and just shared with both of you their mic
Yes. Cool. Hey, Sylvia and Queen, do you know how if I open a space and if I go out again, I don't know because Wi-Fi is bad or whatever, why I cannot go back in again?
I don't. Because it seems like you're only allowed to open a space once. And as soon as you drop out of Wi-Fi, it's kind of deleted from your agenda. Now it's not even in the agenda anymore.
Very funny. Hello everyone. Hello, hello.
We have a listener. Okay. Hi everyone, sorry about that. I think I was having a little bit of issues.
Here what I think due to the technical issues yesterday and today we lost the people. Maybe it was not meant to happen today or this week.
We have a listener. It's Elios, our previous freelancer for B together. Oh, hi Elios.
Or at least that's how I recognize the logo, I think.
Awesome. I don't know. I'd like to be honest. I know that we don't have many people, but I would still like to discuss what we were meant to discuss because I
I don't know, I feel the anxiety as well of the bear market and I would like some clarity and I'm sure that there's enough knowledge to go around amongst us and we have booked this time slot already. We might just all make the most
it. I don't know how everybody else feels about this. Yeah, I agree too. I think we should do this and yeah, let's discuss let's share ideas and I mean at the end of the day one, at least in Shavaswim Gohom with
I absolutely agree with me. Okay, I think we should hand over to you, Sylvia, you are going to do a few interest as we start.
Okay, basically, I think everyone on the space already knows each other, but yeah, we just want to let Queen interest introduce himself. I'm seeing Abdeline in the listeners, he's one of his part of what he and maybe
maybe a little bit introduction from each of us. So I'm Sylvia, I come from Nairobi, Kenya and I work with Harmonic Guild and nice to meet everyone who's here. I'm Quen, I'm from National Tennessee. I'm also going to go next.
Queen, you can go ahead. Actually, I'm not really in the meeting because John has to lead. Sorry, but I can do a quick intro. But I think everyone knows me here. I locked in because of the technical issue. Sorry for that.
Queen Queen? Yeah, can you go see me? Yes, yeah. All right, great. Yeah, yeah, so I'm Queen I'm from Hermana Guild. Queen, can you hear us? Yes, I guess I'm cutting in now.
Okay, maybe Kevin can go. Hello everyone. My name is Kevin. I'm from Cape Town, South Africa. I am an artist with B together and I love being part of the community.
I'm saying MintBase is here. I don't know if they'd like to be part of this because I'm just going to be to send them the link and then maybe you can have an open discussion about the bear market and basically just how to survive.
Oh, Joven, yeah, Joven who's not introducing himself.
I think John's still having technical difficulties. Yeah, difficulties.
I think so too. So maybe the guys from midways want to say hi.
Hello, this is Nate from MFACE didn't expect to pop on but yep I'm out and about excited to hear how to survive this horrible bear market
Awesome, thank you, thank you so much for joining and we're just hoping to have an open discussion about it and you know, let's just talk and have fun and at the end of the day, go home with something from each of us.
So I think I think John is off from the chat. So maybe I'll just I'll just start by asking the questions and maybe Queen or each of you can give us a perspective around it. What do you think what is
the bear market basically what is the simplest explanation for a bear market and what makes it different from the bull market and everything else. So I started Queen and then we can go around and everyone can just share their experiences and their thoughts on it.
Sure. Can I, can I, can I ever hear me okay? Yes.
- Okay, cool. Yeah, so financial and asset markets go in cycles. - Queen. - Yes.
Okay. Am I the one with some issues? Am I the one with internet issues? Well, I can, I can print on it seems that there's a bit of a delay. I think there's like a delay overall.
But yeah, you were saying when the financial markets go through a cycle. Financial markets go in cycles.
when they are fun and good, everyone calls them bull markets and when they're sad and down, people call them bear markets.
You find that we have found that assets increase and decrease not necessarily based on fundamentals.
but also on human psychology. - Can anyone hear me? - If you can, please just send any more to me 'cause I can't hear anything. This face is basically quiet.
Okay. Okay. So I think I'll just have maybe the guys from me please go next and then we can go back around because I can't hear Queen at all.
