with portfolio margin and perps so you
can actually hedge out in one book instead of you know having to keep capital segregated or
on various exchanges yeah that's probably uh like you know what has held back a lot of these
exchanges from getting like the net to the next level in terms of like my volume and mind
share so for sure like it's pretty like hyperlifical pretty and capital efficiency like people
can't and get filled on 50 to 100 btc yeah on the dexes and they don't want to post 50 BTC as collateral to underwrite options.
Because they're using a Dex when they can go to Deribit or fucking Binance somewhere.
And have that experience, have it smooth, have the UX that they want.
And the only caveat to that is that they're trusting someone else to hold their funds while they make the trade.
Yeah.
So that's it, fellas.
Murph, thanks for coming on.
Yeah, come on anytime, Murph.
We'll get you on every quarter is what we try to do
with all of our guests.
We're rotating. It doesn't have to be about
options. It can be about trading.
Grant says,
thanks, man. he loves crossing the spread
and he can't wait to see me in france is what he said
bolus spread crossers how do you think i'm paying for the vacation
that guy said that marty can it. He's going to con.
Yeah, yeah.
It's canes to you.
It's canes to you.
Marty's setting up his chicken shack in canes and living off doing a quarter of the country of Brazil's volume on the stock exchange.
That is true. That is true.
I was like 10 to 20 percent of the futures market in the
bitcoin futures for like a month click trading because the premium on the first day was ten
thousand dollars over the futures than any other futures market you couldn't get off a thousand
lot but you could get off enough to make enough money it was great it was a good time
enough to make enough money. It was great. It was a good fucking time.
Follow me for more live tips and trading emerging markets.
I think that that's the next alpha.
Marty is exploiting emerging TradFi markets the way that we used to exploit
emerging contract addresses launched by Andre.
I think that that's the next alpha
emerging markets.
We can do that.
I'm down. Alrighty, fellas.
We'll see you in two weeks.
Of course, bro. Good to chat.
See you back in two weeks for another Options Talk.
And for those of you that tune in on Fridays,
we'll be back Friday morning
another Eden. Later, everyone. Later.
