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Underground is back!
Recorded: June 18, 2025 Duration: 1:22:01Space Recording
Short Summary
Exciting developments are underway as the LitVM project prepares for its launch, promising to integrate Litecoin into the DeFi landscape with innovative features and partnerships. The initiative aims to enhance yield opportunities for Litecoin holders while collaborating with key players in the blockchain space.
Full Transcription
Thank you. you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you day because we realized we kind of goofed it up, dude. We made one small error.
Now here, I need to mute. Hang on a second.
I got two
mices.
Alright.
So you can still hear me?
Whoa!
Why did that happen?
Why am I here?
Oh, yeah, because it's coming through.
Perfect.
I think we got it.
Go ahead.
What's up?
What's going on, Animal?
You go ahead and speak.
Animal, you got to keep this mic on.
On StreamYard.
I can't hear you at all.
I can't hear you even on Spaces.
Oh, shit. Okay, now you can hear me.
All right.
Are you listening with your animal account or my PopulousBlock account?
Both.
So actually
this is
a tricky one, man.
It's annoying.
How do I do this?
Well, hang on. Just go back to what we did before.
It's fine.
The only difference we had to make
was that you needed to have your mic
on the live stream
unmuted.
If you're speaking
with the account that you're
putting on the screen.
You know what I'm saying?
Yeah, now I think
I kind of got it, but I'm
killing my
audio on my
PC. Because I was hearing
an echo of you. I was hearing you twice, basically.
I was hearing you on this whole
space, and then on my phone, because I'm connected
on my phone. So I was hearing you twice,
and I was hearing myself. Who's on your phone? Your animal account? my phone. I was hearing you twice and I was hearing myself.
Who's on your phone? Your animal account?
Yeah, animal. You see the talking over here? That's coming from my phone.
And that's what's on the screen, right?
Yeah. Okay, so...
Oh, no, no. What's on the screen is the populist block.
So that's who's listening.
So we should be able to do this in a live stream.
Hypothetically
speak. We should.
We should, yeah. So what's the problem?
Let's try it, man.
Let's fucking try it. Let's go.
Going live.
We'll do it live.
Welcome Fulton. Welcome Bagelmeister.
We're about to embark on a journey
a journey of the mind with us a journey to the bowels of the internet i'm letting animal
drive the ship today so we're this is the same crew every time you know they're all excited
um because we're doing...
I changed my name to Underground again.
You feel like I lost my mojo?
Underground is back.
You feel like I lost my mojo?
Is that what it is?
I think you lost a lot of people
just by virtue of the fact that they didn't get the memo.
You know what I mean?
So now you're getting...
You just need to get the followers.
You'll have the mojo.
But I think, honestly...
Look, we have Bogomus. What else do we need?
I know. That's kind of what I decided.
I was like, no, let's just do what we like doing,
which is spaces.
And if it doesn't draw a gazillion people,
then who cares?
It's still enjoyable.
What you guys need is a voice changer
to sound like a baddie,
and that'll be good.
That was supposed to be Chief's job,
was recruiting a chick with Litecoin,
but he never came through.
I will say this.
It would bother me when I was underground
and people would call me Grant all the time.
I'm like, dude, first of all, we're in a crypto environment.
I don't put my name on my profile.
Why are you calling me by my name?
I never liked that.
I shouldn't be clear about it.
Yeah, because I always felt like, why are you calling?
I have an anonymous tag. I should be more clear about it. Yeah, because I always felt like, why are you calling?
I have an anonymous tag, and yes, you can see my videos,
and sure, my name's out there,
but to me,
respect the space a little bit.
I did that the other day
to one of our listeners, and I thought,
ah, dang it, I shouldn't have done that.
So in a way, I almost like not knowing people's names.
I apologize for calling you by your first name, by your government name.
Did you do that?
I didn't realize, because everyone was doing it.
Well, when I had my name, after a while, I just was like, forget it.
It's no secret anymore.
Okay.
So, yeah, we'll get back to this.
It's fine.
Yeah, I like using a pseudonym.
Especially because my pseudonym is freaking cool, man.
Yeah, you're just cool.
How do you just change it to...
But no, it looks better like that, ANML.
It looks better than animal.
It looks like if you're dyslexic, it might look like anal,
which I also kind of like about it.
Like, I think it's kind of funny.
But yeah, maybe it's not funny. But no, I like the way it's
concise and people who speak English understand.
If English is a second or third language, you might not get it.
You should be like, um so you should try now that you're using the populist block because animals actually i
gave him some control of the thing i'll make that clear in case they're seeing some wild shit
so if you so chief is so chief you're listening you're on the live stream, can you hear everything properly? It seems pretty good.
Animal, your audio's
coming through your
mic right here? Yeah, coming
through this thing over here. Okay.
Okay, so
Chief says we're good.
Yeah, try sharing this
in those groups.
So I have the Litecoin Spaces group
it's going to hit some people
multiple times
maybe do just the Populous Block group
and then that Market Litecoin group
alright
let's see
this is how I try to get people in here
no one pays any attention
it should get some attention.
I thought you were going to name this one, Announcement.
And then tomorrow will be
the Underground's Back.
We'll just call it Underground's Back Part 2.
I like this, though,
because then, like, I can step away.
You know what I mean?
This has to be...
The only difficulty is...
The question is, can I end the space
if you walk away from it?
Ooh.
Like, if I go log in...
I don't know.
Alright, this may crash it. I'm gonna...
Ooh, that won't work. I can't. I would leave.
Let me check.
I'm on here
I should be able to end my own space
right
I can't
it'll let me listen
somehow
anyway
but okay
so what are we going to talk about?
do you want to talk about the end of the world?
do you want to talk about oh you of the world? Do you want to talk about...
Oh, you know, I got an interesting story for you.
This is totally unrelated.
And I think this is a new phrase we need to start using in this course.
I'm going to coin an internet phrase, okay?
All right.
All right.
Everybody's listening?
This is recorded.
It's called duck dogging, okay?
Okay.
So when I was like probably 30 years old, 35 years old,
my family's got a place in Northern Michigan.
And I was, it was like probably early September.
So there weren't a lot of tourists around.
And I'm standing just like, I don't know,
there's like a dock with a boat and
stuff. And this lady comes running down. This kid comes running down, goes zipping past me,
let me down the beach or this is like grass or whatever. And then this lady comes up and she's
like, you got to help me out. My son's dog is going to chase, is chasing a duck is going to die.
And I'm like, what are you talking about?
She's like, they do that.
Ducks will just tease dogs until they exhaust themselves and drown.
I'm like, what are you talking about? I'm like, I'm going, this is like toilet paper.
There's nothing happening on the beach.
She's like, we need to go like right now.
I'm like, okay.
So we sit in the boat, this little pontoon boat my dad has,
and we zip off to get this dog who's like 400 yards into the lake.
And we are able to get him into the boat and save him.
But apparently what ducks do, and I was just looking this up because I was telling my daughter this story.