Quinn, please go ahead. I think some of us can hear you. I think it's just so we're that either not hearing you at all or there's a delay, but I hear you clearly. Okay, cool. Yeah, so there are, we've seen patterns in like human psychology where the
underlying asset values are not necessarily correlated to actual value, they're more just a phenomenon of cycles. And so this leads to some of these recurring highs and lows and markets go through a trans-tory cycles and people spend, you know, get PhDs.
and think about this extensively. But you know, bear market cycles which were in and also we haven't really been in at least in the stock market. Bear market cycles are relatively rare in our lifetimes. Like there have been a few major asset crashes but they haven't been
and prolonged in the same way. And so if you're a millennial, all together, familiar with it, we're coming out of one of the greatest bull runs in history. We had 50 years of consecutive stock market growth or something.
So you can sort of think of it as a phenomenon of social psychology that where you go through these sort of prolonged, uh, bear and then bull runs. Um, yeah.
Also, John. Yes, I'm going to introduce myself. So I'm John. I'm the social media manager for at B together, but I'm also a visual artist and have been dabbling in the world of NFTs. So.
I know that there are many like the semantics of the bear market that you know that go with the whole process and you know the cycles and and and but speaking from a newbie in this field of NFTs and crypto.
I think the bear market has been quite daunting and it's been a little bit scary because just looking at, for example, the way that the artwork that were created were pricey.
and then looking at how the impact of the bear market on the value of the work that's been put out there can actually have, I think quite similar to what Krin was saying about the psychological effects because a lot of artists put a lot of worth into their work
and by giving it some kind of value, when you start looking at your piece of art that was previously going for $40, for example, and worth a sudden, it's going for $10.
maybe not so comfortable with this environment and
And that's some of the challenges that I feel that are being faced even within the community because the production of artworks as well kind of slowed down. I know that we had Christmas and everything, but there is that feeling of
what's going on, where are we going, how long is this going to be going on for, and I think those are some of the issues that I would like us to just maybe have a chat about, I don't have, I haven't amassed a lot of financial
knowledge about this bear market, but I'm hoping that this space will at least share a little bit of light on how I can keep my head above water during this season.
I just have a quick comment that what you said reminded me of something. One of the things that is like a phenomenon, an economic phenomenon in bull and bear markets are like the fact that people don't make investments in one another. So like they don't give loans.
because if you're concerned about your own personal finances, you're unlikely to take a risk on someone else. Sorry guys, I don't know if now what are you going to have? I don't know, I think I'm having some internet issues, but yeah, I've been
So, I think we just had what Jonas said or disindeedly on my end but yeah, so okay, maybe now we can move on to the next question. I know if everyone else has gone around and spoken about their market. John? >> So there. Can you hear me clearly?
I think the only person you can't hear that clearly is Quinn, but he was just addressing one of the points that I had brought up during my little rant.
For all the competitors I just said the room I have a bug hypothesis. Oh my god. Okay. I think I just let the discussion go on and until I can you know I can catch up with everyone else. Please carry on in the conversation zone.
We'll call out the name, Sylvia. We'll try to call out your name as often as we can when it's time.
My bug hypothesis is that there's a key mismatch because I'm also logged in on the harmonic guild Twitter account and so my guess is she just like thinks Twitter thinks it's the same account. That's my bug hypothesis.
But yeah, I was just talking about that.
You know, people are less inclined to invest in one another and I think one of the things that we can kind of get out of that is making investments in one another, you know, just extending, you know,
Like extending services and sort of, you know, I use and building together under sort of understandings. I think that gives, you know, if you have a trusted community, I know it's sort of awkward.
talk about trusted when we're trying to build on trustless cryptosupp systems, but that's one of the ways that we can kind of collaborate when there's not it's not so easy to pass money around because ever, all the assets that we're working with are down.
But I also feel that to a certain degree, even when it comes to that support, I am less likely to, and I know this, like I know that what I should be doing and
what I'm telling all of the artists and investors and and and is to you know invest like invest in your art you know even like make as much as you can during this time so as much as you can this time because
because even though it is low, the prices are going to go up in the future. It's not going to go on forever. Everything comes to an end. But I believe that one of the challenges that could be faced is actually going in knowing that
The prices that I'm putting to my work are way lower than the value I'm putting to my work. And I feel that that value, which is put to whatever it is that you're creating, is almost all that you have
as a creative. And I think that's the stumbling block. That's like trying to see that as a long-term investment rather than a short-term return is the challenge that a lot of the people in our community may be facing.
