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The Stacks DeFi Show #93
Recorded: Dec. 16, 2025 Duration: 0:42:49Space Recording
Short Summary
Exciting developments are on the horizon for the Stacks ecosystem, with the imminent launch of USDCX and Zest V2, alongside the introduction of the Bitflow DEX, signaling a robust growth phase. As the crypto community anticipates a shift towards tokenization in 2026, the momentum in DeFi projects continues to build, promising enhanced liquidity and user experiences.
Full Transcription
Thank you. Thank you. Hello, everybody.
Just checking if this works.
I have a few microphones running at the same time.
There we go.
I think that was one of them.
But let's see.
Maybe if someone could give me a thumbs up, if they hear me,
that would be much appreciated.
A thumbs up from GPSC.
That's very reassuring.
And Martin and Staxx.
Great.
Then I assume that I'm audible, which is just great.
Just checking Martin, are you there as well?
GM, guys, yeah, I'm here.
Amazing.
Amazing, amazing, amazing.
Just making sure to do you hear any background noise or any echo when I speak?
Or is it all clear?
All clear here.
Brilliant, brilliant, brilliant, brilliant.
I couldn't get the, turn the sound off on one of the speakers.
But yeah, that's great.
Yeah, I think, well, first of all, it's great that we're all here.
And yeah, for episode number 93 of the Stacks DeFi show.
So we're getting close to 100.
And yeah, of course, for everyone tuning in or maybe listening back to this later,
this is the place where we talk about all the developments in uh in stacks and you know bitcoin defy more more generally and
you know the platform where all the builders get together to um to talk and uh builders and power
users you know people like martin and yeah we talk about all the you know new developments in
the ecosystem things that we're working on just just kind of to have an open space to chat
about all those things and for everyone to get a sense of what's going on
in the ecosystem.
But yeah, Stacks always asks us to just do one thing, which is to briefly
mention that, of course, everything that we share here is for informational purposes only
and should not be considered financial advice.
Yeah, and I guess without further ado, we can just do some introductions.
I can very quickly go first.
I'm Tycho, co-founder of Zest Protocol,
the main DeFi protocol on Stacks
and the largest in terms of TVL,
around $80 million of TVL and the home to over 650 SPTC,
which is the Bitcoin on Stacks.
And yeah, some of which is Martin's, I'm sure.
Maybe you wanna give a quick intro as well, Martin.
Sure. GM, GM, everyone. My name is Martin Taylor. I'm the founder and CEO of Not A Strategy,
ticker code Nasty. We are a meme coin on Stacks. We're a Bitcoin treasury meme coin.
We're actually the third biggest meme coin on Stax now, I think just behind Leo and Walsh
and just ahead of Plaid Earth.
So we're keeping good company there.
We run a real Bitcoin treasury that funds our community.
And we are active on the Stacks protocols like Zest,
just educating people and promoting the benefits of Bitcoin DeFi
and especially on Stacks.
Yeah, that's amazing.
That's amazing.
And I'm just getting all the news from the past week up here.
But I think the main thing that's going to happen this coming week is, of course,
the launch of USDCX on Stacks.
So it's just going to go live first and um you know the bridge
is going live and people can mint it and then applications will likely go live um early in in
the new year and we hope to do that potentially this this this week but um but yeah things got
a little bit a little bit tight and um there were you know some security remediation still to do on the USDCX side, which pushed
the process back a little bit.
But yeah, happy to chat about that also.
I'm happy to chat a bit about some of the developments around Zest V2.
But before we get into that, Martin, you're a big user of Stax, a big user of stablecoins on Stax.
What do you think the, you know, how do you see the, you know, the coming of UCCX and how do you think it will impact the ecosystem and your use cases personally?
It's, you know, it's the stablecoin of choice.
It's just going to bring more liquidity onto, into stacks, and it just gives stacks that
extra layer of credibility of having access to a wider, deeper pool of capital.
So looking forward to it.
