Projects
![]()
No projects found
Investors
New
DAO Treasuries
DATs
Lend / Borrow APRs
Chains
Categories
Spaces
Protocol Spotlight: Tapir Protocol
Recorded: June 17, 2025 Duration: 0:53:18Space Recording
Short Summary
Tapir Protocol launches as a groundbreaking D-bank protection marketplace, addressing the critical issue of DPEGs in crypto. With a focus on de-risking strategies, the project aims to attract both retail and institutional investors, while gearing up for an upcoming fundraising round.
Full Transcription
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Hey, Marco, how's it going?
Hello, hello.
Yeah, with me and the script for that.
Can you hear me well?
Yeah, perfect.
Perfect.
Yeah, okay.
Yeah.
Thanks.
Good to be here.
Yeah, I'm glad to have you on.
Let's do it. Let's kick it off.
Yeah, I'm excited for this one.
Yeah, this is the first protocol launched by Token Dynamics contributor
while we've been going for the last couple of years.
So especially excited for this. And I like what you're doing
at Tapir. The first time you told me the idea, I was stoked on it. It's one of those that
is intuitively obvious as soon as you hear about it, but for some reason doesn't exist yet. And
you know, really, it's one of those protocols that's
just like really elegant, simple, brilliant, and solves a real problem. So I'm excited
to get into it today. And before that, maybe we can just introduce you. So how long have
you been in the space in crypto?
All since 2016.
Yeah, that was my kind of entry into the space.
I heard about Bitcoin before, but I haven't got into it since 2016.
And then full time 2020.
Okay.
Yeah, 2016 is OG status from what I've heard.
And since then, this is your second protocol that you founded.
You had one a couple of years ago,
and in between now and then,
I know you are the lead token economist at SSV
doing research at Diva and obviously contributing to token dynamics doing protocol design for a
couple of protocols under the hood and then risk management in one of our recent clients and now you're founding Tapir.
So a lot of track record here.
You got some good history, man.
What led you to found Tapir?
Why does it need to exist?
Yeah, thanks a lot for the intro.
Okay, so how did we start with Tebhir? Basically, firstly, we were thinking of building a special, very safe, restaking protocol.
You mentioned my background, having been in staking, like SSV and Diva, both staking protocols.
So that was like a first thing, let's just make the protocol that made sense for me.
But then talking to users and to potential investors, we soon found out that actually what's the DPEG protection that should have been just a feature of the researching thing is basically much more powerful thing and
really needed throughout crypto uh so yeah we we kind of fully praised the idea uh kind of
investigated the problem and uh and so that uh yeah this is the thing that uh market bonds and
uh and people are really looking for so that that's kind of the back story here.
You're muted, mate.
Yes.
And so we should also probably introduce what is Tapir.
Yeah, that's a good point.
We haven't really talked about that.
So Tapir is a D-bank protection marketplace.
What does that actually mean?
Or what does it help you to solve?
Basically, it protects you against D-backs.
The question is, what are defects, right?
You can think of it on a high level that tapir basically helped people to trade risk,
helped people to either protect their investment and pay for it in terms of a little bit lower risk, lower yield, or it gives you the ability
to get higher exposure and also higher yield.
So it's basically a concept that in business finances is very well known and there are
many financial products and it's a really huge huge market in traditional markets but in crypto it's
for some reason there is not really a market like this and yeah it's one of the biggest
issues that investors are facing they want high yields but you know you want to direct
some people to correct their investments on people want to take our yields. That's what we do, we kind of facilitate that.
I really like that way of putting it, it's trading risk. And if you look at TradFi, the
total adjustable market for trading risk is in a derivatives market, right? This is like
derivatives, you always hear about how derivatives dwarf the market cap
of all of the other assets combined.
And so this is another kind of, maybe not quite derivative,
but something analogous to it in DeFi.
I mean, you hit the nail on the head.
It's exactly derivative.
I mean, derivative is the nail on the head. It's exactly derivative.
I mean, derivative is a very broad term.
