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Philosophical Investing #2
Recorded: Jan. 21, 2023 Duration: 1:46:00Space Recording
Full Transcription
Hello, hello. Hello, Mr. Prime.
Throw a few ideas around, so we've got, uh...
Oh, I did drop it in fluff, but again, I'm not that active in...
Yeah?
And it's attracted people, you know?
Yeah?
And it's attracted people, you know?
Yeah?
And it's attracted people, you know?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Yeah?
That's amazing, thank you though.
Pik dilop peegee.
I...
He's a fan bizarre, duro.
Wow, this is crazy.
... but you also know what it should be because youmarkt to various lesser establishments ...
Look at this. I'm excited to do it as a speaker.
Andy.
Oh, you're on mute.
That's okay. Whenever you feel free or you want to jump in,
you're going to have something to say.
I have nothing to say at all. I just wanted to say hi.
Oh, great. I appreciate it. Yeah, I appreciate the support.
A lot, Candy. I know you've definitely caught a few people's attention
in the space around, so welcome on board.
I guess for some people, last week's episode was not recorded.
I guess it was a decision I made.
I probably wasn't that confident in having the whole thing recorded.
This week, I did hit the record button when I set it up,
so this will be recorded.
It's good to see we've got Melted Rope in the spaces
who was providing us with some valuable insight last week.
I'm just going to go...
I love seeing all the jelly rascals in the crowd.
Yeah, so, Candy, is it true you had a jelly rascal
or jelly babies at one stage? Is that right?
Can you confirm that?
Yes, I did. I did have jelly rascal.
I had to sell it for liquidity because I'm a broke-ass bitch.
Highly regretful.
I keep telling everyone to buy them just to, like,
make up for my guilt, and I've gotten a few people to buy them, so...
Well, okay.
Yeah, well, definitely appreciate your support on that,
but I'd say it's never too late to kind of get back in in some way.
I mean, I definitely feel like now's not the time to be selling or anything.
That's fascinating.
Now that...
Oh, my God.
What?
The rascals.
The rascals.
Ooh.
Yeah.
Those ones are good.
Yeah.
You like them?
Because they're like the cosmetic, right?
Like, you can sort of put them over an ugly-looking rascal you might have,
so...
So you're always...
The aesthetics are so good.
I love the features you guys decided on.
Like, all the teasers and everything.
I was getting so hyped.
Hmm.
Yeah.
Well, yeah.
I'm glad to hear you.
We've actually got the project owner and lead who's jumped in the spaces.
Carlos, welcome.
In the spaces.
I mean, if Carlos or Melted interested in coming up and just put your hand up
and I'll bring you up.
Otherwise, I'll just keep chattering on.
I was hoping we might get a few more in the space, but perhaps...
Also, side note, Carlos' new PFC is fire.
I'm sure.
I'm sure Carlos appreciates that.
Yeah.
So...
Yeah.
Well, I think it's good to have some female influence in the space here as well
because everyone sort of has their own role, right?
I mean, everyone can't be doing the same thing.
We've all got...
We all made it a bit differently.
And, you know, we all sort of make a contribution in the best way we can.
So, it's good to have your input, I think, in the spaces.
I'm not sure if we've had many, I say, women speakers in many spaces before.
Not that...
Well, I think in some of the corporate ones that I've listened into, there have been,
but not necessarily in the more decentralized type project ones.
So, Melted.
Welcome.
I'll bring you up, I think, as a speaker.
So, we've got a few guys, people up in here.
So, just to give everyone a bit of a background on sort of what we're doing,
this is our second space.
We held one last week, Philosophical Investing.
And I guess it's just looking at things from a, I guess, wider and higher perspective
rather than, you know, just personally, it kind of cheeses me off how it's always
this minute-by-minute, day-by-day and price-trading analysis that is somehow meant to,
you know, be the answer.
Well, that's the information we need so we can make the best decisions on what we're
going to do.
And it just seems like complete overkill.
And, you know, even today was a very bit of an example whereby, you know, I think like
the price of Sol may be lifted from 21 USD to 25, which is, you could say it was at 15
to 20% raise in 24 hours.
And that sort of takes the narrative over.
And I guess if you're thinking sort of day-by-day, you know, and you're trading, you know, and
you sort of have a trading strategy whereby you're buying and selling in the market and
that's what you're about, I can understand how that's relevant.
But I definitely see the trading aspect as secondary to the long-term investing because
if there wasn't this long-term investing aspect, then there wouldn't be any markets for these
traders to trade in.
So I guess it teases me off a bit when the traders kind of think the message that comes
through is that they're kind of all about them.
You know, they've kind of got all the answers.
You know, the price is the most important thing.
You know, for every trade that's made, for every sale, there's a buyer.
And that buyer is buying for certain reasons.
Also, you know, there's something that they see.
And I think fundamentally, someone is buying something because they believe what they're
buying is worth more than the amount they're paying for it.
You know, so they think there's value there.
And so they see there's something extra beyond that financial amount.
And it's about sort of getting and understanding that.
So I had a couple of questions, but I thought I might say my background.
I'm in Australia.
I'm started out in Ethereum NFTs.
I'm not really an ETH MFER, but I am very much on the sole side of things now.
It seems to suit me a lot better from, I guess, personality-wise.
And, yeah, I come from a background also, a bit of a background in sports, a bit of a background
in business.
But I like to think probably more of a general background in life and stuff like that.
So my perspective is kind of like, I don't look at the world as like isolated aspects.
I look to take a very sort of holistic approach and think that everything ties together.
And so what we're doing, you know, sort of investing, it very much ties into our personal
lives and who we are and the lives we build and live and how we relate to the people around
So it might sound a bit sort of lovey-dovey, but, you know, I could make a case that perhaps,
just perhaps maybe a bit of love is what we're all looking for in the end.
So, I mean, I've got a few questions written down here.
I mean, I'm happy for this to go anywhere.
It's a bit of a back and forth.
I'm going to sort of throw this to you, Melted, since you're up here and I'm confident in
your ability, you know, that I'm confident that you're confident, in other words.
And I wanted to ask, how do you define or measure success overall?
Mate, good afternoon.
Afternoon, everyone.
Candy, hello.
That's a good question.
So, how do I define success?
I know, I didn't give you much walk-in time, did I?
I kind of dropped it on you and now you're on.
It's like, you can have a moment to think about it.
That's kind of an answer, if you want me to fill in.
Absolutely.
Give me a minute to do on that one.
Yeah.
I was just, the first thing that came to my mind, like, success is like when you have
a goal and you achieve it.
Okay.
Yep.
So, what, could you give us an example of a goal you currently had or might have had
lately and then you achieve it or the steps you took to achieve it?
Yeah.
So, like, for example, just, like, one of the things on my to-do list for 2023 was, like,
getting my Discord all set up and, like, actually getting the channels in there.
And everything, the pinned messages, all that.
Currently working on, you know, getting the emojis and the emotes and all that.
And just, like, figuring that all out is one of my main goals for 2023.
And I feel like once I figure that out and the Discord looks clean, I'll feel like that
would be a success for me.
Okay.
Yeah.
Thanks, Candy.
So, Melted, how do you look at, how do you look at success or, you know, just even generally
or anything?
Yeah.
I suppose it's such an interesting concept for me because success, I don't think there
is kind of an answer to what that is.
It's like if someone says to someone, you know, that you're successful, it's, they may have
a very different view to what you believe that is.
So, I kind of, it's a question I kind of struggle with a little bit personally because I don't
know, you know, there's the obvious signs of success, right, in someone else.
But, you know, for one person, that may mean that it's having a family and there's food
on the table.
For another person, it might be X number of dollars in the bank.
For another person, it might be, you know, so many successful trips away.
I think success is different to everybody.
Um, or what, you know, what someone deems as successful is very different for everybody.
I think I can decode on, nails on the head that, you know, setting a goal and achieving
it or setting an objective and achieving it is, is success.
And I think that we, you know, I don't think we should try and try and determine what it
is because everyone has a very different view of it, right?
So, for me, my, what I deem for me to be successful is a very different bar to what
I suppose other people may say.
So, it's, yeah, that's a, that's a tough one for me.
It's a good question, but, um, it's, it's something people have always said, oh, you're
quite successful.
I kind of loathe it because I just, for me, I feel there's so, I've got so far to go and
I don't feel I'm anywhere near successful yet personally, on a personal level.
So, yeah, it's a good question.
It's a tough one for me to answer.
Right.
Yeah, you could say that there's an overarching general society's view of success and, you
know, from an outside perspective, if you kind of look at anyone or anyone's looking at anyone
else and they don't really know them, you kind of, is that person, I guess, relatively
healthy, you know?
Does that person have some of the, I guess, foundational aspects for them to live their
life, whether that's, uh, their home or, you know, a vehicle or, you know, it might
be how they dress and how they present themselves.
That might be the society's assessment of determining whether, uh, someone is successful.
But then on a personal element, it's probably more about, uh, you know, how we feel on the
inside might sort of determine, you know, not necessarily what we have or what is showing,
um, up on the outside.
Or it could be some, you know, like even, I mean, it could even be fair to say that getting
married is a fairly strong life marker for success.
I mean, people might have that as a very clear objective.
They want to have that sort of relationship as well.
I mean, and that isn't necessarily something that is defined, you know, from a financial
element, you know, having that strong relationship that you're going to spend, um, each other's
life together.
That's just my thoughts off the top of my head as I, as I tend to ramble on, uh, in this
type of, um, thing.
I don't really have that much structure.
I have a few questions and we just kind of wing it as we go.
Uh, I've seen Nifty and Stanny Surfer pop up.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Nifty.
