Thanks for joining us here this morning.
We're going to start the show here in just a few minutes.
We will give it a few for folks to filter in.
Get our speakers up on stage while we wait.
We are going to start the show here in just a few minutes.
We are going to start the show here in just a few minutes.
We are going to start the show here in just a few minutes.
Good morning and welcome to the lucky lead.
Today is Wednesday, January 24th.
It is another rainy winter morning out here in Chicago, folks.
It is still gray, but it's warming up.
We're going to hit 40 degrees here today.
Those Bitcoin ETF infillows, they're warming up too, likely to cross a billion dollars today
even with the price dipping.
Interest in Magic Eden is warming up as well after their latest rewards announcement and
a few ordinals projects are beyond warming up.
They're catching on fire.
We're going to break it all down on today's show.
I see some friendly faces out there, meta, woody, coffee.
Thank you for joining us.
As a reminder for any new listeners out there, we do run this show every weekday, Monday to
Friday at 10 a.m. Eastern, covering all the major news in crypto and NFTs.
I'm your host, Tyler Dee, and I'm joined today by some amazing co-hosts.
We've got Emily Loves Crypto, a web3 security expert, co-founder of Foolproof Labs, and
a rocket, her fresh new PFP.
You love to see the change.
Emily, how are you feeling with the new image here?
I'm not allowed to use my face.
Sometimes we change it up.
I'll be a weird blue fairy again one day.
I almost didn't recognize you, but I love the exciting new change here.
We will see how your perspective may shift now with the new PFP.
Folks, we've also got ghost content to start over at LuckyTrader, Quiet Whale, deep in
And then Logan Hitchcock, our editor-in-chief over at LuckyTrader, he's repping the LuckyTrader
He stayed up all night watching tennis, but he's still on with us.
Logan, GM, how are you doing?
GM, Tyler, I'm doing really well, man.
I think everybody at this point should be staying up and watching tennis all night long.
We're coming down to the stretch.
It's been a fantastic Australian Open thus far, and the fireworks are just getting started.
Coco and Sabalenka tonight, for those US fans who want to rekindle their love of tennis
We want to stay up and watch that.
I think it kicks at 3.30 AM Eastern time, which I'll be doing it.
And I'll be here tomorrow on the show as well.
So super excited, super caffeinated, and ready to chat about everything.
What was the match that turned into a marathon that you were watching this morning?
Well, it actually didn't turn into a marathon.
I think most people know him, one of the most exciting best players in the game.
I actually lost to Alexander Zverev as a four-set instead of five, but I thought it might turn
It was still a lot of fun, but yeah, I mean, the tennis is great.
I could go on about it forever.
And you know what I was saying?
Tennis and Web 3 have done so much.
In terms of sports and collaborations, tennis seems to be one of those that's done the most.
Martin Grasser's got the great collection.
The Aussie Open did stuff.
I mean, there's just been a lot.
So I get excited every time it happens.
I mean, I would, I think there's a strong argument to be made that Martin Grasser's
June of Art collection is the number one sports-inspired art NFT out there.
Of course, it's called love.
But yeah, tennis and Web 3 and NFTs are just they've been a lovely match.
And we appreciate you sacrificing your sleep for your fandom and also coming on the show.
Well, folks, we're going to talk about more than tennis today.
On the docket, we're going to start with the Bitcoin ETF inflows nearing a billion.
Magic Eden's latest info on the rewards and the battle for Solana RSIC dominating Bitcoin
The puppets are rebounding to fractional NFTs are going to sexes.
There's some big points, drama and more before we dive in, though, ghost.
Any housekeeping for today?
Yeah, I think I need to inject into my veins, whatever, Logie's.
I need to watch some tennis, I guess, because I'm not as awake as he is.
But as always, if you enjoy the show, it's how it does a great run out of the NFT space
every morning in the morning minute newsletter.
Get that pin to the top of the spaces.
Make sure you give that a subscribe if you haven't already.
Everyone needs to find something they love as much as Logie loves tennis.
I think that's one of the lessons here this morning goes.
Thank you for pinning that.
Another housekeeping reminder, folks, we've been keeping the show a bit more casual
So if you've got a hot take on any of the topics we're covering, feel free to shoot that
hand up request to come on stage and we'll see if we can add you to the convo.
Well, I'm going to start with a couple of stories here from the morning minute newsletter.
Number one, the Bitcoin ETFs see major volume despite a dip.
So folks, we were euphoric at the local top.
The Bitcoin ETF approvals, I thought, had to be a by the news event.
How could it not have been by the news?
I personally played the song, pump it up to kickstart this show on January 11th as Bitcoin
was reaching $49,000 per token in real time.
That was a massive faux pas.
It totally jinxed the price action and then everything came crashing down.
Bitcoin fell below 43,000 by the next day.
It has been down only since that moment on this show.
Yeah, has turned to fear here yesterday as Bitcoin slid below 39,000 briefly down more
than 20% from recent highs.
The Bitcoin ETF approvals was a sell the news event after all, but perhaps likely only on
a very short term timeline.
So if you haven't been following these Bitcoin ETFs have actually been wildly successful
and eight days of trading, they've already seen $980 million in net inflows.
They've seen substantially more action than any of the recent ETFs and within days they
became the number two ETF commodity behind just gold passing silver in the process.
So I think that the common question if you aren't deep into this is why is the price
Well, GBTC has had a lot to do with that.
GBTC has seen over $2 billion in sell pressure over the past week and a half of which
FTX accounted for almost 1 billion.
This GBTC sell wave combined with traders happy to cash in on some 75 to 100% gains on
the year has led to this fairly steep sell off.
But the hopes here, if GBTC sellers ever get exhausted, we go up only again at least that's
The fear and greed index back down to a healthy 48 or neutral rating compared to it was 73
last month and in that greedy zone.
So perhaps a sign there that we may be reaching a more stable level.
Hopefully we will find out soon.
So I want to get some quick reactions.
We don't need to dive super deep into this.
