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RAC FM meets $BOBBY | Seby & CompoundDAO in da house| AlphaGrowth
Recorded: March 10, 2025 Duration: 1:02:00Space Recording
Short Summary
Alpha Growth is actively driving ecosystem growth through grants and innovative DeFi mechanisms like rehypothecation. The expansion of Compound's multi-chain capabilities and the introduction of structured products like Bobby highlight significant technological advancements. The discussion also reflects emerging trends in decentralized governance and the competitive landscape of DeFi, with platforms like Aave posing external threats. The focus on stable rates and bonds for institutional investors is expected to drive growth in DeFi adoption.
Full Transcription
All right, all right. So we've got Mr. Seby in. Guys, what we'll do is we'll just get this set up.
We'll get the room retweeted. We'll get Seby in. We'll get B-Bans co-hosting. Yes, Seby, mate, I've got your request.
Let's get this shared in whichever channels we can, yeah? And GM, GM fan, by the way.
All right, brother.
You should have a mic. You've probably got the 10-minute walk of she, the 10-second walk of Shane where you can't hear anything, right? You got a mic, brother?
Yeah, I'm here. My bad. Yep. That's funny. I'm going to use that 10 minute, 10 second walk of shame.
Dude, it's awful, isn't it? It's the same whether you're a co-host or whether you come up as a speaker. People are talking and then you've got this like 10 seconds of silence and you're like, what are the seeing? What are the seeing?
Yeah, I didn't know if it was just for me. A lot of these Twitter bugs, I'm never sure if it's like just me, but every time it's never me. It's not only me, it's everyone.
Yeah.
mate when Twitter went down earlier so you'll have been in bed when it went down right
earlier yeah I didn't see I didn't see that now oh bro I mean I shit myself it was two hours
right before the space yeah and I was like what is going on like I literally shitter brick
dude that was like we had like a 45 minute outage in total earlier you know
Oh my god. Well, we're back. We are back.
We certainly are, mate. I'm wondering where B-Bans is. Normally, she might be actually just sending the kids off of school.
But yeah, the clock's changed there, Seby. So the 8 a.m. breakfast show is now like 7 p.m. for me instead of 8 p.m., you know?
Yeah. I needed that hour of sleep, but we are here and we are alive.
Dude, I'm not a fan. I mean, we'll just, I'm just going to DM a few people. I don't know if you want to share this in any of the telegrams or anything.
We'll literally just have like a quick couple of seconds natter before we kick off like properly officially.
But I'm not a fan of this. I mean, I do live in the tropics. I'm not a fan of this changing clocks across the world.
I think we should all just work on a standard time frame and just deal with it.
Trump clock.
Trump o'clock.
Did you hear what he said, though?
He said, whichever way you go, you're going to get people complaining.
Who wants more light and who wants, like, less light kind of thing at what time of the year?
Right? That's what it is, isn't it?
Yeah. It's all a funny joke and a mess.
And I think it's, yeah, I mean, I actually would like to see if...
If we can, like, actually get some sort of, like, changes.
Like, we changed the Gulf of Mexico to the Gulf of America.
Like, we're just grabbing stuff and changing it.
So that would be, that would be interesting.
We changed the time.
Imagine that.
Me, I do not, I do not, I mean, I'm not going to say I'm a big conspiracy book or anything like that.
But I do read a lot of history and stuff.
This whole thing with the calendar and the work week and everything, you know, there's a lot of theory behind the fact that it's like absolute bullshit.
And so are you a follower? Are you a follower of the 13 month rule or not?
I don't know about the exact that I follow, but I definitely know that we're given something that's not like the full story of here's how the calendar works.
You know, calendars by have been changed by king, just like currencies have always been introduced by, you know, new kings or a king.
You know, in many cases in history, calendars were changed.
You know, New Sella, like we have as, you know, culture changes.
We now have months dedicated to certain things.
I won't name any months.
But, yeah, that's what I think is happening.
there's a whole movement behind the like bring 13 months of exactly 28 days back and there's this whole thing about about the sabbath and about the week actually beginning on a sunday and and how like the human body was always tuned in for that particular pattern and then it was disrupted with a Gregorian calendar kind of shit right yeah yeah and i've heard all that and uh
I don't know definitively.
I think if we're all on a more succinct schedule, it's better.
Like, I don't know.
You've worked on a team and you guys are, like, in a routine.
There's something about that pace.
Then you do that across a nation.
That's actually really interesting.
So I would love to...
to see this progress and I would love to see everybody get more rat wheel.
You know, we work on a completely different year.
Like, so in Thailand, in Thailand right now, it's actually the year, I think it is,
2,500 and 57 or 58, I can't quite remember, but
They do a different thing, the way that they do, like the BC over here, they do it on other ancient stuff.
But they do follow, didn't it get me wrong, the nuts, 2025 everywhere else in the world.
But they've just got their like own calendar system that, I mean, it's still the same kind of thing.
It's just that the years are like planned differently because of like Thai history.
They always maintain this.
Like whenever you see the date on your immigration forms,
It'll always be like it's 500 odd years in the future or something like it's kind of weird sometimes
Is that is that where your base is in Thailand? It is me. I have been here for this is me 13th consecutive year now
Whoa
Everybody tells me that I have to go there
I had a real estate startup in the past and the guy that we did marketing with was in Canada the whole time we were running the business and the second
things slowed down he moved to Thailand for three years it was and he loves it now he just bought a house in Canada and has a house in Thailand and it's like awesome so he that's what that's my intro I would love to actually hear more a bit about that
It's, it's, I'll just, well, we want to keep it on track because we've only got roundabout an hour dude, right?