Yeah.
We're just talking about success and, and, and, and, and how you define it or how you
measure it.
It's got a couple of elements, right?
So firstly, it's, you know, do you achieve what you set out to achieve, right?
That's like the clear message of success, right?
And some people, irrespective of what they do, they have a high, uh, percentage of achieving
what they're trying to do.
You know, like on a simple level and a complicated level, right?
Um, and generally speaking, if you associate with people like that, you'll probably have
a better result than if you associate with people that have a lower incidence of achieving
what they set out to achieve, right?
Um, so, you know, if you're, if you want to sell your house, then there's a real estate
agent that sells a high percent of your houses than other real estate agents, right?
He would be as a real estate agent, more successful, right?
But I think that the measure of kind of personal success is how happy are you with what you have
in your life.
Um, and if you have in your life, the things that make you happy, GG, you know, if somebody
else says many more things and they're unhappy, fuck them.
Like, you know, you're winning, right?
Like it's, it's like, you know, if you look at, I've just come back from Bali, right?
And these motherfuckers have got no money, right?
They don't even know what JPEGs are.
They're cutting grass with the side, right?
But nobody's sad.
Everyone's smiling, right?
You know, that they're happy with what, what they have in life, right?
And most of them have got good personal relationships with other people, right?
If you look at poor people, like, you know, most poor people are relatively happy.
Like it's only the absolutely downtrodden poor that are unhappy.
And if you look at a lot of rich people, yeah, a lot of them aren't that happy.
Um, so it's definitely not the things that you have, but it's kind of how you feel about
them.
And I think for me, it's, you know, are you moving in the direction that you're trying
to move in at the pace that you would like to.
And I think if you, if you're doing that, you're generally relatively happy.
I don't think it's a stationary thing.
I just think like, you know, if we think we're with the right people on the right track,
we're going to be pretty successful.
You know, if we were the wrong people on the wrong track, fuck, you know, things aren't
going to go well.
I knew you'd be good in this space as nifty.
I just had a really strong feeling.
Yeah, that was well said.
A thought that came to mind, I mean, there seems to be this strong temptation to be constantly
comparing, um, you know, uh, you know, you're sort of comparing to others, maybe comparing
to yesterday, uh, whatever the case might be.
I mean, do you find, uh, comparing, uh, well, if you compare to other people that have,
more fucked than you are right now, you know, like if you think, Hey, you know, two years
ago, you know, my body worked better and I had lots more money and I had better friends,
that's not going to make you fucking happy.
Right.
But if you're like, well, look at that quadriplegic, he's got no friends and no legs.
Like you, you don't feel better about life.
So just, you know, bear in mind, if you're contrasting, there's many people worse than
you than better than you.
And they're definitely the people to contrast with.
If you want to have a better kind of mentor outlook, you know, like the, what's there's
that guy that said, Oh, you know, my flatmate's beating me at everything in life.
His flatmate was Elon Musk.
Like, there are plenty of people that do a lot worse.
Pick one of them.
Yeah.
I'll tell you what, you're, you're very, uh, you definitely, you know, come up with some
pretty harsh examples and, and, and, and don't worry, this is not a politically correct
spaces either.
So, um, yeah, you're definitely forgiven there for, um, some of the examples.
Uh, now, Stanny, uh, did you want to chime in?
You don't have to, but.
Yeah, man.
Why not?
Can you hear me all right?
Yeah.
Yeah, I can hear.
Thanks for having me up.
This is actually my first, um, space to speak.
And so this is popping my cherry.
Pretty exciting.
But, um, I was, yeah, Nifty kind of rubbed me a bit there.
I was going to say something pretty, pretty similar to that, but yeah, I think he, I think
he nailed it on the head, right?
I think it's, um, I think it's about happiness, you know?
Um, it's probably a combination of a few things.
I think there's probably, there's obviously a part around, you know, setting goals or outcomes
or, or, you know, things that you want to achieve.
And, you know, that's probably in a, in a lot of different areas, right?
Around, you know, personal, might be fitness.
Goals or accomplishments, you know, financial stability or professional life, your work,
you know, things around, obviously family, like you mentioned, you know, marriage and
love and all that kind of thing.
But not, I don't think it's necessarily just about always hitting your goals, right?
I think it's about, about the journey.
I know you might, you know, you fail a lot, but as long as you pick yourself up and get
back on that journey and kind of go, go a different way.
But as long as you're happy in that journey and you're moving forward and the people around
you are happy, I think that's, that's really, I think what success means to me anyway.
So, yeah.
Oh, thanks Desteni and, um, congrats on popping the cherry.
Well said.
I'm glad I popped it with all you legends.
Yeah, yeah, it's not a bad, uh, group of, uh, guys we've got in here.
I mean, it's rascal heavy, but that's pretty much how we, how we roll.
That's the best way to roll.
That's the best way to roll.
Yeah.
I saw, uh, Mo Max just slid up into the, uh, speaker's chair in there.
Did you want to, uh, make a contribution?
Yeah, mate.
How are you doing?
You're all good.
Yeah.
Good, man.
I can hear you.
Yeah.
Um, so I kind of wanted to, to, to, to mention the same thing along the same lines and it
doesn't surprise me that all the jelly, uh, all the jelly guys have the same vision of
what success is, uh, you know, in terms of being happy, um, I, I kind of feel like if
you enjoy waking up early in the morning, um, if you can wake up with passion on a Monday
morning, I think you've, you kind of like halfway there already, if you enjoy what you
do, you know, that famous phrase that goes, um, you know, do what you love and you'll never
have to work a day in your life.
Um, you know, it's kind of something that I thought I would live by.
Um, but yeah, uh, I think, um, moving more deeper into like the web 3.0 space and learning
about things that I never knew about previously is kind of, um, it's kind of giving me a different
perspective on, on what happiness could be and, you know, things that you could possibly
achieve.
Um, so yeah, I think along the lines of what Nifty and Stani mentioned, uh, I share the
same sentiment.
I feel like just, you know, being happy is, is all the success you'll ever need and everything
else can come after that.
Okay.
I, I wanted to sort of mention to the people in here is that, um, we, Momac and I have
met each other personally and, um, it, it is a bit of a cool story how, um, we, we both
happened to be in Doha, Qatar for the, for the World Cup and as kind of coincidence has
it, we, we both had tickets to one of the same matches and so, um, Momac came and, came
and found me and, uh, a friend of mine and we hung out for the, for the game and, um, and
I don't mind giving you a little bit of a shill here, Momac, uh, in regards to the jelly
joint Dow or the J Dow or the jelly J Dow.
Um, I, I, I've got a bit of a suspicion that maybe we kind of met, you know, and, and, you
know, kind of hung out a bit and then maybe, uh, you know, sort of, Hey, you know, these
guys are real.
I'm not sure how many other, uh, jelly rascal holders or, or, uh, community members you
might've met, but, um, I guess the question is, is, is, is what's your kind of motivation
for getting started with this jelly J sub Dow, which from what I can see seems to be the most
professionally run sub Dow I've ever taken notice of.
Um, so like, how did this come about or why did you even want to take on this workload when
it doesn't seem like you have to at all, you seem to really want to.
Um, yeah, so, so, you know, this is, I'm going to give you the same answer that I've
probably used in about seven spaces this week.
Um, I feel like from start to finish of jelly, Carlos has kind of just given so much love
to the community and so much value.
So it's, uh, it's kind of me wanting to try and give something back to the project, uh,
in terms of value and adding value on top of value.
Um, so yeah, there's like, there's a lot of ideas still that, uh, we haven't, we haven't
really touched on, uh, but I mean, I see you've been quite active in the chats, uh, engaging
with us, which, which I truly appreciate because, you know, you're kind of showing your support
that you, you're enjoying and you kind of see some of the vision that we're trying to
create here.
Um, but yeah, ultimately that's, that's my motivation.
I want to, I want to try and do something special.
I feel like in every other project that I've been in and out of, um, I haven't felt the
same way I do in jelly, you know, just, just the vibe that I get in jelly, um, you know,
we've obviously had our ups and downs with a lot of situations and occurrences, but it's
always, it's always been really good.
Um, the community members and the friends that I've made along the way, um, I kind of
enjoy their company.
I was just telling my wife the other day that I enjoy my, enjoy my, we have 3.0 friends
more than my actual friends.
And, uh, yeah, I didn't, I didn't want to mention I enjoy, I enjoy them more than her
company, but I mean, so, uh, yeah, I think it's, uh, it's been really good.
And because I'm already spending so much of time with the guys and I felt like, uh, I
could really, I could really do something good with, uh, with this and, uh, I'm hoping
the community sees the value in that too soon.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I, I just have similar feelings.
I felt like I got, I got more, I got more Christmas presents from my, my NFT projects
than what I did from people in my life.
Like, no shit.
I was like, I was like, NFT Christmas is amazing.
You know, regular live, a real life Christmas.
Yeah.
Not as good as it was when we were kids.
That's for sure.
Um, that kind of peak, uh, but yeah, yeah.
Thanks for my back.
I mean, I'm really looking forward.
There's definitely a bit of background kind of hype building that I can fear with the
Jelly J Dow.
I mean, that's just my view.
I mean, I, I, it's obviously, it's going to sell out.
I think that's a given.
Um, so I think the support has been there and it's been built steadily, which has been
good without sort of a lot of hype.
It's sort of just been through networks, just genuine people coming in and supporting.
Um, uh, I've got something that I've noticed happen.
If we just changed that a little bit in the last couple, I guess it could be over the last
month and, and it's been alluded to is the, let's say this is in regard to the crypto prices
and, and NFT prices.