One way you could maybe get around that is by having lower upfront prices but higher royalties in the future. If you expect the asset to go up in the long run, then
that you are advantaged in that case when you have a long tail for your royalties that you receive. Sorry for interrupting. May I ask a quick question, Queen?
When you say putting high royalties, in my opinion, if we put high royalties, we don't attract as many investors as we want, because if we have two high royalties, the investment itself, the buying of the NFT is not very lucrative for the buyer.
In case of reselling, so that's why I usually advise to go with lower oil teas. Of course you're right when it comes to, let's say, surviving kickly the bear more
and to have a quick workaround, yes. But on a long-term point of view, I'm not so sure, but maybe I'm wrong and other people have other opinions, so I'd love to hear about it.
I think you're right that it's a really challenging part of price setting. And that where when people view NFTs as an asset that they're trying to
make money off of flipping. They definitely factor in the difference in secondary sale royalties very strongly.
So you would want to discount that for by offering
you would want to influence that by offering the asset initially as a discount so that they, when the market appreciates, get the sort of increase in value. But you're right, it is definitely challenging to set prices with those kinds of investors in mind.
I also have a bit of a comment or a question.
If we invest now while it is a bear market and let's say prices are low,
It would be a very good idea to invest now while prices are low because they could increase during a bull market and your returns on that could be much higher. And is that why it's a really good idea to try and invest as much as you can?
And also, is that I guess why you're also saying work on perhaps IOUs and trusted agreements because in future the payoff or the return on that might be much higher than what it is right now?
Yeah, you are. I guess we should all sort of put in the waiver here that this is not financial advice. You kind of have to say this is not financial advice to your own research. I'm not a financial advisor. If you want a financial advisor, my buddy Rishi can help you out.
So I think one of the ways to think about it is you have to understand your own risk preferences, your own kind of risk profile when you decide to make an investment. And you know, the gamblers always say never put at stake more money than you can risk to
lose. When you're investing, that's why people have sort of stop losses and things like that because you can kind of have more at stake than you can risk to lose. But you can have kind of a, if you get below a certain amount, you buy out.
the last mate trick for that.
So when you have an asset that you're trying to, you know,
I would always operate in a hypothesis that the market is just as likely to go down as it is to go up. And you are trying to expect and extract roughly inflation
So, if you can extract another 2.5% off of that, you're good. But there's just so much variance in crypto markets that you kind of just have to dollar cost average, which is
where you periodically buy an asset over time to make sure your price is roughly the average price. That is as opposed to trying to buy peaks and troughs because peaks and troughs are really difficult to time and also there are so many algorithms in these markets, a little less than
So in general, you'll just like lose algorithms in the long run. So you should think about it more as investing kind of like you would with the stock market or an IRA or something like that and a little bit less like.
Trying to pretend that you're, you know, day trader or something like that. It's just really difficult to time the market and the time most of the gains are being captured by algorithms, especially in.
that was a bit of a word salad. Sorry, John, can we now say that we kind of understand what a bear market is and maybe move on to the next question?
I suppose that the number one question is obviously how do we stay motivated? How do we stay motivated as a community?
Stay in the game, keep the eye on the ball and keep going even though it seems like things are for the lack of a better term falling apart.
The first thing that comes to mind for me is remembering the values, that's why harmonic does this values campaign. It's about remembering sort of why you're doing it and that many of us, the primary reason we're doing it is not to make money.
we have some kind of fundamental belief that crypto is good for autonomy or decentralization or we're tired of big tech companies. So those can be really important motivating factors. What else do you guys think are good motivating factors?
Those are really great actually.
Remember where we came from, yeah.
and what we want out of it.
John? I would like to say that the community that is built around crypto is one that is quite unique in the way that it sees the world. And I feel that maybe that energy is enough
at least I believe for that's the way that I'm looking at it for myself and hopefully for the people around me and within the circles. I'm seeing it as a space as a community apart from any other
I know I'm putting myself on the line by saying this, but it's a subculture, it's like a religion. We believe that the world can be better. Maybe just echoing what Quinn is saying, that seems to be the one thing that's keeping
me grounded in a way and knowing that this too shall pass and the community around me is strong enough to survive this and those values are, you know, what keeps us going. So,
I don't know, I know this.
