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The Stacks DeFI Show #12
Recorded: April 2, 2024 Duration: 1:03:39Space Recording
Full Transcription
Good morning, good afternoon, good evening, everybody.
Welcome to another Stacks DeFi show.
I see it's number 12 already, so we've been going at it for, what, about three months,
four months going now.
So, yeah, sounds about right.
It's April.
And, yeah, we have an amazing set of guests today.
We have, I see, Mithil from Valor, Valor itself too, the Valor protocol team.
Then we have Jacob from Hermetica, very excited to have you on, and I don't see the Alex team
yet.
They're usually regular, so maybe they're still joining.
I'm not sure.
But we have Leo too, but we have the Leo team, and of course, Leo has the awesome STX handle.
I'd still need to know the backstory of that.
I don't know if there is one, but I'd be curious to hear more about that.
But, yeah, as usual, you know, the little disclaimer that I have to drop here is nothing here can
be considered as financial advice.
It's purely for informational and entertainment purposes only, so not financial advice.
And, yeah, with that, I don't know if Tycho is here.
I don't know who is behind the StackingDAO handle today, but happy to have you on here too.
And why don't we give the space to our first guest?
Maybe, Jacob, you can kick it off?
Yeah, for sure.
Hey, guys.
Nice to be here.
Jacob, CEO of Hermetica.
We are building an Options Vault protocol that is going to be launching tomorrow.
And, yeah, very excited to talk about it.
Awesome.
I didn't know you guys were launching so soon, but it is a bull market.
So, protocols are launching left and right.
Make sure to check out Hermetica.
Jacob, if you want to bring the Hermetica account on as a speaker, happy to have them
on too so people can easily link through.
If you want to do that, just give the Stacks BTC account a nudge if so.
And, yeah, next up, I think it's Mithil from the Valor team.
Mithil, how's it going?
Hey, Philip.
How are you, man?
Going really well.
We are around 22 hours away from creating history.
We'll become tomorrow 4 p.m. GST.
That's 12 p.m. UTC.
will become world's first Bitcoin ecosystem project from this cohort to go live on a top
tier exchange.
We are going live on Bybit and Gate together.
But at this point, apart from Bitcoin Stacks and some ordinal projects, there is no Bitcoin
DeFi project that's live on such a top exchange.
So, really excited about it, excited for the whole Bitcoin ecosystem.
I think it's a big week for the whole Bitcoin ecosystem.
And, yeah, man, super pumped and super busy with it.
But thanks for having me.
That is awesome to hear.
Yeah, I can only imagine what you guys are going through now in terms of work and backlog
and excitement.
So, yeah, super, super cool to see that announcement.
And as you said, it's one of the first Bitcoin and Stacks related projects to make a pick on
a centralized exchange.
So, really looking forward to the reception.
And, obviously, all the best I'll be supporting.
So, looking forward to that.
And, yeah, up next is Leo.
Everyone probably knows you guys already.
But feel free to give us a rundown.
Leo, how's it going?
Good evening, guys.
It's very late here.
But thanks for having us again.
Congratulations, as well, to Vela on their launch.
We were very proud to be the first token actually listed on Vela or first meme coin essentially
traded on Vela.
And they're doing great things.
And, yes, we've launched Stacks Tools version 3.
Much awaited.
Much awaited Stacks Tools version 3.
Finally, people can see a bunch of new tokens that I've gotten some hype recently.
Nothing token, Pepe, Rue.
Rue's a new one as well.
And I'm sure we'll be seeing a lot more coins with Alex opening up their kind of new listing.
And as well as Vela moving on pretty quickly.
So, it's exciting times for Dayfly.
Awesome.
Yeah.
I'd love to hear a bit more about the Stacks Tools of V3 that you guys have launched or coming up for launch.
So, yeah.
Feel free to elaborate a bit more on that later.
And I see Tycho has joined too.
So, Tycho, great to have you here.
How's it going, man?
Yeah, all good.
All good.
I fell a little bit ill.
So, it's great that we're jumping in here.
And it was also a bit late because I had a meeting.
But, no, everything going well here.
Here you are.
Brief introduction.
Yeah.
So, I'm a co-founder of Zest Protocol, lending protocol built for Bitcoin.
And also co-founder of StackingDAO.
And before this, I was, yeah, working a lot on products at Trust Machine.
So, working on the Stacks Nakamoto upgrade and all the fun stuff there.
But, yeah.
No, it's been an exciting week.
Once again, we opened some new lending options on Zest Protocol.
But happy to talk about it in a second, of course, after the guests, right?
Which should obviously go first.
But, yeah.
Very excited about the spaces right now.
Awesome.
I'm also very grateful to have you on here weekly.
You know, it's my little secret that every time.
So, it's 4 p.m. here.
And every time we do these spaces, I do the laundry.
So, I, like, jump in whenever I have something to say.
My laundry is going a bit slower now because I'm hosting today.
But I appreciate your presence.
I just wanted to say that.
Anyway, our last co-host is, I believe, Hayden from Alex.
Stay tuned as well.
Hayden, how's it going?
Good, guys.
Happy to be on.
Sorry I was a bit late.
I was just jumping off another space.
We concluded the IDO for Sugar Kingdom.
So, I was on a launch countdown space.
And they did really well.
With it going live on MexC, they had a quick 5X.
So, you know, trading strongly from there.
So, always glad to see things turn out well.
Yeah.
So, I'm Hayden, the BD lead with the Alex Lab Foundation.
We're building a DeFi layer on Bitcoin.
Yeah.
So, really happy to join the space.
You know, lots of cool announcements this week.
You know, as was mentioned, we've created a self-service token listing to, you know, with all the meme coins that are coming out.
We couldn't keep up with them.
So, we'll let users list them themselves on the Alex platform.
And we've also begun the whitelisting phase of Lisa for Liquid Stacking as well.
So, lots going on.
And happy to discuss it with you all.
Awesome, man.
Yeah.
That's a big deal to have a permissionless way to list the memes.
So, that's cool.
Well done.
Yeah.
And so, finally me.
I'm Philip.
I guess most of you know me.
