what's up everybody we will wait a few more minutes let some more faces
roll in here hope everybody's having a phenomenal
so far so good hopefully everyone else is too
i want to start out with a fun little activity what is the spirit animal of everyone up here
let's say a tiger why why would you say tiger mr. andrew
um it embodies me it's a spirit animal i'm using your terms um clever striped magnificent all the
good things oh yeah all right i'll take it he stole my answer i was gonna go tiger too
but for a different reason uh just because Tigger from Winnie the Pooh is a tiger
that's a pretty good answer okay so we have an anime tiger and a regular tiger yeah all right
yo i missed it and what's the question
question is what is your spirit animal
an ape board ape just a regular dnape i don't know
that's pretty good i like it i like it i like it how's everybody doing
doing good doing well how are you guys doing how's everyone doing
okay moving and grooving flus hey good evening guys
good evening good morning good afternoon flus what is your spirit animal um my spirit animal
the bull a tortoise the bull it works hard
everybody is expecting it at least one cycle one bitcoin cycle to make something with the price
i love the theme series so we got we got the uh the bull we've got the ape got a couple of tigers
that's rad okay so guys we have anything and everything to talk about today
before we jump in is there anything on the news it's controversial in the space that anybody wants
to talk about and just bring bring to the forefront here anything going on that's exciting or
questionable or it's really pissing you off
man you know what's pissing me off nah i'm just kidding i honestly i don't really know
i was really hoping that you had something for me there but no i think i think joe the um
the title of the discussion today pisses off a lot of people ordinance and filling up the
block spaces of bitcoin but um i believe yeah ordinance at least for 2023 and 2024
has been pissing off a lot of people especially the bitcoin purists maxis um i think it's a good
thing and um yeah looking forward to uh discuss it and to learn more about it to be honest i think
let's say do you think the descriptions are a good thing yes i think they're a very good thing
why do you think they're a good thing um i think they are what could drive bitcoin forward
similar to how somehow inscriptions moved ethereum and other ecosystems forward especially
one that started with crypto kitties and ethereum back i think plus 2014 yeah that was a little
trading and pumping and dumping though that was exactly it was just people getting on something
that had no real business value so inscriptions especially on you know with bitcoin to liability
because already you have issues where there's like child pornography links and everything else
in there so it's like it's actually a security concern above all else so i'm curious is why you
think that it could push bitcoin forward because it's more likely to hold it back
well people are now experiencing more and more nfts and digital assets in general um getting them
through getting them to bitcoin through inscriptions reminds me of how people got
into ethereum through crypto kitties back in 2014 so this was um i mean perhaps this is the moment
where bitcoin can get maybe the smart contracts platform and the wallet abstractions and everything
that we're seeing in the other spaces that could mimic or be copied into into bitcoin
they're different systems altogether so like ethereum is that account-based system right where
you have the ledger and it's always evaluating the wallet bitcoin is actually you have satoshis
it's mathematical encryption that is producing the actual coin so to do what you're talking about
from the account side like no matter what you're going to need an abstraction for bitcoin because
the network isn't made to have a smart contract wallet staking kind of thing um so you need
theoretically a system that could connect with that but even then that's not the ideal way
to use bitcoin like bitcoin very much in a pure standpoint is just the coin and the satoshis and
it's meant for those particular transactions and it's the adoption of the etf and everything else
you're seeing is already driving that as a matter of fact when that etf gets further because a lot
of the infrastructure isn't there yet from the etf side when that start getting gets paired with
uh monetary pairs currency pairs and stuff you're going to see bitcoin drive a lot more adoption
from those etfs than what we've seen currently i think people thought that it would just happen
immediately and it takes quarters and quarters before you have those high speed trades starting
to occur inscriptions if anything would hold back bitcoin and the stuff that you're talking
about from a wallet standpoint everything else is antithetical to how bitcoin is actually built
but it yeah i don't know what other what others uh i'll give this space for others as well
but it's a side question so you have you have this tech it has this opportunity like mr prime
lab i almost agree with like like almost everything you said i i think i think a lot of its nonsense
but it is bringing a good point my biggest challenge of kind of like the inscriptions
things it's like the people that write inscriptions are all centralized parties and that's kind of
like kind of defeats the whole purpose it's like if they lose their database and they lose their
their way to kind of trade these json blobs like back and forth like forget it it's over so
so you're all these different parties and inscriptions you have to trust a centralized
source which is definitely against you know the whole decentralization thing the other main thing
and i'm gonna crap on inscriptions we may we may run out of like we don't have anybody that's pro
inscription we may run out of uh things here to talk about but um i mean i saw this happen before
back in 2013 and 2014 like effectively with inscriptions it was counterparty it was colored
coins it was uh digital tangible like they're all of these different plays where kind of like
just notarizing um that this abstracted asset was attached to this piece of gold or this abstracted
asset was attached to this individual um and this colored coin represented you know argentinian farmland
so you know we saw before and it was very lacking um and the effectiveness and that's kind of like
why the original like nft standard came to be is like cool you can kind of lock even even though
it's a pointer to a jpeg you can kind of lock the the representation of that pointer to a jpeg
in an nft um and and it has a little bit more uh malleability to it it has a little bit more
functionality around it inscriptions because it's decentralized so you can understand who owns an
nft in a decentralized way like which is cool this time if if taproot wizards or one of these
other things goes down like half of the inscriptions goes down there's like three or four different
providers but each one of the providers like retains all of the value and they can you know
at any point in time decide to spin it left or right
through so that would as well like i would that would somehow answer my question on
um can ordinals and inscriptions bring to bitcoin more than transactional value can we see digital
assets can we see yeah nfts can we see much more on bitcoin than the transactional value that
we have been stuck in for at least more than 10 years now and miners miners are very happy i guess
and for the years to come they will be much more happier with more and more fees being collected
what what is kind of like playing out of this kind of conversation here or or inscriptions is
like the multitude i think we're up to like seven or eight different evm uh bitcoin sidechains that
have these like optimistic rollups that then um that then write and settle on bitcoin so like you
know we've talked with rootstock and core i just saw another one recently called goshen network
there's one called babylon um there's like four or five different like l2s like evm l2s now
that roll up and inscribe their roll ups and settle on bitcoin and and that's kind of interesting
but like once again it's really driven by like the trust of the network right so any one of
these like l2s could decide to write it differently at some point in time
all right but to be correct on track what other digital nonsense is out there other than just
inscriptions that may or may not be like helping the community yeah i've found a dumb question about
inscriptions how how would you say that inscriptions will propel real world assets on change
i don't think they will i mean the only thing that i personally think that inscriptions could
theoretically do theoretically if you want to do an accounting system you can do a cryptographic
hash write it to a particular block just so that if you needed someone else to like audit something
maybe something like that that's a lot of what those l2s are trying to do but real world assets
on bitcoin it's not like the other than tying bitcoin itself as an asset to something
