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The Stacks DeFi Show #62
Recorded: April 22, 2025 Duration: 0:56:28Space Recording
Short Summary
The Stacks DeFi Show 62 highlighted significant trends in the crypto market, including Bitcoin's rise to $90,000 and the introduction of innovative projects like Hermetica and Zest Protocol. With Stacks reaching a new all-time high in Total Value Locked (TVL) and exciting partnerships emerging, the ecosystem is poised for substantial growth and user engagement.
Full Transcription
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Hello, everyone.
I'm just checking if you can hear me.
And that's all good.
Then we're just waiting on the final few people to come up here as speakers.
And then we can we can get started. I'm going to put a little bit of a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a little bit of a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle. Thank you. I'm going to go ahead and put it in the middle of the room.
I'm going to go ahead and put it in the middle of the room.
I'm going to go ahead and put it in the middle of the room.
I'm going to go ahead little bit of a bag.
I'm going to put a little bit of a bag.
I'm going to put a little bit of a knife in the middle of the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle of the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a little bit of a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle.
I'm going to put a knife in the middle. Oh All right, I think we have everyone.
Let's do a quick mic check.
But yeah, but welcome, welcome, welcome to StaxDeFi Show 62 and Bitcoin 90K.
So happy, happy days. It's something biggest brewing in the world and in our world.
Yeah, but without further ado, of course, the friends of Stacks give us the stage,
all the great builders in Stacks DeFi to chat a bit about what we're working on.
And of course, they always ask us to mention just one thing,
that everything here is for informational purposes only
and shouldn't be considered financial advice.
But yeah, let's do some intros and let's get the show on the road.
I'm Tycho, co-founder of Zest Protocol,
which is the largest DeFi protocol on Stacks
and the lending protocol
with probably over 60 million TVL as prices have risen a bit in the last hour.
We were maybe 59 a few hours ago.
And also contributed to stacking now and many, many other things.
But yeah, let's do some intros.
Maybe, Hadan, you want to go next?
And again, I might see people as listeners who actually are speaker,
but maybe Hadan goes next.
And then let's do Jack Lear,
and then more people maybe that I can't see right now.
All right, sounds good.
Hello, everyone.
Pleasure to be on the Spaces with you all today. I am Hadan with the Alex Lab Foundation. Alex is the largest DeFi platform on Stacks and across Bitcoin layers as well. We're principally DAX with sister projects such as VXLink, Cross-chain bridge and the Lisa liquid staking protocol.
So looking forward to discuss the latest.
Thanks.
Hey GM everybody, it's a beautiful day
and a sea of green out there.
I'm Jack, I'm here as a contributor with Hermetica,
the world's first Bitcoin backed stable coin here on Stax and on L1.
I'm also the co-founder of Roo, one of the premier community coins in the STX ecosystem.
So yeah, it's a beautiful day.
Let's get to it, guys.
GMGM, another beautiful day here in Miami.
And it's great to be back on the Stacks DeFi show.
Lior from StackingDAO.
Also really nice to see some green shoots across the board in crypto.
You know, Bitcoin over $90,000.
Stacks also ripping.
Sure, we can maybe pontificate a little bit into why we think that may be the case.
You know, I think we're maybe starting to see some high beta return to Stacks,
which would be really exciting for the future.
But as always, great to be here and really going to enjoy this conversation.
Amazing. Amazing. Amazing.
Just quick check, is there anyone else who's speaker or uh am i uh do
i see it correctly finally it's something hard to uh to get used to but um yeah no amazing amazing
amazing amazing i mean there's lots of things to to to dive into but you know i guess uh maybe to
start off with you know yesterday and and Stacks as a top gainer.
I mean, yesterday, the top gainer in the top 100 in terms of growth, which is, yeah, that's very big to see.
Any first reads on that from you, Hadan and Lior?
Well, I mean, I remember seeing that sort of of 10% candle on stacks and feeling very hyped.
It was really exciting to see.
I think stacks regaining that high beta play relative to Bitcoin is perhaps the most bullish thing that can happen.
Because people are very comfortable holding holding bitcoin if you can hold an asset that that
yields bitcoin when you when you do staking with your stacks and provides a high beta for potentially
even higher returns then it almost becomes a no-brainer so i almost had to dig around on
on twitter a bit to see if there was some sort of surprise news or release.
But yeah, I'm not sure necessarily where it sort of took off. I think looking at the charts,
Stacks has been consolidating for quite some time, has been at a steady support for a while now.
