Well hello scientists it's August 24th 2022 this is updates from the lab a Twitter space for osmosis the interchain amm and we're gonna get started in just a moment well hello
Hello scientists. Hello. August 24, 2022. Hey. Sorry about that. A little bit. We just went interdimensional there for a second. How's it going, sonny? Good. Good. How are you guys all doing? I'm hanging in. Got a mile.
my grain but other than that doing well. Thank you. Yeah I've been pretty well. I'm in a croix-shar right now. I'm this beautiful view while I'm
taking this update so I can't complain. Wonderful. Croatia is a place I've been to once and really enjoyed the whole game of Thrones 5. Yeah they really
Especially if you go to like southern Croatia they would like really lead into it but I call it a little bit over touristy now but I'm in northern Croatia now it's a pretty small town actually so one of my friends I think is family lives here. Nice. I was gonna say the north
there is maybe that's more house of dragons territory. I haven't seen the new episode yet. I have you? No, I haven't either. This is all aspirational. It's pretty good so far. So far.
Awesome. That's good to know. I will check it out. It was pretty groundbreaking. I just don't want to get my heart broken again. Yeah, that ending part was just... I mean, we've all participated in consensus. It's not like that.
Alright, that's a weird spoiler alert at the end, but anyway. Well, happy to hear that you're in a nice picturesque vacation spot and seems like there's been quite a bit of stuff bubbling up and happening.
I did want to just quickly mention that on August 26th this Friday there's an Osmos support lab town hall scheduled for 10 a.m. Eastern time 2 p.m. UTC in the Osmos discord. So anyone who's curious and hearing about what they've been
they're upcoming funding proposal and if you have questions ideas or feedback please tune into that on Friday. Well yeah that sounds great. Future of discussion, discussion, invigorating discussion about
on Twitter. So we're good to have a nice, synchronized assembly menu as well. Yes, absolutely. I think it's good that even before the town hall that people are jumping and asking questions, it helps to get the motor running.
Yeah, definitely. Well, so I don't know, what are some of the exciting things that you've been following in, also as a plan? Well, okay, so this is a question that's left that's that's came
up last week I think and or whatever it was on off week and the guy said I'm excited for osmosis spaces today would love for sunny this isn't exactly osmosis lands so maybe we'll hold on to this later but it's a bigger question about I would love for it sunny dish
share his thoughts on the merge, specifically moving to proof of stake or large US validators like Coinbase with sensor transactions at a block producing validation level. I feel like this is a big moment for the space. Maybe a UASF user activated soft fork. That's not a direct osmosis thing, but it was something someone asked to
Yeah, I'm sure everyone has heard about the tornado cash being out of the U.S. sanctions list.
ground breaking precedent or just like, cryptocurrencies or just like sanctions law where, you know, I think the first time that not a user or individual, not an individual or entity with that and the sanctions list, but like a piece of code with
added to the sanctions list, which is kind of a, you know, definitely very precedent setting. And I'm sorry, there's a lot of un clarity within in general around it. But yeah, so, but that obviously has like triggered this question about like, hey, our
And it's a really just a proof of snake thing, right? It's also a minor, I think some mining pool even on a barrier right now, like don't process transactions that originate from any address on the sanctions list.
And I think there's a question of how far our validator is going to think it. If validator refuses to create a transaction, are they going to refuse to propose blocks with transactions from sanctioned addresses?
Are they going to refuse to vote yes on blocks with transactions from absentient addresses? Are they going to refuse to stop processing the chain from addresses that have like
I think there's a little bit of an overreaction from a lot of the crypto space right now where a lot of people are kind of going
Maybe a little bit over above and beyond what is necessary like you know there's certain Requirements that like are supposed to be done to like comply with US sanctions law But a lot of like projects are like you know kind of Going way above that like front ends. I've been blocking any address that has been sent
money from a slightly, I just never interacted with tornado cash. And I think that's like, definitely, you know, taking the most, you know, a very heavy handed view of the sanctions law. And I think that doesn't
I think a lot of these sanctions stop when we played out in courts over the next couple of months or even years. I think the biggest thing is that we shouldn't be giving in to the government who wants to build in censorship systems.