Looking forward to see, I mean, I do a lot of transfers between, you know, Ethereum and
Stax and Solana.
I mean, Nasty is listed on Solana as well as Stacks these days.
So I'm always sort of transferring money from Solana back into Stacks after we do ATM token sales.
And, you know, at the moment using AllBridge.
And so there's a constant need to transfer the US dollar C between different layers, different protocols.
So anything that makes that easier, anything that reduces that friction, anything that makes it not just easier for myself, but for people that are interested in using DeFi and
interested in investing in meme coins.
The USDC development is a very welcome development indeed.
And I think it's going to be very positive for Stacks.
Yeah, I think that's very true and a very good summary there.
And it would echo all of that, right?
I mean, so far in the ecosystem, we've had AEUSDC, which is the old bridge USDC.
And while it served the ecosystem well, it's obviously not the stable coin of choice around the world.
So it's great that USDC isc is coming and that you know we can we can bridge it
over um and um and yeah with the coming of usdcx there's also going to be a lot of you know new
protocols launching right in the stacks defy space or upgrades to protocols um rather and um and yeah
that's just going to be like the kind of the new bedrock of the ecosystem, right?
One piece of that is the Bitflow concentrated liquidity DEX, which will just allow for a much better trading experience in stacks.
And then there's, of course, HBTC coming from Heretica, right?
from heretica, the BTC yield vault.
The BTC yield vault.
But then also, very importantly,
the upgraded Zest V2,
and it's the backbone for lending on Stacks.
And yeah, Martin, I mean, since you're such a power user
of Zest, wanted to maybe live share some uh some sneak peeks into
zest v2 and some of the things that we've been uh we've been working on um and um yeah maybe to help
you understand some of the trade-offs that we made and how how um yeah how this is going to benefit
um you know people like uh people who use the protocol like you so um so yeah i thought we could maybe you
know chat a little bit about uh about that i know we haven't really shared shared much uh about the
new design but um but yeah i just thought we could uh we could talk it talk it through together and
then uh you know also for the benefit of everyone uh everyone tuning in uh sure sounds good. I'm all ears. I mean, of all the protocols I've been using on Stax,
Zest is definitely the one that has been the one that comes across as the slickest. It's
been low latency, it's never been any dramas with wallets. My know my hat off to you in that regards it's you know very
sort of from a technical point of view it's been very uh very professional i've had very little
problems with it um and that's what you need when you know you sort of you want that confidence when
you're using um a d5 platform um and you know we've we've slowly built up our treasure on there. We've got borrowings
of $130,000, $140,000 against our Bitcoin and against our looped stack. So the markets
have been volatile. And when you have volatile markets, the last thing you
want is for there to be issues when you're trying to put on or take off DeFi trades,
repay or make new loans.
So it's been very smooth.
So yeah, that's great.
I'm interested to know what the changes are and what-
Yeah, what we great. Interesting. I'm interested to know what the changes are and what we can do better.
Yeah, what we can do better.
From a user's point of view, or from your point of view,
I'm wondering what you're targeting to make the improvements in.
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, they're very minor.
So I think it isn't very minor.
It's not like a complete change.
You know, it's not like everything is sort of working completely differently.
It still looks the same.
It still feels the same.
It's just that there's a couple of things that have been changed, which, you know, make the system, you know, much more efficient.
Like, and those three things are basically like, you know, one risk groups groups, two, like, smoother liquidations, and three, the option to turn off rehypothecation.
But maybe to kind of, you know, quickly go through them one by one, right?
So for risk groups, you've maybe noticed that on Zest protocol today, if you go on there, that you can't borrow SDX, for example,
at the moment because it's at cap.
And yeah, and there are like some other things in the protocol that are currently capped, right?
Like the amount of debt to get staked SDX or, you know, things like that.
And essentially, you know, but the, you know,
the example of SDX is probably the the best one right um and
the amount of stx that can be borrowed is capped today because um people can borrow stx at 70
ltv or 60 ltv against against sptc so someone can come in with SPTC, borrow STX, stake it.