And so once it started building up that momentum, I think, you know, the pieces just started coming together.
And I think for me, as a part of a broader picture, I'm also extremely bullish that we see Bitcoin rising while the general equities market is coming down.
So that sort of decoupling is also extremely important.
decoupling is also extremely important. And hopefully this is the beginning of the emergence
of Bitcoin as truly an alternative asset class, which fundamentally always has been, though the
market hasn't yet treated it that way. And so hopefully this is the beginning of that emergence
and trend, which would, I think, really create a lot of rocket fuel in a whole variety of ways.
And that holding Bitcoin as a diversification instrument in your portfolio becomes all the more useful, becomes all the more necessary as that decoupling returns.
all the more necessary as that decoupling the terms
and you have really a unique source of alpha
in your portfolio relative to the general market on the whole.
So, yeah, so excited to see these trends.
Hopefully this is just the beginning
and we see this continue to build up.
There could, of course, be some dips or bumps along the way
with the chaotic economic or tariff news
that may come out.
But, you know, I think it's a nice gust of wind that perhaps when this all settles, things
will continue according to their necessary course of really this sort of tech revolution
that Bitcoin and Stacks is initiating.
So, yeah, it's really been great to see.
Yeah, I think that's well said.
Just to chime in here, you know, when I first joined Stacks, it was really under the thesis
that in order for Bitcoin to be sustainable for the long term and really to grow and kind
of mature and to be all the things that we think and want it to be, for the long term and really to grow and kind of mature and to be all the
things that we think and want it to be, you need all the innovation to happen on L2s like Stacks.
So Stacks and others in the Bitcoin L2 ecosystem, you know, it really offers more functionality
and utility for Bitcoin. And that story is still very early. I would argue that it only really truly became a Bitcoin L2
after we had the two major upgrades in terms of the Nakamoto upgrade
and the launch of SBTC.
And a lot of my thesis, especially when I joined StackingDAO last year,
was that STX really exhibits properties of being high beta to Bitcoin.
And so that cuts both ways.
You know, when Bitcoin does well, at least historically, you know, Stacks would tend to do better.
When Bitcoin does poorly, then Stacks would also perform to the downside in a magnified way.
And I actually put some pen to paper and built out a model going back to early 2021,
which is when the Stacks network initially launched.
And, you know, just to explore kind of with an open mind, like,
does the price performance of Stacks over those these last few years,
is that really the case that Stacks is high beta to Bitcoin?
And for, I would say, you know, from 2021 up until the end of 2024,
you know, there was a strong argument to make
that that was the case. Now, for whatever reason, that correlation seemed to break down just in the
last few months. So, you know, obviously, we've seen a lot of altcoin weakness across the board.
So it's hard to say if it's anything specific to Stacks or if it's just more general market
weakness. And obviously, you have larger players like Michael Saylor, you know, other corporates and even potentially nation states that have been slowly accumulating
Bitcoin to support the Bitcoin price over the last few months as traditional markets and the rest of
the altcoin market have been weak. But, you know, we'll see, I think we're starting to see some
early positive movements for Stacks and perhaps we can start to see that recorrelation
between Stacks and Bitcoin, where maybe Stacks will kind of return to being high beta to Bitcoin.
I think time will tell. We're starting to see maybe initial glimmers that may be the case.
And as the markets overall continue to turn around and as Bitcoins hopefully, you know, hit new all time highs this year.
Again, not financial advice, but, you know, assuming that there is a path for Bitcoin to do
that, I think that there's still a strong case to be made that Stacks should even outperform.
But yeah, I mean, not that we should rest on our laurels, not that there isn't applications to be
built and things to be done. But, you know, I think it's the market perhaps is starting to wake up to that narrative.
that we've had with Bitcoin hitting $108,000 or so, that has been the institution's front-running
retail mostly since like $30,000 Bitcoin. And retail itself has not been super active in the
market for a variety of reasons. And I think we're going to see that change here a little bit more, especially
when you look at, you know, you could arguably say that like, you know, the NASDAQ and the stock
market in general is probably a little overvalued relative to how undervalued actual Bitcoin and crypto products are. And I think that one of the most undervalued
sectors in this space is DeFi on Bitcoin. This has been a narrative that everyone here has been
building towards and for since I've been a part of this space. But that's what being early looks like and would be an early feels like.
And I think that this narrative is coming to fruition.
And it just so happens that as people are like, okay, this alternative system built
on Bitcoin, where's it at?