We don't really have our macro experts on our typical ones on with us, but I want to
talk about it a little bit.
Logie, maybe I'll throw it to you first since you are so caffeinated this morning.
What are your reactions to this Bitcoin ETF action in the week and a half of data
About it more bearish about it neutral.
I think I'm neutral, Tyler.
I'm trying not to overreact to anything have been, of course, falling loosely as
everybody is talking about the inflow numbers, the GBTC stuff, and I'm trying
not to get too high, too low in either direction.
I like you as excited, of course, a week and a half ago or however long it was at
this point feels like much longer with the with the approval, help talk my dad
into buying some of the ETF at the very local top.
So, you know, of course, a little disappointed in the performance thus far.
But, you know, to be quite frank, we've just been through this so many times or
at least, you know, myself as I guess almost reaching veteran status in
crypto currencies, you know, that these drawdowns, this type of stuff doesn't
phase me. And, you know, the overarching, you know, kind of bigger bullet point
about getting ETF approval, which felt like a huge victory nonetheless, right, is
standing out to me more so than this near term price action and whatever may be
happening as a result of, you know, two weeks of people selling, et cetera.
So I'm still I guess maybe that leans more bullish than the neutral statement I
gave to again. But yeah, I mean, I certainly do. I'm not feeling bearish in
any way at this point in time.
Yeah, you talked yourself into being bullish. Has your dad been chirping you
for the 20 percent drawdown?
My dad hasn't been, but my my mom is always chirping, which is unfortunate.
She thinks cryptocurrency is a scam.
And she is always praying that whatever I'm doing is not illegal.
So that that reflects my mother-in-law's sentiment to a T who expressed her
concern and our Thanksgiving Day meal in front of my mother as well, that she was
very concerned that I would be going to jail.
So this is a prevalence, a prevalent sentiment among folks who are just, you
know, arms length away from crypto.
You should have told her you should have told her that Suzu told you that jail
was great. I'm hearing that jail is a techno break, right?
We can get free of our cell phones, free of all the screens and just tech
detox. You just have to tell them it's an inevitability at this point.
You're trying to make as much money as possible.
I'm not sure how that will go over.
Emily, while we're chatting, you know, what have your reactions been so far
kind of watching the first week and a half of action from the Bitcoin ETFs?
And I think it sounds about right along the lines of what we predicted, the
majority of the institutional wealth knew that this has been attempted many
times and has been slowly packing their bags for years, planning on it.
And then there's kind of the last minute go getters that are trying to make a
bet on the actual approval of it, thinking that no one else would have
expected professional money buyers to be buying money.
And so you get a little bit of volatility and it settles slightly above
where it was before. I mean, that makes perfect sense, doesn't it?
It does. And that is how it played out.
But the moon boy in me got a little distracted.
I definitely fall into straight line bias.
I fall into that trap quite a bit.
Jason Bales, our lucky tourist CEO, I think he wrote about this a while back.
But it's very easy just to think those straight lines are going to continue
going up. And in fact, they don't.
They can reverse even if a long term pattern is still going in one
direction. Aqeen, I want to welcome you to the stage here.
GM, do you have some reactions to this ETF action?
Yeah, I do. I mean, I think it's I think it's fairly bullish.
I mean, it's a relatively short period of time to amass a billion of inflows.
I think that a lot of the G.B.T.C.
outflows was slow a little bit and kind of have a slow pace.
I mean, I think a lot of the money flowing out of G.B.T.C.
was sort of like, you know, money that was trapped and just needed to get out.
But in the short term, like the tax hit on exiting early
is probably substantially higher than those like additional fees.
So I think we'll probably see G.B.T.C.
just go into some sort of like a slow drip after this initial outflow.
But I think the thing I'm more kind of interested in and more bullish about
is the fact that trillions of dollars of assets that are managed by
financial advisors are now going to start deploying because they have
a vehicle to do that. Right.
And I think people need to appreciate the fact that most advisors today
they sort of, you know, rely on execution from these black box platforms
that they subscribe to annually.
And if assets aren't there, they're typically not buying.
And so now that you now have, you know, a very familiar wrapper
that they can now start making allocations on behalf of their clients
and actually earning fees.
Right. So it's important to note that, you know,
advisors typically don't recommend things unless they see a way for them to make money.
And so I think we're going to now start seeing over time,
you know, what what percentage of allocations our advisor is going to start
recommending their clients deploy into crypto.
And I mean, if it's, you know, one percent, two percent, five percent,
it's still going to be a substantial amount of capital
that kind of slowly gets into the space.
And so I'm still pretty bullish.
I think, you know, there's just going to be a constant bid
and we'll kind of see where the flow settles down.
But I think we have a ways to go before these large deployments stop.
I think we're just beginning.
Sure. I can feel bullish.
It just may take a bit of time to play out here.
I think the other rumor, I think maybe stronger than a rumor,
but there's already kind of talks about the ETFs coming next.
And from some of the statements we've seen, it looks like the path to approval
may be a little bit more clear, this go around
and without all of the legal battles.
So that will be, of course, one of the next narratives to watch in this space.
Well, I think some good talk on the Bitcoin ETS.
I want to get to our second lead story here from the day.
Too big not to talk about Magic Eden announcing their new cross chain rewards.
So on Monday, we got the major news that Magic Eden would be effectively
launching their own token, the NFT token via the non-fungible Dow.
Yesterday, we got more details and those early Solana users are going to be happy.
Here's a quick TLDR of the new Magic Eden rewards program.
So Solana OGs are going to receive a retroactive diamond drop
to account for their transaction history back to 2021.
Magic ticket NFT owners will be rewarded somehow,
though the market isn't pricing that in very much.
Bitcoin and Polygon NFT traders who have used Magic Eden will also be rewarded
in the months to come, honoring past, present and future activity.
And then Magic Eden, their wallet will go live soon as another way to earn diamonds.
This does make this, I believe, a first of its kind cross blockchain reward system.
So a bit of a first there.
