Projects
![]()
No projects found
Investors
New
DAO Treasuries
DATs
Lend / Borrow APRs
Chains
Categories
Spaces
UNDER EXPOSED: The Retail Rally, Trump’s Policy Impact & Crypto AI 2
Recorded: May 6, 2025 Duration: 1:14:01Space Recording
Short Summary
In a dynamic discussion, the hosts explore the latest trends in the crypto market, including Bitcoin's near $98K rally, significant institutional investments, and the implications of New Hampshire's groundbreaking Bitcoin reserve bill. As macroeconomic factors create volatility, the conversation highlights the growing interest in crypto from both retail and institutional investors.
Full Transcription
Thank you. Thank you. GM, GM, everyone.
Thanks for joining us here this morning.
We're going to start the show in just a minute.
A couple shout-outs.
Circling the drink.
Horia, TDF, Spit GM, Frog Leader, Googly, GM, GM.
Thank you for joining us.
Ari, Mac, Evie also on with us.
Ari, I think we've got our speakers up on stage.
Sims, whenever you're ready,
let's kick it. This So so so
gmgm everyone and welcome to underexposed episode 24 of our weekly macro show hitting all of the
biggest topics and trends impacting crypto and web 3 today Today is Tuesday, May 6th, and we are fresh off the heels of a historic 20-year rally in stocks.
Bitcoin got near 98K in the midst, but this week we're selling off ahead of tomorrow's FOMC meeting.
Stocks are down, crypto's down. Gold is pumping once again. And our question,
was this just a bull trap or the beginning of the disbelief rally? We're going to break it all down
on today's show. I'm your host, Tyler D. I've got my co-host in the house, starting with D's,
art collector, coin stacker, trader, wrecked commissar. D's, GM, how you doing?
Doing well, man. Just another day in the neighborhood.
I've had a week straight
of rainy, shitty days here in Ohio
since our last show, but
at least the market's been entertaining.
Well, I hope it turns around for you. We're finally
starting to turn the corner in Chicago.
It's going to be 70 and sunny here today, so
wishing that for you
as well.
Word 70 and sunny is on nuggets fans after last night
and uh the game seven peter founder of several companies our resident macro expert gm how are
you doing and i'm curious about your thoughts on your nuggets yeah gm uh great to be with you guys
like one on the market it's been fun to be a Nuggets fan. Went to game seven. That was electric, even with the blowout at the end.
Really fun game.
Excited to go to game three.
Thought I'd be going to game three with the Nuggets down 2-0.
But it'll be at least 1-1 going home.
So incredible win last night.
Jokic, to me, is clearly in this conversation of top five players all time
already.
Even if something happened today,
I just think he's such a remarkable player.
His brilliance was on display
last night. Probably the biggest shot of the game
was the three that he hit down four.
Super happy for Aaron
Gordon, who had another amazing game.
He's had an electric playoffs and is
getting the notoriety he deserves. Great time to be a Nuggets fan. Certainly still very fearful of this OKC team.
They're the best regular season team by far. And I do think they're a better team than the Nuggets,
but the Nuggets have experience and definitely have a starting five that can keep up with them.
It's been a very interesting NBA playoffs. I feel like this has been one of the better of these first rounds that i can remember in quite some time quite competitive
it feels i don't know pretty open right now would you would you say that the field looks open
well i thought boston and okc were clearly the two best teams and uh would kind of get to the
finals somewhat easily and then they both lost yesterday and both had huge leads in game one.
So I still think Boston's probably the best team.
I still think OKC's probably the second best team.
But all three favorites in the second round lost, Cleveland included.
So all road teams are up 1-0.
We'll see what happens with Minnesota and Golden State today.
But yeah, the playoffs have been incredible.
I tweeted out just the delta between playoff basketball and regular season basketball.
So, men's product is incredible in the playoffs.
They have a regular season problem,
but it's just an incredible playoff product.
And, yeah, hopefully we have a lot more great games
than we've had already.
Yeah, bodes well for round two as well.
Folks, we've also got Jeeves on with us.
Early stage crypto VC,
dabbles in Internet Capital Markets,
wears a lot of hats,
just wrote a nice little essay for us a couple of days ago as well.
We'll get into that.
Jeeps, GM, how are you doing?
Man, I'm doing great.
Just like Peter said, the game last night was incredible.
The Jokic MVP odds last night spiked up to 6.4%.
They've since sold off on Polymarket.
He's our MVP. I think he's great and amazing.
I'm excited to be here with you guys today. Lots to talk about. Big week. Pivotal week,
honestly. Yeah, I'm excited to get into it with you guys. Before we do, quick disclosure,
the opinions expressed on this podcast are those of the speakers and do not reflect the views or
opinions of any organizations they are associated with. We are here to share insights, provoke thought, and maybe even stir some debate, but this is not,
I repeat, not financial advice. While we talk about markets, investments, and trends, remember,
your financial decisions should be made with the help of your own research or with advice
from a licensed professional. All right, well, let's get right into it. I know there is a lot
to talk about, and I want to start with talking markets and macro as we always do, because I'm confused.
And I need to talk through it with you guys here this morning, this afternoon.
So taking a look at the board, we kind of just chopped on the week, really.
It goes to 94.4, down half a percent on the week.
That's after it did go up to 97K, like I said in the intro.
It's down a bit.
Seoul is down a bit.
The news, Walter Bloomberg is on fire every single day with news about the trade war situation.
It doesn't really seem like we've made a whole lot of progress.
It seems like maybe we're getting closer, although no talks with China have been done, at least to date.
That's what Besant said here this morning.
So that goes against a little bit of what we've heard on that front.
Stocks down.
We've got Paul Tudor Jones saying that even if some of the China tariffs
get washed back a bit, stocks are going to put in new lows.
So he's leaning bearish.
S&P down on the day, a touch.
It's up 2% on the week.
Again, coming off of a historic 20-year rally.
And then gold is looking to kind of make new all-time highs here.
It's back over 3,400.
It's up 2% today or more. From a crypto perspective,
some of the big headlines from the week. So Strategy and Sailor are talking about raising
anywhere from 20 to $80 billion more to buy more Bitcoin. So they're not slowing down. We've got
Bernstein projecting 330 billion in corporate ETF inflows into Bitcoin by 2029.
Trump now really muddying the political crypto waters with some of the personal deals he's done.
Two dinners this month have now caused the genius bill, the stablecoin regulation, to have some real opposition.
And that story is developing here live this morning.
We've got Vitalik saying that he wants to make ETH as simple as Bitcoin,
perhaps an effort to revitalize and catalyze that chain.