I mean, that's a great yield strategy, right?
But if STX would suddenly go up a lot, then you can get liquidated there, right?
Because the asset that you borrow is, you know, STX and it's quite volatile.
So what that means is that, um, you're always kind of limited in the system on
whatever the most, you the most volatile asset is,
right? Or the most, you know, basically the weakest link, right? So you have to kind of always look at
the worst case scenario and look, okay, what's the weakest link here? Oh, yeah. Borrowing SDX against
SBTC. Okay, that's why we have to cap all of the SDX borrowing, right? Whereas the only problem
really is like borrowing SDX against SBTC, because if people borrow SDX against staked SDX and SDX borrowing, right? Whereas the only problem really is like borrowing SDX against SBTC because if people borrow SDX against staked SDX
and SDX goes up, then the collateral also goes up.
So it's not a problem.
But borrowing SDX against SBTC is a problem.
But that's why we have to cap all the borrowing of SDX
in the system, right?
Which is like a bit unfortunate.
Now, the way that v2 fixes that is basically with risk groups.
That's kind of what we call it.
But basically, what it allows us to do
is to basically say, OK, if you borrow SDX against SVTC,
yeah, then you can only borrow it at 20% LTV or 30%.
But if you borrow SDX against staked SDX, then you can do it at 80, right?
And we can do the same thing, the same things for stable coins, right?
We can kind of split out.
Okay.
Like USDCX is very liquid because it's USDC.
So we can allow you to borrow this much, but USDH is less so.
So we can only allow this much.
All right.
And that way we can basically kind of tweak risks
in the system more.
But yeah, what that means for users
is just less blocking on borrowing, right?
Because today, you might come to the app and you see, wow,
I can borrow SDX for only 2% or something or 1.5.
But then when you go there, you actually
can't take it out yet
so yeah that's one that's risk groups so basically yeah we'll just allow for more borrowing then two there's also smoother liquidations so today like if you if your position hits the liquidation
level you just get liquidated for half the position. And in the new system, there is essentially kind of a,
there's not one liquidation threshold, but there are two.
So there is kind of like a moment where the liquidation
starts, and then there is a moment where
the full position is liquidated.
So if you hit the first liquidation threshold,
then the liquidator can come in and just basically
liquidate a small part of the position to kind of bring it back to health, not 50%,
but a smaller amount. And if the LTV hits the second liquidation threshold, if prices really
move violently, yeah, then like only then like a large part of the position is liquidated.
So yeah, essentially what it does is it makes the liquidation system a bit less brutal while obviously still building on, you know, the thousand or so liquidations that's just protocol processed over the last year.
So still keeping it safe, but basically, yeah, making sure that liquidations are not, yeah,
are not like as impactful for user balances
as they were before.
And then the final thing is also that a user can select
to not re-hypothecate their assets.
So if for some reason the user wants to borrow
against their estate stacks,
but doesn't want the protocol to lend them out, right?
Which also means that they won't earn extra yield on it.
Then they can choose to basically not do that with that little checkbox.
So, see if you want, you know, no rehypothecation, you can choose that.
And yeah, those are basically the main new things about V2.
Yeah, so Zest V2 is basically one, risk groups
for more efficient borrowing.
Two, smoother liquidations to make it less likely
that full positions get liquidated.
And three, the option to choose no rehab
authentication on collateral.
So Martin, what do you think?
Yeah, great.
I mean, the liquidation process is really important.
You've got to strike a balance between, you know, having, making sure the health of the protocol is maintained, especially during volatile times.
And you want the liquidations to go as smoothly as possible and you want people to know where
they stand with liquidations and to have proper notification or proper user interface just show them their position and show them where
the risks are. And that's pretty well spelled out.
One thing I really haven't delved into much is the actual process of liquidating. People
can liquidate. Is that how it works if you get access to the, I've just never really seen
where you can find a table of people that are about to be liquidated.