It does feel kind of high level, similar to how Blur has rewarded past activity
in its airdrop, while also reward rewarding kind of current and incentivizing
future trading via how it's season one played out.
But again, this is going to be a little bit different because it's going
to span for blockchains, folks.
If you're interested in learning the details, head over to Magic
Eden dot IO slash rewards to learn more.
I think the question for me becomes, and there's a few questions, a lot to unpack
here. How much will farmers dive into this program with active farms already
going on Blur and Tensor?
How much share will Magic Eden be able to gain back?
And then Bitcoin has been an NFT ecosystem free of farming to date.
Is it going to be impacted now that there could be some incentives to trade
NFTs on Bitcoin on Magic Eden?
So those are the questions in my mind.
Logie, maybe I'll throw it back to you here.
First question, do you like how they've structured the rewards?
I think it's totally fair.
I know there's lots of debate always regarding distribution of airdrops and
tokens, and there's no perfect way to do it.
Right. But the retroactive stuff in my head always is, you know, one
of the best and fairest ways, right, because it does reward those who are
using it, perhaps without any inkling that there may be a token or maybe
a reward associated with it, despite, you know, us knowing in some ways
that, you know, with like a gems program and stuff that this was on the
So I think that's totally fine, as well as, you know, providing the
opportunity for those to earn on everything since yesterday's
announcement. So, you know, it wasn't like a stark snapshot that is
going to box out a bunch of folks as for whether or not, you know, this is
going to steal significant market share from from someone like Tensor.
I think TBD, you know, a lot of people that are utilizing Tensor, you know,
are utilizing it because it offers some of the functionality that something
I mean, it's not quite, but almost like a straight copy paste of what Blur
provided for Ethereum and FT trading.
And it seems to be, you know, if you're active or a pro trader, you want access
And, you know, Tensor is not slowing down in terms of innovation, either, right?
Price lock just came out this week, still getting off the ground and going
as well. And of course, an airdrop that's people are getting antsy about,
but but still going to come.
So I think it's going to be tough, perhaps, for Magic Eden to steal back
I'm sure they'll eat into it a little bit with some of these incentives,
But, you know, if I were Magic Eden, you know, you know, this is great,
of course, to take some of that.
But I just keep doubling down on the attention that's being paid and
provided via Bitcoin, which is where they've they've dominated,
you know, and seem to be, you know, the clear leader, you know,
who knows how long that may be the case.
But for right now, certainly the clear leader with really no, in my opinion,
no even close competitor behind.
Yeah, I mean, I've been trading ordinals now for probably six weeks.
I dabbled in before that, but more seriously, kind of checking every day
And Magic Eden is the only place that I go for Bitcoin entities.
And I actually don't even know off the top of my head another
marketplace that I could go to.
So I think focusing there certainly makes sense.
I mean, again, I've got this Solana market share chart up right here.
I mean, IntensorShare is quite literally up only.
I mean, they've reached 80%.
I wonder, I mean, that is an uphill battle Magic Eden is facing
And in some ways, is the mindset like, OK, Magic Eden is rewarding
all the historical users who traded on their platform.
But if I'm new to the ecosystem, it's kind of like, you know, choose your fighter.
And now you kind of have to pick, you know, which of these do you think
is going to be the bigger airdrop, I guess.
I think the wild card here, the X Factor is timing.
I think Magic Eden would probably benefit from putting a date on this
on this airdrop and perhaps being able to front run some of the Tensor action.
I don't know. That's just kind of some of the top of mind thoughts.
Ghost, I do I do want to quickly get your thoughts here more just on Tensor versus
Magic Eden in the battle for Solana.
You know, I think you've dabbled a little bit over on Solana T's,
But which marketplace do you see yourself using?
Do you think you would maybe switch because of this?
You know, it's funny, I started using Tensor
originally when I was training Sola NFTs.
And then I think when we kind of pivoted into ordinals,
I found myself using Magic Eden for that.
And then I started using Magic Eden also for Solana NFTs
because they were there also.
So I don't know if that's just an anecdotal bullet as to the potential
that Magic Eden might have for being able to take over Solana market share.
Because if it's all just right there and easy to use,
you become comfortable with it.
I don't see why I would then go over to Tensor
unless they were incentivizing me in a big way.
And we've kind of seen that the price of Tensorians went crazy
with people expecting that rewards airdrop.
And now, since then, almost like every other platform has,
besides OpenSea, obviously, has incentivized people in some way
to trade and do stuff on their platform.
So I think that the battle is, it has potential.
I mean, I think that what Logan said, though, is true,
which I think them doubling down on ordinals would be huge.
Because I think for most of the people that have pivoted over to ordinals
it's been such an easy, seamless experience on Magic Eden.
And I think that is a powerful thing for people
that are just making their move into like a confusing ecosystem like ordinals.
Yeah, they are setting it.
They're trying to make it as easy as possible.
I think this wallet is also, you know,
potentially a game changer for NFT traders who are across blockchains.
I think I saw someone tweet that Metamask
needs to be looking over their shoulder at Magic Eden's wallet.
I'm not sure I'm ready to go there with all the other wallet providers
But I do think for the NFT degen,
who's actively trading on Solana, Bitcoin and Ethereum,
a wallet that makes it easy to do that is attractive.
So I think that is a very interesting product here.
Emily, we were chatting a little bit about this in the group chat.
I'm curious for your reactions to the Magic Eden rewards program,
you know, this whole battle for Solana or any takes you might have.
I think a large part of the motivation behind a lot of these air drops
and trying to gain dominance in the marketplace
is still, you know, kind of due to OpenSea
and OpenSea's ability to generate such an enormous amount of revenue.
It's kind of like clouded people away from what you can actually do
with this type of data that's available.
And it's almost like they're trying to buy dominance and time
in order to make more money without actually, you know,
understanding what the underlying mechanics are.
And it really surprises me as someone like Magic Eden
or any of these marketplaces
instead doesn't appear to have any plan
for the massive amount of data that they've been collecting.