It seemed to me that when the crypto price goes up, right, versus the U S dollar, the
NFT floor price goes down, you know, in the, in the base unit currency, which is maybe Solana
or Ethereum.
Uh, but when, also when the cryptocurrency price goes down, the NFT floor price goes down as
well.
So it seems to be that no matter what price movement happens, uh, in the crypto market,
uh, NFT, I guess the floor price anyway, uh, drops.
And so that means people are choosing to sell under both conditions.
And so, um, I wanted to throw that kind of question out into our little panel there.
Uh, and I'll, and I'll, I'll go to melted in a minute is, is to why, what, what's happening
here?
Why, why is the floor price dipping?
Uh, when, when you say it's good news, it's going up or it's bad news, it's going down,
but it, it, it seems to be constantly bad news for NFT holders, at least in the short
term.
Yep.
Melted, you're up.
Now I've got a theory on this because it's something I've tuned on for a little while as
a source of frustration as well, but, and it's, it's because I look back and I think what
it would have been seven, eight months ago, uh, I remember talking to, to sind about tire
robotics, you know, they were, they were at the time, something like 10,000 us dollars.
They're insanely expensive to get your first big box.
Um, obviously the price is tanked on everything.
They become more reasonable.
And now they're in this, this bit of a struggle power play where they kind of get over 200.
So they go back under because the price has been moving.
It's this, it's this little game, but it's nowhere near what it was in USD.
I think what we need and what will change all of that will be a, um, a settling of the
price.
So at the moment when you get a 20% swing a day, people looking at it going, well, that's
a short term pump.
I can get out here.
And everyone's thinking about trying to buy back in lower.
That's the mindset of Solana and probably NFTs at the moment is if I can sell it this,
I can buy back when the price tanks again, cause it's going to tank again.
What we probably need to see is, um, and it's going to happen with everything, jelly include
is if we can get sold to, you know, 30 us dollars and it sits there for a month, you
will see the floor price on NFT start to come back because that is the price that people
correlate Solana with the demand still there for these NFT projects.
It's just that there's people that are willing to sell and go back to us dollars at this point
because they think there's going to be a better entry point on the actual currency itself.
So I think when the prices stop gyrating as heavy as they are, you know, 20% swings in
a day aren't healthy either way.
Um, when we can get, you know, sold to sit at whatever it is, it's 30, 50 us dollars, even
if it's for a month and it slowly grinds up, you'll see that the NFT pricing will follow
that because the demand's still there.
There's just people trying to take advantage of price movement or what they think will,
will happen with the price after these, uh, these big moves.
So that's, that's my, my thoughts on that space at the moment.
Um, okay.
Annoying.
Yeah, it is a bit annoying.
I mean, I've kind of got my, I've got a bit of a theory I've been working on as well.
So I think we're kind of similar minded in our theories, but before maybe I sort of, uh,
put my theory out, I just want to see if any of these other speakers, uh, if you're,
if you're speaking, there's probably two ways you can kind of notify me to speak.
Just unmute yourself, just like Nifty did, or put your hand up.
So Nifty, what do you, uh, I spoke to Denomics about this and Denomics knows stuff, right?
And I was speaking mainly about crypto.
I'm saying like, what has to happen in the economy for crypto to just like fucking go up?
Um, and he says sideways economic growth, right?
And I think it's exactly what Melted said about the NFTs, right?
If Seoul goes sideways for a period of time, NFTs will go up.
Um, that's, you know, if they go out, if it goes up or down and if T's will go down,
if it goes sideways, it'll go up.
Um, so I think that's, that's the, the main thing you'll get projects like jelly and,
you know, jewel box and other things that are beating the market.
Um, but what I do with my stuff is I don't have anything priced in Seoul.
I've got a price in Aussie dollars.
And if you just have it priced in the fit currency where you live and it's green, you're doing okay.
Who cares?
Yep.
Yep.
I've sort of got this idea as well.
I mean, like how, how reasonable is it to get some, you know, the sideways action that I'm talking about?
Because it seems like, I was going to think it's, it's like, it's like third, it's like one in three days, the price is up, one in three days, the price is down.
Maybe one in three days, the price is steady.
Um, you know, it's, it's like, it's just always going to be one.
It's not like the stock market, you know, like the stock market is probably, I don't know, like steady seven out of 10 days, you know,
maybe up two days out of 10 and then, and then drops significantly, maybe one out of 10 or something like that.
Like, like the volatility is greater.
Um, I, I, I'm just wondering how, you know, like reasonable that is.
Most of the line of poor is like kids that are smoking weed.
Like we're, we're not talking about seasoned investors, right?
Like, you know, I see on, like someone saw their PFP to buy food the other day, right?
Like we're, we're not talking about people that have got their money they're prepared to risk.
You know, it's smaller invested in great projects.
These are like mainly dickheads that have got their stuff invested in rugs that they need to pay rent with.
Like that's, that's the mindset that people are investing.
ETH does better because you've got older people with more money.
Um, but you know, but even then, right?
Like they're, you've got very few people that invest in NFTs and crypto and like they're not sophisticated investors.
Uh, it's, it's, it's going to be a super volatile market just because of the idiots and, you know, and then you've got some people, right?
That are super rich, that are still idiots.
Um, and then you've got such a small market cap, but it's quite easy if you're super rich.
Like look what happened when, uh, Carlos got, um, hacked, right?
Like actually it just went through the roof, right?
Like, cause it's got such a small market cap that that much movement can, can make a big difference.
You know, you try and move a stock with a hundred thousand dollars.
It's not going to happen.
Yeah.
All right.
Okay.
Let's, um, Stanny Surfer.
Yeah, thanks.
Um, yeah, I think a little bit of what Nifty was saying was, was bang on right around.
Like ETH and SOL too, like SOL's like coming from, I probably spent, uh, about 12 months in ETH and FT's before SOL.
And there's a big difference, right?
I think like SOL's seems much more like of a younger market.
People are flipping more, they're probably a bit more degenerate.
And I think like over the last few months, obviously like with, with the SOL price dipping as well as like all the macro view stuff, right?
Like all the stuff with FTX and Sam Beckman, the Freed and the macro view and interest rates rising.
There's so many things, right?
So people are, all those people that are investing money.
That's not what I like to call play money.
You know, like I think if you're investing large months money and NFTs that you need for rent, you should have a, probably a good hard look at yourself.
But, you know, there's probably plenty of, you know, teenagers and young people out there that are doing that, right?
So what they're trying to do, like SOL price goes up or down, they're trying to flip and get in and out to try and, you know, make money quick, right?
So you've got those young kind of, I guess what you'd say, inexperienced investors or not quite mature to the point where, you know, they're buying to increase value of a long period of time.
They're trying to get money in and out, you know?
So SOL price goes up or down, they're trying to get it out, transfer it to USDC or pull it out.
Like no one's really got that much faith in exchanges anymore.
So there's just a lot more of like, I guess, volatility and change and it's just a much more speculation, right, than what it probably was 12 months ago.
You know, we're also in a bear market as well, right?
You've got to, I think, you know, if we're in a bull market, it'd be a totally different story, right?
Because things would be going up, up, up, people probably wouldn't care about SOL because they'd be going up as well.
So everything's going up, everyone's just investing money and having a great time.
So I think there's about a million different factors to it.
But I think, you know, when you combine them all into one, probably the royalties as well, right?
Magic Eden, getting rid of the royalties, that wouldn't help because people just makes it easy for people to get in and out quicker.
So, yeah.
Yeah, but I suppose it's a lot easier to buy an NFT than it is to sell it, right?
Because a buyer, you can buy it in an instant, but to sell it, you've sort of got to list it.
Well, there's two options, right?
You can sell it, you can list it and wait for someone to come along and buy it, or you can, which is becoming more prevalent now, like the instant sell feature.
So there's a bill, put collection offers out and you can sort of action it.
But usually you're probably taking like a 20% hit or something on the floor price on that.
And then it's almost like that lack of liquidity, you know, or ease of being able to sell is what sort of creates that immediate drop.
Just because if someone's looking to sell, I mean, and I guess the volatility, it just takes, it just puts the buyers in a position just to wait a bit, you know, rather than just like, you know, because, okay, things are going up.
Maybe I'll just wait and then the next one comes along and, you know, list theirs lower.
For sure.
I think if you look, it'd be interesting to see if there was some form of stats on like ETH floor price fluctuations over time versus Solana.
Because I think Solana, like the floor price fluctuates so much more, right?
You know, you get undercutters, you know, yeah, it's just, it's not, it's hard to compare, right?
But yeah, I think, I think you're right.
You're on the money.
Yeah.
I've got a, I've got a, I guess a theory I've been working on was like, let's say if you are holding, right, you're invested.
So you've got this asset, you've got this NFT or anything and there's movement in the market, right?
You know, like, like, like, like, like the price goes down, the price goes up or there's some sort of major change.
Like, if you're already invested, you've really only got two options, right?
You can either just keep holding or you can sell.
And it's almost like there's this human need to kind of take action.
It's like something's happened.
I need to act, you know, and you could say that holding is acting if it's conscious.
But it's, it's, you know, really, it's, it's quite a difficult, it's just still doing nothing.
So it doesn't really feel right.
And so it's like, okay, I need to do something.
I'm going to sell it.
Because that, you know, means I'm active in the market and taking advantage.
You know, maybe it helps us feel like sort of be more in control of what's happening.
It's, you know, that's a theory I'm sort of working on is it, is it because if you're already invested and something changes, well, you could buy more as well, which is actually what I try to look to do now on projects I'm already in is when something like that happens and people come into the list and it drops.