I know when I was involved with Arcadeco you could see who was being liquidated. I think
they were liquidated by the system but you could see who was in danger.
And I think there was a process to liquidate them.
I'm not too sure how that works on Zest.
Yeah.
So because Zest Protocol has so many users
and so many different assets that can be borrowed,
it's, yeah this such a system exists
but only only internally rents and anyone can run such a system uh it just takes quite a deep
and decent amount of overhead right to um essentially you know create the the indexing
and get all the get all the vaults or all the positions from all the users who have borrowed
on this protocol and and so on.
So if someone would want to liquidate,
that's kind of what they would have to do, right?
So they would have to index the full protocol,
like run a full node, and in that way,
like, yeah, be aware of all the positions that exist.
So it's something that's kind of, you know,
not accessible on like a UI level
because it would just be, yeah, it's a bit too complicated, right?
And it would not really be possible to show that to users.
Okay. So it's done by the protocol or people that just have access to that?
Yeah. So obviously, like, you know, we run liquidators, right?
Just as this protocol team.
And then there's also like external people who we don't
know who sometimes liquidate someone.
So it's an open process, right?
It's open to anyone.
But if you'd want to liquidate, you need like a little bit
of a setup, right?
A bit of a technical setup to,
yeah, to make sure you have all that data.
Okay, sure.
Okay, sounds interesting.
As long, yeah, look, as long as it's done,
and it seems to be done efficiently.
And I mean, the history of the liquidations
has been good in regards to the health of the protocol, right?
I mean...
Yeah.
Exactly.
We've had a huge sell-off the last...
We had some pretty full-on days going back to October the 10th, I guess.
Yeah.
And there's been a lot of protocols that have been put under pressure,
but CES seems to come through it all.
Same as Granite and Stacks as a whole seems to have weathered
a very dramatic sell-off in BTC over the last three or four weeks
or a month or two now.
And BTC being the collateral of Stacks DeFi,
it's been a good test for the system and everyone involved, I think.
Yeah, it's been hard work.
But yeah, I mean, the has been been holding up well and uh
and also i think that you know the only protocol in stacks with this kind of magnitude of liquidations
right because um also on granite we don't really know yet like what their capacity to liquidate
really is because i don't think they've processed um the liquidation as far as i'm aware because
like all the borrowing is against btc right which is not not as volatile whereas in the Zest Protocol side there is borrowing against SDX and you know
that then really hardens the liquidation system right also for BTC if it would have to happen.
Sure I mean Stax SDX definitely has been under a bit of pressure for sure.
So I can imagine people coming under liquidation problems there.
And that brings up another sort of use for Zest in terms of borrowing.
We've been using it to put on some shorts as well. So we went into this downturn
a little bit too leverage. So we've, number one, tried to reduce our leverage, but number
two, we've restructured our borrowings and taken a lot of the USDC borrowings and turned them into stacks and SBTC borrowings just to sort of do a short-term
overlay of a short position while we reduce our leverage. So that's sort of worked well.
So that's another thing you can do. You just, you just borrow Stacks, you borrow SBTC,
you then sell it for USDC and effectively you short that,
you short those tokens and you use the USDC to repay your debt
if you have that debt.
So, you know, that's sort of a short-term
or a long-term trading strategy you can do. That's
something we've done a bit just to try and do a bit of a trade with this downturn. So
that's been interesting. And the liquidity has been there to do it. So hats off to Zest for having the
liquidity to be able to do that. And that's all gone fairly smoothly. And I think just generally,
I think with Stax, we still, especially in the DEXs,
we still need a little bit more liquidity.
It's still a bit difficult if you want to sell one Bitcoin
or half a Bitcoin or even 0.1% of a Bitcoin.
There's still quite a bit of slippage.
So hopefully the Bitflow upgrade will address that.
And I know, you know, I thought it was a really good call yesterday,
the Bitcoin capital markets spaces a series.