And ETFs, they're just not slowing down.
I bet just a wall of green.
The capital continues to flow into Bitcoin via these ETFs.
So some signs of hope, certainly some bearish signs out there as well.
Peter, I'll toss it to you just kind of for starters.
What jumps out to you this week from a macro standpoint?
How are you feeling about things?
As always, piercing volatility, the theme that I expect to continue here in 2025.
I think right now, the way everything's positioned, we certainly have more room on the downside.
Noticing today that the 10-year is slightly up.
Gold is ripping, which is fearful.
And yeah, you have really smart macro guys being quite bearish. I mean, Stanley Drunkenviller,
Paul Tudor Jones, you were just mentioning that. Buffett kind of had a couple comments that seemed a little bearish, but also this is just a blip in his eyes.
So some of the smartest minds and biggest capital allocators basically leaning bearish.
Bill Ackman was on CNBC yesterday as well,
and he tried to paint an optimistic lens in some ways,
but he did mention, and this is kind of one of the themes I think we'll see,
is in Q2 I think we'll see a lot of slowing in earnings.
We had really good earnings broadly in Q2, I think we'll see a lot of slowing in earnings.
We had really good earnings broadly in Q1, which were front loaded.
And I think most companies kind of took a pause after Liberation Day.
And I think those earnings will be reflected in Q2.
So there's a lot of different things, a lot of cross currents. We have oil down, gold up, rates going up.
But the stock market has done really well recently. And I think the
main reason the stock market has done well is once Besson said that treasury buybacks are on the
table, that's liquidity. So, so many different cross currents to point out. It's really tricky
to figure out. I just think in general, we'll see a lot more volatility throughout the year.
And one other note that
I think we chatted briefly about in our chat, but certainly one of the consequences, basically,
these Asian countries made some deals and statements that they're going to work together
and they're going to have these long-term trade alliances, Japan, China, South Korea.
So America is trying to really play that we you know, we do have a lot of leverage as
the biggest consumer in the world, but these other countries certainly can band together and that
definitely would not be great for the U.S. So a lot of different things to think through.
But yeah, as we said today, especially out of FOMC, when you see rates going up a little bit,
gold spiking, that definitely gives me some pause.
Do you have any expectations for FOMC tomorrow
and what Powell might come to say?
I think the odds of a rate cut are near zero.
I think we're seeing like 1.5%.
So I think pretty much no shot there.
I think they just continue to sit on their hands,
and it's really just going to be the commentary.
Cause I do still think a June cut is a favorite.
I haven't pulled up the odds as of today,
but I saw,
I was like,
yeah,
it looks like a little bit higher,
right?
Yeah.
Yes.
So I expect them to send their hands.
We'll see.
they're really in a tricky spot here.
the tariffs are a huge wrinkle in kind of their plan.
Um, I would be shocked if they cut rates
this week, but the commentary is really what will drive markets in the short term. So
it's a tricky spot for Powell. I mean, it really is. You have some inflationary forces. The jobs
report were good last week, but I think a lot of the negative data that we'll see
in the economy from Liberation Day will be expressed in Q2. So that puts Powell in a pretty
tricky spot, not knowing all the impacts of these tariffs. So I expect nothing to happen this week,
but the commentary is really critical for markets. Yeah, I think that's a fair take.
Jeez, we were chatting a little bit about this.
I feel like you may have some thoughts.
Powell clearly in a tough spot.
Man, yeah, I think Peter hit the nail on the head there.
Powell's going to be late twice,
and this time it's not going to be his fault.
I think he's just forced into that position,
like Peter mentioned.
Look, prior to tariffs and other stuff, Powell was really steering the ship well.
And I thought we weren't going to get to 2% inflation, but it felt like they were going to maybe accept that 2.5% was an okay number.
They started to bring rates down, and it really looked like a soft landing was on okay number. They started to bring rates down and it really looked like a soft landing
was on the table.
Now, it doesn't look like that exactly.
And he's always going back to just hard data, right?
So we inevitably, I think,
need to sort of take a pause here for a minute
and see what exactly is going on. There's a lot to this,
Tyler. So for one, right, like there's a huge divide in expectations going forward with two
major camps of people that I'm seeing. Like one is this camp of folks being cautiously optimistic,
this belief that the Trump administration is going, you know, they're doing the right thing that will eventually lead to long lived prosperity for the United States with some pain between now and then,
and maybe a pretty bad rollout. Like Peter mentioned, folks like Ackman are in that camp.
Then there's the other camp. They feel that they're looking down the barrel of a gun
and the administration has completely upended and ruined the global
economy as we know it, and that markets are in for a lot more pain. Peter points out the Paul
Tudor Jones article there. So I think the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.
And I kind of tweeted on this earlier this week that I'm not one to bet against America, especially when it has its back against
the ropes. I think if you were to look throughout history, we've ended up coming out of those
situations in a lot of positive ways. And I think you can just point to that through history.
The US has always been sort of the underdog that's won. We've now become the big dog.
Unclear where it goes. But let me let me pause there i have
a lot of thoughts here well so i think that that's kind of where i'm at and i feel like
for you to be like very bearish here like do you have to be in the camp that we're going to break
the 20 to 30 year trend on the s and P that stocks go up and to the right
over a long enough time. And I'm starting to see people point to that, that, that, that this,
this new generation of investors has just been taught that you put your money in stocks and
they go up and that's how, and that's what has happened, uh, for, I mean happened for quite some time.
Some are calling for that to end.
But I'm not – it's going to be hard to predict that.
I'm not there.
Yeah, yeah.
I'm with you, Tyler.
I think you have to be – one, you have to bet against America.
Two, you have to bet that the existing system is the only way that this works out
and that a new system
effectively will not work out. I think that's what people are betting on, is that we've completely
upended this thing that was working so well. Why are we shaking this up? The administration
clearly has ideas as to why it should work and why it will work. If it does work, I think it's
unclear. I think economists
don't have a great frame of reference. You can't predict the future. They're using
mostly historical guidance for this. Do you have that journal piece that they had?
They read a piece last night that the Fed's basically in a lose-lose situation here.
in a lose-lose situation here. And I think I agree with that as well. The TLDR is that the Feds,
in this lose-lose dilemma, they either fight inflation amid rising tariffs or they cut rates
and risk fueling stagflation, which is just a dirty word. No one wants that around. So like
Peter said, they're likely just to stay cautious and wait for clear economic
signals, especially around the labor market.
Right now, it's like the labor market is going to be the only area that forces them to cut
rates because inflation is likely to spike again.
And that's going to negate the hard data that they're looking at there.