I don't know if they do it intentionally.
If they do, it's psychotic as hell. But they, you know, they escape quickly.
So they'll only fly like maybe 30 yards.
The dog can still see him.
So the dog keeps swimming.
And then they'll move another 20 yards.
And the dog just doesn't know any better and just keeps chasing and chasing to the point it runs out of energy and just drowns.
Because it's so far from shore.
Holy shit.
And I'm like, no, I didn't get exactly. I just thought
this might be something that happens in
media
where they just keep like
moving the goalpost and keeping you
chasing and keeping you arguing
until you're freaking just mentally
over it. Like, I can't have this conversation
anymore. So I
think this is a thing. We're going to call it duck-dogging.
If someone keeps moving the goalpost, they're duck-dogging. If someone keeps moving the
goalposts, they're duck-dogging us.
Alright? I like it.
We can use that.
Because we've been duck-dived
for, like, it feels like forever.
Especially in crypto. But, like,
yeah, with politics, definitely.
I have a question.
What's on your
shirt?
This is my curling shirt.
What does it say?
It's a day.
That is...
Curling shirt.
Oh, really?
What does it look like backwards?
It's just very topical.
Oh, I didn't even think about that.
You didn't? I just threw the shirt on. I didn't even think about that. You didn't?
It's,
I just threw,
I just threw the shirt on.
So it's not intentional.
Okay.
I can say that's a topic.
I'm definitely not,
I'm not sure how I feel about it.
Yeah.
Well,
I mean,
look,
there's,
there's definitely a lot of a nuance to it not in the same way as there is with what's happening in the Middle East I think it's
very clear what's happening there but I think look there was there was Arnold
Schwarzenegger today I don't know if he saw, but he was on The View.
And he was, of course, you know, the gubernator of California for some time.
Right.
And he's got a very, I guess, rational opinion, which he gave to the women of The View.
and I think it's the sensible answer.
What he was going on to say is that, look,
he started off by very clearly saying that he's an immigrant
and he's very grateful to the country
for providing such a wonderful lifestyle for him, blah, blah, blah.
Okay, guys, you've got a great country,
land of opportunity,
especially if you're a jacked Austrian guy.
They're very generous with him and his family.
But he went on to say that this has been an issue that's been going on for a long time
time and that what's needed is immigration reform specifically to be able to have
and that what's needed is immigration reform,
working individuals like working immigrants be able to get visas or rather to have a larger pool
of visas given out to immigrants because we knew we do need we you guys we don't have the same issue
in canada but america does need um the immigrants the illegal immigrants that they currently have
there to do you know all the all the jobs that they're doing right if ice were to come if if
ice were to go to home depot or the farms and stuff where um these guys are working america would grind to a halt right
um so there needs to be some kind of reform there now of course trump did say this as well
last week and he's walking it back for some reason i don't know but i think he's right i think um look
it's a better solution than what we have now. Because right now, I mean, when people say,
it's like, yeah, but who's going to pick,
you know, who's going to pick our fruits and stuff?
You know, who's going to do all this?
Who's going to build our houses?
It's like, yeah, well, so you have these people now
that are working, that don't have workers' rights, right?
They don't have human rights
in the end
because their bosses can abuse them
and have them work
double shifts, triple shifts
five or seven times a week or whatever.
And if they fail to do
this, they don't get brought back
the next day.
So they don't have any protections. They're being abused
potentially on the job. But I'm saying it's not
everyone that does this. There's obviously, like,
better people
than others. They keep coming back for a reason.
They come here because it's a better
option than what they have at home.
Right.
And so even as bad as we might think it is,
I remember hearing an argument when they talked
about, like, the slums of New York
back in the 19, like, turn of the century, 1880s, 1890s.
And they're like, well, the reason people were in the city is because it was better than living out on the farm.
You know, it's actually a better alternative than what they had.
But anyway.
For sure.
I mean, they wouldn't they wouldn't be here if they didn't need to.
Right.
Like, I don't think.
Yeah. Let me just. I need to, right? Like, I don't think... Yeah.
Let me just... I need to write a quick message to someone. Yeah, to be clear.
To be clear.
It says have curling
club in it, right?
Does it wear?
It is a curling club.
I'm not just making this up.
You know,
I don't know.
I do agree there are people that,
you know, like there's a common sentiment
that Americans don't want to do these jobs.
And there's certainly a lot of truth to that.
They don't want to do them under the conditions
and of the wages that they have today.
Right. But I also think that there's a lot of like just as when slavery
ended, we saw a mass amount
of innovation come by to automate
jobs were not automated in the past because we had cheap
slash free labor.
I think if those people were not there,
people would invest in automation, plain and simple.
That's what's happened everywhere.
You know, you go into factories, they use automation.
People have gotten too expensive.
And now, is that the plan?
Was that, like, is that part of their master plan there's just to to make it to get rid of to cause some kind of crisis that makes us that you know robots are now
commonplace i mean the timing is lining up um within four years within his term i think we'll
see i guarantee there are machines that can be invented that go pick up to, you know, then that'd be like a humanoid robot.
I mean, go look, have you ever seen like when they shake the pecan trees, those, or the machines that grab a tree and strip the branches and bark and cut it into eight foot sections and load it on a truck, all one machine?
Have you seen those?
Like there's, we can make things that can do, can do these. I mean, God, you've seen those like there's we can make things that can do
can do these i mean god you've seen those brick laying machines right yeah yeah there's you know
and that that's i mean i don't know if that's better or worse if you're saying like we want
to have people not working it goes back to that question we were talking about. Do you want no one to work?
I'm a believer that we should have people working.
But at the same time, it's like, well, why would you do it
if you could have a machine do it?
I don't know what the purpose is.
If it's cheaper, it's going to happen.
That's the thing.
If a machine is less expensive than a migrant worker,
it's going to happen.
Which is kind of fucked up.
Right?
So, I don't know.
Maybe this is a warning for that,
for what's to come.
I have no idea.
One thing that's crazy,
do you see the video of the robot?
He was,
it was working retail
folding clothes and stuff.
And there was a human next to it.
And the robot was folding a shirt,
putting it on a pile,
folding a shirt,
putting it on the pile.
And the human at some point was like,
wait, give me just,
and the human put its hand out
and the robot handed the shirt to them folded.
You know,
we're getting there with technology.
It's pretty,
it's advancing so quickly.
Real quick, we got Aztec in here from LitVM.
Aztec, how's it going? Welcome.
How are we doing tomorrow?
Yeah, well, this is a test run.
So if you'll look at the PopulousBlock profile,
rather, we're live streaming this from that account.
If you click on that, you should see the video
and hear us as well.
But don't do both at the same time. You'll get a weird echo.
If you're in the spaces, it's going to mess your brain up a bit.
If you're in the spaces,
it's going to mess your brain up a bit.
But yeah.
So I don't know.