I think that the challenge is spreading it and reinforcing it. And maybe that's what the space is for, to be able to talk about and go back and dig deep into why we're here.
Yeah, sounds. That sounds good.
Could I maybe like ask a question here or maybe suggest something also? What was I thinking?
If you're an NFT artist, you're not necessarily an investor.
When you create on several platforms, although it does cost minimal, if you're creating a lot of art,
It does cost you, if you don't have a lot of near, then it does cost you quite a bit to actually mint and list on certain platforms, depending on how much they charge you.
Would it not be maybe a good idea to say if there are those of us who might have?
some extra near laying around to invest into those who might need not need, but who have a lot of ideas and a lot of NFTs that they want them in, but they can't necessarily mean because they don't have that much
in a near to be able to mint if I'm making sense. So to say that I have a bit of money around and I want to invest in other people,
And I know that that is what we are doing as a community, but maybe just to boost that a bit more. Am I making sense?
Yes, you are. And I think as a community, we applaud that. If somebody in the community is creating work and they, you know, share it with us and they're like, okay, this is what I'm working on. I'm working on a collection or whatever it may be. I need some support. I believe that the resource
are made available to anybody that is willing and able to create during these times. I don't think I think like we all we in the business of promotion and we need material to be able to promote so we do applaud it and we do support it.
The patron and artist relationship has existed for, you know, since Michelangelo. So I, and now we've got really easy, you know, through royalty pass-throughs for investments like you can either financialize it or not financialize it.
I mean, so I do think paying the expenses of an up and coming artist and either taking a slice of the value in the long run or just doing that for the love of the game is a really is a good way to like leverage
You know, you're the community that you have. And I'm also like spending time to educate people is another way you can kind of think of as an investment, like, you know, maybe the nearer that you're going to spend is like one or two.
year, but it takes a long time to get an artist to understand all of the things that are required to go through in order to be an artist on a blockchain. And so you can also think of your times as investment like that.
I agree with that when whenever I end out and I did this myself like with the last credit crunch in like 2007-2008 go to school and learn like put your head down learn as much as you possibly can
and you will emerge after the bear market with knowledge and the tools to move forward. So I definitely support that. Let us learn, let us educate each other, each one teach one and all of that. Let's do it.
So the question is still, well, I hope that we've probably covered it is how do we motivate each other. And yeah, I hope that we've got an answer. (buzzer)
I think we can also motivate each other by practicing what we preach.
We're all able to create. We're all able to impart knowledge in whatever form where it's hold on to your fans or hold on, create, pump it out, pump out as much as you can. It doesn't matter if the near seems really low.
So I feel those positive affirmations around our community is what's going to keep us going. And it's a survival guide of sorts. I think that's one of the reasons that's something that we're trying to hopefully for the future kind of have where it's like, okay, this is what
we do when it's a bear market, like, you know, bombshell divides, like get down, you know, get together, come together, teach each other, exchange skills, you know, keep going, wait for it to, you know, calm down and re-emerge victorious. I think that's
Those are the sentiments and I think that is what I hope to encourage and to foster through these spaces.
Memes can be helpful in those kinds of things, like just sort of like fun and encouraging things and joking around and like connecting people and just talking about ideas that are important to the
this, even if it's not coding or drawing or whatever work that you do, just sort of kicking around ideas and joking about things like this is an important way to sort of build the community to get through it together.
And I also suppose if, for example, if social good is your vibe during a bear market where, you know, the returns are low, maybe it's an opportunity to challenge ourselves to
charity begins at home to start doing that social good physically even if it's on a small scale whether you are you know helping around or whatever it may be whatever is within your reach without bursting your own little safety bubble
Maybe that is also the time to do things like that. Go back to basics and just spread the love and spread the knowledge around you rather than trying to be global.
It's very, very quiet. Can everybody here, can somebody show of hands if it's quiet, if you can hear me?
There are some questions that were brought up in the lower agenda that was laid out that may have not been addressed, like any specific
measures that can be taken to navigate the bear market or strategies that bigger projects are putting in place so that they continue to grow during these times. I don't know if we can touch on that briefly.