I think you're talking in the one, another one tomorrow night.
Yeah, there's one tomorrow.
There's one tomorrow at 10 a.m. Eastern time.
Yeah.
Close spaces with that to make sure that everyone sets their alarms.
Yeah.
That's great.
Yeah.
I mean, I thought that was a great, I want to call it spaces,
because it wasn't spaces or podcasts, whatever, series.
Kyle was there and Rina, I think it is Rena, is it?
And Andre and all that. I mean, we've got a really good depth of
talent in the Stacks ecosystem and
they're very switched on to the institutional side of things.
And it was really, I think
it was good seeing Rena address the issue of, she said, we want
to see a situation where people can sell 1000 Bitcoin at a time.
I'm sure she was obviously exaggerating a bit there, but I think it's good that the Stacks endowment are aware of the need for more liquidity and
as a lot of the commentators in that mention, it's a bit of a chicken and egg situation
where people, a lot of the instos won't come over until the liquidity's there, but we need
the instos to get the liquidity.
So that sort of cycle needs to be broken.
And I think it slowly is being broken.
It's a dam that will slowly burst.
And I think you guys are up to 650 Bitcoin on CEST at the moment.
That's close to a record, isn't it, Tycho? Tycho Rieferle
The amount of SBTC currently, yeah. We're at all time highs.
Tycho Rieferle
Yeah, yeah. So that's great. And look, I really enjoyed the show yesterday. I mean,
there was some really good speakers from people that are really involved on the institutional side
and it highlighted both the opportunities and the challenges in getting institutions
across to DeFi.
There's still a bit of hesitancy there.
A lot of them sort of seduced by TradFi strategies with covered options.
And I know Tether do a lot of over-the-counter lending and all that sort of thing.
So there's still a bit of coaxing to get them into DeFi.
But a lot of the commentators there seem to think that for Treasury companies, DeFi really
is the home, is where they should be operating,
where these Bitcoin treasuries ultimately should be placing
at least, you know, a significant amount of their capital.
I think that will happen.
I think that will definitely happen.
It's just that, like, for most treasury companies,
it's also a bit of, like, an operational thing,
which is maybe something that they don't mention.
But it's quite difficult to explain when they kind of lose custody over their Bitcoin because they are wrapping it.
Whereas like when you, you know, say you're selling calls or you're selling puts or something on Bitcoin, then you obviously keep custody over the underlying Bitcoin.
The only thing you do is you sort of sell an option to sort of, you know,
to buy it at a certain price, right?
Or to sell it at a certain price.
So, yeah, it doesn't show up in any of the analytics and things that way.
And, you know, it looks familiar to accountants, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then something like, oh yeah, I now have SPTC on Stacks
or something like that.
But that will come.
I mean, I think there's also, you know,
some very exciting things in the works on the Stacks core team side
to sort of accommodate for this use case.
So, yeah, watch this space.
Yeah, definitely.
I mean, I know they're working stacks are working on um
doing a non-custodial um version of uh sbtc and it's kind of very very technical and very um
groundbreaking and um i think um you know just generally there's a lot of building going on
um across stacks you know you have everything from, I saw Rafa doing the ruins
capsules. There's another guy, I forgot his name, doing the X402 integration into stacks.
two integration into stacks um and then uh today i think um rubes announced uh the um his new
platform which is um covers yes bitcoin markets and i had a quick look at that i think uh is it
tenera tenera yeah i've pinned it here as the as the third tweet from the left um and uh i mean i
have had early access to it for a little bit already,
because I kind of helped Bruce with some testing and, you know, giving feedback and making sure
everything works well. But yeah, it's a really brilliant platform. You know, you can actually,
you know, check all the trades, the charts, and all the tokens on Stacks are really high quality.