This whole fucking thing, honestly, dude,
it hurts me to see
the human suffering that's coming out of this.
it's just
I hope it ends quickly
and they come to some kind of
like an immigration reform act
would be great
do you think
do you think that you're being shown
I mean there are things that
again I told you I haven't been paying as much attention as I should be
does it feel very George Floyd-ish
though like that there's
these
protests and riots are being
amped
up? They're amplifying
things to make things
worse.
I don't know.
I feel like because
of the internet
and these echo chambers that are a side effect of things like Reddit and Facebook and whatnot, we have a lot of political hacks, party hacks.
People that just follow the party line, that see all their friends and their favorite media outlets outlets are posting and they just echo it without even really thinking.
Now, to be fair, like, protest video on the screen share.
Are you, sorry, is, Chief, are you sharing something?
He's trying to.
Or you had it up there, Chief.
You lost it, though.
Here's the thing.
If we start sharing stuff, dude,
we're going to lose the audience
and we're going to have to unmute our mics
for the live stream.
You know what I mean?
Chief's like, yeah, cool.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, I hear what you're saying on that.
No, no, we don't.
Oh, because it won't be able to hear us
through the thing.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's like
a whole other animal we gotta get into.
I mean, he could show...
We just have to get in the habit. I think we can do it.
We just have to
unmute and...
I mean, the audience will be
muted until we
bring him back.
Let me try it.
Hey, Chief's got his sunglasses on.
You alright, bud?
Yeah, Chief was there, right?
You were in the protesting.
You were mad on the ground.
You got a video I saw.
I took some pictures, some selfies and shit.
You get arrested?
You're still in America.
Good job.
He's flipping us.
He's giving us a finger now.
All right, let's try it.
No, we don't need to mute in here.
We just need to unmute in there.
So let's switch.
We're going to...
Yeah, there's no audience participation.
So the people in the spaces, they're not going to know the difference. But let's describe the We're going to... Yeah, there's no audience participation. To the people in the spaces,
they're not going to know the difference.
But let's describe the video, I guess.
Alright, let's try this.
Go ahead, make the switch, Chief.
Make the switch. Or, animal.
Chief will have to do it.
Is this thing up? Oh, no, it is up.
Yeah, it is.
Okay, let's go. At the stage.
Alright, so let's see.
Okay, you got booted.
All right, so here's what we're seeing.
Everybody's patient.
So Chief was down.
If you guys watched the live stream, you were right in the heart of it, dude.
Like right down.
And that, to me, looks pretty peaceful.
Yeah, it's not bad.
I'm seeing everybody just marching.
A lot of American flags,
right?
Which I think is another
misconception. Again, the ones
that get amplified are the guys
with the Mexican flags, which could very
well just be
plants, right?
Chief, you want
to come up here, add some context? Where are you in this thing?
He's got to talk. He's got to talk.
We got to talk?
Because this is obviously in LA,
but I don't know anything about LA.
Oh, hang on, hang on, hang on.
It says your mic isn't connected.
Dude, my computer got all jacked up
chief
we can't hear you at all
so maybe he needs to
come up here
he's on the stage
anyway
no I mean that's the thing
I think peaceful protest is the
best way to go about this
and it's the same thing that we had where there's always instigators in these crowds that are, you know, when you're doing a, if it was a MAGA rally, it's going to be like, they're going to put, the CIA they're gonna put,
the CIA's gonna put people in there.
I'm being controversial, maybe, by saying that,
but I think it's obvious that, like,
there are, there are instigators,
paid instigators,
on both sides.
You guys have that black block where you're at?
Does that ring a bell?
The black block.
Okay, on Canada here, we had a bunch of student protests because tuition was apparently
too high for some people. Which when you
look at what you guys have to pay in the States,
it's a joke. Anyways, so these
protests, every summer
for like four years. And
there's one group called the black block
which were like
anarchists. Yeah, I think they have them.
Antifa kind of.ifa yeah they just showed up
they showed up early
yeah it was before Antifa
these guys preceded Antifa
and yeah they would just start shit
and then it turned out
that there was a bunch of
state police that were part of it
you know
and they were like
starting riots
yeah that was messed up.
You see the same thing
in Palestine, right?
Where, like, you'd have
an Israeli instigator
throwing a rock across a fence
from the Palestinian side,
and then Palestine responding
with rifles and...
Israel responding with rifles
and causing some shit.
Yeah. Yeah.
It's been a pretty shitty week, I think, globally, overall,
with Iran now and all these fucking bombs.
Like, holy shit.
It's been weird.
My feed, I figure I could jump on them
and get a bunch of news.
And all I'm really getting is reactions.
I'm not getting actual news feeds.
And I almost don't know, maybe I need to start following some new people.
Anybody else in here, if you want to pop up and chime in.
Where do you get your news?
Like, do you have accounts you listen to that you go,
you know, they seem to be pretty fair.
Or like even handed about it.
I know that, I mean, that ground news is more of a website.
Yeah, it's an aggregator.
Do you think there's one out there that's the fairest of them all?
That should be somebody's tagline.
No, I don't think there is.
I think everyone's got an agenda one way or another.
And I feel like it's by design
and it's kind of sickening i feel like the you know places like x right where people
where people aren't doing it for monetary gain right people are just up here talking and trying
to get down to the to the truth of of the matter as we'll get the best takes.
But it's
so hard because
there's so many bots.
It's like the dead internet theory,
right?
You've heard about the dead internet theory?
You know what that is?
Yeah, yeah.
There's just more bots than humans online
and so it's just a bunch of machines talking to each other.
Someone wants to come up.
You got to run everything.
It's all good.
I'm trying to do two things.
Did it work?
Is he up?
Yeah, what's up, bro?
I went up to him, bro.
Anyway, now I just wanted to make sure that I was able to hear on the stream.
So everything looks like it's working on the stream, right?
Everything seems perfect.
Yeah, something happened.
I think we have a pretty good workflow.
Yeah, I think we figured it out.
Something goofy happened to my computer.
Like, I don't know, because we had like a power outage the other night.
So I came on and like all my basic settings were gone and so
I had to reconnect my mic and everything so I don't know if maybe that's what
happened chief something wasn't letting you speak right but you're not speaking
on the live stream oh yeah I'm not speaking on the live stream I'm speaking
on I guess this still works you can still do your sound effects and stuff, right?
Can I?
Can you guys hear it?
Here it comes.
Yeah.
Nice.
There you go.
There you go.
Anyway, underground is back, guys.
Underground is back.
Well, so does Aztec want to come up?
Me and come talk, just kind of get a preview of what you guys were talking about.
We were just thinking like tomorrow, we normally do our thing on Wednesday nights.
And I don't know anything about what's going on, so it might be more animal contriving thing.
Yeah, look, I don't want to put him on the spot at all. Nope, nope, on the spot.
Obviously, on the spot.
No, no, no.
But I mean, I just wanted to give him an idea as to what we're working on,
working with rather.
Yeah, we haven't really discussed
what we'd be talking about.