I think that even in Ethereum we're not going to see like mass scale censorship and users are just going to delegate away from the validates who like start to do like do censorship. Okay. Yeah, it's a I agree that it is
It's basically very complicated right now. It's hard to coordinate around it because there are people who have such strong reactions, people are afraid of consequences. But like you said, that sort of... I mean, there was a discussion about this on Reddit. And I actually appreciated it even though it got a little bit petty.
There's a granular aspect to this and the really broad stuff of like you said, anyone who's received a dime from an address that used tornado cash being roped in just seems so broad. I don't know. It just seems like city who's like they don't have the timer bandwidth to actually do it.
anything discriminating or discerning about, you know, actual criminal actors and stuff. And that just sounds, it seems lazy. I would say it's like an extraordinarily lazy kind of binary like your guilty or not move. It's definitely cool. Yeah, it's a very lazy approach of life.
know, oh, we're not going to figure out how to like effectively like comply while keeping like a lot of the purpose of what we're doing. And so we're just like, yeah, it seems like a very lazy sort of reaction to the situation. I mean, as to like
what they should do, I don't know. I don't know how they could, you know, if anything could be done to make it more tart, like you said, accurate or something, I don't know, but like, if that something could be figured out to avoid this kind of broad brush approach, I think.
I think it would be better. So, I mean, you know, we've been chatting a lot with Boyd team recently about, obviously, this is top of my team for them as well. Yeah. We have situations where developers are getting arrested. You know, they're also very a little bit trying to figure out
what their next steps are and how to go about this. And we've been floating around a couple of ideas of like, in general, I think that if you think about the reason this tornado cash was gone after so hard was like North Korea basically longer than $1 billion through.
And that would, that's what got like, you know, the government upset. And that, you know, how can we build systems to like, you know, impinge, you know, proper use of the privacy features while, you know, still keeping these things like,
So we've been discussing with the team different mechanisms of going about it. One thing that we were thinking of was, hey, is there technically a way for governance to de-anonymize certain transactions?
have like, you know, I imagine that look, if there was a billion dollar hack on Osmosis and the hacker like put it through void, you know, there maybe would be a, governance might want to choose to like be able to de-anonimize those transactions, right? And like, you know, I think obviously the standard of like what should be the
Hello, I think you broke up for one second like when you were saying how we should determine what should be de-enonymously. Yeah, so I mean I think it will come up. It will be up to governance and like
like how to make those, you know, they'll have to be a process to figure out what the bar will be. But I think that's like, you know, I think that's one thing that could potentially help solve it. The other is like, you know, just, like, you know, restrict
But we lost you again. You said the other thing is restricts.
All right, we got a return to this because I really wanted you with this answer. But you can name it out. Hey, Sonny, you cut out when you said the other thing would be to restrict and then it cut out.
Oh, sorry, my sister is calling me. That's why she's cutting me off. That's understandable. So what I was saying was, yeah, so, yeah, so you know, governments will have to decide what that borrowers.
for how to go about it is, you know, what is the purpose of the privacy on us Moses? You know, we're not trying to build this like decentralized mixture and stuff. You know, I think for us Moses, we have a very specific
specific use case of privacy, which is we want private trading, right? Today on every decentralized exchange, you're leaking your entire trading history. Where any account can basically say that like, hey, you can go see that like, hey, this address is making this trade, this trade, this trade, this trade
You can't see which account each trade is coming from. But on the central exchange that's completely visible and people can just like our copy trade deal or steal your trading strategies and stuff.
the goal of why we want privacy on our spaces. And so there's ways that we can actually do this where we can modify the circuit in void or to basically, hey, instead of being like, maybe you can't do transfers in the system.
I think there's a lot of design space of like, hey, what can we do to actually address the underlying problem? And I would assume that most of the most awesome holders and also it's governance. They don't want to be helping North
Right now, privacy is pushed as like, hey, it's just like super scary thing. There's no reason. The only reason you possibly need it is for money laundering. And I think that's the narrative that we need to shift. And that comes with building the architectural changes needed to--
Push, you know, agree with that narrative. You're preaching to the choir here. I love this approach. I think it's, yeah, it's wise and yeah, it sounds like you're doing good, good work with void, trying to hash out a path forward.