Derivative only means that it derives value from something else.
So basically, stock is not a derivative.
Stock directly represents a value of the company. But for example, option on the stock or futures,
those are the most basic derivatives. they kind of track a value of
something and give you some kind of a payout, right?
And yeah, you are true, it's a derivatives market, I think, is roughly a hundred times
bigger than the equities market.
And if you look at the market that is most similar to this, it's like a credit default
swaps market.
And that is $9 trillion with a T dollar market in trade buy.
So yeah, that's really a huge market.
And this is just the credit default market, like the derivatives market as a whole is
much, much bigger.
Yeah, that's another reason it's a huge there's a huge
market here and uh and it's it's cool to see crypto finally getting to this level of maturity
where these kinds of protocols are starting to come around and um and you mentioned so you
mentioned like what is a dpeg and what is the definition of a dpeg but i'm curious
from the audience by a show of emojis how many of you have experienced a dpeg but i'm curious from the audience by a show of emojis how many of you have experienced a
dpeg event i would expect to at least a couple hands so i think uh once we maybe dig into some
examples everyone's going to be like oh yeah i was there for that um because the people in the
audience here are not new we haven't, maybe, that's my point.
We haven't actually, I haven't explained DPEGs.
So maybe you can try to settle that or I can do that.
Yeah, well, what is a DPEG and how do you define that?
And what have been some famous examples of DPEGs?
Yeah, let me start with example.
I think that's easier and then we go to the definition.
Basically, some assets, the most famously stable coins, stables,
are called stables because they should track the value of some stable asset,
usually US dollar, I think USDC, DAI, USDT, right? become stable as unusual usd or i think usdc usdt right and for them to defect means that they are
no longer worth one dollar for one usdc and uh yeah that's actually what happened what was it 2023
yeah well so valley bank right there was that usC DPEG. There have got to have been a handful of even USDC DPEGs. I feel like a lot of these news stories, just CT, crypto Twitter is so quick to forget. different variants of of stake teeths d pegs and you know they're the the the
combined market cap of all of these assets is is massive and it's it's a
real problem because for conservative investors institutions or even DGENs
like DGENs are are concerned about DPEG events because they can lead to
cascades of issues that I'm sure we'll talk about. Which way do you want to take that?
Do you want to define what a DPEG is or do you want to jump to like some more examples uh which way would you like to to go with
this market maybe i can talk a little bit about the problem and how big the market actually is
and yeah define it so as i've said a good definition is well uh when the asset basically no longer
tracks the underlying when one usdc is no longer worth one dollar or one st is no longer
worth one eat right when this relationship which should hold this one-to-one relationship between
the asset and the uh the underlying is broken so that's how I would define DPEG.
And maybe let's look at how big of a problem is it.
Is that clear enough or do you want to...
Yeah, I think so.
Yeah, I didn't know if you wanted to clarify it some more
because you had mentioned,
and I think this is a good definition,
is the asset is supposed to be trading at one-to-one
with something underlying.
But oftentimes, for various reasons, it'll trade at a discount and sometimes at a premium.
But I don't expect we'll get into that today.
But yeah, like what is the what is the rough market size for all of all of these DPEGs or for, you know, the potential of these assets in maybe in today's DeFi landscape,
not necessarily like the future where you might have a lot of different TradFi assets moving on
chain or RWAs. I'm sure the market could grow, but what's the rough order of magnitude um solution space for uh for this type of protocol yeah so
basically i have done a research for the last five years and there have been a lot of defects
most famous which basically was probably touched almost everyone in crypto or very many people is Steve SPE DPEG and USDC DPEG
and also USDT had small DPEGs Luna so yeah that's the most infamous one I would say
and the total current market that doesn't for example include luna because luna's uh usdt which is no longer with us just the current
market cap of the t-packed assets for the last five years is 254 billion right which is huge
uh that's that's like one quarter of a trillion uh and that's uh i'm looking right here that's 16 assets that is 16 assets yeah and that and is
that the market cap of of all of the assets that have de-pegged or like the pegged assets uh that
that could de-peg no this is just the ones that DPEG, right?
