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XTalks: Interoperability and Web3 Gaming
Recorded: Jan. 8, 2024 Duration: 1:09:51Space Recording
Full Transcription
www.blogsp edit.com
Hey,
thanks.
And like I said, this is an ongoing series that we've got planned out and it's great to have so many guests on and obviously being able to shed spotlight on not only L1X, but also onto all the other projects that are jumping on that see the interoperability vision on top of that.
So huge, huge cast of speakers here. I won't take up too much time with my ramblings and I'll probably just pass straight over to Kryptonaut.
Hey, thanks. Appreciate that. Hey, everybody. Welcome to Xtalks. My name is Cody. I'm the chief experience officer at Layer 1X.
And as it was previously mentioned, for those that are just joining, we are diving deep into the wild frontier of Web3 gaming with Digga Labs, Tater Games and Haven's Compass.
And hopefully I pronounce this correctly. How do you say that? Cicaba? There we go.
Yeah. So we're really excited to dive into this. I think we can go down a couple of good rabbit holes.
If those that are listening in, they know I like to go deep on some on some topics.
So before we do, first things first, let's let's do some introductions.
So if you want to just jump on and give us a quick rundown of who you are and what your project is and we'd we'd love to learn more about it.
Sure. Yeah. Thank you. OK. Sorry. Yeah. After you. Yeah.
All right. I'll go first. My name is Gabriel. I'm the creator of New New Spirits.
Also founded a game studio called Tater Games, which is how we met Layer 1X.
Yeah. I mean, I think this is going to be an awesome space, so I don't want to get too much into, you know, all my stuff.
Everybody can find that. I'll probably just throw something up in the Jumbotron so people can can investigate at their own leisure.
We're building a game that's all about having some fun, playing some games together and planting real trees in the real world.
And we've already planted over 20,000 trees with our with our system.
So we're hoping to do more of that and inspire others to to make a real world impact with their projects as well.
So thanks for having us here, Layer 1X. And it's great to be on the on the panel with some amazing speakers.
So please do check all them out as well.
Perfect. That's awesome. Thank you.
So, yeah, thank you so much. Maybe the next one is me.
So, actually, we are building Sakaba. Sakaba is an internet interconnected network for WebC games.
And we utilize V3.3 and also VNFT and Bright Market X system for WebC games.
So we use, you know, a very basic contract of DeFi protocol and utilize it in WebC gaming industry.
Our vision is optimizing, optimizing opportunity in WebC gaming system.
You know, like WebC gaming system is kind of mixing a lot of layers, such as pure gamers and traders and investors and also alpha seekers and also airdrop hunters, you know.
So we're building a network for each loyal system, loyalty for a trader, loyalty for gamers and loyalty for investors, loyalty for airdrop hunter and making a gamer's ID based on, you know, gaming activities.
And we incentivize such activity with VNFT and V3.3 system.
And as a background, you know, like we already working with Elden on the team and, you know, quite like interesting in this layer 1X, you know, like our podcast and also this AMA, you know.
So I'm so glad to be here and looking forward to talk about interoperability and also gaming industry, you know.
So, yeah, that's about Sakaba and myself.
Perfect. Thank you.
I think I can go.
So, I'm not sure. Can you guys hear me, by the way?
Loud and clear.
All right. Awesome.
Well, first of all, thank you for having us.
My name is Abawood.
I'm the COO of Haven's Compass.
What our game is all about, it's a first-person shooter.
It's a tactical game.
It has high-level weapon abilities.
You can modify them and so on.
So it's an FPS, literally said.
Our game is hosted on the Epic Games Store.
So it's one of the first, if not the first, Web3 game to be on the Epic Games Store.
We can download it.
Until now, we've had over 25,000 downloads, thousands of games played, and were incubated by CD5.
Perfect.
That's awesome.
All right.
So did we hit everybody?
I think we did.
How about Diggaard?
Diggaard?
Diggaard.
Diggaard.
Maybe they can come on a little bit later and give us a little...
Oh, are you there?
Can you hear you now?
Hello.
Yep, can hear you.
Hi, everyone.
I'm Lucy.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Do you want to give us a little rundown about your Diggaard and what you're creating?
It looks like we might be having some connection issues.
Yeah, it looks like we might.
Okay.
Well, if we can get Diggaard back up and have him tell us a little bit about himself and the game, that would be great that they're coming out with.
I'm sure there's a lot of people that would love to hear about it.
So in the interim, we'll kind of start diving into some questions.
How does that sound?
Sure.
Yeah.
So let's just make this a quick little kind of an open panel.
There's going to be no real questions directed at anybody's.
Feel free to jump in whenever you want.
And we'll just talk about a few different topics here and try to go down a couple of deep rabbit holes on some of these.
So with that being said, let me just pull up my list of questions here.
So first question I have is, with all the problems that your project may be facing and trying to solve in the gaming space, how do you differentiate yourself from other games within the Web3 space?
I think I can jump in right away and answer that question as a beginning.
That's fine.
I think the main problem with the Web3 games is the complexity that a lot of people are facing.
So some people that just want to play a game in specific, not really familiar with Web3 itself, they're going to have a few issues here and there when it comes to blockchain elements.
So how to create a wallet, what to do with that wallet, how to, you know, save the seed phrase and whatnot.
Anything that has to do with the blockchain that the people are not really very much interested about, especially if they're not Web3 gamers.
I think that is the main issue in the Web3 gaming space.
Apart from, of course, the tokens and whatnot that happened two years ago.
I think we're all familiar with what went down with the games in 2021, right?
So for us, we're we're solving that issue in just completely, so to say, hiding the blockchain element.
Um, it's in the back end, it's in the background of the game.
We're focusing on the game itself.
So if anyone wants to play the game, they can as simple as that.
Uh, if anyone wants to use, uh, the NFTs, uh, if anyone wants to use the tokens that they're going to get throughout the game, they can also.
They just need to know how.
Uh, and of course, what we're doing is we're going to introduce that and make it easier for the, for, for those who want to use these things, um, uh, to do them.
So as in giving, uh, a bit of a crash course on how to do stuff, let's say it like that.