I'm like, okay, this is an opportunity to buy more, you know, like to try and go the opposite of the market in a sense, assuming that it's, it's getting oversold.
You're just DCA, right?
It's just possible over the drops.
Well, yeah, that's me.
I'm not much of that much of a sweeper as opposed to just accumulating, you know, because I want to be accumulating, let's say, for days and weeks.
Um, because my timeline is more, I guess, weeks, months, years.
So I don't, yeah, it just sort of makes sense.
And also it doesn't disrupt the market that much.
If I'm looking to buy, um, I can probably DCA lower if I do it over time rather than a big sweep, which raises the floor price up.
Um, you know, because as, as there's just this time element when sellers come in and, you know, everyone's not listing at the same time.
People are sort of different time zones or whatever.
They've got their own world going on and then, okay, I'm going to list this.
So there's a gradual time-based listing process.
But we're getting technical.
That's for sure.
Okay.
I'll jump over to, um, Melton to give me a break.
Thanks.
No, I was just saying, I think, I reckon you've hit the nail on the head a little bit.
A lot of it comes down to people's timeframes.
Like when you've got that longer timeframe, like, like you look in and I look in as well, it can be, it's almost a pretty easy game to play sometimes, especially with projects that you've got the utmost trust in.
Like let's, let's look at Jelly, for example.
Um, every time it pulls back, you know, it's an opportunity to buy and people have put, you know, it's been put, it's pulled, it pulls back for whatever reason.
And one example I see quite a bit is, especially with successful D-Rugs is that it gets to a point where for some people they've reached the amount of money they're extremely comfortable with.
So they've turned this eight-sol NFT into 120-sol NFT and they'll pat themselves on the back and say, you know what, for me, job done.
You can then cut it down.
They'll take 10-sol less because hell, they only paid eight for it anyway.
So what's 110 versus 120, they'll undercut the market, no issues.
And they get to, you know, they get out with what is a healthy bag of profits.
Even when, you know, if you, if you're in it long enough and, you know, you believe in what's happening, you know, that this is, you're confident that this is the start of something bigger.
And those dips always, they get filled and then things sort of go back to their normal, normal progression.
So, yeah, I think it's, it's just different timeframes that people have present opportunities.
So if you've got a long-term timeframe, there's, there's buying opportunities abound for people that are playing at their short-term timeframes.
Yeah, yeah, it makes sense.
Makes sense.
We, we've had a new speaker come up and join us.
So I'm interested, I'm as interested as you are to see what Jocelyn or funny Jocelyn has.
Jocelyn is a Filipina comedian, ADHD.
Okay.
I'm taking that as perhaps a warning, but Spaces host, I had some experience.
I mean, you've come up to join our Spaces and I'm interested to see, yeah, as our second female on the speaking panel.
If you're free, perhaps you would like to just unmute yourself and maybe give us a little brief introduction.
Yeah, I've got the thumbs up.
Yeah, there you go.
You're unmuted.
So Jocelyn, how are you doing?
So I'd like to start by saying thank you, Twitter, for providing the place.
Thank you, Alderaan, for hosting this space.
Shout out to Candy for helping me find this place and getting to join the conversation with you guys.
Obviously, I'm always ready to speak or say something at any given time or notice, but I do like to read the room a little bit because I never know.
You know, these spaces can be really serious conversations about serious things, which I guess if money's involved, yes, most people think it's serious.
But when I saw the title in terms of philosophical investing, number two, so this must be the shit.
Just kidding.
I don't know what number one is.
No, it's just the second episode.
The first one was last week.
Oh, nice.
So a little bit about me is I started doing stand-up, sitting down on Clubhouse, which I consider the original social audio crack that was made popular during the pandemic.
It was where I was first exposed to NFTs, and when I was asked, what do I know about NFTs, I said natural flat titties a lot, actually.
But I guess those aren't the NFTs that you guys are talking about here.
So no disrespect with that.
You've got some good material there just lined up, really.
I do, I do, actually, yeah.
It's, you know, a few months ago I made this leap onto Twitter spaces, you know, and when I think of philosophical investing and just try to tap into what you guys have been talking about, you know, a lot of it, unfortunately, is like it's a money mindset.
And I've never been a money-hungry B-I-T-C-H.
That's just not the bag that, you know, I'm rocking.
And you guys keep talking about your bags, and guess what, if your bag isn't a Birkin, whatever you're doing isn't working, okay?
We'll just throw that out there.
And for those who know what a Birkin bag is, they know what I'm talking about.
And those who don't, it's okay, no worries, no shame, no shame, no blame for being poorly raised and raised poorly, maybe.
Anyways, I love it.
So, Jocelyn, are you in Manila?
Are you in the Philippines now?
No, I'm not.
See, I was actually, I was born and raised in the United States.
I'm my family's first generation born and raised in the United States.
But my ethnic background is Filipino, yes.
So, yeah.
But I do have a lot of friends in Australia from down under.
But when I think about philosophical investing, for me as a comedian, as a painter, my investment has to be in myself.
So that's a different type of thing that you guys are talking about here.
And what's wild about what you guys are talking about is, like, you know, someone coming in today, brand new, fresh off the boat or whatever, compared to someone who's been here since the beginning, it's almost as if there's still a lot of lessons to be learned.
There's still a lot that needs to be figured out.
And there's ultimately a lot that can't be sold, you know.
And it's just, it's true Darwin.
You know, the strong will survive, you know.
And my whole thing is, like, I just, I want to leave toxicity in the past, you know.
If you guys want to build a stronger, better ecosystem, you really should try killing it with kindness.
A part of my brand here on Twitter or crypto Twitter is I'm a Web3 Bambi, where it's I will come and ask them questions just to help onboard, you know, people who don't know anything.
Because I was on a plane not too long ago, and I said the word NFT in Web3, and the woman looked at me like I was speaking some foreign language.
So as much as, like, a lot of people who know a lot about what's going on, there's still a lot of people who don't, you know.
And so in terms of investing, it's like when I was first told about NFTs, I was sold that it was, like, this rarity type of thing.
But now it's changed.
The ecosystem has changed.
The philosophies have changed.
You know what I mean?
And, like, and when I talk about it, I say I'm more of a holder, not much of a show or a grower.
I'm more of a holder than a flipper just because I'm not that young or that limber.
You know what I mean?
I'm not Simone Biles out here, you know, making flips on the floor mat here.
But a lot of people are.
And that's just not my main bag.
But I love being a part of a new community and meeting new people and learning about people and bringing β I'm here to offer comic relief for all those in need, you know.
And so I'm glad I β
Okay.
But I'm also here to learn, too, as well because I want to be a part of the future.
I don't want to be left in the dust.
Okay.
Yeah, thanks, Jocelyn.
I mean, you're really touching on a few things.
I mean, this is definitely the right spaces for you because you're thinking, I guess, broader than just, I guess, numbers or money, you know, in an account or trading them.
We're sort of looking at, you know, what you even use that money for, how you make your life better, how you make, you know, the world, you know, I guess, yeah, a kinder, more loving place.
This is definitely what we're looking at and the things we're considering, not just, you know, just make my numbers go higher.
And that's better than the numbers are lower.
Right.
But, you know, I've got a question here, you know, I think that lines in.
I mean, at the same time, we can't not consider that trading takes place.
I mean, human, you know, development has benefited greatly from trading in goods and services or whatever that is, swapping food for whatever someone's growing something, someone's making something, we swap it over and money kind of plays this intermediary role.
So, I mean, how much money, it's a question.
It's like, how much money is enough?
Well, how much money is the minimum?
Like, how do you work that out?
Right.
And to me, I personally have yet to even put any of my own USD into NFTs, personally, because I just don't have any.
I don't have that kind of disposal income.
But I have been gifted NFTs from people from pretty reputable projects, like the Life's a Joke underscore NFT, the cloud community.
They do a talent show, and I was one of the first comedians to come through and do jokes.
And from there, I was gifted this NFT, right?
So, this NFT does have inherent value, but then it's like that weird, like, when do I let my human, my emotions, you know, like, motivate me?
Because then I really want to hold on to this NFT, but if it came down to it and I needed money, I could possibly try selling it.
But then there's no guarantee in that as well, you know?
So, it's like how much of what you're investing is emotional versus monetary.
Yeah, or in fact, what guarantees do we have in any aspect of our life, you could argue as well.
I mean, anything can possibly change it at any particular moment.
I wanted to throw over to perhaps Candy again, just to see if you are holding any NFTs at the moment.
A lot of people came in, and I know you did mention at the start that you used to have a Jelly Rascal, but no longer.
But are you holding any more NFTs or you're looking to move into that space at all?
Do you see opportunities for your business?
Yes and no.
A bunch of people were asking me if I was going to release a project, and I was thinking about it.
But I think it might take a while, honestly.
I have to be, like, super patient with everything, and I have a bunch of other goals that I want to achieve first.
So, I'm going to work on it slowly.
But besides that, I agree with what Jocelyn said about there's just, like, so much of a fluctuation
between the way that new investors invest and the way that experienced investors do.
And I'm kind of, I feel like I'm kind of in the middle somewhere, personally.
And, like, a lot of people get, like, emotionally attached to their NFTs rather than just crypto.
I feel like people who just trade, like, coins are not as emotionally attached because NFTs have way more of a community.
Right, because the NFT project is an artist, right?
There's somebody who, there's a creator, there's a founder who you would think to some degree is emotionally invested
because ultimately that's them putting themselves out there for ridicule, for, like, you know, risk of, like, being rugged.
And a lot of times I'm learning, like, a lot of projects are rugged just because a lot of them were made by people who don't have MBAs.