um i don't think it is going to propel anything
all right joe curious why you asked the question would you add what do you have in mind well i
mean earlier you'd mentioned something brian about how early on you could forget exactly what the
the use case was but it made me think of for instance gold how you could have a piece of gold
that is tied one to one to a very specific gold nft that had an inscription for instance
that was kind of where my brain went but i'm sure someone's already tried that i'm sure it
flopped or maybe there's a significant reason why that's not the direction they're going
but that's kind of how i was thinking about it so so you could do that like theoretically you
could right if you could use the blockchain as a whole system of like iou's but there's like
no real way to enforce it right if you want to like really enforce these iou's once again you
have to go back to like traditional regulatory means go to through like courts and judicial
means um it's not it's not binding right and it's not necessarily binding unless you have like a
binding notary and in a particular jurisdiction and that notarization and it's by like an official
notary in that jurisdiction then it's not binding but but that's kind of like kind of defeats the
whole purpose of of of the the internet ledger right it's like how do we build the tools and
how do we build so it is binding and and bitcoin not being like turn complete you can't continually
kind of like process an oracle and then figure out whether or not like you hold that asset so like
like you know to be to be more explicit or more like i have a bar of gold i turn it in
and you write it on the the blockchain they're like oh i turned in one bar of gold now there
now i have one bar of gold on the blockchain but who's the oracle that continually says that
that bar of gold is still there or i didn't melt it into rings or i didn't so you get this really
really strange kind of like decoupling from the digital asset which in essence it necessitates
a centralized party which is it defeats the whole purpose okay yeah which is which is the main
major issue around real world assets in general because as soon as you start to go from like
electrons to atoms like you're landing in a physical space that has physical regulations
so it kind of doesn't matter whatever you say on chain if the physical space and the physical
atoms are going to hold a gun to you and say this is now my gold well it's not your
gold anymore right even if you have the digital representation so that's so that's the challenge
yeah i was just gonna let's not forget right bitcoin and ordinals is on bitcoin it's super
expensive in the same way that ethereum is having issues with scaling and that that's super expensive
versus something like solana that's much cheaper so you can view a lot of these things as still the
sandbox area for this emerging tech there's no reason why this shouldn't be multi-chain as we
get more bridging solutions you pick the train that's fastest and cheaper and most suited for
your needs i think the people who are building on bitcoin for these new use cases are kind of
abstracting and getting away from what its core use case is and i think it
yeah it diminishes the space as a whole
do we have any pro inscription people up here or anybody want to come up in
and be pro inscription i'm i'm very curious i just well i'm like still thinking about to be
honest with you i'm not really into like inscriptions ordinals nft's anything like that i
mean i think that they they will have use cases later on as far as like passes to entry to places
or deeds to houses and stuff like that but like i'm actually just confused thinking about i believe
that you said that brian like something like it that they're centralized and that it that it would
that you would lose everything if they went out of business but i'm kind of i don't really
understand what you meant by that because it's all inscribed on the blockchain so
i i don't really i didn't really like i was trying to think about that and understand
what you're trying to say about that could you like explain or maybe i just want a topic i don't
know sorry yeah no no totally no it's totally on topic right so so like there is um like think of
like ipfs right and and there there's a way to kind of like plug in these like pointers of jeg pegs to
like ipfs and kind of have the connect and most of the time people don't do that they just throw some
some of their nft pictures up on ipfs and it kind of sits at the same pointer and then you know you
toss around the nft to each other so most of those things are like you don't really own the jpeg
you kind of like ruin own the digital rights or the digital representation um like basically what
you have is this json blob right and in an inscription i you you pass around this json blob
and and you pay to like pass it from one wallet to another wallet right it's now not longer on
this wallet it's in another wallet kind of similar to nfts but without kind of um some other like
extra functionality around it so but once again it's like what is it pointing to right so so like
is it the jpeg is it a media file is it a particular file like it's even less tight it's like
literally like a json object and it's just passed around from wallet to wallet and and the people
that kind of like centralize it in the marketplace is there like they have different methodologies
to pass that json blob around but like if they don't do it is they don't centralize that kind of
component then they can't really like hash it in a way and then you can it there bitcoin won't stop
you from from like doing it again the only you need a centralized authority to do it with
and on the nft side the the nft um consensus mechanism will stop an nft from being like
double spent or double printed but like it's not necessarily the same on bitcoin without
a centralized party all right that's that's why the nft protocol came up in the first place
like seven five one came up is like how do we how do we get these digital pointers to pass around
in in a decentralized way
and brian it's a definitely a topic that has been dividing the bitcoin community for i would say
a year now but personally i'm i'm not pro but i want to be a pro for inscription and ordinals
for the same reason i mentioned before this i want to see bitcoin what can bitcoin do outside the
transaction event of things there are non-financial applications for bitcoin that
personally i think they are magnificently amazing for communities that suffer from
corruption and those utilities are around like having tamper proof documents
having digital identities that are tamper proof as well privacy and much more of those topics that
now bitcoin communities are since like segregated witnesses and since taproot upgrade
it's becoming more and more a topic to talk about uh privacy being being one of them so
perhaps ordinals and inscriptions could bring some of the innovations we thought we saw in ethereum
like zero knowledge proof roll ups which now are like they're being bridges built between let's say
the minus ecosystem and the ordinals ecosystem so that you can benefit from both both words the
evm compatible world and the bitcoin world i believe it's still as well early stages
many of us are looking at etfs and what the institutions are going to do with with bitcoin
and with the upcoming halfing there might be this might be the fuel for a a price rally
but i think the price rally will come from ordinals and inscriptions similar to how it was
fueling those rallies in the ethereum early days with the cryptocurrencies
um there would be really interesting if going back to brian's point actually about um like the
individual ordinals um so like right now you have hacks where like pngs will be poisoned especially
the functional space of it so that therefore you can hack into someone's email account you can
change data structures and as we get more into generative ai stuff where things are automated
it'd be really interesting just like if you could connect the security and absoluteness of the
bitcoin blockchain with um data security and identification so that you know something isn't
poisoned or a hacked sample because right now you could totally throw a virus up on ipfs and
poison a ton of things from that png
okay so i'm going to go completely the opposite direction and go pro inscriptions for a minute
here just to play devil's advocate um recently talked to uh okx and uh talked to the head of
dfi over there um in asia specifically they've added over a million wallets in like the last like
eight weeks for people trading inscriptions because they just started uh to to put like
inscriptions support bitcoins of inscriptions support and there is a narrative happening on
in asia right now that um ethereum is the west's technology and like why would i why would i play
with america and you know the western sims uh tech when when bitcoin is is mostly run by asian
miners and this is asian tech now this is this is our chain now so you do get the vibes of of