And you just kind of laid out a case
to be bearish in the near term, right?
And there's this other group is talking about
the ports are going to be empty,
the cargo ships are empty in LA,
and that's going to hit shelves in two to three weeks.
It hasn't hit yet.
But then like, I'm sitting here,
like, we're not the only ones with this information.
So why did we just see this historic rally in stocks?
And that's why I can't piece together.
Was it just a total bull trap?
Was it retail-driven?
And I've seen the take that this was a retail-led rally.
Peter, you pointed to the best in saying they're going to buy treasuries.
They're going to buy treasuries, I guess.
Any other thoughts from your side?
Or any other thoughts from your side?
Why are we seeing this kind of rally despite all these bearish headwinds and uncertainty?
The market clearly pivoted once they asked us,
what tools do you have at your disposal to help with this?
And buybacks, that's what he mentioned.
And he said they have multiple tools.
So to me, that is just a sign.
And again, we talked about it last week, but all roads ultimately are going to lead to nominal inflation.
And I think that's part of the reason we're seeing the markets go up.
And also, we had a lot of good news in terms of just earnings for Q1.
I think, obviously, Trump pivoted in a big way with the pause and just talking about deals.
So the administration just broadly kind of went the other direction.
Obviously, we still have this huge China problem.
But I think the big implications for the real economy, because remember, the market and the economy are not the same.
The real implications for the economy, I think, are going to be coming here in Q2.
And of course, a lot can change again.
I mean, that's why we have this theme of piercing volatility is we have an administration that's just making these big moves and they're moving really quickly.
So I think you just need to be in a position as an investor or know what you are.
If you're trading, you know, for the really experienced traders out there, if you have an edge, this is a dream set up, a dream market with all this volatility.
I think the most sophisticated players are going to do extremely well in this market.
If you're an investor, think about your asset allocation.
Think about your lifestyle.
We've talked about taking lifestyle chips off the
table certainly if you know you're really exposed to crypto um and you didn't take lifestyle chips
off the first time and then we had all that pain and everyone was you know talking about going back
to work at mcdonald's you got this relief bounce uh to take a you know lifestyle chip off the table
again just be thoughtful about who you are and what you need to do to protect your lifestyle. And certainly there's still a lot of really good setups for crypto overall.
We haven't talked much about stable coins. We have that bill. Bitcoin seems to be in as good
of a place as ever. The main risk to Bitcoin, which I definitely want to talk about, is just
sailor and all the copycats of strategy that to me at some point it feels like there's some,
I don't know what the percent chance is, but they blow up in some capacity. That's my biggest fear
for Bitcoin, I guess, short term. But yeah, it's a very tricky time. So many cross currents,
right? There's so many cross currents to evaluate. So Tyler, I feel you. I don't think anyone who
says they have super high
conviction that this is what's going to happen i'm very skeptical of anyone who has a view like
that because there's so many cross currents yeah that's kind of where i just that was my resolution
is that there are very smart people on both sides of this it's very unclear to me that any of them
really know what's going to happen so if why not just have a gradual DCAN strategy?
That's how I've been approaching the equity markets. Crypto I'm approaching a little bit differently.
And I want to talk about this crypto. Dees, I want to toss it to you.
If you have any additional reactions or commentary to our macro combo
or what might be jumping out to you about the crypto
board here in early May?
Yeah, nothing crazy or new to add here on the macro side.
I've been a little checked out of the news cycle myself.
And I did think about selling some stuff, like Peter said.
Prices are pretty good right now.
I haven't actually sold anything yet,
but looking at some of the things I'm up on big since the April lows,
I have been as close to selling some now as I have since we bought.
Mostly just it would be trimming a little bit of fart coin and hype probably,
or maybe trimming some Solana.
And yeah, just kind of hanging out.
I haven't done any either yet.
Yeah.
I want to dig in to that here in a minute because I want to,
I want to talk about the Solana trade.
Before we get there,
I do maybe want to start with,
with,
with Bitcoin.
Peter,
so you laid out a concern and I think it's a fairly broad concern.
So I think on Friday, say they're announced they're going to raise up to $80 billion.
It was like $42 billion in equity offerings, $42 billion in debt to buy Bitcoin, effectively.
And that's a lot.
To me, we talk about this a lot where to me,
we talk about this a lot of them are.
So when he,
when he's raising the equity, it seems much less risky than when he's raising via debt.
Cause when he raises via debt,
that increases his liquidation price and increases increases liquidation
risk.
Is that how you're looking at it?
Or I guess what is,
why is this a risk on your radar here?
Well, I think everyone's had this as a risk just in the event that they're,
you know, in a position where they have to sell.
And there's a lot of reasons why they probably don't have to sell in most scenarios.
But it certainly, to me, is still a concern.
The Thousand X podcast, which I really enjoy,
they talked about how they think it's inevitable that sailor will blow up at some point in time and that he's kind of gone on as a rogue trader so there's just some momentum around it and it
just seems um my big concern is just that the pride always comes before the fall and there's
been so many moments where sailor like oozing, you know,
pride slash arrogance. And that's my kind of where my spidey senses get up. So I don't know.
I do love Bitcoin. I certainly could see this working. You know, the counter to this is that
this is how people have gotten really wealthy with real estate. And it's certainly easy to make a comparison with Bitcoin and real estate just to store
value.
But it is, in my eyes, the biggest short-term risk.
And then quantum computing is another risk that's really, really hard to get into all
the implications.
There's been a couple of really good podcasts out about that.
And I do think Bitcoin would be able to fork and be in a good position outside of maybe the legacy coins.
But yeah, all signs to me are still very, very strong broadly for Bitcoin.
So I definitely want to keep, you know, accumulating Bitcoin.
I think that's the best crypto asset to own at this point in time.
That's kind of been my view for a while now. But yeah, I'd be curious the best crypto asset to own at this point in time. That's kind of in my
view for a while now. But yeah, I'd be curious to your guys' perspective. The quantum thing is a
much tougher conversation. Certainly, I'm not equipped to have it. But the other short-term
risk is strategy and the copycats. Are you guys concerned with that at all? Or is it something
that you're just kind of, it is what it is?
It seems incredible.
Jeeves likes it.
Yeah, I like it. I think it's great, right?
It's a strategy for different folks to acquire more Bitcoin.
They see a business opportunity here. I think for us, it helps our Bitcoin
positions. I'm not as concerned about Saylor blowing up, but maybe I'm overlooking some of
the bigger risks here. I think in the situation where Saylor or some of these, specifically
Saylor, some of the newer strategies obviously will have different prices and targets but in the situation where sailor blows up like i hope i don't own any bitcoin at that point
because at that point things have gone pretty far south well you would want to be in yeah you
want to be in cash but we've even had folks i'd be i'd want to be in cash yeah there'd have to
be like a systemic major issue, I think, at that point
for Bitcoin to get to the pricing where
Saylor's liquidating really large chunks.