So, you know, I don't I don't know, like I'm just kind of
I'm kind of waiting for the next thing to happen.
Like we've seen air drops forever.
We've seen NFT trading forever.
I'm kind of surprised people aren't bored of it yet, to be honest.
Well, no one's getting bored of free money.
So I think that that primitive is going to stay.
That's that's hard to get bored of.
Right. They just kind of sit there and keep raining down on you.
It's you know, this is as we've been kind of talking through it.
I mean, this is a very similar style points program, right?
At least on the surface with the information that we have so far
that we've seen, you know, play out already.
It will be interesting if anyone kind of comes in and tries to change things.
I think any decision you make, of course, comes with trade offs.
Right. So if you reward the G's, you're typically rewarding the whales,
which you do want the whale support typically as you go into,
you know, a battle for market share.
But at the same time, you can kind of limit folks with smaller balances,
perhaps with less history, their incentives.
So it's tough to get right.
I don't envy the position necessarily before.
Maybe we just wrap up this combo.
Logan, I'll throw it back to you.
I think there's been a little chatter about Magic Eden going to the number one
spot in the marketplace wars, marketplace race.
Do you think that's realistic?
What would need to happen for Magic Eden to really catapult to number one?
I don't think it's going to happen any time soon, Tyler.
Like I mentioned before, I think Magic Eden is number one already for for Bitcoin.
I think what needs to happen for Magic Eden to be number one is we need to see
consistent activity across all these chains, right?
As you noted with the potential wallet coming with the fact that they're
already set up to handle multiple chains, which we know other marketplaces are right.
You know, OpenSea has Telana NFT trading or at least it did for some time.
But I think if people continue to be multi chain and active across chains,
it positions Magic Eden pretty well to continue just to eat into things.
Right. Like why would you trade elsewhere?
You know, if you're doubling or tripling your rewards on Magic Eden for loyalty
or whatever, you know, whatever the incentives may be.
So I think as as we continue to build out these more robust NFT ecosystems across
blockchains, that's where it becomes really appealing, you know, for Magic Eden moving
forward. And as you noted here a couple of times that we talked about on the show,
this is not you know, this is not the first time Magic Eden has been super innovative.
They have been doing so much stuff over the course of the last year and a half,
just been shrouded behind Telana being irrelevant for a period of time.
Telana NFT is being irrelevant for a period of time.
And, you know, happy for the team and everyone over there that this has all
come to fruition and starting to gain some of the spotlight for all the
innovative things that they have done, you know, in the wake of all that's
And just kind of, you know, reacting to your statement, it would be cool if I
could like sell a crypto undead on Telana and then immediately buy a Bitcoin
puppet all in one interface with a few button clicks, you know, right now
that is a more complicated action to take.
If you could do that with all the mechanics, the blockchain, with the
currencies, everything happening behind the scenes fairly quickly, and that
would be a game changer, especially if you're bullish on NFTs thriving
across all of these ecosystems.
So what I'm hearing is sell crypto undeads and buy the coin puppets.
I mean, NFA, but I'm taking the puppets over undeads seven days a week
at this point, and we'll get into more ordinals discussion here in a bit.
Aqeen, you've been patiently waiting, curious for your additional thoughts.
Yeah, I mean, I think this is going to essentially be a battle between
like specialists and a generalist platform, right?
And I think so far, we haven't really seen, you know, even with OpenSea,
we, I don't think there's, we've seen a lot of, the way I kind of think
about some of these changes, there's not a lot of activity other than on
ETH, Solana, and now Ordinals, right?
And I don't see Polygon having so much activity.
Maybe Basie's kind of picking up.
I think, you know, in my view, when you look at the products,
when you look at Tensor, right, they've shown a track record of just really
being innovative and moving quickly.
They have very, very liquid markets for their NFTs, so less of liquidity.
And so the question for, in my mind, would be, you know,
will Magic Eden be able to build these liquid markets and attract enough
value for it to make sense?
I think it's a, it's an uphill climb because as long as in my mind,
Tensor continues to innovate and really cater to the user based on Solana,
it'll be a better product for Solana.
And I agree with a lot of the sentiment around, in my mind, you know,
Magic Eden doubling down on Bitcoin and the Ordinals ecosystem,
because I mean, yes, I use it for Ordinals, but that's it.
Like if I'm, if I'm trading Sol, I go back to Tensor.
I don't, I don't see anything compelling in terms of the product in its current
state that would pull me away.
And meanwhile, I think Tensor has just a lot of features and a lot of liquidity
that I think will be hard to shake, especially if Magic Eden is trying
to sort of serve the needs of users of multiple chains.
I think my sentiment is, my personal sentiment is pretty close to that.
As well, I guess perhaps if, if you haven't been farming Tensor hard
and you feel like you're way behind the folks who had a head start on you,
perhaps that's a reason to go and just jump into Magic Eden now.
But man, if Tensor can, can run out the Blur playbook, I mean,
Blurs dominated what now for a well over a year, 15 months,
and it doesn't look like that dominance on Ethereum is slowing down anytime soon.
Tensor is in position to do that as well.
So Magic Eden certainly has a fight.
I want to move on, but Logie, maybe last thoughts.
Yeah, I was going to add there is that, you know, regarding the Magic Eden
versus Tensor thing with Solana, you don't have that second marketplace
really on Ethereum right now that's offering the types of incentives
to really challenge Blur.
So it's tough to compare, in my opinion.
We will, but that's going to change next week with frame.
So that's the new wild card.
So I think we will be revisiting this whole marketplace conversation
Well, folks, this was some good discussion in our top two stories.
There's a few other things I want to get to.
But first, let's read the news.
Today's top headlines powered by Lucky Trader.
Trading volume on ETH fell slightly to $20 million on Tuesday,
with most leaders saying slight red.
Deadfellas did lead top movers popping 78% to 0.27 ETH.
Neenah's super cool world and Chimpers each jumped 40% as well.