They don't have experience in running a business or starting a business or any of that.
They were just an artist who wanted to get their art out there.
So it's really sad and unfortunate that people are attacking people for, quote, unquote, rugging when, hey,
at the end of the day, they tried something and it didn't work out.
And, you know, and there's nothing they could have done about that.
So instead of attacking people for, like, their failures, you know,
we should really just commend them for even just trying something new.
Does that make sense?
I think it's a valid view.
Definitely.
I mean, yeah, well, it probably goes to some personal experience as well.
Over the years, I mean, yeah, I guess blame, you know, doesn't really change anything ultimately.
It only sort of makes us feel a bit better.
But in a practical sense, it doesn't, you know, it's not constructive to creating the path forward.
So, yeah, definitely can relate to that.
Yeah, Melted.
I think, I reckon Jocelyn absolutely hit the nail on the head there.
Too often we use this word rug, right?
And it's become a word that's just so ingrained with literally everything.
Like something doesn't go your way.
It's now just like, oh, I've been rugged.
But I think we really need to try and separate out what is a failed business venture versus someone that has deliberately gone out of their way to try and steal money.
Because they're two completely different things.
Like initially a rug was someone that set up something to try and steal from you, basically, convince you to take this thing, which they then just pulled all the promises from underneath you and then just bailed.
So, to me, that's a very different thing to someone that has poured, you know, a ton of time and effort and themselves into something that just for whatever reason has not taken off.
It happens all the time in real life.
Like businesses just don't work sometimes.
Their situation changes.
Something happens.
It's like, I think we need to come up with a different way of describing those projects to, you know, people that go out of their way to deliberately deceive others.
I guess it's more of a criminal act, isn't it?
It is.
I'm going to say the N word here.
It's narrative.
That's the N word I was saying.
It's up to us to change the narrative.
So, it's more conducive to what we're actually trying to, you know, exemplify.
So, yeah.
Sorry, I didn't.
Sorry.
You thought it was another N word, you weirdos.
Narrative.
Okay, people?
Yeah.
Okay.
Good.
Yeah.
Let's just hit Stanley Serpon.
That's good.
Hey, I hadn't thought about what you, how you describe that, Mel, but you're bang on, right?
I think there's, well, I just call it rug, which is like the instantaneous, I'm going to steal your money and run away.
Or like the slow rug, which was like the, yeah, look, I'm probably going to take your money, but I'll make it look like, you know, after a few weeks or a month that I'm gone.
But, yeah, the other flip side, right, is that you've tried, you've given it your all and then it's just failed.
But I guess I'll throw out a question or a thought maybe around how do we get better as a NFT ecosystem in not just creating 10 new projects every day?
You know, how do we get better with teams?
Is it around doxing?
Is it around verified people that have skills?
Because you need to prove, I think, that if you're going to start a new project that you've got the skills in that whatever you're promising, utility or whatever you're trying to build, you know, the community, the branding, whatever it might be, that you can actually do something with that, you know, so that when we bring people on, that we can actually have less rugs, less slow rugs, less failed businesses that we have.
And look at what it might mean is we have less projects going forward, but hopefully we'll have high quality projects that are backed by people that, you know, actually have good in real life skills, good web three skills that are actually going to provide, you know, ongoing value to the whole ecosystem.
So I think that's, yeah, let's throw that out there, Mary.
Yeah, well, it looks like Jocelyn's might have a response for you.
Very much like most things in my life, especially the weed that I smoke, it's quality over quantity, right?
And then for me, it's a joke, good job, thanks for laughing.
No, and for me, it's like, in terms of my show that I host, MySpace, oh God, I hate when I say that, it's just always funny to me when I say MySpace.
But my show, Sufficiently Awkward AMA, my show is about getting to know the people behind the PFP to answer the burning online question, can you really trust someone you met on the internet, you know?
And I feel like it's showing up, it's being present, it's being available, it's not being afraid to be honest, you know what I mean?
Because I think a lot of people are out here just faking it, you know, trying to fake it until they make it, which is another route you can go, that's fine, that's great, that's for some.
But for me, I'm all about keeping it real and being honest and true and genuine and sincere, you know?
And I feel like the only way, it's about building trust.
And I mean, building trust in general is already kind of a stretch.
Hell, it took me a long time to even trust myself, you know what I mean?
But, and then it's like the building the trust that even if you put yourself out there and something doesn't happen or go your way, that you're not going to get attacked or being torn down, you know?
If you guys really want to build, you need to be building each other up.
And you're like, the way you can do that is by being willing to learn more about each other.
But then the ridicule just might be too scary for some, I don't know.
Yeah, thanks.
Melted.
Yeah, look, I think you're right about that ridicule.
Like, it's, I've never come across a space that is so hyper-fixated on, look, we all want to succeed, right?
That's the ultimate goal.
But there's no way, like, the IRL business owners aren't under this pressure.
Like, how many of those tank every single day, the amount of, like, IRL businesses that fold, that don't succeed?
That's life.
You know, when you are investing, you need to do as much due diligence as you can, which is why I think it comes back down to making sure that you're not falling for hype or deceit in the space, which is the genuine rug, right?
It's where people are trying to convince you to give them your money with promises without real action.
And I think we've seen the sole space in particular mature quite well.
A lot of projects coming out now are bringing utility or bringing their use cases out before they're actually going for money.
They're saying, hey, here's some proof of work of what we can do and where we're going.
Long before they're asking for the dollars and cents, which I think is a big, a big positive.
But, you know, I think the space is still very new.
There's going to be 100 projects.
I think we've always said probably 90 of them will fail, probably more.
There will be, I personally think there needs to be consolidation in the space.
I think Stanley smacked that right on the head that projects need to join together.
We're too, you know, a lot of them are too small.
They're trying to run with one founder and two or three people.
We've got to get into bigger setups.
You know, we've seen on the sole space, Alika and Honest Rugs or Assassins have recently acquired Wastelanders.
As far as I'm concerned, there needs to be more of that.
We need to protect people's bags by building bigger communities and bigger setups.
Thanks, Melted.
We've got a few hands up.
We're going to go with Stanley Surfer first.
I'll just go real quick.
Thanks for the others that have added to that question.
But I think, I hate to do it.
I wish Doc was here so he could jump up and do a quick stallions show.
But I guess if those that aren't aware, it's a project that Carlos actually originally derugged and then the Ligma team took it over with Doc and Bobby at the helm and then Alder on myself and a bunch of other Ligmas helping out.
But I guess the main tool and the main vision for that project was exactly around this thing, around verification of people and trying to build trust in the space.
So I think without trying to, the question actually wasn't a shill for stallions.
But as we were talking about it, I was thinking that it is actually really what we need.
I think we need to understand what people's skills are, to verify, to have more trust in ourselves and honesty in ourselves, but also trust in others.
So, yeah, I won't show it too much, but yeah, check out stallions.
It's where we're going.
Well, I think it's a relative comparison because I guess stallions just did acquire the Busy Boars project with what they had built.
And it's almost two projects coming together and becoming a much more solid, stronger project.
So it's probably an example of what we're thinking about.
Candy.
This is going a little bit off topic, but I was going to say I am kind of seeing a transition with, like, buyers.
Basically, what I was going to say is I think before people were viewing it as more of, like, buying a product.
And now people are kind of seeing it as, like, investing into a team or product.
Yeah.
Yeah, I think I'd agree with that as well.
Well, I'm definitely looking, trying to get an understanding of the people behind it more so than, I guess, the picture.
It's a combination of things.
But, yeah, you know, who's going to be leading it and their ability to lead it is one of the highest criteria that I personally would look at.
Dynamics, welcome.
I'm glad you put your hand up to come up.
Yeah, thanks for having me, man.
Yeah, no problems.
What are you thinking?
I was just β the only reason I put my hand up was Melted just touched on something just before about the pressure of founders and the expectations of the holders and stuff like that.
Because I literally had this conversation with someone the other day around, like, how β I guess it's the expectation or the perception of these holders and what they think they're entitled to.
You know, by being a holder of a collection, they think they're some sort of, like, VC shareholders that own a piece of this company and things like that.
But what they don't realize in the actual VC world, like, I come from not necessarily a startup background, but I have been involved in startup companies and I own a company myself.
What they don't realize is when you become β like, have private equity in a company, you don't fucking knock on the door next day saying, when's my rev share?
Like, you don't get rev share.
That's not a thing.
You know, being a venture capitalist, you do not get rev share in a fucking company.
Like, the money that a company makes is invested back into the company to scale it to be a big, successful company, and then you have a liquidity event, which is an exit, when you sell the company to a bigger player, and that is when you get paid.
That is when venture capitalists get paid.
You do not get weekly rev share, monthly rev share.
You don't get to knock on Carlos' door saying, Carlos, win this, win that.
That's not a thing.
I don't know where this expectation has come through from these kids in Web3 thinking that they're entitled to some sort of revenue share from somebody else doing all the work and investing all their time and all their money.
It's fucking insane, man.
Yeah, I don't know.
It does my head in.
The way I see it, the holders of a project, especially when there's a business or some sort of SaaS product that's attached to it, your holders are technically, the way that I would see it as a founder would be your holders are your beta testers and your marketing team.
You can reward them, but they technically don't own your company, and they're not entitled to revenue share.
They are your beta testers.
They get early access.
They experiment with your product.
They give you feedback.
They give you the information you need to fine-tune your product to market it to a wider audience, and then they help market it for you, and you reward them for that.
That's kind of the way I see how it should be.
But maybe that's just my perspective.
But, yeah, I'm just keen to hear what you guys think.