And then who's he selling to?
In current state, yes, it's very difficult.
I think what people who are worried about it
are worried that he continues to raise debt.
And he does not show any signs of slowing down.
And that's the course he's on.
And he had been buying via equity,
but now it looks like he's throwing debt back into the mix,
which makes this all messy.
He's blown up before too.
I mean,
it's not to say that like it can't happen.
There's a chance it could happen.
I guess let's,
let's go around the table here.
What's the probability you would put on these strategies blowing up within the next two years?
I'll go first.
Yeah, I was debating 5% or 10% in my mind.
So I probably would lean more towards the 5% number.
And certainly to paint the other side of it,
it's definitely just like a continuous bid,
especially when the market sells off.
That's very comforting as a Bitcoin holder
is that you have these large, large buyers,
which is great.
But yeah, 5% seems somewhat reasonable.
It's a really hard thing to price. i i've seen a lot of different analysts kind of go into why it's super unlikely and if you hear a sailor
he's like oh i'm never going to be a forced seller um but i i did not i've looked into how some of
the debt works and i i'm assuming the terms are similar here for the new debt that's the other
thing is normally when you continue to issue debt as a company, there's different preferences that
the creditors have. So definitely need to research it more. But it caught my attention yesterday
when the Thousand X podcast guys were saying that they feel it's inevitable that Sailor's
going to blow up. DJ Vodz? On a long enough timeline, I feel like it's inevitable that Taylor's going to blow up. DJ of odds?
On a long enough timeline, I feel like it's higher.
Two years does feel lower to me.
My gut was like 10 to 20%, so I guess I was a little higher.
But I'm also just more pessimistic.
I think if you extrapolate out like five or ten years,
it becomes a much much higher chance but
interesting i actually think the odds go the odds go down over time because i think bitcoin goes up
over time yeah i just feel like we're one uh you know 70 or 80 percent drawn out away from
there being problems we've we've had our fair share of those over the years.
You can map out a scenario though, right?
The strategic reserve scenario where
it gets passed, maybe the US
even starts to buy,
and then Congress
and the presidency gets flipped.
Yeah, my bearish
just comes from
the 2028 election.
Trump embeds himself way too much
in the crypto community
as we're already seeing
with all these bullshit dinners and tokens
and everything else the family is doing.
2028 Democrats have control
and they're just like,
you know,
we're going to blackball this shit out of crypto
because that was,
seen as something that was like buried Trump best.
So that's kind of where I get the concerns from.
Maybe not until then.
I put the Sandra Lutz live tweeting it earlier was pretty damning.
Yeah.
I'm going to try to pull that up for us.
I think the odds of God,
if dims get power,
the odds of crypto pushback are like over 50%.
Yeah.
Great breaking.
Mark Carney is at the White House.
So we'll touch on that in a little bit.
We'll get that candidate deal.
We just want to be friends.
That's it.
Yeah.
It has become a partisan issue, which is a concern because it just feels inevitable that it's going to swing back and forth.
And then if you look at just what's happened in the first 100 days plus, Trump's approval
rating is like all time low for the president in the first 100 days.
Congress seems more split than ever.
Again, I go back to the dinner that Jeeps and I had.
When you have a known Republican lobbyist being extremely critical of Trump,
that's a concern.
So that would be one scenario that would be quite bad is really steep regulation.
Although Bitcoin seems that it's just totally separated from the rest of crypto from a regulation
standpoint. that it's just totally separated from the rest of crypto from a regulation standpoint i would be shocked to see i would be more i think the more likely scenario is that you know politicians go
after other crypto assets versus bitcoin um but that's just my perspective especially now that we
know how many people own it ibit etc um but it's still a risk for sure i feel like to get a 70 draw down you'd
have to see the run you have to see the parabolic run to like 500k and then 70 takes it back down
to like the other scenario too that just to the paint let's say palter jones is right and we have
new lows in the stock market let's say we have like a like q2 data is really bad. Something happens geopolitically and we get like a real bad recession.
I'm not as confident.
And I know Bitcoin is decoupled from the NASDAQ in some ways.
And I know it's acting like digital gold, which is exciting in some ways.
But I do think in that situation, people are going to flee to like more cash oriented assets i think gold would
have a higher bit than bitcoin and that that is another risk to it i would say um just as you know
crypto assets all right now are like you know around three trillion if we see a 30 40 huge
drawdown in the market um i think crypto would be down significantly as well
but it could not be maybe it decouples in that scenario too but that would be down significantly as well. But it could not be.
Maybe it decouples in that scenario too.
But that would be another risk to pay in terms of your probability curve.
I think I'm with you there.
In a bad recession, I think Bitcoin gets dragged down.
I think in a mild recession, it could win and outperform,
where it becomes an investable asset alternative.
Totally agree.
So it's kind of a fine,
it's like a third in the needle here to a degree,
which is making this more complicated.
So we played out some of the bear case,
but CZ went on our good friend Farouk's podcast,
and he shared some insights,
some of his personal thoughts on the crypto market.
One of those was a prediction.
He thinks that the crypto market cap's going to $5 trillion by the end of 2025.
And perhaps he's in the business of being bullish,
you know, legacy running one of the biggest crypto exchanges in the world,
his ties to BNB, building in the broader crypto space.
$5 trillion's a lofty number.
That's 66% from here.
So I'm curious for your reactions to that,
if you're on the over-under,
and then what is the path to five trillion?
What does that look like mechanically?
We were joking about this earlier, Tyler,
how you were like well maybe it's like 1.5 billion of its bitcoin or half a trillion
comes in and it's alts and I just said I mean 2.5 trillion could be bitcoin and we could see
an outflow of a half a trillion in alts realistically like bitcoin could just get
bigger and bigger and i that world tyler comes from what we've been talking about most of this
year which is fund managers starting to recommend that two percent allocation that actually starts
happening um i you know we we touched earlier lightly on some of the stable coin bills, right? They're stable
and genius. There's some, let's call it turbulence right now with those. But more importantly,
is the market structure bill. If that gets passed, that gives the green light to a lot of folks to
be able to invest in this asset class because there's clear
delineation on what these are, right? What types of assets these are, how they can be treated in
different ways. So I think it's a combination of sort of the legal framework around it mixed then
with just additional inflows from net new buyers that are pretty sticky.