But I'm a core contributor at Arcadeco and also at StackingDAO.
Arcadeco is a collateralized stablecoin.
You can use your STX or StackStacks from StackingDAO to borrow, yeah, things against it.
Well, in the form of our stablecoin USA more specifically.
And then for StackingDAO, it's the leading liquid staking platform on Stacks.
We have about 110 million in TVL, going hard, focusing on integrations.
And speaking of integrations, I'm going to give the floor to Jacob because I just heard some alpha.
You guys are launching this week.
Jacob, tell us a bit more about Hermetica.
What are you up to?
And, yeah, how do you see the overall ecosystem?
Yeah.
Yeah.
We're launching next tomorrow.
And, yeah, we're expanding the StakeStacks ecosystem.
So, our first vault will be a StakeStacks bull vault, which allow you to get leverage on your StakeStacks holding.
And there's really a lot to talk about because it's, let's say, a little bit more on the complex side of things, the product.
But I can run you through it.
There's really three main aspects to it.
One is we're collaborating with 2Prime, which is an institutional-grade asset managers that manage treasuries for a lot of the big Bitcoin miners, high-net-worth individuals that have nine figures of capital under management.
And they have helped us design an option strategy that's really quite unique and we are very excited about, which combines a number of different binary call options.
So, the option will buy a binary call strip, two different binary call options to essentially give you long leverage where you get a big upside payout on chart moves on StakeStacks, but at the same time gives you a base yield from an at-the-money call option.
So, you can think of it as a vault that makes a little bit of money most of the time, but when there's a big move, it makes substantial amounts of money.
In the last bull market, this strategy would have gotten you 70% peak to trough width.
And this is the important part, since it's an option strategy that's built in risk management.
There's very little drawdowns.
There's no liquidation risks.
And, you know, so that is on the option side.
Essentially, you can think of it getting access to an institutional-grade option strategy through a bull vault.
The other element is that we took a page out of StakingDAO's book and are integrating a liquid staking token for the vault.
So, when you deposit StakeStacks into the vault, you get a liquid staking token back.
So, you get StakeStacks bull back.
And that allows you to essentially stay liquid on your StakeStacks position.
You can trade in and out of that.
There will be markets on StakeStacks bull.
But, yeah, it allows you essentially to be invested into StakeStacks, be invested into the vault, the bull vault, get leverage, but also stay liquid.
And then the third element is that we have taken security very seriously and have designed the vault.
So, it is what we call fully non-custodial, meaning even in the case that we get compromised as a team or as a protocol and the admin keys to the smart contracts are not within our control, nobody will be able to access the StakeStacks in the vault.
Only the amount that is being traded, which is 2% every week, will be made available for the trader to withdraw.
But in case of compromise, that's the only amount that can be accessed.
So, you get institutional grade, option strategy, you're fully liquid, and it's really fully non-custodial.
It's a DeFi product.
It's not a fake DeFi actually wrapped into a fake version of DeFi where you actually give up custody of the keys.
So, very excited about it.
It's going to launch tomorrow on a whitelist.
We're opening up to our OGs, we call them, which are folks that have been with us from very early on and are willing to put a significant amount of stacks into the vaults.
10,000 stacks is the threshold that we're looking for.
If you're interested to be on that OG list, there's only ever going to be 42 of them because that's the magic number.
Reach out to me or sign up to our waiting list and then you will get access to a form to sign up to be an OG.
As the product matures, we'll whitelist more and more people.
So, you do stay involved and engaged.
But this will be a slow, soft launch for OGs first and then slowly to two more people.
I'll stop there.
That's awesome.
That is really cool.
So, 42 OGs.
It's going to be a race to become an OG.
I'm going to...
Yeah, there's already 30 signups, I think.
Oh, shit.
So, 12 OGs left.
And there's...
I don't know how many people are here.
About 100.
So, if we all apply, only 10% can get in.
Oh, man.
I'm happy to say, happy to share that I'm already an OG.
I think I was one of the first ones.
So, I'm giving myself a pat on the shoulder for making it.
But that...
Yeah, Tycho, you've been the first one, actually.
The first one I was.
Damn.
Yeah, that's a lot of credit.
That's a lot of credit.
You got OG, OG status.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And of course, to sort of make sure that I fully understand what I sign up for.
So, basically, it's essentially...
So, there's an option going to be sold just on the stacking yields, right?
That ST Stacks produces.
So, the...
And that's like a very much a bull option.
So, if Stacks swings a lot, like, what sort of roughly...
Well, first of all, before asking any questions, is that accurate or am I missing something?
Yeah, so the first one is...
And this is kind of new or different from protocols that you're used to in maybe the ETH world or the Solana world, is that we're not selling options.
We're buying options.
And that is very important in our mind, because if you're selling options, you open yourself up to a lot of tail risk.
Yeah, it can be just the principle, right?
There's a lot of options strategy that you see...
Yeah, exactly.
A lot of options strategy that you see in the DeFi protocols that are live on Ethereum is that they sell, for example, cover calls, which makes a little bit of money most of the time.
But when it loses, it can lose big, because it loses...
Can you guys still hear Jacob, or is it just me?
No, he doesn't hear.
Oh, too bad, too bad, too bad.
But I think we need to learn more about this ASAP.
But, yeah, I think when Jacob comes back, we need to dig a little deeper here.
But I'm not sure, Philip, if you had any more questions prepared or other things for our other guests.
I had, I had.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure.
I was waiting for Jacob.
I also had some questions there, but like you said, we'll jump to him right when he gets back.
Maybe jumping to the other guests.
Meytil, you want to talk a bit more about the Veller listing, what it means for you with Veller, the IDO.
Yeah, how do you foresee the next few weeks going?
Yeah, for sure.
Where do I start?
It's so many things, right?
So, I think I can just say that what we were building for the last 14 months, everything is coming together.
And like the whole Bitcoin DeFi is coming together, you know, like what we were building.
So, we are not just listing.
We also did, we are also doing our Veller IDO exclusively for Stacks ecosystem because I genuinely think the Stacks community is the best community right now in entire crypto space.
And they have been so supportive to us.