And I was hoping, like, big bands would be in.
I was thinking the room would fill up.
But I'll tell you something about Thailand, you know, it's quite unique.
It's one of the only countries out here that was never colonized.
It was a buffer state between French, indoor China.
And obviously, like, what was ruling like in East Asia, so the British Raj, you know,
you know, had all a Mayanmar, obviously the rule in India back in the day, but Thailand's always like had this like buffer zone status in this part of the world and they've been able to retain a fair amount of autonomy.
they've got a bit of a different like outlook compared to like say the Burmese the Indians
the Vietnamese the Laosians the Cambodians you know for France basically run all of those like for
200 years you know so they've got this very like a nationalistic kind of like mindset
But it's, it's not for some people.
It's not for everyone.
But if you kind of get with the program and you understand it, it becomes quite easy to, like, live with and amongst.
Do you know what I mean?
Sebi, like they've just got a real die hard working in crypto.
Dude, they've just got a real diehard love of their country.
And you've got to realize as well that ties have got this mindset of like ties do what the fuck ties want to do.
So people will come here and they think it's like a bit unruly or it's, you know,
like the look at the traffic and but they don't understand that's how is, that's Thai society.
That is how shit works here.
That is just the function of...
It's mad.
It's like people live kind of like for the day, in the day, for the moment,
like they might die tomorrow and they didn't really care.
Do you know what I mean?
but they've got a deep sense of like tradition buddhism's quite huge it's i've been everywhere i
said me in my life i've been traveling all over the place for like 25 years it's the closest place
i can ever call home do you know that that's what i always say about thailand closest place i can
ever call home bro and i lived in places like australia and that wow seems like they're
pretty inclusive i'm assuming you're a white gentleman and uh
Yeah, not tie.
Oh, mate, I'm as white as a ghost.
I mean, I'll actually go a little bit of a tan off the winter.
I was talking to B-Bans about my white spots.
And when I was in the show yesterday, I was like, oh, I've got a right time.
But, I mean, it helps if you speak a little bit of tie.
If you show a bit of respect, like, it doesn't take much as a foreigner to survive and to survive well here.
But foreigners come here with the mentality is that everything should work like a Western society or the Western way of thinking.
And that is the wrong attitude to live in a far eastern country.
Do you know what I mean?
Sevi, it's just that's not how it works.
Oh, yeah.
Right, mate.
That's very interesting.
Let's get out of business.
I thought I would have had B-Bans.
Yeah.
Finn will be skipping out most of this on the intro.
So I just want to do an official beginning and then we're going to kick off, mate.
I was just trying to get the room a bit fuller and see if B-Bans was in.
But she had a list of questions.
Jesus, I woke up this morning.
Be-Bans is like, I've put a list of questions on Google Drive.
I'm like, whoa, calm down.
You make them may look bad.
But yes, never mind.
Let's get to the intro.
So for everybody in the room, go.
Good.
Good morning, Rock FM.
And it is a good morning for you guys in the US, I believe it.
The clocks have just changed, right?
It is March the 10th, 2025, and this is Rackfm.
And we've got Sebi from Alpha Growth in the audience.
And just to let everybody know, RackFM is actually powered by alphagrowth.io,
who are deal flow experts that offer tools and strategies for crypto ecosystems,
investors and builders to help research, track, manage, optimize, and execute operations all on one platform.
They drive ecosystem growth via grants, bounties and top-tier business development.
They help connect you with partners, other projects, plus they've got access to 3,000 developers,
just wait to look for their new home to build.
They also excel at source and early stage deals with using data-driven algorithms to help match you up with the lead founders.
Main thing is, trusted by compound doubt.
Quick question for you, Sebi.
What's been your journey since you joined Alpha Growth, mate?
Just a little quick little thing on you, if you don't mind, bro,
before we get into the mechanics of what you guys are up to.
So how did you, how did you get an Alpha Growth?
How you founded since you joined the team?
You seem to be doing very well, bro.
Yeah, well, thank you for the intro.
And the way that I got into Alpha Growth was as a founder.
I...
as the compound growth team got the growth program, what is it, I guess, passed in governance.
they reached out and we were reaching out kind of in both ways and saying, hey, I want you guys to
use my software. And this was a video processing software for, it's a corporate tool. Basically,
you plug in what TikTok pages you like, what TikTok videos, like in styles you want to replicate,
and then plug in your company's information so that in
an AI would tell you, hey, go get a creator to make this video with this style, saying these words with this background.
And it was like a creative director, organized all in one, all powered by AI.
So that was used by compound early days, like back in June.
And as they subscribe to that, Brian was like, hey, man, we need a lead marketer.
And that's how I came in.
was, you know, as a service provider, then as a founder, or then as a, rather, a service provider as a founder, then as an employee.
And I've got no doubt, yeah, it's one of the best decisions you made
because for people in the room who are right, you might not know, like alpha growth,
they're really, really going places at the minute.
They're starting to really get a name for themselves.
I think it's the most important thing after they've had previous successes.
So it was a good, good thing to do, Seby.
It was a wise move at the right time for you, was it?
Yeah, I mean, the...
The whole time I had a real estate company back in 2020.
And the whole time I was making money, I was putting it all into crypto.
I was very familiar with, you know, defy in 2020 to 2022.
So being like part of compound was like, oh my God, this is amazing.
Now, the one thing I will say is that, you know, in the time that I went into like full AI mode, like from 2022 to last year, what changed on compound was the fact that rehypification became the new normal.
So other than having to learn like rehypification, I knew what like I knew the defy world.