So yeah, we definitely want anyone
to check it out now people definitely should check it out i i had a quick look and uh uh the first
thing that grabbed my eye was they had the heat map there when when you opened it up and uh uh
nasty was one of only two tokens in the green so i went great that's working perfect um but um yeah look it seemed really
slick and all the pricing seemed really really slick and up to date and there was a lot of
other information there on on ruins and other bitcoin protocols which i haven't had a chance
to look at so um hats off to rubes it's done it's been a big effort there so just one example of many guys building and not being deterred by the
mini bear market we're going through. Building during the bear is the way to go and
Hermetica are doing stuff and about to become a new guys who have done it. So, you know, hats off to everyone in Stax.
It's really a lot of momentum happening on the building side.
And, you know, there's a lot of positive things coming out
of the Argentina DevCon event.
So, you know, it's all as positive as it can be.
It's just, you know, we're all as positive as it can be.
It's just, you know, we're all going through a bit of a downturn with pricing and it's across the board.
So all you can do is build and manage your leverage, I guess,
and manage your positions and just weather the storm.
Yeah.
And also to share some thoughts there, right? So that's actually the first tweet I've pinned here on the storm. Yeah. And also to share some thoughts there, right?
So that's actually the first tweet I've pinned here on the left.
But I think 2026 is likely going,
it's going to be a very exciting year, right, in many respects.
But I think the most exciting thing,
which we had a little bit of a taste of in 2025,
is the whole tokenization theme.
In 2025, we had a stable coin fever.
You probably remember earlier this year
where Circle did its IPO,
and it went absolutely crazy, right?
And Wall Street really seemed to understand tokenized dollars, but you
know, now we're going to get tokenized everything.
You literally see the chair of the sec talking about how all financial
markets, you know, need to move on chain in the coming.
Well, two years is the kind of time, timeframes he's, uh, he's putting out
there.
So yeah, that's incredibly, incredibly bullish.
And, you know, traditional markets are also going to understand quite quickly that tokenization
doesn't just mean, you know, now you have stocks on the blockchain.
It means that you can now also program these stocks to do, you know, to do anything, right?
You could like, instead of just buying Tesla, you know, someone can make a protocol that splits out, you know, Tesla stock into all the different categories.
And you can just bet on, say, only the Optimus robot, right?
Only buy Tesla stock derivative that just tracks Optimus earnings or, you know, or things like that.
So it's really going to get very interesting on-chain. And the SEC has also said that all these experiments, they won't hold it against people.
So a little bit of a no, yeah, call it a no enforcement window to some extent where a
lot of experimentation can happen.
A lot of builders can come online to uh to do exciting things so i think that's really
going to lead to you know call it a big l1 trade right or l1 l2 trade because suddenly people
understand that how much you know financial financial engineering or financial innovation
is going to be possible you know using gas on block space so I think that will probably lead to a revaluation of some things like
ETH and SOL and by extension
also Stacks.
And then pair
that with the upcoming rate cuts.
And I think also for the Bitcoin ecosystem,
the launch of critical infrastructure
like BitVM3,
which is getting very close to
audit and will likely go live next
year. So I think some of those things are going to be very interesting to watch next year.
And looking back on this year, you know, it was basically a bear market, right, for altcoins.
And we didn't really know that going into it, but looking back, it was.
So, you know, that then usually means that the next year is up, right?
It reminds me a lot of 2022, where at the end of the year, you were like, yeah, we were
actually in a bear market and it was down, even though we thought, you know, all the
time that within a couple of weeks it could turn around.
And yeah, and then 2023 was the year where the reversal started happening, right?
So also expecting that for turn 26.
So I think it can be a much more strong and violent reversal
than 2023, which is still very slow and only
kind of started at the end of the year.
Because yeah, for this upcoming year,
there are just too many good catalysts.
So yeah, definitely good to keep an eye on that.
And yeah, I guess we can kind of slowly wrap up the spaces as well.
We've kind of covered all the main items.
But I know, GPSC, you're also here.
So just want to quickly get your take,
or if you want to point people to the things that are happening
elsewhere after this. Yeah, so go ahead. Yeah, what's up, guys? Happy Tuesday.