I think you β yeah, I've never seen so many hundreds come up in spaces, actually, so I'm pretty sure everyone is fully supportive of what you just said.
Let's go to Jocelyn.
Well, I just wanted to make a comment because, you know, me and Candy, we're both, you know, females in Web3, which are few and far between, but we're also, you know, not afraid to speak up, raise our hand, and be heard by anyone who wants to hear us.
And in doing so, you know, we both have been encouraged to launch our own NFT projects and have been told firsthand β I know I have, and I mean, I'll tell it to Candy, too.
You know, like, you know, if we launch something, if we do something that people would say that, yeah, I'll definitely mint it and whatnot, but then it's like, you know, how much trust is there in that?
And then it's a weird β I know for me, again, speaking as a comedian and working with an A-list Hollywood comedy producer, you know, and this is about IRL, like, comedy.
It's like, one, it's a marathon.
It's not a sprint.
And so it's like a weird, you know, we're both getting pushed, not so much pressure to launch a project, which I'm sure her and I would love to do.
But then, again, it's like, what's the team going to look like?
You know, is it just going to be us doing all the work?
And then, yeah, like, and then people do mint β I would like to think that if people mint it into my project, that they're just there to support me, not necessarily to use me as some type of, like, money cow or mule to, like, make a profit off of, you know?
And that's coming as us as content creators, as entertainers, you know what I mean?
We're not, you know, our own, like, specific kind of artists, you know?
And, again, it's all about that N-word, that narrative, you know?
And so, Denomics, thank you so much for coming up and saying that because a lot of the people running around this, like, ecosystem don't have a whole lot of life experience.
They really don't, you know?
And it's up to us more mature adults, I guess, you know what I mean, to, like, kind of, like, not necessarily put them in their place, but to let them know, hey, like, you know, this is not necessarily how it works in other realms.
And for me, Web3 is its own other reality that, you know, that needs its own, like, self-reality check, which is only up to us to keep doing it, and that's by showing up and expressing ourselves.
Yeah, thanks, Jocelyn.
I mean, I tend to agree as well.
I mean, something that I've noticed is that a lot of these D-rugs seem to be doing a lot better than these big projects that have these, sort of, highly focused mint events.
And it's all, like, the mint event kind of takes over.
And most of the time, the mint events leave a pretty sour taste in my mouth.
Like, there's always something that doesn't go to plan, something that was promised or wasn't delivered.
You know, someone missed out when they should have, you know, been able to have access.
And it's like β and I've just seen so many mints where a large portion of supporters of people kind of get alienated.
You know, there's conflict.
And it's like, what β if you're building a long-term business, why is this mint so important?
You know, it's almost like the D-rug just kind of removes that whole mint process.
It's already been done.
Some are kind of in some people's hands.
Some are on the market.
And it's all pretty cheap.
And then people can kind of come in in a kind of natural way.
Just seems to be almost like a more effective way of, like, building a community gradually than β you know, it's almost like the warning sign.
If a project is having, like, a hype mint, it's like, that's a red flag, you know, because they're doing it β that's in their best interest.
It's not necessarily in my interest as an investor to get caught up in some, you know, highly sort of dopamine-firing mint in the mind, you know, that they'll have to get up at 3 a.m. for, being based in Australia anyway, which before was, you know, not uncommon.
So, yeah, that's right.
Yeah, dynamics.
Sorry to hug the mic again, but just Jocelyn touched on something, and I think Mel had mentioned as well about life experience.
Like, a lot of the people in this scene don't have a lot of life experience.
And I know some of you boys are in the Aussie β was it the Aussie or ANZ Rascals chat, and we talked a little bit about this the other week, about the law of the lid and, like, the founders and the people who launched these projects.
And the common thing that, like, me and my crew always look for when we're looking for a team to invest in, because you touched on, like, you know, talking about investing in teams rather than an idea, because everyone can have an idea, but if you don't have a team that can pull together, well, then it's literally just an idea.
It's never going to go anywhere, right?
But what I see in Web3, or NFT specifically, and when people launch in these projects, I look at the founders of the team, and I think a really common theme you see is you've got β maybe using the word grifters is not necessarily the right word, because not everyone has bad intentions, and grifters is kind of a bad word.
But a bunch of β or a guy with an idea, and then he has his mates who help launch the project.
And it's all good to have mates who help support you and stuff like that, but your mates are not right for the job.
Like, when you're assembling a team to build a business and scale an idea to be a big, successful company, you don't employ your six best mates who are fucking degenerate idiots, right?
You actually, like, go out there and you find talent, the right people for the right role who can help you to scale a business.
And you look at any of these NFT projects, and they're generally a group of mates.
And I can tell you straight away, like, there might be one dude in there who's got some skills.
Maybe he's a great dev, or maybe he's just, like, a good ideas man, a good, like, a project lead.
But then the rest of them will have zero skills that can help this business in any way, watch, shape, or form.
And they just get handed these roles.
Oh, like, hey, you can be the marketing guy.
Oh, you can be the community manager.
They just get given these tasks, and you expect this to be a successful business?
It's run by a bunch of kids who probably shouldn't even run a lemonade stand.
Like, I look at these projects, there's so many projects out here, I know I'm rambling, but they have so much potential, but they fucking suck at running a company, because they probably have no experience on how to scale a business, and they don't have the right people in the team.
And it sucks, because there's so many projects that are so good, and I'm like, man, this has so much potential, but the dude leading the project shouldn't be leading the project.
He should be in the back room working on the dev stuff, because he's a developer, he's a social retard, he doesn't know how to market the product, he doesn't know how to speak to the public, he can't jump in spaces, but he's a fucking based dev who can build some cool shit.
So he should be employing somebody else to be that front man, the hype guy, and that will be a massive successful product.
But he gates it themselves, because that's their baby, so they want to be the top of the food chain, and they hold it back, because he's not the right person for the job.
And I see this in so many projects, they just don't have the right people for the right job.
And it's hard to find a project that has the right people in the right positions to actually lead a big business.
And that's why I'm so bullish on, like, say, D-Lab's team, for example, because I think they've realized that now.
Not only do they already have some very successful people in place, but I think they've realized that because probably Kevin's experience in scaling companies, he knows what needs to be done.
But they have let go a bunch of their mates, because Frank even said when he first launched D-Gods, it was him and a bunch of mates.
But he's let a lot of his mates go and has now filtered down and got the right people in the right position, and that's probably why they're going to be so successful.
I know I just rambled, like, so much shit.
Let's hit some hearts in the chat or put the nomics there, man.
Like, I was standing up.
I was, like, saluting, you know, like, out while you're speaking.
Like, you're making us proud.
You know, it's like hand over heart stuff that's happening right there.
You know, and as I said earlier, this is not a politically correct space.
So, you know, there's a bit of swearing or, you know, stuff's a little bit on the edges.
That's more than fine, because I think people appreciate the direct message, you know, that you're sending.
And, you know, it's just sort of like giving that sort of honest appraisal from the experience.
Because I think hearing the truth is necessary, you know, it's very necessary.
Yeah, Jocelyn.
No, denomics, there was reason behind your ramble, you know, and wow, you used the R word, you know, and here I am tiptoeing around the N word.
But the thing about it is, like, that's the thing.
It's, like, knowing what your strengths are, knowing that there's an actual title for what your strengths are, you know.
And then maybe that dev guy wants to break out of his shell and be the hype man.
So maybe he'll try and fail horribly or succeed admirable.
You don't know.
But then again, that's just the risk that you take in this whole thing that's happening, you know.
And, yeah, it's hard to decide who you want to bring in.
So obviously you're going to default to your mates and your family and your friends.
But if they don't know anything about the system, then what help can they really be?
They can be those holders who don't expect anything from you other than just to, you know, show support for you and whatnot.
So that's what I'm saying.
So for me and Candy, as people who are being pushed to do these projects, it's like, okay, well, what exactly does that even mean for us, you know.
But, again, like I'm just sitting here taking notes and there was reason for how to ramble.
So don't think that, you know, your rambling went unnoticed or unrecognized.
And like Alderaan said, we were saluting you.
So, again, just thanks.
Sharing is caring and that includes your opinion even though opinions are like assholes and everyone has one.
So anyways.
Well said.
I know a lot of this chat has reminded me of this lesson.
This is something I learned and you're going to, you know, well, you're going to think what you think, but I don't know how long ago, 20 years ago.
I must have been watching daytime television and I was watching Dr. Phil.
And there was a teenage girl on there and she was wanting to be a model when she kind of grew up.
And his advice that he was trying to, I guess the message he was trying to get through to her is like, you don't know what you don't know.
And it's quite a strange concept.
And so it's actually something that I look for.
I'm looking at people.
Does this person understand what their limitations are?
Do they understand what knowledge they don't have that is a gap in their understanding of, you know, what they're trying to do so that they can fill it?
Because it just seems like, you know, generally a warning sign for me is when someone, you know, they have an idea and they're very excited about that idea.
You know, and it's like, ah, you know, like an idea is like a very small percentage of make stuff of what you need to make something work.
You know, and ideas are, you know, they're just sort of, they're like this rolling in the air, they're blowing in the wind, they're kind of everywhere.
You know, the idea isn't the determining factor of achieving something.
You know, it's like, it's the commitment.
It's a sacrifice.
It's, you know, it's like learning and working with people, you know, and it's like changing your life to support this.
Um, that's, you know, that, that, that's, you know, that's what it takes.
Um, so, I mean, if I can just sort of throw anything in there, it's like, no, uh, knowing what you don't know is a very powerful position to, to put yourself in.
Uh, but it takes really being quite honest with anyone's self to sort of recognize your own failings or weaknesses or just gaps.