Well, it's here on Stacks.
And I think that more people are going to come to this ecosystem for that
reason, because they're understanding the value proposition of what DeFi on Bitcoin means.
And because Stacks had such a head start, you know, building towards this narrative,
we already have DeFi on Bitcoin here right now. So even as you have retail come into this space and they do retail things,
as they take profit and find good place and so forth, there's this whole real DeFi ecosystem
to participate in. And this will, I think, we'll see this happen at the same time as
more institutional level entities are also using the rails that
have been built out here on Stacks for their DeFi needs as well.
So I agree.
I think that the timing's excellent.
And I think that we have a lot of blue skies ahead of us.
And it's just a matter of sticking know sticking with your conviction and and and you
know surviving you know the the highs and lows but i i think we we're in a great spot right now to be
honest yeah yeah that sounds that sounds very very much very much right right I mean in a Bitcoin cycle
we expect Bitcoin innovation to be the thing that that that does well so um so yeah that
uh makes all the sense I'm just trying to get Jacob on here as well who's uh we just requested but um
yeah let's see let's see let's see Jacob are you uh are you here GM GM hey how's it going we're just uh commenting a bit on the on on the market but um but yeah
it seems like you have some exciting things to uh to announce I'm seeing Hermetica 2.0 everywhere across Twitter
and also big announcement, of course,
from us two together, right?
It says Protocol X Hermetica.
So maybe we should talk a bit about that.
Yeah, for sure.
We've been cooking for a long time
on really a major upgrade to the app,
which is coming in less than 24 hours, which is very,
very exciting. It's a complete redesign of the app. It will be very, very sleek, very well made,
very beautiful, very simple. And there's going to be some new goodies in there. One, there's going to be a dashboard that is going to show in real time
where USDH is trading or where our backing assets are and where our positions are. So you can
actually see what's going on within the protocol. You don't have to just trust us and look at our
monthly attestations to see that our backing assets are still there, which is really exciting. And then there's
going to be another dashboard that is requested by popular demand, which is seeing the APY of
SUSDH over time, a breakdown of how it compares to US treasuries, a breakdown of how high it is,
depending on a weekly basis like
the breakdown so it's going to be a lot there to dig in all packaged up really nicely with a new
portfolio view and and just in general like a new way i think i would say one of the most beautiful
apps in all of crypto um i don't say that lightly. We really spent months and months
obsessing about every single detail of the app.
And yeah, that's in the final stages
of getting ready for production.
That's why I also was a little late.
We're doing some testing
and get that ready for you guys tomorrow morning.
I'm really excited to share it with you
and hope that you guys can play around with it
and give us feedback and dive in.
And yeah, obviously the other big update
or the other bit collaboration that we have
is with you guys with Zest
and the USDH that is still there actually
to be borrowed.
I think there's still like 700K or so or more ready to be borrowed at 2%, which is kind of crazy that nobody wants to borrow borrowed. I think there's still like 700K or so or more
ready to be borrowed at 2%,
which is kind of crazy that nobody wants to borrow that.
I don't fully get it because with the prices going up,
it's a great way to get long.
You can borrow that.
You can swap that into any Stacks asset, Stacks, PTC,
and get leverage long for 2%,
which is dirt cheap, right? Like if you go on a, and you go leverage long for 2%, which is dirt cheap, right?
Like, if you go on a,
and you go leverage long stacks,
you're probably paying like 40% or something like that.
So yeah, it's a great opportunity
and we're really excited to see that working
and more people getting in there.
But yeah, what's your thoughts on that, Tycho?
Yeah, I mean, it's a big moment, right?
I mean, we've been waiting for good stablecoin liquidity
to allow borrowing against SBTC, right?
Allow for more borrowing against stacked STX.
And it's happening now.
I mean, if you look at the amount of USDH
that's slowly being picked up,
it's been about 90K, right?
In the last four or five days.
So, you know, that's a lot in terms of growth.
Of course, there's much more space to be covered there.
There's still like 750K or 770K roughly in USTH sitting there
that can be borrowed.
be that can be borrowed so um so yeah that's um that's that's really uh yeah it's it's it's it's
small small steps but you know big um big big it means something big right in the in the in the
broader context and uh you know probably the main use case for stacks as a whole right is to borrow
stable coins against btc or or stacked sdx so uh you know making that possible with usdh is
uh that's that's kind of what uh well we're all here for right so um so yeah very very very excited
about um jacob um just to follow up on something you mentioned uh you said like are you building
out a new essentially data dashboard where you can see where USTH yields
stack up compared to TradFi and in treasuries?