Yeah, I think the void team has been very, you know, they're very much on the same page where like, you know, they understand why why privacy is important and why we're doing this and then, you know, making sure, you know, we can ship the product that's actually useful to users and it's a question of like not having any having this like sort of
middle ground of like privacy versus like nothing at all, you know, I think it makes sense to do the, you know, ship whatever we can safely. You know, it's a tight rope to kind of balance on what you're talking about. On the one hand, we want to preserve
users' privacy for very good reasons. But on the other hand, we want to prevent actual bad actors from stealing money from legitimate users. There's something to be said about the Google mantra of, "Don't do it." The reason the whole
narrative has shifted around this full narrative is about money laundering through it's initiated by the Ethereum merger right like this wasn't really such a big topic of conversation when eth was on
and proof of work. So the Google motto of don't do evil is kind of-- I know, we need to-- sorry. Yeah, I'm just thinking about how Ethereum
move from proof of work to proof of stake. And there's more, it's like, sensorability inherent to the system now, because they're the pivoting to this more permission system. You know, and that kind of I'm not sure.
I don't actually agree. I feel like there's the conflating this with the merge seems like, you know, people just took two things that seemed to be happening in the same time frame and like, you know, trying to conflate them or like link them together in some way. They are proof of work mining tools that are also censoring sanctions.
I don't think it's actually that different from the proof of work versus the proof of state system. The difference would be if one third of Ethereum validators decide to not vote on loss of happens actions.
I don't think anyone's actually been discussing that so far. Most of this has been around. Even the mining pools that have been doing it have been just not proposing blocks. But they do vote on the ones that have sanctions and addresses.
Well, I mean, the question is how do we think about this in the cosmos context? You know, because that Ethereum is just more visible because it's a bigger ecosystem. And that's why they're positioned to talk about this particular thing, but it applies to us as well.
How we build a system where we preserve privacy without enabling North Korea, basically, to land our money? Yeah, and I think that's why, like, for osmosis. Like I said, I think we have a very specific use case of privacy on osmosis.
And I think we should be building our technical architecture to meet that use case rather than this generalized use case that has a lot of legal risk. When we could instead be focusing on, hey, let's build the
the thing that's more scope to our use taste and actually carry much less legal risk. And then, you know, we wait for, you know, seeing how things develop in, you know, courts and stuff. And like, you know, I just think this was, this was like too big of a reaction so early on.
like it just been like you know a week or two since they're about to happen and there's just so much lack of clarity right now. Yeah I think that's fair I mean I understand what would I think I just want to do the same but I just want to be clear about like your point Sunny that this is not just how
happening on proof of stake, like looking at our Reddit thread here, this is from Mountain Rabbit saying that OFAQ sanctioned Blender, which is a crypto mixer on Bitcoin on May 6th for processing like, I don't know, 20 million from this same group. They also sanctioned
And this thing called helix, which is an underground tumbler for Bitcoin. So there's like, it's happening on proof of work chains as well. It's happening in various, you know, I don't think this is isolated, just a proof of stake, although that might, and we may have some particular, I don't know, vulnerability.
So the vulnerabilities or specific approach to it, but I just want to make that out there. The difference is that on Bitcoin, it's higher level applications that are outside of the consensus protocol that are being censored. Obviously like a mixer, right?
So, but then what we're talking about with Ethereum is censorship at the consensus level. So that's kind of, you know, more dangerous when we talk about that. >> Right. This is my claim as well of that because the use case of osmosis is more scope.
than what Ethereum is. It's more similar to Bitcoin, where it's like an op chain. I think that allows us to be a little bit more finding middle ground on what's possible rather than having to go to the extreme.
Right, so we're not in such a precarious situation as you do them too. Yeah, I think that means that we have more design space that we can explore. And so just so I thought
understand this, the fact that it's at the consensus level and that like you're saying, sunny, that the Osmosis is better parallel to Bitcoin and being an app chain, but that is that, is there any way to kind of boil that down a little bit more for people who don't fully understand the difference there?