Um, because you can't fill them unless, uh, you know what they are or, or they're recognized.
And I, I dare say that's what some of the, the sort of good project leaders do.
I know Carlos is in the chat and, um, I'm absolutely for sure that's what he does.
You know, he will fill those gaps, um, you know, and, and he goes with his strengths and that's what, that's what a good team leader does is they utilize people for their strengths.
Um, I saw Jocelyn, you had your hand up there, but you've taken it down.
Uh, I just was all for AI.
It's almost like people forget about being human and that, you know, you know, among that's part of my people on the internet that amongst the bots and trolls that there are actual humans here.
And as humans, we make mistakes, you know, and as long as you're not a criminal trying to really just like scams or someone, then, you know, we should be able to like forgive people for their mistakes and not hate them for making those mistakes.
Because at the end of the day, they were probably somebody who was a risk taker and was willing to put themselves in an uncomfortable, unknown position to see if they could succeed.
And if they failed, then like, you know, we, a lot of people forget or don't realize that failure is also an intrinsic part of success.
You know, for me as a comedian, it's like, I'm not going to become a better, funnier comedian by always being funny.
There's going to be some times where I'm not going to be funny, which is rare, but you know what I'm saying?
Like, again, I, you have to lean into those moments where you remind yourself that you're human, you're going to make mistakes.
But every experience that you have is a learning opportunity to become better the next day or the next time.
Yeah, well said.
Well said.
Yeah, dynamics.
Yeah, I think that like the role, like what you were just talking about before, the role of a founder and like the leadership role is more about being a conductor.
It's not so much about me, me, me, or what you can do.
It's about recognizing who you have in your team and who can fill those roles and who can do the job best.
Your job is like the puppet master to conduct the orchestras, so to speak.
Your team members are all the different instruments and you're just telling them what to do or not telling them what to do.
But yeah, hopefully that's the right analogy.
Yeah, I think a lot of people, like a lot of the founders in this space try to wear way too many hats, which is a huge problem in IRL business, which is normally how business starts, right?
When you first launch a business, if it's your own thing, if you're an entrepreneur, you're generally wearing multiple hats.
You're the ideas guy.
You're also doing the accounting.
You're hiring people.
You're doing the marketing.
You're writing the content.
You do everything.
And that is, you just burn out and you never do everything well because you're not the best at doing marketing or there's somebody who can do accounting better than you and cheaper than you and quicker than you.
So I think it's, yeah, it's more about understanding your strengths and weaknesses, finding those people to fill those roles who can do your job better, more efficiently than you.
But yeah, I think too many people, I don't know whether it's like an ego thing, like they don't want to let go of the reins, if that makes sense.
They want to be in control, might be a control freak type thing.
But when I see a lot of people launch businesses or NFT projects, they want to do everything.
They don't want to let the reins go to that guy to handle that thing because they want to be in control of everything.
And in my opinion, you're holding it back.
You're holding the growth back.
Thanks, Dynamics.
Candy?
I was going to say, I think it's a control thing.
And I also think it's a routine thing.
Like people get into a routine of just doing what they do and they just don't want to break that routine because they're focused on just their goal and their goal alone.
Yeah, that makes sense.
That makes sense.
I'm melted.
Yeah, I think Dynamics is pretty spot on.
I think too, if you really want to grow and be a large project, it's way too much work for one person or even two or three to do.
I think a part of it for a lot of people is it's definitely control, but then also trust.
Like if it's your baby, this is your idea that you've melted from an egg or something, the thought of handing it over to someone, especially in this space, unless it is a friend, which is why I think Jocelyn said earlier, it all starts this way with mates.
I'm already new Dynamics.
It's scary, right?
So I do see it from both sides.
But yeah, Dynamics is spot on.
If you want to grow or become a larger project, it's not a one-man job.
It's not a two-man job.
And I think Rinkar, who's just come up, can definitely attest to that.
He runs a very, very successful project in his own right.
Yeah, Rinkar just requested to come up, but then he disappeared, so I'm not sure what's happened.
You're here, are you, Rinkar?
Ah, you are here.
I can see you.
So have you been listening long, Rinkar?
Yeah, for over an hour, I think, right now.
And on most things, I agree.
Founders shouldn't do everything.
There should be teams built around.
But one thing is, people who want to work in Web3, right, they have expectations for their salaries, which are quite often funny.
So there's one problem.
And the second problem is, many projects can't pay the salaries for these amazing people who should do things, right?
Guys, don't get me wrong.
Everyone knows my marketing sucks, and we are looking for someone.
But if you hear the numbers they want, they are far off from top marketer from Web2.
So there is always a second side to that if a founder don't want to let go.
Sometimes it's just financially or not being stupid and getting rucked by future employees or something like that.
So it's not always just the founder is bad or something like that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so for those who don't know, Rinkar is the founder of Koala Bot Club, Zootek.
And so it's worth checking that out.
He's definitely a respectable person to have a bit of a look at.
Yeah, well, I guess one thing that had crossed my mind, I sort of had been working on a theory over the years, as you do, to try and understand the world.
And I know almost everyone mentioned about control.
I mean, we want to be in control of, I guess, what we've created to make sure that it, I guess, follows the vision that we have.
And maybe that can be a limiting factor as well as in, like, having the vision, maybe having sort of a wider vision for it to adapt can be more effective.
But also I think there's a status element in that this project that I have created or this business or whatever it is I've created is a representation of me and, like, it's a part of me.
And getting some separation from that can be difficult, but also, you know, it can actually be quite powerful because it's, ultimately, it's not us or the person's individual.
It's a collective thing.
Just, yeah, just my thoughts that popped into my head as we kind of do.
Dynamics.
You know, just to not combat, and some people might find this a little bit critical, but what Rinka just said about possibly not having the budget for, you know, employing staff, I can definitely appreciate that and understand that, you know, early stage startup, you do run a bit of a shoestring budget and work with what you've got.
But I'd also argue a point there if I was looking to invest in a team and they haven't worked out things like how much money they're going to need for this and that and what sort of budget they're going to need and how much money they're going to need to raise, then it's already, you know, waving a few red flags to begin with to basically say that are you guys capable of running a company if you didn't think about marketing budget, if you didn't think about employing this guy?
You know, working in the space that I am at the moment working with Fat Cats, we get a lot of projects, the wanting incubation or launching and stuff like that.
And so I do a lot of speaking with these guys about, you know, their plans, what's their business plan, things like that.
And sometimes you'll be surprised how often this comes up when they start talking about, you know, the size of the collection and how much it's going to be, they're just throwing numbers around.
And I'm like, hang on a second, like if you're planning on building a business, you should have all of this, all of these stats should be written down.
You should know how much this is going to cost to build, who you've got to employ to do it, how much their budget is, what sort of runway you're going to have, estimates on timeframes and things like that.
That's all the shit you're supposed to know before you ask for money.
And then once you've got that figure, then that's when you work out how, you know, how big your collection is going to be, how much money you're going to ask for the mint, you know, so you raise enough capital to do those things.
And arguably not everything goes to plan and some things are really blown out.
But, yeah, I would also be a little bit wary of projects that can't afford to do certain things because they didn't put that into the budget.
Well, then, you know, that's fine.
You can keep grinding and go and go and go.
But, I mean, if I was looking to invest into an entrepreneur who's building a business, I'd want to make sure they know what the fuck they're doing, if that makes sense, and have thought about that stuff.
But I know every situation is different.
Some people get off to a really bad start.
Market conditions can suck.
There's lots of factors that come into play.
So, it's not black and white, if that makes sense.
Yeah.
Sorry for jumping in because it kind of goes all in our direction, KoalaBots, right?
Market changed.
When we got a little bit hype at the beginning, it was before Great Goats launched.
But we saw the market is going down.
Great Goats was kind of, for me, always the time where it went down after them.
So, we still said we will do it.
We saw immediately we will not mint out.
We are still in the green numbers.
We have a big treasury.
We have a lot of money for the project.
We are giving SMBs away and stuff like that.
But by employing now a marketer who at least will take 5,000 net, probably, if you take someone who's half decent.
So, gross will be a little bit more because you pay taxes and everything.
It is a different game.
And by then changing to 0% royalties, there are so many factors where we just say we don't want to afford a marketer.
Because our holders are happy.
Man, they are getting more than in 99%.
I think only Jelly Rascals gives more away than we do.
And we have to say this is for us much more important than having now another hype and whatever to grow the community.
This will come by time and by happy holders.
So, we definitely pivoted in this.
And, yeah, as I said, there are so many things which happening in Vectry, greed, royalties and so much stuff which messes up your plans.
And our business is, for the last nine years, profitable.
We are just putting a small part into the NFT space.
And we are doing it because we love it.
And, yeah, it's not always this black and white type.
I think there are many things to consider.
But, yeah, most of the time it's financially.
And for me, personally, it's always important to be in the green numbers.
Because this is how our holder can count on us before we grow new holders.
Yeah, thanks, Rinka.
Yeah, and good point, Dynamics.
I mean, I can recall some projects whereby they weren't going to mint out.
And they're like, okay, we're going to cut the supply.
And I'm like, huh?
What?
You're going to cut the supply?
I mean, isn't that going to affect the whole budgeting plan for the project you had going forward if you cut the supply in half?
Can you just do that?
You know, like on a whim, you know, like 12 hours into the mint, we're going to cut the supply?
It's like, what?
Uh, you know, this is not a challenge.
That's exactly what I'm talking about.
Or I've seen others drop the mint price, like cut the mint price in half.
And I'm like, hang on a second.