Oh, it would have to be.
It would have to be.
Peter, curious for your thoughts, what it would look like to get to $5 trillion.
And where do you currently sit on the overall?
It's way in the range of probabilities.
I mean, imagine we get some good trade deals uh more liquidity gets pumped into the market we kind of go back into this
golden age um there's all these you know crypto bills passed tons of money flowing into stable
coins and more and more people just view bitcoin as digital gold which you know that's our view
uh bitcoin goes up and leads the charge and then other things fall behind it
maybe eth gets a narrative that picks up some steam solana gets a narrative that picks up some
steam i certainly see that the i think that's you know a decent part of the the probabilities here
so again that's why it's hard it's not like there's a consensus view where we're painting
some bear cases before and it's certainly easy to see the bull case here for crypto.
Again, just that M2 supply that we talked about last week, that's going up into the right, I think.
Why shouldn't crypto fall behind it?
We're talking realistically. Let's play this out.
We're at $3 trillion right now.
Bitcoin goes up 66%.
We're at $150,000.
Isn't that a target for a ton of people?
$150,000?
It's a nice number.
Let me send you the rainbow chart.
The other thing too is...
That was the law target for this
this cycle at one point think about the euphoria that we had as we went you know and how fast we
got up to like 100 110k if we bust through all-time highs it's going to be the same euphoria
animal spirits and and as crazy as it is and it and just irrational behavior by human beings,
that's when people will be buying.
When it goes through 110 or whatever,
that's when all the people
who you normally don't talk to about crypto
will be like,
oh, I should have some Bitcoin or whatever.
I should be buying.
It's so classic
that when things rip to all-time highs,
people start buying.
So it wouldn't shock me to see that, honestly.
It happened in six weeks.
God.
The normie group chats have been quiet.
You know, when the normie group chats start rolling back
and people are feeling good,
that's when you know,
eh, maybe I should think about the sell button.
It's that 115, 120.
It's like, oh, states are buying Bitcoin.
Maybe there's an SBR news.
I mean, who knows what Trump is going to do?
There's so many things that can trigger just this euphoria on animal spirits again. And if it rips
past all-time highs, it feels like there's a lot of air right there that could just be gobbled up.
And then you have, you know, think about it from the strategy copycats. They're trying to do this.
They're saying they're going to do it. Imagine the panic that they may have thinking that their chance to accumulate Bitcoin below 100K is over. And
they raise their target and start buying aggressively too. I mean, there's a lot of
ways in my eyes that this could be gobbled up to that 150 number. So I don't think CZ is out of
bounds by saying that. I just think there's also a lot of risk to the downside.
Pop over to the chart I just sent, Tyler.
Yeah, one sec.
This is, I think, a great...
I just love this chart, right?
Call it the banana zone, call it the rainbow,
call it whatever you call it.
Call it the rainbow chart.
Oh, man, it's beautiful.
And then the timescale on the bottom,
if you can just shrink that timescale,
the left slider, probably on the bottom, you can move that over to the right.
Yeah, let's condense it a little bit.
You can see 2017, we hit that absolute red peak.
Next cycle, we kind of came up a bit. This one, we have not broken that green green band we haven't gotten into the yellow or oranges
or any of that is this gospel no but i think it gives you an idea of like where the power laws
could take us and so 150 according to this says it's still cheap i'm gonna read off these numbers
that hodl category so i've So I've never looked at this seriously.
This is incredible.
So Christmastime 2025, if we are at 155K, it's accumulate.
209K, still cheap.
283K, hold.
389K, is this a bubble?
535K, football intensifies.
At 700K, sell. Seriously, seriously sell and then 970 300k i'll
happily sell a couple that sounds good to me i don't i don't need it to get the 700k to tell
me this we just need one more on top of this and it's kathy wood prediction because you know that's
well above this but we got to orange wow and uh so you got to peak red in 2017 and then
deep into the third orange band in 2021 um and so even if we miss that get to yellow and we're
talking about yeah mid to 250k i mean even if the price goes up instead of going down, we're talking about making more money.
It's wonderful.
If we can go to the yellow, it's great.
Let's just not go back to the blue.
That's the rotten banana then.
We don't want to go back there.
Yeah, that's a funny.
The moldy banana.
So we have some good chat on Bitcoin.
I want to talk a lot for a minute.
I went to drinks with a few buddies and met one of my friends,
friends who I had met before.
And it turned out his company,
he got acquired by Janover now DeFi development,
the,
the major player,
which has been going long Solana for their corporate treasury.
And he was asking me if effectively, if he should hedge,
he's going to have some equity in January now. So he's very long Solana and how I would feel
about that position. And effectively, if he should hedge to a degree, putting the hedge
question aside, cause I think that's more of a personal risk, but I'm curious for your guys' view on Solana.
If you were in that position,
how do you feel about being heavily long Solana right now in May 2025?
And would you want to be looking to sell now,
or would you want to let this cycle play out a little bit?
Deez, I think I'll throw it to you first. I think you were kind of talking about maybe taking some soul off the table curious
I'd still rather own Solana than Ethereum
I still own a good amount of Solana and almost zero Ethereum
like less than 30 Ethereum
so if I'm going gonna bet on that or soul i'm gonna bet on soul still
that being said um a lot of my solana i got for like under 75 dollars 2023 and feels not too bad
selling some here if i was um and i've also seen like, I haven't really been messing around with it
but I feel like Sui has caught
a lot of hype kind of recently
and I don't feel like
it's, from what I've seen, 10x
better than Soul so I haven't really migrated
a bunch of money over there to fuck around.
But I do think there will be
shiny new toy narratives where people
are looking for new L1s
or things that compete with Solana
to try to outperform it so there could be better returns
outside of Solana, but I feel really
comfy holding it and staking it.
If I did sell some, I would maybe
sell a quarter at most of what I have.
I would still want to keep most of the position.
I did sell a lot of Solana december and january though too that that's another caveat like that that was my that was a great time to sell that was taking lifestyle chips off the table
like i don't i don't even think my average sell was over 200 it was maybe around like 190 or
something but felt really nice to just sell around there um so i've kind of sold enough that where
like i don't feel that pressure to like fully exit or anything i mean i still use solana just as much
as i use e um i've been using eth a little more lately just a bit on nfts i think openc has gotten
a little better and i've been uh just trying to market make some of the PowerLaw
or just blue chips.
But it's pretty competitive, and it's kind of frustrating.
But that's the only reason I hold ETH is to buy and sell NFTs.
That's where my ETH stack is right now.
I'd say I use...
Top Outlook for ETH.