So it was not really much.
adjusting to you know what I already knew and then taking those you know marketing elements I
what I will say and I had a conversation with Brian the first time like I met him in person
person about this he was like because yeah he was like what you know like what what's what you
know makes you so excited about alpha growth I was like dude I can't think of a better idea like
a down needs something uh
and you can just go say you want to do it for them and make a case for it.
And it's like my biggest complaint in the world.
I want to be effective.
I want to affect change.
I want to be in control.
Everybody wants all this stuff.
And this Dow model is the best way to do it because you're literally getting paid to make a better ecosystem.
And it builds your notoriety.
So I know it's kind of a long-winded answer.
But that's what I really like about alpha growth.
So, this is perfect, by the way, Seby.
So, mate, I want to ask you, I mean, you mentioned DeFi there.
I just want to kind of.
sort of broad perspective from you a lot of people me included think the
DFI is prime for like I didn't want to use the word comeback but you know things
come in waves we've seen the main wave etc we saw DFI take a little bit of a
backseat for a while they're starting to I'm starting to see a lot of bullish
sentiment
in regards to like defy and how we're moving forward with it right so if you were to just give like your general opinion on how you see like the crypto market in relation to like i say defy maker i mean it's never going to wait but i mean you know what i'm talking about you know another defy summer or whatever do you think this is going to happen now sevi given everything we've seen in recent months
It all depends when money gets cheap.
That's like the only time I'm investing is right before money gets cheap.
Like the, and that if we look at Bitcoin, if we look at anything, that's when there's a run.
So now making it makes sense for defy.
With defy, it is the thing, right?
It is the killer app in crypto.
So when money gets cheap, people start to buy a ton, these prices start to appreciate.
Therefore, value has been extremely increased in proportion.
What happens now and what we've kind of set up for in defy and why I think this time is going to be different is because rehypification is so huge.
We have all these CDPs and we have all these...
you know, staked and restaked assets and hell, now we have King Protocol, which, you know, alpha growth is doing growth for.
Like, we are taking on these programs because we know this is this to be a primitive.
It's one of our seven DFI primitives is rehypothication.
So when you mix Jeep money with a ton of additional context from many exploits in many years and months of this defy financial experimentation,
you create a perfect storm for people to lock a ton of assets into a loop and make really big green candles because it's just like consolidating liquidity away from what people are buying and what token goes up, right?
You buy the thing that goes up, you deposit it, you now get stables.
Cool.
Now you have these stables.
That asset is still there.
It's just not being sold.
So, yeah, I think that's what the future of defy looks like.
Why it's going to be big, how it's going to be big.
And then there are going to be things inside of that.
Like, okay, does AI run this cycle?
I think it does a little bit.
But then the next cycle...
where we'll have, you know, regulation and on both AI and crypto,
that's when things will get really cool because Web2 will be incentivized to like really come in that.
But, yeah.
I like what you said about the free money because there's not enough people that are talking about the like the yen carry trade
The game like is over like the days of free money are starting to dry up dramatically and and people don't realize this
This is why you're seeing like huge inflows and the gold and shit. I
Right, so I listened to obviously, you know, we interviewed Eric last week about the insurance and the reinsurance and he was talking about some cold stuff.
I really like these trade five blockers that he was talking about and especially in regards to like a stable yield situation, you know.
And obviously I caught like Brian there talking about this, right?
So, Bobby, I mean, everyone in the room, they're all crypto hard nuts, people on the replayer crypto hard nuts.
Everybody pretty much knows compound, right?
It's along with all of you, it's probably like, you know, the one and two, whatever people think, right, in the DeFi world, yeah?
Bobby was born out of a necessity, sevi, is that right?
So...
You know, is one of the barriers for trade-fye money coming into Defi, one of the barriers is the yield situation.
Institutional investors trade-fi, they love stable yield, they hate instability, right?
But Bobby came out in necessity, is that right?
Yeah, so two things there.
Bobby being a necessity and then what is it that gets stratify into and how does Bobby pertain to that, I guess.
But with Bobby, Bobby solves compound's core problem, which is the number one reason why people don't use the compound solution and go and use some more for AVE and that's borrowing rate.
The borrowing rate gets unstable when there's not enough utilization, or sorry, there's too much utilization and not enough supply in a given market.
So what we did with Bobby, or actually, I'll take a step back for a second.
And the way that you solve this problem is actually by farming your own protocol.
So, for example, if, you know, there's a 10% borrow cost on the USC arbitrum market.
By depositing supply side capital,
lending money into that market,
what happens is you go get that yield,
but then you also drive that yield down.
So what Bobby does is exactly that.
On arbitrum, it looks at the stable coin yields all the time,
and it's just processing conditional position changes.
So whenever it makes sense,
Boom.
Move all the money to the highest yield.
Stabilize that market.
Then Kelp and Renzo don't have to go and unwind their positions.
That is the strategy.
And then,
What was the other one?
Oh my God.
Well, let me give us the lowdown though, but you guys launched on Arbitrum first, right?
But there's plans now to be replicating this, is that right?
On optimism, is that right?
You guys had some meetings, the other in Denver?
Great, yeah, so I'll keep going on that.
We had a lot of amazing conversations, and the current state of, I guess, compound agents...
is that we're going multi-chain, multi-asset, and how that looks is on base.
They want a single asset on the single chain.
So like get another eth or get two Bitcoin assets on there,
and then we can stabilize those markets.
Optimism wants a cross-chain, like a super chain agent,
on unit chain, on base and on optimism.
And then,
Mantle is also in talks with us for an agent as well.