Honestly, I'm just going to tell you right now,
I'm curious as to what like the roadmap is
in terms of like the timeline
when things will be happening.
I'm curious as to what you need,
if anything,
from the Lightpoint community.
And yeah, anything else you want to talk about?
Was it, you guys were talking last time in your spaces
about the possibility of using MWeb to, you know, onboard onto LitVM, right?
Which I think is amazing.
Would it be the first fully
end-to-end anonymous
DeFi solution?
Maybe.
So yeah, if we could talk about that,
although I'm sure that's
a couple years down the road.
First, you have to build up the ecosystem,
and then you can get fancy with MWeb.
I don't know how big your team is.
What's his name, Yago?
He's here right now.
Talk to him.
Oh, what's up, dude?
Hey, Animal.
Thank you, Underground, also, for letting me come up.
Of course, man.
I do like the setup.
It looks great.
So you were watching on a live stream, too?
Well, Animal...
Is that me, or did I lose him?
No, I think he got rugged.
Yeah, I think it's just him
doing an episode. Hey, you know what? Hey, start over. I think he got rugged. I think it's just him.
Doing an episode
about
Lit BM or interviewing
us or something along those lines.
I'm just checking everything out,
but it looks great, guys.
Can you hear me now?
Yeah, I can hear you.
I hear everyone.
I hear Aztec.
I don't think i've seen anyone do this before like this format where you've
integrated live streams with the spaces i think it's fun um we could pull people up you know and
if we want like you know when you guys come on we can have you on video as well uh so we could have
like a more focused
session right uh screen sharing and whatnot if anything if there's any slides you want to show
whatever um or not even we don't need that but yeah yeah this is the future man we're ahead of
the curve we're we should patent this i actually yeah it's just super complicated i can't believe
we waited this long because it was so it actually ended up being so easy we've been talking about it for like a month or two i wanted to do this
freaking uh year or two ago i was like there's got to be a way to do it and i just couldn't
figure out the i knew i had to have a second account or something but i could never get the
audio from my phone well they did the desktop spaces were crummy for a long time i think that's
why yeah they just fixed it yeah they just fixed that they fixed that like maybe like a year ago
right so i remember we're trying it and the audio was always bad you lose certain controls and that
type of stuff but so yeah i don't know i do have talked to vogelmas because he's supposed to be
my connection and you know he didn't i've got any updates about shipments i'm supposed to be my connection. I haven't gotten any updates about shipments I'm supposed to be receiving,
but you've got to keep it vague.
What?
You weren't here last week?
Well, I'll be back tomorrow.
I should be right at 9.
I'm going to be coming in.
We can try it again like this.
Is it easier for you to host it like this?
I mean, I have it set up right now.
It's back.
I can do it, but it shouldn't be too hard for you to do either.
The thing I don't know is if you can pass it off.
Whoever's deciding, if you've got to go,
and you're like, I'm tired, it's a little clock,
then we've just got to cut it.
Are you using two computers then? No, I'm tired. It's a little clock. Then we just got to cut it.
Are you using two computers then?
No, I just want a computer and a phone.
Hey, guys, I lost a connection.
I apologize.
No, yeah, you're fine.
No, we barely heard you in the beginning.
You were saying it just kind of started where you and Animal reached out to you.
So I haven't had a chance to look at a lot of this lit VM.
What's the, I guess, what's the story here? When did, when did you, I guess, when did you decide that you were going to build on Litecoin versus Bitcoin? Have you been working on it a long time?
Like kind of what's the general background of it? Cause I missed the summit and I know I missed a
lot. I've just been real busy sure it's a good question um i started doing research on back in the day i had an initial
deck for this idea and i was going to call it zkl LTC and this was like early last year so at
the same time that a lot of the Bitcoin layer twos or Bitcoin kind of like
technologies were coming out for like DeFi and runes and ordinals and then runes.
As about the same time I was thinking about it.
And so I've been a like when was the first coin I ever purchased.
And so, yeah, basically I work with Lunar Digital Assets.
It's a full-stack blockchain venture studio.
We incubated Polygon, QuickSwap.
We've had some great success in the industry
and many other projects.
I've been passionate about the hard money space
and Ethereum for a long time,
just because of my background.
And I just wanted to put it all together.
I was looking at the current landscape of technology,
and it's just, you know, there's everything so fragmented,
and it's almost like Bitcoin bitcoiners playing bitcoin land and
you know light coiners in light coin land and ethereum bros and solana bros over there and you
know so the idea is to create uh litecoin zk omni chain you're you're basically bringing everything
all together but uh litecoin is the soul of the, you know, light coin is gas on the chain and, and this is not wrapped, uh,
light coin, this would be native trustless light coin on the chain.
And this is the enabled because of the ZK technology.
Um, animal was asking, I think earlier about like,
how big is the team it's, it's actually really big.
So there's two dev teams that are all stars in the ZK world and pioneers
really in ZK technology.
And then we also have an advisor, David Chom, who is the godfather of cryptography.
He was working on cryptography before anyone in the Bitcoin space, before anyone really was thinking about crypto and stuff like that.
Was he at the summit this year?
He was. He was mainly... he showed up for a second he wanted to
meet uh we we wanted we basically uh asked him to come by and talk to charlie because he's building
i i i don't actually i don't know if i can really talk about what he's built. It's, it's, it's a really big deal for, for, uh, he wants to do this for Bitcoin, but we're
thinking, you know, maybe he, uh, he does this for light when as well.
Anyway, anyways, yeah, he came for a bit.
He was mainly at, uh, some of the side events.
Like we were at a DNA house talking with like Brock Pierce's crew and, and all that at his side event.
It was going, going on right before the summit.
And so, yeah, I think he was at like side events and then also showed up for a little
bit.
So what are you like, what are the things, I guess the key, I guess, what do you think is like this unlocks, you know, kind of as real applications that you feel have either currently have traction or that you think maybe this improves on something that's existing today that makes it go from being an idea to like people actually, you know, adopting it and using
these tools. That's been the toughest part of crypto so far is people finding really good
utility. To me, beyond, I mean, I think the sound money, the hard money thing is the one that
we all know works really well.
And there's been a lot of experimenting that goes on, which I think is great.
But some of it kind of comes and goes, right?
It's fairly fleeting.
So what do you feel like this unlocking the staying power?
I guess that'd be the question.
Sure. So Litecoin is hard money and it has all of its use cases.
So we're basically just building on top of all the great work
that has already been done there.
And what it would unlock is if you have a new layer
for native trustless Litecoin to live on,
that's in the EVM,
like an Ethereum virtual machine type player,
then it unlocks everything that you can do on Ethereum,
but for Litecoin.
So Litecoin just adds a ton of utility.
So from the start, it's gas on the chain.
Which is big. Yeah. You know, you have defy. So,
so is it a separate chain? Is it kind of like you port over meaning like you kind of like with
the drive chain conversation where there's some sort of locking mechanism that you, in order to participate, you move your coins to an address and then that gives you this capability or is it somehow native inside the Litecoin blockchain?