And I think that's, uh, that's a very important thing to do for, you know, to draw as many people as possible into the Web3 gaming, uh, field or niche.
Yeah, a hundred percent.
I agree with you on that one.
That's, that's for sure.
It definitely sounds like user experiences is a focus for Haven's compass over the next, uh, year or so, would you say?
Yeah, definitely.
I mean, our game is planned to launch fully, uh, by the end of this year.
We already had an alpha and a beta that we released, uh, to, uh, to our community for them to test it out, for us to get the good feedback, uh, so we can fix things.
And that was already last year.
So that's one of the things that we're seeing also in the, in the space that a lot of games are releasing everything, NFTs and tokens and whatnot, but they're not releasing game.
What we did is actually, we released the game before we did anything, um, for, for the people to actually give us feedback on the game itself.
We're making sure that this game is the most fun to play and, uh, that it's, uh, quite stable.
And as soon as, as our community gets familiar with the game, that's when we're going to, uh, launch the rest of the, of the planned launches.
So let's say there's, there's a mint that's going to happen soon, a free mint, uh, on scale network for NFTs.
Um, so everyone's going to be familiar with, okay, yeah, I played Haven's conference.
I liked that game.
I tested it out.
I gave them feedback and now I'm going to go and grab myself that free mint.
Um, and that's how, how we're doing it.
Oh, that sounds, sounds amazing.
Um, you know, uh, web three is kind of like, uh, uh, uh, asking somebody, you know, a web two person to go and, uh, run a JS application from the command line interface to, you know, search for a restaurant.
That makes sense.
Yeah, totally.
Totally.
Yeah.
I think we'll see a lot more, uh, people take, uh, Haven's route, uh, this year, uh, with this run, uh, trying to.
Uh, like you said, hide, hide, web three, um, functionality and onboarding processes will become more simple.
Uh, there's a lot of companies and projects that are coming up now, uh, that are just working on making that as easy as possible.
And I mean, that's really, really what we found.
Uh, everybody was kind of preaching back in 2021, everyone's coming to web three.
Um, and now everyone's kind of realized that nobody really wants to go through those extra steps.
Um, still like 95, 99% of people, uh, don't want non-custodial wallets.
They want somebody to be able to recover funds for them, reverse transactions.
If something goes wrong, you know, there, there's lots of things that, um, you know, centralized, uh, value transfer does.
It's for the average user that they're not ready to give up on yet.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I totally agree with you on that one.
Like my background in the real world has come from developing SAS products and things like that.
So user experience is definitely right up our alley of, of what we're trying to accomplish is specifically with layer one X.
Um, you guys have.
Well, and that's what we're talking about here today, interoperability.
Like no one cares if you're using T-Mobile or orange or AT&T or whatever.
They just want to be able to call you.
That's the bottom line, you know?
For sure.
And so to restrict, uh, interaction, digital interaction based on some, what, super abstract, you know, such as the chain, you know, such as a decentralized protocol for, uh, a ledger recording is, is just, that's too far for, for average user.
Yeah.
At layer one X, we call that keeping everything under the hood.
But so it's, uh, trying, trying to keep it simple.
Uh, we have a term that we've used over the course of the year, uh, this past year is, uh, we want to make crypto so easy that grandma can do it.
Right.
Uh, if, if we can make it so that she doesn't have to ask her grandson or her granddaughter to help her, uh, purchase crypto, play a game, do whatever it is.
We've, we've, we've succeeded as, you know, people within crypto to, to try to drive that adoption.
So it's great to see you guys are definitely focused on that this year.
So does anybody else have anything they want to add?
Um, yeah, I mean, I'll, I'll just, um, hop in there, I guess, uh, new, new spirits is unique.
And of course that it's, that it's actually trying to do something, uh, for the real world.
Um, all of our NFTs are tied directly to trees planted in the real world by, uh, verified partners that, uh, are either on chain or have, um, uh, record keeping that is in line with, uh, local governments, uh, such that it can't be double counted or have be skated.
Um, and, uh, yeah, I think we, we kind of have a little side niche and that we are a cooperative game.
Um, um, our, our, our multiplayer is in the works, but our multiplayers won't be like PVP.
There'll be more, um, team, team versus conditions.
Um, you know, so playground things, uh, you know, like, uh, ultimate Frisbee capture the flag, these types of things, but, uh, more asymmetrical, more, uh, more like overcooked, uh, you know, where you're all working together to get the recipes out the front door, uh, as fast as you can.
So, yeah, I guess those are our two, two eco niche and cooperability.
Perfect.
Thanks.
That sounds interesting.
And how many trees did you guys say that you guys have, uh, planted so far?
Is it 20 or 25?
20,000, 20,000.
Yeah.
20,000.
Um, we, we got another 500 going in soon.
Uh, and there were, there were about 3000 or so planted in the alpha stage.
So yeah, we're, we're over 20, we're just over 22,000 probably, uh, in, in all.
Oh, that's, that's awesome.
Kudos to you guys for sure.
So I'm, I'm curious, where do you guys plant these trees at?
So most of the trees have so far been planted in Africa.
Um, and, uh, some, some of them have been, uh, planted along coasts.
Uh, we have some friends who plant, uh, mangrove trees along coastal areas to help restore and
protect coasts from, uh, you know, inclement weather.
And it also, uh, rejuvenates those, uh, biomes, uh, quite quickly.
Um, one of the things that we like to focus on is, uh, not just chucking trees in the ground,
but, uh, working with people that are planting trees in such a way that it's, it's more restorative,
uh, and then it restores, uh, ecologies for fauna as well as, uh, you know, uh, keeping
soil in, in, in contact.
We have a great partner, uh, in Australia called Airseed.
Uh, they're planting trees out in the Australian bush, uh, which I just saw a, uh, a thing pop
up in social media on how big Australia actually is.
And all of Europe basically fits inside of Australia.
Um, so, you know, everybody thinks, oh, Australia, it's, you know, it's a small island down and
it's not a small thing at all.
Uh, and there's some quite, uh, significant challenges to reforestation in a lot of the,
uh, those, uh, kind of unpopulated territories.