And what we were building was in versions.
The first version we planned was the AMM, Uniswap V2-inspired AMM and the Launchpad.
So, we also launched at AMM two weeks ago.
We have over, I think, 1,500 users now.
So, some of it doesn't, like, actively show up in some of the data analytics platforms.
So, I don't know how it works.
But we are one of the fastest growing DEXs in entire Bitcoin space.
Our first Launchpad on the Launchpad is the Veller IDO.
And we just finished our green campaign for the Veller IDO, like, an hour ago.
And we were, I think, over 40x oversubscribed than what we wanted to, than what the whitelist spots are.
So, the whitelist spots are over 7.50.
And the Veller IDO is starting around midnight today, Dubai time.
That's around 8 p.m. UTC.
But that's not just it.
I mean, after the phase 1, which is for the whitelist people, for Veller IDO, we'll open it up for all the community members.
So, if they have missed it, they can still come and participate.
Then we are listing tomorrow as first ever Bitcoin DeFi ecosystem project on Bybit and Gate also.
So, you know, that's also big.
I think it's not just big for us as Veller, but I think it's a huge day tomorrow for entire Bitcoin ecosystem.
Because as a first ever project on a top three exchange, and Bybit has over 30 million users, you know.
So, for the first time, the mass world, you know, like global, you know, retail audience will get access to participate and play around with a Bitcoin DeFi app, you know, at this scale.
So, I think it's very big for entire Bitcoin ecosystem because how we perform will actually pave the path for future coming, like hundreds of Bitcoin DeFi ecosystem tokens and projects.
So, also happy to actually talk to any Bitcoin DeFi ecosystem project who's planning to launch soon, who's planning to go live on any exchange soon.
Because I think what we need to do here is to work together as the Bitcoin ecosystem whole and to propel the Bitcoin ecosystem forward.
So, also, like, it's, I mean, that's why I feel very proud and very excited for tomorrow, not just for me, but for the whole Bitcoin ecosystem.
And also, our prop decks is going live soon.
I mean, the only reason we are going live with the exchange so early is because our prop decks is going live a few weeks later.
So, our prop decks is going live on testnet around mid-April in a week or two after the TGE.
So, really looking forward to that as well.
Awesome, man.
You guys just don't sit still.
And it's very inspiring to see.
It's really cool.
And so, just to recap, you have a listing tomorrow, a gate and by bit.
You're doing a launchpad for anyone, really, who are, what are the requirements to, if, say, I'm a new token, I want to list on Valor, I want to use a launchpad and its IDO.
So, how are the requirements, what's the process for me to apply or is it open or how does that work?
So, eventually, because it's, I mean, because we live in a decentralized world, so eventually it will be a governance-based decision where people will, like, the Valor community will choose what to, what project to list next on the launchpad.
But right now, because it's still very early, they would, we would have to vet them.
So, any project who wants to list on our launchpad, on Valor launchpad has to reach out to us.
But we are, we as a team are very easily accessible on all social media platforms, on Twitter, Telegram, on Discord.
So, it's, so please reach out to us, anybody who is planning to build on Bitcoin ecosystem, planning to, you know, propel the Bitcoin ecosystem forward will be more than happy to help.
That is awesome.
Yeah.
I saw you guys had a great listing.
I saw, my Twitter timeline was, like, all over it.
And that was Roo.
I cannot say, like, what it does or what the token is about, but I saw it everywhere.
And so, that must have been amazing exposure for you guys, too.
Yeah, for sure.
For sure, right?
I mean, Jack Binswitch is a real Stax OG.
Actually, when we started building last year, he was one of the first people to write a blog about us.
It was probably March or April last year.
I don't exactly remember.
But he has been a Stax OG for years, right?
I mean, and he launched this meme coin called the Kangaroo Jumping Coin, I think, with the ticker Roo.
And they decided to launch it with us, you know, with Velar, because I think it's also, I think it's more about the mindset.
Like, even when we started, Taiko knows it and Philip, like, we have been, we haven't spoken as much as, like, me and Taiko or other people in the ecosystem.
But our mindset was always to propel the Bitcoin ecosystem forward.
You know, we always looked at the missing parts, what's missing in the Bitcoin ecosystem or what's not working well.
And we wanted to, and we wanted to build that.
We were not, we were not afraid to take the risks.
We are, we always want to take the risk and be the first mover in whatever we do in a way that, you know, even if it doesn't help us or if it doesn't work out, but at least it would be a good learning for other people building in the Bitcoin ecosystem.
So if you, if you see, like, even when we did our test net, we are very community oriented.
That's why we broke the world record for any test net app on, on Bitcoin.
Like we, our test net of version one was participated by 165,000 users.
Also, we are doing an airdrop for them tomorrow.
So they have been waiting for airdrop and have been supporting us for months.
So they will be rewarded tomorrow with the airdrop apart from it.
We, we, that's why we started building the world's first pub decks on Bitcoin as well, because until now, nobody did it, but, and also it's not easy because it's a different tech stack.
So we had to write the whole pub decks from scratch with or without the resources that we had when we started.
I'm not even going into that, how difficult it was to build on Bitcoin last year compared to this year.
You know, but we always wanted to take the risk, not just for us, but for the whole Bitcoin ecosystem.
And it also shows in, in the products that we built, but also the listing that we're doing, right?
I mean, we are the, we don't mind going forward as the first, first major Bitcoin DeFi app on a, on a major exchange, even if it works out or doesn't work out for us.
So, you know, like we are even going pre-product.
So if, if not for us, it would still be a great learning for other Bitcoin DeFi projects that are coming up now or in future, you know, about how, how the things work, how to list on exchanges, how to build community, how to build and launch products.
So what we do basically is, is, is basically we want to, you know, like work with other players in the ecosystem to, to, to experiment on Bitcoin and see what, what path the whole Bitcoin ecosystem takes forward.
So I think, I think Jack Binswitch, coming back to your point, Jack Binswitch has a similar mindset, like he has been a Stacks OG and supporting Stacks for years.
And I think it's a great time to launch a meme coin, which has a utility in, in now or in future.