Anytime I'm holding ETH, I'm just like, man, I just buy another Punk or buy another Maskell Lucy, buy another Remnant, buy another anything that isn't on ETH.
Yeah, I hear you on that.
I'll provide a slightly different take that's maybe just outside of the trading world, which is in the early stage venture world, a lot of builders are going to the Solana ecosystem.
And so one thing that they've done really well is early in Solana's days, it was kind of difficult to build products there.
it was kind of difficult to build products there.
And now the infrastructure, the attention,
the price action has all gathered around Solana.
And you're seeing, we talked about this last week
a little bit, how Sui is from a narrative standpoint,
like I missed the Solana trade.
I'm going to go after the Solana killer now.
And so I'm going to invest in
SUI because it makes sense. But I think that's just a very surface level view. And so if you
dive in further, all of the metrics around Solana sort of developers, activity, dApps, etc.,
they've obviously cooled off. But for the most part, if you normalize them against the
playing field, that is where builders are going. That is where activity is. That is where 95% of
my on-chain transactions are today. And so I see a world where, you know, whether it's D-Pin,
some RWAs, whether it's, you know, more of the consumer-facing dApps that we've experimented with,
the trading infrastructure that's been built on Solana. I see a really bright future for where
Solana is going, even though price action might not reflect that in the moment. And so I'm very
optimistic about Solana. Interesting. I'll share my thoughts in a second peter do you have a
take on where you would lean yeah i mean i'm pretty optimistic about solana in a lot of ways too
uh it certainly seems like more builders are there um even without meme coins being as prevalent as
they were there's still a good bit of stuff to do on Solana. I think in DeFi in particular, it's gaining a lot of momentum.
So, yeah, I think it's fine.
And it really just comes down to how you want to allocate.
Even within Solana, you know, you can move to like a JLP type product,
which is going to give you exposure to some other crypto assets,
stables, ETH, wrap Bitcoin, and then you'll make some of the perps funding.
You know, it's still basically a long Solana, but with a little less risk, less upside, obviously. So that's kind of how I think
about it if I was in that person's shoes. Also, just more bias towards Bitcoin in general from
a risk-reward standpoint, especially at kind of current prices. But yeah, it's hard to make big arguments for for eth
which would be the main one and then of course you'd go further out in the risk curve and try to
bet on on you know another layer one or some other project but yeah um it's kind of tricky
it's a tricky spot i'm curious your opinion tyler yeah so i told them on the spectrum, 0 to 100, 0 being max bearish, 100 being
max bullish. I'm about 65.
So leaning
kind of cautiously bullish Solana.
And I pointed to
builders
still continuing to choose to build
on Sol.
This
blossoming group of
companies trying to include it in their corporate treasuries,
which we've really only seen for Bitcoin and Solana.
We haven't really seen that for Ethereum.
And there's three big ones that popped up in this past week.
And then I also don't think meme coins are over.
And I think those are going to continue to dominate on slana and I mean I use
slant almost every day now um I'd say I use eth I I bridge to eth to make a some wrecked trades
and other than that like every once in a while for big purchases, like I had to move some capital to eat,
to buy the punk when I bought a couple months back,
but I'm not really doing anything on ETH on a daily basis.
I'm much more active on Salana and that, that feels meaningful.
And I am one who thinks there will be a next man up.
I think it's kind of foolish to think there will never be another next,
next man up with respect to another L one,
but I don't think we know it yet.
And I think sweet's done a lot of great things,
but I don't think it's sweet.
at least in its current state,
because even like in 2020,
2021 Solana had something that people were trading in at T's.
Like there was like, there was kind of the foundation starting to grow
of like retail activity.
And I don't know that we're seeing that necessarily
anywhere else, but that can change rapidly.
So that's my view.
I'm leaning bullish.
Got about 10 minutes left in the show.
Maybe kind of go around the horn on a few of the other items that happened.
So one, we've got a new pump fund competitor.
Deez, I'm curious for your thoughts on this one.
So we had – actually, so in the last couple weeks,
we've had two major players come out with their own meme coin launch pads.
One, Launch Lab from Radium.
They ran up to $100 million in lifetime volume in about a week.
So some pretty solid numbers there and then we saw boop from ding-a-ling come out last week with heavy incentives for influencers to drop tokens heavy incentives to trade and hold tokens
on their platform curious for your thoughts if you can, and the high level question here, is PumpFun
in trouble? Can one of these take the throne?
I'm surprised it took this long for some competitor to pop
up. I had the opportunity
to invest in PumpFun
over a year ago and was like,
I don't see there being a moat here,
and somebody could just do the same thing with lower fees.
And I could not have been more wrong.
The social moat they have is just massive.
In terms of Boop in particular,
I went back and forth on making the token to get the unlock.
And after a day of just watching everybody say,
you're an idiot if you don't make the token,
I just fucking made one and didn't tweet about it.
And it's like a 7k market cap and it's going to go to zero.
But tokens unlock in 16 days, so we'll see what it's worth then.
I did get it to graduate.
I mean, there's a bunch of bots on the platform right you see uh any big twitter account make a cult it graduates and
goes to like 100 to 200k instantly and then it's dumped back down to zero within like two minutes
um just from like the bots uh playing on the platform so i do think you think there is room for disruption here. We saw it last cycle with OpenSea and their 2.5% fee.
And a bunch of competitors came up.
And funny enough, one of the competitors that came up that I invested in is Luxrayer.
And that was also made by or heavily involved Dingling,ling who is now making uh or pushing boop
so there's definitely a trend here um not sure if any of these new launch pads will win but uh i'm
going to take the free money and sell it as soon as possible because it'd probably be pretty stupid
not to um but we'll see what happens i mean i there are way better incentive structures and the
boop incentive structure
is way better than the current pump fund incentive structure for holders.
so I hope,
I hope to see disruption there.
Also like pump fund website still hurts my head after a year and I never use
I only use third party things to talk to it because it's so bad.
I can't have people suck at switching they suck at switching
to better protocols like the best example i think in crypto where people took so long to migrate and
i think a lot of people still have not migrated is in when you look at wallets i still know so
many people that still use legacy or old wallets because they work and there's some great
products out there now that is like that just shows how hard it is to migrate users to new or
better products in this space it took me until 2024 to migrate to rabbi off metamask i got i don't
know what it was at metamask but something really pissed me off and i missed out on making a bunch
of money because i was having issues at metamask and i just fucking migrated and uninstalled it that day but
it took me a while like it took me like two years of people telling me once a week like
why are you still using metamask you and me both man yeah but once i made the change it was amazing
why wasn't i using this years ago? What was I doing? Exactly.