And that doesn't mean that there aren't, uh, ecologies out there.
There aren't animals out there that, uh, can benefit from rapid or, uh, enhanced reforestation
after, you know, things like rush buyers and stuff like that.
So, uh, pretty cool stuff.
All around.
Interesting.
Yeah.
That, that is very interesting.
Thanks for sharing that.
Uh, does anybody else want to add, add anything else, uh, to the question before I move on
to the next one?
Sure.
So let me, let us try to, you know, uh, explain, you know, kind of differentiation and what
is kind of unique point of Sakaba, you know?
So, yeah, like, uh, previously you mentioned about like why your game is unique, you know,
but Sakaba itself is not really actual gaming.
It's more liquidity hub and also infrastructure and gaming engine for, you know, all the website
gaming.
Uh, the unique point of Sakaba is, uh, as I mentioned before, but like, you know, we utilize
in very basic contract of DeFi protocol, such as VNFT and also bright market and, and liquidity
point, you know, uh, so actually we fork in, uh, learning, fork in learning contract of
Veldrum, which is the, one of the most popular DeFi protocol on optimism, you know, uh, in the
previous, uh, gaming industry, uh, WebC gaming industries, even like, and that's pretty young,
but like there was really, you know, good enough, uh, DeFi fork or utilizing a DeFi, DeFi
X system, the voting X system, you know, for WebC gaming X system, but we, uh, actually
from, uh, crypto and also DeFi, like, uh, OZ guys, you know, and also like, uh, 50% of our
members are based in Japan and Korea.
So they are like a really popular country of gaming, you know, so we totally believe,
you know, that we can utilize very basic and a contract of DeFi, uh, evolved and revolution,
you know, from this few years for WebC gaming and the gaming itself, you know, we have more
than billion gamers, you know, all over the world.
So the, the, the biggest opportunity and the biggest, you know, market is for gaming.
So we totally believe, you know, gaming is the next step for crypto is being a mass adoption.
So, you know, and, and also like incentive system, voting system, decentralization system
of DeFi protocol is the best way to evolve the, you know, WebC gaming to the next step.
Um, so I think that's quite like a unique point and also a differentiation of Sakaba protocol
than other, you know, like like system or like infrastructure, but I totally respect to
all the infrastructure, you know, such as layer 1x as well, you know, that's you guys
doing a really amazing job, you know, so yeah, we are in a different field, but like totally
respecting you guys as well.
So, yeah, but yeah, that's the question, you know, adding to other, other people's answer.
Yeah.
Thanks.
Uh, yeah.
Thanks for sharing.
I appreciate that.
Um, a lot of good insight on, on what makes you guys different for sure.
So, um, I see that we've got, uh, DigiGuard back up.
Uh, do you guys want to try, try coming back up on speaking a little bit about your project
real quick before we move on?
Yes.
Hello.
Uh, do you guys can hear me now?
Yes, we can.
Oh, sorry.
Uh, I gotta, uh, interrupt with my connection.
Uh, let me introduce myself again.
I'm Lucy, we live, uh, at Liga Labs.
We have, uh, two projects.
One of them is, uh, DigiGuard, which is, uh, provides Web3 solution for, uh, games.
And the other is Eldarune, which is a game factory that builds interoperable games and
media, mediaable teams.
Um, we have four different games right now under development.
One of them is World of Elimnias, which is an idle games.
It has three, uh, more, uh, four different modes.
Three of them, uh, are idle games.
And one of them is action RPG.
And also we have, uh, a trading card game called, uh, Heroes of Eldarune.
And one story game is, uh, Eldarune Journey.
And the final, the MOBA game is called Eldrash.
So, yeah.
Perfect.
All right.
Yeah.
Thanks for sharing.
Uh, do you, do you have any comment on the, the first question I asked?
Yeah.
I'm sorry.
I missed the connection while my internet connection corrupted.
No, you're fine.
I was just, uh, yeah.
The question was, uh, what problems is your project trying to solve in the gaming space?
And how do you, how does it differentiate yourself from the other games?
Yeah.
Thank you very much.
Let me, uh, answer this question quickly.
Well, we have four different games and, uh, for every, uh, for every type of players.
So, um, we want to, we want to build games for fun games for every type of players.
And, um, with these games, you, you, uh, we have only one token, uh, other token you can
use for, uh, for different games.
And also all our NFTs are interoperable, uh, with, uh, these four NFTs.
So, uh, we are providing, uh, like various games and various assets, uh, to, to be able
to playable for all, all type of games.
And we are doing it on chains and we are, uh, we will be able to integrate, uh, via Layeronics
to, uh, across all of, uh, chains.
So we will be accessible across different, uh, platforms across, uh, to different communities.
Perfect.
All right.
Sounds great.
Thanks for sharing.
Um, which is a great segue into our next question.
Uh, most web three games are pretty siloed on their own blockchain, making it difficult
for players to move assets and interact with other games on other chains.
Um, this potentially limits, uh, true interconnected and immersive gaming experience.
Uh, what are your guys's thoughts on interoperability and how will that play a role in your guys's
game and platforms moving forward?
Well, there's, there's definitely a lot to say about that actually.
Um, well, interoperability in general is, is something that really enhances game experience.
Um, there, there's like an impact on, on several things, you know, when it comes to, uh, the
tokenomics itself, uh, the, the community and how large it can be.
Um, so what we're doing, actually, we, we do have partnerships with, uh, multiple chains.
So four of them right now.
Um, that's why I said like the next freemint is going to be on scale.
The next one is going to be on a different, uh, on a different, uh, chain or network.
Um, and you know, it's, it's a very good thing to have because it's, it's going to connect
a lot more people from the community into, into one game.
Um, as said before, it's all, as you said, actually under the hood.
So no one really cares which blockchain we're using, um, except when it comes to the NFTs
for us, it's only important to be, let's say EVM friendly because, um, you know, EVM there's,
there's a lot of, uh, networks that can be used under the same wallet, which is going to
make it much easier for these players.
And for us in terms of development, instead of having several wallets and then, you know,
connecting so many different things to, to each other.