Or is it like connecting to the Aglier?
yeah so this is um it gets really technical but by what i the easiest way to explain it
and i'm not a dev but uh you know i've been like i've been working with projects for so long that
i'm pretty technical but the easiest way to explain it is that the uh litecoin never moves from the main chain. So you don't need to use your Litecoin on LitVM.
LitVM is another chain, but you don't actually have to move your Litecoin there.
Because the way it works is with ZK, which is just math, it's just cryptography.
Right.
You can prove that you have the asset.
And then so ultimately you're just playing with a ZK proof on the other chain.
So to not get so technical, you're uh proving that you own the litecoin and and that enables you
with the zk technology to use that litecoin on the uh on litvm so how so when i you know because
like let's say because i completely understand what you're saying it's you're um because it's provable, you can move
coins on this new blockchain.
But then it does...
Wow, this is interesting.
So how do you, like,
let's say you want to transfer assets on it,
how do you make sure that that
ties back to...
And how is Litecoin gas on the chain if you're never moving,
I guess you're paying it in as,
so how are you signing transactions from another blockchain?
I guess that'd be the question.
so the,
So the Litecoin is...
the,
the Litecoin is,
So the way that technology works is it's...
The ZK proofs are rolled up to Litecoin.
So...
Okay.
When you do the transactions on live VM those
transactions are being rolled up to litecoin so if it's the gas then you
know it's a taking a portion on the main chain. That's my general understanding.
Yeah, there must be some way that it's...
There must be some way you're signing transactions.
I get like consolidating, which is a little bit like what DriveChains was doing, right? It was taking
a lot of activity and
consolidating into one transaction. It was also what MWeb does, basically,
right?
When you're coming back from
every two and a half minutes,
it's just consolidating everything that happened.
All the transactions, yeah. I'm wondering
like, so
with LitVM, if you have...
Yeah, I know, but
and I
and this is the way I'm still seeing it.
It's like as if when you create an address on LitVM, you'll have a wallet.
And that'll be integrated into some kind of system, right?
The LitVM system.
And you'll be able to buy assets with that, maybe transfer some Litecoin to that wallet.
And you'll be able to buy assets with that, maybe transfer some Litecoin to that wallet.
And then from there, you can buy things on like a DeFi, maybe like an NFT space or NFT marketplace or like on a DeFi chain.
And then those assets will be exchanged for Litecoin and they'll appear in your wallet.
All right.
And then from there, from your Litviem wallet, you'll be able to manage your assets and play with other tools that you guys develop on there.
Other DeFi, maybe like some kind of lending or borrowing platform.
Maybe it'll enable you to wrap them or whatever. Yeah. Yeah.
Right. I mean, you won't need to wrap the Litecoin. So the chain will have all kinds of different assets on it.
Ethereum, general stable coins, wrapped Bitcoin, and native Litecoin, and wrapped versions of Litecoin. But yes, you'll be able to take your Litecoin, your native precious Litecoin,
your native precious litecoin and if you're if you're using a lot like metamask or you know with
i i'd love to see us actually work with one of the one of or all of the the main kind of like
litecoin wallets as well just enable them with like web3 functionality but but yeah you at the at the wallet level you just
you have your assets there and uh and then you'd be able to interact with uh litvm
decentralized applications so that could be like an uh a marketplace for ordinals and other Litecoin assets.
It could be a real-world asset platform, a DeFi platform.
You could do lending and borrowing.
You could do loop strategies using Litecoin.
You can get healed curiosity like is it something i realized when i was on was so frustrating whenever i've tried to interact with those other platforms
is like getting the gas right and like the different avalanche c chain or whatever it is
and there's these variations and you never feel like you're like I have the money why can't
I send it and I don't know that's just the nature of the beast in this is that environment but
I've always you know again Litecoin always just works every single time and does it take
it still has to yeah it's still happening on the. So you're still having to pay on-chain fees, right?
Right, because everything rolls back up to Litecoin.
Okay.
No, that's cool.
I mean, that's something that I wished we would have had three years ago, right?
It always felt like we were kind of left out of the equation.
So where are you went on the uh i
guess you know we're we can talk about this tomorrow maybe again i didn't i don't intend
this to be a spaces spaces we just want to try this out make sure we had our tech right i'm just
dealing with you guys i i don't even know if i could come tomorrow specifically at whatever time
but um you know i just wanted to check out what you guys are doing and hang out
for a bit uh but but yeah how are you asking how far yeah i don't mind like where are we at
in this stuff you're on and so you guys know i'm big on community and i i think that uh
it's really important to just share what you're building as much as you can. You know, obviously some of this stuff is, uh,
still not fully unveiled because, um,
just working with the different development teams,
they'd rather us not like kind of share how far along, you know, we are on,
or, or, uh, specific types of parts of the tech.
But yeah, how far along?
So one way that you guys can verify that this technology already exists is with following
Bitcoin OS.
So they're the development team on the Litecoin, Bitcoin roll-up side.
And then Gateway is on the Ethereum roll-up side.
But if you've been following Bitcoin OS, you guys might not have heard of them.
But they've been working on ZK stuff for Bitcoin for years now.
on ZK
stuff for Bitcoin for years now
recently they just came out with
kind of unveiled this technology
called Charms
and it's basically just
the same exact technology that I was talking about
ZK on Bitcoin
you can prove that you have Bitcoin
the Bitcoin never leaves the chain
and you can
bring that Bitcoin over using the ZK technology to other UTXO chains.
So they proved that the technology works and that it's usable on Cardano.
So this is the first place they used it.
They recently did this and they had a Bitcoin transaction on Cardano.
It's a native trustless, not wrapped.
And basically all we're doing is modifying that technology for Litecoin.
But obviously the other part of it is that we're going to be able to use that native trustless Lite when in an EVM or an Ethereum virtual machine
environment. So, so there, there's a little bit more to what we're doing, but, but yeah,
this stuff, this technology basically already exists. We're just modifying it. And then
we're working with other development teams to modify other technologies that exist already.
So we're using Polygon technology.
Just to kind of oversimplify it, we're using Polygon technology to have the Ethereum layer too.
And technology that's a light
gambling and
gambling on Litecoin
is that what you're saying?
is that coming?
what did you say?
a lottery or gambling on Litecoin?
I'm interested
you can do anything
really
programmable tokens
unified ecosystems, covenants, trustless bridging, scalability solutions, private transactions, roll-ups, and true L2s.
So you're saying that this is actually functional on Bitcoin right now?
This is functional.
This technology is functional on Bitcoin.
It's already been
utilized.
Okay.
I'm just curious if there's any...
If you guys have run into any
limitations, any blockers
on Bitcoin
that maybe
Litecoin
is better suited to handle?