I think, I think he has a big vision with Kangaroo coin.
Most people can't see it now, of course, because, you know, like it's, it's just begun and it's, it's going through the hype phase right now.
But I think it will have a great utility.
And I think because of the mindset that he, the Roo token team chose us because we just want to push the community forward.
You know, we just want to push the Stacks ecosystem forward, just push the Bitcoin ecosystem forward.
And we don't mind taking risks and, and experimenting with different business models, different products, different venues to, to play around.
Awesome. Yeah.
I appreciate you guys, true leaders, I would say.
Like you have to take risks if you want to make a difference.
And so you're the first to do that.
You lead by example.
So definitely appreciate all you've done.
And I really got to know you better only like the last four to six months or so.
And I definitely have to second that.
You're one of the, the true people, you know, who just don't talk, but also do.
So appreciate that.
By the way, you have the biggest Stacks AE USEC pool across all of Stacks.
So that's a pretty big deal for USEC liquidity too.
So if you're looking to swap into USEC or into Stacks USEC around that pair, go to Valor.
They have about 2.4 million now.
So definitely need that for the ecosystem too.
So appreciate that.
Thanks a lot, man.
And yeah, just, just one small thing before I forget, because we'll, because Valor is, Valor token is going live tomorrow.
We'll also run farming from tomorrow.
So anybody who starts farming early tomorrow, like after we go TG, would have great opportunities to, to earn really great rewards, you know.
And we will also go live with the Valor AUSDC pool, which will, which will bring more utility and which will bring more, you know, liquidity to, to AUSDC token as, as, as a token on Stacks.
So, and also we will run Valor farming on top of it.
So like, likewise, like, you know, like when we were launching our AMM, we asked around the ecosystem, which stable coin do you, does the ecosystem need right now?
And the, and the, and I think the best stable coin available in the ecosystem was AUSDC.
So we also ran points on AUSDC Stacks pool, even before we went live.
I mean, even before we are going live tomorrow, we ran point system as pre farming.
But after that, I mean, after tomorrow, we want to run Valor AUSDC pool as well, apart from the Stacks AUSDC pool, and we will run farming on both.
So it's a great opportunity to not just bring more liquidity and utility to AUSDC, but also for the people who are putting liquidity into this farms on, on Valor.
Good stuff, man.
Yeah.
Again, appreciated and looking forward to that Valor AUSDC pool.
For those not familiar, by the way, with AUSDC, it stands for AllBridge, Ethereum, USEC.
And so it's a USEC version bridged from Ethereum to Stacks on AllBridge.
And it looks like it's going to be the de facto kind of centralized stable coin to bear against.
So, yeah, get your hands on it.
You'll need it.
Yeah, we'll make sure it, we'll make sure it becomes de facto stable coin on Stacks.
Don't worry about it.
But thanks a lot, Philip.
I'll have to leave.
Like, we are literally going TGE within the next 22 hours.
So I'll have to leave.
But it's always great to talk to friends on Stacks spaces.
And please look forward to our TGE tomorrow.
Look forward to our IDO tonight and tomorrow.
People who are whitelisted can participate tonight.
And if you didn't get a whitelist spot, we will open up the IDO phase two for everyone.
It will be first come, first serve basis.
So keep an eye.
Next few hours are going to be interesting for Valar community and Stacks community.
Just keep an eye over it.
Yeah, thanks for being here.
I know you're super busy.
So appreciate that, man.
Have a good one.
And all the best with the launch of the Valar token.
Thanks, guys.
Cheers.
Bye.
Cheers.
I think, Jacob, can you hear us now?
I think you're back.
So I'm going to give the mic to Tycho since he had some insightful questions on Hermetica, your launch.
And yeah, what's going on?
Yeah, I'm back.
Good, good.
There's a bit of fumbling around the microphone.
I'm not sure if you, maybe you should adjust it a little bit.
Tycho seems to not be.
No, yeah.
There you go.
Oh, can you hear me or no?
Yeah, yeah.
I can hear you, Tycho.
Oh, can you hear us or not quite yet?
Testing, testing.
I think it's still difficult.
Maybe just quickly.
Should we maybe mute?
Jacob for a second, then ask Leo some questions about SDX Tools and V3.
Yep, for sure.
Leo, the floor is all yours.
What's new with V3?
Give us a rundown.
What's new?
And also, by the way, SDX Tools is like, for those who don't know,
it's the homepage for all the tokens on Stacks.
I'm a daily active user, very happy.
And yeah, I've been looking forward to this V3 a lot.
So I'm really excited to hear more.
Yeah, Tycho is definitely one of the first ones that keeps saying to us
when new features.
Yeah, it took us a bit longer than expected,
but we've definitely finally got Stacks Tools up and about.
I think the most important was probably just getting all the new tokens
that I've launched, especially as Stacks DeFi continues to heat up.
So you've got nothing.
Kangaroo, the newly launched coin on Vela.
Max, I think Play is on there.
And there's one, I think Pepe is the other one that people seem to love as well.
So that was definitely important for us to get up,
just so we can have all the pools there.
We're missing a lot of Stacks Swap tokens.
People like to trade there as well.
So we've got them on board as well.
And then looking into mainly some new features that we've got
is a new update for BNS.
So now that people who have a BNS attached to their Stacks wallet,
when they make a transaction and you're checking through the transactions,
for example, if I went to Leo right now,
I'd see that someone called Kimbo.btc sold 25,000 stacks.
So it tells you automatically who that person might be.
And that's something we've adopted from our times of trading, actually.
You won't be able to find data like that on DexScreener or DexTools,
but we've actually adopted that from OpenSea back in the days of NFT trading.
So people would connect their ENS to their OpenSea profiles.
And if they're buying or selling NFTs, you'd see their ENS and who's trading.
So this is just an easy functionality to allow people to see.
I mean, once Stacks really gets going and people are wallet watching,
seeing, you know, who's going to find...
There's BNS names that you've kind of labeled addresses as or...
Sorry?
Is it like the .btc kind of BNS names that you've labeled addresses as?
Okay, correct.
Cool.
So you'll see them as makers if they've got it connected to their wallet.