Very, very busy week for our ecosystem. I think that hearing a little bit about the the Stacks Market V2 for Zest has got me feeling bullish.
Right. Giving users the opportunities to, you know, borrow and lend a little bit more efficiently, as well as, you know, not get fully liquidated.
You know, if, you know, price action has a drawdown is very nice.
You know, there's there's a lot going on in our space, guys.
It is the time to build, right?
We build for the future and build ahead of the crowd.
And, you know, that's what our builders are doing right now.
We have such strong conviction in, you know, what we're doing here, building on Bitcoin via stacks.
And that is my signal.
And I've been paying attention to a lot of different things that are being built.
We have a lot of apps coming, as well as this new upgrade for STX tools.
And to narrow is pretty exciting as well you know putting putting stacks on the map and
letting other users from other bitcoin l2s and side systems know about what we have here is important so um that's exposure for for the newcomer to to learn about what we're doing so
it's it's very good it's it's exciting for me i think that it was a it's a
busy one this week for a reason it's the last few weeks of of the the year and uh you know really
really good announcements coming out of our ecosystem yeah yeah if you there's anything to
take away from this space and and you're you're in Stacks, I mean, I see some familiar faces, right?
Like Target, Val, Stacks Africa, and Brissinger,
IPeter as well, .btc.
So yeah, definitely recommend checking out the new Tenero website, right?
It means ByRubes, right?
The creator of the Leo coin on Stacks or, you know, the face of Leo coin.
And, you know, there I can check the price of Leo, you know,
to the final candle in the final minute.
Yeah, or any any token on stacks.
But of course, you know, Leo as the leading meme on stacks is obviously,
you know, one of my favorites there in absence of a Zest token or a StackingDao token today.
But yeah, more on that later.
I think Rubis wanted to join.
But yeah, he didn't make it.
He didn't make it yet.
But yeah, and then so next week is kind of Christmas.
And we're kind of going into this Christmas slash New Year's
period.
So we're probably going to do a short break of the DeFi
shows because normally we're obviously here always
every 10 AM Eastern time, pretty much every, well,
virtually every Tuesday, 10 AM Eastern time Tuesday.
But next week and the week after, well, next week,
we're definitely going to do a pause and likely the week
after as well.
But then, yeah, unless something crazy happens in the market,
we definitely need to do a DeFi show. We something crazy happens in the market we definitely need
to do a defi show we'll do one in the in the new year's week but otherwise we'll be uh we're going
to be back here on um on uh uh in the new year yeah but um but yeah the work continues so it's
also nice to have a little bit of this time over christ and between New Year to work on some long-term projects,
like, you know, for Stacks to finish up the USDC integration, let it run for a bit,
and for us to work on some of the other exciting projects,
because we're ready with our V2.
Zest V2 is ready to launch.
I guess just waiting to align with the rest of the ecosystem for them to get ready to.
And then we can make it a little Stacks DeFi season.
So you definitely want to be back here.
But yeah, make sure to follow AdSys Protocol on Twitter.
Make sure to follow GPSC, Martin, me if you're interested,
or the Stacks handle for all the latest latest on stacks and what's happening across the
ecosystem. And yeah, if you can't get enough, then tomorrow, same time, 10 a.m. Eastern time is the
Bitcoin Capital Markets virtual event. So make sure to not miss that. I'll be there as well as
a lot of other great people. So, yeah, looking forward to it.
But, yeah, until for now, we will come back likely in the new year with the DeFi shows, and then we'll make it to 100.
So, yeah, thanks, everyone, for joining.
Thanks, Martin and GP, for coming on.
And then, yeah, we'll speak soon.
Yeah, Merry Christmas, everyone. for coming on and then um and yeah then we'll we'll speak soon yeah uh merry christmas everyone have a great uh christmas and have a nasty new year cheers yeah very very merry christmas to
everyone merry christmas bye guys
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