things going on of like within the uh within different hemispheres and and the narrative
of uh inscriptions and ordinals tabroot wizards it's like you know this is this is our chain
right this is like where we're going to play and we're going to have our nft moment so
it is bringing more people on board and the craziest thing is like you can look at these
videos you can see them on on twitter you can see them on like reddit where they have these like
kind of like 1990s us like real estate conferences where you know somebody's friend or mother or
cousin is bringing people in and getting people on board on bitcoin and inscriptions for the
first time and it's like really really strange it's you know it's got these like like slideshow type
aspect with and cigarette smoke in the audience and and it's just it feels like the the 1990s or
like you know early 2000s like real estate micro conferences throughout you know middle america
is happening right now in in asian markets with with bitcoin and inscriptions
so it's onboarding a ton of people but i don't know we could go to another topic
joe what do you got what's the most interesting thing that you don't want to talk about i have
i have a question based on what you just said and it just please everybody excuse the ignorance if
this is very obvious but if if bitcoin is truly decentralized how do we know that all of the miners
are in in china so you can tell by like the there's like a bit of the message when you
mine a block that you can put on there and there is some metadata on there also from when
the block is created like uh there you you can track where like where the block is created
um through metadata and there are ways to do stuff uh with ip as well so literally if somebody wanted
to like put up a wall and block like you know different sockets and different ip's um like the
network could be brought down as well by by blocking certain types of uh and this was actually
talked about back in 2016 2017 there was a fork and they were talking about having um
like like china was like thinking about doing this and putting up like you know the great firewall
blocking bitcoin as well bitcoin transactions and this is like theorized that it could happen
and you would start to create two different chains because if the two nodes couldn't
communicate to each other you would have the bitcoin nodes um you would have the the
chinese bitcoin and then you would have the non-chinese bitcoin if the if the great firewall
blocked uh the ports and stuff for for bitcoin um there's a big discussion 2016 2017 um so it's
possible i mean it's all on the internet and if they can't get access to the internet the
blocks get produced to the next things within their within the network right so if the network
doesn't have access and the nodes can't play on that network um and they don't
communicate between each other they they literally fork
well thank you for clearing that up yeah i mean uh what else what else do people talk about what
else what else is everybody thinking about it's uh we've got this pseudo bull market here
a lot of people said it was going to be social phi that's not entirely looking up
what uh what other what other narratives are people pumped about
i thought i thought the same go ahead yeah i thought i thought i thought that there would be
be something i thought that social phi would be bigger as well but you know the i think that
the problem is there really is no good social phi it's just connected with twitter api or like
a casino like making yourself like a token or something like that it's not really like
social media or anything it's just and most of them are buggy and and shitty anyway so it's
not even worth using so yeah i think there's i think albeit the salon no you finished where
you finished yeah no i was just gonna say i think that i think that it still could be
a narrative but they just need to have a good uh good software because right now everything
that really exists i i mean at least anything that i've tried or used is i wouldn't even
really consider it's social media it's more just like gambling or or turning like i don't know
trying to turn your profile into into money or something like that yeah i think i'm bullish
obviously solana this ecosystem this run i think will make some serious progress in terms of allowing
people to own more of their creative stack yeah i suppose that is social phi um but i think we'll
make some pretty substantial strides this cycle i think solana is well placed to do that um i
don't think it's going to be resolved in this cycle it's just too big a problem and
and the web two incumbents are so massive have such a big head start but i'm pretty bullish i
think we've really turned a corner and the fact that we could see a chain like solana really blow
up this cycle and real use case is built on top of that if that is social phi or something like
that is is a pretty massive validation for web through i think we're still pretty early relative
to a lot of the other counterparts bitcoin ETF just got affirmed and you talked to people
outside of the space for a lot of people crypto still is just bitcoin so seeing some of these
real world use cases i would be amazing to see and i hope we make some pretty massive strides this
cycle um hey guys you know a buzzer based on what you what you mentioned regarding solana i i heard
some rumors that solana are trying to do something related to social phi with their solana mobile too
which is which is going to be released next year um and if they do that then you know every
everything happening right now with everyone trying to build something a platform like like
adam said it's it's fading uh but i believe that you know this is something that will
benefit all content creators um like being you know transparent with what you're what you're
giving out to content creators and all of that and sharing all of the revenues instead of you
know getting some piece of the cake from from whoever is uh you know holding ownership of
facebook or tiktok or all of that so i think content creators once we have a solid platform will
will all be obviously jump just ship and go into into this direction and this will
create mass adoption so um yeah right right now we're still in early stages but i believe if
if a big ecosystem like solana build something like that like yeah this would be the future of
social media yeah there's no doubt it's a superior use case right and creators want to own more of
the stack everybody understands that it's just the fact that the products haven't caught up and
they don't have the distribution so it's it's very difficult to explain to a massive creator
who has a giant business hey use this product rather than we're other than twitter or another
web2 incumbent but the moment that those products are there people will will start to build their
audiences there all right talking about solana actually well first off i was using it recently
and it took me like you know i i like it i think it's really good for payments i don't think it's
bad i think it's really good technology is nice as fast whatever but like you know how can you
know and i don't know if it's just the wallet or the node that was using but it took me
sometimes 20 tries just to send send my payment so you know like i mean i don't really know if
that like i said that could just be like a node from the wallet or whatever i really don't know
how deep that that goes but it was not working and the other thing is couldn't if they if you
know they made if they sued so if the government sued solana made you know crypto league or
whatever they want to do couldn't they just shut down solana instantly you know yeah that's
that's a concern adam that you know especially it started when if i'm not sure if you guys remember
but uh two years ago when when the servers of solana crashed because of you know tps problems
and there was you know a lot of a lot of problems happening and they shut down their servers
uh that that was the first crash that solana had because like if it's decentralized how can you
shut down and restart servers uh so yeah adam this is a concern for any blockchain right now
like yeah although they're saying it's decentralized but at the same time like we're seeing that in
in a way or another it is centralized um especially exactly what happened with solana last time
yeah see i mean like like i'm kind of i mean i i'm definitely not a bitcoin maxi i used i used to be
a little bit but i because i think that it's all good but i just think that you definitely have to
keep that in your mind that you know because i use solana i'm not like flooding solana i think
it's a good chain i think it's like really you know they have nice marketing nice branding it
works good whatever but i just think you definitely have to keep in your mind that
it could be shut down or something like that
yes indeed it's prone to shut down and one thing that solana as well is good that i think
it has a good community um with all the challenges that they faced with the ftx problems