I've never seen that before.
I think that's super cool.
And I'm even also like personally, I still see it.
Something I noted that's kind of interesting is if you look at Aave and the rates that
you're earning by lending out USDC or ETH or some of their larger assets.
Those yields are, at least right now, they're below what you can earn just by sitting in
treasuries. I think like the last I saw for USDC, it's like between two to three percent
versus, you know, you can be comfy, you know, knowing that you have the full faith in government
that will continually print to pay out the yields if you just hold on to treasuries paying out four to 5%. So yeah,
I'm curious maybe if you have any thoughts about that. Yeah, so that's right. The dashboard will
have a chart, historical chart of comparing SUSH yield against the three months treasury as the, obviously the,
the comparison of like the, what everybody compares yield to. And then we want to track
that. And then there's going to be a couple of other cool metrics in there. And we'll probably
build that out more as people, you know, the request new comparisons and historical views.
But in general, yeah, it's very interesting right now in the market that the treasuries
are paying out more.
I think SUSDH yield has been slightly higher than treasuries, which is obviously great.
But it is interesting because the funding rates are still quite suppressed, even right
now, even with these latest pumps over the last last let's call it like week um if you look
at the market obviously we're really close to the funding rate market which you can think about as
essentially telling you how many people are long or short as an as an aggregate measure right if
the funding rate goes negative there's more people shorting there's more demand for short leverage. So people are shorting this rally. And so funding rates are negative or zero. And that's why it's compressing the yields across the board. And that's the same if youables from Aave and then you buy Bitcoin or ETH or any other volatile asset.
And it seems like nobody wants to be long right now because everybody got super scared at the bottom like they always do.
And now is in disbelief of this rally and doesn't want to get more risk.
Generally, I think that's very bullish.
It's a very interesting spot in the market that we're in.
I'm very long on the options markets. I talked about that excessively. And I think that this
rally is great because you want to see a rally that people hate and everybody sidelined because
that really gives pressure to the upside when they pile in.
site when they pile in.
I see.
So it's like when people need to cover their shorts,
that's when we're in the right position, right?
I guess that's, yeah.
But do you think TradFi is shorting?
Is that what you think?
I think TradFi is not really that active in our leverage markets.
I think they probably use the CME more than anything.
But yeah, I mean, in the short term,
a market is always trying to screw as many people as possible.
And a market does that.
The big players do that by liquidating as many people as possible.
So liquidation levels always act as magnets in the market
because that's where large players can get liquidity.
If the whole market is short, they will push it up, get everybody liquidated and then sell into that.
And that's what's happening right now.
Or that's one lens to look at it.
In the short term, the market always is going to try to liquidate as many people as possible.
If everybody's short, it's going to short at it. In the short term, the market always is going to try to liquidate as many people as possible. If everybody's short, it's going to short squeeze them. And so I think that's what's happening right now. In the long term, liquidations are less important,
but the short term is always governed by liquidations. So it's generally very bullish.
All right. All right. All right. All right. All right well that's um that's great that's great news
that's great news that's great news also in uh in other news maybe quickly on the on on the zest
recap right i mean of course there is a million usdh that you wanna you want to you want to get
your get your hands on um but you know also you know pretty get your hands on.
But also pretty good developments on state stack SPTC,
which rose by about 7%. And yeah, of course, the yield on SPTC
has also gone up quite a bit.
It's now actually 4.88%,
mainly because of a bump in the yield from uh from
the stack side but yeah if you have a if you have sbtc in your uh in your wallet uh you know 4.88
on uh percent on on zest so um yeah that's some some really great stuff and um and yeah like
the or every uh every every week seems new new all-time high, right?
In SDX terms on the stacking data side.
But yeah, any color you have on that?
Yeah, it's really great to see.
We just recently hit 72 million stacks TVL.
So it seems, as you noted, every week we seem to be hitting new all-time highs. Always
great to see. I think it just points to how much confidence our users have in our LSTs. And also,
I think how there's more utility that's developing over time for the LSTs themselves as well.
So even though Stacks token prices may be down still, you know, in a fairly large way from their recent all time highs, I think it just speaks to all the development that everyone here is doing in Stacks DeFi, you know, because as I like to say, liquid staking really serves as the foundation for everything else that you want that you want to do in DeFi, you know, because you don't want to decide between earning the consensus rewards or putting your assets to work. You want to do both.