Yeah, the example is like, you know, what I just mentioned about like, hey, we have a specific use case that we need problems before, which is private trading. We can actually, you know, build that without needing the ability to like do private transfers.
that's not, you know, enabling private transfers isn't, you know, the purpose of osmosis, right? We're not trying to build a private, you know, transfer system. There are people in those who are building private transfer systems, you know, like ANOBA,
They're building these things, but that's just not what we're trying to build. If we remove that from the scope of what we're building, we remove a lot of legal risks as well. And focus on the things that we actually need to build.
The other thing is, let me see if I understand this correctly, is if someone like North Korea wanted to launder money through Osmosis because of the limited scope of the use case, it's not even part of the sort of application logic, right?
So they wouldn't really look to use osmosis as the most viable product to do that. Yeah, like if if something like boy had the ability to let's say de-anonymous transactions via government use for someone who's a drummer.
money laundering probably not or like in the option true if like you really just can't even use it for private transfers would would someone use it for money laundering? No, it can't use it for money laundering right? Like we should just focus it on like for the use case that we actually needed for.
Yeah, I like that. I mean, it's like a preventative measure. It's like there's a tit for tat here. If you decide to exploit this, we have a, you know, a backstop.
Yeah. I think it's like you walk into a convenience store. Are you gonna rob it? If you know there's security cameras everywhere, you can't get to the tapes. I don't know. It's that kind of, I'm trying to come up with an analogy, but it makes sense to me.
Well, I guess, you know, some other stuff that's been going on, I think people may have noticed that they suddenly got like some tokens that magically appeared in their account in the last couple of days, last week or so. So it's been a long time
But the rec drop distribution process has finally, you know, so basically I think on the telegram and a couple other spots is then a you know people who've shared the data of like how much each address is gonna get from the rec drop and then it's based on what we have
which pools you were LP-ing in at the time and how much was that we've taken from each pool. So we've actually now have distributed the tokens. Everyone's a rec drop of mounts for every token except Osmo, Adam, USD and Polina.
And basically, you know, we're working on acquiring the assets needed to distribute the item and off mode, but all the other assets have been distributed. And then the UST and LunaC, they have, you know, given that they're not, you know, we could go ahead and acquire these assets from the world.
But basically, you know, UST and Lena Cion also, since it's currently like disjoint from what's available on Paraclastic right now because Paraclastic still has an activated the IDC channels as necessary. And so what I think is that, you know,
What we're going to do is instead of that, we're going to distribute the Osmo equivalent of the U.S. T. and Lundician stand. So I think that will be better for everyone. I assume the backdrop recipients would also prefer to just receive more Osmo rather than useless Lundician U.S. T. Seek.
So, yeah, so, you know, the rest of the restaurant with the Osmo app and Adam should be coming in the next few days. Most of the finds that have been distributed so far have been the ones that were like returned by the, by the sort of,
like the expoiders and so the rest of the funds are being hovered by the foundation and so this is some legal stuff we have to go through to make sure the foundation gets the chance for the asset from the foundation to the rest drop of the zone. So yeah, so you know expect those to be coming very soon as well.
One other thing is we did set a cap on any address that received less than 50 cents worth of a rep drop. We just excluded those from the rep drop for now just because otherwise it would be a lot of transactions on the chain.
People really feel very strongly that they really want their 50 cents worth of rep drop. We can figure out how to do that. Unless there's been a lot of event for that. They save a lot of time and less spam of the blockchain to not to shoot those. That sounds fair.
That, some of that reminds me there was another question from the community on this kind of related dysluna thing. So I'm just going to throw it out there. They said, now there is another Terra Rebels team who is trying to keep alive. The old chain, staking and burning should start in three days from now. Can you please inform about it?
and see if Osmos' team can contact them and collaborate to reopen IBC. Yeah, so, you know, I've had a couple of programs back and forth with some folks from that project. You know, I've shared with them the sort of, you know, step
that would be needed to reactivate it and they sort of said that they'll get back to us on picking out weirdes on their priorities as well. So if people want to go, you know, consider strongly encouraging them and asking them to prioritize opening these ideas to the channels.
you know, please do that. We're happy to provide the technical support for it and like help on like what needs to be done, but our team just doesn't have the capacity to like coordinate it and like do all the work for it. So, you know, it really will be up to the, you know, yeah, so, you know, if you have contact with them or you're part of their community, please encourage them to.
help all of these channels again. Okay, thank you. Ball is in their courts. Bug them. Yeah, you know, we shared with them the sort of code changes that we made on the Osmosis side, you know, and they just have to sort of replicate those changes on the tarot classic change to to do it as well.