I think there wasn't any blockers or limitations,
generally speaking,
but obviously Litecoin as a base layer
is faster than Bitcoin,
so naturally it's going to be,
because transactions are still being rolled up to Litecoin, being that it's going to be because transactions are still being rolled up to
Litecoin being that it's faster you know that's going to be better and in the
overall like scaling process but but you know it's it's not a it's not a real limitation for Bitcoin at this point either.
I guess it's like we achieved mass adoption, you know, and we were comparing this technology on Bitcoin versus Litecoin.
I mean, there's definitely, you know, a much bigger reason to use Litecoin than Bitcoin in my opinion.
Right on.
So, okay, is there...
Yeah, because I see you got a little ticker at the bottom.
It's building BOS on a whole bunch of stuff here.
I can't really show that screen just because I'll lose the audience
and our audio.
So how do we get started?
If I wanted to play with BOS right now,
I have some Bitcoin
and I want to create a BOS wallet, I guess.
Is that where I would start?
I actually
what they've done so far
is to showcase the technology themselves
but it's not
it's not like
everyone's actively using it
right now.
Okay, gotcha.
But where can you get started? I i mean it's going to take a little
time at least on our side just because we're making the modifications and soon we'll have a
lot more information you know the main thing that we've been working on is i mean there's there's so many parts of the project that have to be outlined before we can kind of get to where
we want to go. So basically with the, with the modification and everything, you know,
we, we want to get everything ready and usable by Q4
of this year so that's kind of
a general
time frame on our side now for Bitcoin
and all that I'm not
you know that's not exactly
something I'm following like super closely because it's it's you know it's just
different it's like that's bitcoin os building that technology for bitcoin and they're they're
they're using it on uh uh cardano right now so a little bit it's different than what we're doing
a little bit different than what we're doing.
Right.
Well, still, Q4 seems pretty...
I mean, that's pretty quick.
I'm excited to see what you guys got, man.
Honestly, like, I've been
a light-coiner for a while.
honestly, I kind of had FOMO when I
saw all these things happening on
Polygon and stuff. I was like...
And Solana came along
and um i mean i don't know how you guys feel about solana but i'm not a huge fan of their
constant downtime whenever things get spicy over there um so yeah man if if and like light coins
like one's a badass man it's been around forever. 100% uptime.
It's hard money.
You know, we've got a guard dog.
We've got Dogecoin, all that stuff.
So don't fuck this up, I was going to say.
Yeah.
I mean, like, I'm not sure you can break Litecoin.
No, it's not Litecoin that would be the problem.
this Litecoin over.
It's us just getting all of our technology ready to bring the native trustless Litecoin over.
And that and like,
And that and like... Sorry, go ahead.
sorry, go ahead.
Yeah, just like,
I guess one more thing
on this entire
kind of LitVM thing.
Not only is it going to bring
programmability and,
you know, new utility
and functionality,
but a big part of
my goal for Litecoin
is just to add more ways to earn yield on Litecoin.
So you can do that playing in real-world assets or DeFi or there's a ton of other different
types of, depending on, so everyone has their own personal risk tolerance and then also how decentralized the mechanisms that they feel comfortable with using.
But this will just open up all kinds of different optionality for Litecoin holders. You know, my goal, I'm big on decentralization.
And I want to put my Litecoin to work in a decentralized fashion.
But, you know, there will also be other new kind of institutional options as well
that are not as decentralized.
But, you know, maybe there's higher yield.
And so depending on everyone's personal strategy, there's just going to be a lot more options for strategies using Litecoin.
price of Litecoin comes up pretty often.
What I've always noticed with ecosystems is that if you bring more utility to an asset,
that creates more demand and the price goes up.
You were asking about Solana.
I'm not a big fan of Solana.
If you guys know me, I a big polygon guy you know because we
incubated polygon and polygon and solana were at odds for a long time so uh i'm also not a really
big fan of the casino um i but but that doesn't mean that like i i hate it but uh anyways uh i just want to say like i i appreciate you guys doing this you have
you know the polygon team has an excellent track record um and i i hope it like like you said like
it's going to bring utility i hope we also get also we we also have the wind to our backs in
terms of market conditions um you know i hope we
we don't go to war and like the stock market doesn't tank and it's and it gets released and
like do you guys consider that at all when you when you release stuff i don't know if you can
even say that if me saying this or like if you're talking about it if it kind of takes some of the
magic away or like it's effectiveness so maybe you know kind of like drome powell when he when
he wants something to happen he he doesn't talk about it.
He talks about other things that make the things that he wants to happen, happen.
But yeah, I guess what I'm trying to say is the rest of the crypto ecosystem right now is kind of in a downtrend.
Hopefully by Q4, you know, we'll start to see the light at the end of the tunnel,
right in time for Litvm to hit the market
and to blow everyone's pants off and to start like you know a bull run for litecoin i i fully
think about all of this stuff so i'm big on macro and and uh the way i look at this is that
um so i don't comment a lot on like, uh, political stuff, but, but, uh,
cause I'm just, my focus is just on, I'm a big nerd, you know, I'm like progressing the,
the technology forward and industry forward. And I, I just, i try not to get caught up too much in
politics but but i do look at it from a macro sense where i think hard money becomes more and
more important you know if we are if the world is going in a direction that i'm not you know
i don't like war and all of that and um but you know, hard money just becomes more important.
If more and more countries don't trust each other,
well, I don't think it makes sense to,
that, you know, these countries are going to be using stable coins.
It makes sense to use hard money in between these countries.
And so I guess the best way for me to answer this question is that I do fully look into
all this stuff and it's a big part of kind of my thesis for LitVM, which is that hard
money is going to become more and more important, not only because it's just being adopted for
many different reasons, but I think you need that
money that can be trusted
by friends and enemies
just giving it more utility
just further
speeds up the adoption process.
Totally.
Yeah, I agree.
No, I think it's a good place to stop for now.
Dude, thanks for joining us.
I appreciate your time.
We've been going on for an hour.
I know if you guys want to come on, I think Rock's also...
Well, because as far as I know, it's you, Rock, and his name, and Yago that were at the summit, right?
So, yeah, it was us three, but it was also a large portion of the Bitcoin OS team that was there.
Okay.
Yeah, I don't think I met them.
I was running around so much, this whole thing. I was helping Rebecca gather speakers and stuff and find speakers. With the Bitcoin conference happening next door, a lot of the speakers were in both places at once and they'd show up like five minutes before they were meant to talk.
You know, they'd show up like five minutes before they were meant to talk.
So we're kind of like, you know, not any of their fault at all.
It's just the way scheduling was for them.
So I was off and running around just looking for people
and didn't get as much time as I wanted to to mingle with you guys.
But it was a pleasure meeting you.