And that's what LSTs are for. So, you know, I think it just speaks to, again, just how there's
more utility and more energy starting to come back into the Stacks DeFi ecosystem. So always great
to see. Something else I wanna mention as well,
we also saw a lot of growth
with our native Bitcoin stacking pool.
I believe that basically tripled in TVL
over the last few weeks.
So I think it's great that that product as well
is starting to get more notice from the community.
But yeah, we're seeing new all time highs,
not just for our native Stagging Pool,
but also for STSTX, our initial flagship LST,
as well as STSTX BTC,
where, of course, you're earning rewards
in the form of SBTC.
Yeah.
Oh, awesome.
Awesome stuff.
And, Adan, how's everything going on your side?
that we were posted a teaser.
That teaser video is that essentially
our excellent cross-chain bridge
is undergoing a rebranding and a bit of a transformation
into what will now be known as a protocol.
And more information for that is coming soon.
The official announcements come Wednesday,
but basically to put it in a nutshell,
it'll be essentially a Bitcoin facing application,
but rest assured that all the smart contract functionality
is done on the stacks layer,
but that will be a big push that the team will be,
will be making over the next several weeks.
And so that's something that a lot of work and time has been put into. And the idea really being to meet those native Bitcoin users at their own level,
provide those expanded capabilities.
And as they become comfortable with that and dig into it,
they'll find that it's all made possible essentially on stacks.
And so, yeah, just a way of expanding our market, expanding our users and doing that sort of outreach of meeting Bitcoin users from their own Bitcoin wallets with
Bitcoin transactions and Bitcoin transaction times.
But again, that smart contract functionality is done entirely on Stacks.
And that sort of, like what would you say, you know, sort of the use case of that primarily is?
Or like what the value it creates for users?
Sure.
The value it creates for users is, you know, I guess our longtime goal in Stacks and Bitcoin DeFi as a whole has been to unlock Bitcoin liquidity.
But again, we found over the years through conversations with users that a lot of those more set in their ways Bitcoin users,
in their ways, Bitcoin users, you sort of filter away
probably over a majority of them
as soon as you even mention anything that isn't Bitcoin,
any sort of alternative, any other chain,
they just aren't even interested in creating a wallet.
And so the idea is to have a platform where users can, one, connect their Bitcoin wallets to it natively.
And from those Bitcoin and from, you know, essentially Bitcoin wallet transactions, engage in the variety of transactions, whether they be swaps, whether that be bridging, whether that be some other functionalities
that we're building into it as well.
And so, yeah, the idea is to bring that sort of utility
directly to Bitcoin,
have it as a Bitcoin native-like experience,
and to use that essentially as a differentiator and as a way to provide
that additional accessibility, those additional tools without running into the sort of natural
obstacles of, you know, that anything besides Bitcoin, I don't want anything to do with it. And so that's sort of the sort of marketing angle that we're taking with the Botico launch.
I know.
Cool.
Cool, cool, cool.
And yeah, does that also mean that, would that have a separate token or is it kind of integrated into Alex?
integrated into Alex?
Well, and so at the moment, it is a rebranding of Xlink.
There is an Xlink point systems.
You know, there'll be further announcements on how those will be transferred over.
But at the moment in our ecosystem, there's only Alex token.
At the moment in our ecosystem, there's only Alex token.
And so, you know, Alex will sort of remain steadfast as kind of this financial hub on Stacks.
You know, you'll notice that like on Alex, for instance, there's both the Stacks Dex and there's also the Bitcoin Dex.
You can basically think of a protocol in a way is that if you took the, the, the excellent cross-chain capabilities and you merge those with that Bitcoin
DAX, um, then, then, and you have something that's, um, that's more directly,
uh, Bitcoin, Bitcoin facing Bitcoin marketed, um, then that's, that's
essentially how, how, how the pairing, uh, how the pairing would work.
Nice. Nice.
Well, looking forward to that.
Yeah, points.
Points season.
Looking forward to discussing next week.
I hope to bring our protocol CSO on to discuss a bit.
That's great.
That's great.
That's great.
That's great.
That's great.
No, amazing.
Amazing. I know that, uh, you know, Jack, Jack, you're also,
also here maybe, um, um, yeah, just kind of curious if there's anything, uh, anything on your mind, anything that you want to, you want to jump in with or, or ask someone, you know,
on here? I mean, we're just kind of, you know, hanging out at this stage, I guess.
on the, on, on here. I mean, we're just kind of, you know, hanging out at this stage, I guess.