So the goal is that we work with, we make Bobby,
and Bobby sets the framework for, in short,
structured products that give profit to the Dow.
Instead of everybody in the compound Dow,
and I'm glad this is recorded,
all of these people that are giving alpha growth problems in the forum
are people who are, you know, service providers.
But if you look at their actions like Torque or Gauntlet, they have gone and made completely different solutions off of compound.
Like if you care about a protocol, why don't you just make a software, make a DAP rather, that profits the treasury of that protocol, right?
The selfish thing, the right thing to do.
So Bobby is that.
We're making this as a structured product and all of the money goes to compound.
I think it's like 75% of any fee collected goes to the Dow's treasury.
The rest is all to cost for compute and development.
So yeah, that's why we made Bobby.
So it's like stabilizing the market, then allowing us to have this incentive flywheel,
which also ties into a marketing campaign enabler.
So AI...
And I will add one more thing to bring it all together.
It is a bond.
So instead of people just depositing or, you know, buying on the secondary market, you now have the ability to lock Bobby, which allows us to further incentivize locked positions on compound.
Meanwhile, everybody's, you know, incentivizing mercenary capital.
And...
The one point that I forgot before is, okay, how does this get institutions in?
One, you can have more fixed rate if the rates are stable, right?
If you're always jumping in between like 2 and 10%, it's like, okay, you're going to make money there, but that's very hard to manage.
But if there's this mechanism, this automated market maker, Bobby, that is balancing...
a given chain's market, arbitram's markets, we can now make a bond, whether it's Bobby is the bond or whether it's like a USC, C-USDC bonds.
But then now that you can make a new risk profile.
So you have U.S.C.
Bond that investors can buy.
It's yield-bearing treasury or treasury bond.
And now you have an environment where that can make profit, that profit should go to the Dow,
and that TVL makes profit, that profit goes to the Dow. And I don't know, it's a hopeful circumstance
instead of this like, you know, situation where everybody unwinds their positions
because they're unstable borrowing rates.
Sebby, you know something, we've got two, as you can see now, they're a bit tardy, but never mind.
They might not have realized the clock's changed.
We have got two co-hosts in.
I do want to see.
I have got a little bit, little bit of a poignant question since you mentioned Gauntlet, and I was on the space last week.
So I have got a little poignant question for you.
I do want to welcome the co-horse.
So GM Red Eye, thank you very much, brother, for jumping in.
I did invite you.
How did you in Jim?
Jim.
Nice one, bro.
So let me just let you know Red Eye is one of our proper little DeFi Chads.
So I did send, I says, do you want to be your co-hosted here?
Like, bro, for you can.
And B-Bans, we've got B-Bans from the block.
GM, hostess with a moustress?
B-M-G-M.
Oh, you're all right, darling.
You sound a little bit ropy there.
Are you all right?
Yeah.
Um, yeah, I'm fine.
Okay.
Right.
So, Sebi, I mean, I'm gonna, we don't like kind of jump all over the place, but you know, if we've got 90, uh, if we've got 5% input and we get 95% output from you, we're doing a good job.
That's there.
That's what Ragafin wants to do.
You mentioned gauntlet.
Right now, for you guys, with the compound situation, do the biggest threats come from outside,
i.e. places like RV, who we saw like with Sonic, I think what, five days last week.
They did 70 million TVL in five days, right?
Does the threats for you guys at Alfa and running compound, does it come from outside or is it internal with the likes of Gauntlet and the situation that we saw last week?
Where are the biggest threats come from?
I think the biggest threat is like a general Dow narrative because I'm not going to sit here and cast any blame to a gauntlet.
Right.
The beauty of the Dow is that all the decisions are made by all of the Dow in every decision.
So they're doing it the right way in terms of their path.
They're getting things past.
Like I said before.
When you think about something from a like a business perspective,
we were brought to compound to bring a business mind.
So how I see it is my job is to make compound's revenue increase.
I've been looking at other projects on compound.
Say for example, like there's a delegate.
I won't say his name, but he built a project.
Now think about this. Imagine a delegate, somebody who's supposedly working in good faith for the Dow, but
All they're trying to do is make a contango competitor.
We have contango.
We have Kian.
These are great looping products that offer compound.
It's almost like a canonical solution there,
the way that they've worked with us, as what I mean.
They've worked so close.
But why would somebody who wants compound to win go make another structured product,
go make another looping product, go make another vault tool?
Right.
we don't need it right it the protocol doesn't need it and i will say like with era gauntlet is
much bigger than like just its service to compound so i understand why they have that and it also
serves in a need that other vaults don't offer so that's kind of here nor there right with
with gauntlet and error that's a tool for them but there are other delegates and people inside of compound
that literally yell at us saying that we're double spending,
but will propose to the Dow
proposals to get them rich, like, hey, give me a grant to make this looping and vault tool,
even though the protocol already has one with hundreds of millions in TVF.
It doesn't make sense.
And then alpha growth gets yelled at for promoting quote-unquote meme coins.
Some have considered Bobby to be a meme coin, although all the revenue goes to the Dow.
It's like, wait, the selfless people are getting called stupid and selfish, selfish.
And then the selfish people are being praised for being sustainably minded.
And that mentality, right, is what is plaguing compound right now.
It's the mentality that the people who are out of touch,
just because they write words very nicely in a DAO because everybody makes the decision the beauty is also the
the biggest poison that you know we get get into a situation where nobody can agree right so that's if you
go if you want drama go look at the the compound forums right now it is sickening oh we love
Oh my god, it's like there could be a reality TV show about this stuff.