So I think that is, um, you know, one of, one of the very important, uh, things to say
when it comes to this.
Yeah.
I think EVM compatibility is kind of, uh, being established as the standard, um, touch point.
If you're looking for interoperability, um, and it's got to start somewhere, right?
You know, there's gotta be some sort of, uh, agreed upon protocol.
Uh, and, uh, I think that, uh, you know, the, the way Ethereum was set up, it was kind
of set up to be that from the very, very beginning.
And, uh, I think that shows pretty enormous foresight, uh, for kind of the nascent state
of the industry was in at the time when Ethereum was created.
And of course it was still proof, you know, proof of, um, uh, work back then, um, which,
you know, there's been constant evolution since then.
Um, we even have, you know, ZK layers, you know, which, which allow even, even faster
transaction speed and, and stuff like that.
So, you know, we'll see, we'll see, we'll continue to see evolutions like that.
But I think as long as there's that touch point, um, you know, that kind of agreed
upon standard protocol, which is what we did with, you know, web two, we had the HTTP,
uh, and HTTPS, uh, protocols for, you know, basically sending, uh, sending a letter.
Uh, so as long as we have that in place, I think we can move forward and we can, we can
explore all of those, those exciting opportunities.
Like, uh, you know, uh, Hayden was saying, we, we look forward to, you know, having mini
games with all of our partners involved.
You know, we have, uh, some amazing partners like saw by Ecoverse.
They're very heavy into the eco side of things.
We have, you know, Skytopia, which has amazing cute characters.
Um, and we're seeing some amazing strides happening from, uh, others in the industry.
Um, and there's always talk of, you know, can we do some crossovers?
Can we, you know, have our NFT show up in your game?
And that was always kind of one of those, uh, underlying benefits that was sold with, with
NFTs in the, in the first cycle, the first NFT boom was that NFTs could be used by anyone
across any gaming system.
Um, and while that is true on a technical sense, it was never really realized.
So, you know, we, we do have, uh, a lot of space to make up with regards to that.
Like, how can we just use our NFT in, in somebody else's game?
So how could the new news show up in Haven, for example, or, you know, when the Haven's
NFTs show up at new new spirits and, you know, without, without overburdening the dev teams,
which, you know, developing games is already a huge endeavor, um, trying to figure out
how all of that is going to play together.
Well, uh, we need tools and stuff like that to come into the scene to help, uh, make those
easier.
And I think the only way to do that is just by, you know, developing good partnerships
with really strong, uh, partners, games and exploring those.
And then from those will come again, that kind of EVM level of interoperability, that
kind of interface layer, uh, so to speak, uh, that will allow people to do that more easily
in the future.
Yeah.
That makes sense.
And, uh, just to add to that also, you know, when it comes to having EVM friendly, or let's
just call it one, one, um, similar, uh, type of protocol that everyone's working on, then
we can skip all the, um, I don't know if you guys saw what happened also two years ago, and
it's been happening over and over the, the random bridges that, that, you know, they just
lock an NFT and then unlock it somewhere else.
I mean, that's, that's too much random work in any way or another.
So it's definitely better to have these proper partnerships in place.
Yeah, definitely.
I mean, we, we wanted to be as multi-chain as possible.
Uh, we, we launched our token, uh, we minted on Ethereum and we bridged to BSC and Avalanche.
Unfortunately, we did that through multi-chain and that doesn't work anymore.
You know, so it's like, now what?
You know, it's like, you guys were promising a service and like, you know, to be fair, they
can't do anything about it because, you know, they're buying bars, you know, but, but still
that doesn't do anything for, for us in the ecosystem.
So we need to find an alternative.
You know, we need, we need to, we need to do better at this time around.
Agreed.
A hundred percent.
A hundred percent.
All right.
I actually think that's why we, we started talking with Layer 1X in the first place.
It was like, it was like, wow, we're, you know, we, how are you guys with bridges?
And like bridges, no need no stinking bridges.
Exactly.
Hashtag burn the crypto bridge.
Right.
So, yeah.
It's.
But when it comes to the same game, then it's easier.
You know, if it's one game and using different NFTs from different chains, then it's a simple
thing to do.
But when it comes to two different entities trying to work together in one thing, then
yeah, the bridge is very nice stuff.
Yeah.
And this is, this is kind of interesting because I did have a follow-up question to that
original question.
And it was, what do you guys think the long to long tail effect will be on, you know, introducing
once everybody gets hooked on to interoperability, if that's through Layer 1X is X talk, or if
it's through a bridge, heaven help us if they do that.
But what are the long tail effects of, of what it is?
And we've kind of touched upon it and, and, you know, with the NFTs, but what are some
other long-term or long tail effects that might happen and occur as a result of interoperability?
Like you guys said, bringing in.
I think we'll see an explosion of user generated content.
Absolute explosion.
Um, we've already, we've already seen some huge successes with UGC, uh, ARC, uh, survival,
for example, uh, even, even some amazing franchises have like spawned off of essentially user generated
content or modding, uh, you know, Dota, for example, Call of Duty had their own stuff.
Um, and, uh, yeah, it's, it's, it's going to get crazy, um, that, that ability to participate
and own, you know, the content that you're creating, be compensated for it without having
any sort of, uh, you know, jury or, um, you know, benevolent benefactor inside of, you know,
the corporation that owns those entities, you know, if you own the NFT, you will own, uh,
the ability to do things with that, um, and profit from it, which, which is just going to
take that, that scale of, of industry and do something that we've never seen before, in
my opinion, I think this is, this is going to be something, um, the likes, which, you know,
people are talking about AI right now and how amazing that tool is.
Uh, leveraging the human factor in this, the amount of creativity that's going to come from
it. It's, it's just going to be unprecedented, uh, in my opinion.
There's a lot of innovation that's going to happen also after that, you know, like, um,
I think in terms of, of game development or just the game design, like how people are going to
innovate when it comes to how they design their game, uh, for something to keep going on for the
future. I mean, for us, we're going to have multiple, you know, games after this one, uh,
obviously we're, we're a game development studio, so we're not going to stop at one game.