Sweet. We do have the ecosystem grants here today with a few grantees. Are there more, any more updates that you wanted to highlight, Sonny, before we talk to them? I guess one other thing was, yeah,
people maybe have saw that the front page of Osmosis website has had a slight redesign to it right now. So you can, you know, this swap widget has become a little design refresh as well as you know, we fixed the slippage as we talked about a couple weeks ago.
And you know the swap widget is takes up a little bit less space on the front page to make space for New stuff to be added to the front page pretty soon for people to probably guess what kind of things are gonna go there, but yeah, so you know
We were definitely going to make the front page of Osmos a lot more powerful. Yeah, I love that development that y'all did with the front end team and everybody. It's very elegant UX. I know I'm just blowing smoke here, but I posted a clip
about I think from that episode where you mentioned it and I hadn't realized it was already in place but yeah if you guys look at this swap widget now like I don't know to me that really really amazing UX and UI design is it's so good you don't even notice it but well played
Thanks. - Hey, Peter Ricoh.
Hey everyone, welcome to the old set of recon. Good to see you.
So what's going on in the Asmosis grants program?
Yeah, sure. So yeah, today we published a retroactive blog post that goes into like what the OGP has funded since inception, which was a little over three months ago. And like we break down funding by batch.
category contributors and all this fun stuff. And we also highlight some of the projects we'd like to fund over the next few months since a lot of the existing RFPs are being worked on already. So we use this post as an opportunity
opportunity to come up with some new RFPs and highlight them for the community. I encourage everyone to check it out. You can find it on our website, under the blog section, as well as on our most recent Twitter thread, which summarizes the post.
And yeah, I can also briefly mention
our latest batch of grants, which includes like grants to margin to deploy their perpetual protocol and their governance contracts on osmosis. We also funded you almost to increase the features available for osmosis users.
Another interesting one was Pine Street Labs, which is building support for osmosis in their initial release of wallet OS, which is basically a technical backend to extend wallet functionality for enterprises and custodians to attract
more institutional investors to us Moses. And yeah, I know we have some of our most recent grantees on here today. So yeah, we'll be great to hear from them as well. Awesome. Is there any kind of hint you can get from the blog post?
about what you're looking for in the new RFPs. I mean we can obviously just look at it, but if there was anything that you wanted to share about that. Yeah, sure. So of course like apps will remain a key focus going forward.
to extend the core functionalities of osmosis and funding apps that leverage its product suite will be a big focus going forward. And yeah, infrastructure definitely another one, particularly making osmosis more
composable by creating additional avenues for other chains or zones to integrate with the AMM will be great for us Moses as well. And then yeah, there's a bunch of tooling that could be built as more and more doused the proanos Moses like it's important to make sure they
and keep operating effectively and efficiently and securely. And yeah, and there's this new grant like RFP category. We'd like to, we'd encourage applicants to apply for, which is research and there are a bunch
of interesting research initiatives that could be worked on to identify you, like revenue generating opportunities in the future and help, like, think about the long-term success of Osmosis as well. And this includes stuff like LP incentive optimization and
research on osmosis, MEB and Dow organizational research and all this kind of stuff. And we've added all these new RF RFPs to the list as well. So people can check them out and see if there's anything interesting they'd like to work on.
Awesome. Thank you for for going over that for those of us who can't read or I mean we'll look at it. I'm just being silly. That sounds like a good a good set of targets for for people to
to contribute through the grants program. So is Todd there? I know Todd was the last time we, I guess last month he was on board and we didn't get to talk to him from from block pain. Can we, shall we start with you or are you
you uh wait you're not at it yet when you're ready whoever's ready I guess we have yield mouse hey guys can you all hear me yes uh as my
I can hear you also. I got you here to Todd. So whoever. Todd, go for it. Todd, let's rock. Hey, thanks for having me. Yeah, welcome.