And are still with us, right?
So USD is not there, but USD is the Dive, right?
STE is now, basically, most recently was USD 0++
that is still DPEG.
I think we have to add that to the GitHub.
Yeah, there's like four right now
that are currently DPEG.
There's Synthetix USD,
there's USD0,
at least those,
and I think a couple more.
So what happens in a DPEG,
or maybe we should talk at a more general level,
like Tapir is the marketplace for trading risk of DPEGs.
How does it actually work?
And then maybe we can move from there into an example scenario.
Yeah, so how does it work? Basically, you are trading the risk. we can move from there into an example scenario.
Yeah, so how does it work? Basically, you are trading the risk. Some of the people here maybe,
I don't know how many people are familiar with Pendle. That Pendle is basically a similar product,
but in Pendle you are splitting the underlying underlying token into a fixed yield part and variable yield part.
Tapir is analogous in the sense that we take the underlying token. So let's say Athena USDE, and we split it into two parts.
One token is the DPAC protected part,
and the other part is the yield boosted part.
OK, so if you just buy the DPAC protected part,
you are protected against DPAC.
If you buy the yield boosted part,
you take all additional risk and get additional yield.
So that's how it is in a nutshell.
Is that clear?
Do you want me to go into example or clarify something?
Yeah, that makes sense to me.
And I assume it's not just that you can buy the one side of the market that you want.
You could also create both.
And, you know, like Pendle or like polymarket uh sell the side back that you don't
want and then double up your exposure on the side that you do of course yes yes you could do all
all kind of fancy strategies on top you can lever up on one token um you can you can vote both in some ratio you can uh market make you can add liquidity and
yeah there are more things you can do with it it's uh basically that's the beauty of d5 that's
due to uh splitting this exposure into two tokens and you can do you know many different stuff
to two tokens and you can do, you know, many different stuff.
Yeah.
And what kinds of, what kinds of assets can you do this with?
Like, do you whitelist certain things or like, how does, how does that all work?
Yeah.
I mean, this is a big strength of our approach because we can do any assets.
Because we can do any asset.
It doesn't matter.
It doesn't matter because when you compare it
to traditional companies or protocols
that do it in a traditional way, they usually
basically need to risk assets, the actual asset and if they need the asset too risky, I mean they need you to do the
risk assessment.
First, this takes time before they can give you the protection or something and you also
need to run the whole team who actually does the risk assessment. Yeah, and it's a whole process,
and it's not very suitable for DeFi,
because DeFi is known for its rapid pace,
and highly risky.
So the traditional protocols
and the traditional approach
currently serve DeFi well.
Compared with the peer.
We can do any market because we create the marketplace.
We don't actually underwrite with, right?
We let the markets play out the dynamics
and find the right price.
That's awesome.
And like Pendle, it's got specified timeframes, right?
So you can have any asset with whatever configurable timeframe
users want to create a market for.
Yes, yes, yes, of course.
First, I think we'll do some reasonable defaults
because we need to establish the markets somehow.
So the three-month time frame which
handle uses seems like a very reasonable one.
So we could use that.
But as you have noted, it doesn't really matter.
But you could do any time frames.
Yeah.
But maybe what could be helpful is to go into the example.
Maybe.
Yeah.
Yeah, that was going to be my next question.
So what happens after 90 days? like how what are the sample returns for a holder of a DPEG protected asset and a yield bearing
asset like the DPN YB tokens yeah so we have like two scenarios other is if the effect didn't happen.
Let's go through the .
The effect didn't happen.
In that case, at the end of the period,
after the three months,
you can just take out the same amount of
undrawing as you put in.
The important note here is that we don't compare it to
other traditional approaches that uh where you buy
by usually the protection in some other assets usually in usdc uh which means you are not really
making any yields on the on the amount that uh you bought the protection for uh human to peer
you bought the protection for, you bring to peer.
If nothing happened after three months,
you still get all the yield of the underlying.