No, it's a very exciting time as someone who's been here in this ecosystem for a long time
to see everything the way it's kind of coalescing together into the vision that, you know,
building on Bitcoin really can look like. And I mean, here we are talking about stuff that was essentially unthought
of, you know, by and large, just a couple of years ago. You know, we have Hermetica, which is,
you know, literally a Bitcoin product. I mean, that's the first of what I think is going to be
many such products that are going to be hitting the market as
Bitcoin continues to become a more dominant asset on the world stage. We're talking about
being able to use apps such as Alex and Velar to decentralize, you know, in a decentralized manner to be able to trade using Bitcoin.
It's phenomenal.
I mean, we literally have a preview into the future.
And again, I think as we see more people,
you know, discover this narrative
and then we're really going to see
how people utilize, you know,
borrowing on Zest to further advance their own goals. You know, we're going to see more people
use stacking DAO to protect gains that they, you know, and protect wins and figure out how to still
keep their capital active and working for them as they build their positions more into this ecosystem.
If you're paying attention to the larger market right now, you can see a lot of big names kind
of grasping at straws, trying to figure out relevant narratives to build price action around.
And we have the most relevant narrative right here, right now.
That's the thing that I think most people who aren't exposed to this ecosystem yet just
don't realize that just a week or so ago, you're seeing people like, what's this crypto stuff all about?
Like, really?
Like, what are we really going to do with all of this?
And, you know, what's this actually mean?
And you have to take it back to Bitcoin.
You have to take it back to decentralization.
This idea of peer-to-peer transactions without any need for a trusted middleman anything that
that you can build around that and expand that and make that more usable and put it in more
people's hands that is a surefire way to win there's going to be a lot of ways that this
technology changes the world but this is the foundational way in which we see that happen. And yeah, that's what we have right now.
We've got a burgeoning, fully functional ecosystem where anybody in this call right now can go
according to their own risk tolerance, take underlying assets, whether it's Bitcoin or STX, and really manage their portfolio and their risk in such a
way that has just not been available up until this point. And that's usually exciting because
we're in a space that's constantly innovating. And actually, we have not seen the bulk of the innovation that's to come.
Right here on this very ecosystem, we're going to see more and more use cases that, again,
we'll be talking about like, man, no one was talking about doing this just a couple of years
ago. This is wild. But right now, we're just so far ahead of the curve from everyone else.
This is how you win. This is how you bring in retail. This is how you win.
This is how you bring in retail.
This is how you bring in institutions.
And it could just literally could not be more bullish.
You need in any crypto endeavor,
you need the network itself,
you need developers, and you need community. And last I checked, we were,
you know, one of the highest rates of developers in the entire crypto space. I think we were like
number seven in terms of that. We've got a community that is literally second to none.
That is literally second to none.
When we raised the cap on SBTC, we hit our max in under a day.
This is all what you call alpha.
This is real alpha.
This is not hype.
So the hype comes, but the real alpha is for those who are early.
And if you're listening to this right now, you're still early.
So yeah, could not be more pumped to see where we're headed.
Great.
Have you already borrowed some USDH on Zest?
I know you're a big active in DeFi and all that stuff.
Not yet.
I'm sitting here. I have to free up some liquidity
to make that first borrow i've got my usdh um working over on velar right now i've got some
longs since like 77k on bitcoin that i'm really enjoying so um yeah what we're gonna but that
that's the next step because i want to watch this price action
and i want to take some of this uh you know i might i might break off some liquidity from
from some of these longs that are heavy in profit and and get some more usdh and
yeah yeah this is this is exciting but yeah y'all kind of see where that's going. Yeah, this is going to be more exciting.
Borrow some USDH against your SBTC or SDX.
Buy some Roo, you know?
So this is the moment.
These markets are interesting.
But go ahead, Jacob.
I see you're just unmuted.
It's a much better way to go long by borrowing USDH right now
because the fees that you pay on the dealer are probably a lot higher than 2%.
And so you can go leverage.
That's what I'm doing.
I post it.
I have my SDSDX bag in Zest.
I borrow USDH against it and then buy more stacks, stake it,
put the stake stacks back into zest and
loop that and i'm i'm getting paid what is it like eight nine percent on the st stx yield and i'm
paying two percent to borrow so i'm i'm literally getting paid to go along stacks which is kind of
great and um so highly recommend if you want to actually get leverage
to use Zest and the spot markets,
because it's a lot cheaper than Vela.