Have you, have you, as an org, have you learned any really valuable lessons from the launch of Bobby?
I mean, is there anything that you guys did that, you know, you're like, oh, we nailed that?
Is there anything like where you went, oh, well, maybe, you know, we would have changed this or we might have done that?
Any reflective thoughts on the launcher, Bobby?
Yeah.
Well, I will make the clear distinction that we're closed to launch.
It seems like we've launched because that's good marketing, I would think.
And that has been what we've learned.
It's the culmination of two learnings.
Co-marketing is the first best way to get attention.
And then two, incentivizing is the best way to create
action and push people over the finish line. And I say that because Bobby is like the perfect
co-marketing tool. It's allowed us to go and do a space with arbitram, a space with chain link,
a space with both of them, go to chain link house, go to Sozu House, talk about it,
go up to optimism, right, and talk to them about agents on compound. So that's been the
takeaway that
We knew these things, but now we're just putting these things together.
And the funniest part is not even to benefit alpha growth.
Like alpha growth doesn't benefit from Bobby other than the pat on the back and the check on the list for making something that increases compounds revenue.
do you know i don't know why i forgot it really hadn't launched i've it's been that there's been that
much there's been that much stuff or like that's all i've been saying on the tail recently
dude you mentioned chain link there very briefly and uh i want to get red iron b bans in for some
questions but what's it like trying to work with an org like chain link like is it full of gatekeepers
is it is it quite an easy org to fit in with or because you guys had them on there on thursday last week right
Yeah, they're really easy to work with.
I mean, I want to take more pages out of their book.
I think that we're still on like a move fast, not a move fast break things, but just a move fast,
an alpha growth.
Like we're all about the bottom line.
We want to move fast.
We want to do great.
I've got one last personal question for you.
Now, I like him on a personal level.
What's it? What's Brian like to work for as a boss?
He seems right on the fucking money when I taught him like pretty much every day.
Like he must be a pretty decent boss to work for, right?
Yeah, like I'm young.
So I have always been extremely conscious
of putting myself, like working for, I've only ever worked for two people.
The last person I worked for, I gave him like half of my money when I exited my real estate
startup so that he could put it into his fund.
Like, these are people I really look up to is what I'm saying, and I'm very conscious
about who I spend my time with in professional settings.
So working for Brian is very, very, very...
I think, focusing.
Like, what is it?
Sobering.
It allows you to focus on,
he allows you and like inspires you to focus on the actual problem.
Like what is it that is stopping you?
Is there a blocker?
Brian saying like that's a non-problem is almost ingrained in my head.
Things I would, I would, you know, stop and like wait and talk to somebody and go ask a question.
He's like, non-problem, keep going.
And he's right, right, in many of these cases.
So it's like having that, I don't know if you've ever had a really, like a teacher you've loved learning from.
And when you're in the test, you can hear their voice.
Like you can kind of talk to the test and it talks back in the teacher's voice.
I have a relationship with crypto and defy.
where a lot of it is Brian.
That noises, that sound, or not noise,
that person is Brian saying, like, think this, think this way.
Because there are these, like, super cool first principles that he brings,
that aren't everybody else's first principles,
that it makes him such a special operator.
And I think that you guys and a lot of people see that on the outside
and as a result of what we've done,
but being part of it and like seeing it happen in real time and come to fruition and being part of one of the people that he's leading to make that happen is super inspiring.
Yeah, bro, there's been quite a few times we've been on the spaces just like on a personal chit chat and he'll bring a viewpoint that like nobody else in the room's kind of brought at that time.
I do want to maximize our time today because for anybody that doesn't know...
Alpha growth are actually working on and involved in some really big things right now
I do want to talk about a couple of those things but B-B-Bans red eye
Let's get the co-hosts in and I mean I know B-bands have questions
Red Eye anything that's got you curious from what you've heard so far on the D5
D5 front
No I'm gonna be looking up
looking at Bobby.
But, yeah, I enjoy, I enjoy listening to this, you know,
the compound and Avae are like a more mature state for DFI that ecosystems like
Cosmos can, I think, learn a lot from.
So just kind of listening to, you know, how alpha growth is interfacing with some
of these major protocols, what their pain points are, what they're looking for, things like
that.
And, yeah.
Yeah, it's helpful to have an outside perspective, someone looking out from looking out or looking from the outside inwards.
Yeah, I just find this fascinating. No questions at the moment. Cool.
How about B-Bans? I know you had some stuff lined up B-Bans. Let's go.
I do have a couple of questions, but I did miss the first like 20 minutes of the...
interview, so I hope that...
The first 10 minutes was just me and Sebi's shit talking, so don't worry, darling, get your questions, and I haven't asked them yet.
You, Gucci. Go on.
Okay, so I'm trying to make sure I don't pick something that is not a good question for Sebi.
Good morning, Sebi.
So my question...
Good morning.
My question is, how does Alpha Growth measure its success?
And what are the key performance indicators?
And does it track or gauge growth and impact in the, how did it track or gauge growth and impact in the crypto space?
Great question.
So for every engagement, it changes.
For example, compound is one or two KPIs that we focus on.
And those are just growth and revenue to the treasury.
And then for say a rocket pool or a Ronan, that's going to be completely different.
Or if it's a, you know, a vault company, that would be completely different because the measure of success for them changes.
How do we track it is all Dune.
Dune, Dune, Dune, Dune.
So for compound, we actually have Woof made us a dashboard that shows...
Hey, this is exactly where compound is.
This is where we would be if Alpha Growth wasn't hired,
because then it removes the TVL from all of the initiatives that we've led.