RSIC led action on Bitcoin with about 60 Bitcoin and volume on the day
It is at 0.054 right now live as we speak.
Those Bitcoin puppets up nicely as well, sitting at 0.032.
Commoners minted out their 10K PFP collection
and a bring your own uncommon sat style mint.
The floor is up to 0.021 Bitcoin on some steady volume and a nice
win for anyone who minted.
Over on Solana, NFTs were mostly green.
Those frog hannas up 33% to 8.2 sold.
Tensorians up 22% to 91 and parcel up 19%.
Crypto undeads steady at 11.
Arcade and Wasabi have partnered for the first ever loan against U tokens
or fractional NFTs facilitating a 5 ETH loan against 487,000
U pudgy tokens, which is basically equivalent to 48% of a pudgy
The Anime Foundation announced strategic launch partnerships with
Animoka and San Fran Tokyo to expand global anime along with
We saw Endless Clouds will launch its two web three games,
Treeverse and Capsule Heroes on the immutable ZK EVM platform
and then Florian Protocol announced a partnership with the sex
Wu for trading a fractional NFT tokens for pudgies and board
So a huge day for fractional NFT tokens and web three and crypto
crypto majors are back in green this morning.
Bitcoin was up 3.4% at 40,180.
I think it might be down a bit since.
ETH up 1% around 2250, Sol up 9% at 87.
All L1s did surge on the day.
Tia at 1675 say at 66 cents and Sui at 127 leading meme coins
rebounded even more with with jumping 50% back to 320 million.
I think Myra was up 30% as well.
Rabi wallet stirred a points related outcry from users after
announcing its latest airdrop of points and also the
points of everyone with an EVM address.
We saw iCandy Interact department with Animoka to launch
this game Snaky Cat and then Animoka also partnering with
Hashkey Exchange for a strategic partnership to enhance web
three and digital entertainment.
So a busy day for Animoka there as well.
There are a lot of headlines to dive into there.
Logie, where do you want to start?
Should we start with points and this Rabi wallet?
Are you surprised to see like was this the straw that broke
the camel's back here with Rabi dropping points instead
What's your read on the timeline sentiment around Rabi's move
Well, the timeline sentiment at least the timeline that I
was viewing sentiment was pretty poor and I got to say
Tyler, I didn't get as many Rabi points as I expected.
So I have to fund it, right?
Now, I mean, whatever, you know, personally, I'm just kind
I don't have a super strong take as to the points versus
Of course, it feels so drawn out at this point in time.
Just even though it may not even really be that drawn
Like we've been talking about farming very heavily only
in the last two and a half months, which in real world
time is not that long, but for us every single day
it just feels so so long, right?
So I'm trying to be, you know, kind of even keeled
here, you know, they're trying to steal people away.
They basically ran back the same rainbow thing with the
referral and you know, they use the Fox emoji all that
I've utilized it a handful of times.
I think it's a totally, you know, acceptable alternative
to MetaMask or any other wallet and people should give
It does just think that, you know, I didn't get as
many points as I should have.
Yeah, I mean, I think that is the that reflects the
sentiment, right, and I understand why a team and a
product would do this, right?
You want to attract new users.
You need to have the incentives to get them to switch
over, but I also empathize with early adopters who
now are going to see their all their their points
diluted, right, as the product, you know, tries to
grow the pros and cons of the move.
Certainly and not a new thing that that Rabi did
certainly in line with what several other protocols and
products have done, but it seems like we may have too
many points and not enough tokens at this point in
time board board Elon your quest to come up on stage
would love to hear what's on your mind here.
Yeah, I've been thinking a lot about building a point
system and just kind of watching whatever one is
doing and I think there's a pretty significant design
flaw right now with with with all the points which
is they're first of all, they're waiting too long
in between points being released and then people
being able to find out what they're actually worth.
So if you're playing a game and you're scoring points,
you need to know what those points are for, right?
Is it I'm competing and I'm going to get something
better than my competitor if I'm going to get a prize
relative to the to the number of points.
I have what is that prize if I have to wait three
months, especially in this space where no one has
any attention span, I'm just going to move on to
the next thing and I'm not actually going to use
the product and ultimately, that's what the business
wants, right? The business can attract you with
points, but to get you to stay and be loyal and
retain you, you need to use the product.
So I think the design flaw is that the points are
not actually being used as a soft currency.
So when you play a video game, you get coins,
you get whatever some sort of energy that you can
then use to build up your your character,
your land, whatever it might be and it creates
this little flywheel, this engine, right?
Where you get better and better and better and
it's a lot more fun to play.
And so with a lot of these airdrops of points
right now, you're just sitting on these points
and you can't do anything with them.
But if they were actually a soft currency like
not a crypto token, but a soft currency where
you could use those points to upgrade your
account to get you know, benefits that other
users don't get then you're actually
incentivized to spend the points and use
And then by the time, you know, by the time
you get to the point where the points can
be traded in for a currency, you were actually
using the product and you don't have to be
punished for like spending your points.
They could calculate the total amount of
points you've earned, not necessarily how
many you have in your wallet at that moment.
And I think that that ultimately is a
win-win then for the customer and the provider
because right now the point system is very
provider or like business friendly.
You understand why they do it.
They don't want to like they don't want to
They want to retain you for a few months
string you along and not necessarily promise
any sort of monetary reward to the customer
Like you don't know exactly what you're
getting as opposed to like an airdrop of tokens
where you know exactly what you have monetarily
immediately. So yeah, I mean, I'm sort of
like still playing with this idea, but
I do think that points are going to need to
be evolved to actually be useful and have
utility as a as a non-crypto unit for
them to kind of, you know, retain like any
value over time because we're going to
see hundreds or thousands of examples of
this and people are going to get tired of it.
Yeah, the fatigue is setting and you make
a lot of good points there.
I mean for me personally, I haven't even
bothered to check my my Rabi point balance
and I've got like 50 EBM walls and some
walls with some heavy activity over the
last few years, but it's just become
less and less interesting to me bored.