Um, so it, it changes the whole game design. So you start thinking, and how can I make something
in this game that's going to continue to the game after it? Um, so imagine like you have something
from, yeah, let's say something like modern warfare two, or you have a skin, you have something there
and then you're moving on to the next game they release and you can still use that same skin
or you can still use that same, whatever, you know, in terms of, of, of a first person shooter
now, but any other game can have the same thing. Overwatch had the huge problem trying to switch
to Overwatch two, uh, that they alienated a huge amount of their community. They basically relaunched
essentially the same game, but then wanted to resell all of the skins over again. And the community
was like, what the, you know, and it's like, well, why, you know, why can't you tokenize that and have
those, you know, transferable? You can certainly provide more, uh, you know, updated skins and stuff
for, for sale. You know, there's always going to be people buying the newest, latest, and shiniest
things, but, you know, uh, Magic the Gathering is also having that issue with, you know, release
schedule being too fast. You know, most of them, like the majority of the Magic community is like,
slow down, you know, you're putting too much stuff out there. And then every time that, you know,
they try and put AI inside of their, you know, artwork or their marketing promotion, the community
erupts, you know, they just can't do anything right because they're not, they're not trying to
build a good product. They're just trying to build as many products and sell as many products as
possible. And so, um, again, I think this is something that web three also kind of allows you
to understand as a consumer and participate in, uh, you know, that kind of the growth of those,
those systems. And, you know, we're, we're looking at essentially, um, having our holders act as node
generators for the currency that we will sell in game. So we, we haven't released our hard currency
yet, but we will have an in-game hard currency. It is a completely free to play game. So it does
have, you know, that mechanic in there. Uh, but, uh, the problem with a hard currency in all of the
games that we have out right now is that it is a hundred percent centralized. I mean, it is more
centralized than anything you can imagine in your head right now. Uh, as far as a centralized
currency goes, uh, it can be changed on a whim from day to day and it often is changed. Um, and,
and there really isn't any recourse for, you know, the purchaser of those, uh, of those currencies,
uh, they can get mad, they can rage quit, uninstall or whatever, but it doesn't matter to
the centralized authority that changed that currency because they've already,
they, you know, acquired new users. Um, and, and that's, and that's not cool.
Not at all.
Yeah, for sure. For sure. Um, let's move on for the interest of time. Let's move on to another
quick topic, but that was a good one. I'd love to go down that rabbit hole again with you guys in
deeper, maybe another time, but, uh, sure.
For sure. Anytime. Yeah. So moving on to, uh, kind of, kind of where we've touched upon with
the last, uh, topic was, you know, we mentioned web three and then we kind of make that migration
from web two to web three experience. It's, it's all about giving the user control, control over
their identity, control over their, uh, their data. And that could be gaming data. It could also be the
ability to have them able to customize their own experience. How important is customization with
you guys moving into web three, uh, for the users for being able to control their data, have access
to their data, uh, stats, um, you know, things like that.
Go ahead. Hey, I see you off. If you want to, if you want to start that, but yeah, I'm, I'm
always off mute actually. My mic is almost always on, but, uh, yeah, sure. Um, I, I think, uh, well,
first of all, like we all need to work to draw in web two players, regular gamers, uh, into web three.
Um, the, the first and foremost thing to do is actually give them confidence. And in order to
give a gamer confidence, you need to give them the ability and the chance to actually control,
uh, whatever is, is in our hands. Let's say if it's user data, if it's, uh, their equipment in game,
if it's their credit in game, if anything, anything that comes with that, they have to see it as
clearly as possible. And I think that's exactly where it starts. So if you can give the gamer
confidence, um, then you have it, you know, they're, they're going to be there. They're going
to play that game. They're going to enjoy it. And, uh, no, one's going to worry about anything.
So imagine a gamer, um, that is playing as it has been playing a specific game for a while. And,
um, yeah, all of a sudden that game is, I don't know, out of support or deleted, or,
uh, you know, he's been playing thousands of hours to get these few weapons and unlock a new sword or
unlock a new, I don't know what. And all of a sudden you're, you're moving that game. Um,
they're going to lose all trust and they're going to lose that confidence in, in this game itself,
because they couldn't control their own assets, which you're holding for them.
Um, yeah, there was a, there was a Bronies game, uh, recently, um, it was, uh, uh, them's fighting
herds. Uh, it was a really niche, um, 2d fighter, sprite based fighter. And, uh, it did all right.
And the Kickstarter, you know, raised some funds from the community. Uh, they got things up and
running. Um, and they just never broke out of that, that Kickstarter, um, niche. And so they
ended up closing the project. And of course the community was pissed, you know, they never delivered,
et cetera, et cetera. But, you know, I mean, the, the money that they raised was most likely used to
develop that game. I mean, they did develop quite a bit on that game. And as a developer,
you can kind of see, you know, uh, you can see some telltale signs when, when a game is like,
yeah, we had a million, blah, blah, blah. And we spent it all on development. And this was the
game that we released. And you're like, that wasn't a million dollars, you know, but this game,
you know, they, they did, they did the best that they could. And, um, you know, costs for development
have, have spiked significantly in the last, uh, even two years, uh, more so than they have
in the past, you know, uh, you know, developer rates have, have doubled or tripled, uh, in a lot
of regions and, you know, the pandemic, uh, cause some, you know, some, some supply issues in terms
of resources, uh, local resources for a lot of these companies, ours included, uh, you know,
there are a huge amount of challenges. Um, but, you know, ultimately by decentralizing things,
you enable, uh, you know, network development. So a project does close, uh, if somebody happens
to just buy up all of the NFTs for that collection and they're like, yeah, I've got all these NFTs.
I got, you know, all this stuff, let's, let's relaunch, let's do something different with it.
Uh, you know, there's, there's nobody going to go after them for, you know, stealing the IP of
those characters, uh, because they own them, you know, um, and, and I think that's really cool.