So just looking at Leo's front page,
I can see a guy called Kimbo, BTC, Capsicum, OrbitalX, VHole.
I mean, if you're watching Roo,
one of the bigger whales in Stacks ecosystem, Falcon Capital,
he spent a bunch of money on Roo.
Of course.
Of course, Falcon Capital.
That's a big shout out to Falcon Capital as always.
Yes.
If you take a quick look on Roo as well,
I'll bring it up.
If I click Roo,
click into holders at the middle of...
For those who don't know,
Falcon Capital is sort of like,
it's this very mysterious big Stacks whale whale
who is somehow everywhere.
Like, you sort of look at transactions
and you're like,
oh, okay,
like, who bought this coin?
It's like, boom,
Falcon Capital right there.
I think also a single digit percent holder of Deco
and stuff like this.
So definitely a wallet to follow
if you want the alpha.
Falcon Capital will be to see.
But yeah, keep going.
Yeah, you jump on Roo,
jump on holders.
Falcon Capital is the top holder.
He spent 60K on Roo.
And then you can go through his portfolio
and check that he's got,
you know, he's holding Welsh,
Lio, Roo, Gus.
And like you said,
he's got, yeah,
$700,000 of Deco.
So he's a big fan of a lot of meme coin trading
and DeFi trading in Stacks.
And I've spoken to him as his trader a lot otherwise.
But that's a really good feature for us,
I think,
because BNS is one of the cornerstones
of Stacks as well.
And then looking into just other things,
we've introduced social links.
So projects can actually
lodge a ticket with us
and you'll be able to get,
and we'll verify their social links,
such as their Discord, Twitter,
Telegram,
and website.
But the point of doing that as well
is it's more of a DEX screen,
a DEX tools kind of thing.
It's putting a little bit of onus on tokens
that especially when you see a lot more tokens
start launching
and people are seeing the new deployed tokens,
they can hopefully lodge a ticket with us pretty quickly.
And then you can find out more information
about them as well
if you see them on Stacks tools,
but you don't see them anywhere else.
Because that'll lead into more features
that we will have for Stacks tools,
especially with Vela and Alex's new programs
in relation to tokens and launch pads.
So we want to hopefully have something up on Stacks tools
where you can see when tokens are deploying
and when they can be traded.
And then you'll be able to go in
and see their social links
if they do verify with us.
And then just another other features
like, you know, candlestick data,
15-minute data,
which is not really helpful
because Stacks is still running on block times.
And yeah, that's a lot of things that we've done.
One thing I do want to,
maybe it's a little challenge for Vela and Alex
because they're moving in from...
listing tokens to launch pad and governance.
Tokens voted by way of governance now
on being listed on Alex and Vela.
I think what people would like to see
from Alex and Vela
is just the launching of coins
without having a governance vote,
just more decentralized.
I think that'll increase the rugs
by about a hundred times,
but also increase the amount of tokens
that will be deployed
and just increase the degeneracy of DeFi,
especially when people are coming from Sol,
Ethereum,
and Bitcoin users onto Stacks.
And what they'd be used to be trading is,
you know, just tokens.
People might have some good ideas of meme coins
and they just want to deploy
and maybe it catches on a lot more
than they expected
and it turned into something big.
So, I mean,
you wouldn't really have the expectation
of listing before them.
But, I mean,
that's what I want to see next,
if I'm being honest.
For sure, for sure.
I do wholeheartedly agree.
There is this, like,
lame thing, perhaps.
I guess you guys have thought about that,
maybe Filip or Hadam.
Like, I know there's some technical limitations
for making that possible on Stacks, right?
But, I'm curious for your thoughts.
I think anyone can deploy on StacksSwap right now, right?
But, not yet on other DEXs.
Yeah, that's right.
Everyone can deploy on StacksSwap right now,
but not on Alex or Vela right now.
So, I mean,
I think everyone would love to see Alex and Vela
getting down and dirty
with the degenerate trading.
Sure.
Well, I'll post to the top of the spaces.
But, just yesterday,
we launched self-service token listing on Alex.
And so,
you'd have to have your token
and your contract already created.
But if you do,
there's now,
on our pool page at the top,
there's a, you know,
a create a self-service listing
where you can submit the pool contract,
submit token contracts,
set the parameters,
submit from the backend,
and our devs will check
that the token contract meets the SIP10 parameters.
And the second is that we just verify
that the token content isn't affiliated
with anything derogatory.
So, those are the two tests.
I mean,
and then if it comes to test two,
if it is a token
that has very strong community support,
we might have a community vote
in order to approve it.
So, it isn't completely permissionless yet.
That's, you know,
this was already a big step
from where we were before.
But that's the direction
that we're moving in.
But yes, it gives a really,
with all the tokens,
I'm sure we've all seen
being airdropped to our wallets.
You know,
they can now,
without having to reach out
to the Alex team
and go through a more onerous process,
just go through
our self-service listing portal
and have their tokens listed
on our AMM decks
so that they have access
to the, you know,
largest liquidity base on Alex.
And so, yeah,
we're excited to have that.
and to see those first listings
come up.
Will there be any assistance
to people
that can actually deploy contracts?
I guess because not,
I mean,
I would say
probably 90% of people
that want to deploy a contract
or a meme coin
don't know how to do it,
basically,
or wouldn't know how to do it
on stacks at all, actually.
That isn't something
that we have at the moment.
This is just sort of a beta
that we've just launched.
But, you know,
we have our year to the ground
and, you know,
if that's the strong
community feedback we have,
it's something that we may
consider going forward.
But, yeah,
at the moment,
it's just,
yeah,
the token has already
to be existing
in order to be listed.
sounds good.
Should I just shield Leo now?
What's the vibes?
What's the vibes
of the space?
I mean,
oh, yeah,
it's...
I mean,
it's a cat season.
It's,
it's,
yeah,
yeah,
but what,
yeah,
I mean,
I've heard about this.
I've seen people
talk about cat season.
But,
why is it cat season?
Like,
I'm actually curious.
Why is it cat season?
Why is it cat season?