There's this idea,
a lot of crypto comes down to security and being your own bank.
And when you have a wallet that works
and you know it in and out
and you haven't lost all your money
due to some fuck up,
it's like you really don't want to switch
because what if you fuck it up?
But then once you switch,
you realize like,
man, I was missing out on making my life a lot easier yeah i i resonate with that it's not that
i don't see better products it just feels like a lot my funds feel like they're safe right now
so like why go through why apply any risk vector that that isn't necessarily needed right now but um it's a good point and
geez this is maybe it's a good segue uh to your essay i'm trying to pull it up just vampire
attacks in general this is kind of a broader topic but boop um let's say it's fair to say it's a vampire attack on Punk Fun,
would fall into that category.
They could have, yeah.
And you laid out some thoughts on how crypto-native companies
could kind of vampire attack somewhat too.
So I'm curious for your thoughts.
You want to elaborate on that?
Yeah, absolutely.
This has been something I've been thinking about for a while.
Shout out to Mason over at Paradigm.
Him and I were out for a walk here in Denver one day.
He turned me on to this idea of ZKTLS.
And this is maybe six, eight months ago.
And since then, I've dove into it.
And I'm fascinated by this technology.
So brief history in what a vampire attack is.
The first one we really saw was when SushiSwap came after Uniswap.
And effectively, the whole idea is it would look at the existing dApp, look at your history, look at your loyalty, look at your points, whatever it may be,
how many tokens you hold in general, and they will mimic those rewards on the new platform
to incentivize users to come over and use that new platform. So another example of this,
like Dees mentioned, was LooksRare with OpenSea. Now, we've seen this tried a number of times, but one of the biggest issues that we've
seen is it's all circular at the end of the day. So we're competing for the same user base
with a new product within crypto. And honestly, I can't think of any truly successful vampire
attacks. If you guys know of any, let me know. But what we've seen is
there's lightning in a bottle here. You're able to bring users onto a new platform. And most of the
time, people are going there for economic incentives, and they extract and they leave.
And that's kind of just the circular thing that happens. But I think the concept of vampire attacks is brilliant.
So in this essay, then I talk about ZKTLS.
So we went over vampire attacks now into ZKTLS.
This is a new technology that's forming.
And so TLS is transport layer security,
which is when you're on a browser and you're interacting with your bank
or you're interacting with really anything on the internet. This is that secure layer for you. ZKTLS allows for ZK
proofs to be able to prove certain things within your existing Web2 identity. So if I go to my bank
and it shows my balance, if I go to, there's currently services that are doing this with your credit score to bring your credit score on chain proven with Equifax or other providers.
So think like any data that exists in Web 2 can now be ported into your Web 3 identity.
So now let's try and mix those two together in some way.
I want to create a Web3 Uber competitor. I can go grab your entire history,
all of your loyalty, all of your existing information and your customer experience
that you had with Uber. And I now can bring that into Web3 and mimic those same loyalty,
the same benefits, the same persona that you had there on chain with this new app
and be able to bring you in. I think there's endless use cases here that you can think of
where now the biggest key on top of that will be to market to those existing users,
bring those web two users onto your new app. That'll be the really tricky component. But I think this opens
up an entirely new opportunity for new users to be onboarded into crypto and to use CryptoDapt
where they have their existing loyalty, their existing persona, their existing payment history brought into that ecosystem.
So I think this is exciting. I don't have a definitive use case. There's a number of protocols
that are building this infrastructure now, but this is a trend I'm looking forward to over the
next year or so. This feels like a big one. And i read your essay and it was pretty eye-opening
for me and i don't know that i've had like the light bulb moment yet of exactly what the right
use case is to go out and attack with this um but like it feels like this is the type of thing that
could actually help penetrate into like penetrate web 3 into web two and unlock a much larger customer base i think
one that jumped to mind is just like owning your owning your data online and is there like a dpin
style app tied to that where effectively you could be like earning on your data being shared with advertisers, for instance?
100%. Yeah, I actually, looking at Peter's hat, I just thought of a use case here.
One would be, Mando, folks, if you're listening, go basically create the infrastructure with all
the major gambling apps and allow users to port their gambling identity, history, how
much they've won, how much they've lost into your app and offer incentives on Yeet for
those customers.
It's one way you can do it to bring folks over.
It all comes down to providing incentives on your new platform based off of your existing
user behavior or your customer behavior.
It's a very interesting concept.
I mean, the incentives have to be good, right, to be realistic,
to get people to change their behavior to try out new apps.
And maybe we lean a little bit more open to that in Web3
just because we know of how lucrative the rewards can be.
But it does feel like there's something,
there's something here.
Yeah.
It's one of those things where I think if there's a killer use case,
it's something where you could go to any one of your friends and be like,
try out this new app.
Cause I know you use this existing web two app and they can basically port
that identity and have a really great starting
point in Web 3. Versus us, when vampire attacks occur, look, a lot of my friends didn't have an
OpenSea account and history. They didn't have a Uniswap history or were even involved here,
so they couldn't even participate. This allows for a whole new level of participation
with an entirely new user base.
Yeah, I like the idea a lot.
I think there's some of the risks.
I think there's perhaps some legal hurdles to get through.
For sure, yeah.
In the implementation of all this.
One company is going to do this really, really well,
and then cat's out of the bag.
Yeah.
I think you're right.
It's a big swing.
It's going to be a – it'll be a disruptor.
Big swing.
For sure.
And I feel like people – just kind of tying this back to our crypto conversation,
I feel like people are rooting for this in the meme space.
I think people want to see PumPum get disrupted,
which is why we've seen people throw their weight behind launch lab,
behind boop,
even early on.
And we'll see how,
if that fizzles out.
But they want to see the disruption.
They want to see less extraction from the ecosystem,
more users win.
Let me ask this question to you guys twofold.
One is, why do you think people don't want to migrate away from PumpFun?
If you look at the data, PumpFun still just is so dominant.
And then two, what do you think it will take for a vampire attack to be successful in the end?
We've seen a number of attempts here and I don't think that any have been really sticky or have had longevity.
Would love to know just what you guys think.
Like after I wrote this,
I didn't have great answers.
I think the idea that,
I mean the best vamp attack that always comes to mind for me is Blur.
And I don't know if it necessarily totally fits in to your definition, but it's pretty close, right?
It was an NFT marketplace.
They gave traders an airdrop to come and then token incentives to trade on a...
Good point, yeah.
And for a while, I thought thought blur was the better platform for trading
nfts like that pendulum shifted somewhere in the last year where they seem to just ignore blur and
work on blast but um there was a point in time where like i genuinely outside of incentives
thought blurb was a better platform to buy and sell on a piece. That was why I invested in it,
because I was sick of OpenSea at the time.