Maybe one follow-up question.
Had there been any protocols products
who have done, you know, points drops
or token drops in a way that you
thought was interesting, you know, or
you can't personally or have you not
really seen a great model yet?
I mean, I definitely have seen flashes
of what I've described in in games
and I think I think Nifty Island
might be doing this, but you know,
basically in games you have more of
a reason for people to want to spend
credits or points on stuff in the game
for like intangibles cosmetics,
that sort of thing and I think that
the, you know, the marketplaces,
they're trying to gamify their platforms
and the only way to like play the game
that they have is spend, right?
You spend to earn points and that's
that's not super fun, right?
That's like, oh, you know, I'm dropping
money on Marriott and getting
Here's, you know, here's a little
here's a little nibble for you and
that's just that's not something
that keeps you coming back.
You use it very infrequently.
So I think that these platforms
probably need to study how video
games have done this if they want
to employ a point system versus
a immediate airdrop of tokens,
which is really what their customers
want because those people are
traders, they're not players.
And so I think that's kind of
the fundamental mistake I've seen.
So yeah, I don't want to point
to too many like specific games,
but I definitely think that
generally the category is doing
I mean the gamification is
certainly very important and
maintaining attention, especially
as more and more of these continue
to pop up and again, like the
timeline and duration is also
I think just quickly coming back
to friend tech and this is not
a discussion on the merits of
the app itself, but there was
still a lot of attention and
hype around Christmas Day, you
know, Racer had kind of teased
in his room some kind of, you
Had they done a burn your
points for tokens at that time,
even if the tokens weren't
tradable, but as a signal that
a token is indeed coming at
some point, I think that would
market attention in that space
at least a little bit longer,
at least for the folks who had
been kind of dedicated power
users up until that time, but
just saying, hey, V2 is coming
in spring, that kind of an
unknown timeline, I think for
many folks, myself included was
just not enough to keep interest
So, I'm absolutely with you
Emily, your hand popped up
and then we'll go to Joaquin.
Yeah, I definitely agree with
Bordi one as far as aligning
participants in your tokenomics.
And I think that it's been
it's been mostly amiss so far
and it's incentivized heavy
trading, which is a good way
But if the goal of points is
ultimately product adoption,
then you have to be incentivizing
people who are a good fit
It's almost a detriment to
get an enormous amount of
adoption through incentivization
like an airdrop or tokens
for participating and then
participants the second that
the transition is made because
then it looks like you can't
retain users and that's an
even harder metric to fix.
And you know, if it comes down
to something like impressing
investors or creating a liquidity
event, there's only so many
chances you can run that single
play before people gain a lot
Yeah, I'm with you there for
Some more factors to consider.
Akane, you've been waiting
curious for your thoughts before
Yeah, I mean, I think that
you know, ultimately part of the
issue is a lot of points work
when you have some thought as
to the utility long-term,
And I think there are many
applications that haven't
figured it out and I just
trying to draw points and
And I think the challenge now
is with folks like Tensor
that has had a points program
for a while and actually build
I think in some of the previous
rounds, you know, you could
kind of get into lotteries for
airdrops and different things
You have to be able to think
about, okay, once I drop a token,
what does that translate into?
platform like Tensor has had
the time to sort of learn and
maybe will optimize that.
And then you actually build in
the incentives into the NFTs
And so part of the game is as
you use the platform, you can
level up your NFT and as you
level up, you actually get
benefits on the platform.
So you get lower fees, you get,
And ultimately, all that track
record of leveling up, you
would think over the long-term
raises the value of your NFT
relative to one that's not
And I think that by the time
they drop a token, and perhaps
that token will now be a nice
form of liquidity, right?
They'll have enough of a metric
system to know where to deploy
the majority of that liquidity
based on the activities and
But I think, you know, the
smart thing that they have done
is either way, your track
record of leveling up is tied
to the NFT, not the platform.
So if I decide to stop the
game today at level four or
five or whatever, right, when I
get, when the airdrop comes,
you would assume that because
of my level, I get a little
bit more because I have a
track record of using the
So I think that's one design
interesting and it kind of, in
my mind, shows some forethought
and it's sort of purposely
So it has to sort of make
sense based on what you're
And I think when I just see a
points program tied to a wallet
or just these random things
where it's hard to kind of
think about, okay, what value
You know, it sort of is like,
okay, they're not all the
same and it needs to be more
thoughtful and you kind of
see potentially where that path
And in the meantime, there
needs to be a game that is
worthwhile playing where you're
at least accumulating a score.
Yeah, I'm so with you on the
programs that look like, you
know, a lot of thought went
into designing, you know, how
the rewards will be accrued.
You know, how is it tied to
versus, okay, here's a point
We're going to string you
along for another three to
six months and keep you happy
So we'll see how this continues
Clearly some fatigue has set
We got to spend a few minutes
talking about the new behemoth
NFT collection on Bitcoin that
has just been rocketing these
Logie, catch us up with what's
been happening with RCIS.
Have I become too bullish
starting to take a step away
Tyler is just the rocket ship
selection of the rocket ship
whatever other emojis people
use to showcase excitement.
nothing but up only in the
I was cautious about this
when it initially dropped,
There was that initial surge
I was I was cautioning you
to just kind of take a breather,
you know, like listings will
I think one of which maybe
you were able to capitalize
this is really just crushed
And of course, it's working
on a few different things,
It's working on one plenty of
momentum from a free airdrop
to expectation of a future
airdrop and three just the,
you know, overall excitement
that has yet dwindled a bit
But, you know, just overall
excitement surrounding ordinals
and the future promise of
And so I think the confluence
you know, makes this something
that's really, really interesting
There are so many variables
here at Play, though, right?
Like you have to activate
the RSIC in order for it to mine.
You earn and keep that allocation
It should have been activated
and I think it's just going
to be interesting to track
moving forward as we learn
a little bit more, right?