So, you know, your community can kind of put their money where their mouth is. And, you know,
if the developers can't deliver, they can step up and they can take over. Um, you know, so this kind of
opens it up into, you know, what we started to see with, you know, kind of open, uh, open, uh,
game licensing, open license for, you know, development and code, uh, where, you know,
projects start out with, you know, good ideas that maybe don't make it quite there, but, you know,
somebody else is able to take that code and push it further, uh, just because they have the time,
the passion, or they even have the funds to do it. Um, so, yeah. Um,
how, how essential is it for bringing web two users into web three? Uh, I think that's a different,
that's a huge topic. Um, but maybe, maybe it helps to kind of define what is web three versus web two. And,
um, and, and essentially, you know, it's, it's that, that non-custodial element,
but does it even have to be a non-custodial wallet to be considered web three? Can you have a
custodial wallet still be considered? I'm a web three gamer. Uh, I don't actually have the private
key to my wallet. Uh, you know, it's, but I access it and I use that wallet. Um,
yeah, it's a tricky question. Cause like I said, majority of users don't want that level of control.
Um, they, they want, uh, a lot of that heart heavy lifting to be done for them. They want somebody
to fall back on when something goes wrong. Um, and I don't see average users, you know,
grandma, for example, easy enough for grandma. I don't see grandma ever really needing a custodial
or non-custodial wallet. Um, so what I think has to happen is I think, uh, gaming and other industries
that can take advantage of web three technologies need to understand this and they need to make those
tools, uh, you know, like heaven was talking about earlier so that it's, it's there. It's just not
something that the user has to worry about. You know, I want to come in and I want to, I want to
have some amazing, uh, you know, assets. I want to have, you know, a couple of skins. I want to have a
couple of weapons and blah, blah, blah. And then, oh, these weapons actually have value. Okay. Maybe I'll
trade them, you know, because I want to go play this game and I want to put some resources into that. Um,
um, and, and I can do that without ever having to, you know, type in a seed phrase, you know, or, uh,
you know, uh, I, I think that's important. I, I, yeah. Oh, go ahead. Haven. Sorry. Yeah. I just,
I just wanted to say like, don't, don't you think it's, it's an important thing to have both things. So
if they don't want to see that phrase, it can be saved. I didn't want to say that, you know,
you don't want to ever give anybody the opportunity to, you know, you know, make a
custodial wallet, but certainly you can give them the education like, okay, this is your
custodial wallet. You know, we have control over this wallet. If you want control over this wallet,
this is how you do it. And this is why you would want to do that, you know? Yeah. Um,
you know, and, and then that education kind of happens naturally. And then I think, you know,
five, 10, 15 years down the road, everybody kind of understands that. And they'll have,
you know, varying levels of control over various wallets in their, in their, uh, portfolio.
And some of them will be, you know, completely centralized and custodial and a lot, and some
of them will be very protected and personal and, and they can even reference each other. You know,
you can have, uh, you know, your personal ID and everything like that in a very, you know, cold,
cold storage, you know, never access this wallet, uh, except when I need to change something or go to,
you know, you know, the, the port authority office, you know, like, you know, something,
something really official, you know, I got to get my buddy out of jail or something, you know,
like, you know, I got to go to court, uh, to, you know, defend myself, uh, you know,
against murder allegation or whatever, you know, that now I have my wallet, you know,
and this is my, this is my ID. Um, but you know, for the most part, you know,
we don't bring out a social security number and just share that with everybody. Um, and that was
the reason it was, it was supposed to be a protected number that only authorized individuals
had access to and would use that to verify and control your identity. And I think that
as the digital age becomes more and more complex, uh, something of that line is going to be necessary.
Um, and, and I think there are so many other things outside of gaming where blockchain is super
crucial and we should have, we should have been pushing this for years now, you know, voting and,
you know, um, you know, our, our public officials and representatives, uh, their actions should be
on chain so that we can see what they're doing, you know, to track it. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
There, you know, somebody needs to be watching, you know, the fox in the house, so to speak. And,
and, you know, I mean, there is a reason why it hasn't been implemented yet. And it's because they
don't want that, you know, but, uh, you know, you know, power to the people, you know, you just don't
give them a choice, but at the same time, you know, we don't have enough education, uh, you know,
to the masses, you know, granny doesn't know what, uh, uh, you know, what a blockchain is yet. Um,
but the more we can do that, the more we can bring people in, allow them to participate in,
in, in on-chain gaming and on-chain, you know, recreation, they can start to understand those
things in a safe and productive way such that we can make those societal changes.
Also super deep topic. I mean, I keep,
I love it. No, no, I love it. I love it. I, I think you and I could go down some pretty
deep rabbit holes for sure. So, um, yeah, let's, uh, let's keep it going for sure. Uh,
uh, does anybody else want to add anything in? Um, I do have to apologize to Diga. I apologize.
I mispronouncing your guys's name. I, I'm going to chalk it up to it being 5 AM where I'm at right
now. So, um, bear with me on this one. It's kind of early. I'm already too deep in the Red Bull,
so it's, it's turning out to be a good day. So my apologies to, uh, Diga. Um, but I,
no worries. Yeah. Thanks so much. Great. This is really not a problem, mate. No, no worries. And
we call it Diga, but it's not a problem. Yep. So, uh, I think you've got, uh, another member
from your team that's going to be joining us. Is that correct? Yeah, we were, uh, actually,
uh, John, let me ping him again. Maybe he, he, he, he were here, but I think we lost him.
Okay. No, no problem. Uh, did you want to add anything to that before we move on to the next topic?
Well, yeah, I, I agree. Uh, uh, I agree most of the, uh, thoughts, uh, you, you put,
and I will, I will, I also believe that like the Web3 assets will be, will be like being, um, uh, an owner
to the in-game assets will bring most of the gamers and giving an easy access, uh, for the,
like a grandmas will, uh, will help also to bring a lot of Web2 players. I think, uh, the project,
the projects, the games that, uh, provide these two, uh, to the gamers, uh, will achieve success.
Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Like the, the games in the future, that's not going to matter whether it's,
you know, especially tagging in a Web3 game is going to kind of throw up roadblocks, but, uh,
um, making it accessible, making it fun, uh, and then having those proven use cases of why it's
valuable to have this on chain, uh, in those games just automatically. I mean, we were talking with
somebody who was trying to sell like a World of Warcraft account or something like that and
was worried about getting scammed. So he's talking to his mom about putting it on a, you know,
into a crypto wallet or something like that so that they could, they could exchange it that way.