And I think Blur really forced OpenSea
to make their platform better,
which made it better for all of us.
Fees went down, experience got better.
They copied some things that worked with Blur
and brought them over to openc and they still
do their own stuff that is unique to them so i think it depends on your term of success like it
was successful for a year or two but i guess on the long longer scale it's like you know maybe
not as successful today but i think that's because the priorities of the people behind blur shifted
heavily over the last year or two um the pup.fun i don't feel like it is drastically harder to make
a better user experience um than what there is and it's not that crazy to lower the fees right
like people who are doing thousands of millions of dollars of volume
and paying that fee over and over again,
they want to slice that.
And as time goes on and there's not a token airdrop
or there's not a give back to the people paying the high fees,
then it makes sense they're going to look for a better platform.
So I think at the end of the day,
the UX has to be better than the current thing.
And then on top of that,
the incentives are what get people to migrate at first.
And then the combination of a better UX
plus better incentives gets people to stay there.
But the UX has to be better.
And then you need incentives
or some type of distribution
to get people to try it to feel
the ux difference like i think that's one reason so many people use metamask instead of rabbi right
now there's no incentive for them to try rabbi there's no like airdrop thing it's just if you
want a better ux and you trust a friend who told you it's better like you try it but there's no like
and you trust a friend who told you it's better,
you try it.
But there's no like,
hey, if you use this,
you're for sure getting an airdrop.
If they said something along the lines of
users at the end of the year get an airdrop,
you would see conversion rate go through the roof.
And then I think it would be sticky
because people who use it would be like,
wow, why the fuck was I using MetaMask?
So it's like to me you kind
of have to have both i think you need three things so i think you need that airdrop slash incentives
to hook people in at the beginning i think you have to have a better product you have to have
some improvement over the current state and then three you need to have something for people to do
so i think part of the reason why Pump is still winning
is most of the hotter memes still over the last couple weeks
have been launched on Pump.
All the users are on Pump.
The liquidity is still on Pump.
So even though Boop might be a little bit easier to launch a token,
I don't really know the trading experience
is necessarily that much better.
It feels kind of like the same.
There's just not enough action yet for them to win.
They weren't ready day one either,
and that gave people a bad first impression,
I think, on the UX of the site.
It was just crashing or not loading or telling people
there was no airdrop or the charts weren't updating or whatnot.
It's not great, and I think you do lose a good bit of people
who only try things once.
And if they try it on lunch day when it's breaking,
they might not come back to try it again.
We've seen that a couple of times.
That happened with Pudgy as well, I feel like.
Dude, the Pudgy day was horrible.
Yeah, that's a good point.
I'll add one thing.
I think you guys hit some really great stuff for a vampire attack to work.
The one thing I'll add is I think there needs to be a symbiotic relationship between the user and the platform when it comes to the incentives and liquidity.
Meaning, I don't just go there and you give me free money and I can sell it.
There needs to be something where there's give and take.
That way it just helps with sort of price stability.
Tyler, I think you hit on the biggest thing though,
which is there's got to be something for people to do.
And it was easier for NFTs
because NFTs were all just instantly ported over.
So you could just trade your board apes, whatever.
You could trade them all on Blur.
And then new projects were also unlocking trading on blur, new NFT projects. So you need something
similar. If I had to bet on pump fund being disrupted in three years, I think I would take
the yes, but still probably an underdog for it to happen. Folks, we've got some breaking news live during the show.
We have our first state-level strategic Bitcoin reserve
bill passed in
New Hampshire. This is
a shocker. I actually had it on my
call sheet. One of our discussion points was going to be
are we not going to get any strategic
reserves this year? Because we just
saw two fail.
Arizona's governor vetoed their bill over the weekend. And then Florida just withdrew theirs. We were running out of options. We're
running out of horses in this race. And then New Hampshire puts it over the line. They were a huge
underdog to be the first state to sign this. So this is huge. This is breaking. I have not had a chance to dig into the specifics of the New Hampshire Bitcoin Reserve bill,
but it has been signed into law.
All right.
And then their treasurer is now authorized to buy Bitcoin directly or through an ETF.
It looks like if this comment can be trusted, up to 5% of public funds into Bitcoin.
I'm going to try to look up more on this.
Jeez, I mean, I was lost to you, immediate reactions to this.
Live free or die, baby.
I'm looking up how big is New Hampshire's treasury.
But what do you think this means?
Do you think we're going to have other states?
Because it's like so many other states.
I think this is great.
Yeah, it's a positive signal.
Like this is really great.
From what I understand, Arizona was really interested in this,
but there was some other political factors in play as to why it wasn't passed.
This is historic, Tyler.
This is huge.
This is absolutely huge.
Shout out to Peter for getting this to us.
This is like hopefully the start of other states considering this.
Obviously, it's done on a small scale, but hopefully this is a snowball effect.
Other states consider it.
Yeah, I'm happy to see
this. Peter Reactions, you're the one who shared the breaking news for us.
I'm curious for your thoughts. Live free or die, baby. I love that line from
Jeeves. That was great. Yeah, this is great news. I mean, more
good news for Bitcoin. I think on a state level, there's certainly more merit
than kind of the national level.
But yeah, I didn't expect New Hampshire to be the first state. I thought it was going to be Arizona.
But here we are. So kudos to New Hampshire. And hopefully we get more good news like this on a state level.
See, how's the market reacting? We're getting a pump and Bitcoin's flat on the news. Sad.
Bitcoin's flat on the news.
Sad.
I think I saw that New Hampshire's state budget is,
or not their budget,
their treasury balance is around $3.6 billion.
So $180 million perhaps earmarked for Bitcoin.
We'll see if they go through with the purchases.
I was starting to get bearish that we would see this,
to be honest,
at least this year in its current iteration.
I thought maybe it was just going to take more time.
But now maybe the floodgates will open.
And that clock is ticking on the United States level, Strategic Reserve.
Their time allotment to build that plan is uh, is taking, I don't have the exact
countdown, but that is going to be due here soon. So maybe this will really get the ball rolling.
I think that's a good way to end the show. I think we went around the horn on most of my topics. We
ended with some breaking news. Uh, so it was fun to be able to capture that, but folks, I think we
will go ahead and close it out.
That will be the show.
I want to thank our listeners.
As always, thank my co-hosts.
We'll be back next Tuesday.
Until then, enjoy your day.
Enjoy your week.
We'll talk to you soon.
Hot air rises.
Bye.
Praying for the hot air.