There's still the boosting
thing we need to figure out
which obviously adds some fuel
And apologies, I think I said RCIS.
I'd written up, you know,
300 words on how the ordinals ecosystem
was dead, volume was gone.
All of these high-dollar mints
had sucked out all the liquidity.
Quantum cats was going to take
whatever remaining we had.
If Casey's behind it secretly,
They're pumping in this massive liquidity
into the ordinals ecosystem,
which I think has given life
to several other collections as well.
Certainly it's helped the Bitcoin puppets
who were one of the primary collections
who received the airdrop.
Those are up again back at 0.032
It was a nice environment
for the commoners to mint into last night
You know, most mentors had to have given
some forethought, advanced thought
to prepare for that mint,
but still a nice outcome.
I think those uncommon stats
were trading at 0.009 Bitcoin
So the commoners at 0.021
buying more of these at a lower price point.
I too got a little bit concerned
What piqued my interest yesterday,
I think that they shared the activation stats
and there was like 12,000
and the NFTs hadn't been activated yet.
So I saw that as a bull sign
and then they shared them again this morning.
I think the inactive are down to 6,000.
So still a solid, you know,
30% of the float, 33% of the float
hasn't been activated yet.
of what the true collection size is
versus some of these which may just
And then clearly that some advanced thought
went into building this collection
with how it's been gamified,
some of the details of the game
And then again, seeing the tokenomics yesterday
was what really triggered me to think,
okay, this one's worth taking a look at
where folks, if you didn't see this,
they announced it's going to be tied
to a 21 billion token supply.
when the Rune's protocol launches,
that's expected around the halving.
I want to say in April at some time,
pending how the blocks process.
And then the average Rune's holder
is expected to get 1 million tokens.
The wildcard, and I missed this
on like my first five reads of the white paper,
is this raffle that happens.
I think at the halving with the top raffle prize
that is, what, that's basically five,
that's basically 1 billion tokens.
So you can do your market cap math,
but someone winning 1 billion tokens
is just a wild, wild raffle.
I think potentially at a scale we have not seen yet.
I'm letting my excitement take over.
I need to level back step away.
I have a few of these as well.
Emily, your hand popped up.
I'm curious for your reactions,
and then we'll go to Logie.
Yeah, I think there's a lot more liquidity available
for well-thought-out and interesting products,
than there is for your typical generative art release.
And that's why I do not think that the same kind of typical
audience would apply to RSIC
as far as what liquidity is available to consume it.
It just seems a lot more in line with the Bitcoin community themselves.
I don't think it's Casey.
I don't think he's got anywhere near the amount of time
required to launch something like that
because he just said every day on ordinals.
But I think it's likely someone who is closely acquainted with him
and has worked with him and has a good understanding
of how it works within the Bitcoin ecosystem.
And someone who has a really strong understanding,
like a strong technical understanding of Bitcoin mining.
And I think that that has a better appeal to your average
kind of Bitcoin maxi, I guess.
And I just don't think it's going to be something easily compared
Yeah, I'm with you there.
And then also, I've learned in this process that
It's just a sexier activity than farming.
And I'm much more excited if you can't hear it in my voice
talking about mining, mining runes
than I am about farming any token at this point in time.
Of course, you know, where my moon boy had,
I had to pull up some of the token charts
for that orty token, the BRC20,
which got to over a billion in market cap.
The rats token, some random token.
I don't even know what this is, got to like 600 million
and still currently at 250 million dollars.
So these BRC20s have history of going to high valuations.
And I'll just leave it at that.
Logan, thoughts on your side, and then we'll go Joaquin.
Well, I'm just here to talk you down just a little bit,
Tyler, as you requested in some way here.
I think it's funny to see all the tokenomics stuff, right?
And I just want to harken it back to, you know,
when people were earning banana every day,
when people were earning all those tokens every day
and they started to do the projected passive income tweets,
I don't think we've come that far just yet.
I haven't seen any personally on my feed about, you know,
the potential for how much in ruins
they would be earning at a XYZ market cap, right?
But every time that those things start to circulate,
that is typically a sign that, you know,
just backing away from the buy button.
So just wanted to throw that out there.
Logan, trying to harken me back live on the show here.
I'm not going to let you do it.
Quick, remind me what the Cyber Kong's floor was
in US dollars when bananas were trading at like 40.
Well, I'm not going to do so,
but maybe Ghost will like to.
I was holding that during the time it didn't sell
and it was probably like close to $750,000.
I think it hit a 200 East floor at some point
and banana was like $150.
What a wild, wild callback that was.
Folks, if you weren't around in 2021,
like no one even really talks about Cyber Kong's these days.
That collection at 200 East floor,
it was liquid in the high 100s.
This is back when East was up there, like 3,000, 4,000.
That was a wild, wild run that Prada went on.
I'm keen, curious for your thoughts here.
Yeah, I mean, I think to Emily's point,
you know, I think there's a massive difference between
I think drops that are thoughtful and designed by Bitcoin,
OG devs potentially and everything else, right?
And when you see the design in my mind of this project,
it's just so well aligned to like everything about Bitcoin,
but even the supply at 21,000, right?
It aligns very nicely with a 21 million supply.
And so I just think that, you know, it's interesting.
I mean, I got two of these for free.
And so it was just a no-brainer to kind of turn them on
Like it's, but I think the design as to your point,
the design and sort of what potentially comes next
and the airdrop makes it at least compelling enough
to kind of see it through.
And I think Bitcoin as an ecosystem is just so massive.
I don't think there are enough quality projects yet
by any stretch of imagination.
And so when you see a quality project,
that's well thought through to me,
it's something you hold for sure,
especially if you get it for free because you know,
the successful projects in this ecosystem,
I think are going to be an order of magnitude bigger
than we've seen almost elsewhere
just because of the under supply of quality
and some of the barriers to entry that you have on Bitcoin
to actually develop really thoughtful things.
I feel like node monkeys is starting to get
I wasn't really sure what kind of staying power
I've been very, very impressed with them
kind of holding up at 0.17.