If you needed $400,000 fucking five minutes ago to build this thing, how come you only need $200,000 now?
Like, are you going to be able to build it for $200,000 if you can build it for $200,000?
Why the fuck did you need $400,000 before?
Like, there's questions that come up with that.
It's either you have a cap raise that you need, or you just don't do it.
But it depends on the project.
And as Rinkar said, it's not black and white.
There's so many things that come into factor.
I feel really bad for anyone.
I'm not familiar with when Rinkar minted his project.
But there was a period of time not that long ago, probably three months, four months or so, where anybody who minted during that time, like as a project founder, probably in a really shitty position.
Because, you know, they got hit with the market eating shit, zero royalties, all that sort of stuff.
They saw their treasuries get wiped, didn't mint out, didn't capture royalty volume.
No one was buying secondary.
So they got screwed, man.
There's a few people who got, you know, the short end of the stick during that period, which is unfortunate.
So they're in a shitty position.
So I can appreciate that.
Because I minted the same day when the youths tube came out.
Yeah.
Ouch.
And I pivoted my launch date three times.
And they pivoted it exactly on the same day every time until we said, okay, fuck that.
Rip the band-aid off and get it done, mate.
And what you say is such a nice point.
I always say, when someone is cutting the supply to half, I'm instantly out of this project because it doesn't make sense.
Yeah, you can argue that we do the same.
But I always communicate, guys, we have the infrastructure.
We have a warehouse in Cyprus, two in China.
And if we do not mint out, yes, we do not open another world.
We just utilize our old ones, right?
We have the plan for a hundred dollar raise or one million dollar raise.
For us, it absolutely doesn't matter what we do as long as we do something.
But I haven't heard anyone else than us being able to explain what happened if you do not mint out.
And we always communicate.
For us, it's not a problem.
And for the holder, percentage-wise, it's not a problem as well.
But, yeah, what you said is basically on point.
I'm always out as soon as I hear a price reduction or cut the supply.
Let's jump to Melted.
Yeah, I think the important part is just having that plan, kind of like Dynamics said.
And everyone's going to see different strengths.
It's like, yeah, if you look at Rinkar's point around marketing and the sheer amount of money, you know, the solid marketers want to do it.
For some projects, that's, you know, it makes sense.
It's fiscally responsible not to spend it in that space if they don't need to spend it there.
So that's where I think, you know, Dynamics is spot on with it not being black and white.
But if you need it and it's not planned for, then you're fucked up.
But, you know, if it's not part of your plan, then, yeah, it's a different story altogether.
So every project is going to work a little bit differently as long as it's sort of pre-planned and thought about.
And you can answer those questions when people connect you with them.
Yeah, you're doing well, I think.
And, yeah, if you cut your supply in half or cut your mid-price in half, then without a reason or without, you know, having a plan like Rinkar did, then, yeah, there's no way I'm buying any of your NFT, sorry.
Yeah.
Yeah, good point.
We're going to probably go just for maybe 10, 15 or so minutes and sort of wrap it up.
I mean, we'll get to Jocelyn in a moment.
We've got a few people, yeah, in the chat.
So if you had a dying, burning question perhaps to ask, you can request to come up.
But otherwise, we'll go for about 10, 15 more minutes before we wrap it up.
And obviously, this is the second weekly episode.
And we're looking to build some consistency and just have this every week and around about the same time probably.
It's a Saturday afternoon for myself here in Australia.
So for whatever time it is, it's probably looking to be around this window.
But, yeah, before we finish up, we'll probably get some last sort of words or comments or views or feedback from some of our speakers.
Or if you were wanting to jump up and, you know, and you can do that also.
So, yeah, Jocelyn, over to you.
I think the final thing I want to say is that's the beauty and the beast that is Web3, you know, this idea of, like, limitless possibility, you know, this idea of, like, you know, being β I know for me as being my family's first generation born in the United States, it's like I've kind of put stress on myself to be the first in my family to find success with solo entrepreneurship, you know.
To start a business and a brand that is me being me, being funny.
And, you know, again, the beauty and the beast of Web3 is just, like, the endless possibility.
But with that, it's going to β it's sadly, it's trial and error.
You know, it's like resilience.
It's like, you know, getting back up when you get knocked down.
And we'll only see how far certain people can go.
But, again, my main lane is just getting to know people, learning what they want to bring, what they want to build, and not tear anyone down, just build people up.
And, you know, the possibilities are endless and limitless, really.
But it's about just, you know, trying to create a community that will foster trust and kindness is what I'm all about and stuff.
So, but, again, thank you so much for letting me jump onto your space and speak.
You know, a lot of times I get kind of, like, thrown down just because, you know, I'm new to the ecosystem and that, you know.
But, again, it's like everyone has value.
I feel like everyone has the potential to be funny as well.
So, like, thank you for giving me the opportunity to just share and join the conversation because a lot of times females aren't really invited to speak.
So it's been great.
And thank you for having me.
And hopefully I get to join in next time.
Appreciate you.
You're welcome, Jocelyn.
And, yeah, most definitely welcome to join back in next time.
I suppose when I looked at your profile, I'm a bit of a Twitter space as noob.
This is just my second space hosting.
But I had a couple of people jump up or want to come up last time that perhaps weren't coming up in the right spirit.
So, I mean, when I sort of saw your profile there and saw that you were from the Philippines just because I pretty much lived for a few years in the Philippines.
So, you know.
And also, if you see the word comedian, they don't really know how I'm going to come in when it's my turn to speak.
But, obviously, I can read a room.
I like to, you know, vibe check.
Okay.
You know, I'm pretty good at that and stuff.
And, again, my β for me as a comedian, I'm rare.
I try to offend the least amount of people.
So, hopefully, I've done that here.
And that's a lot of people anyway.
Oh, there it is.
Got the giggle.
Appreciate it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, offending the least amount of people.
I'm not sure if it's possible, isn't it?
It's like comedy is always sort of walking that tightrope, you know, of what's appropriate and what's not, you know,
and sort of quickly coming back to, I guess, the safe side of it while stepping over momentarily.
But, no, I think once we started to get the vibe of your humour, which is quite dry, yeah, and, you know, and pretty quick as well.
I mean, you've sort of got to be tuned in.
I mean, yeah, it's quite good fun.
So, I just want to give a last chance for any of our speakers up here to probably have a last word.
If Candy wanted to β thanks for coming up, Candy, if you wanted to say anything.
Oh, yeah, you're welcome.
Look forward to seeing your progress as you do.
I'd recommend, you know, it could be worth people giving Candy a follow.
Why not?
And thanks, Nifty, for coming up as well.
Thanks, Danny Surfer, for coming up.
Thanks, Rinka, for coming up and having a chat.
Melted, I really appreciated your input, Melted.
I'll throw to you in a moment while I'm sort of giving you the praise.
I do recall from last week that Melted, he works as a financial advisor, so he's a professional, you know, financial or investment advisor.
I'm sure he can correct me if I'm wrong.
And he's providing his insights in there.
So, I feel quite fortunate that we've got his β I guess, you know, he's not just coming from that Web3 perspective.
He's actually got, I guess, university training and maybe 10, 20 years of experience.
So, yeah, Melted.
I just wanted to finish off, you know, at the start of the space, you asked the question, man, what was success?
And I think we could probably all agree that Alderaan as a Twitter space is a solid success.
So, that's all I wanted to finish on.
Well done.
Then two great spaces.
All right.
Yeah, thanks.
Well, I'll just β yeah, I'll slowly have to deflate my head at the moment.
So, yeah, I'm just doing my best, really.
And I'm just trying to β honestly, I just think, well, what kind of spaces would I want to listen to?
It's pretty much as simple as that.
And whilst at the same time trying to get a broad range of people's perspectives and different contributions in a reasonably orderly manner.
You know, as orderly as we can so that everyone has their chance to be heard and, you know, in a way that everyone's being respectful.
So, that's the idea.
And, you know, perhaps in one, you know, one space or one chat isn't necessarily going to change a whole lot.
But I think having consistent opportunities and developing these ideas over time because I guess one thing I learned, and that's coming from a sports coaching background,
is that when you have like a practice or a training session, usually by the end of that session, your athletes are not β haven't really improved that much at the end of that session,
that training session that you've just had.
But actually, they've probably gotten worse at what you've been trying to train or teach or learn because, you know, they're tired, you know, like their body's been sort of working on it.
But when you come back, maybe next week, that's when the improvement occurs.
So, there's β you know, you go away, you have some rest, you know, maybe you see these ideas or concepts happening,
you see some examples, and now there's a reference point for them, and then you sort of start to process, you know, how things are sort of making sense.
And then we can come back together around next week and then throw some more ideas around and then kind of collectively growing week by week as we go along.
Well, and that's just generally my vision that I'm seeing here.
No rush, no hype, you know.
We don't need any bots in here.
All we need is just real people, you know, learning or contributing or sharing, you know,
and then I think we're all benefiting just in an area that I feel there's a bit lacking generally,
at least from what I can see on Twitter.
You know, it gets a bit mind-numbing.
So, with that, we've sort of been going for an hour, 45 minutes,
and it's probably about the peak for how long anyone can kind of, you know, maintain their concentration level up to a high standard.
So, thanks for popping in.
You may see me in the Discord or we'll see each other around, but we'll be back on next week.
And, you know, feel free to give any one of these people here a follow.
I'm sure everyone will appreciate it.
Just give them a follow, you know, so you can see what they're up to.
So, you know, now we've got a bit of a voice to the face.
So, thanks, everyone.
And I'm going to wrap it up.
We'll see you next week.
Catch you all later.
Great space.
Thanks.
Yeah, mate.