Um, yeah, I mean, there, there, there's been, there's been too, too long, uh, too long, uh,
you know, insecurities with value transfer, you know, aftermarket value transfer in games.
And if we put value in our gaming excess exercises or gaming activities, uh, for ourselves and,
you know, there's gaming, uh, there's value for others or that effort or that value. Uh, we should,
we should have tools that make it safe for them to transfer those, those values. Uh, and that's,
that's essentially what web three does. For sure. For sure. And, you know, one of the biggest things
and, and the reasons why I, I joined layer one X is because I feel like, uh, I've been in crypto since
2017. And since 2017, there has been no change, real change in the user experience, um, for all of
crypto that I've been in and it's been kind of might, might've actually gotten, I agree with you
because they just keep making a copy of a copy of a copy. Right. And so it gets, uh, weaker and weaker
and weaker. And, and so I've had the privilege to help a couple of different projects with their user
experience, um, before coming to layer one X and layer one X is definitely provided a platform for
me to try to vocalize and to try to prompt change, which is great. And I'm of the believer that I think
that decentralization can, can definitely exist without sacrificing the user experience. And so there,
there are things that have been thrown out, you know, like centralized wallets, this and that. And,
you know, we, we feel like that all of that can be done under the hood and there's a lot of movements
that we're trying to make at layer one X that actually, you know, here's some alpha for you.
I guess you could say we're trying to move away from having to have those seed phrases, right? Uh,
being able to verify who you are through other means, um, that will allow you to tap into some
different resources to still keep, uh, things decentralized, but give it that centralized feel
and, uh, being able to, to recoup, you know, access to your wallets, uh, access to your NFTs,
those kinds of things. And so it's really curious to see, I'm curious to see where do you guys think
that in the next probably two to three years with newer technology coming out, where would you like to
take your games and your projects?
Uh, first of all, that's super cool. Um, I, you know, I hope to see some stuff like, uh,
you know, biometrics being used or, you know, physical, uh, devices being used to, um, verify
identity. Uh, you know, there's a lot of, a lot of IDs that are already storing digital,
uh, you know, uh, identifiers and stuff like that, that could be used as seed phrases to access,
uh, or to, you know, verify access to a wallet. Um, you know, it's, it's crazy how, how easy sometimes
it is for, you know, a wallet to be compromised, you know, even though it has those layers of security,
if that, uh, you know, if that, uh, private key has been transferred, you know, there's human
vulnerabilities, there's network vulnerabilities, there's obviously we still have a library hack
that happened, uh, at the end of last year, which everybody was like, what is going on? Like, why is
this happening? Um, and, uh, yeah, I think, I, I just think it's, uh, it's super cool that, uh,
you know, we'll see some of those things here in the very near future. Um, yeah, that's all. Uh,
I'll, I'll let somebody else take the actual question. Didn't mean to derail.
I, I just got very confused. Can you, can you repeat the question? Yeah. Um, basically just,
you know, where do you guys see your projects heading with the new tech that's rolling out
in the next, you know, two, one to two years, uh, basically, uh, with digital identities coming out,
interoperability coming out, um, you know, uh, uh, technology to tap into faster speeds for
processing your games. I mean, you, you tell me, where do you see your, your project heading in
the next one to two years with the new tech rolling out?
Well, okay. Now, if, if we're going to talk about identities, there, there's not much that I can say
when it comes to, um, you know, the game itself, because it's not something that's really required.
Let's say it like that. When it comes to new technologies, of course, we always try to utilize
new things that are coming up in our game. Um, so let's say, for example, now we had something
that had to do with an AI. So we're making sure that our, um, bots in game are actually, you know,
like they, they do this stuff that these new technologies can, can bring us. So they are,
AI will not be repeating the same words over and over again, or doing the same actions over and over
again. Uh, as an example, in terms of interoperability, again, uh, that's, uh, that's
definitely something that we're doing already. We're utilizing that we're trying to, you know,
have as, as many chains as possible at the same time. Uh, we want that connection to happen. We want
cross-platform compatibility, you know, um, we want to make sure that obviously everyone wants to make
sure that they have most of the community in their games. Um, and specifically now I'm talking
about games, obviously, because we're a gaming project. Um, there's, there's a lot of other
things or a lot of other opinions that can be out there for us. There's a lot that we're planning.
As I said before, also we're launching multiple games all after this, and we want to make sure
that you can use anything that you're going to use for this game that you can use in the games
afterwards, whether it's the tokens or whether it's the NFTs, um, and most important, you know,
multiple blockchains at the, at the same time. Perfect. Thank you. Uh, does anybody else want to
add anything? I think processing, um, you know, the, the, uh, uh, remote processing power is going to be
pretty awesome in terms of allowing mobile users to access more triple A looking
uh, in feeling titles with physics and, uh, stuff like that. So, um, I'm, I'm hoping that new new
spirits will have a lot more, um, uh, physics, uh, gameplay physics based gameplay in, in the future.
Uh, you know, a couple of years down the road, like I said, mentioned UGC is going to be huge.
Um, so we are, we are working towards that as well, uh, within the next two to three years, uh,
having a strong, uh, UGC community that's building content for the game, uh, and being rewarded for
building that content for the game. Um, you know, it's kind of going to be like the new version of
LiveOps. Like right now, LiveOps is all about, you know, the team just working, constantly churning
new content out every, you know, month or two months or whatever, um, to, to keep people interested
and engaged where, where I think the, the communities will, will take over a lot of that, um, that drive
that, that effort. Um, as far as, you know, the ability to, to fund games, I think that's also
something that NFTs still offer a pretty significant advantage over, uh, old school publishing. And I
think we were seeing quite a few platforms coming now that are looking at publishing, um, the publishing
of games, uh, crowdfunding of games will also change, you know, as, as they can be rewarded
with tokens or assets from within side of the game. Um, so, I mean, I mean, the landscape is going
to be moving so fast that I think any prediction that we make right now is, is, is just, uh, you
know, it's, it's, it's way too early to tell. Uh, but we'll, we'll get back to that question,
you know, next month. I love that. I love that answer. Um, anybody else want to add anything?