So yeah, you know, kind of funny. I actually was entirely done with it about a week after it got approved.
I just need to get through the process of finishing up the process of claiming. So what is Tinder duty?
When I first started validating, I looked at the various tools out there and there really wasn't anything that watched
for missed blocks per se like traditional monitoring tools. So, you know, that that was Tinder2DB1 and it was really super basic. Just subscribe to the web socket and look at each
block and if it didn't see the signature from the validator, it would send a message through page duty. And so what we were able to do on this grant is extend that out.
actually have a whole bunch of functionality like watching node health is my node thinking put a dashboard on it and use
Discord or Telegram. It's just a whole ton of features that we were able to add to it. I think it's a lot of little utilities and tools
and tend to do this always been like the one thing that I'm kind of known for and the cost of those space. It's funny because originally it was like 200 lines of code but it's expanded quite a ways from there.
Awesome. I'm glad that the grant allows you to beef it up. Yeah. And now there's more stuff going on right now. One of the things that was requested was the ability to grid both layers
load a config. And so I built some features into it to allow encrypting and decrypting a config and passing in a password to handle that via environment variable.
And the reason for that is actually so that it's easy to deploy on a cost. So it will turn out to be about $2 a month to run a tender duty on a cost. So that's really cool.
think that's gonna be useful to a lot of people. That's great. Yeah, I was going to ask you why would you want to remotely load a config and you nailed it. So really nice to hear about this. Yeah.
Thanks for the opportunity and I'll give somebody else a chance to talk about their project here. Thank you Todd. Thanks for coming on board. You're most are you are you ready? Yeah, sure. So talk to us about what you're working on and why?
First, thanks for the grant. We definitely appreciate it. We put a lot of work into it, a lot of sweat, blood and tears. We sort of got two things going on right now. First is, well, I guess the general premise is, you know,
trying to use Auth Z module within the customer's SDK that allows users to grant very specific permissions to another wallet to be able to perform permission to actions on their behalf. What does that mean?
grant yield most permission to claim staking rewards and then delegate them back to a list of validators. And then that sort of sort of the first thing that we came out with and then probably a six-ish
6-ish weeks ago maybe we also launched LP pool compounding on osmosis. So you don't have to give up custody of your asset. You don't have to unbound from a pool and then hand that over to a yield most right. You can just delegate these permissions using the OLC module.
that allows you most to join a pool on your behalf with your assets and then bond those assets to a bonding period that you specify. And we've been working on making that stable and scaling that. Probably getting ready to move that from alpha into beta very soon.
So yeah, those are sort of the two things that we have brought to osmosis and why? Well, we saw, we all sort of, we all started to deal almost before all this happened, but we all saw what happened to Celsius and Voyager and H3C and all those other
custodial services that take your money, promise you a yield, and then they might or might not pay out. And you have no idea what they're doing with your money. You have no idea how you're actually earning yield. This sort of goes beyond that too, right? I mean,
you look at some of the more traditional defi like urine, it's the same thing right? You have to hand over your assets to a smart contract, you have to hand over your assets to an organization and they then do things on your behalf and when they have control over your assets they can do whatever the hell they want with them right? They're going to find
I promise you that they're not going to do X or Y, but we all know that things don't always work out like that, right? So hoping to be able to, you know, kind of walk back on sort of what's happened in crypto, which is handing over custody over your ass.
other people like with Ozzy now there should be absolutely no reason for that type of thing right because we should be able to create a system where where you can delegate permissions to to another organization to another person and they're able to do those
very specific things, right? And I think we're all might not might think that this is sort of a foreign concept because we're all used to giving up our custody to another thing, right? But when you think about, let's say a Google document, right?
When you create the Google document, you can give someone three different permissions, right? Owner, editor, or viewer. Depending on what permission they have, depends on what actions they can take with that document. And you can sort of extrapolate this to like all aspects of life, right?
It's a great access to buildings, pass codes, parental controls on TVs and tablets. It's all over the place. It's time to bring into crypto. >> Dude, I have this in my household based on how ice cream is divided between me and my wife. >> Tell me more.
Oh no, it's just that like if you're going to eat a pint of ice cream, you have to leave half for the other person unless they... What I don't want to say is that people draw boundaries. Not everything has to be a clear, like it's yours or mine.