they stood out as a community they continued building and yeah we're seeing the results uh
we're seeing the results today um from my perspective i as i was mentioning before
if we're gonna see i mean the topic that people mostly are talking about is the halfing is coming
we're less than 90 days away from the halfing what what will the price do will it copy
um previous historical patterns or will there be a new narrative playing uh as i said before i
think for a new narrative to see a new narrative now based on historical patterns it has been always
the start of the wave with nfts and then dexes and then price shoots up and then everybody
cash out and prices go back to like normal trading levels and perhaps this is gonna play again this
year because of ordinals and inscriptions that it will draw a new wave of people into nfts and
then into dexes and then out they flush them out of the system but this time it's not gonna be on
ethereum it's not gonna be on solana this time it's gonna be on bitcoin and with the trade fine
narrative that is playing with the approval of the etfs this is gonna just be more and more and more
powerful so um yeah when is the hundred thousand level one million dollar sense and mo was speaking
of a one million dollar bitcoin this is all up to speculation but let's see what this year will bring
i think it's a really good point if you have a ton of buy pressure on bitcoin and because of
let's say call it price action or some global macro event or even a global micro event
like the halving basically makes less bitcoin available and that needs to be dumped on the
market so like if you can imagine like every day there was like one more bitcoin being created
and the miners had to sell it to run their operations you can just like imagine like okay
they set to sell half so half a bitcoin a day out of like a hundred you know need to be sold to
to keep the operations going um you know just because you know they have costs and electricity
and cooling and all that type of stuff so if that's the case if you have don't have um one person or
multiple people buying at least half a bitcoin a day then then what ends up happening is the
price goes down if you have more people buying bitcoin than half a bitcoin a day then the
price goes up it's really that simple as like a simple base case so wait brian brian isn't there
isn't there something else in that where the actual price relative to the inputs the price of
machinery electricity electricity all those raw materials as that price let's just assume that
stays the same bitcoin to us dollars will say as the price of bitcoin increases the relative
share of bitcoin that needs to get sold decreases and vice versa as bitcoin price decreases
the relative share increases that needs to get sold so there so that happened very early on
because like switching your mining gear from like bitcoin to litecoin or um you know to doge or
whatever was like super simple but with the advent of asics um what ended up occurring was is that
it's very very specialized software like asics stands where applications specific something or
other compute um so basically like literally the chips and computers that they're running
only run bitcoin now they don't run you know other other systems so it's not like there's
fungibility in their compute power it has to mind bitcoin so if you're not running your machinery
you've just kind of like lost all of the value of like the machinery that you and you built the
infrastructure you know there's there's a dude one of the biggest like uh youtubers oh man dropping
his name i think it's like fox right he lives in western virginia west virginia west virginia
and he goes through his mining operation it's about like 80k to 100k to set up his
mining operation with his miners and everything and he'll produce around um 30 000 uh profit
per year so like 30 return it's like a two to three year kind of like return on on capital
but if he doesn't he's got to keep the machines running whether the price goes up or the price
goes down um early on that was the case and that was kind of like the philosophy is like
you know if the price goes down less people will mine it'll be easier to get and then like it'll
kind of like bring it back up because of like oh cool there's more volume and it's easier to get
but what ended up happening is you know people get their machines they put their capital expenditures
and they just run it so like the halving what that effectively does and why the price will go up
is is there's there's basically consistent buy pressure of bitcoin there's some some level of
consistent buy pressure and now with the halving there there's less supply being generated and
created so that's generally why the price like does a two to three x after a halving it takes a
couple months like you're like six to nine months and that's why everybody's talking about the halving
because it takes a little while to but and like oh what's the halving even less bitcoin is it's
so now you know the supply is even more limited so it's there's less available and then price
pressure goes up because the the constant uh buy pressure is there with less on the market
and baron i think the difference between now and you know previous years is that we we have a sense
of community right now like especially with ordinals also like people you know that that's
i think and uh you know i think flust talked about this is solana what made what made it powerful is
that after each crash there was a community and this community comes from the nft space
uh you know they they they backed solana they kept on talking about it they kept believing in it
and i think this is also what's what's different between right now um and this is why i think
people are more optimistic right now because you have ordinals although i know many people that
believes in bitcoin don't believe in ordinals but ordinals created the community in bitcoin
and this you know creates a difference between the the value right now and the value four years ago
yeah you know that's something that that i rug no that's something that i that i that i always say
is that uh you know there's a lot of people that are in bitcoin that are in this stuff that
found freedom there and they're never gonna leave this space because they know what it can do for
them so it's like you know same thing like you just said like the community it's like you know
this is bigger than just like an investment for a lot of people so that's also something to think about
yes and the numbers let's not forget the numbers we have um in the upcoming halving approximately
on an average of 10 minutes we're gonna see more or less three bitcoins being mined per block
which is fascinating uh almost all of the bitcoins has been mined if i'm not mistaken we have 18 million
bitcoins that has been mined already a lot has been stolen a lot has been lost a lot is the
ownership of the u.s government which is now the largest holder uh or the largest whale
uh among bitcoiners um we have the u.s presidency coming up november uh in this year so all these
factors they're just pointing one laser arrow towards bitcoin whether it's u.s elections yeah
people will flock into bitcoin before and after this event as we have seen historically they the
reaction of investors was similar uh but the main event of this halving is having this three bitcoin
per block yeah with an approval of an etf with the few million people that will come to experience
ordinals and nfts for the first time from a bitcoin perspective i think we are we're heading to a
yeah that having to be super interesting um and and see what happens for the entire space
and unfortunately like the whole entire industry tends to be correlated to bitcoin so a bitcoin
like a good outcome for bitcoin is a is a big it's a good outcome for the entire industry
i actually wonder about the etf about what you know i mean i guess we'll see how that plays out but i
wonder if that was i mean obviously it was made to manipulate the price a little bit more but that
was interesting what somebody said about the having out lowers and then you have to have more
people more people buying than it is produced or whatever obviously then sold too but that's
also an interesting point yeah i think that's a good question yeah i think that's a good question
but that's also an interesting point yeah and for etfs people forget like etfs will not
push the price up etfs will push the price up in one condition if the investors they come to this
etf provider and they purchase the etf so why would i need to purchase a bitcoin etf if i don't
understand what bitcoin is or if my portfolio manager is not understanding what it is to offer
it to me as an investor so education is is playing a very crucial part for the success of etfs and i
think this is why black blackrock has started giving like they're focusing this year and next
year on educational content for their portfolio managers so the number one trade like the vast