Yeah. Like for us, you know, like inked up early to this car, like one of the most
important stuff in it. And also like, we are really into, you know, like, uh, I love like work
of layer one extreme, you know, like interoperability stuff, but you know, like from next few years,
uh, we, uh, to truly believe, you know, like interoperability stuff is that the biggest,
you know, was, uh, for webc gaming, you know, like gaming always needed a, uh, very fast TPS
and also finality and also like scalability, but you know, just one blockchain, it's not really
enough, you know, for next, uh, triple gaming and also the huge title, you know, maybe in next
bull run, you know, we have more 10, 10 X users or like a hundred X users. So we always need a new
change, new blockchains. Yeah. So yeah, in that case, it's going to be super hard, you know, or, uh,
making, you know, we have maybe a hundred tens or a hundred, a hundred blockchain or like 200
blockchain, you know, but like transferring the asset and also like, uh, experience of each
user is going to be super hard, you know? So yeah, like, uh, interoperability of, uh, all the,
like asset and also like experience and also like all ramp and off ramp, you know, is quite important.
Quite important. So we suck about like, we all also you utilize an infrastructure for like, uh,
interoperability, uh, between like each blockchain, but yeah, like, you know, uh, we totally believe
the infrastructure for a, uh, cost chain and also interpret operability is quite important.
And like, that's the stuff, you know, we are really utilizing it. We're not really gaming,
but yeah, we kind of really interested in that one. Yeah. Sorry for, yeah. Like adding the one
point, but yeah, that's about it. No, you hit it right on the, right on the head. So, uh,
appreciate you sharing that with us, uh, for sure. Interoperability is definitely going to be the key,
not only for web three gaming, but it's definitely going to be key for everything across the board,
especially in the bull run that's coming up soon. Fingers crossed, uh, that it's going to happen
sooner rather than later, uh, because now is the optimal time for, uh, interoperability and, and for
all projects chains to unite and to, uh, grow together, especially in this next bull run. So, um,
one last question for you guys. I know we're just a little over our hour mark, but I definitely want
to ask this question, give you guys a second. How can listeners learn more about your project
and stay updated on its progress? So if you want to take 30 seconds and kind of do your last
remarks, that would be great. And we want to thank you guys all for, uh, coming on and participating as
our guest panelists on our, uh, X talks, uh, for the gaming, uh, topic today. And, uh, so yeah,
who wants to go first, I can, uh, go ahead. So, uh, thanks to you. First of all, thanks to layer one
X for this, uh, awesome, uh, AMA, uh, or Twitter spaces that we're doing and, um, how you can hear
more from us. Obviously you can join a discord channel or low our X account. Um, there's soon,
we're going to ready a telegram channel for chats. Um, so you can follow us, check out our website,
and that's how you can get all the latest news from us and make sure to join the freemint end of this
month. Yeah. So let me, please let us follow. So actually, as I mentioned before, like Sakaba is
a gaming economic engine for WebC games and we utilize in VNFT and also bright market for WebC
gaming. And we are about to start our preseason, you know, uh, from, uh, this Q1, uh, hopefully,
uh, from this February. So yeah, please follow up, follow our Twitter, like X account and all the
information, all the important information is also on our discord, you know, so please follow this
Twitter and also come to our discord room. Yeah. And thank you so much for such an amazing day.
You know, really appreciate you guys. Thanks. Thank you. Yeah. I also want to thank you
for the same amazing session. And we have two upcoming events, actually, with both on Digard
and Elderum site. Feel free to join our socials. We have, uh, Discord, uh, X and Telegram for both
Bigard and Elderum and ask anything you would like to answer those questions. And thanks again.
Thanks, Digga. We appreciate you guys coming on.
Thanks, Kryptonaut. Um, uh, awesome panel, great guests, uh, it's, it's a fun discussion. Uh, hopefully
I didn't derail us too bad. Uh, but you know, this is such a huge, huge topic. Um, and so there,
there are a lot of, a lot of aspects. So I really, really appreciate it. Uh, really fun talk, uh,
coming off the holidays, coming off, you know, uh, COVID. I hope my voice wasn't too lame for all y'all.
Um, find out more about new, new spirits. Uh, I put something up in the jumbotron. You can find us
there, new new spirits.io. You can download the game and play it for free. Uh, it's not an on-chain
game. It's just a normal web two game, but the web three portal is up on our site as well. Uh, and
that's where you can get ahold of NFTs, uh, and, uh, all kinds of other stuff there. Um, and, uh, yeah,
we're just, uh, we're continuing to build. We're working on multiplayer. Hopefully we can get there
and join us in the discord. We have a very active discord with lots of discussions and events happening
there. And, uh, hope to see you all there. Uh, please do check out everybody else. I threw up,
uh, I've managed to find some gameplay from Haven's compass, uh, that I threw up in the jumbotron as
well. So make sure you give a shout out to those. Uh, it looks, looks like a really fun game. Uh,
hopefully, uh, uh, you guys can check that out. Um, yeah, like follow, you know, show up and, uh,
say hi to these, uh, these amazing communities if you can. Uh, and of course, give your love to layer one,
uh, X for hosting this, uh, to crypto not for having us here. It's been awesome. So thank you
everyone. Awesome. Thanks everybody. It has definitely been a good, great AMA. I love going
down these deep rabbit holes. So anytime you guys want to go down another rabbit hole, let me know.
I'm happy to jump on, uh, on a, uh, chat with you guys, but yes, definitely check out all of the, uh,
guests websites as well as, uh, make sure you follow them. We're definitely going to be following
them because I think there's going to be some good, good stuff coming from you guys over this next,
uh, year in 2024. So with that, until, until next time, uh, we'll talk to everybody later. Have a good,
have a good rest of your day, evening, whatever time it is for you. And don't forget about our next AMA
happening tomorrow. Uh, watch Twitter for the notification and to set your reminder. Thanks
everybody. Have a good one. Thank you so much. Have a good one. Thank you. Bye. Bye everyone.
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