So USD, let's say it has down 10% or 8%,
you still get 8%, both if you are the DP holder
or if you are the YP holder.
OK, so that's a very important thing for how you define
is that basically there is no opportunity cost
for neither buyer nor seller.
Both are getting fully in on the actual line,
which is not true with other approaches we have seen.
So that is one thing.
Maybe we can go to the example where the DPEG actually happened.
So let's say we have USB-E,
and it DPEG's 10%.
What happens in the end?
After a three-month period, what actually happened?
If you hold the DPEG protected asset,
you can get out this clean.
What you put in plus the DPEG part.
So let's say you put in 100 worth of USTE,
you can get out 110.
Because there was 10% DPEG, and DPEG, I mean, that's roughly, it's not exactly that, but
it's roughly 110, which means you get the full yield of around underlying, you get a little bit more because you get yield on the yield than you get the yield as well.
And for the yield boosted part, you get less. Normally you would get 90 back instead of 100,
and also they're happy to D-back, so your actual money you get is something close to 80.
Okay, so the moral of the story here, your losses are double if you sold the DPEG protection, if you hold the yield boosted asset, and you
take double the loss, and you get all the yield, everything you have. But on the other
side, if there is no DPEG, you get more because the DPEG protection
costs something.
So maybe I kind of overcomplicated it a little bit.
So you can think about it very easily.
DPEG protected asset gets a little bit lower yield,
and any DPEG is covered. You get...
and you get it in the line.
Yield-boosted part, you get
your DPEG-based price because you need to
make all the DPEG-protected
side of the deal and you get
hired. That's why you uh sold or why why you got the yield
yeah that makes sense and i i assume there's a little bit more math behind the scenes. And, you know, we may be able to dive into that another time.
I'm excited to talk about, like, how the mechanisms work under the hood and things like that.
But I think that'll be better for a future space.
Because I want to get to a couple more questions.
Like, who do you envision using Tapir?
Where's the product market fit for this?
Yeah, I mean, there are many people who would use it.
First, I think people like you and me.
I would love to go into the panel and buy the high yielding products,
but I don't have the time to do the research on all the protocols,
I don't know the risk profile, so I would love to get like 20% yield
on ETH tracking or USB tracking assets, but have it feedback protected so I'm happy to
take you know 15 instead of 20% and I'm still very happy with that so
regular DeFi users who want to get the high yield DeFi opportunities but want to
sleep well as well want to underwrite the risk.
Because in high-end defy,
there is a lot of fields to go around.
I don't need to worry about it.
Hopefully.
Yeah, that's fine.
Thanks.
Because my mind goes to, like, institutions,
but it could also just be de-gens who have complex strategies
that want to de-risk one aspect of it
because they're not as familiar with one source of yield,
but they are in the second,
and so they want to de-risk the one to capture the yield
from their area of expertise or something.
So that makes sense as another place
that you would expect people to be using this.
Yeah, I mean, this is definitely true.
You kind of touched on a very good point.
Like, even me, the whole finance of the modern world
is about specialization, right?
I don't have the time necessarily to study every and each asset but
there are people you know who go down deep into the rabbit hole study protocols and they are the
ones who think okay like this is the safe protocol i'm happy to earn extra yield uh i see i can i can
earn five percent more on the yield and i don't think it's risky i have done my homework you know
send more of the yield and i don't think it's risky i have done my homework you know uh and i
i'm happy to kind of pay to those people who take on the risk this is what like the whole traditional
finance is built around right everybody specializes in something else and uh yeah basically do do do their investment decisions likewise.
Yeah, no, I think that makes sense.
And I would expect to see even more interest in de-risking over the next few years
as people realize that they're actually
not that good at doing research on things.
You know, look at how many people got wrecked by Terra.
There have been a lot
of other protocols that have caught attention and turned out to have hidden assumptions.
Fluid a few months ago was uncovered to still have the problem of impermanent loss. I was
just reading Eric Falkenstein's latest article on that today. There's so many things that are risky endeavors that people jump into in crypto.