So you can literally see a line in which compound just like dies into the oblivion of the direction that it was headed.
But Alpha Growth is that, you know, green line that shows like we've kept it on, you know, pace.
So yeah, that's how we do.
Okay, so what are the impacts if like a major client targets aren't met?
And how do you guys like mitigate that?
How do you guys handle that?
Yeah, so on the compound, compound is where I'm going to get a lot of these references from.
It's the account I work on most.
And at compound.
Yeah.
That is the subject of a lot of the forum debate right now is, okay, in the case of our last growth program, we didn't have any of these clawback mechanisms.
And good morning, Brian.
We didn't have any of these clawback mechanisms.
Now the Tao is suggesting that we institute...
a lot of these mechanisms so that, you know, TVL can be clawed back, or not TVL, service fee, service, you know, payment can be clawed back through these era vaults, which kind of ties in what I was saying before about Gauntlets era, this vault product that they have, is different than other vault products.
But yeah, a few ideas there.
Okay, and then I have another question.
So I don't know if this is a good question for you, or maybe it's probably a better question for Brian.
I'm not 100% sure, but how does alpha growth handle client dependence?
A compound is a big client.
And like, you know, I mean, I don't know if you guys, what percentage of revenue comes from these top clients and what strategies reduce the dependence on big clients?
That would be a Brian question.
I don't know if Brian's talk.
Yeah, I can talk.
GM, Jim, Jim.
Jim, GM.
Good morning, Brian.
Yeah.
GM, Brian.
Good morning.
I'd say, I mean, it's going to really kind of, if I give a percentage to it,
it'll tell you exact, our exact revenue.
No, you don't have to give a percentage, but just give, like, you know.
It compounds are our largest client by far, and it's,
I don't know, depending on what this new election goes through or not.
Last year, it's about half.
This year, it'll be more than half of our revenue.
So it's the one that needs the most work.
It has like, we have like eight people on the team where we're going to add like another like, you know, four people, five people.
It really needs, it needs like the protocol needs.
How many chains it deals with and how many assets it deals with?
They're going to like 40 or 50 some assets across like seven or eight chains and then we're going to expand to four more chains.
You're talking about like, you know, it's a pretty wide spread surface area.
It's sonic one of those chains, Brian.
Yeah.
Oh, God. Sonic, Sonic canceled their grant, like the week of us launching. So we built all the code. We have the whole entire thing. And then it was the, so our standard deal is like 10 and 1. So 10 million liquidity bootstrap loan for like the base asset. So like.
just borrow zero interest rate actually we pay you to put the loan on there and then like once the
first 10 million is received then you can remove your own 10 million coming from the foundation it's their
made up tokens so it's like not a big deal and we're actually paying them to put there the first 10 million
there and then one million dollars of incentives and then we bring half a million dollars of
incentives so it's like one and half a million and so like
Sonic said, no, that's too much, but we'll do five and five.
So like five million and 500K, and then we were going to match 250K incentives.
And the week before we launched it, they pulled out and they ended up giving 15 million to AVE,
because AVEPAR was the Polygon TVL, which then kind of started this whole interdispute
between the Morpho Polygon gauntlet deal, which is like,
Norley, because if Sonic didn't pull out,
and Sonic basically told us that Avey promised
in Polygon's TVL.
And then we went to Polygon and Polygon was like,
Yeah, we're going to do the deal with gauntlet and morpho under the umbrella of compound.
So it's very strange.
Whole thing's very strange.
I was going to say, I mean, that exemplifies just how could throw the entire D4, DFI, where everybody's fighting for everybody's dollar, right?
Yeah, and you have to pay a lot of money for dollars, right?
It's like...
I guess it's not too crazy because in the grand scheme of things, it's probably like one to one to two percent cashback rebates.
If you kind of think about it that way, except in defy, they just put those up front.
Right.
So like if you have a cashback card visa or whatever, like they just say, hey, we're going to get you like one to two percent up front.
and yield and then they kind of like mask it as like oh this is 100% APR but it's not really 100% APR like it'll come down to like anywhere between 2 to 7% at scale so it's like you know cashback hey Brian I mean B B B B Bans do you want to follow that up or not because I'm going to pivot a little bit since Brian's here and Sevi's not here for long do you want to follow that up B bands or not
No, no, I'll let you go.
I asked already, like, three questions back to back.
I do have a couple more, but I can wait until...
Oh, you're all right.
No, no, no.
Go on, go on, ask them.
We'll pivot later.
Go on, ask your questions.
Come on.
Now, Brian's here.
I know you've got some serious ones.
Come on, Donna.
No, you can...
I just...
I'm kind of curious.
How do you guys handle, like, competition?
Like, what's your biggest competition and how do you guys handle that?
Obviously, you have competition because you had somebody pull out, you know, from a grant...
in that situation.
But like, what do you guys,
how do you guys handle that?
Well,
I'm going to come in on the back of this
with a little extra caveat
and just say one thing.
regardless of what people see, I'll be very quick, regardless of what people might see it,
there is a need in crypto, in ecosystems for what alpha growth provide, right?
So now that the fact's been established that there is a need for what you guys provide,
exactly what Bavans said, yeah, how do you manage that competition?
I think it's really straightforward.
We have like probably three types of competition.
The first competition is do nothing.
So when we go to a client, they're like, oh, you know, we'll just, we'll just devour our way out of a whole.
We don't need sales and marketing and BD.
We don't need partnerships.
We're building the best thing in the world.
Everybody's just going to want to come to us because our product is so amazing.
So that's competition number one.
Competition number two, internal resources.