majority of all money and all trade is actually money like literally trading pairs currency pairs
and when you're trying to get into those currency systems that just doesn't happen
outright like you have a pair you see this like with coins where it's like BTC and another coin
or something else um the etf allows access into those markets that otherwise bitcoin wouldn't
have a way to actually get into those markets to be part of those currency traded pairs
so weird like that you haven't really seen the demand for etfs yet and where that actually goes
and that that's going to take a few quarters at least yeah the thing that i mean i guess
there's going to be a lot of unimportant people that that buy etfs that should just be buying
bitcoin anyway but it does make sense why if they're already not understanding it if they
don't even understand enough to buy it they're obviously not even understanding enough to get
into the etf yet so it's kind of well a currency traded pair is where you're trying to hedge
against inflation or potentially like the ruble going down or up and those transactions are
usually like hundreds of millions if not a billion dollars um like they're extremely
extremely large and you're looking at making one to two percent off of it right so it's not
what they'll do is they'll take that bitcoin etf and the bundle it with the pound and
the bundle it with like five other things and now they can trade it back and forth to de-risk or get
the upside now 100 the exposure to bitcoin becomes once it's in etfs it starts to be easily sold to
like wealth managers it's something like 75 percent of the wealth in america it's like 76 percent
somebody said is hold but held by rias and custodians so rias and you know gustin advisors
are not going to go and and sell something that that isn't part of their custodian or tech stack
now now an etf is so it's like oh you want exposure to bitcoin cool i can get you exposure through this
etf and and then especially if there's some sort of like de-correlation it seems like it's like
kind of like recorrelated there was like a little mini pump that was like kind of de-correlated but
now it's kind of you know hedging back and kind of correlating again but if bitcoin is
de-correlated to the market it's something that every single person in their portfolio should have
because in you know modern portfolio theory basically says that you need de-correlated assets
to to hedge risk and especially if they're like counter-correlated um then it becomes
more more valuable or inversely correlated it becomes uh much more valuable but once again
like people don't understand it like people don't understand bitcoin you know what people do
understand ryan what do they understand they understand jpegs and memes yeah you know what
today uh till today i was walking and i saw this place it said gaming and it was like you
know just whatever it was like a video game place i don't play video games but i was like
let me go in there and ask these guys if they know what an nft is i just wanted to
you know just see what they said so i went in and i said yo like you guys you guys like nfts here
and he said nft you mean like bitcoin and yeah i guess so you know he's like no so
i was like this guy didn't even know what he's talking well he didn't he he heard the word before
but he still doesn't understand or know you know yeah you know i believe that's the thing it's not
you know the end user or the end you know a company owner company founder
i don't think it's it's about them it's about the financial advisor like for example most of
the financial advisor right now with advice for example entrepreneurs or or founders to
invest okay ten percent in gold ten percent in safe investment a twenty percent in something else
i think this is where the narrative once those people start you know saying okay you have to
put ten percent in bitcoin or in in in crypto then this will change the narrative it's not about the
end users it's about you know financial advisors starting advising people that okay you have to
put like a percentage of your of your investment in in crypto or in bitcoin
but like what brian was just saying it's got to be in the tech stack
and currently until we had that etf it wasn't
i do i do really love that take though because at the end of the day everybody's financial advisor says
yeah you want to conservatively you want to put all this money in u.s equities and if everybody
puts money in u.s equities then the ponzi keeps going up and then by the time you retire
a bunch of younger people will have also invested in and then you get to extract the value
out of your 401k and then the ponzi continues it's the same thing so i like that as a status quo
eventually when financial advisors say yeah you want to put a little bit in crypto a little
bit here a little bit there as long as everybody does that it's going to be all right
joe that's the same thing with with gold like i consider gold a ponzi like who gives who gives
gold everything everything yeah i was going to say let's do the decentralized and transparent
ponzi how do we get them into it
through movies and i don't know if if you had the time to watch netflix lately there's a new movie
for kevin heart and it's only about stealing an nft like uh from the beginning of the movie the
end of the movie is just he's just talking about how they are going to steal this nft
and historically i think since 2014 or maybe 2015 and the movies as well bitcoin is used as the
currency for criminals when they want to do a ransomware or they have a kidnapping or they're
buying something illegal and yeah they do a wire payment with bitcoin so this change in narrative
i think is this positive and besides financial managers the mainstream media should step up
and show how bitcoin is used in other communities to serve its purpose of being a hedge against
inflation and being a medium to to do payments
stuff man i think um you you want the media to kind of like hop in
and i've talked to a bunch of pr journalists and they kind of drive a lot of the discourse and if
you kind of talk to these journalists they're like if it bleeds it leads right so we have this like
massive media like industrial complex that like some of these pr people and journalists that i
talked to in crypto was like okay you need to raise 10 million or more to get you have to
be indicted by the government have a major hack or some major drama or else it won't get clicks
and i can't even write about it so like financial systems and the and decentralization it's kind
of boring right it's like tech it's it's it's cool to work on if you're like an engineer
but like in terms of like to read about from like a third party that's why it doesn't get like as
much as tension as like some of these things as like hey this is what criminals use and this is
like this is like this act but like on that note bitcoin network is like the most scrutinized
and viewed network out of all of these networks like there's there's goj operations there's fbi
operations there's secret service operations that are reading every single block every single
mempool and that stuff gets tracked this dude who got caught and the reason why um america has
like so much bitcoin is because of like these different hacks that happened before and it took
him eight years but eventually selling bitcoin cash in like a foreign exchange they were able
it wasn't even bitcoin that he sold he even sold bitcoin he sold bitcoin cash like eight or nine
years ago and then he was able to get caught so this stuff is like super traceable if you ever
try to like cash out of it but i think i think what you know one of the things like joe was
bringing up before and kind of tie it back to inscriptions or whatever is like because people
don't understand bitcoin and they don't understand like oh i i own this this coin i own this token
on a ledger on a computer system somewhere the the pushing and pushing the meme and pushing the
identity and abstracting kind of the tech into a nice little jpeg is is kind of what catches on
because they can see like oh what did you get oh i got bitcoin oh let me see it uh i can't really show
it to you right it's like oh i got this i see adam in the audio out of the speaker he's like
it's got a monkey jpeg he's like what did you get well i got this monkey jpeg it's worth like
so much more now like oh no way that's amazing so it's not it's not tangible right and and
there's like a huge percentage of the population that if they can't see it they can't touch it or
they can't feel it they can't know it and and so as we get into like this other digital nonsense
it's digital nonsense and it's all a ponzi until it's not until somebody else wants it like
so some of these like gaming companies that are launching they're like okay we're only launching
with like 400 users and the reason why they're doing that and like limited releases is like
that's all their servers can handle and and that's a it's a prized spot what was that like
crypto on deads recently that's that's not somebody was talking salon that was on salana