They don't price in the risk because they don't know how to do.
And there's not a protocol for that, even if they do realize that they need it.
you know, even if they do realize that they need it. So as another, another reason that I'm,
that I'm excited about this, because it's de-risking an important aspect of, of DeFi,
which is DPEGs. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. And, you know, as DeFi becomes more mainstream,
it means more like traditional finance and traditional institutions coming and that's also like a tool which is which is really
crucial for them right like if you are a large institution you you need to have like your risks
in check it's not just your money you're playing with you're playing with millions of money that
are basically not yours and you need to have like a proper risk management uh so yeah we envision that defy is going to become the
threat by basically that uh that's that's what what are at least that's what i'm here for that
there is only going to be finance and d5 is going to become that and uh yeah i think institutions coming in and more investors coming in will
definitely take advantage of this i think this is one of the biggest opportunities we see
yeah especially with all the rwa is and stable coins um being the hot narratives right now. I think Tapir makes a lot of sense in addressing and de-risking all of those assets.
So you mentioned that Tapir doesn't take on exposure because it's a marketplace.
And that seems like it's a bit different than some of the other approaches to insurance of all kinds in DeFi.
So what are some of those examples of where insurance has been tried already
and how is this different than those approaches?
Yeah, the most prominent one and the only one with signature is Nexus Mutual.
And Nexus Mutual is basically like a traditional underwriter. They themselves
have some kind of a risk management team which assesses the risk and they underwrite the
risks themselves, which is a very reasonable approach and we would love to work with them
to be basically the underwriter on the risk on our platform as well.
You can think of Tapir as like the superset of the insurance business.
Tapir is the marketplace.
And the traditional players that have been here so far, they would be the YB token holders.
They would be the underwriters, right?
They would take one side of the market.
So, yeah, I don't know if that answered the question fully well.
Yeah, I think so.
You know, another thing that comes to mind for me is, like,
Nexus Mutual, in my mind, failed because it was too capitally intense.
And the problem, there's a really hard problem in insurance where you have to charge more than you end up paying out on average.
And to do that, you either need to have extremely diversified risk positions with actuaries behind the scenes. And that's,
you know, even reinsurance, like that's a huge business. That's one of the largest businesses
in the world. It's extremely capitally intense because of this. And in DeFi, the ask is basically basically pay us 13% for a 12% chance that you blow up.
And that seems like a bad deal to most protocols
because not to mention that they're paying in their own tokens a lot of the time,
which causes a whole other domino effect.
But that seems like a problem that Tapir avoids
by just not having exposure to the tokens directly,
just creating a marketplace between participants
that would like to protect against a subset of risk events,
which is not like total implosion of the protocol,
but just a de-pegging of backed of backed assets i mean i would have a couple
points of that i wouldn't say the next mission will fail but they they have a nice product
they're just not growing and i think you touched on the few few points there uh they cannot be capital efficient if their risk would be covered.
There is no, or at least there is not many options for reinsurance,
where they can insure and the only other option is to hold the assets on their balance sheet.
And as you mentioned, if you have high yielding assets on your balance sheet
and you want to insure that, obviously the insurance would need to cost more than that. mentioned, you know, like if you have high yielding assets on your balance sheet and
you want to insure that, basically the insurance would need to cost more than that. But they
could do naked insurance as well, right? They are just taking on the risks themselves, but
then they need to have basically like a really good pricing of the risk, which is hard to define. And yeah, they need to have the whole risk team
can assess the risk.
Yeah, so that's where my couple of points there
is what we're saying.
Yeah, and so how does Sapir facilitate
the pricing of risk between participants?
Like Pendle has your AMM.
Do you also plan to have an AMM, and how will that work?
I assume you let the market find the price of risk, basically.
You might be on mute Marco.
Yeah. So I was just asking if, um, how, how the, how to peer prices risk or allows participants in the AMM to price risk?
Or what's your approach to...
How does the market discover the relative value of YB and DP tokens?