Vela is great too, obviously, not to take away from them.
Yeah.
That sounds just right.
That sounds just right.
I mean, that's what we built all this stuff for.
So very exciting, very advanced use case as well right of course then you know it depends a
lot on the liquidity of stx the staked stx which uh which will also go live in in the coming days
i mean the guys from bitflow are not not here to share the latest on that but um but yeah there's
some uh some some good things um good things coming for sure and uh yeah i mean i see some some great
people in the audience as well like mr mr wag me cpsc tripping monkey algorithm you know uh
tassi and uh and and many more if you want to ask something or if you want to jump in like feel free
to uh you know grab grab the mic or request to speak if you want.
But Hadan, what do you want to say?
No, actually, I have a quick question.
I was just wondering if, Taiko,
if you've heard any further news on the SBTC CAP3 increase.
Is that still set for the end of April?
I haven't checked the stacks developer account
yet but i was i was curious about that because we do want to time our launch of our search for
i don't know anything more than you do but i assume so um and uh yeah so um so um yeah so i
think i think that that's still very much the case.
Okay.
I'll reach out to them to hype it out, to get everyone excited.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Because then, you know, we're nearly at one week countdown.
That's very soon.
Yeah, yeah.
It's like nine days away.
So that's what I'm like, you know, let's start, you know, pumping it up.
Exactly.
Exactly.
Amazing.
GPSC is here as well.
Go ahead, sir.
Hey, what's up, guys?
Happy Tuesday.
Hope everybody's having a very blessed start to their week.
I love seeing the markets green.
And, you know, I've been using, I've been stacking DAO
and providing collateral, that same play that Jacob's talking about
and posted to the timeline.
I've been playing with that play for a little bit
and kind of building my position,
leverage long STX, you know,
and that's a great way to put it.
You know, that's what you're doing
is going leverage long
whenever you use these value loops
while you're earning like 10 it's it's like our eight eight
percent it's like 8.01 when i checked it this morning um it's a no-brainer um super bullish
i love seeing stacks back above 70 cents yeah yeah awesome stuff are you still doing the the show right after this right there's usually
the you you have the you're doing doing something right after this on on the zest or stacking down
discord right yeah yeah yeah so um right after this i'll be i'll be doing a meme lesson like
anybody that's interested in learning how you know i cook some art and make my post and stuff like that i'll
i'll be sharing my screen in the stacking down discord and in conjunction with the space so
uh trying trying to get some people to to come in and you know anybody that's interested in learning
how to to make some some art you know that's it's kind of where i got my start in the stacks
ecosystem so you know just teaching everybody and um you know i'm thinking
that uh there's been a couple people that reached out to me and wanted to to come on so maybe i
might just do like a more personal lesson with with some people from the stacks ecosystem so
we're just having some fun and we have a uh we're gonna we're gonna do a meme contest uh along with
it so um come have some fun.
You know, it's been awesome kind of getting integrated into the community
and getting everybody mobilized.
So definitely jump into the Discord.
We've got plenty of stuff going on.
That's where you want to be right after this.
No, amazing.
Amazing, amazing.
Any other things we need to
need to get in before maybe we go to to the to the outros you know for uh for for the week but um
maybe jacob you want anything draw attention to what's what's coming tomorrow i believe
yeah so i mean tomorrow big release very very excited about it. We've been cooking for such a long time.
I'm really, really excited to share with you guys.
I think you're going to love it.
It's going to drop tomorrow morning, and I'm very curious to hear your thoughts.
But it's also another thing.
We are very holistically trying to get feedback from people that are really using USDH.
people that are really using USDH.
So call to action.
So call to action if anybody here in the audience
or if you're listening to it later,
if you're using USDH,
meaning you have staked USDH in the last month or two
and are actively using the protocol,
I would like to talk to you and ask you four questions.
It takes like three minutes
and I'll give you a little goodie
at the end please reach out to me in dms i really really want to talk to you
because it's going to significantly shape our roadmap and what we do to make usdh better
i will vouch that it does in fact take just like three minutes it's not one of those things where
you get fished and you're stuck there for
20 minutes, you know, answering endless forums. So it is super quick.
Even less, I would say it's possible in 30 seconds.
But yeah, I'm not sure how useful the feedback is,
but I think it was quite useful in that in 30 seconds.
Yeah. Right. You guys already did it. Yeah. So yeah, it's very short.