You guys put on an awesome talk um
and yeah we hope to have you on here again sometime yeah let's let's definitely do it
it was definitely great meeting you in person and uh yeah i i fully understand i mean i was
literally being looped into uh interviews and conversations non-stop so it's you know you're
on the ground you want to meet everyone hang out but at it's, you know, you're, you're on the ground, you want to meet everyone, hang out, but at the same time,
you know, everyone's trying to work and, uh, you know,
get bills done and et cetera. Or so everyone, and then, you know,
you're, you're over here making things happen at the like one summit. So yeah,
it makes sense. It's just hard to do it all,
but definitely want to come back and obviously hang out with you guys again and
at the next summit did you i'm just curious when you left did you leave the the same day
uh or the next day rather what was it saturday yeah i gotta step away guys i'm not gonna leave
i'll just step away okay no i just because i just want to i just want to know because if i was the
only one that heard this but at the airport on Saturday, I was there.
I had to wait a couple hours for my flight.
But around between noon and 2 p.m., there were people at the gates.
They're calling passengers.
They're like, hey, can so-so come to gate 39 or whatever?
But there were people.
These guys were calling out, like fill my crack in please come to
gate 69 please. That's fill my crack
in. I see wieners
please. We're looking for an icy wiener
or like did
am I the only one that heard that shit?
Are you grabbing all this audio?
I am. I actually am bro.
I'm glad you thought that
you saw me doing it. I was like
you want to see wien, bro? What the fuck?
Yeah, I know, because at the airport, while I was waiting at the gate,
they were calling...
It's Phil My Kraken. There was a bunch of others, honestly.
Exactly. It was like Bart prank calling Moe's. Right.
But it was like for like a good two hours.
Every fight,
I think the Bitcoin or win there and just was bribing the,
the,
the flight attendants at the gate or wherever,
like whatever they like,
it was pretty hilarious.
I'd never seen anything about like anything like that in my life.
It felt like I was in the twilight zone.
I was like,
what is going on? but it was awesome dude i did not experience that because i i uh i
wasn't flying so uh i i lived close by to uh nevada and uh okay i actually drove because I wanted to see some sites, some special places.
One of them was the Uber Dam,
and there's some interesting architecture there that I wanted to go check out in person.
But yeah, I can experience all that fun stuff, man.
It was messed up. It was funny, though, for sure.
Definitely like that, and I saw Jack Mauler's in the airport.
I was like, well, that's weird.
Okay.
He's a tiny little guy, isn't he?
I'm not going to comment on any of that.
But he looked happy.
He looked happy.
Okay.
He was in a rush gang.
I think he was running to his plane.
Dude.
He looks little.
When you look at him on screen, he looks little.
Okay.
Look, I'm 5'8 and a half, so I've got to put the half in there
because I've got to make people know I'm not 5'8.
But I'm not a big guy.
I'm not a tiny guy.
But he looks like he's like 5'5",
5'6", or something. Like a little leprechaun.
Animal! What is this?
What? I'm not fucking doing this
right now, Grant.
What? You're worried about Jack Mauler?
Yeah, I'm worried about Jack Mauler's.
That you call... Okay, I'm asking you for an accurate description of the guy.
Is he about 5'6 or something like that?
Something.
I don't know.
I don't know.
You met me and you met Jack Maulers.
I'm six foot.
So I don't keep...
We're all little midgets.
He's shorter than I am.
I'll just say that
we're all little people
little people sorry
he's probably your size
he might be my size he just looks small
but it might be because he does a lot of
interviews in that big closet
he's kind of got bigger hair, too.
He wears a hat, so it probably makes him look smaller, too.
Yo, what's up with that closet?
He doesn't have any clothes, eh? Is that it?
I don't know. He's always in the closet, isn't he?
It must be like a special...
No, dude, I saw him.
He was with somebody.
It was a chick. Yeah, they both looked happy.
If anybody knows, getting out the closet is on the ground.
So maybe he needs to be out.
Not that there's anything
wrong with that.
Not that there's anything wrong with that. No.
Of course. There's nothing wrong with that.
Not at all.
That closet is huge.
And I wonder what he's waiting for.
The LSU is different.
I kind of liked it.
It adds an element to this.
Yeah, when you put me on the spot like that,
you're like, yeah.
I try not to squirm in public.
Anyways.
All right, fellas.
Good times, guys.
I think you guys are heading off, too.
I got a head off also.
But thanks for letting me on, bro.
Bros.
Yeah, thanks for coming, man.
It's our absolute pleasure.
Should we do a commercial break?
We've got...
We've got to go.
We didn't put it out there, yeah.
Let's do a little quick commercial
break. All you need to do
is we need to just change
we need to create like a background
on the thing.
You know what I mean? And then we just
Oh, geez.
Sure. Whatever. If you got it.
We need to upload the ads here. We we need to upload
the ads here
we still need to get our shit together boys
chief where's your ad
put it up
is there any audio
here with this chief
I think there is too though so if you want to just let it
play yeah
I'll just leave it up there with no audio.
It's fine.
But what was I going to say?
Cake Wallet, we looked at it a few weeks ago.
Oops, we got to pull the mics up here.
When we looked at it a few weeks ago, there was that day where all the cards weren't working on k-wallet
but i've gone back and remember that we looked at it like one thing was in there yeah yeah so
i don't know what happened apk or api problem probably maybe their website or the servers
were down there this one out you know look i think it's just bad timing you know we're going to re we're going to reinvigorate this when we get people listening to us again
but if you guys are using a cell phone anybody in the audience use a cell phone there's these
new things uh you can save 15 bucks 15 percent back i just looked at my personal cell phone bill
i'm paying about 130 some dollars a month
yikes because i got kids and i got another daughter that's wanting a phone now so
we're talking i don't know what would that be per month 20 some bucks of 15 or like 160
uh get paid back in crypto every month so you get like almost a half a litecoin a month just
by using your normal service and i've had them quote it same level of service basically the same cost is what i'm getting
and then you get 50 bucks for signing up this has two different numbers on here just use the block
promo code i don't know because people are listening they're not i guess we got to share
it in the space at the same time. You get $50.
They'll pay you $50 in crypto right out of the gate.
So you get over half a Litecoin.
So in a month, you're going to have a full Litecoin just for using your cell phone.
That's a pretty good deal.
I mean, that's half a Litecoin, bro.
You know what I'm saying?
$30, $50 plus half your whatever.
What's the price today?
I don't even know.
I know we went down.
We're going back up.
All right.
I'll take your word for it.
Ka-ching.
Yeah, visit stackmobile.com and use promo code BLOCK for $50 upfront payment of Litecoin.
Chief, we've got to have a private meeting where I give
you all of my funny jerky voice
things because I've got 100 of them.
And then, obviously, CakeWallet, we do
talk about it all the time.
Is it going to take a long time? Because, my God.
I'm not joking.
I need to sit down and just
write them down. I'm talking.
God help us, Jesus.
There's a funny one. There's a funny one.
There's a funny one. So that's a
that's a guy, right?
But it starts to sound like
that's a character. If you guys don't know, on
Family Guy or
American Dad, there's
a character. It's Saul Rosenberg
is the name of that character.
But I think it's on American Dad.