Yeah, I was actually just looking and thinking about that question. It just sort of brought something to mind that like, although crypto is in a bear market, not everything necessarily is. And so, so like, you know, Harmonic does a lot of work in the music industry.
And like the music industry was, you know, on the verge of collapse. Like because of the way the streaming royalties don't get me started about it, work musicians make most of their money on touring. And so when people couldn't tour, musicians, bank accounts, dried up stuff.
super quickly. But now, you know, people are back touring. And so, and also like crypto kind of spikes during that time in of COVID. So, you know, one of the ways that I think we can kind of as firms
And so, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know,#
One of the things that makes your firm more robust is not being so consolidated in a single industry or whatever. And that can really help you find a business model that is working and also has the right timing.
Sorry, do you mean like many, many streams of income? Is that what you're referring to? More or less, yeah. I mean, because businesses have many streams of income as well, you know, if you're, you know, you sell
You know, cans for food and cans for soda and like when people aren't buying people buy soda in the summer and they buy food in the winter, you know, so you try to think about how you can
There's the dorky economic concept called the production possibilities frontier and that's like the total horizon
and involve the different things that you can possibly make and like the numbers of the different things that you can make. And so you kind of like want to test, okay, well, maybe I'll try this thing that's a little bit different than I normally do and see if there's demand there. And so running those kinds of experiments to see, okay, if I do this kind of our
is their demand here? If I have this price point, is their demand here? And then you kind of do those experiments and then have a feedback about what works. And that can be that can be a really helpful, helpful tool. That's actually probably a lesson harmonic needs as well. But.
Yeah, I think I, I, I, the way that I am digesting this is takes are low so you can kind of risk it a little and kind of diversify your approach to creating for example. Is that correct? Yeah.
Because there's not the risks, especially if you're not making piles of money, there's not the risk of leaving something that you're doing. So if you're not locked into a certain model because you don't want to screw it up, because nothing is really working all that well, so you can try different things.
And that's why really game changing businesses come out of recessions is because they've been forced to do this kind of stuff because you know if you're about to smart people eventually you'll find in a in a bull market eventually you'll find something that works you know and anyone can make money in a bull
market, even me as an investor can make money in a bull market. So it's really not that hard. But in a bear market, you have to really refine what you're doing and that ends up being a really good opportunity because you will have found product market fit when everything starts exploding again.
This is true. This is true.
Kevin, I'd like to ask you, like, how are you staying motivated?
Like how do you keep going?
As like, you know, one of our community members, you are creating your NFTs. How are you staying motivated? And what are you saying to those that are near you and asking what's going on?
And of course, in a way, it's like the way that I feel and even just like looking at my immediate circle, when we started talking about
When I started talking about NFTs and crypto to my family and friends, it was like, oh my gosh, here we go. So now it's almost like the writings on the wall with the bear market. Like this was never going to work, but people are forgetting that this happens often. Like it happens.
whatever the investment might be and it's not limited to the crypto world. So yeah, I'd like to hear what other artists are doing. Kevin, I think you might have to request to speak or something because you're just done as a listener.
Well, well, Kevin's getting inserted out. I can answer there was actually an article on the Wall Street Journal that that crypto is a scam and it should be illegal in the United States. My father said to me and I'm like, oh my god, we're like, and have this conversation again.
If people don't tell you, you know, people are going to tell you you're crazy until the moment they start trying to give you money, you know, that's kind of one of the cycles and, you know, as an entrepreneur that that's a component
of it where, you know, they're going to, if your idea is any good, you're going to have to absolutely force people to listen to you. And that's just kind of one of the adversarial parts of being in a market, you know.
There's also this great quote where air clapped in told Jimmy Hendrix that they don't boo nobody's so the fact that people are booing you kind of means that you've already made it to a certain point
Because they can recognize you. For what you have done.
Yeah, I think that's a very fair point because I feel that the challenge never minds the challenge of surviving it as for myself. I think the challenge of also fighting for it.
to everybody else that is against it is an added pressure that has you know that has you second guessing your decisions and your choices and I'm sure that it's not you know exclusive to
myself or you can, I'm sure a lot of the people in this space and not in the space can obviously relate to that feeling of, oh my gosh, because it's treated like a pyramid scheme. I feel that that's the way that I
I first encountered it. It was like, "Okay, you're investing in what exactly and how does it work?" And just the sharing of the knowledge was so, you know, so done so freely that it took me a moment to catch myself and think, "Okay, where exactly are we going with this?"