it's like they're releasing a game with like a couple hundred spots like not a ton of activity
and they just want to incrementally onboard and they'll have like a season two a season three
and so if you're talking about these types of assets it's like cool i got this character
i have this in-game token that that's something that's that that kind of becomes functional even
it's a it's a kind of virtual context it the utility is basically embedded in the gameplay
or in the asset itself and that's much easier to grok and understand than some sort of number
on a ledger for most people yeah let's not forget this is why as an industry we shouldn't fade meme
coins right it really brings so much attention to the space and when you're competing for
attention it does its job and it doesn't show up in a really meaningful way not to mention it's
emerging tech what is emerging tech oftentimes it's the things that looks like a toy or that's fun
that five to ten years from now gets productized and has it as a killer use case
people are paying money to to send you know like on tiktok to send lions and
shit like that to people without you know getting anything in return like that's why
you know meme coins make sense like you know people are wasting their money on things right
now in web tool that it's it's better being wasted or you know invested in web 3 like in
different technologies especially when it comes like you said in meme coins like
yeah meme coins is getting a lot of attention to to certain ecosystems and and we saw that
right now in solana like when solana you know um out shined ethereum in terms of meme coins like
everyone is talking about solana right now so um so yeah i think it's only a matter of time before
you know we start getting mass adoption especially in terms of gaming um we need one successful game
and you know all of the gaming industries will start either to crumble or to start you know
trying to see like okay we need to ship to web 3 how can we do that like you know those those
people are making billions of dollars out of gamers but once gamers start shifting their attention
like they would have one of the two choices either they would just crumble and close or
they would have to shift their attention to web 3 if pokemon go came on chain tomorrow though it
would be game over joe when pokemon go chain for realsies when we get in pokemon go on chain
i don't know dude nintendo's got to be cooking something up they'd be dumb not to
that's also something that i've heard before too that that kind of makes sense is that to build a
great really great video game takes a really long time so you know i'm sure that people are
doing something in the background and also something to think about which i learned very
the hard way is that tokenomics really matter and i think that axi i think i've heard i don't
really know much about it but they had really bad tokenomics and that's why they didn't succeed
even though i had like a big or i mean i guess they succeeded i don't really know but
i've you know i've heard that something like that
what are you all playing pokemon go where you guys go what happened
there's a new one there's a there's a new fortnite esque pokemon shooter coming out that's
like they seven million to bill and it's got like 1.4 million users i forget that it's like
play something or whatever i just recently came across uh like me like i just saw it a couple
days ago it's it's really it's really massive and i think what what's crazy is like you have
if you go to like game developers conference and i went there one time walked through it
when i was in san francisco the the myriad of games the thousands and thousands of games
that are built like are cool right and everybody has like it's like the music industry right it's
like millions of songs are now created like the the aspect of gaming and games will create
millions and millions of games in the future just just before like the way it is to easily
before it was incredibly incredibly hard and then you get a tool set and then the infrastructure
to build these games become easier and easier so more and more games will be produced as more and
more games are produced the ones that stick around have like the network effect and the
community involved with it right and so when you're talking about a game a gaming breakthrough
it's like you got these huge large studios and and stories like rockstar games and um what was
it um like guitar hero they they i think it was like their fifth game right and all four flops and
it was like their last shot and guitar hero like stayed true and and blew up and so it's just
i think you're gonna see without without subtokonization without some kind of web 3
aspect in gaming that really drives attention or like a new model uh i i just don't think you're
going to see the demand on you know web 2 games as much in the future right because if you're if
you're really around there for the community yes the game has to be fun it has to be engaging
has to be challenging and you know do all those bells and whistles but in terms of without
monetization for the user and it's not going to be every user but if without the user being
able to monetize their gaming experience like functionally um you know i think it would be
like some sort of vampire tech get a web 3 fortnite get it on all the consoles get get a flavor of it
like an open source version on all the consoles except it's paying its users like that could be massive
yeah definitely and you know what adam was saying for axi infinity all right it was successful for
them but it was the worst thing that happened to our ecosystem like what happened after axi infinity
investors we see pcs started investing crazy money into you know what is the next axi infinity
and axi infinity like adam said it had the worst economics um so people started you know trying to
imitate axi infinity after that and we see we see started investing crazy amount of money into
games and all of them failed and this was this i think was one of the reasons why you know we
don't have yet a good gaming project um because everything was delayed like bcs are not you know
because they already paid a lot of money they saw a lot of projects failed so they're still
on on the edge of investing with within with a new gaming project but this will happen like
this was only you know a delay but yeah that's why i believe what axi did was was something bad
for for the ecosystem because it delayed the good type of gaming project that could you know
release or launch all right is game fire rug or is it real i'd love to hear from other people up
here it's as real as as people want to keep playing it i mean i thought for sure that fort
night would be dead by now not even close i mean same with minecraft we adults up on this panel
still play minecraft not going to point fingers but it's an awesome game that has endless amounts
of things to do there's always new updates and new ways to play same with fort night so i think as
long as they keep improving a game and people still want to play it it's not a rug i think
that's really the core issue though right is they need superior gameplay for really good onboard users
the tokenomics the fact to own your nfts own your in-game experience all is a great value add
and people would all sign on but ultimately people want to unwind and enjoy the game first
everything else will follow i hope that happens with the pokemon gun game that looks awesome
i saw the first person shooter with uh thank you mouse also when his ip got released i'm hoping for
that also we uh we had actually talked to one of the investors that had looked at investing in splinter
lands early on because of their tokenomics and we'd actually been considering making a game a while
ago but the experience when you get to like reading off the chain it just slows everything
so far down that it the experience of the game isn't great so you end up building a web2 format
for something and there's just a lot of complexity or when you're doing web3 but like splinter lands
for instance was something that you know they did try to make something real for gamepy and they
did try to build a business around it that they thought could be sustainable because they weren't
just taking like vc money they they were looking at like monetizing future revenues and stuff like
that that's that's the problem when the money is easy then innovation lags down it slows so most of
the game five projects that we see today yeah i don't i don't want to say like rock pools but
it is a easy way to grab money i think but that's because in order to build a game that works like you
can exactly browse exactly exactly 100 100 for that same reason but at the same time monetization
is is very important and i think rewards are are as well important like look at the unity
game engine and the unreal game engine the reason why people use those game engines is because
it's affordable to do so so like there's going to be a web3 thing you almost need a web3 game engine