You guys know what I'm talking about? Who has that voice yeah the guy that's that voice oh my word that type of thing
oh yeah that's right yeah yeah so that's the actual jerky boys guy doing that voice
and um there's one where it starts to morph into sounding like women people think it's a woman all the time. So they call him ma'am. And so there's this one where he's trying to sell his husband's,
or she's trying to sell her husband's old war memorabilia and shit.
And she's talking about how she's got like a foot of an old Civil War soldier
and she's got all these cannons and shit.
She's making all these sound effects.
It's so funny.
I mean, I don't know.
I get too much joy out of it.
I've listened to him a thousand times.
Oh, it's appropriate.
People love it.
It certainly is.
That's like an echo.
All right, well, yeah, let's wrap it up.
I will be back.
We'll be back here again tomorrow at 9
doing the same thing,
so check out the live stream
and tell us if you like it.
And invite your friends, man.
Participate.
We want this to be like a fun call-in show.
Yeah, I had a friend in last week.
Maybe I'll try and invite some of my other friends.
Like Joel from Poker Chief.
He's a pretty good one.
He might be funny if I can get him to sit down
and tell old stories
about me.
Have him drink some wine. I'll drink some wine
tomorrow.
I might. I don't know.
I've been drinking too regularly.
I told animals I was going to try and stay sober.
It's like nice out. We're having a
bonfire. I'm like, what am I going to do? Stay sober?
Stay sober and enjoy a bonfire. I'm like, what am I going to do? Stay sober? Stay sober and enjoy the bonfire?
I understand.
Yeah, I mean, that's
out of mind, bro.
You just got to stay away from the devil
and leave you alone. Yeah, I've been doing good with food.
That's what I'm excited about, man. I'm feeling really
good about it. Wait, wait, wait.
Jesus made wine out of water.
That is true. It's not the devil.
It's not the devil.
Yeah, I mean,
was that the Hail Mary?
Was that like, lead me not into temptation?
Or was that...
That's our father.
Yeah, yeah.
Just take one.
Just take one, you know?
Moderation. No, man, I'm already...
I tore myself away from that shit, bro.
I came out of there
into the lake, kicking and screaming.
More power to you.
I did a long stretch.
My...
I think
I did probably...
Think about this.
There was probably a good decade where I wasn't going out.
I didn't drink very much.
It's just been like since I, I don't know, maybe the last five years,
I kind of got back into going out.
Whereas my kids got a little older and I felt more comfortable.
I never liked wanting to have a beer in front of them or something like that.
And I don't know.
As I got older, I started to feel more comfortable with the
idea i guess that makes sense they're older they understand um before we get the other house
you see what i got here oh no see and then you're look at this
how's it work i mean people i've heard i've heard mixed reviews i've heard mixed reviews
for sure i mean i think he's showing us on the live stream he has this methylene blue which if
you guys don't know about it rfk takes it all the people are supposed to be like better than
it's like instead of coffee right supposed to get you like super focused and yeah yeah it's pretty sweet it turns your mouth blue um
yeah honestly if it felt like uh like a coffee without the jitters now i had coffee
and then i took it afterwards um and i definitely felt it more than i felt the coffee
and um it's like a clean it's like a clean coffee eye.
You don't get the jitters.
You don't get the anxiety.
But you do get the clearness, the mental clarity.
And look, I've been doing it for long.
I'll report to you.
I'll report back, I guess, as we go.
This bottle is still mostly full.
It's going to be like next, next.
In a couple weeks.
My eyes look weird.
And I'm reading up on the dosage,
dude, and it's so vague.
Different people are like, yeah, you should put like 20 drops in. And this would be like,
if you really want the full effects, you should go
50, 60 drops. Oh, yeah?
Okay.
Take the whole fucking bottle, bro.
Some people are going
as high as 100
so I'm going to work my way up there
I'll let you guys know how it goes
yeah I'm curious
about that that's one thing I looked at and I thought
that might be kind of nice I'm a coffee guy
I drink black coffee so
I'm hooked it's affordable
this whole thing
was 20 or like 30 bucks Canadian
so okay can this is where I want to be unrecorded
I'm saying it was for a friend it was for a friend it was for a friend I was in Michigan
marijuana is legal in Michigan and I want to just I was curiosity I was going to see how much they were. A bag of gummies.
200 milligrams.
That's a lot.
Guess how cheap it was.
You're never going to believe this.
$30 to us.
Shelves of these things.
I'm like, what?
They had a whole section that was under $5.
200 to 400 milligrams like you know like and i don't know if they just have so much and i'm
thinking i wouldn't even pay somebody to turn around and bring that up two dollars
find that in your change drawer
that's that's insane yeah because that's like but there are some people
you know how expensive it is to make money there's some people that's because that's like... Do you know how expensive it is?
To make money?
There's some people, that's one dose for them, right?
When I was doing gummies, I would take
I don't know, say
max 60 milligrams.
For me to knock me out, dude.
Yeah.
I wouldn't even touch that.
That was like peak COVID, right?
We were quarantined and shit, and I was just
fucking comatosing myself to make the days go by quicker.
Now you're going to do methadone.
Times have changed.
Now it's time to get back at it.
Let's get at her.
Five years later.
We're out of the woods now.
Holy crap.
If I would have spent
30 or 40 bucks, they'd give you like free i don't smoke so but i mean like crazy how about i go middle shelf
middle shelf an eight they give you an eighth for free if you spend 35 bucks which is supposedly
like i again i've never smoked so my buddy said it's like enough for two, like enough for like four or five good sessions.
You can get two good blunts.
Okay.
So four people could smoke and have a great time.
And they give it to you for free after you spend 30 bucks.
I don't know.
I don't know how it makes me, me actually wants me to bring back a conversation
remember when
we should do this tomorrow
let's talk about tomorrow
Martha Bueno
remember she was talking about hemp
and how when it got
it made illegal
and that they used to make paper
and clothing
and rope
and all this stuff out of it
and like how abundantly it grows
how easily it grows
and how
like I'm in the paper world
and I'm thinking, why aren't things made out of hemp paper?
If it is
that cheap and renewable and we're not
having to cut down trees. What is going on?
How?
I don't know.
It's a big paper, man.
It's a big paper lobbyist, bro.
It is. Big wood. That's what I call it.
They start fucking forest fires to inflate their prices.
Big wood.
Yeah.
Probably.
Big lumber. That's what I mean. Big lumber.
Sorry about that.
Oh, it's appropriate. People love it.
Alright, so now I'm watching.
Here's the thing that's happened is I've stopped watching
the spaces, so people are requesting.
I'm just watching these guys.
Are they requesting?
What I'm saying,
I don't know if this is,
it's changing the way I'm acting in spaces.
I can tell you that,
but all right,
well,
everybody,
thanks for stopping in.
We'll see you tomorrow night.
you got to end it.
I'm taking off.
See you guys later.
Sounds good.
Bye-bye, everyone.
Bye.
And I'm ending the spaces, too.