Well,
look,
I can't,
I can't tell you exactly
why it's cat season,
but I'll give you the breakdown
of what I understand
about crypto
and meme coins,
okay?
we all know it's been run
essentially by dog coins,
okay?
There's no,
it's no fighting that fact.
The main dog coin is Doge.
The second coin behind that
is Shiba.
And now,
our third challenger
has arisen
and it's,
it's a dog with hat,
which is basically trading
at 4 billion.
And I'm pretty sure
one month ago,
I was looking at it
and it was about 200 million.
dog coins have ruled the world
and it all,
I think,
stems from this tweet
from GCR,
who is a well-known trader.
I think everyone knows
who GCR is
and he said,
this is in February 9,
2023.
He said,
waiting for a LMEO
token that catalyses
a paradigm shift
and meme
investing away
from dog tokens
to cat tokens.
there's always been
a thesis
of when are the
cat coins
going to start running?
And there's been
a few cat coins
essentially escalating
in Solana,
I would say,
that probably started
this run.
I think Popcat
was really the first one
that went to about
300 million
that I've seen.
And then recently,
a random cat coin
called Mew.
And Mew is essentially,
I mean,
if anyone's played Pokemon,
I assume everyone
in this space
has played
or knows what Mew is.
They've called this
cat coin Mew.
And they say,
and they say,
it's a cat
and a dog's world.
And I mean,
I probably shouldn't
be speaking about rumours,
but the rumours are
that the coin market cap
founder
is involved with Mew.
And Mew
very quickly
to about
700 million
market cap.
I saw it
pretty,
I didn't see that.
I mean,
well,
if you look at,
I've got one of my
chats that actually
scanned Mew
at like 700k
market cap
or something.
And it gives us
a reminder
at 500x
or 1,000x
that you scanned
this coin first
and no one ever
bought it.
I don't think
anyone bought it.
So it's just
a reminder
that we missed
generational wealth
on a Mew coin.
And so that's
kind of sparked
cat season
because,
you know,
massive,
what's the,
one ship,
one tide lifts
all boats
or something.
Yeah.
One floating
tide,
I don't know,
lifts all boats.
So one cat
coin goes to
almost a billion.
I think it almost
hit a billion
at the top.
And then you just
see cats
cats running
now.
So you see
there's a nub
cat,
Ansem now.
Ansem,
so Ansem
shilling
keyboard cat.
He's now
shilling his own
cat,
which is called
Hobbs,
which is at
50 million
market cap.
And this is
where,
this is where
I see the
inflection point
between
Solana
and Stax
because as
everyone will
know,
Manib,
the founder
of Stax
and the
father of
Leo,
is also the
co-founder of
Zeus.
Ansem,
who's like the
main character,
now talks about
Zeus' network.
Zeus appears to be
some kind of
bridge between
Solana
and Stax.
If people want
to go check
Zeus,
I think they've
got a test
next.
There might be
some rewards
for,
you know,
testing the
BTC tokens
on there and
depositing it.
It's not really
working for me
right now,
but that's
where I see
the inflection
point of
cat season,
Leo,
the son of
Manib,
Manib working
on this
sole,
quasi-Bitcoin
bridge,
I think it
I don't know
exactly yet.
And everyone's
just buying
cat coins.
So buy Leo
is essentially
what I'm
getting at.
I think that
was a good
history.
What do you
think about
that?
Any questions
about cat
season?
That was a
great overview,
man.
I love it.
I learned
something too.
I knew
about the
GCR tweet,
but it's
still refreshing
to hear the
whole story.
And I think
maybe I
dreamt that.
I'm not quite
sure, but
wasn't Elon
Musk's cat
or dog also
called Hobbies
or something?
I don't know.
So Ansem's
cat, which is
called Hobbs,
is also Elon's
dog, which is
called Hobbs.
I don't know
where.
I think,
is it from a
show?
Calvin and
Hobbs.
Hobbs is
a cat
from, or
a tiger,
kind of,
from a
show called
Calvin and
Hobbs.
I think it
must be a
famous American
kind of thing
because I
never watched
it in
Australia.
I wouldn't
know.
I don't
know.
I don't
even know
how to
pronounce it.
Yeah,
Hobbs.
Right,
Hobbs.
All right.
No, it's
very fascinating.
Two main
characters that
have animals
with the
same name.
That must
be, yeah,
I don't know
if it's
coincidence,
but it's
certainly
interesting.
But I
understood.
And that's
what's
interesting as
well, because
people follow
what characters
shill,
essentially,
or that's
what the
meta essentially
is in
meme coins,
and that's
what gets
things started,
right?
So Toshi
is Brian
Armstrong's
cat.
Miro is
Toli's
pet or
dog,
I can't
remember now.
I think
it's
dog.
Kimbo
is one
of the
head of
DeFi
AVAX's
dog as
well.
And now
you've got
Ansem now
with Hobbs.
I mean,
Elon's dog
Hobbs also
ran on
Ethereum maybe
two or three
years ago.
Actually,
it went
pretty high.
Vitalik has
a cat
called
Hemule,
or Hemule,
I don't know
how you
pronounce it.
And if
you look at
Ansem as
well,
he shills
Welch
daily as
well.
Not daily,
he shills
Stacks and
Welsh from
time to
time,
and Bitcoin
L2 is
something he's
very fond
And I
mean,
he talks
about Zeus
as well,
and I'm
pretty sure
Zeus has
some big
things coming
as well when
you look
at how
that might
affect Stacks
I probably
need to go
through some
spaces and
learn about
what Maneed
might have
said about
how it
could impact
Bitcoin L2
and Solana.
Because if
the Solana
volume comes
here,
I think
watch out
for Stacks
DeFi,
to be honest.
For sure,
man.
Fascinating,
yeah,
as I said.
Very cool.
So yeah,
conclusion is
we should all
anticipate
cat season
on Stacks
got the
message.
I'm giving
you the
alpha.
I'm giving
you the
front row.
Awesome,
cool.
Jacob,
are you
back?
Can you
hear us
and can
you speak?
I can
try.
Can you
guys hear
Yes,
yes.
I can hear
you.
Great.