that people can build off of i mean unity yeah i think it was unity that just got into all that
trouble with all the creators that started moving their games off of it because it's a two to three
year thing and it costs a lot so it's not like you need a lot more money in gamepy to make it
work not less and just like you know nintendo the video game consoles themselves like going back to
um arcades when everyone in the 80s arcades got really big right and then they end up crashing
in the marketplace but without arcades you don't get to like in-home game consoles in the same way
you don't get to a lot of the other things that ended up coming out afterwards so you kind of
you need more money in gamepy to make it work but look that's one thing and the other thing is
let's say right now there was a game released on chain um i don't care whatever ecosystem it is
be it ethereum salon or anything else like if one million user right now goes in or two million users
and use this game at the same time like there's no ecosystem right now or or a blockchain
that would i think that is not yet proven that can tailor to that much users
um and i think that's that's that's the issue we don't we don't know yet if it works if we have
this huge influx of users into one game especially if it's on chain that's why something that i was
really interested in this is something that we can discuss later that's why i was interested in
i'm not sure if you if you heard about say v2 which is the parallelized evm blockchain
which can tailor for that um so that's something that we also need to see like we don't know yet
if if if a game on chain can tailor for that much amount of users
yeah that's kind of what i was saying as well so i think that we're in alignment on that is
like because if you have it's not even just writing to the chain it's reading from it when
you have a game because you you want to know like if i trade you a sword or a boot or something else
and we had to even consider to maybe do a trading card game when that way it's slower and maybe you
can keep the trading cards there for that format right so um you can keep the attributes there
but if you're doing anything along those lines how do you read from it when like an interaction
occurs in a fast manner so like you have to insert a lot of artificial slowness in the game itself
so that the chains can catch up so you can read from the ledger
yo we got a new we got a new person in the audience marco yeah something thank you i do
um i know a little fascinating um but some forwards on gaming gentlemen um just that i just chimed in
my uh two pence worth as we say here um few few points the gentleman that raised the point about
unity um you correct all points uh although you well what happened is unity changed their licensing
model um but they've now pulled back on that so unity is the same price as it's always been
um the one around uh but here are a few points i think that people don't realize or don't understand
i know a little bit about gaming um is that to build a good game let alone a great game
and add untouched on it will take three to five years um it would typically cost somewhere in
the region of 25 to 75 million dollars so there isn't a project in the space that has that kind of
liquidity to build those kind of games now i appreciate you might say that's a sort of a triple
a game and do we need a triple a game at this stage probably not but even saying that you know to
to drive your game forward you need users as somebody has touched on and you know i hear
people talking about nfts they've got a collection of 10 000 etc etc 10 000 users isn't going to
propel your game forward isn't going to give you enough revenue to iterate upon that game
you need and somebody mentioned minecraft minecraft has nearly 25 million active users a day
every single day there i'm not saying that's the kind of numbers that you need but you need
millions of users every single day to give you that revenue so whether you bring in a token
whether you're bringing nfts you need paying customers and you need mass numbers to generate
liquidity so that you can iterate onto your game or you build a season two or a season three whatever
it might be and you know for me i'm not saying you gentlemen are doing this people are kidding
themselves when they say gaming is going to be the great whole border because as someone's
gentleman just before we mentioned we haven't tested the infrastructure yet for those millions
of users let alone if you're asking gamers to connect the wallet what was the last the
last time i looked what's it 400 000 wallets or something they just aren't the weight of numbers
and then on top of that you go to a gamer and you know i know gamers well have a stake in an
esports team you go to gamers and you ask them about connecting a wallet or crypto
then they're not seeing the value prop they're just not seeing the value props and
i'm not seeing it yet i see other um utility or other solutions being the mass on border
and i'd love it to be gaming but i think we're a long way away from it yet
how do you mind me charming it dude rad aspect um you know the the one counterpoint
that it's kind of like super interesting is that is that minecraft itself is super decentralized
right like there's probably like eight major providers of of servers but like people run
their own servers all the time and and so yeah you have 25 million users some of the servers
that i've been on and i yes i'm the person who the adult on stage that still plays minecraft i never
played as a child but i do play with my children um uh the main thing is is like some of the servers
can handle like five people right uh and you can only have like five people on the entire server
and and so if you think about the the strong decentralized nature of kind of what we're
building it's like you don't have to put every single action on the blockchain and and that's
why a lot of these gaming companies are starting with nfts and like these character transfers i mean
as as a gamer myself i think one of the scariest things i used to play this game called population
one when somebody had the the silver tournament skin meaning that you had to beat like a thousand
other users or 10 000 users to like basically like win that skin it without losing like
that was like an oh shit moment that was like that was a sign of status that was a sign like
that was earned right and then just like you know with any nfp or any all these skins within
these gaming it's you know status can be earned or purchased and and and that's kind of what we're
doing we're we're trading attention for status so at first like in everything like kind of we do
and i don't want to get like too off the topic here but you know you're trading your time and
attention to learn a game so that you can earn a skin so that you can show other people the status
that you have with that it's almost like a certification mode if like you graduate from a
college or something else like it's probably harder to get like one of those crazy tournament
skins than it is to graduate from college so mad respect to that it's just that the simple
thing is is that it's not transferable that status that attention is locked within that
kind of centralized network where minecraft was rad is you could start to like share your maps
and and share your servers with each other and like you you can think of anything like there's
like servers of like new york city there's servers of like um what like elsa from frozen's castle
like there's all kinds of servers that you can like kind of share that and share that experience
with others now if you were able to like throw a token on there and monetize that
now you could get paid for that not just hey hey you got a couple geek points for building out
the server it's like you could monetize that experience because you are a creator right so
that's that's what we're getting at and we were talking about um last point we're talking about
socialify before that was like the whole point of that it's like if you're a creator and you're
creating this content and it's owned by these like webto surfaces you don't like yes x tries to like
give you some semblance of a check back on in terms of earnings but you don't own it those posts
aren't yours there's videos on youtube aren't yours so if you wanted to take it off platform
they can just like wipe you any second so i just like i think that the same type of conversation
when you talk about gaming you're talking about gaming creators well you know there's a platform
hundreds of millions to do but the real magic in my mind is when when people are able to
like nft gate or token gate those experiences so i want to go play that map that map sounds
rad sure i'll play a couple bucks and token to go play that map and that map is then earned by that
that that map creator yeah i think very similar to the games right everybody wants that world
everybody wants that future i think they just need to they need to be built whether it's the
games or the infrastructure for for the creator economy there should be enough money there's