Yeah, I'm sure there's an article out there that's like
talking to your parents about being full-time in crypto at the Thanksgiving dinner table. I'm also a big proponent of nuclear energy. So every time somebody bashes on nuclear energy, I'm like, "Ahh!" It gets frustrated, and I just want to share with them the data.
You know, it's a balance between trying to convince people who think it's a scam. And sometimes your customers will think it's a scam too. And like that's a challenging thing. I've had people give me just like thumbs up emojis and DMs that I sent them and I'm like, oh, okay, well, what does that mean?
Yeah, exactly. It means like good for you, man. So you kind of fight for the ones that you think are most important and just let the rest be noise. I agree. I agree. Yeah, I definitely agree with that.
It's a vessel, but it is for...
For all purposes and intentions, it's a noble battle.
I don't know if there's anybody else that would like to add something or if you don't want to use your voice maybe put something in the
like in the chat. If you've got something that you would like to share, please feel free, raise your hand or you know like I'd like to hear what's
are the other guests to the space are feeling about this or if there are any questions that haven't been asked, whatever, really.
Please speak up. This is our time.
Okay, while we wait, I'd just like to say thank you to everybody that is here today. I know that we've had a few challenges. The tech gods were meanies for the last few days for someone own reason. Twitter hasn't been playing
like a good kid. But we're here and we've made it and I can personally attest to the fact that I'm walking away feeling a little bit
more confident about the choices and the decisions that I have made and the community that I am in and I hope that it is the same for others that have attended this.
Absolutely. Thank you. And I guess in sort of closing thoughts. Yeah, you know, be kind to each other and reach out.
send the memes and unsolicited direct messages of well-wishing, sign your emails with things that are goofy. Sort of keep people spirits up.
We have a bull market to look forward to.
Yeah, you're better than someone else on the top.
I think if we also look, I've just slowly been, well, a bit been following the, just a trend on near coin itself, if you can call it that the near protocol, I'm sorry. And it's slowly been going up.
very little, but just in the recent like week it's been going up. And that's something to look forward to. It's not obviously at the height that it once was, but I guess we can still look forward to going even higher than it was in the past.
And thanks for inviting me also to speak. Thanks guys. Thank you. Thank you Kevin.
And think of this as a marathon. It's not like, you know, the 100 meters dart. This is a marathon. Let's think about this as being in it for the long game. Let's keep going. Let's be tenacious.
Let's stick together, let's be the shoulder for others when they, you know, like a lot of people have invested and have lost at least that may be the way that they feel at the moment.
But let's stay in there. Let's, you know, let's be there. Let's be those people that are doing what we're doing here, but within our communities as well. I think that is what is required in order to survive it through to the bull market, because
It does have an effect on all of us. It has an effect on our emotions. It has an effect on our finances. It has an effect on us.
Let's be together. Let's be together. Yes.
I don't know if Soviet is still listening.
I think she is. Please go ahead, Kevin. Does anyone know what bees do in the winter?
I don't know. I just saw something the other day and I don't know what the answer to that question is. I thought someone might know.
What do you get when you cross a vampire and a snowman? God what what what do we get? Frostbite.
I asked Claudia while we won the road trip and she didn't respond she just rolled her eyes.
Okay, I guess this is it. I just want to say thank you to everyone. Please are there any last comments? Any last words before we say our goodbyes?
Thank you, thank you everyone. This was our first, well, this was my first Twitter space and it's, it has come with its challenges, but I can gladly say that
Thank you to everyone, you guys were very supportive, everybody was lovely, I know we're a small group, but... This was my first split of space.
And it's come with challenges, but I can gladly say that thank you to everyone. You guys were very supportive. Everybody was lovely. I know we're a small group, but remember, first, it's kind of a small group.
Are we all good? I'm out. I think there's an echo. Thank you very much. Thank you everyone. Bye bye.
Bye everyone. I'm so sorry I couldn't listen in.