Yeah,
nice.
I lost
internet
connections.
Sorry for
that.
No worries.
You were
talking about
Hermeticus
faults and
how it
works or
how it
bought or
not or
sold all
options.
I don't
know anything
about options,
but feel free
to go ahead
and come
continue your
conversation
with Daiko.
Yeah,
I think that
most people
don't know
anything about
options.
you know,
this is like
a little bit
of a complex
topic in the
finance world.
Options are
the most
sophisticated and
complex and
hard to
understand
financial
instrument.
I don't
expect anybody
here to
understand it.
Also,
it is not
necessary to
understand it
to use our
vault product.
We deliberately
design the
front end and
the educational
materials so you
don't have to
understand it.
But I can
give a short
rundown just
to give a
little bit more
color.
Essentially,
the big
difference between
our Medica
vaults and
vaults that you
are familiar
with in other
DeFi protocols is
that we don't
sell options,
we buy options.
Selling options
exposes you to
a lot of
tail risk.
You make a
little bit of
money.
Most of the
time you lose
a lot of
money if you're
wrong.
What Nassim
Taleb calls
the turkey
problem.
The turkey is
happy getting
fed and getting
bigger every
day until one
fateful day he
all of a sudden
dies, which is
Thanksgiving.
We don't want
to be the
turkey.
We want to
have vaults
that have no
tail risk but
defined risk and
give you specific
leverage or earn
abilities on top of
that.
We don't sell,
we buy options.
The strategy that
we're running for
the bull vault is
quite sophisticated.
It's been designed
by the quant
traders at
2' and it
essentially buys
two different
options, two
different binary
call options.
Binary call
options are
options that give
you a defined
payout if you
cross a barrier.
If you go above
a specific price,
you get a specific
amount of stacks.
These two options
are one at the
money option that
gives you a
base yield since
it's at the
money gets hit
quite often.
In a bull market
you get that
paid out, I
think it's around
80% of the
time.
That is
essentially a
small yield
coming in all
the time and
that allows you
to stay invested
into the vault so
you can hit the
other option,
which is a far
out of the money
option, that if
it gets hit,
has a significant
payout.
You can think
of it like
you have a
small yield
coming in most
of the time and
if there's a
big move, you
capture that
big move with
a big payout.
In option
terms, it's a
50 delta and
a 20 delta
option.
It's a
combination of
two different
options.
There's also
the yield from
staking because
it's state
stacks.
You get a
base yield from
one option,
you get another
yield from the
staking rewards,
and then you get
a big payout
on big moves.
In a bull market
we've seen in the
backtest 70%
yield on the
20 delta
option.
I hope that
makes sense.
It probably
doesn't to most
people.
Again, it's
super complex
stuff.
I myself have
to wrap my
head around
a lot of
this stuff.
This is
literally designed
by some of
the best
traders in
the industry.
We don't
expect you to
understand this,
but essentially
we are making
financial products
available to you
that are usually
and this is not
just marketing
speak.
This is usually
reserved for
high net worth
individuals,
institutions,
people with
10 million
plus in
their portfolio.
You can
come and
deposit as
much as
0.1 stacks
or state
stacks into
the vault
and take
advantage of
these kinds
of strategies.
I'll sub
there.
I definitely
second the
notion that
options are
complicated but
very interesting
and I remember
trying it once
in traditional
markets of
stocks during
COVID time in
2020.
I was very
bored and I
just wanted to
say that yes,
what Jacob
is offering
with Hermetica
is awesome
because it
gives you
access to
options.
It is
definitely an
added value
and I had
to contact
my broker.
I had to
send them
an email
to enable
options trading
specifically for
stocks.
In the end,
I never did
because I
didn't know
what the hell
I was doing.
I'm not going
to touch this
but now that I
know that
Hermetica
automates this
for me,
I'm happy to
try this out.
That's just my
experience with
options and
that I'm
interested in.
I'm sure there's
a lot more
people that are
in the same
situation as
I am.
Yeah, I know
options are
super interesting.
They're super
complex so you
can do a lot
of stuff with
Our products
are a
simplified version
of options.
You don't have
to understand
options.
I want to
emphasize that.
You just
have to
have a
specific
either you
want to
earn yield
there's going
to be
earn vaults
or you
have a
specific
directional
bias on
the market.
You're
bullish on
stacks,
you're
bearish on
stacks,
you're
bullish on
Bitcoin and
then you
can express
that by
depositing into
the vault or
then buying the
token on the
open market.
You can think
of it like an
ETF if you
want.
An ETF is a
structured product.
An ETF you
can buy and
it gives you
in a Bitcoin
world just
exposure to
Bitcoin which
is a great
product but
it's pretty
simple,
very boring.
Our products
are kind of
like ETFs but
they give you
exposure to
leverage.
That's how you
can think of
Sweet.
Yeah,
definitely.
We'll try it
out.
And so,
just a very
dumb question
perhaps,
but so the
yield,
it is
denominated in
STX or
how is it
paid out?
So the
vault is
denominated in
STX and
all the
yield will
be paid
in STX.
Awesome.
So if
people don't
get on the
OG list,
can they
still try it
out or is
it just
gapped with
the OGs or
how does it
work?
Yeah,
so the OGs
will be the
first ones to
get access.
There's only
42 so there's
obviously a
very limited
space there.
It's for people
that have a
significant amount
of state
stacks.
Once those
are onboarded
and we are
comfortable that
everything is
smooth,
we will
onboard more
and more
people.
You can
just watch
our Twitter
for more
announcements.
There will
be more
tiers of
people that
can come
and experience
the app and
get whitelisted.
It will be a
whitelisted
experience for
the foreseeable
future and
then at some
point it will
be open for
everybody.
But yeah,
stay tuned to
our Twitter.
Subscribe to
our waiting
list if you
want to get
access to the
whitelist.
That's exclusive
for the
waitlist.
So get on
hermedica.fi
put in your
email and
watch out for
the emails that
come in in the
next weeks.
And yeah,
come into our
Discord, ask us
questions and
engage.
We are now
coming out of
stealth mode.