They're at 0.174 I'm saying right now,
you know, the rares mid tiers are continuing to move
and this is not bag bias.
I don't have any actually flip to my node monkeys
a couple of weeks back now,
but I am thinking strongly about re-entering.
I think that the collections that prove strong,
that prove well thought out,
I think there will be continued demand for those.
Of course, we will see this quantum cats meant next week
is definitely that the X Factor wildcard,
you know, what's that going to do for these other projects.
So certainly it's going to steal attention.
And we've got a few minutes left.
I think some big things with with flooring protocols
We saw the the loan against the bag of you tokens
and then we saw this woo central exchange sex list
the the pudgy you tokens and the board ape you tokens.
Logan, maybe I'll throw this to you.
How big of a deal is this?
Getting these fractional tokens for NFTs listed on a sex
and do you think that we will see demand?
Like what is the path to demand look like?
Yeah, it's really interesting because you know,
the idea of fractionalizing NFTs and trading them
has been, you know, long yearned for in many ways,
but not necessarily acted on and this is really the first time
we're starting to see it distributed the idea
that is and tokens in this case as well distributed a bit
more broadly right with the ability now to personalize
on a centralized exchange the ability to maybe do a little bit
more with them like package them together and get a loan.
And so I think it's just something to continue to pay attention
to you know, we had our partner wasabi on the show yesterday
talking about, you know, how you can use these right to go
long or short NFTs even if you don't have access to you know,
enough to buy a crypto Punk and those types of things weren't
present when we first started talking about for actualized
NFTs and I think they're just a lot easier to grasp and understand
when you when you are, you know, contextualizing in that way
and showcasing it like this is what's possible with them,
right? Whereas before it was literally just like okay,
you own 0.000 to 5 of a crypto Punk and so that's what
I think is really really cool about this is at a certain
point Tyler, I think you know, we're talking about the
tokens themselves right now, but at a certain point if and
when they're adopted more widely, which I do fully expect
them to be, you know, we won't even really be thinking about
the fact that they're you know, they're fractions of an
NFT, right? Or maybe we will but at least we won't be
talking about it as like the super revolutionary part is
the fact they are fractions.
I guess maybe that's more of what I'm trying to get to.
Yeah, and I think that the Punk's token will be the
grail if we actually get a fully liquid punk. So I know
we've had one in the past but to your point, I think
there's a big difference between fractional in 2021
fractional to me felt like okay, I own a tiny fraction
of this entity. I've got the you know, basically a fraction
of a picture. I didn't think of it in my head as like
a liquid token. I think with this meme coin mania that
that's been playing out here for the last six months, I
think folks are much more versed in these tokens. I
think for your protocol and the you tokens having a
million tokens per NFT was smart because now you can
have these large supplies. I think folks mindsets are
just starting to shift about how you can trade tokens
versus NFTs and it's different than fractional NFTs.
I think it feels different saying okay, I own one
third of a pudgy penguin cool or versus I have 333,000
new tokens, which I can start to do with. So it took
me a little while to come around to it. I didn't
totally get it at first. I didn't totally get where
Florence demand was coming from because I think I
was so anchored and fractional from 2021. But it's
different and I'm certainly starting to come around
to it a whole lot more. Logi additional thoughts and
we'll wrap up. Yeah, I was just gonna add one of
the other things that this is doing for me a
little bit. You're just talking about the meme coin
mania. And of course with meme coins and shit coins
like we're thinking in market caps. Whereas an NFTs
you know, it's always been a stat that's been there,
but it's something that I've had a really hard time
wrapping my head around right like the thinking
about the pudgy penguin market cap. Like what
does that mean? How you know, how does pudgy
penguins really stack up and you know, how far
could it move up or down right? The market cap stuff
just makes it so much easier to understand performance
relatively speaking and strength and all those types
of things and at least in my head and maybe it's
not even close or you know, there could be some
technical flaws that I'm not understanding here.
But at least in my head moving towards these
you tokens or just those fractionalized tokens
and in a more fungible way allows me to understand
it personally understand a bit better. You know
what these NFT projects are truly worth in the
market cap sense, which is something that I just
personally have not utilized too often. I don't
see many people citing, you know, market cap data
regarding projects, but it's still important. Yeah,
that's such a good point and I think that could
be part of the mindset shift of maybe this next
cycle that could be one of the drivers for
leveling up these floor prices. You know, if
you think about what are the catalysts that could
actually move pudgies up a level, board apes up
a level, punks up to a level. Like I'm still like
there's this narrative or some view out there,
you know punks are going to go back to $500,000
or a million dollars floor. It's kind of hard
to wrap your head around that at a per NFT basis.
But if there's a token aspect micro punks with
billions of supply now, you know, if you start
to think about in market cap standpoint versus
floor price, it does, you know, kind of change
how you look at things and in a cycle where tons
of coins are going to billion-dollar valuations
and digital assets become a little bit more part
of the conversation, I could absolutely see it.
So it's going to be a fun trend to watch.
I think we are in the very very early stages of
it. As for this show, we are in the very late
stages of the show. We are in fact going to
end things here before we go.
What's minting today? A handful on the list.
We had William Mapon and Avante art this morning.
Centrifuge means by 6529 just went live three
minutes ago. 10 Jill and art blocks curated
Eastern Ravens doing dots at 2 p.m.
Eastern and then Zocchio at 8 p.m.
It's a bit of a slower day.
A few big name art drops.
Mapon was here this morning with a one of
one of 35 collection called Centrifuge.
That was priced at $5549 and then art blocks
curated is back with backs.
It's $300 supply selling in that standard Dutch
auction format. So go check that out if you
are interested. But folks, that's it.
That's our show. We'll be back tomorrow at 10
a.m. Eastern. Thanks to our listeners for
tuning in. Thanks to my co-hosts.
Thanks to our keen and bored Elon for coming
on up. Everyone enjoy your Wednesday.
Let's make it a great time.