So, hey, I hired a growth guy from Web 2, or, hey, you know, this, we hired a marketing person who was at, you know, some other L1 for the last three years.
They're going to be our head of growth.
They're going to be our head of ecosystem.
That's probably our second largest competition.
Our third largest competition in terms of like new entrance.
There's a firm out of Eastern Europe that's doing liquidity deals and they have like a menu price of like.
10 or 15 protocols, they're the closest thing to what we were doing about two years ago.
So I think we have like a window of like two to three years before other companies are doing what we're doing.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Yeah.
So Brian, we found out about that.
Oh, sorry.
Dude, I got to say one more thing.
Our other competition is AA Dow.
that's our other go
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
stop
no i mean like look they they they
that's like what we do
is what they were trying to do or did not and we went
we put a we put a counterparty proposal up that's how i met you guys
I remember I remember I'm sure we'll not lose any sleep over here there
well that's what you're not anymore dude I did at the time losing sleep right now
yeah but you probably could have done a fucking job of distributing the grants as well
at least you wouldn't have had that do you know what it would have happened were you guys
at least you would have been independent we wouldn't have seen norm getting like every
like third grant for bloody
binary builders or whatever.
I mean,
a lot of that money
seem to go in one direction,
Brian.
I mean...
Dude, I heard...
I heard some crazy wrongdoings.
It was, it was wild.
I was like, ah, I wasn't that bad.
And then I was at this event and people were like, it wasn't that bad.
This, this, this happened.
I was like, whoa, I never heard of that that.
It was like, it was wild, dude.
Do you know what?
Do you know the expression, jobs for the boys, right?
So in its original incarnation, right, it was literally jobs for the boys situation.
You know, the way that the, yousef had just been sacked, right?
It just lost his fucking job, if anybody knows.
And you had them all, oh, we need a job for Yousef, we need a job.
Like literally, it's almost like the creator of the fucking doubt.
Sorry, I don't want to swear, but it's almost like the creator of the doubt just to give you a man a job and a nice little salary.
I mean, kind of disqual.
So, you obviously saw the numbers.
Yeah, you obviously saw the numbers.
I mean, they were getting unbelievable money for no work,
some of them, like on the Oversight Committee and things.
That was a scandal.
Yeah, I think it's tough, right?
Because you need a little, like going through this process again in a very much more transparent way.
I was talking to a compound delegate last night.
It's like, why don't you tap the, like, the dev resources in the compound community to build these things?
And it's like, we tried two projects where we try to combine like three different groups, like get like these two parties to work together.
Yeah.
And we put them in the same chat, we said,
here's the spec to build.
And then it was like crickets.
And they're like, well, how much money I'm getting?
I'm like, I don't know.
You tell me how much money you need to build this thing.
And they're like, well, how much money are they getting?
I'm like, I don't know.
You guys figured out.
Figure out what the price to build this thing is.
And so you have like two dev shops or two dev teams that like sit there and you're like,
am I going to get a budget and a price in a timeline?
And then they go, well, I don't know what they're going to do.
I don't know what I'm going to do.
I was like, guys, work together, divvy it up and just go do it.
And they're like...
then i get all these dms i don't know if i can work this way this is not how we work so when you
even when you try to get like community builders to work together they don't know how so you kind
have to for like any single project you kind of have to give it to one firm because like the
management and overhead of like managing two firms basically comes on your plate as like another
whole project management cycle so you kind of uh you know it's like oh let's kumbaya let's all work together but like
It doesn't actually work that way in reality.
And in every instance I've tried.
I know what you mean, Brian.
I've got to say there's a large proportion of RackFM's audience that will kind of have the opinion that a lot of these devs are a little bit self-entitled, these crypto devs.
It's like there is a little bit of it.
I mean, Brian, I actually want to, this is the point I was going to make earlier before B-Bans obviously continued with a line of questioning.
We talked to Sebi earlier about you as a boss, right, and about how he got involved with alpha growth.
No, no, yeah, it's lovely word, lovely words to see about you, but you seem, I mean, you've snared at FM now, but you seem to have an eye for talent.
I said he was explaining how he was like he was a founder before.
Obviously we interviewed Eric last week as well who'd obviously been a founder that you got on the team.
You seem to have a little bit of a nose for talent.
Don't you? Is that what you look for? You look at like people who've already built shit like bring into your team.
Is that is how this is working out while for growth right now?
100% dude it's like you want basically people want to work with talented people that are like fun to work with that are like interesting and in the i don't know if i told you this i got basically five rules for hiring uh the first one is can you do the job uh that's kind of like the most basic if the person can't do the job then you don't hire them that's like
Stupid simple.
Can they learn something from you?
Can you learn something from them?
And then here's the fourth one.
There's five of them.
The last two are probably the most interesting ones.
Could you see yourself working for them someday?
I think this is like a very, very intimate sign of respect.
Like, would you work for that individual?
Like in a flip-sumption scenario?
That's a massive nuance, Brian.
That's a massive nuance, that might.
Yeah, because if you fundamentally don't think you would work for the individual, like in any way, shape, or form, you fundamentally don't respect that individual.
And then that was my four hiring things for a long time.
And then I was working at this investment bank in San Francisco.
And we hired this hippie designer.
And he goes, and the people would come into the door and like talk about the tech or designs that we were doing or whatever.
And then he would be like, I'd give him a hug.
And then I was like, okay.
And then somebody else would come in and is like, I want to give him a hug.
And then so we came up with, I came up with a fifth rule.
Does the thought of giving this person a hug disgust you?
And if the answer is yes, you can't hire them.
I think you add one more rule.