Yeah, basically it's market.
We'll work with partners to first establish the market,
which means just to create an AMM for a particular asset.
Right.
Okay.
Cool.
Well, yeah, I think that without diving like really deep into the mechanisms, because I wanted to keep this as like a sort of a cursory overview. like what else can you say about the protocol?
Like where are you at in development now?
And what other common questions are you getting
that maybe I didn't ask?
Might be losing you on my end. Thank you. All right.
Sorry for the technical. I think that was on my end, Marco. I can hear you now, though.
Okay, perfect. Yeah. So I don't know how much you've heard before. Tell me. We're talking
about the creation of the market.
Yeah. I think you can skip ahead to whatever you're talking about and I'll be able to pick
up where we left off.
Sure.
So I'll just reiterate my last point.
So, yeah, at the creation of the market, the partners who partner with will provide initial liquidity and basically will establish the market at the price they see fit.
And, you know, as with other regular AMM, as people trade, they can trade with the AMM or they can trade with limit orders.
Basically, the price changes in time.
So, yeah, that is the mechanism we'll be using. It will be special
kind of environment because you need to take into account the time value.
That's really interesting.
So the partner protocols are depositing liquidity. So they're basically putting themselves in a position to back their claims that the token won't de-peg.
Or like they're putting up stake basically in their token de-pegging.
Yeah, I mean, there are more types of partners, right?
One, it could be the protocols themselves,
whose token is it?
So they can create a market and make this as a service
to their customers to be able to also buy the D-back protected
or in-roboost version of their asset, right?
Another type of partner is somebody who, you know, believes in Tapir,
wants to provide the liquidity, obviously they are not just doing it for the hearts
and thumbs up, but we will incentivize this with the Tapir token, because as any market,
there is a cold spark start problem that
you need to establish the marketplace you need to establish the initial liquidity
and what the tokenomics part and what token is great for it incentivizes it so like another type
of partner is somebody who believes in peer you knowER, wants to help it out, wants to get TAPEER tokens,
they can provide the liquidity as well.
And so we've been doing some evaluations of tokenomics and we're starting to talk a little
bit about tokenomic mechanisms. What are the mechanisms that are used in to peer
if you're i mean talking about the token because i know when yeah sure for sure i mean yeah we can
we can do broad strokes i think that's that's best for now uh and we have talked about this a lot I don't know who I have worked with you on various tokenomics
keynotes and there are two things with tokenomics basically.
One is can the protocol take fees, right?
Can it capture values now?
And the second one, can it drive the value it captures into the token?
Okay, so these are the two separate things.
In our case, can you capture value?
Yes, we can definitely capture value yes we can definitely get
value since we are creating the marketplace and we we are doing the wrapping and unwrapping the token
so as is kind of industrial standard will take small fee on the on the withdrawal uh
uh 50 basis points or 25 basic points or something, which is reasonable.
So that is one source of revenue.
It's very small, but if you are a marketplace, you can pick volume.
It can add up to a very significant number as we have calculated in our predictions.
So yeah, that's one thing that's the developer capture.
Also, we will...
So that's the most direct way to capture piece
and then how to drive it to the token.
We like the five-minute burn mechanism, so we'll definitely employ that.
Where the fees we collect are basically
collected in some other asset.
When the pool is USDE pool, you collect it in USDE.
If the pool is STE's pool or some E-base pool.
We call it an E-base pool. Kind of nice.
Because by definition, you have really liquid assets
that you can charge fees on.
And so you know that whatever token you can get paid in,
whether that's an LP token of the pool
or the assets themselves,
that they're going to be extremely exitable and liquid.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Exactly.
You know, some tokens, you know, if your whole tokenomics is about a utility token,
yeah, that's kind of unfortunate.
I'm not, I mean, but I think this is a much better mechanism because you are like directly
capturing value from the token that actually has value, right? Like each value or USDC value that
you can actually sell on the market. And then with buyback and burn, you can just buy back your own token from the market, burn it.
And basically, this is what many protocols do.