enough money being invested in projects in all of these spaces i think it's just just a matter of
time so i maybe at the moment there's not enough to build that triple-a game but i would not bet
against it i think it's the way things are headed uh it just takes time i i think that it's going
to take someone coming out with a dedicated um system that is making a lot of money for it just
because um like that's the it is a lot of money like the gentleman was saying before you know
75 million dollars plus if you're getting to a cheaper system i mean if you think about the other
types of games that exist um like mobile games like the very first mobile games like angry bird and
stuff right um super simple but we we got better and better and better at them it still cost
a lot of money so and how angry birds end up making a lot of its money was through ip licensing
um later on and merchandising so but even then even though it was a dollar whatever
but you had like unblocked me and all these other things that really helped it take off
um so i i think it's going to need a lot like the amount of money that we've seen go
for like a chain would need to go for a full project
i completely agree they could start out small though too right so we were talking to these
um these guys uh mo mate and uh web-a-verse and they're they have a really interesting project
they're i i'm nice i can't release numbers but but they're uh over a hundred thousand
monthly active users um interacting with these chatbots these ai chatbots that they're generating
so they'll like read every song lyric of billie eilish and everything that she's ever said or wrote
out and put out there and and they generated billie eilish chatbot from from her language
and they have like over like a hundred thousand uh users a month right now like interacting with
that their their long-term plan is to be able to like tokenize like virtual interactions which is
which is wild with these with these creators now is it like is it going to be amazing or is
it going to be a dud right this is this goes back to like the alexa thing when you start to like
get into this space right alexa's you know when you talk about these like voice chat systems
now we have openai but i used to work in alexa and the thing that we would always talk about
is if you didn't get the answer that you wanted five out of six times you you would think the
thing is broken and you just would stop using it so you know these things have to work too like
the other dude was talking about what it took 20 times to run a transaction through salona
like that's crazy dude that's crazy you had to push that out like 20 times like this stuff has
to work right so even with the things like crazy amount of tps like salona just getting
those transactions through if you want a tournament you won that crazy you know 10,000
people silver skin and then you can't get your your nft at the end of the day like how sore would
you be right so yeah it's got a lot of challenges and issues but you know incrementally step by
step it's gonna be like really stupid angry bird style games at the beginning and then and then
i think it'll i think it'll evolve over time but that's that's the challenges of emerging technology
and anyone that's been around for a while and has gone through the cycles of emerging technology
knows that you have these uh these challenges that come up and it's you know we just hope
and pray that the the innovators the builders in the space the true builders will come up with
the solutions and more often than not that they do um so you know i i think we fall into a bit of
a culture and i get and i totally agree with you by the way but i think uh you know and even i'm
guilty of this we we try something and we want it instantaneously and we want it to work perfectly
instantaneously but when you're dealing with an emerging technology the hard facts the hard truth
is it takes a while for it to work now could we have solved it could we have sold some of our
challenges with better ui better ux absolutely we could but again that's all part of the innovation
path that we just need to go down so i agree with you i just think we've got to be a little
bit patient and it's not going to happen tomorrow but it you know i'm bullish that it will happen
yeah i think that i think this is yeah i think that we're very early it's like insane how early
we still are you know it's like i when i when when i first started getting into bitcoin i was like oh
you know like thinking that that times are about to change but you know now like as as long as
it's been going and like i guess i really want to stay slow because it's like you know i also
another thing that i was that i was thinking about too is that every time that something like
good happens in crypto or let's say supposed to be good everybody ends up getting rubbed you know
like so it's like the bull run and then all of a sudden all the new guys that start coming in they
get rubbed the etf all the new guys that come in they get rubbed so it's like you know every time
that something good happens something bad is also happening and then they gives the new a lot of
the new people a sour taste in their mouth and then there's a couple of stragglers that realize
what's going on and they stay around and they build more and it gets bigger and bigger so
it's really kind of you know i think we're early and like you know even like this
this conversation this discussion right now is really making me think that i think that really
the way forward to get a lot of people is that is going to have to be gaming or social media
something where you mess on board people like and they're going to be active on the platform
that's really probably the only and and younger people and that's really the only way that we're
going to be moving forward here yeah you can see the kind of natural progression of like twitter
and then rumble and and the patriot one and like you have these like the tech to build a twitter
and and the space is out there right and you can see that that new forks of the same system
either either social phi and friend tech or or any of these other social phi stuff is coming
and and kind of that's the promise right it's like whatever it is if it starts to get into
a a structure where enough people on the platform say hey this isn't for me anymore
let's fork it like you can and and that's like really the the promise of of all of
these technologies and decentralization if enough people believe in your white paper and your thesis
and and believe in you then they're going to speculate on your token they're going to
speculate on what you've built and then follow you around all right this has been cool guys um
want to give like a last little like shill session and everybody in the audience if you
liked what you had you know please follow alpha growth follow the people up on stage
anybody else want to come up and show anything uh let's do that and let's uh let's start
to close it out yeah uh andrew lubon from pulsar um we have we're launching our pfp upcoming on
salana um so go to pulsar.ai create your profile connect your wallet join the whitelist um and look
out for our pfp drop that's coming soon from there we're also going to launch our our token
and uh our point system so we'll be doing all of this on salana uh excited to have it soon
and that's pulsar.ai uh and we're the google for nfts go check it out
coolio all right everybody's got anything else we got any last little little shills um we're
gonna keep this going and it's not the space going but we're gonna do another space we might
be changing the the time uh here coming up soon but we're gonna be doing a weekly space
from alpha growth alpha growth we do business development marketing and crypto we deployed a
shit ton of grants we helping you know over 200 some companies get a grants right now
where the bd and marketing team for compound uh collab land and kava uh chain so if you need
help with bd and marketing and shrewd in the audience i see you out there dude i got your
message i'll get back to you tonight or tomorrow um you know we help people get grants we help
chains and ecosystems grow and we're always trying to grow a project or a chains alpha
that's why we're called alpha growth joe you got anything
i would say uh next week if anybody wants to try their luck we're gonna be doing uh first
annual or i guess first weekly kill crypto so if you think your project is cool you want to come
up and show it we'll have some investors you might have some chains here and you have 60 seconds
give us your tight 60 pitch and if it's cool you'll get praise you'll get some investor
introductions if it's not you'll get roasted try to we'll try to be uh lightly roasted
or no no no no no no no you're gonna get roasted if your pitch sucks
hey like the more you pitch the more you get better so that's it brian calligan alpha growth
that's uh let's close this shit down thanks for everybody joining thanks for everybody listening
and uh we'll chat later cheers guys later see you guys