We've been
building this
for a year
and a half
really.
And there's a
lot of nuance,
there's a lot of
interesting things
we can chat
about and
come in and
chat with us.
We're there.
Very cool,
very cool.
I'm going to
drop my email
address.
Definitely want
to try this.
So yeah,
anyone who
heard this,
42 people
starting tomorrow
if you want
to be an
might be
other benefits
to being an
I don't know,
but I need
to be an
so there's
going to be a
really cool
NFT that
comes with
hand-drawn
by a good
friend of
mine,
no AI.
And then
that NFT
will give you
a multiplier
to our
upcoming
point system.
Yes,
you heard
that right,
you heard
it here.
All right,
get those
NFTs.
And yeah,
I like that
it's not AI
generated.
The robots
still have not
taken over,
so looking
forward to
that NFT.
Cool,
I have to
drop in two
minutes,
but if
someone from
the audience
wants to
ask a
question or
chat,
feel free
to ask
for the
mic,
and yeah,
we'll have
you on.
Nice,
yeah,
so much
to talk
about.
I'm not
sure,
Adan,
how you
are on
time.
I would
also have
to get
going
recently
soon,
but one
thing we
want to
share is
that on
the Zest
vertical side,
we just
enabled
STX loans
against
STSTX.
It's been
going pretty
well.
It's been
like,
I think,
well,
roughly
100,000
deposited,
so that's
like 350k.
But yeah,
there's basically
some interesting
strategies that
can be done
there.
I mean,
stablecoin
liquidity
remains
quite low
on stack,
so it's
quite hard
to enable
significant
leverage,
where people
can borrow
a lot of
stables
against
STSTX.
But a
really interesting
strategy in the
meantime,
with all this
activity of
stacks tokens,
is STX loans
against STSTX.
So basically,
on Zest
protocol now,
people can post
STSTX and
borrow STX
against it.
And then
obviously the
play there
could be
to sell
that STX
to buy
something that
could go up
quicker.
And that's
something that
we've launched
and of course
Zest
protocol is
still in
whitelist
phase,
so if you
want to
have access,
definitely head
to zestprotocol.com,
launch the
app and make
sure you're
on the,
you request
whitelist,
and we're
processing them
almost daily
now,
so it can
come quick.
But yeah,
that's basically
a very exciting
way to have
more uncat
leverage,
you know,
as compared
to stablecoins
which have to
remain capped
for some
time,
and Arcadeco
which is also
fully maxed
out,
so people
looking to
go long
stuff,
it's basically
that tool
that we've
put out
there more.
Yeah,
so there's
a lot of
new stuff,
but yeah,
I'm not sure
if we should
maybe wrap
things up,
if that's the
best way to
go here.
I'm not sure
if you have
any thoughts
on that
so far.
it's been,
you know,
it's been a
good week,
a busy week.
For the first
time on Alex,
we reached
200 million
TVL.
Yeah,
the Lisa
whitelist
is ongoing.
We've launched
Alex trading
on Uniswap
using the
Xlink bridge
to bridge
over to
Ethereum.
and yeah,
we just
had an
IDEO
conclude
and there's
voting live
for,
it might be
two projects
although one
might just
be wrapping
up and so
yeah,
definitely
plenty going
on in the
ecosystem.
Awesome,
awesome,
awesome.
I think then
yeah,
maybe,
you know,
in terms of
signing off,
like,
Jacob,
do you want
to share
people where
can they
find you?
What should
they do?
And then
I guess
pass it on
to Leo
and to
Haddad
and then
I can
close things
out.
Yeah,
appreciate it.
Thanks,
Tycho.
Yeah,
just follow
our Twitter,
Hermedica
at Hermedica
go to our
website,
Hermedica
dot Fi,
sign up for
our waiting
list and
watch out for
the invites
to sign up
for the
wait list
to come
in in the
next couple
of weeks.
And yeah,
that's it.
Hope to see
you in the
vaults.
Yes,
Leo,
you can
follow us
leocoinstacks
on this
account or
for updates
on the
Stacks
Tools
website,
you can
follow us
or also
Discord.
You can
see,
you can
find it
in our
link tree.
And if
you do
want to
follow
some of
you can
follow me
F-O-M-O-T
and also
Rubes,
R-E-U-B-S,
that you might
find him as
well.
So thank
you for
having us.
All right,
everyone.
And Alex,
you can
follow the
account here
on the
Spaces.
You can
check us
out on
Discord,
discord.gg
slash
Alex Lab.
Yeah,
plenty of
announcements
coming in
the next
days.
And so
stay
tuned.
Thank
you.
Yeah,
and to
learn more
about
Zest
Protocol,
of course,
feel free
to follow
me or
Zest
Protocol
Twitter.
And yeah,
whitelist
is coming
in almost
daily now,
so make
sure you're
on there.
And yeah,
have access
to the
largest
leverage
platform
or the
most
uncapped
leverage
platform
Stacks
right now.
Also to
justice
there,
of course.
it's
Stacks
season,
so let's
get this
going.
We're
back
10 a.m.
same day,
Tuesday,
next week
for number
13 of the
Stacks
DeFi show.
We started
numbering them
because we
already had
so many.
But yeah,
this place for all
the alpha and
learn about new
protocols launching
on Stacks and
new strategies to
do every week
as we get to the
Bitcoin halving,
Nakamoto release,
and all this
really,
really exciting
momentum that's
coming in the
ecosystem.
So yeah,
remember you're
early and
yeah,
let's
reconvene next
week.
I mean,
just before you
end,
Tycho,
my name is
actually speaking
in a
Zeus,
Bitcoin and
thing about
Zeus network
now.
So maybe
people want to
head on to
that if
people find
it interesting
to find out
what's
happening.
Yeah,
yeah,
yeah.
Well,
that's something
a good piece
there to point
if you want to
continue listening,
you know,
add money on
Twitter and
figure out
where he's
hanging out
for the
latest news
there.
But yeah,
that was it
for now,
I guess,
signing off.
And yeah,
let's chat
more next week.
All right,
everyone,
take care.
Bye.
Host
stacks.btc
from
Stacks Staking