If they walk around with dirty-ass sneakers, you got to be like, hey.
Yeah, they don't care.
You know, as a man, as the man,
As a man, a good watch and a good shoes mean everything.
You can wear Primark, $3 trousers, you can wear a polo shirt from fucking Walmart.
A good watch and a good pair of shoes or sneakers speak volumes, be bands, right, Brian?
100%.
Dude, every time I go against the hug thing, I get burnt.
Yeah.
I mean, like, if I, your body, like, we don't listen to our bodies that much.
And there's like this, like, intricate system of like, ding, ding, ding.
Like the little spidey sense will go off and be like, oh, this person's no good.
And if you don't listen to that.
then, you know, you're just asking.
Well, Brian, when you come to Thailand,
they're sure, mate, didn't worry,
we'll be hugging at the airport,
but you'll have to check your pockets afterwards.
Hey, I know, I don't.
After you hug you, I'm going to be like,
so how did you feel about that?
Yeah, Rebel DeFi had a hug.
Is he still here?
Oh, he's left.
Rebel DeFi was in the room.
Listen, he's been on the motorbike Rebel DeFi with me.
Listen, Seby's got at 9 o'clock, I believe.
And Brian, he held the fort so much.
Yeah, we'll wind it down when you guys go right and keep it out like a short interview.
I always does better numbers, but.
Seby, I know you've got a shoot, bro.
Anything you like want to comment on?
Any, you've been listening to Russ there, obviously very patiently, but dude, you set the show light.
That was a great convo we had earlier, by the way.
Anything you want to be signing off with or whatever?
Yeah, I would sign off by stay in touch in the compound.
Stay in touch with the compound forums.
It's a teapot.
And it's awesome.
And I think that we're also learning a lot from this.
And seeing how right now we're in a historical time in crypto,
I think like whoever captures the like blue chip name,
the blue chip traffic levels sets themselves up for like unimaginable wealth.
in the future like controlling a avay entity or having a being a major shareholder per se is a
superpower right having lending in defy is super powerful and i think that uh a lot of our efforts have
been selfless to the compound dow and i'm excited to stay on that side of history
And I don't care where that really takes us.
But I think that's the right side of history to be on.
Brian has always said, as I've been part of the offer growth team, we're the good guys.
And all you have to do is show up, do good work, and be a good person.
That is that.
And if you show up in this industry and you go to the Dow in good faith and you are a good person
and you carry forth a brand of...
accountability and action in that direction of course you are setting yourself up for the the perfect
future and so brian thank you for making that the the brand that that i've been able to put myself
behind and rack for spreading that message and sharing those values um so yeah i'm excited to
take on monday we have a big day ahead of us and thank you guys
No worries, Sebi. I like, he resonated with me, I'll be quick, Brian, he resonated very strongly with me there because I'll tell you what, you know, the minute that you put a name out behind you and say like, oh, Rack FM powered by Alpha Growth, everybody, you know, your typical audience, I want to be, well, what are you getting out of it? What are you getting out of it? And it's like, I remember the words of JFK, right?
Think not what alpha growth can do for what alpha growth can do for you but think what maybe you can do for alpha growth
So if ratfm plays it's like little part in the big machine in the cog and
then I think we're on the right track.
So, like, I'm just going to make that statement
because we have had queries,
we have had, you know,
people like tanking that in, challenging us and like,
why is this every day?
Like, blah, and it's like, well,
maybe we're looking at a long-term, like, time frame.
Maybe we're not looking at today.
Maybe we're looking at,
you're not 18 24 months down the line uh brian i know you've got a nine o'clock but there's very
big plans i mean you guys are working with you i believe you need chain you're working there
with ronan there's going to be some huge stuff this year in the pipeline right dr pepbee dude
oh yeah tomorrow tomorrow yeah i can't wait for bansas ready for dr pebbier.e how cool dude
i'm looking forward to this
Look, there's these projects that are just like super weird and esoteric and like, look,
it could be like nonsense and it could be like dead in a couple of months or you're literally
talking Dr. Pepe and it's going to figure out like how it's going to cure one of your,
like your knee cancer or something.
Dude, it's insane.
It's insane what they're doing.
And it's, uh, it's very cool.
And they're like the, the AI is generating and hallucinating, uh,
potential like drugs and cures.
It's really wild.
Brian, I've probably done more,
I've probably done more research this weekend on Ron and Dr. Pepepe than I've done
on crypto in the last like 18 months.
Tell me.
Yeah, Ronan will be fun.
Ronan is like, dude, Ronan's like integrated everywhere in Southeast Asia.
It's pretty wild.
They got on ramps and off ramps and people can like pay each other Ron at the store.
It's pretty wild.
And have just dropped the tester of the new game.
You've got Ronk that's like, obviously, their base like meme coin.
I'm telling you, people are sleeping on Ronan right now.
People are sleeping on Ronan.
But Brian, you've got to dive as well, is that right?
You've got to...
Thank you.
No worries. We'll wind it down. We're going to spin up guys and unrecorded, a typical normal rack FM, but I just want to thank Brian and Sevi and say, what a show.
We only had an hour. We had that much to cover. You know what it is. We're rack of them. You know what you get. We do what we see on the tin. B-bands, Red Eye. We spin down and spin up a new show, yeah?
I'll move.
And the recording, yeah.
See you guys on the dark side. We'll be live in about two minutes, probably less than, all right? Take care. Watch what you're doing. It is the 10th of March, 2025. This has been Ragafm. Good day to you as all. Watch what you're doing. God bless wherever you're on the world. Bye-bye.
Speaker
bryancolligan
from
AG Product