I was being a little bit facetious, but I agree 100% agree with you that this is not a weird or foreign concept. Thanks. I'm glad to hear that.
was one, I had one question about the first part when you were talking about the, with the old most, you don't, you said something about how you, you don't have to unbond the LP pool first. This is just like a practical thing. Like, do you have to, because then when you describe it, it sounds like you do have to give
delegate to permissions and then Yolmos, you create the LP. It's not like you can take it if you have an LP position now and hand it. Absolutely. That's exactly what you're doing. You're handing over the management of your current LP position over to
the field most through the delegation of those specific permissions. >> Awesome. That's great. That makes it super easy. It's really good UX user experience so that people can just start doing it whenever they want to.
Absolutely, and you can turn it off too at whatever you want. There's no commitment. There's no fees being charged right now. It's completely free service. In exchange, we ask for feedback. We want your feedback and we want your ideas. We want people to come and present us with
This cool yield opportunity that involves 17 different steps like I want I want people to come and talk to people things like that Awesome Yeah, and is this functional now? Yeah Great so have at it folks. You know for
There's been there's miss out hiccups here and there but we've we've worked through a ton of bugs ton of edge cases and scaled it to about 400-ish users at the moment I want to say so so we're getting we're getting ready to move it to beta
This is great. I just added Nate who looks like you're also with you most if you wanted to add anything Or no, sorry, you'll maxi totally different my bad sweet. Yeah, if folks have questions
for the Yolmos team to hang around. And I think we should, or our son needs, and else have questions or stuff they want to ask of a block of Todd or Yolmos.
Okay, take that as a no, unless, unless. What about the good folks, uh, modules? Yeah, okay, let's go. Let's rock it, Margin. Thanks for being here. Sorry. Well, I'm sorry, but you're last. There's nothing wrong with that. Sometimes you say the best for
Thanks for your last. Welcome. Hi everyone, Max from margin. The TLDR of margin is we are building generalized margin engines for Cosm wasm networks and our first product that we want to bring to market.
So I would assume most people know what some petrol's are but they're, you know, they're non-expiring derivative contracts for crypto assets. I guess on the centralised exchanges it can probably find some loan crypto assets as well. But obviously we've
proper crypto heads, so we think that they should be on chain of centralised but that's sure to do. And our grant from Osmosis is around helping us bring our governance contracts more quickly to to mainnet. And so that's what we've been doing.
Kind of keeping it otherwise simple is so the architecture of our our our perpetuals are using a van in our sort of V naught that we have some ideas on how to make that more efficient like how to grow liquidity with the open interest and also to add like maybe more GMX style
So, price discovery and market making as time develops, but that's obviously all in the works. So for our VNOR minimal verbal product that we should hopefully have deployed on Osmos' main net as soon as humanly possible, we've actually literally just got
So things are ticking over quickly and quite happy with that so it's not completely sudged for one of a better word and like you can tell they really looked into it, it's always nice. And yeah we've also got a testnet live, it's actually on Junos, testnet and it's over to our website.
website and go and play with it. But someone did actually build a massive position and use all the liquidity at state and it may have actually been me. So it's going to be surprising when the candlesticks are quite extreme. So yeah, I'm not really sure what else people would like to know. I mean, I guess, prepare
I have a question about what we have an interest in perpetual. I was just curious how are you going to decide on which
tokens you're going to support. So this is a great question. I would almost say you're a plant. So in our, I say being using the belief, like in our initial state, we want to deploy, we want to be like the potentials for the native tokens of each
one. So one was Moses, one Osmo, one Juno Juno, and like kind of the sort of the thesis there being like the anti-actrient thesis in a way. So someone's always just gonna shout at me but like that okay I'm token hall token ex. I'm on so I obviously have I have my tokens on L1
So like I would probably want to hedge my portfolio and use the per on that network. Maybe that's true, maybe that's not true, but then like kind of come into your question more directly. What like other things would be less is like we get through our governance to be honest. So yeah, like throughout governance and
You know, it's a like kind of what the community want to us, you know, to a certain degree, obviously, like you're not going to list every single token, but like the in inverted commas blue chip. Cosmose and Cosmose tokens like that's like hopefully they'll be listed on our most
And like the other thing to say there is like so on an L1 you like we've already got cross margining for your margin accounts So like if you have perpetuals positions on an L1 for multiple tokens, but you're already across margin And then I thought the question you were gonna ask and like quite a lot of people have been asking us about
is like stake assets, if someone's got a lot of ideas of how to do that, will really be willing to listen to a gas ID8, so one of another adjectives, because people seem to really like it, I mean from my perspective there's a bit of
like a pricing problem. Maybe, but anyway, that's maybe something to discuss, not like offer to my head on a tips test. Thank you. Hey, what's up Nate? Welcome. What do you got? Thanks.