This is what traditional companies do, like Apple, they do like to share buybacks.
This is a very direct way how to try value to the token.
Yeah.
Yeah, I think one of the things that's done it really well recently has been Hyperliquid,
showing that targeted buybacks really do work, especially when you have real revenue.
And as partial as I am to utility tokens, I think in marketplace protocols,
it makes much more sense to capture value directly. And it's funny, you mentioned like 25,
50 basis points being small, but I'm thinking like, man, the TradFi investors and VCs that are
hearing that are like, holy shit, small. And it's like, yeah, that's a reasonable take in crypto.
And on the defensibility side, this protocol has no competitors, right?
There's nobody else doing DPEG protection at this point.
Cork protocol is the other one that I'm aware of, and they got exploited a couple weeks
ago.
So it's like a clear market.
But yeah, they are very small and they are not like a significant player or they don't have much market share.
Nexus Mutual has had around 100 million worth of coverage but has been struggling to grow.
I thought Nexus was much bigger than a while ago i feel like nexus was in a maybe
i don't know i remember when nexus around maybe 2017 2018 was in the top at least the top 100 i
remember seeing them on the front page of coin market cap um but uh yeah um yeah i think they But, yeah.
Yeah, I think they were bigger.
And this is, I think, one thing is token value.
And the other thing is, like, what is the amount of underlying that they are insuring, right?
Yeah, I mean, in the token... Go ahead.
Bigger in the past. There were really high expectations because in fairness,
DeFi insurance is still one of those products that feels like it should have
product market fit, but people haven't quite figured out how to do it yet.
And that's what I was so excited about when you first shared this idea
for Tapir Protocol.
So I'm as bullish as can be on your approach to solving this problem.
I really, really like it.
Yeah, thank you.
Thank you for that.
thank you for that yeah i mean that's that's why we are doing it i think we believe we have the
Yeah, I mean, that's why we are doing it.
approach and we have what it takes to to really have a product market fit in defy you know to
to have the simplicity you are just buying simple token work and you get the back protection against
everything you don't need to read the fine print right like it's protected
against this but it's not protected against that you buy a single token you don't need to buy like
the protection uh in some extra way you you know like you just buy the dpe version of the underlying
asset that's it right uh you get all the yield with you so i think we have yeah that's i mean if i didn't think that
uh it's that's a good product and and it's a huge market we wouldn't be here today for sure
um so and and where are you at in development these days yeah uh we have we have the testnet deployed and uh yeah currently
i'm working on approaching investors you know just working on the deck and yeah we'll be raising soon
so yeah you guys see awesome yeah go, go ahead. Love it. Soon.
Soon, TM.
Still like, you know, weeks, not months.
Okay.
We haven't been talking with some investors.
Oh, yeah.
Awesome.
Well, how can people reach you if they're interested in participating in tapir either as an investor in the raise
or contributing or um you know as community like what are you looking for and how can they get in
touch yeah a great way is to blow up to p or x it's let me see what is the exact handle.
Yeah, it's the peer underscore protocol from X.
So follow that.
If you want to work with us as a partner,
want to contribute or are an investor
or can connect us with some.
My DMs are open here.
So that's why just DM me, DM me here.
I think that would be perfect.
Awesome.
All right.
I just put Tapir Protocol, tag Tapir Protocol in the comments.
So anyone listening to this can go right there.
It's Tapir, T-I-P-I-R underscore protocol.
And we'll reach out to Marco.
And for us, Token Dynamics,
if you guys are interested in help with your protocol,
reach out to us.
And yeah, Marco, it's been a pleasure.
Thanks for coming on so we could talk about this.
I'm giga bullish on Tapir and really excited to see this move forward.
I'm sure we'll be doing another one of these around launch time.
Okay, yeah, perfect.
Thanks for the opportunity.
Yeah, and it's always great to talk to you.
Great questions.
Yeah.
See you around.
Thanks, man. Catch you later. Thanks.
Thanks a lot. Catch you later. Thanks, everyone. Bye bye.