And it's anything is useful any feedback is useful we want to talk to
as many people as possible that actually have used the
protocol so please please please
pretty please reach out to me I want
to talk to you
let's go let's go let's go let's go
cool let's
quick quick quick hooks what
what do people need to do?
And what should people check out after the space?
Maybe, Jack, Jacob, you want to go first?
Go ahead, Jack.
I think Jacob first it is, unless you guys can hear Jack and I can't.
I can't hear Jack.
Okay. Yeah.
We're always cooking.
We're always putting out very insightful market review and weekly update data. So if you're not subscribed to our newsletter yet, you definitely want to, you can head over to hermedica.fi. Scroll to the bottom and put in your email. It's really worth it. an effort in curating a really high quality newsletter
that brings you news from the ecosystem,
from the app,
but also gives you a very detailed overview
of how we're seeing the markets.
So head over there,
sign up for our newsletter
and you will get the next one on Friday.
And then, yeah,
put on a notification bell for our X account.
We have something massive dropping tomorrow.
And yeah, I love you all. Keep the dropping tomorrow and yeah i love you all
keep keep the pump going and um yeah we're all gonna make it
that's all right ilio gp any uh any final words yeah always great to be here uh another stacks
defi show in the books and many more to come. Yeah, if you want to learn more about StackingDAO
to earn those sweet, sweet consensus rewards on your STX tokens,
as always, go to stackingdao.com,
follow our Twitter account on StackingDAO,
and just stay tuned.
Definitely will be more updates in the near future.
Yeah, dude, i just wanted to chime
in and say you know jump into the discord the stacking doubt discord um we're we're going to be
doing a poker tournament on thursday as well so we're going to do that around 11 a.m et uh come
have some fun you know uh there's so much base building going on in this ecosystem and I just want to
find ways for us to have fun together
as well, make connections
and spend some time
time is our most valuable asset
so let's spend it together
and have some fun
best
best poker tournament
in the Stax ecosystem guys
I see Hadan is still requested,
but I can't seem to get him up somehow.
I accepted the request multiple times,
but it's not working.
So check out.
Did I hear poker tournament?
What's up?
Did I hear poker tournament?
In the Stacking Down Discord, yes.
Ooh.
I gotta jump in there.
When is the tournament?
It's gonna be on Thursday at 11 a.m. ET.
So, yeah, this is one of those things, man.
Getting some activities going and seeing what people like.
We've got some Pokemon tournament.
Do we have prizes?
Do we have prizes for the poker tournament?
Yeah.
It's poker or Pokemon?
So there's poker.
Pokemon was two weeks ago.
Poker is going to be once a month.
So trying this out and seeing if people like it, man.
I'm a poker guy.
Who doesn't like poker?
It's the best game ever.
All right. I'm a poker guy. Who doesn't like poker? It's the best game ever. All right, I'll jump in.
Let's go, Jacob.
Amazing.
Amazing. Amazing. Amazing.
Hadan, we could hear you.
Finally, you're here.
Oh, yeah.
The audio was rigging out on me a bit,
so I left and joined Daikin.
But yeah, from my side,
be sure to give the Alex account to follow
in the coming days. Lots of announcements, more details on protocol to be fleshed out. And
looking forward to discussing that a bit more in depth with you guys next week and answering
any questions and just covering, you know, what our goals are and what we're optimizing for.
But always a pleasure to join you all in the spaces
and may the trends that we've seen this week so far
in Bitcoin and Stacks continue
and make this truly a remarkable spring,
the spring of a Bitcoin T5.
May the force be with us.
But I know we've been doing outros for a bit.
Leo, did you already go?
Or am I hallucinating now?
I guess mine wasn't particularly impactful.
Yeah, again, great to be here.
And yeah, see you all next week.
Amazing.
That's right. Next week, 10 a. here. And yeah, see you all next week. Amazing. That's right.
Next week, 10 a.m. Eastern, Tuesday.
I might struggle to be there
because I'm at Token 2049,
which is going to be exciting
if the market continues like this.
But you never know.
We're up, we're down, we're everywhere.
But on the long term, everything is going in the right direction.
And yeah, it's going to be exciting weeks coming up for Stacks
with I think some interesting releases as well
that everyone is going to be very, very excited about.
So I'm leaving it at that, more next week.
And then I uh everyone coming here
and uh and yeah let's uh let's build some let's build some Bitcoin finance
all right great to talk take care everyone bye