I appreciate time, a long time power user of Osmosis and all these apps. It's a pleasure to hear from them. I'm curious if both teams that just spoke, so margined and UMOS, could potentially
collaborate to create vaults where you can combine positions in LP pools with positions in perpetuals or options. I've seen it done on other chains like this where you can create sort of a delta neutral-esque position to
create these yield opportunities. So I'm just curious if you guys are thinking about that or how you think about it. Have you read my mind? Have you looked at, have you had my computer? What is going on here? I'm just a yield maxi man. Yes, that is what our interest is.
in for petrol is exactly that. Yeah, so that's what I do manually. I do that manually with my own portfolio. And so I've always wanted to build something or do something in the space on cosmos so we can connect on that later. But I just think it's super interesting to be able to offer a vaulted strategy
strategies that are, you know, it's like democratizing access to these Delta neutral strategies that only like market makers do with high amounts of capital, giving that access to, you know, call it retail or crypto native retail rather. Great question.
I mean, from our perspective, we hope people do that with margin. But obviously, given that, it's not someone we've been really focused on, but one of the people from the secret network
actually keeps mentioning this to me. And yeah, like hope like if you have want to do some like further discussion later, like, toaps up for that. We've done quite a bit of research into this and at the moment with how off the off
IBC transfers work or rather the granting of the permission. It's kind of a dangerous permission to give out. So we haven't released anything but we are trying to get that up to that so that it's a little bit more possible. Up until today the perpetuals always lived up
on their own L1, right? You have Injective and there's a couple of products coming out on ComDax and then there's also the ability to short on Kava. In order for you to be able to properly rebalance things, you need to be able to move assets between networks. But if you have all the assets on one network,
or if the margin product is taking care of the liquidity/tvl/whatever on its own, then that changes things a little bit, right? Yeah, yeah. Can I ask a smooth brain question here just to read
wine for a second, not to stop the flow, but can someone just explain what perps are for perpetuals for those of us who aren't full yield maxi-d gents? Yeah, I mean, it's a derivative contract and the TLDR is like, you
by a price for an amount and depending on where you go long or short, if number go up, if you get paid, if number go down, you lose money. Like very simply, I don't know if someone might have a beautiful, beautiful DLDR. I like how you took out the articles, if number go up.
There's something really interesting about Purps, which is when you enter into a perpetual contract, essentially like a futures contract that never expires, so you never actually have to deliver, so the only thing you need to pose
depends on the exchange would be the difference between the price you entered at the contract and the current market price. And so it's a very capital-efficient way to enter into a position which is why
it's interesting to combine that with LK positions essentially to hedge risk at a very low cost manner. That's why it's really interesting to combine it. That's just my two cents there.
I have to get going so I have a 1 o'clock, but thank you for having me. I appreciate this a lot and margined Please, please follow me so I can DM you let me slide into your DMs Yeah, I think they're open
anyway, but I shall follow you. Thank you. Bye everyone. Yeah, Charles. Thank you, Yield. Most thanks for being here. Thanks, Max. I think I mean, we can take another question or can we? I'm just checking in if anyone has them.
Okay, well this has been fairly fruitful. I appreciate everybody hanging out. Great question from Nate and Todd, Margin,
Good to see you, Shane go here. Thanks everybody for popping in and anything to add, Sonny.
- Awesome, thanks everybody, have a great rest of your Wednesday and stay posted. - Thanks. - Thanks. - Thanks, Sherry. - Bye everybody. - Thanks.